Over 40,000 tenants avoided eviction during COVID with access to this free legal justice.

5 billion people around the world don't have access to justice. And when we talk about access to justice, it's not only access to courts, but it's access to simple legal services. Over 86% of the American population doesn't have access to justice as well. So we have both the human element and the technology element that help us to create at least solutions that can make content or legal information accessible and understandable.

Hello, and welcome to this episode of The Unnoticed Show. Or should I be saying hola? Because I've got Mauricio Duarte joining me. Mauricio, thanks for joining me, actually from Denver, Colorado, but you're originally from Guatemala, aren't you?

Yeah, correct, Jim.

So Mauricio, you're a trained lawyer and you've recently given up all of that goes with legal life to join a company called Access to Justice Technology, which is a social enterprise that builds technology to improve access to justice, which is amazing. You're on the show to share with us how you've been able to start to do the marketing for an enterprise and help the products and the services that this organization is offering to the disenfranchised to get noticed. So can you just tell us more about Access to Justice and what you're doing for people?

Yeah. So first of all, thank you for the invitation, Jim. As always, we were talking in the background, it's always good to meet interesting people with, I guess, with the podcast community. I have my own podcast in Spanish, but that's not the item here, but going to your question, access to justice is a real, let's say, worldwide problem. It's not a problem only in my home country where I come from in Guatemala. It's not only a problem in the US. It's a worldwide problem. And the first, let's say, data entry that caught my attention as I was transitioning from a path of becoming a senior associate or a partner at a big law firm, it was 5 billion people around the world don't have access to justice. And when we talk about access to justice, it's not only access to courts but it's access to simple legal services. So sometimes as attorneys, we have expensive, let's say, fees attached to our services. So many underserved people cannot access those services. And access to justice is a very broad term. But with that, I also focused myself on the US. That was a market that I wanted to start working on. And the data showed that over 86% of the American population doesn't have access to justice as well. So again, even in a market as complex and as robust as the US market, there's a lot of need for enhancing access to justice. And again, it's not only access to a judicial court, it's not only access to an attorney, but it comes to access to legal information. How can I understand what rights do I have if I'm a tenant, if I'm a mom, if I'm a dad? What are the rights that I have in any type of conflict or issue that might arise? So with that, I came together with A2J Tech that is very focused on how can we provide 2 different approaches. One, free solutions that could be leveraged by technology to provide productized legal services. So that means you need a document, you need a form, you need an additional, let's say, item for your legal needs. How can you create that by your own? Do it yourself, we call it, or DIY, do it by yourself using technology. And the second item that we started is how can we create— if we cannot create a free solution, how can we provide solutions or products that could be affordable at a very low rate that can, let's say, anyone can use? So with those efforts, I would say the biggest challenge has been 2 things. One is when you come from the legal industry and you become an attorney, you are used to very sophisticated words, talking and speaking. And sometimes myself, when I have certain discussions with practicing attorneys, You You rephrase that because sometimes we use, and I used to do it, I still use it from time to time, phrases in Latin and very complex words to explain something very easy. So instead of saying, oh, this is wrong, you would say probably, oh, this is not the best approach to this specific situation. Like you're changing the wording to make it more complex, but you gotta think that at the end of the, let's say on the access to justice market, the people that you're talking with. It's not an entrepreneur, it's not a businessman, it's something that someone that probably doesn't have access to internet, probably someone that didn't go to college, or someone that probably had to drop out of school because of their circumstances, or maybe someone that didn't even go to school at all. So when you have to translate the legal information to the, I would say, the wider population, it's a real, let's say, challenge. to translate those complex words and even the statutes that Congress passes that have some complex words around it. How can you create accessible language for people to understand what rights they have? That was the biggest challenge, I would say. And the second has been internet. Even though now we think that internet is a need for everyone around the world, there are still people that don't have even access to a desktop computer.

Desktop computer.

Some of them might have probably, if they're lucky, access to a cell phone or maybe even a tablet, but we have to stop thinking that everyone has access to internet and a computer. So with that, sometimes our challenge comes, how can we create solutions that can live off of the grid or off internet to trying to provide more solutions that don't necessarily depend on internet? Although internet, it's a powerful technology, If we cannot create or be innovative enough to create additional solutions that can be offline, then we sometimes hit a wall or a shortcoming because we are not helping the population that doesn't have access to internet, which is a bigger issue, I would say. Access to justice has a strong and direct correlation with access to internet. And access to internet, the data has shown that it's a very big issue as well, especially during the pandemic. So if you don't have internet, sometimes you don't even have access to some of the solutions. So that is probably the 2 biggest challenges that we have. on access to justice, how can we communicate information, and how can we create more solutions that are offline that can have a bigger impact on the population.

So you've bitten off quite a big problem to solve there, haven't you? Over 5 billion people, according to your website, don't have access to legal justice. And I see you've got some 70 to 80% of all people have had some civil issue. arise in their lives. It can be a marital one, can't it? It could be a theft, it can be an accident, any number of things that need attention from maybe legal support. So Mauricio, you've highlighted 2 big issues. One is about the content, one is about the delivery. How have you solved then at Access to Justice the, if you like, the simplification of the content? We have this in other spheres, of course, where in the medical industry or even in technology industries In an attempt to sound like an authority, the people who are speaking about these topics use language that distances them from the audience. How have you solved that at Access to Justice?

In my industry, and I'm glad that I have now the privilege of working with other professionals, so you work with, let's say, copywriters that sometimes they get the content from an attorney such as myself, I do their research and I try to word it And we try to achieve or strive for a 6th-level reading level, which is, let's say, common in the industry. And then sometimes say, this is not a 6th-grade level. This is probably 9th grade. So sometimes working with other professionals, and I would say that's the biggest change that I've seen in the legal industry, that now we're working with other professionals, with other industries, and understanding that you can convey information in a simple way, but you need other professionals or other experienced, let's say, people that can also help. Like, you don't know everything, I don't know everything. Sometimes as an attorney, I used to think I know everything, but I do not. I do know certain aspects, but I know that other professionals can bring more to the table and bring a lot of value. So I would say that is number one. And the other thing is that we have technology or use technology and tools that help us just to make sure that we are, let's say, making the good approach and wording a specific, let's say, statute or a specific— that makes it understandable on, again, that 6th grade reading level. So we have both the human element and the technology element that help us to create at least solutions that can make content or legal information accessible and understandable.

Now then, let's talk about the second part, which is the technology and the delivery. I mean, people used to get newspapers, for example, with notices in them and Those are not necessarily appearing on street corners anymore, especially in the time of COVID How are you making the documentation and the advice accessible to people that maybe don't have the internet, maybe have a mobile device, a phone instead, for example?

Yep, correct. And I would say the biggest— our vision whenever we create a product or a solution is always If we're building something, don't think that you're building it for a computer. Think that you're building it for a mobile phone. Number one, that is our priority, because it's— the odds are that people are gonna have access to a phone rather than a computer or a laptop. So always our focus is build for mobile first, build for desktop and laptop second. But with that mentality, it always comes, let's say, a struggle, and it goes a lot of testing, for instance. Saying, does it look good on Android? Yeah, but it doesn't look good on iPhone. So you've got to, let's say, do a lot of testing and iterations of a product or a solution only to test if it looks good in mobile. And if it looks good in mobile, then we can move to desktop and laptops, I would say. However, other alternatives that we have found in other projects that we've been involved with access to justice is in certain jurisdictions, in certain states or certain, let's say, regions of a state and even around the world, people don't have a lot of access to even mobile phones. So what we have created, or the projects that we have been involved with, is creating what we call legal kiosks. So instead of you needing internet, you can go to a public library, you can go to, say, a governmental office, or you can go to places that you would normally walk around, and you can access that solution on a legal kiosk. Obviously, that requires more budgeting and more funding, but sometimes, for instance, the last year, the federal government in the US have a project on legal kiosks, but that's how you can create alternatives that are outside of you needing a mobile phone or a computer. It would only probably require you walking a couple of blocks from your nearest library or the nearest public office, but that's how an alternative can be provided, and you don't need internet because, again, that system is embedded on that legal kiosk. But are the type of alternatives that we're also looking at when we see that the bigger issue of access to internet is something that can have an impact on how we deliver our products or our solutions for access to justice.

That's a really innovative solution and reminds me of some people called Janajal who are delivering water in the same way through kiosks where the pipes are no longer able to supply fresh water. So this idea of delivery in situ at point of need for information as it is for water in certain markets. Really fascinating, Mauricio. Can you give us an example of a project that Access to Justice has worked on recently and how that's changed some lives?

Yeah, I would say probably one of the best and recent examples was during the pandemic during last year. So in the US, just to give a bit of context, The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, or what is called the CDC, issued an order that— it was an order to prevent eviction. Under the scope of this order of last year, any tenant that was living in a housing project or in an apartment could not get evicted. But the only requirement besides meeting some eligibility requirements was filing a declaration letter, and that's how it's called, to your landlord. Or So you had to create this legal letter that has some legal wording based on the CDC wording. You have to create it and give it to your landlord. So with that, I remember it was probably September 1st. It was late at night when we heard the news that this was coming out. We weren't expecting this order. So with the CEO, we had a discussion, probably, I remember it was 6:00 PM, late in the afternoon. And we say, okay, we have— this could be something really impactful on access to justice. If we say that we are a company focused on access to justice, we have to create a solution for this. So in 48 hours, we brought the whole team together and we say, leave everything else on the table. If you're working on a project, stop that. If you're taking a break, you have to come back. We are investing all of our efforts and resources from the company. Again, this wasn't financed by a third party or someone else. It was financed by the own company. In 48 hours, because the order was about to come on September 4th, so we had only 48 hours to work on this prototype. Let's build a solution that came now called COVID-19 Eviction Forms. So with that, we created a website, we created, let's say, a document automation platform so you can automate the declaration letter to give to your landlord. And now that we go back, and yesterday we even created a social media post, if we go to the organic growth of the solution since it was first launched, we are nearing 40,000 users that have created an eviction letter.

Wow.

And with this, let's say, simple prototype that again, it was in 48 hours, it wasn't something that needed angel round financing or seed round financing to create something meaningful and impactful. We just created it in 48 hours, but I would say the important thing was everyone was passionate about this solution, everyone was into it. And with that, I would say the passion of the project, the user could understand or see the passion that was put into this platform. So with that, the organic growth of the solution was amazing, I would say. We didn't need Google Ads, we didn't need Facebook Ads, or we didn't need PR statements, or let's say the traditional marketing of a solution. It was a very organic growth. And how it started is we started with our social media. If you go back in our posts in Twitter and LinkedIn, they're probably the 2 main platforms that we were very active. We started, we launched COVID-19 eviction forms in English and Spanish, and then we added additional languages. In Portuguese, Somali, and we added a bunch of languages to make it, let's say, inclusive and multicultural for that platform. But as things progressed and as we were looking October, November, December, we noticed that there was peaks of traffic in our website and we started wondering why do we have such a lot of interest if we created this out of scratch? We haven't given a marketing budget, we haven't even Let's say, called news media. But as we were figuring it out, users were referring our platform to other users, but those users at the same time were referring our platform to housing projects or to legal aid or to nonprofits that were tackling nonprofits or were tackling— sorry, housing issues. So with that, we started looking at news. I remember reading a newspaper article that was mentioning our platform. Then we were featured in the APA. let's say COVID-19 response solutions. And like that, we started being featured in many platforms, but again, it was an organic growth. We didn't need a big budget on marketing. We just needed a good impression from the user, which again goes to testing. We need to test, test, and iterate the solution because if the user has a good experience— so that goes to UX/UI on a technology level— if the user has a good experience, they're gonna refer it to someone else. They probably know a bunch of colleagues or acquaintances that are in need of the same solution. So again, it was a very organic growth, and I would say now the CDC order has been, let's say, extended through June 30th, 2021, and we expect hopefully being at 50,000 by that day, even more, but who knows. And again, it has been a very organic growth, and that at least for us it was a lesson on if you create a meaningful solution that is going to have impact on users and especially on access to justice, that is the industry that we are dealing with, people are gonna need it and people are gonna start referring it to someone else. Again, you're not necessarily always— if you build something, there's this saying that if you build it, then they're gonna come. It doesn't happen like that always. But if you create something meaningful that is going to have a tangible positive impact in someone's life, they're going to come. If they see that they are in need and you are providing something for free, again, that was because of our specific model, people are going to come. But again, you don't have to think that in order for something to be successful, you need big marketing budgets or you need big expenditures on Google Ads or hiring a digital agency for, let's say, leading up your efforts. It could be a very organic growth. And the one that was doing the social media was me, that I'm not a trained digital marketer. I'm not a social media guru. I'm just an attorney with some experience on using Twitter, Facebook, and LinkedIn. And I use Hootsuite probably to post the social media at the same time. But that's it. And again, that's how we've seen, and many of our other products and solutions have had the same traction. On a very organic growth and approach.

Yeah, Mauricio, that's fantastic. It's what they call the cascade theory, that if you share information that is new and easy to understand, that people are more likely to cross the threshold of reservation and to share it with others. And that sounds like an absolutely fantastic example of the cascade theory at work. And finally then, for access to justice, If people want to find out more about the projects and the services, Mauricio, because you have some documentation automation, you have some graphic design, you have project management and some bespoke projects as well, I believe. How can people find out about you?

Yeah, so to find more about A2J Tech, you can go to our website, that is goa2jtech.com, or you can find us on social media, on LinkedIn and Twitter, probably the 2 main social media that we're active. We are also on Instagram, but we're not as active. So you can find us as A2J Tech on LinkedIn and on Instagram and on Twitter. You can find us as @GoA2JTech. And we're always happy to help, happy to answer questions, happy to collaborate or even partner up on projects that are in need of solutions for the legal industry.

Mauricio, you yourself have an inspiring story coming from Guatemala and taking up the mantle for, for law and then moving across to a platform where you can serve people with access to justice. So hats off to you. And thanks so much for sharing both an inspiring story from your own life, but also with what you're doing with Access to Justice. Thank you so much for being on the Unnoticed Show today.

Thank you, Jim.

So you've been to Mauricio Duarte, who's in Denver, Colorado today, but is all the way from Guatemala. Talk to me about Really creating products and services that serve a need. And I think the inspiring story around their COVID eviction notice is that if you create a good or service that is readily identifiable and needed, then regardless of the marketing, the consumers will come and take it and they'll share with other people that they know. And that is the cascade theory. So thank you so much for listening to this episode of The Unnoticed Show. My name is Jim James, and if you like this show, please do subscribe. And in the meantime, we wish you the best of health, a profitable business, and that if you're looking for some legal support, you could check out A2J Technology in the States. And I'll put their website in the show notes. Thanks so much for listening. Thank you for joining me, Jim James, on The Unnoticed Show, and I hope that you found it useful. I'm on a mission to help business owners to unlock the value in their businesses through communications and getting noticed. If you've enjoyed this show, do please share it with other business owners, rate it on iTunes or on other players as well. For articles written about each podcast and other topics to do with getting noticed, just come to my website eastwestpr.com, subscribe to the free weekly newsletter. Keep on communicating and let me know how you're getting on.