8 Daily Rituals to Help You Reclaim Your Thyroid Health with Danna Bowman & Ginny Mahar

Hey, J.J. here. Can you believe how fast the holidays are knocking at the door this year? One minute it's pumpkin spice season, the next you're getting your guest room ready and wondering where their wrapping paper went. And that's when I turned to Wayfair. From bedding and towels to holiday decor and last minute stocking stuffers, Wayfair has everything you need to get your home and holidays together fast. And for way less. With Wayfair, I know I can refresh my guest room in no time. Maybe I'll add a soft new comforter or a few holiday throw pillows. With Wayfair, it's so easy and everything arrives super fast. Plus, there's free shipping for any order over $35 easy and total peace of mind. So whether you're hosting, gifting, or just adding those final festive touches, Wayfair has your back. And when the holidays wind down, Wayfair has everything you need to tuck it all neatly away. Smart storage solutions for every room from the kitchen to the closet. Get organized, refreshed and ready for the holidays. For way less head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. Wayfair Every style, every home. That's W-A-Y-F-A-I R.com hey, it's JJ here. You know, I've been talking about environmental toxins forever, and laundry detergent is a sneaky one. A lot of them contain harsh chemicals like dyes, preservatives, and even UV brighteners. Those brighteners don't actually clean anything. They just coat fabric so your eyes think things look whiter or brighter. That's more chemicals I don't want on my family sheets or skin. And if you've got sensitive skin or allergies around the house, this can be a big problem. That's what got my attention about Earth Breeze. It looks like a dryer sheet, but it's actually laundry detergent. You toss one in the washer and that's it. No pouring, no mess, and no heavy plastic jug. Their packaging is lightweight cardboard, which helps reduce plastic waste. And if you choose the fragrance free option, it's gentle, hypoallergenic, non irritating, and non sensitizing. I really like how simple it is and how fresh and clean everything comes out without those unnecessary chemicals. Right now you can try Earth Breeze for up to 40% off with free gifts@earthbreeze.com virgin that's earthbreeze.com virgin for up to 40% off plus free gifts on.

Your first order this episode is brought to you by Buffalo Trace Distillery. Powerful yet smooth. Contained but never tame. Proudly going their own way but never going alone. This is the spirit inside Buffalo Trace Bourbon made at Buffalo Trace Distillery. The world's most award winning distillery, Buffalo Trace is also always perfectly untamed. Distilled, aged and bottled by Buffalo Trace distillery, Franklin County, Kentucky. 90 proof, 45% alcohol by volume. Learn more at buffalotracedistillary.com Please drink responsibly.

We came up with this idea. We decided to use technology to make this journey easier for other thyroid patients than it had been for us to add not just support but also the motivation and accountability pieces that are required and turn them into results.

Here's JJ Virgin Triple board certified nutrition and fitness expert and four time New York Times best selling author. It's time to reignite wellness.

All right, if you've been diagnosed with a thyroid disease, either Hashimoto's or not, or you are struggling with some of the thyroid related symptoms like constipation, dry skin, hair falling out, depression, elevated cholesterol, if any of these things are going on, this is for you today. If you feel like you know you've got thyroid disease but you're still not where you want, you're not back yet. I've got some really cool information for you today from Dana and Gina. Ginny. So Dana Bowman and Ginny Mahar are two thyroid patient advocates. Both had thyroid disease. That's how they got into all of this. And they couldn't find the resources they needed to get better. And so once they found them, they decided to put it together in a way that made it really easy for people to do. They host Thyroid Refresh TV which I'll be linking to in the show notes@jjvirgin.com forward/8ritUls. And that's the number eight. Not spelled out the number eight. And the reason I'm going to be talking about doing eight rituals is because we're going to go through eight rituals that you can put into your routine every day that will help you get better results and optimize your thyroid function. They also created something super cool we'll be talking about too. And that's the revolutionary wellness game Thyroid 30. And like, I just love this whole idea of how to gamify what you need to do to get your thyroid better. So we'll be talking about that as well in the Importance of Community, which of course we now know this. The research is super clear that that if you want to uplevel your health up level who you hang out with. Go hang out with healthier people. All right, now, before we dive into that, I wanted to give a shout out to Stephanie Delonzo, who says, when you want to live your very best life. Listen to this. Five stars. I love how you bring so many wonderful guests to share all aspects of of living your best life. Well, today is no different, Stephanie. But except today I have two. I. It's a twofer with Dana and Jenny. So I'm very excited to have them both on the show with me today. And I'm also excited to share this with you.

Hey, it's JJ here. Now, let's be honest. The holidays are basically a financial ambush. Travel, hosting gifts, surprise holiday school things. Suddenly you're wondering how December turned into a spending spree. If you want to keep your finances under control this holiday season, you need to be using Monarch. It's rated the Wall Street Journal's best budgeting app of 2025. Monarch is the all in one personal finance tool that brings your entire financial life together in one clean interface on your laptop or your phone. What really grabbed my attention is how fast those little holiday expenses pile up with Monarch. Seeing everything in one place makes it a lot harder to accidentally overspend. And honestly, I appreciate anything that keeps me from starting January with a money hangover. You'll love exploring the holiday spending category. Imagine how good it will feel to actually see what's happening before your credit card statement does that whole dramatic reveal thing. Monarch basically shows you exactly where the money is going in real time. And that level of clarity could change everything, right? Don't let financial opportunity slip through the cracks. Use the code virgin@monimal.com in your browser for half off your first year. That's 50% off your first year@monarch.com with code Virgin.

This episode is brought to you by McAfee.

I got a message that our flight.

Was canceled, but they can put us.

On another flight and we just need.

To confirm our credit card info.

Wait, I got a security alert from McAfee.

It flagged that message as a scam.

McAfee's scam detector automatically spots and alerts.

You to suspicious texts, emails, and deep fake videos. Learn more@mcafee.com Online Protection Dana and Jenny, welcome. So excited to talk to you guys.

We're so excited to be here. Thank you for having us.

This is always a hot topic. I mean, it is amazing how many people are struggling with thyroid and have thyroid issues, me included. And so this is always one we like to talk about. On the show. And I'm excited today because, you know, you guys go along with everything that we've talked about to date, but then also have some fresh new information. So it's. It's a bonus here. So what I'd like to do before we dive into the interview and some of the things that you're going to share, I'd love to know what. What got you guys interested in everything that you've been creating around thyroid health.

I'll go first, Jenny. For me, I was. I'm a thyroid advocate. I was living in Costa Rica with my family, and we lived there for eight years. It was fabulous. And I was correctly diagnosed with Hashimoto's while living there, which is a big deal.

Yay.

But the only medicine I had on hand that they could offer me was just a T4. And I thought it was great. At first, I thought, okay, great, I've got my pill. I'm set. I'm going to go off to my Zuma convention tomorrow, and I'll be done and I'll be good. My symptoms will go away. Didn't know that they weren't going to do that. Had no idea. Lifestyle was not mentioned. Gluten was not mentioned. Autoimmune was not mentioned.

You're lucky you even got diagnosed, right?

I mean, I was lucky to get diagnosed. Now looking back, I can't believe it. This guy was really, you know, fantastic as far as that goes.

But.

And I felt so alone. I felt so isolated. Like, why am I not getting better? Here I am a Zumba instructor, and I got to go home and take a nap for two hours after I teach, and I've got my pill. What's going on? I just couldn't figure it out. So I started doing research, and bam, the whole world opened up. I finally started asking the questions. And so for me, I started another website and got connected to the thyroid community, and I haven't looked back since.

And Jenny.

Well, for me, I think the thing that really fuels my fire, this is like the call that I was asked to heed, is this idea that in addition to finding the right doctor and getting on the right meds, if you have a thyroid issue, like hypothyroidism, diet, lifestyle, and mindset can make a huge difference. And I think the reason this is so important is because a lot of us aren't hearing this from our conventional MDs. I was diagnosed in 2011, shortly after the birth of my son with hypothyroidism. And I spent four years feeling really compromised with my health. And the whole time I was being told by my doctor that my symptoms were all in my head or just the aging process. I was told they had nothing to do with my thyroid and that it wasn't necessary to change my diet or anything like that. And this is what thyroid patients hear now. My symptoms didn't go away until I incorporated diet and lifestyle changes. And I had some really textbook hypothyroid symptoms like fatigue, weight gain, joint pain, depression, hair loss, brain fog. And medication only was not enough. So I finally hit rock bottom and said, I can't live like this anymore. And I took the reins of my health. And within about six months of starting to make diet and lifestyle changes specifically for my thyroid health, I had my life. Not an exaggeration for me to say that I had my energy back. I had cut my Hashimoto's antibodies in half. I was enjoying motherhood again. You know, it makes me want to cry thinking of all that time and energy. I lost the first four years of motherhood in that sick and exhausted struggle when there were really simple.

And it was hard enough. Oh, my gosh.

And I'm asking my doctor, should I be eating differently? Is there something I'm doing wrong? You know, and there were some really simple changes I could have made sooner in terms of diet and lifestyle. So that's what Dan and I are really on a mission to do, is help people get that knowledge. Not just get it, but be able to implement some of these things more easily than we were able to and sooner. Don't suffer for four years if you don't have to.

No. And don't suffer alone.

So I, you know, I think about, like, getting diagnosed when you're. When you've got, like, a baby, when you're already exhausted enough. Oh, my gosh. But, you know, first off, someone's getting diagnosed, and for. For a lot of people, I see that they don't even get diagnosed for quite a while. You know, which is part of the first issue is that this is going on and you don't. You aren't aware of the symptoms. Maybe you go to get to a doctor and they're at conventional lab markers and not looking at the fact that, you know, your T3 is low or you've got all these symptoms and your TSH is elevated, and they're just like, nope, you're in the normal. Which I know we. The normal range at this point hopefully has gotten somewhat blown up. But I also think. And I was talking to Dr. Jeff Bland on A podcast yesterday, and he made a great distinction between disease care and health care. And, you know, when you go to. To a doctor about, a conventional doctor about thyroid disease, they're going to look at what medication they need to do. But really with that disease, we have to pull in all of that diet and lifestyle, that healthcare side of it, to really get you better. So what I would look at, because I know it took you some time there, what when someone, let's say someone actually did get diagnosed. But I'd like to even backpedal a little bit to if you're suspicious, first of all, what are the things you should be looking for that would make you suspicious that you could have a thyroid issue? And then what should you do first to make sure that you're diagnosed correctly?

I'll jump in really quick first, Jenny, for me, immediately start asking questions. Fatigue. I had pretty much lifelong constipation. I know it's not the most glamorous topic, but none of it is. I had extreme fatigue, memory, brain fog. You know, my hair was very brittle. I just couldn't think. And I kind of lost my zest, my creativity, my juice for life a little bit. And a lot of the symptoms were overlapping and I just didn't ask the questions. And so for me, I would like to just stress how important that is and also want to shout from the rooftops to get a full thyroid panel, not just a thyroid test, and to look at how you're feeling and to talk to your doctor about. Okay, so great. Here's all of my lab tests. Not just the TSH, not just the free T3.3T. Here's my full lab panel. Great. I want to take these home with me, please. And I want to understand them. I want to ask the questions, and it doesn't really matter if I fall within these ranges, that's fine, but I'm not feeling well. What else can we do, like, ask the questions?

So let's say now that someone's diagnosed because you set yourself, like, between diagnosing and then, like, thinking you're just going to get better because you went on the first medication and then not getting better. Like, what's. What can someone, now that they've been diagnosed, what should they be doing? What should they be looking out for? Like what? You know, I would assume one of the biggest mistakes is just assuming that, right? You go on thyroid medication and you're fine. But, you know, what do we do here, right?

Because I think you're saying that very important part of your protocol and and we don't want to bash that in any way. A part.

It's a part and you said it.

I love that you brought this up because this is where the magic can really happen. And that's why we're here. So we've broken down the tenants of Thyroid Healthy Living into what we call the eight daily rituals. Should we go down that list?

Ooh, I just love the whole idea of eight daily rituals too.

Yes, let's go down.

And where did these come from?

These eight?

I was going to say we're like.

Where do we get these expert written book on the shelf? We didn't just make these up. These are the across the board recommendations that you hear from pretty much all of the leading thyroid experts out there. So the eight daily rituals, these are all rewords. So number one is remember, did you remember to take your medication and supplements? This one sounds obvious for a lot of people, but for some people that's a major factor is just taking your medication on time, remembering to take your supplements, things like that. So remember, number two is refuel. And this could be its own show. But refuel is everything you consume as far as food or drink. But. And the basic premise of, you know, of thyroid nutrition, let's say if you're, let's just take it up to 30,000ft, is just avoiding inflammatory foods and toxins in the diet as well as maximizing nutrient density. Number three is reactivate. So this one's about movement, staying active. And there's a little more to that for thyroid patients besides just exercising. Because so many of us have issues like after we work out, we get exercise fatigue. We might have hypermobility, connective tissue disorders, inflammation. We might end up in an autoimmune flare. So it's really important with your reactivate ritual to listen to your body and know that in many cases less is more.

I'm going to put into the show notes for everybody too. And we will do this. I think we'll do this@jjvirgin.com eight rituals. And it'll just be the number eight because I love this so much. We'll also link into Thyroid strong, which is Dr. Emily Kivert's thyroid program. Because it was like when she brought up doing this, I'm like, oh yeah, this is so awesome. Like, finally someone's addressing this. So glad you brought that up. Oh yeah, she's, she's the bomb. Okay, good.

Next. So number four is repair. So this is about healing the gut. And leaky gut's been linked to, you know, among other things, food sensitivities, thyroid disorder, skin problems, weight gain. So healing the gut is a really essential part of the overall healing process. Five is rejuvenate. So this is daily self care of some kind. My favorite because yeah, we love rejuvenate. That's our favorite because too much stress can really affect our cortisol levels. It can lead to adrenal imbalance, it can throw off our hormones, our metabolism. So really becoming mindful of how we are coping with stress and managing stress is going to be one of the most powerful aspects of anyone's healing journey.

I just have to do a little shout out on self care because I'm actually reworking a lot of what I've written for Miracle Mindset Warrior mom around the fact that it's for caretakers. But the bottom line is we're all caretakers. And the bottom line is as a caretaker, the first person you have to take of is who?

Yourself.

Right, right.

And. And for some reason we just don't like. Yeah. We do not put the auction mask on ourselves first. And there is no way you're taking care of a family if you are not taking care of yourself first. So I just want to really underscore that that is not being selfish, it's being selfless. That we must put that priority in there in order to do all the things we need to do in the, in the world. Okay.

Absolutely. And if it makes sense, Number five.

Right. Yeah.

And if it makes you feel better, do it for your family and your loved ones. You know, you can't be there for them if you're not. Okay. Right. So number six.

And not just okay. Let me just add that in there. Not just okay, but great. You know, taking some like intentional moments for yourself is very healing and rewarding and your creativity can come out and those kinds of things. So this is an opportunity for. For you to make yourself feel great and be great for your family.

Yeah. Such a good thing.

And yourself.

Number six is reduce. This is about reducing the toxins in our homes and in our bodies because as we know, thyroid disorder and autoimmune disease is linked to. It has been linked to heavy metals and environmental toxins. So really important that we are mindful of what we're exposing our bodies to as well as how we support those built in detox pathways like the liver and the kidneys. Number seven is relish. This is another fun favorite one. So relishing small victories, finding support, being supported, allowing yourself to be supported. And this is about both connection and Celebrating our victories along the way, no matter how small. And then finally, number eight is recharge, which is sleep. Sleep is foundational to our health. So really getting enough quality sleep ranks right up there. I think with drinking enough water as far as just simple ways you can reduce a lot of common thyroid symptoms like brain fog, fatigue, depression, things like that. So those are the eight daily.

I'm always happy when sleep gets brought up, of course.

Right.

When I first met my husband, he was a five hour night sleeper and I'm like, you know, yeah, like I really like you, but this ain't gonna fly. It's so funny now because he's now like a, you know, he's a. We, we are big sleepers. I mean, eight hours is the minimum, right. And so he is, it is incredible. And what happened when he first started really sleeping is he couldn't keep weight on.

Wow.

Yeah. And I think people just don't realize, like, if you want to have great skin, if you want to d. Age, if you want to have a good healthy thyroid and adrenals, you know, sleep is, is key. So I'm going to underscore that one again because anytime it's brought up, I get on a little bit of a rant about it. So I love that. Now the bigger thing, and we were, yeah, we were talking offline about this. So you have your thyroid refresh tv, your podcast, and then you've also created something super cool because, you know, I work in weight loss, one of the like lowest compliance things that you could possibly do, like, like the highest recidivism rate, blah, blah, blah. And I, I've always looked at like, okay, what, what makes success automatic? What can we build that you can build in that really helps is this community is having the support. So I know that you've put together this thyroid 30, which I'd love you to talk about and why you did it. What are the elements of it that can really help someone be successful so that we can start to use some of these in our everyday life.

Well, let me jump in because I'm really excited to talk just really quickly and then I'll let Jenny give you a little bit more details on it. For us, we built something that we wish we would have had when we were healing. When I was by myself, feeling terrible, not understanding, taking my medicine all alone, I felt like in Costa Rica, if I'd had what we built, if I'd have had thyroid 30, then I would have been instantly connected. Instant community, instant high vibe. Because I let myself Go down that rabbit hole of poor me, poor me, poor me. Because I just didn't really know. And so we built Thyroid 30 because this is something we wish we would have had. It's built by thyroid patients, for thyroid patients. And so we're really passionate about spreading the message because of the community and the high vibe that you really need to heal because so many people don't understand it's an invisible disease. And it's hard for family and friends. It really is hard for them to get it. So to be in a close knit group feels close. Even though everybody's from all over the world of people who get it.

Yeah.

When it's amazing.

Well, I think was something that really connected Dan and I, right off the bat is that we both shared this feeling that when we started it was like we were in a vacuum. You're out there, like, hello, is anybody out there? I'm just completely changing the way I eat and live all by myself over here. It was really challenging and I had found support through other health challenges that were more for the general public, but I wasn't finding other thyroid patients there. People who understood some of the, you know, unique issues I was facing. So, like when you're hanging out with a bunch of crossfitters and, and you're like, yeah, I've been exhausted for the last six days. After that Zumba class, the general public or the thyroid healthy public will say they don't really get it. So I was really hungry for that understanding. I wanted to be on this journey with not just other people, but people who get it, who could relate to that unique struggle that thyroid patients go through. So Diana and I, what we decided to do is we came up with this idea, we decided to use technology to make this journey easier for other thyroid patients than it had been for us, and to add not just support, but also the motivation and accountability pieces that are required to take all those recommendations that, you know, the eight Rs, the eight daily rituals, and turn them into results. So we had this lightning bolt idea to really take thyroid healing to the next level using technology. So Thyroid 30 is our 30 day wellness app and it uses gamification technology, which that's just a fancy way of saying that we used game based rewards, badges, scoring teams and data to help propel patients up that thyroid healing ladder.

And so you actually made it fun rather than a drag. Imagine people might hear that and you get rewarded, right?

And you might think, what's really, is that really going to help me? I'm not a Game person. What's a badge going to do? This won't work for me. But you would be surprised. I mean, these simple gamification tools, they really tap into positive psychology.

We know they work. I mean, look at, like, look at video game technology. We know this stuff works. I just love that you're putting it here, here. You know, you've done a couple interesting things. Number one, the community of support is so key and critical because as you know, you know, there's specific things that you need to shift in your diet and lifestyle and then you get out into the, like, regular world and people are like, oh, no, no, no. You can just have this and then a stamp play with us. You know, like, I just got a text tonight. Someone's like, like, hey, come meet me at this speakeasy place. I'm like, it's a school night. People, you know, like, I'm not going out at 9 o' clock to like, on a, on a. Like, what day is today?

Wednesday.

Like, no, that ain't happening. Are you crazy? So we're in our jammies, so it's good to have a group that, like. Oh, yeah, like, right. I know. I mean, it's like some days I'm in my jammies all day, but so I. I love that you've put that together because it does work. And it's like, like, we need to make Changing your health.

Yeah.

Because, you know, one of the things that I like to say is smiling and laughing is good medicine. Well, having fun is good medicine. I think that there's a lot of focus on the thyroid world, or there was before, and everybody kind of gets in that, like I was saying earlier mode of humdrum, poor me. And when you can get. Step out of that, you have positivity, you have a different outlook. You just automatically feel better. So making it fun. Wow, what a concept, right? And getting rewards and badges.

Well, I think.

Awesome. Yeah. I want a badge, too. I want a badge, too. I want a badge. Darn it.

So I think there's another issue of overwhelm too. There's so much information out there about what to do if you have thyroid disease. You can find that anywhere. But we're really also trying to solve the problem of, okay, I know what to do, but now how do I actually do it? So it just sort of brings all those pieces together. And it's been really one of the most amazing experiences in Dana and I's lives to witness the way it has helped other people and to just be part of this community.

The Way it's unfolded. Yeah. And the way it's unfolded, we, we built it with these experts in mind. We built it with the JJ virgins and the Dr. Alan Christensen's of the world because it's fully customizable. So if you're going to be sugar free for 30 days and you're reading JJ's book and you want to follow whatever protocol she has out, it is possible and doable. We really felt like bridging that gap because we heard from so many doctors saying, you know, I don't. I only have so much time. I only have, you know, what, an hour and a half or two hours if you're going to the, you know, functional medicine kind to spend. And then after that they need recipes and videos and workouts and things like that. And so we kind of just, just hold their hand and let the, let the patient heal and have fun while doing it and then get their expert information from their doctors or their healthcare providers.

So very cool. Well, I love that you've created a big community of support and then broken it down to 8. I always love it when we've got like rituals and they're all start with ours. It's very cool. I love all of this stuff. Now we are up against the clock here, so I want to make sure that I'm honoring all of that as well. We are giving everyone, every time that we do a podcast, we give a gift. And I love this quiz that you've put together about how well you know your thyroid and so you're going to be able to grab that quiz. And what I'm going to do is I'm going to put all this information@jjvirgin.com 8rits Like I said before. And so you'll want to review the show notes for those eight rituals and to grab the quiz, we'll put information so that people want to check out your community and see all about that. We'll put the information in there as well. So if you want to check out 30Thyroid30 their app, you can see that too. We'll link over to your Thyroid Refresh TV podcast. You guys have so much going on. My goodness, it's crazy.

And we got.

And we're fitting in me time. We're fitting, we're fitting in self care, believe it or not.

That's so good.

Yes. Well, you better. It's one of your rituals. If you don't, I'd be very, very, very worried about you. So. Yes, very cool. Awesome. Well, I thank you so much for taking your time out to with me today. I so appreciate you guys.

We are so thrilled and honored to be with you.

Jj.

It's, it's. We've always followed or we followed you for as long as Jenny and I can remember, you know, starting out together. And so to be on your show is absolutely fabulous. Thank you so very much.

Ah, well, you provided a ton of value. Now, after the break, I'm going to be giving you a top takeaway. So hang out and stay with me. Blue sky.

Some people think nature is like this, but actually it's like this. Mother nature's not all sunshine and rainbows. Nature can be hotter than a sauna and colder than an arctic skinny dip. That's why Columbia engineers everything we make for anything nature can throw at you. Columbia engineered for whatever ever.

All right, welcome back. Now this is the time where I give you an action step to take to make sure that we took all this awesome information and then went into action with it. Of course, I want to make sure that you download the quiz and the eight rituals and you can do that@jjvirgin.com eight the number eight rituals. So you can grab everything there. We'll also link to Dr. Emily Kaibard, thyroid strong. So if you're looking for an exercise program that will help support you in your thyroid healing journey, she has put that together. It is a brilliant as is she. So we'll have that in there as well. If you need any testing or additional support, then we can also, we'll also link into LabIQ, Dr. Alan Hopkins. And then of course, Dr. Alan Christensen's got his team of physicians virtually who can support you. So we have got you covered with the community, with the wellness portal, with everything. But, you know, and here's the, here's the action step for today. It was one of the rituals. It was the ritual of rejuvenate. And that is that ritual of self care. And when I heard that, I'm like, that's going to be my thing. Because obviously I can't say pull out all eight. And what I would tell you with those all eight is pick one, get it dialed in as a ritual, go to the next with the first one really being self care. And I look at self care as step one of self care is put yourself first. No, that's not selfish. In fact, it's selfless. We have a lot to accomplish on this planet and can't accomplish that if you are dragging around and not at your best self and not being able to really show up where you need to show up. Strong so the step one of being an amazing caretaker, of really being able to do what you want to do in life is to take care of yourself and put your self care as the uber or single most important thing out there. And so that is my reframe to you. That's my big action step. My challenge is to really look at your self care and I'm always, I got to tell you, working on my self care routine. I have a sunlight and sauna, I have a joovv red light therapy machine. I have some really amazing like these incredible purigenics collagen masks. I have my supplements, my food, my exercise. I have a a gym at home now with my exisr and my equipment in it. And so I'm always working on all right, what is my self care and how do I take that up to the next level? Oh and of course my big I have the most awesome bathtub that I do my Epsom salts baths in. So that's where I would like have you start is self care. What is your self care routine and what can you do to like take that up a notch and take care of yourself? And if you think about the people you want to take better care of in your life, the best way to start is by being the awesome role model by modeling incredible self care. All right, I would love to shout you out on our next podcast. So if you haven't left a review yet, hey, this is a big ask to have you do one. And while you're there, make sure that you subscribe to jj. And all you have to do literally is go to subscribe to JJ. It is that that simple. Subscribe to JJ and.com and it will take you right there and you can subscribe. All righty, I will see you next time. Bye.

Foreign.

Hello listeners, this is Anne Bogle, author, blogger and creator of the podcast what Should I Read next? Since 2016, I've been helping readers bring more joy and delight into their reading lives. Every week I take all things books and reading with a guest and guide them in discovering their next reading. They share three books they love, one book they don't, and what they've been reading lately. And I recommend three titles they may enjoy reading next. Guests have said our conversations are like therapy, troubleshooting issues that have plagued their reading lives for years and possibly the rest of their lives as well. And of course, recommending books that meet the moment, whether they are looking for deep introspection to spur or encourage a life change or a frothy page turner to help them escape the stresses of work, school, everything. You'll learn something about yourself as a reader, and you'll definitely walk away confident to choose your next read, with a whole list of new books and authors to try. So join us each Tuesday for what Should I Read Next? Subscribe now wherever you're listening to this podcast and visit our website, what shouldireadnext podcast.com to find out more.