Life Lessons from Broader Horizons with Jory Allen

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Hello everybody. I am Coach Nathan Thibodeau with Contractor Coach Pro. But you are listening and watching Contractor Radio, our podcast that is designed to bring information, some entertainment, some education and some enjoyment to contractors and anybody else who has a fancy to listen. And so I get to host this week's episode. Super excited about that. I'm also super excited about our guest. I get the opportunity to introduce you to Jori Allen of Sales Rabbit, and I'll let him talk about Sales Rabbit because he's the expert at it. But one of the things that I find super cool about Jory is Jory and I have had a number of conversations. He's one of my favorite people in the industry and he's a real good friend to myself and my team. And he and I have spent some time having really cool conversations. He's an introspective person, he's a deep thinker, he's a traveler, he's a foodie, he's a hard worker and I think he's got a lot of really cool things to bring to the table that you guys might find interesting this week.

So.

But before I bring Jory up so we can have this cool conversation, we're going to pay a few bills with a word from our sponsors.

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Welcome back to this week's episode of Contractor Radio. I would like to introduce to you Mr. Jory Allen. How are you doing today, sir?

Doing great, thanks. Awesome. Awesome.

Well, super happy for you to take a few minutes to chat with us. I'm wearing my sales rabbit hat. Although this one goes back a little ways because your guys's new ones. I don't. I don't know how I feel about those black ones.

I don't like it. I don't like them either.

You can see I've got another one.

Right, I was looking at.

Yeah, Yep. And then I've got the black one behind it. So I do have one.

I do have one with the old bunny that. That Jim likes. Jim likes the one with the actual bunny rabbit.

I know. No, I don't. If you guys have any of that, man. If you've got a random one of those old T shirts or one of those old. I would love that. So I'll just. I'll leave that for you. I actually get to see you next week, too.

I believe we'll throw that one just.

Just to kind of throw out some of that general information. Who is Jori Allen? Where do you work and what do you do there?

Sure. I am the sales manager at Sales Rabbit. I rent. I manage our team of account executives who do demos and close deals. And so that's what we do. Sales Rabbit. We're a field sales tool that sales people use in the field to track what they're doing. And. And then we usually push things over to a CRM to manage it. But we're. We're really focused on anything to do with field sales, whether they're knocking doors, whether they're following up on leads, whether they're. Anything that's map based and field focused. That's what we do.

Okay, good.

All right.

I'm glad we did that. So now your biz dev and marketing team will be happy with me. And then I won't get a call from Sean or Zach that we didn't talk about Sales Rabbit at all or anything like that. So that's good to hear that. But you've got some other really cool stuff that I've always found interesting about your life and about the way that you think and about your experiences. So the. The real, like, the real question is, who is the real Jori Allen? Right. People say, hey, what do you do? Or who are you? Right. And say, oh, I'm Nathan Thibodeau and I coach at Contractor Coach Pro. That's not really who I am. So who's the real Jori Allen?

You know, I'm an introvert, which is kind of weird for a sales guy, but I think introverts can make amazing salespeople because we can be really outgoing when we need to be. Right. But like you said, definitely an introspective thinker, religious, single. I've lived a lot of lives. I've been through a lot in my years. You know, I have a lot of passions. I believe in taking time for passions. And. Yeah, I have. I mean, my passions are things I really spend time doing. They're not. Oh, I just like to do that. No, I've, like, food is a passion. I spend time with food. I cook. I find new restaurants. In fact, I'm the de facto guy for finding restaurants anywhere I go.

That is the truth. If we're in the same. If we're in. If Jory and I and Jim and Michelle, if we're all in the same vector, we're, we're. We're poking Jory to find, Find where we're going to go. Have some food.

Exactly. And that's. I spend time doing the things I love, and that enriches my life. And I'm all about a rich life. I think that's part of why we're here.

Well, so one of the things that you mentioned I found interesting is that you said you've lived a lot of lives. What do you mean by that?

I've been through a lot. I've lived in other countries. I speak another language. I speak a language that's not very well known. It's. It's Dutch. And I speak it fluently. I have for 25 plus years. I've lived in Holland. I've lived in Belgium. I've traveled the world. I've been to 38 countries. I try to hit four new countries a year every year. Four. Last year was the first year in five years that I hadn't hit my four countries because I couldn't travel. I had it all planned out, but I had to cancel the trips. And I just, I have a lot of experience. My mother died when I was in my early 20s and we were super close. My dad passed away 12 years ago. I have five siblings. I have 12 nieces and nephews. I have three great nieces. I've just, I've been through a lot. And then that's what, that's what makes me who I am, is. Are the things that we experience. Right. Yeah. Yeah.

So you said you've got some, some passions that you, you make some time for. What? So you mentioned food and you mentioned travel. So one of the, one of the questions I always kind of have, especially with the foodie side, is like, like, I like to eat.

Okay. And I have.

And I, I Know, a lot of people, like, I think everybody, like, likes to eat and needs to eat, but I know that there's. There are people that eat because they have to, and then there are people who eat because they. There's something more to it for them. So on the food, how did you discover that you, like, had a real passion and love for food? And what does that. How does that translate for you?

What a fun question. I appreciate that. My whole family's that way, and I don't. I don't really know why. When I guess, see, again, my mom died when I was in my early 20s, so I didn't get that chance to get to know her as an adult. So I kind of knew her more as a kid. And so there's a lot of things I don't know about her. And so I'll ask my sister now or my sister, my older sister. She'll tell me things like, my mom didn't like to cook. My mom did cook, and she was a great cook, but she didn't like it. So my sisters would cook. Well, out of six of us, there's six of us siblings total. Every single one of us can cook and cook really well. I'd put any of us up against a chef any day, and some of us are better than others. But when we get together, like, Thanksgiving is a treat, because I was going to say, I'll bet. Amazing.

Christmas is amazing.

It is. And it's not. We're not fancy people at all. In fact, you meet my family, you're like, we're simple people, but we make great food. And it's. It's just. Everything's perfectly done. And we go out to restaurants. We love to try new restaurants. So part of it just comes from the way I grew up. We. And the other thing is, is I actually have a brand. I teach a cooking class, and I. My brand is called Discover Scratch, and I own the dot com and I own the Instagram and things, and it's all about cooking from scratch. And. Well, let me rephrase that. Eating from scratch, whether you're. I just think it's a lost art, is to eat food that you made or eat food that somebody else made. You know, if you're going to a restaurant, do they make their food from scratch? Awesome. You know, I cook almost every single day for myself, and I love it. I think it makes all the difference in nutrition and, and enjoyment is because I. I make the things I eat, and I care about what goes into it. I really care about ingredients.

So what was the name of your Instagram page?

And if people want to follow you, it's called Discover. Scratch Discover. Okay. Yeah. I haven't done a whole lot with it, but it's there and it's out there and someday I'll get around to doing more for it. Okay. It's definitely a passion. Is, is anything with food I'm, I'm passionate about. I love great restaurants and I also love. One of the strange things about me is I love to share all the things I love. So, you know, the more the merrier. I have. I love doing dinner parties, having people over, cooking, enjoying food together. It's kind of family to me. Yeah. So.

All right, so that's pretty cool. So basically like kind of your older siblings kind of led you into the whole, the whole passion and love of food because they're kind of the same way. That, that, that's really cool. I'm the oldest in my family and I'd rather not know what I led my siblings love. So the other, I know that the, the other passion that you really have is travel. So how, how did you discover that you love to travel? Was that another thing that you got from your siblings as well?

No, I, I had never been on a plane before. I was 19 years old and I flew to, to Amsterdam. And so your first living over plane was to Amsterdam? Yep, and I lived over there for a couple years and I learned the language. Like I said, I speak it fluently. It became, it's a second home to me. It became a huge part of my life. And so Europe is just amazing. It is, it's old, it's rich. Every single country is way different. The countries are small, so you can go from one to the other quickly. I mean, Holland, top to bottom is a three hour drive. Side to side, it's a two hour drive. It's not big. And yet there's, you know, 20 million people there, so. And the culture goes back hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years. So it's that. I think that's what instilled in me the love for travel, is doing it and realizing that I love it. I love to see, experience new things.

Oh, my wife and I had a, had a multi state tour or multi country tour planned for September in 21. And that would have been my first, that would have been my first trip across the pond. Because for me, so far, I've been to Canada a number of times, which I love it up there.

Yeah, right.

And I've been to Mexico a number of times and I'VE been to California, which I think is its own country, frankly. But. But yeah, we ended up having to cancel our trip, and that was just a super bummer. I was really, really looking forward to that con. To being able to go over there and experience so much of that. Okay, so let's.

Let's just.

Quick, quick travel tip then, right? Like Jory, the travel book. Let's say you're somebody like me and you're like. I'm like, hey, I don't know. I've never been over there yet. And what would you say? You've got to do this at first. Do you have anything like that?

It depends where you're going. So I've. Like I said, I've been to 38 countries. And so for me, there are countries I. Every single one of them. I appreciate. There are countries I love and go back to, and there's countries that like Greece to me. I don't ever need to go back. Not my cup of tea. I enjoyed it. I appreciated many things. It's dirty and kind of gross. Not my. Not really my thing. Finland, I thought I'd love it. Didn't really love it. Copenhagen in Denmark, on the other hand. Oh, my gosh, I've been back there twice since I went the first time, and I absolutely love it. There's just something about the city and the country that I. I really love travel tips. Staying in there especially.

I mean, I think even. Even.

Right.

Well, even. I mean, with the whole. With the COVID thing. I know every country over there is probably a little bit different or there are some variances between borders. How's that like right now? Or what's that like right now?

You just need to make sure you really understand that. That does make it much more difficult. Getting from London to Amsterdam was a hassle. It took me almost an entire day and a missed flight because they didn't accept the COVID test I had. I had to redo it. It took several hours. It was a pain. So, yeah, plan on. Plan on making mistakes and do as much research as you can beforehand. I don't really. I'm not that guy that travels. I know a lot of people have, like, their itineraries. We're going to do this, this, and this. I'll do a little research and kind of get an idea, but I wing it. I wing it. I. I usually rent a car wherever I go, and I just drive and I've. I find things. I want to find great places to eat. I want to walk around cities. I want to do some shopping. I want to see the sights. And it's. It's so fun to do in a car. And most countries I can do that in, you know, except for something like Bali, where you don't want. You don't want to be driving, so.

All right.

So kind of pulling this back a little bit.

I just.

Sometimes I get lost in the cool things that I hear people say, and I'm like, I don't talk more about that. So when it comes to, like, personal fulfillment.

Okay.

And what kind of trips you're triggering, what makes you. What makes you feel like you're doing your life. Right.

Okay.

Between your passions of food and travel, and I'm sure there's. I know you have a passion for nature as well. I know you like getting outside and hiking, and I believe you bike, right? If I remember.

No, Jeep and trail run. That's what it is.

Jeeps and trail run.

Right.

So I know you got a passion for these things. And so when it comes to fulfillment, what. What is the difference between fulfillment through your passions and fulfillment through the work of your hands? Or is there a difference?

Yeah, they're. They're kind of one in the same. I mean, the things that fulfill me have a lot to do with people. I'm a lot. Yeah. I. I have a. One of my best friends is. Is an extreme extrovert, and he loves everyone. He want. He wants to connect with everyone. He wants to talk with everyone. He gets to know everyone. I don't. I don't want to connect with you unless I like you, and sometimes I don't.

Do you use your extroverted friends as a filter like your extroverted friends? You're like, oh, Jory's probably not going to like this person, or, hey, Jory, you should meet you, like, this person.

Well, I think the biggest difference between extroverts and introverts is they. They just don't understand each other. We're so different, you know, I don't really want to be around people most of the time unless I know them. If I don't know them, I'm usually in a business setting, so I can put that hat on, and I'm just fine. But my relationships are long and deep. And that's one thing I love about the industry. And we have many industries, so roofing is just one of our industries that we serve. But we have many. But this industry in particular, the roofing industry, I have my deepest relationships in, like, with Jim Johnson and. And I just. I'm a collector of People and Jim is one of those. I, you know, Jim and I will be lifelong friends and we're close friends, and that's what I prefer. I prefer. I don't mind having lots of friends, but we have real relationships. We talk about real things, we get into real conversations. That's fulfilling to me. When I travel, the fulfillment, I think comes from experiencing things. I want to experience it all. I want to taste the food. You know, I walked into a shop in London that there were just tons of things out that I'd never seen or tried before. You know, meat pies. What's a kidney pie? I don't know. I want to try it. You know, I'll try anything once. I want to try those things. I want to experience it. I want to. I want to go into the beautiful neighborhoods. I want to see beautiful mountains. I want to see waterfalls. I want to, I want to be there. You know, I've never been on top of the Eiffel Tower. I've been to Paris probably a dozen times. But, you know, I've seen it. Okay, check it off. Yeah, I saw it. Cool. Don't need to go up on it. Don't need to do a lot of the touristy things. I'd much rather walk around a neighborhood and look at the architecture and grab some fruit from a stand and munch on it and just watch. I'm a people watcher because of an introvert is more introspective. You know, we observe a lot and we watch. We look at what's around us and we're constantly observing everything around us. And I do that in my travels, you know, but a lot of times I have, you know, if I'm on a plane, I'm not usually talking to the person next to me. I have my headphones on. I'm doing my own thing. But as far as fulfillment goes and doing, you know, even work, you know what gives me fulfillment with work? Well, you know, I make a good income, I enjoy my job. But does it fulfill me? Well, there's certain things about it that do, but my work's not my life, you know? Yeah.

Okay, well, that's cool. But you're saying though, that you, you find a similar type of fulfillment between chasing your passions in between and between success at work?

No, they're totally different. The success at work, I think if I were to look at what fulfills me at work is not making money or closing deals, even though I do both, that's not fulfilling. That's fun. I enjoy it. This doesn't do anything for me. What does it for me is having a voice, having a seat at the table. It's been interesting. I've been here five and a half years in a company that's eight years old, and I've seen massive change around me, and I've been able to influence that change. That's fulfilling. If I look at my sales team that I manage now, all of the things they do have everything to do with the way I do them, because that's what I do. I come in, I look at what's done, I figure it out, I build a system, I execute a system, and then I duplicate a system. That's just who I am. That's fulfilling to me.

So it's almost like. It's almost like work is a creative.

Outlet for you, for sure. Yep. I think we all have our creative. Like, as a chef, you know, I cook, but I don't even call myself a chef, because I know what chefs do, and chefs are brilliant. I'm a good cook. I take a recipe, I'll make it, and then I'll tweak it. I'll make it better. I don't usually come up with things from scratch, and I'm similar. I'm actually similar in business. I don't usually come up with the idea I make it better. You know, I look at our sales, and if you look, you know, we're now doing, as a company, more revenue per month than we did the first year I was here in on an annual basis. And that there's a lot of reasons why. But part of the reason is because we're growing and we have systems and we're. We. We scale those. And that's fun to be involved in that, because I'm really good at that. I'm really good at coming in. And when I came in, there were no systems. You know, in fact, I was talking to one of my guys today at lunch that he's like, I didn't know if you would last because you were not happy that there weren't this and that, and I wasn't. But I made them, and I built it, and I figured it out. And that is very much fulfilling to me.

Like, kind of like if you.

Teach.

A kid to tie their shoes, and then years later, you see that kid tying their shoes, and you're like, I taught him how to do that.

Right.

And so you look at the things that are going on at sales Rabbit, and you're like, you see this system, and now you're not even training somebody to do that somebody else is training to do that. And that's a thing that you built and created and put into sales Rabbit, and you're it flow throughout the company five years later. That's really cool.

I like that. And especially with the. In, you know, like I said, the influence is fulfilling the influence to be able to say, hey, you know what, we really need to head in this direction and then see the company do it. It's cool. You know, we. We used to do so many things differently than we do today, and it's cool to see that where I had something to do with that. Yeah.

Yeah, that's really cool.

Do you.

It in. In the. In the context of chasing your passions and in the context of fulfillment, like you said, you're saying you feel like the. The level of fulfillment or that type of fulfillment is different from. From each. Does it. Does it has something to do with the.

The.

Do you find that the.

The.

The chasing of your passions results in more growth or the creative outlet and doing what you do at work results in more growth? Where do you feel like you grow more? Is it an equal kind of thing?

That's a good question. I mean, for me, we're here on this earth, I believe so here's some joyous beliefs that come in. I believe we're here to grow. And I hear. I believe we're here to become. And so for me, all of that has to do with growth, whether it's business, whether it's personal, whether it's passions. I'm very. I'm a very driven person. At 21 years old, doing mortgages, you know, 25 years ago, I was making $80,000 a year, which is a lot for a 21 year old, you know, 20, 25 years ago. And I did it because, you know, it's funny, my. The guy that hired me, it was my girlfriend's uncle. And he. He took me to the county courthouse and. And he gave. And he showed me where to find judgments. And he said, look up these people and call them and ask them to let them know they have a judgment, see if they want to refinance. And I built a career out of that for many years, being really successful. And why? Because I took something and I built it and I figured it out and I scaled it and I made it better. And then I hired guys and scaled it with them, and then that's part of my skill set. And that's what I've done here too, as far as fulfillment goes. You know, being so driven has also driven me into the ground. I say, I've lived a lot of lives. I feel like I'm on my third life, and when I look at the previous lives, I look at it and say, yeah, you didn't do that right now. I don't believe in regret. I think regret. I've learned over in my life that regret is vain. And, you know, if you don't. If you regret, I think you're saying, I don't believe in my path. I don't like my path through life, and I love my path through life. And there are lots of mistakes, and I have made a lot of mistakes, but I learned from those mistakes and that I am who I am because of those mistakes, not in spite of. And so looking back and being so driven and seeing where it took me, did I find success? Yeah, huge success. You know, I started a company 15 years ago that, that was. That ended up being in every Sephora store in the world that was doing millions of dollars based on a couple of guys with an idea. Like, it was super cool, but it also. It also brought a lot of pain. There were lots of mistakes made. So when I look at what drives me and I'm so driven, part of my life lesson is to allow the flow of life to take me where it needs to. And that probably doesn't compute with somebody that's lazy because they just allow the flow of life to take them wherever the way they want it to. But for a guy that's really driven, I've had to learn to back off and realize that I can't make things happen. You allow things happen if you. If you're open to allowing life to take you where it needs to. Everything is a learning opportunity. Everything you experience has the opportunity to help you, to teach you to grow pain more than most. Oh, yeah. You know, if you ask any successful person out there, you will, and they're honest with you. There is a lot of pain. There's a lot of failure, and that's what made them who they are. And I'm no different. You know, I've been through. I've been through so many things, whether it's lawsuits, whether it's bankruptcy, whether it's death, and, you know, I've lost both parents, family drama. I mean, you name it, I've been there. Except for marriage, haven't done that one yet. That's. That's probably my next great adventure.

The whole new pain you get to figure out later.

Exactly. And I'm looking forward to all the ups and downs of it, you know, because I know it will be. Right.

Yeah. I mean, that's, you know, that's a, that's a whole journey in and of itself. I mean, so, I mean, you did say something there that I found interesting. That I think a lot of folks, especially in the entrepreneurial side and especially like you identifying with being a, a driven person and then making a statement like, I can't make things happen.

Yeah.

Like those two ideas. So like being successful, being driven and then saying something like, I, I let life take me where it's gonna go. Those two ideas, if you think about conflicts. Yeah. Like the things that are screamed at us.

Right.

Like 10x effort and the grind and make it happen and you can achieve your dream and all this kind of stuff. And then, then to hear you say, I'm a person who, who, who's accomplished a lot. I'm a very driven person. But I let life take me where it wants to go because I can't make things happen.

You.

That's like, that'll poke a few people in the eye, I think.

Yeah. And you know, somebody, somebody a little later on in life. And that's one of the things that I, I don't look my age, but I'm 46 and I've lived a lot of life and, and that teaches you. It brings a depth of wisdom. And wisdom comes from experience. And I have a lot of life experience. And you're right, it seems to conflict until you experience it and you realize that, you know, I was in the right place doing the right things many times and there were massive failures and problems and you just realize that they're there for you too. It is all for you. If you really realize that, you just back off and you're like, okay, what is it I'm to learn here? You know, I find myself in a bad situation and I, I don't, I don't fight for it to end. I ask what am I to learn? And let me stay in it until I've learned everything I need to. And that's a very different come from.

Let me stay in it till I've learned what I need to. Man, I can't. That pokes at some stuff in my own life where I've, I've had that own experience. Like I've, I've been in some times. I mean, there was a time in my life between, between my mid-30s. I'm sorry, my mid-20s and my early 30s. I thought like, I was in a bad place in almost every sector of my life, except for my health.

For.

Eight, almost 10 years. And I did get to a point where I just started asking myself, is this my new normal? And if this is my new normal, then I'm just going to adapt to life being this way. And I'm okay with just. I'm just going to set in it and just go with it like. Because there were those phases for me where I was like, is, am I just supposed to learn something here? Is that what's going on? Or is this what life is like? Because I thought this life is. This is what life is like. I got two options. Either A, I gotta end this right, get off the merry go round, or B, I adapt and make this my new normal and learn how to live in inside of this environment. And that was clearly, I made the second decision.

Thank goodness.

But I mean, it wasn't. I was not thinking I'm going to kill myself, but sure.

No, no, I get where you're coming from.

From a logical perspective, it was like, I either learn how to live here or you don't. What else are you gonna do?

And so for me, it has, it has everything to do with belief. Like you cannot. You know, what I'm not saying is that I believe in God and that I believe that he has me here to teach me certain things. Certain things that are really hard for me. And my certain things, Nathan, are very different from your certain things things. That's why our lives have been so different. Our lives haven't just been different because of our, our choices. If you really believe in. And I believe a God in a God that's omnipotent, which means all powerful and omniscient, which means all knowing. If he's all knowing, he already knows the choices I'm going to make. Do I have free choice? Yes, I do. But he knows what I'm going to do and he knows where I'm going and he knows what I need to do. So I have a. There's a. There's a. There's somebody in my church that taught me once that said, you know, life is a. Life is like a, like a curriculum. He uses the word curriculum a lot. And I like that because it's not like you have this set path you have to go on, but there's certain things you have to experience and I think it's individual. I have a very different life plan than you because I'm a very different person and I have very different things to learn. So if you believe that, which I do, then you look at life and say, it's not about all the things that we think it's about. It's about becoming. It's about, hey, I have weaknesses and I want to overcome them. I have. I have faults, and I want to grow past them, and I want to make as much progress here as I can. And that has everything to do with that attitude. It's founded upon that belief. It's founded upon what I believe and who I believe God is. I don't only believe in God. I believe Him. When he says that he has a path for me, then I believe him. And I want to follow that path. And I do that, you know, in my, my way of doing that is allowing him to guide my hand. And what it means is what that looks like. And maybe it looks different for each person. I don't know. What it looks like for me is I'm just constantly aware of what's happening around me. And instead of fighting against it and trying to make it, I back off and say, what's going on? You know, is it time for me to move on? Is it time for me to do something different? That's. That's what I'm doing when I'm, when I'm allowing.

I, you know, I, I know Jim Johnson's gonna watch this, and I think he's. I, I smell a new T shirt coming, becoming. I just, I just, I, I see that coming. Jim, I know you're gonna see this, and I know that you're probably gonna jump all over that. And if you do, good for you. I think that's pretty sweet. I love that I'm gonna. I shift gears here for just a little bit.

Sure, man.

If you're listening, if you're listening to this, before we move into talking about this, you should probably pause it, rewind it, and then just move through that little bit again and then just rest in those concepts for a second and think about your own life. Because those things Jory just shared, absolutely powerful. And I appreciate you, Joy, for doing that. I've got some other questions I want to ask, and I think you've got a little more time for me.

Right? Let's do it.

Cool.

So.

But what we're going to do is we are going to. We're going to hear a quick word from our sponsors and then come back and ask Jory some different stuff here. So we'll be right back.

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Welcome back everybody to this week's episode of Contractor Radio. I am sitting here having an amazing conversation with Jori Allen of Sales Rabbit and of, of life and of experience and of food. And so we just kind of were talking about some pretty deep and heavy components before and that was, that was super cool. I want to shift gears just a little bit in talking about some of these passions that you have and some of these things that you chase and that you do and that you make time for, either via story or some illustrations. What do you feel like are some of the greatest lessons you've learned that you've grown from through either, either through, either through your love of food or through your love of travel or the outdoors?

See, let's take outdoors. So I, I live in, I live outside of Salt Lake in Utah and I can be up on top of a mountain overlooking within, you know, usually an hour of wherever I'm at. And I do it often. And you know, when you're standing up on top of a 10, 11, 12,000 foot peak, looking around, you feel things, you feel, it's a different point of view. Things are more vast, you know, and it's cool too, as you're heading up depending on the peak. A lot of times as you're going, you're seeing layer after layer unfold and life is similar. The more, the more open you are and the more you're paying attention, the more layers you can see as you, as you traverse this life and mountains are the exact same way. Once you get up to the top and you're looking out, it's almost, I mean you can't, you can't leave, literally can't take it in. You're standing on a peak, there's nothing around. You can turn 360, there's nothing higher than you. And you're seeing the whole world unfold as far as you can see. And each, each way you turn is completely different. In one here you've got a valley with a city and you've got a mountain and mountains and peaks and rolling and then you go and open, there's another valley with another city and, and it's cool when you're hiking up because you are, it's unfolding before you and if you're, again, if you're looking around and you're paying attention, it's, it's, it's astonishing. You know, they, they call the mountains, they're, they're. What's the word? Majestic. And that's the perfect word. You get up to the top of a peak of a 1012,000 foot peak, that's the only word you can think of is this is majestic. It's.

We've got a few of those here in Colorado.

Yes, you do. Even higher than the ones in Utah.

Yeah, I've climbed my, my fair share of 14ers here and I can relate to what you're saying that. So now as far as like the lessons go, when you, when you talk about the concept of the different layers and I think sometimes our limitations on the ability to take certain things in.

Right.

Like our eyes can only see to a certain level. Right. Before you have to shift, how do you feel that that lesson or those two concepts. I think one of those things is limitation of observation perhaps, or perspective. And then the other one being like the different layers that you're noticing as you make your way through that journey. How have, how do you take those things and apply them to your life either personally or professionally?

Well, let's take an example. I read an incredible book called the Captain Class, which hit me like a ton of bricks because it was exactly me. I've never read anything that quite depicted me in a business setting more accurately. And it talks about these, these, these massive years and years of research that went into these teams that were wildly successful between, you know, even over years that they had multiple coaches. And when they really dug in, they found, they only found one consistent thing. It's. It was the team captain. That's how I view myself. I'm very protective of my team. You know, sometimes when they made me a manager, they said, hey, can you take this from a corporate point of view? And I'm like, to a degree, yeah. But I'm not going to protect. It's not my job to protect corporate. That's your job. My job is to protect my team. And that's what I do. And so the perspective changes based on where you're standing. You know, my CEO has a very different perspective than I do. My VP of sales has a different perspective. I don't have his perspective and I don't need to. That's his. I have my stewardship and it's over me at myself and my guys. It's not over the whole company. So I don't try to have that point of view. That's his job. Okay, So I don't know if that answers your question, but that's a big example.

I think it does. I think, like, that. That concept of realizing that, you know, you two, like, two of you might be standing on the same peak, like, you're seeing different things depending on which direction you're pointed.

Exactly.

Right. And that's. I think. And all those perspectives are important, right? Because I've done my fair share of climbing. And while you might be looking out this direction and you're going, oh, okay, so this may be our way down and where we're going to go, meanwhile, the guy you're climbing with is behind you, and he's like, oh, there's a storm coming.

Yeah, exactly.

And we need both of us.

Right?

So I think that is good. What is. What's your favorite story from your travels? Like, what's your favorite. Like, you think back and you go, oh, yeah. And that. That's just. That one is always when somebody says, what's your favorite story from traveling?

What.

What you got?

I don't get asked that. I asked. I get asked what my favorite places are. Favorite story. I don't know. I've had some odd things happen. I was walking around in Thailand, and it was strange because in the. In the first couple cities I was in, it was out in the country, and I was all alone, and I was by the beach and. And then I get to a big city and these people were just hounding me. You know, these girls would walk up and just, oh, massage, massage. And I'm like, what. What are you talking about? Like, it's. It was strange. It was strange to have people approach you and want something from you so directly that. And again, because I'm more introverted, I kind of. I don't. I pay attention to everything around me, but I don't engage in a lot of things. And so it was strange to have people coming up. And I actually didn't love Thailand for that reason, is that people kept poking at me all the time. And that must just be a cultural thing. I didn't enjoy it. I thoroughly enjoyed Bali in Indonesia. People don't bug you. And it's. And I much prefer that I don't. When I want to engage, I'll engage. I don't want people poking at me all the time.

You must love New York City, then. Nobody wants to talk to you there.

I do love New York City. I totally do. Absolutely. Right.

Okay, well then let's. Then kind of you, you're saying that this concept of layers of, of your path and also different, different perspectives was a major component that you learned from being out in nature and climbing mountains. Do you have a, a most impactful thing you've learned from traveling?

There's something, you know, people, the, the word culture gets thrown around a lot, especially on a corporate level. Oh, yeah. But when you're in a culture, you know, Bali is a good example. When you're in Bali, people are very religious, you know, but they're not religious the way you were raised with religion. They've got these little temples everywhere, their shrines, they, they practice it very differently from you. And that changes the culture, changes your experience. The way people are, the way people treat you has everything to do with not only the people they are, but the way they were raised, the culture they were raised in. You mentioned New York. New York is very different from Utah. You know, in Utah, it's, it's very rude to be so blunt. Back east, it's very normal to be blunt and people think it's rude. And I thoroughly enjoy it. I love it. You know, Tell me, tell me straight up. A lot of people aren't like that.

Yeah, no, that's, that's totally true. And I've definitely experienced that and I can relate to what you're saying on that.

So.

All right, I got two more questions for you.

Sure.

What is the best advice or guidance you ever got from a mentor?

The first thing I think of, I've studied many several years, years and years and years on a weekly basis for hours at a time with a Native American medicine man. And I loved it because it, to me, it was the gospel. It was just from a different point of view. And I couldn't. In all the years I studied with him, I never found anything that went against what I believe, which is astonishing. And one of the things he used to say was, he said, trust, must trust God. And I love it because some people are like, oh, I can't trust that person. I'm like, of course you can't. There's fallible as you are. Trust, must trust God. He's the only one we can trust, you know, so that's, that's one of the great, that's one of the great lessons of my life is, is trust and what faith is.

That's awesome. Alright, so last question. We've got a limited amount of time here on this, this spinning rock.

Right.

And so one of the things we. That, that we do with. With the podcast. Oftentimes we have guests is we ask them when your time is up and you're all done.

Right.

Can't take anything with us.

We're at.

We're out of here. What is the thing that you would want for people to remember you by or how would like. What is that?

I don't.

Legacy is such a charged word anymore. But when people remember Jory, what would you want them to remember most?

Well, it's interesting because when I. When you ask me that, I don't think of what I'd want. I think of what people say to me. You know, I think of. I think of the things people tell me that they enjoy my food. You know, they enjoy a good hug. I get that a lot because, like, when I hug, it's real hug. They. They enjoy. They enjoy the connection and the ability to not be surface. Those are the things that. When I think of when you ask people that are close to me what they enjoy about me, those are the things they say, and I really enjoy that. And it's not stuff I came up with. I kind of enjoy that even more. It's just who I am, and I want to perpetuate that. And I want to. When. When you say legacy, I think a lot of people think with business and this and that. Right. I don't. I mean, I love. I love things, and things are cool, but they don't mean anything when you've lost everything and when you have nothing, you realize that they don't. There's no value in things. Now do I enjoy them? Sure. I own two cars. They're both brand new. They're expensive cars. I like clothes. I like all those things. Do they mean anything to me? Nope. You know, you take it all away and I'll just go and get it again. I'll just go find a way. I'll just go. I'll go create something. It. It's taken me time, but here. But I'm back. You know, I built. I built it again. I may lose it all again, but, you know, it's not about. It's not about trying to. Not to get knocked down because you will get. It's just about keep getting back up. It's really all that matters. Awesome.

Well, so here's what I'm gonna do. I'm going to give you the heads up. We're going to close this thing out here in just a second with a takeaway you'd like to leave with anybody who listens to this something that you'd like to just leave with them that as they are are done listening to this. Our time together that you want to leave on their brain. And I'll give you a second to think about that while we get one more word from our sponsors.

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What's. What's.

What's something you'd like to leave them with?

You know, what's on my mind, and I didn't come into it thinking this, but it's just occurred to me as we're talking is one of the things I do that's made me who I am and has brought me a lot of fulfillment is just to. It's just to stop and look up. You know, sometimes when you're hiking and I hike a lot, you know, hike thousands and thousands of miles every year, on the way up, I look up. You know, I'm not looking down at the ground. I'm looking up, I'm looking around. I'm stalking and taking pictures. Now on the way down, I'm running and I'm going and I'm looking at the ground. But when I'm on the way way up, I take the time to look up and to look around and to. That's what I would take away or want to leave with you, is take a minute and look around you. Look at the people, look at the things that have meaning to you. Notice them, appreciate them.

Yeah, I love that. Because it also requires you to take your eyes off yourself.

Yes, it does.

That's awesome. Jory, thank you so much for your time. I really appreciate you, brother. All right, we'll see you next week on Contractor Radio.