How to Grow From $600,000 Revenue to $1.1 Million?

Hey, everybody, it is Jim Johnson here, your host on Contractor Radio. The show designed for contractors so that they can get control of their business, so they can grow their business and achieve some personal and financial freedom that they wanted when they started their business. Our goal here is to help people be better so they can have better businesses and lead better lives. And I'm super pumped today because I have a guest with me that I've gotten to know here for the last few few years. It means a lot to me. He is one of the hardest working guys that I've met. He has an amazing company and he's going to tell you more about that here this morning. But we're working on this series over the summertime of what contractors go through the life of a contractor. And I want this guy to share a story because I think it's so valuable to you. I think it's going to bring you some insight into starting up your business, what growth may look like in your business, the obstacles and challenges you may face in your business. This is going to be one of those shows you don't want to miss. So without further ado, let's go ahead and bring in our guest. He is very analytical about what he does. He's a super smart guy. He really pays attention to the details that allow him to facilitate a situation that benefits his employees just as much as it benefits him. Hey, Josh. Welcome to the show. Josh Swisher from North Face Construction. How are you today?

I'm doing great, Jim. I appreciate you having me on.

Yeah, I will. It's an honor to have you on, man. It really is. I've been working to put together what I call the best of the best really is it's guys that have worked hard over the years to build something they can be proud of. And we've gotten to be a little part of your journey. But you've done so much just on your own and being the guy that you are. Tell us a little bit about North Face and yourself and how you got to where you are.

Okay, so I'll do the brief synopsis. I've told the story a few times and it gets a little entertaining, but I started roofing when I was 15 years old, 16 years ago. So that tells you my age. I started working for my neighbor before I had a driver's license. So I would flip him shingles, drag tarps, you know, everything. You know, at that time we were coming in, we were in the recession and it was really starting to hit. So by the time I graduated high school in 2009. His business wasn't really doing well. So my initial plan had been to manage his business and kind of grow up and help him build it. But I ended up going to college instead because there wasn't any work. And at the time I didn't really know much else to make money. So I would do Craigslist ads for roof repairs and go patch a shingle for 50 bucks and stuff while I was going to school. So In January, on January 10, 2010, I took an intro to business class and I learned when LLC was. And that was the day I started North Face Construction.

So we started like to put your own llc?

No, no. I just learned what an LLC was and I'm like, if I. If this is what I need. I've been making cash all these years. I had no proof of income and I wanted to buy a truck to impress girls. You know, that's what you do when you're 18. So that was my whole reason. But I, you know, it started LLC and then I was doing side gigs and still just like on the side, snow plowing, snow blowing of driveways with my parents Snowblower and their RAV4 pulling the trailer around and just kind of. It wasn't really serious. But then in 2013, I got my builder's license while I was still attending college for my business degree in St. Cloud. And I contracted one job, and then there's another one, another one, and referrals, and everyone knew I was doing roofing. All my friends, social media, I was always posting about it, so it just kind of grew from there. And then the storm of 2017 hit. If you're a Minnesota person, you know, the infamous storm. And then it was just like, hold on, hold on. And like, here we go. And that's when things really turned into a business from that point forward.

So that's super interesting. I think a lot of people probably start the way you did, not necessarily going to college and earning side money, although I think that happens quite a bit too. But it's like I have this skill set and I do some side jobs and then they become full jobs and then it becomes another full job because I got a referral and I did good work. And I think a lot of businesses kind of have that type of scaling process to them, where they build from referrals, good work, customer experience, and things like that. They may or may not be the low price leader because they don't have a lot of overhead and those type of things. Were you any of that?

Oh, I had no overhead, so I lived it. I lived, I was living with my parents. You know, I didn't have a car payment, I didn't have a phone payment. My only bill to be a licensed contractor was my yearly insurance premium and keeping the license paid every other year.

A few deals.

Oh, I could, I. Yeah, I. I didn't know what I was doing. All I knew is how much I wanted to make per square as a subcontractor when I was installing, which at the time I was getting paid like 50 a square. And then I added on maybe another 50 a square. So I was doing 100 square on top of my cost. So I was.

You were a subcontractor to somebody else, the actual contractor?

Yeah.

So like contracting to the homeowner and residential clients, I was subbing for other.

Roofers like in my friends. So like my boss and his brother both own roofing companies. So when I started my llc, I, you know, would funnel my subcontract work. I would be on, I was part of a crew and I would count my bundles every day and I had my little helper that I paid cash.

And just how valuable was that to you to know it from that side, like to you, to actually be a subcontractor? How did that help you?

Pivotal, because I know how to do everything hands on and I knew how to lay down lots of squares fast and make money doing it. And I kind of knew what, I just kind of knew the ground up from the business and the efficiencies. I knew the material I needed. I knew like crews, I knew guys that could go and do the work. So we're just kind of boots on the ground to get things done.

I think that's, that's an invaluable thing to have. Most of us that start a business doing contracting or whatever may not have that actual hands on experience. The guys that I talk to, that have more of that can talk in a different way to the homeowner than somebody just becoming a salesperson or a business owner. Did you find that to be valuable when you're talking to homeowners?

Yeah, because my first few sales, I'd say, you know, I'm the guy, I'm a young man, I'm starting my business, I'm learning, I want, I really appreciate giving me the chance. But I'll be the guy out here working me and my helper and you know, I can promise you that you're going to get a good job. So it's just really endearing, you know, the Owner always sells, really sells at a high closing rate. But then it also helps when you say, I'm actually going to be the person out here every day. I'm going to come up, I'm going to be here at 7am and I'm going to stay until it's dark or after and get the job done.

When. Okay, so I got a couple of questions because you said something early on too, that you were posting this stuff on Facebook. You're like, hey, you're posting your jobs and the work you were doing. How did that help?

People just knew it was just branding. I look back like it was just branding. Like, Josh is a roofer.

Yeah, Josh the roof guy.

Well, yeah, well, they call me my friends be like, hey, my dad is missing a shingle on his roof. Can you help us? I'm like, yeah, I'll come over. No, couple hundred bucks. Yeah, I'll help you out. And then this, it's just compound. So like my network knew what I did. You know, a lot of people don't know what you do, like talk about it.

It's interesting to people all the time. Like, I get asked for, like to be a friend on Facebook, right? Like somebody do a friend request with me and I'm pretty diligent about who I let into my world. First things first, I'm always going to look negative or positive. You're a positive person. Yeah, I'll keep looking. If you're negative, you're out immediately. And then I go to look. What do they do? Right? Like, I, I, I don't know. Do you do this whenever people friend request you? Like, do you look at like, what do they do?

I do a brief overview because I especially in our industry, most of the time they're trying to sell you something if I see a certain friend screw. So most of the time I'll just let those sit in queue.

Yeah, no, no wonder I have such a hard time getting people go, yeah, I'll be your friend. No, I'm just kidding.

Yeah, yeah. I just don just DMing and trying to sell me on stuff I don't need.

But the, but I'll go, okay, so they're positive. They don't seem nefarious or anything. I'll go ahead and let them. And so I'll hit the friend accept button and I'll immediately get like a message, a dm. Hey, I've been following you, watching your stuff. I'm a roofer and I do, I'm like, how does anybody know you're a roofer it's not anywhere on any. Yeah, I couldn't see it on any of their pictures. There was no like name of their company or anything. Like that's like step one. That should be on everything and anything that you do because that network is super valuable to you and you start building your brand from day one. I really hate interrupting these videos, but I've got some important information for you. If you haven't tried out Atlas Shingles, you should because they put you first as a contractor. They want to give you a competitive advantage out in the field so that you can win more sales and be more profitable. Check out Atlas in your local area, find your local rep, get hooked up with them today and start making more money tomorrow. What now? Has it always been North Face?

Actually when I first filed LLC, it was not. And I changed it like nine months later. Yeah, it was literally J.C. swisher LLC. I didn't care about the name when he start. Yeah.

And what made you do the name change? Why that?

I just wanted. I thought about it. I'm like, well, I don't really want my name on the business necessarily not. I just felt like I would like to build a brand outside of just me that people can subscribe to a little bit. I don't know. It wasn't much thought going through my head when I was 18 year old. 18 years old, I just did it.

Trucking girls. I own a real company that doesn't have my name on it. It's super funny. So those first few years, you're 18 years old, you decide, hey, I'm going to be North Face. You were subcontracting other people. When did it switch to like being your own thing?

In 2013 when I got my license and I got hired for one job and for an insurance claim. And then that was just one. That was the only one I did that year. And then the next year was like three more and then it was a few more and it's just like kind of organically grew into that. And then I knew I had it. I had it kind of figured out by the time 2017 came around that that's what I was doing. I didn't always. At one point, I wanted to be a customer modeler. I wanted to do like additions and like grandiose things. And I did a quarter million dollar edition and I made 20 grand. And between like the lead to like finish, it took like a year and a half. And I was like, I'm never doing that again because I didn't have like.

Why why did you go and stick with routing that?

Yeah, right. Well, I, I just, I learned what I didn't want to do. I didn't want to be inside people's houses. It changes the whole dynamic of contracting when you're interrupting their day to day life with their kitchen remodel and stuff like that. Because when I did that addition, it was kitchen everything, master everything. So it wasn't, it was a good experience and great people, it went well, but I didn't make any money and I put hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of hours into it.

So yeah, that was, I was a bit of a wake up call, I would imagine. So then you go, I'm a roofer. Right. Is that, is that what you decide to be or is it something more than that?

Well, it's roofing, siding, windows and gutters. So exterior of a home, we keep the water out of the home above grade.

Ah. So exterior envelope approach.

Yes.

Don't have to be in the house or anything like that. So you're in one of those areas of the country where they get storms and in 2017 you guys got one heck of a hailstorm and. And so what were you doing in revenue like 2016 and then how did that change for 2017?

That's a great question. So I'll give you a little backstory. So in 2010 I actually still have my first pay on paper income statement in a frame in my office and I made $6,000 in profit my first year in business.

And do you pay yourself though? Like you didn't live off of 6,000 bucks, did you?

Pretty much. I lived at my parents house.

Oh yeah, you were living at your parents house?

Yeah, I lived in my parents house. I didn't have to buy food, I didn't have any bills. And then there was probably some ca cash on the side that wasn't deposited in the bank account. But so that was that year I did 18, 000 revenue. The next year I did 24. The next year from there it was like 60 something. The next year from there it WAS 120. And then it was, I can move.

Out of my parents house now.

Well, that's what happened is I was going to College at St. Claus State for my entrepreneurship degree and when I went to graduate, I looked at the last year and I just qualified for a home with my prospective wife that we were going to get married and she was pretty much a minimum wage college poor graduate. I made 30 grand while I was in school part time and we bought a house together barely Bought a house together, barely. And I just remember graduating just like, well, if I made. If I'd made this money part time while working my butt off, I can either go to Target Corporation or UnitedHealth, and I can be a business analyst for a comfortable salary and benefits. But then I'm not really in control. And I just wanted to kind of take that leap because what's the worst gonna happen? What's the worst gonna happen? It's all paper and numbers, you know, and you're gonna. Not gonna lose your family. So I kind of took that leap of faith at that time to continue things. So then we did 240,000 revenue, and then 2016, I did 600,000 in revenue. And that was when I did that addition. That's when my wife quit her job and she joined the company full time. And then she went back to school for her master's in business during that time. And then in 2017, we hit 1.1 million when the storm hit. And then after that. And I can keep going if you want, but.

Such a. It's a steady pace of growth. It's not like. Because a lot of guys would make this mistake, this storm happens. I bet you had opportunity way more than that if you wanted to.

What if I knew how to do it?

Yeah, like, but you didn't have the people, you didn't have the resources, and so you kept it at a manageable number and pretty controlled growth. Has that been your MO for the whole time?

Control. I call it control listening.

For those of you on the podcast.

It's controlled chaos. It's controlled chaos. I'd say I have big goals and it gets challenging sometimes for. It's overwhelming sometimes at the pace I try to push things.

Yeah. And everybody's goals are, like, different too. For somebody, for one person, it might be, okay, I'm going to go from 600,000 to 1.1 million. And that's like this big, huge push. And you got this other guy. It's like, at 500,000, we're going to do 5 million. Right. So, like absolute, utter chaos at that point. What allowed you to go from 600,000 to 1.1 and not be too crazy or worry?

It was. So I was. Well, first off, I found a sales guy and I don't know, I don't remember. It was like on one of these forums in 2017, Cody, Cody Bates, if he's listening, he's an amazing person. He, he, he just started his roofing company with some partners down in Florida this year. They're killing it. Amazing. But he. He was working in Florida, but he was a Wisconsin guy. And he DM'd me and said, hey, I saw that you had a storm up there. And he's like, I'll come and work. It's the off season in Florida. And I'm like, I need the help. Come up here. So he taught me how to, like, supplement. I didn't know what that was. You know, he taught me that. And then I hired my first full time employee that fall. Derek who, you know, he was my first real employee on the payroll.

What did he do?

Production. I handed off production because I knew I could keep selling, I could trade, I could train him to do the production.

Those are pretty smart moves. First off, you get kind of lucky, right? Like a sales guy that knows what he's doing gets a hold of you. And then your first real hire, though, is a production. You didn't hire another salesperson. Why'd you hire a production manager instead of a salesperson?

I just knew how much time I was spending running the jobs. I mean, I remember one day, I had 10 roofs going in one day and I was managing them all myself. But when they're within like 4 square miles in Blaine, that's not that hard. But I just knew I need to hand it off that. That stuff because it was taking up so much time. I was missing out on opportunities to sell because I couldn't get to places fast enough for people to. Because there's such a lack of people. Everyone needed the work done. So it's just the speed to get it done was the key to making the money.

So I've. I find it interesting that you gravitated towards the sales side of it. Sounds like you had some skill at that versus the production side of it. Because that's kind of, you know, you can go one way or the other. One guy can say, hey, I'm going to run production and hire a bunch of sales guys. Or the other way around, say, hey, if I hire a production guy, I can go sell more. Especially with your background, like knowing how to install and do the work and all those type of things. Why. Why that particular choice?

I don't really know off the cuff necessarily. Besides, I always like sales and I like dealing with people and driving the revenue a little bit. And I knew he could fulfill on the promises. So I just. I wanted to grow. I wanted to grow and I wanted to hand off things that would stop the growth in regards to. In my mindset at that time. You know, I wanted to drive revenue and push it forward. Because then I hired my first salesperson that following spring. I hired Derek. October of 2017. I hired my first salesperson in March of 2018.