How your brands can go to life with an effective PR communication strategy; with Fiona Goldsworthy

Hello and welcome to this episode of The Unnoticed Entrepreneur. Today I'm really excited to have a business partner and someone who is running the UK's number one tech PR company called Brands to Life. I'm joined by Fiona Goldsworthy, who is the MD of Business and Technology at Brands to Life. Fiona, joining me from London, welcome to the show.

Hello and thank you very much for having me on today.

Well, it's delightful to have you on the show because we've had a lot of business clients together and I've really enjoyed working with you and the team at Brands to Life. Now, as a multiple number one rated agency in the UK, tell us, how do you help tech companies to get noticed?

Well, there's a variety of ways to do that. Ultimately, what it comes down to is very good storytelling. We've been very lucky since our co-founders, Giles and Sarah, set up the business 22 years ago now, I think, that we've always had tech at the heart of what we do. But as we've seen recently, tech has really taken off and become pervasive around the world, accelerated by the pandemic. And yeah, I think how we tell the stories is fundamental to getting them noticed.

Fiona, what makes a good story as far as the media are concerned? Because every entrepreneur thinks that their own story is great, but that's not always exactly how the media sees it. So take us through that, can you?

Absolutely. I think it comes down to, you can just tell a story for the sake of a good story. We've got some serial entrepreneurs, some very successful entrepreneurs around the world, some of them South African based in the States without naming names, who are very good at being controversial. And that's how they get the headlines. Former presidents have been very good as well at getting headlines. For us, what we like to do is look at better stories for bigger impact, which is our mantra. And what we mean by that is looking To see what a brand, a client, an individual wants to actually achieve from a business perspective, and then working backwards to find out how to communicate that. And when I say communicate that, it's from an earned perspective, or if you say from a media perspective, it is mapping it onto the wider world, finding out why it's relevant to the wider world, and then communicating that. The other big thing for good story is also thinking about the audience, because not everyone's story will be relevant in the same way to different audiences, which is how you make sure that you land the right message in the most compelling way in the right medium.

So Fiona, you've used the term there, you know, talked about mapping the story from the entrepreneur to the wider world. How do you do that from a practical point of view? You make it sound easy, but that's part of the skill that Brandstolite brings to the table, isn't it? How do you do that for an entrepreneur?

There are many ways of doing it. So many of us and our heritage came from earned. When I say earned, you know, is pitching to the media. A lot of us still speak to journalists. Journalists day in, day out. And when I say journalists, I mean analysts as well. I mean influencers. I mean blog posts, podcast hosts, if you like, everyone who has a way or an outlet where they want to share interesting stories. So from speaking to them, we understand what resonates. We read the media avidly. A lot of us consume so much media, whether that's traditional newspapers, online newsletters, blog posts, podcasts, video. All of us are constantly consuming different ways of telling stories. We're very lucky to be right next to the Tate Modern. here in London as well. So, we recently, some of our team went out to be inspired by art, you know, storytelling through visual media as well. So, it's partly about understanding the media and how it works, but then, as we've grown as a company, we have become multidisciplinary. And by that, what we mean is we don't just rely on storytelling to the media. So, we have a video and studio team who do creative storytelling. They do video, visual ways of telling stories. We have social teams who do a lot via social, so we can get the same story or narrative out on LinkedIn. That's all kind of the output. The upfront bit comes from this analysis and insights, and we have a dedicated insights and analytics team here as well who do a lot of that research. They have various tools and platforms, but also the methodology to understand and unpick what it is that a tech entrepreneur wants to achieve and how to basically go about ultimately delivering that through a relevant story or the right kind of medium.

Well, you've got A lot in there, Fiona, you've made, you know, and I know you guys have an amazing team and create a great deal of work. You have talked about multidisciplinary. Could you maybe sort of give us your definition of public relations now? Because in the past, an agency like Brands to Life would be known for, if you like, just media relations, media outreach and placements. What do you think has changed now in terms of the mix of communications? that an entrepreneur or a company needs to have in order to get noticed?

So, public relations. I mean, I think it's still fascinating that my parents don't fully understand what I do. What is it you actually do? And the way I position it to them is that we help to manage the perceptions of our clients and brands externally. Mostly what we do is positive and proactive storytelling. We do have crisis comms here, of course, for when things go awry. But I think PR, it very much depends on the sector you're in and which part of the business you're supporting. Because if you're in-house, PR is keeping things out of the papers, potentially, if you think about it. From a shareholder or an investor relations agency, it might be about crafting the best possible story for shareholders. Increasingly, we're seeing PR actually encompasses so many other things, including employer branding. You know, it's now about positioning a company amid the talent war, the Great Resignation, how to become an employer brand of choice. So, internal comms becomes hugely important. important as well. So it's quite hard to define what PR is now, but I would still go back to saying it is about trying to control or influence the external perception of a brand, a company, an individual. And in terms of multidisciplinary and what we do here, as I said, tech is at the heart of what we do. And we are, the team that I help look after here at Brands Life is the number one tech team in the UK, thanks to PR Week. But we also have a thriving corporate and purpose business. We have a thriving consumer business. We have a thriving digital and social business, a thriving health and wellbeing business as well. And then, as I mentioned, there's a video and studio. So, we have a US office set up as well. So, we have lots of different ways of reaching into different sectors, going beyond tech, but then also about how we bring that to life. So, we don't just rely on earned, but we have multiple other ways of getting the message out to the right audience.

Fiona, you've mentioned there that you've got different teams for tech, for corporate, for consumer, for healthcare. Why are they different? Why would you not have the same team working on different kinds of companies? Is not all PR the same?

Very good question. I mean, when I say different teams, it's more from an organizational perspective and to know where a brand might sit or where a new business pitch, who would be looked after. We are very much in sort of a matrix structure where we have some people in my team who work on a corporate account. We have people in digital and social who also have predominantly tech clients. So we can access all those different skills from different teams so we can offer the client the best mix that they require. But ultimately, it's so we have the pools of expertise. And I think the difference between tech storytelling and, for example, corporate and profile, corporate and purpose, those 2 teams, is we all do lots of corporate storytelling for our tech clients. Corporate, we'll do lots of corporate storytelling for all sorts of different brands, all sorts of different industries. And that's probably the main difference between that. But as I said, there's a lot of sharing expertise, skills, talent, and we all sit, we used to sit in the same office here. Now, obviously there's a lot more virtual and remote working, but we're all in the same building, very much the same company. And it's that access to those different skills that makes, I think, Brands to Life such an interesting and long-term place to work, which is why we keep people for a long time, but also a lot of our clients with us for a long time because they can see that we help them evolve their offering and we can cater to different requirements.

So you've raised an interesting issue there about the evolution of communications strategy as a company grows and goes maybe from founder to different series and maybe even IPOs or exits. What guidance can you give entrepreneurs in terms of helping their PR strategy to change over time as the company grows? Because that's another challenge, isn't it? It's not static at all.

I think this is where the insights and analytics is so important. Regular check-ins. I think we are very entrepreneurial and innovative, which is why we set up a health and wellbeing team a few years back, which is why Giles and Sarah set up a US presence. And I think we like to try new things every year. We try and do something that's a bit new. That's how we like to win awards because we do something new and innovative for our clients. But you can only do that if you keep trying to do something new and don't just fall back to what always works. That's not to say Don't reinvent the wheel, but how can we tweak things, make things better? So, we have regular reviews with our clients, monthly, quarterly, half-yearly, however often we can, where we check in on the progress. We check in on whether what we are delivering for the client ultimately is having an impact on their business. And if not, then let's tweak it and let's adapt it. And this is the best way for us to stay close to the business, to figure out what their business objectives are. How they want to be perceived and how to work with them. So the strategy and analytics that comes in, often we help them understand that actually doing what they've done to date isn't going to help get them in front of that C-suite audience, or is it going to help them move into this new market? Increasingly, we're seeing when we stay with brands or clients for a long time, they've gone from, you know, Series A to Series D, they're looking to list, that's when they need to really start building their brand and their profile. And that's where you realize they have challenger brands snapping at their heels. You know, I think VMware is a great example of a client of ours we've had for over 10 years. They came to us as a challenger brand, I believe it was to Microsoft, and now they're the incumbent and they've got all these other brands snapping at their heels. And it's the hype cycle. So, it's helping them evolve throughout that hype cycle, helping them evolve their story, the messaging, the proof points, and helping grow with them as they evolve their narrative. Because what the narrative or the story that a tech entrepreneur might tell at the beginning of the company or the beginning of the launch It's very different to what you stand up and say one year after you've listed to shareholders and to a company that now has, you know, 500+ employees. So we work with them on that. And a big part of that is helping them unpick and understand the communication that's required at each stage.

Okay. So you've mentioned the key person there, and obviously, you know, my fellow unnoticed entrepreneurs, what would you say would be maybe one of the key challenges that you've met with entrepreneurs as clients, what would you give them as advice on how to best use the agency or to embrace public relations, Fiona?

I would say treat us as consultants. And a very good friend of mine actually works for a major management consultancy, and I need to get him to write this down so I can share it with everyone officially. But he says that PR should be paid a lot more because As consultants, we often have the ear, you know, we're doing briefings with the CEOs of these big companies. We're speaking to very influential journalists. We're speaking to the customers. We're speaking to your future superstar talent hire. So, I think it's treating your comms agency as consultants listening to the advice, because what we love about tech founders or tech entrepreneurs is the passion and their belief in what it is that they are. bringing to market or what they want to launch. The problem can be that if they see comms or PR as an afterthought or as an executional vehicle, as opposed to being part of that process, is that they won't take any feedback on board, and then you might not get the best possible results for the launch. And again, that passion, I don't want to do any disservice to that passion because it is so wonderful and powerful, and it comes across when they're speaking to journalists, investors, when they're speaking to new hires. customers, et cetera. But often we can help them shape the story so that story can be told in a more powerful and in a more compelling way than they might originally have anticipated.

Now I've got a question for you here, Fiona, around, you know, which one should get the most profile? Should it be the CEO, the founder of the company, or should it be the brand of the company? Now there's sort of two schools of thought, aren't there? You know, should you be building the CEO brand or the corporate brand? And we've seen successes from brands and obviously in the early days, Alan Sugar, for example, being another one. So which way should a company proceed? CEO profiling or brand profiling? There's a bit of a teaser for you.

There's no right or wrong answer. I think it depends very much on the company and on the brand. There you go. There's a politician's response for you.

That's right.

I think you can do a lot with the CEO and the founder. You can do a lot with, particularly if they're willing to go out and be authentic. Show that what they're, what it is that they're developing, launching actually has a purpose in the world, particularly nowadays where there is an emphasis on purpose. There's an emphasis on making the world a better place. There's an emphasis on helping your staff to address mental health challenges, helping to address climate change. If they're willing to be authentic and be real, then there is a huge opportunity for them because increasingly people want to work for inspirational people. I think, you know, working for an Apple or a Nike or a Google, increasingly that's shifting. If you speak to younger audiences now, they want to work for companies where they can feel that they're helping the world or they're making a difference. That's not to say that any of those companies aren't, far from it. It's just, there's a different shift. And what we're seeing internationally as well, where there are talent challenges and companies are struggling to compete, if the country leader or the CEO is out there and visible, they're more likely to actually hire. or make that hire because they feel they can relate to that individual. So, I think that relatability and authenticity is very important, but you must not neglect the brand because the CEO doesn't always stick around. And I think it's important to know that the brand stands for more than just one individual. I would actually argue that it's not necessarily about whether it's the CEO, the founders, or the brand, but it's also about shining a light on the people who work within the business as well. We've had a lot of success By shining a light on female engineers working for companies or developers. So, people doing the actual work, helping to build it. And that's an interesting story rather than the very polished CEO at the top who has been trained and media trained and isn't going to slip up or show any ounce of personality. So, I think those days are gone and that authenticity is really important.

Well, that's really interesting and great answer, by the way. And I think so, really need to have both. Is the answer, not one or the other. That's fantastic. Now, as a company, Brands to Life, as you say, it's been over 20 years, 3 years successive top of the rankings in the UK for tech. How is Brands to Life as a company getting noticed? This is a question, a PR question for a PR agency.

Yes, obviously it's important to show that we can do PR for ourselves as much as we can for our clients. The way to do it, in my honest opinion, and I think that's the same for what I'd say for clients. is not just being controversial, not having a view for the sake of it, but making sure it aligns with what it is we're trying to achieve. So, if there is a story that breaks that we have a strong view on, or we have helped solve a challenge previously for, that's where we'll put our hand up for it. And I think our co-founders are still very visible. They will often contribute to PR Week activities, but increasingly the MDs across the business, our digital and social MD, Kinda Jackson, she talks a lot on podcasts. She was out at the Cannes Festival recently. Our head of consumer has very— our MD of consumer, she has lots of very strong views on creativity and how to hone that. So, we try and get that out. But one thing that's really worked well for us is our Tech Trends event that's been going for 10+ years now. And each January, we get together some, I think it's 4 illustrious journalists from across the likes of the BBC, Forbes, Channel 4, New York Times, Metro, and we ask them for their predictions for the year ahead and what the big tech trends will be. And that has been something that Our customers, our prospects, but the industry generally keeps coming back to. And we have lots of people who we've never worked with, but they turn up regularly every single year because they know it's an event they don't want to miss. Used to be in person. Unfortunately, it's now mostly virtual, but that's not to say it won't go back to being hybrid or in person again. And I think it's having something that is central to what we do, where we're showing we can help add value and making sure that we're getting out there and being seen again in the right places. So I wouldn't necessarily want to go and do a podcast with Sky News on the latest in supply chain challenges, but I'm very pleased to be here today to be talking about how to help tech entrepreneurs get noticed, speaking to you for your target audience. I think it is thinking again about the target audience. So being in the industry, being visible. And again, you know, I think it's important that the co-founders, but the MDs are also out there so that when we're looking to hire people, they know who it is that they're going to be working for.

Right. That's really wonderful. And now, as you say, you're both participating in the industry, but also leading and facilitating the industry in discussions as well, which is also fantastic. I will ask you, what trend do you think there is in PR? If you were to look, Fiona, at the next 3 to 5 years, what would be your sort of view on what is coming next for PR for business owners?

That's a very good question. You won't hold me to this in 3 years' time?

I will be checking back in 3 years' time and cross-referencing what you say today with what you said then.

We actually, one of our Tech Trends panelists does that every year. He comes up and holds everyone to account for the previous year. But I think my prediction is we will continue to see different channels. When we're interviewing 21-year-olds straight out of university and we ask them, how do they get their news? Very few of them say the BBC or The Guardian or the FT. They refer to TikTok, they refer to these threads on Reddit, they refer to this whole other world. And I think this diversity of platforms is coming in, which means we have all these different channels, which means we have to tailor the message accordingly to think about how we get the message across and also be creative. That's not least because, as we've seen, traditional newspapers are shrinking. I remember buying sort of the New York Times or the Sunday Times at the weekends and it being a huge read, whereas it's thinner and thinner. That's not to say that I think earned media won't go away. It's still very important. It's just harder to get into it. But then when you do get that wonderful piece in the New York Times or on the BBC or in the Handelsblatt, it's all the more powerful because it's a story that's resonated. It hasn't, it's not pay for play to get it there, but it's a journalist that's looked at the story, investigated the story, and written hopefully at the very least neutral, impartial, ideally a positive piece about the brand or the tech entrepreneur. So if anything, this plethora of channels and different platforms means that the power of earned is even more important. But we have to keep adapting, we have to keep innovating. And I think the future of PR is that it will become, it will remain and become more important. It will just take shape in different ways and it won't be the traditional, oh, you do PR, you do media relations. It means so much more these days and will continue to take on many different shapes.

Fiona, that's a wonderful answer. And my young girls They've never watched the BBC News. They get everything and they trust YouTubers and TikTokers more than they trust the Newsnight team, which is interesting food for thought, isn't it? Fiona Goldsworthy joining me from Brands to Life here in London. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom with me and my fellow unnoticed entrepreneurs today.

Thank you very much for having me on. It's been an absolute pleasure.

It's been really my pleasure to have you sharing a vast amount of experience. And I'm sorry I had to put you in such a short window. But of course, as always, I will put Fiona's details in the show notes. So for those of you that have listened and enjoyed this, do please share this with a fellow entrepreneur, rate it and review it if you have the time. And in the meantime, if you've got a PR firm, maybe offer them a little bit more money for what they do. But if you're not willing to go down that path, do engage them as consultants and do keep on communicating. Thank you for listening to me, Jim James, on this episode of The Unnoticed Entrepreneur.