How Kiwi plant-based food startup is gaining market share by focusing on meat reducers.

And welcome to this episode of The Unnoticed Entrepreneur. Today we're going to meet an old friend from Beijing who's living in what could well be paradise, Waiheke Island in New Zealand. Welcome to Jade Gray, that's G-R-A-Y, who is the founder of a company called Off-Piste Provisions. Jade, welcome to the show.

Jim, great to chat.

Well, it's so good to see you. I mean, you and I knew each other in Beijing. You built GungHo pizzas there, and then you sold that to the, to the team in Beijing, but you'd built a thriving business there. Then you moved back to New Zealand in 2019, and so quickly you've built a business that's already pioneering in the meat alternative food business. And so I'd love to talk to you about how you're really changing the whole sort of category, because you're building beef jerky without the beef, Jay. So tell us about Off Beast Provisions and what you're doing.

Yeah, so Off-Peas Provisions, we're a food technology company that's looking to make impact through the reduction of greenhouse gas emissions and in particular animal livestock. So our solution to that challenge in New Zealand, about 50% of greenhouse gas emissions come from livestock, is to get rid of the cow. As simple as that. And the way we're doing that is through some pretty Pretty smart food tech, which takes the humble pea and turns it into a pretty healthy and appetizing snack. In our case, a bunch of what we call alternative meat snacks. So think of beef jerky, pork crackling, or what you may call up in UK, I think you call them pork scratchings. In America, pork rinds. We've got beer sticks and a bunch of alternative snacks, which we're selling through New Zealand, Australia, and the US.

I love this on so many levels, Jade, and you're a pioneer in Beijing. Tell us a little bit about the origins of Off-Piste, and then later on you're going to tell us about how you've been crossing the chasm because building a new business is hard enough, but you're building it in a whole new category. as well in terms of these plant-based meat alternatives. So tell us a little bit about the genesis of Off-Peace.

Well, it goes back to '96 when I first moved to China, and my job there was running a cattle feedlot operation up in northern China, right out in the back sticks of, uh, of Dongbei, which is northeast China. Um, and after running that, I went into meat processing with OSI and McDonald's and Ran butcheries for Costco and I was right in the meat space. But I lost, yeah, I just lost passion, interest in the sector. I got to see under the hood and I wasn't that inspired. So got out of the industry, got into restaurants, built that out for the best part of 20 years, Jim, as you know, and you're a frequent guest at one of my pizza chains.

Yeah, wonderful Gung Ho Pizzas.

They were. Yep. Still going strong in Beijing. But during that time, near the end of the venture in about 2016, we really got on the whole sustainability impact journey. And that was a— in China was quite pioneering. And we were actually the first B Corp certified food and beverage company in China and the third B Corp in China full stop. So it was definitely kind of pioneering in that regards of impact. But during that journey, we really analyzed our carbon footprint. And the big, I guess, epiphany was that animal products just had such a larger footprint than plant-based in real terms. And we're talking, you know, 8 to 10 times larger footprint for the same equivalent of nutrition. So that was really the epiphany for me. And then we came across plant-based meats and plant-based dairy. And that was what just opened my mind up to this whole new world of, wow, okay, this can be a really viable solution without having to sacrifice on the eating experience. So when we started business, moved back to New Zealand, looking at New Zealand's greenhouse gas emissions being livestock, we said, hey, let's attack that. Let's get rid of the cow and use pea. And we effectively use pea protein and some really smart food technology. to mimic effectively meat.

I think, you know, it's, it's fantastic. You know, I think you used Off-Piste Provisions. Is that because of your original fascination with skiing, Jade? How did the name come about?

Yep, that's definitely part of it. Well, when I came back, um, I've always loved the outdoors, Jim, and I was looking at, you know, the next chapter and how do I bring outdoors back into my life, uh, but also looking at the whole plant-based meat space and saying, well, how the hell do these two kind of get connected. And then I stumbled across the whole ambient shelf life, you know, shelf-stable products, which don't require the cool chain. And when you head out into the mountains, backpacking trails, cycling, skiing, you name it, obviously people pack their provisions and they put them in the backpack. You can't go to the local convenience store. So all of our food technology is built around 18 months shelf life, which is our real point of difference compared to a lot of the other products in market. So Yeah, that was the, I guess, the marriage of the two. And now I get to go skiing and do a film shoot. And apparently, it's part of the work.

Well, you've always been brilliant at combining your business with your lifestyle as you did in Beijing and now you're doing down there in Liviu and Waiheke, which is just such an amazing place just off Auckland, I think, isn't it? Now, tell us a little bit about how you're building the business because, you know, this show is about how entrepreneurs are building a business. as much as the business they're building. So, Jade, building any business is tough. You've done it in China, now you're doing it in New Zealand. What are some of the challenges that you're facing and that you're dealing with and how are you overcoming those?

Yeah, I think every venture has its own challenges and you can be, you know, experienced at entrepreneurship, but each venture poses so many new challenges that you've never encountered. For me, actually, it was coming back to New Zealand. There's a kind of a reverse culture shock. Spending 20 years up in China and then having to set up teams and investors and navigating the landscape, you know, regulatory and culturally in New Zealand. So it was definitely the first kind of awakening. It was like, okay, this is a new game again. So time to learn. COVID obviously was a big kicker. We, you know, about 8 weeks before we were going to market, there was a lockdown in New Zealand for 6 weeks. And that completely threw out You know, production, pre-market, launch, branding, you name it. So I think that crisis management, and I had gone through SARS in China, I lost a business during SARS in 2003. So I did lean on that experience. And the experience I learned there is, you know, during crisis, you need to make decisions based on imperfect information. And you can't wait to get all the information. You've really got to, if you wait, you pretty much die. So I took the front foot during COVID and we just plowed ahead, obviously cautiously, but we didn't hold back. We didn't wait. We just got on with business as usual and found a way. So yeah, I think that was definitely one of the bigger challenges recently. And then food technology, you know, it's quite a new space for me. I come out of a more marketing background, food, but not so much food technology and working with universities. You know, I'm surrounded by people with PhDs and Yeah, more degrees than I can bloody pronounce. But it's so fascinating being with these highly intellectual people and challenging them, you know, from an entrepreneur's point of view, from a marketing point of view, from a brand awareness point of view, not just around the science. And so I think that marriage of having a consumer-centric design process, which is where I come in, and then having very much a food technology science approach, which is where the, uh, you know, our science team come in. It really creates that, that friction you need to come up with great innovation. Um, so yeah.

Sorry, so looking at the, at the product packaging, um, just to touch on that, can you talk about marketing? Although this is plant-based, you've got pictures of cows on the front. Do you want to just tell us a little bit about the design philosophy and strategy you've taken there? Because, uh, Absolutely.

It's probably the most contentious part of our brand. Jim's well picked up. A couple of things. One, when you're designing packaging, you know, the packaging's really got to work on the shelf. You can't rely on other marketing when you've got a small budget and you're dealing across hundreds of stores. You need to have the packaging doing the heavy lifting. So catching people's attention is key. We design not because it looks great. It needs to look great compared to your competition. So you've got to mock up packaging and then put it on the shelf and look, how does it look on the shelf, not on the computer screen? And one thing we noticed is that our target market actually are meat reducers. They're not vegans, they're not plant-based. They're people who eat meat who are trying to eat less meat. So when they walk down the jerky aisle, they don't want to see packages of peas. They want to get their attention triggered by a new product offering. They look at it and then it says plant-based in big font. So we're not trying to fool anybody, but we get their attention when they're looking for their meat jerky. And then they're like, ah, actually I wouldn't mind trying that because I'm trying to cut back on my red meat. So that was a key part of that. I think the second thing is, and I learned that from running abattoirs, whilst it seems socially acceptable to celebrate the slaughter of pretty sentient beings, We actually like to celebrate the lives we've saved. So we don't see anything wrong with putting up the animals that we're actually trying to somewhat avoid slaughter, but at the same time offer an eye-catching packaging for a consumer.

Nice. And you've got the sort of magic roundabout. People remember this in the UK, Ermine Trude, the cow is actually eating a flower. So it's got a little bit, I was going to say tongue-in-cheek, but flower-in-cheek for the cow as well. Jade, what about distribution then as well for the product? Because you're launching from Waiheke Island, which is a tiny island. You're going global. You've got now over 700 locations in New Zealand. You've launched in Australia. You're going into the USA on Amazon. How have you managed to get the distribution?

I think it's about having a really clear marketing strategy and where a consumer sits. Where do they shop? Where do they hang out? That's actually the harder part. Once you identify that, then the distribution in our approach becomes quite simple. You understand who operates in those areas and those channels and those sectors. But really identifying who needs your product, not who wants it. And I think that's where we see some brands fall down. They're trying to target, be, you know, everything for everyone. But we're saying who actually needs it and who would miss it if they don't have it in their life. And so we identified the outdoor market and also the convenient, what we call conscious consumer market. So once we identify that, what we call a brand persona or the avatar, we just then understand their lifestyle where they hang out and then make the contacts and What you'll find is those category managers of those stores who are dealing with that consumer, they get the story straight away. You know, but if you start knocking on doors and you think you're trying to chase these big chains and that's just not who your niche is right now, yeah, you don't get much love.

Jay, that's a really good insight as well about sort of to some degree niching down. Have you been doing much social media or has it been word of mouth? What's been the way that the brand has grown?

I think you've got to cut through the noise, right? And the only way you're going to cut through is leaning into your strengths. You can't try to emulate somebody's strengths if you don't have it, is my approach. You can neutralize your weaknesses, but to really lean into your superpowers. And in the day, it's storytelling. There's a thousand ways to tell a story through dance, through music, through color, through You know, oration. There's different ways. So you've got to work out what is your superpower of storytelling. For me, it's actually mainstream media, PR. And I've just honed that over the years. I think in China, you're forced to talk to a lot of PR. Back in the day, everybody from Wall Street Journal to BBC would call you about some story about China and the like. And you got pretty good at that game. And I missed the whole social media thing. I'm an Xer who was never good at computers in general. So for me, it's mainstream. And the thing I've picked up on that was really about that story, which has legitimacy and the mainstream media wants some legitimacy, whether it's your reputation, whether it's the venture, whether it's your backers, whatever. And what I clicked on in New Zealand was legitimacy of having government funding in our grants. So we got a lot of research grants. And by getting that seal of approval from Ministry of Primary Industries through Callaghan Innovation, you know, Ministry of Business Enterprise, you get those ticks from the government and then the mainstream media felt safe to bring you on and really push you because you've already been, you know, somewhat screened and certified. So that's something I leaned into early. And leverage that to get that PR.

That's really, really interesting because on your website you don't have lots of social media tags. Um, it looks like Instagram and TikTok actually, uh, and not Facebook and not Twitter and, and all these other. So that's really interesting, being able to build distribution in, to some degree, a conventional way but with an unconventional product. Jade, fascinating how you've done that.

Yeah, I think it was because it's unconventional that there was a story there for them. But then for them to know that you're not some crackpot, they wanted to see that you'd already had some sign-off. So definitely, it's not to say we're not doing social media, absolutely. But I think that's more around community building. And for us, that takes time. And we appreciate to get— we've got really high engagement with our community. We're not about just numbers, we're about engagement. And that takes a long time. But to get that initial cut through, mainstream media still has a lot of power. And especially for our target market, which actually was Generation X and baby boomers, who are the key meat reducers, that's still where they get the majority of their news and information.

Yeah, that's the credible news source, isn't it? Still for most, well, you and I are the same generation, actually a bit older there, closer to boomer than X, right? At my level. Jade, what about overcoming, You know, the chasm, you know, I love to talk about how you get across to the other side. From a marketing point of view, plainly doing that, but also what about aspects of, for example, like talent, finding the people to come and work with you, especially when you are a startup, you're doing what some might consider to be an oxymoron, beef jerky without the beef. So kind of hard sell there. How have you overcome that issue?

Yeah, I think Off-piste, I mean, in regards to talent, and everybody talks about talent being the biggest asset, but I just see so many people who don't actually walk the talk on that. And it takes time. You know, this is about building trust. It's about building relationships. And that takes time, like in any relationship. So, you know, I definitely call myself the chief recruitment officer for the first 2 years of any startup. Maybe on my name card, it's CEO or founder, but that's not how I think. It's about recruitment. and recruiting stakeholders and in particular employees. So, you know, every day you're selling the dream and I don't care if they've sold the— if they've signed the contract, that means nothing tomorrow. You know, you've got to keep selling the dream and getting that engagement. And that again, it's about time. It's about understanding what their aspirations are and aligning that and trying to allow them to link how their aspirations tie in with your aspirations. So we spend a lot of time around alignment. And I think the other thing around that is identifying the skills you don't have early in the piece because as an entrepreneur, you need to obviously wear multiple hats. And I prefer wearing hats that I feel confident in than trying to wear hats that I'm not confident in. So doing the organizational chart, if you look at The E-Myth, for example, talks about building out the chart right from day one and then putting yourself in every seat, but slowly taking yourself out of those seats. And I definitely take that approach.

Well, and Jade, you also did that very well in China and using Vern Harnish's scaling up and doing those workshops and so on. You really empowered your team really amazingly well. Jade, with the Off Beast provisions, from a marketing point of view, is there anything that you felt You've done? I know it's only been a short amount of time, you had great success, but anything you feel that you've done that really didn't yield the results that you'd suggest people don't, you know, don't try at home?

Uh, yeah, I mean, to be honest, we, we tend to fail fast and just move on. Um, so I don't spend a lot of time doing autopsies. And, uh, you know, if there's— I, I definitely take an approach of throw 10 things at the wall You know, 2 are going to stick. Don't ask why the 8 didn't, just double down on the 2 that did. So I don't think I actually, and I'd like to give you a more concise answer, Jim, but I think that to me is more about it. It's just moving on. Don't dwell on mistakes. Don't dwell on what didn't work. It may have worked. It may work tomorrow. It may have worked yesterday. It just didn't work today. It doesn't mean that the planning was wrong or execution was off. Sometimes there's things you just don't that just don't align and you just got to move on. And so I tell my team, like, you know, let's celebrate the failures and move on. You know, if there's something to take out of it, absolutely. But let's not dissect it and look for blame or accountability or, you know, if anything, at the end of the day, it sticks with me. I'm a marketing guy. If we got the marketing wrong, well, it's on me.

No, and I love that idea that you don't take it personally, Jade. I think that shows a great deal of self-confidence actually as well, that you can move on so quickly from failure. Genius. Well, and that's why you're so successful and across so many different categories and in so many different countries as well. Jade, you've also raised money with— just a sort of one quick question. You've raised money. Can you give advice on how you raised the money? Because you're in a niche category, a growing category, but you're in a location not so close to big markets. How did you overcome that story to investors?

I think the key thing is one, you've got skin in the game. So they need to see that, whether it's time or money. They need to see you've definitely got skin in the game at the start. So I started the venture with my own funds. And it wasn't, you know, we're not talking huge amounts of money, but it was enough to get traction, get, you know, start the journey of getting a prototype. The other thing is over the years, I've always kept in touch with mentors and people who I've come across on the journey. Who I was inspired by, and I just kept them up to date with my story. And there's kind of that adage, don't fall at Buddha's feet in time of need. And so I'd always keep in touch with these people, and I generally enjoyed being in touch with them. And they'd always say, hey, if you ever got a venture, look me up. And that was fine. And some of them literally 10 to 15 years later, I've kept in touch. And when it did come about, I started firing a few emails saying, hey, I've got something. you know, brewing. Are you interested? And the response was, I think I literally approached 4 people and 3 came on as pre-seed, you know, um, I got the funding. I mean, we, we raised our first $1.5 million about, it was less than 24 hours. Um, because I literally fired out an email at about 2 AM in the morning on the Friday night. And by 6 AM, um, we had the funding. Um, and so that wasn't, you know, because of a great idea or because I'm an incredibly, you you know, gifted entrepreneur. It was just because I kept in touch with people who believed in me. And then I put a pretty reasonable idea in front of them and they, yeah, they backed it. And the last thing is probably, you know, we've done 4 rounds to date, you know, in a relatively short amount of time. And all of those pre-seed investors have stayed on for 4 rounds, which to me is the real, you know, that's the real sign of approval from them. But the key is we're, you know, you're always raising money and the best time to raise money is when you don't need it. So, you know, I'm constantly raising and it's not trying to get checks. It's just trying to connect with people who may want to back us at some point and then staying in touch. And I send out weekly emails, just, it's literally a minute read and it's just people who've been interested in my journey. I fire out an email, one minute. It's got 3 points. It's a highlight of the week, lowlight of the week. What's looking promising and a photo. And that's it. And it just keeps people in touch because often we go looking for money and we don't get it. And then you just kind of give up and you don't come back to them. It's like, well, maybe the time wasn't right for that person, that VC or whatever. So yeah, that's the way I've approached it.

Jay, I love that. So many wonderful points to take away from there, including this idea of keeping the relationships going with people, as you say, not falling at Buddha's feet just when you're in crisis, but paying homage and sort of showing up, you know, in a consistent way as well. Jade Gray over there in Waiheke Island, if you want to reach out to you, or frankly, I'd love to go back to Waiheke. I went there once many, many years ago and fell in love with it. If you want to find out more about you and Off-Piste Provisions, where can they do that?

Yeah, we're at, um, a website on offpeacedeprovisions.com. Uh, you can follow us on Instagram at Off-Piste Provisions. LinkedIn, they're probably the 3 areas you'll get in touch. And then I'm sure I can share my email, Jim, in your notes and happy for people to reach out. And we are looking for partners, especially up in the United States. We're currently doing a Series A fundraise, which is quite exciting. So yeah, definitely keen to meet people who are keen to move the plant-based movement forwards in the US.

Jade, great. I've been hoping to have this conversation with you for a long time. Thank you so much for taking me up on the invitation to come on the show.

No, a lot of fun, Jim. Thanks for the invite. Cheers.

Well, isn't that fantastic? So plant-based alternatives, building a business from a paradise, really, Waiheke Island. But Jade, he's being very, um, um, modest there, but he is a brilliant marketeer and also a brilliant entrepreneur. And I can vouch for both those because I've seen him succeed in China and now in New Zealand. So if you've enjoyed this show, do please share it with a fellow unnoticed entrepreneur. And if you've got a chance to review it on your favorite player, then do that because that really helps us with the show. And in the meantime, just encourage you to keep on communicating. Thank you for listening.