[Bonus Episode] Science-Backed Strategies to Succeed With Intermittent Fasting With Cynthia Thurlow

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Are you kidding me? Seriously?

Yeah.

So 16 times a day.

And so if you think about if you are, if you are spiking insulin 16 to 17 times a day, you are storing fat. There is no question. You are not burning anything. You are storing it. So pulling out the snacks and then just having three meals a day will go a long way in improving how you're able to kind of go from breakfast to lunch, lunch to dinner, dinner to breakfast, and then before you know it, you're going to be fasting because you're not eating anything from dinner until breakfast. And for a lot of people that's 13 or 14 hours at a minimum. And then they get so confident because they realize, okay, I can do this. Like this is manageable.

Foreign. Hey, it's JJ and welcome to Ask the Health Expert. But this isn't just any old Ask the Health Expert session.

This is your bonus session.

Yes, it's the weekend and because it's the weekend, we are going to take some time with an amazing expert. So be on the lookout for these.

Saturday Ask the Health Expert bonus sessions where we're going to go deep into.

An amazing subject with an incredible expert to give you actionable items that you.

Can put into your life.

I am super excited to have Cynthia Thurlow back on the show. She is my go to in intermittent fasting. She's a women's intermittent fasting expert. If you have not watched her TEDx talk, she's a two times TEDx speaker but she has her second talk there on intermittent fasting. It's like last time I checked it's nearly at 8 million views like crazy. She's the founder of Everyday Wellness Project, an amazing podcast you'll want to dial into. We're going to put all this on the show notes too. Her TEDx talk, her podcast. She's a nurse practitioner, been one for over 20 years now she's training others on how to do intermittent fasting. She's been all over the media as well. Gosh. Abc, fox, ktla, cw. She's been a medium and an entrepreneur. She was recently listed in Yahoo. Finance as one of the 21 founders changing the way we do business. And her podcast Everyday Wellness was listed as 20 podcasts that will help you grow in 2020. And that was by Entrepreneur and then by Business Insider. 21 podcast to expand your mind in 2021. So I love this episode. What I realized as I was doing this episode with Cynthia is that we just kind of need to do probably one episode of Cynthia at least once a month because there's so much information. She really is the go to expert here for women's intermittent fasting. She's also providing her sleep strategies book and talks a lot about fasting and sleep. This is usually 29 bucks she's giving it to us. You can get that@jjvirgin.com fast sleep. So make sure you grab that and I'll be back in just a minute with Cynthia.

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Well, welcome back, Cynthia Thurlow. It's so awesome to have you with me.

Oh, I'm so excited to be here. I've been looking forward to this.

Well, you are a crowd pleasing favorite and, you know, being a women's intermittent fasting expert, like, talk about, you know, you've got the subject that everybody wants to know more about. So I'm excited to dive deep into it. And, you know, when you look at becoming this expert in intermittent fasting for women, what's the difference? What's the difference between men and women in fasting?

It's a great question and one that I'm asked frequently. I think it really comes down to women are much more sensitive to the deprivation of macronutrients. And that ties in with our hormones and the fact that, you know, through most of our lives we're able to conceive and carry a child. So our bodies, our brains are much more sensitive to the foods that we eat and how well we manage stress and sleep and, you know, how we kind of navigate the world. I always say, you know, men kind of blissfully, you know, barrel through life and women kind of have to take in a lot of what goes on around us and adjust and make accommodations and modifications based on where we are. Obviously, women that are still cycling, women that are still able to conceive, have to be a little bit more savvy with intermittent fasting versus, you know, women when we go through menopause. I mean, we're more akin to men. You know, it's reverse puberty. We have less circulating and fluctuating hormone levels in our bodies. So I sometimes find that menopausal women have the easiest time with integrating intermittent fasting into their lives versus cycling women.

So I love reverse puberty. I've never heard that before.

Well, I love thinking about it because I have teenage boys and so their hormones are ramping up and mine are kind of ramping down in a different direction. Direction. But yeah, if you think about it that way, it really explains that, you know, we, you know, for the first 60% of our lives, we are able. Well, maybe not 60%, but from the time we start getting a Period, until we stop getting a period that's a chunk of time in our lives. And then the second half of our lives really begins. And Statistically, that's about 40% of our lifetime. So it's a significant part of our lives when we are no longer able to conceive a child, but we have the flexibility to not be tied down to having a menstrual cycle. And for so many of us that kind of suffer through the moodiness of premenstrual syndrome and PMDD and all those other things that we deal with when.

We'Re younger and just the pain in the butt factor of all.

I was just telling someone the other day, I said, I remember being on a really amazing vacation with my husband, and I'm in an African country. And I think to myself, okay, my period came early. I'm in this bathroom airport, and I'm like, okay, this is going to be interesting. But, yeah, the inconvenience factor of getting caught without expecting and being prepared for things like that can be a source of frustration for sure.

Yeah, understatement. So before we dive into the how tos, maybe we should talk about the why to's. Like, what are the big benefits of intermittent fasting? You know, why would someone want to do this?

Well, I think it really goes back to how much our lifestyles have mitigated a lot of our health problems that we're seeing today. And our bodies are really designed to eat less frequently and not snack. And that's completely contrary to the dogma that we all grew up with. That breakfast was the most important meal of the day, and we needed to eat many meals and snacking and eating all the time. And so one of the main benefits of intermittent fasting is that you are able to, you know, tap into fat stores for energy. And that's a superior fuel source for energy. Our brains love ketones, which are these, you know, these. These bodies that are produced when our bodies break down fatty acids. And so, you know, ketones can be absorbed directly across the blood, brain barrier, and our mitochondria, these powerhouses of our cells, love the utilization of fats for fuel. So that's number one. And really, that's the way we're designed to live. Our bodies are designed to be fueled and fat adapted and being able to be metabolically flexible to use carbohydrates and fats for fuel. So that's number one. We recognize that, you know, especially with escalating rates of obesity, diabetes, you know, we get lowered fasting insulin levels and so that can lower our risk for developing neurodegenerative disorders. You know, things like type 3 diabetes, Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, lessens our likelihood of, you know, going on to develop, you know, Frank diabetes if we're insulin resistant. And again, the lowered insulin levels provide, you know, more, you know, cognitive abilities. We're clearer mentally, and that's a huge benefit. I just think about, you know, in terms of when people are really thinking about the things that, that make their lives easier, thinking less about food. You know, you're able to power through your morning without having to worry about eating breakfast or stopping to snacks because your blood sugar is not nearly as stable. And most of us are really carbohydrate adapted. So we're, you know, we burn through a quick source of energy, we're frequently hangry, we struggle to lose weight. And so that ties into that fat adaptation. Again. I also think about the fact that we, you know, when we're not eating, we tap into a biological process called autophagy. And, and it's this waste and recycling process in the body. And so we get rid of diseased and disordered cells. And when we eat food, that process stops. So I remind people that it's important to get rid of diseased and disordered cells, whether they're cells that will go on to develop cancer or they're just wonky. You know, the older that we get, you know, the mitochondria in our, the powerhouses of our cells, they can get, you know, dented and disease kind of like a tin can. And I like to remind people that it's a, it's a way and a means that our body can be more aligned with that the healthiest cells will survive and go on to live. We get rid of the junk and the recycling process. And for many, many people, you know, by being fat adapted, by keeping their insulin levels low, you know, suddenly their menstrual cycles are more regular. If they have polycystic ovarian syndrome, for example, oftentimes they start to have a weight. You know, weight loss is the side effect of intermittent fasting. They can get better balance between their sex hormones. For many people, fasting can, you know, better align a lot of their adrenal and thyroid issues that they can be mitigating. So those are kind of the big ones. I also like to tie in the fact that many people will actually start to sleep better because their blood sugar is better balanced. They're not waking up, they're not having these fluctuations, these emergency backup system in the body when our blood sugar goes too low, there are mechanisms in place, like spiking cortisol. So for many, many people, they're surprised when they start fasting and they've got, you know, better balancing of their macros. All of a sudden their sleep gets better. And that's a huge pain point, as I know. You know, with women, as they kind of sail into perimenopause, that all of a sudden they've got all these sleep issues and, and that can be problematic. So those are some of the top things. Of course, there's lots of them, but those are usually the ones I try to discuss the most. I always say that people come to intermittent fasting out of curiosity of losing weight, and then they stay for all the other benefits.

Yes. And that we're going to dig a little bit more into sleep, but before then, so someone's hearing all these things. And hopefully if you've been listening to this podcast, you have stopped snacking. Like that is, you know, hopefully. But this might be your first podcast and maybe you still are snacking. You know, that whole thing where people think that they have to eat small meals throughout the day to keep their blood sugar level. I'm like, no, you're just keeping it up. So someone right now is kind of eating the typical standard American diet of like breakfast, a snack, lunch, a snack, dinner, and then maybe even a snack before bed. I can't figure out why. How would they move from that to being able to successfully intermittent fast?

Yeah, that's a great question. You know, I generally recommend that people remove the snacks first. So that's step one. Remove the snacks and then really structuring your meals so that you're focused on protein and healthy fats predominantly and making those switches, you know, adjusting those macronutrients, the two macronutrients that we know are most satiating. But remove snacks first, then proceed with adjusting your macros. And those two things alone. I think people are fascinated with how differently they will feel. And jj, one of the most recent studies I looked at, acknowledged that the average American consumes a sugar sweetened beverage or some type of food 16 times a day. So when you think about.

What? Are you kidding me? Seriously?

Yeah.

16 times a day.

And so if you think about, if you are, if you are spiking insulin 16 to 17 times a day, you are storing fat. There is no question. You are not burning anything. You are storing it. So pulling out the snacks and then just having three meals a day will go a long way in improving, you know, how you're able to kind of go from breakfast to lunch, lunch to dinner, dinner to breakfast, and then you, before you know it, you're going to be fasting because you're not eating anything from dinner until breakfast. And for a lot of people, that's 13 or 14 hours at a minimum. And then they get so confident because they realize, okay, I can do this. Like, this is manageable. And so that's generally a good starting point.

That makes a ton of sense. I'm still kind of floored by the 16. 16 times.

Unreal.

Yeah. Wow. Yikes. I wonder how much of that people don't even realize they're doing.

I think it's the liquid calories. I think for so many people, they don't register the liquid calories. Because I have conversations with my kids about this all the time that, you know, not so much my kids, but I know, like the average teenager and they're out of the house. And maybe not before, not during COVID but, you know, during other times during the year or during other years for that matter. And, you know, they're having a couple soft drinks, they have a couple fatty coffees, they have all these things that cumulatively over time, they just don't register two or 300 calories here and there. And, you know, 40 to 60 grams of sugar can really derail a diet pretty fast.

Gosh, you wonder what Starbucks alone has done. Like, it used to blow my mind back in the days when everyone hung out at Starbucks. But I go in there and see these high school kids, or even young, younger, you know, you'd look at kids and I go, you're getting your 10 year old, like a caramel macchiato, like what? Or a frappuccino. I'm like, oh my gosh, a caffeine sugar hit. You know, you just wonder that alone, like how much people just added in with these coffee drinks.

I just don't think they realize. And I tell people all the time, I'm like, if you decide to add fat to your coffee, that's very different than someone adding, you know, a bunch of syrup and a bunch of like whipped cream and sugary stuff. You know, I just, I truly think that people. It just doesn't register. I know. You know, the last time I was in the airport with my kids and, you know, my kids actually like coffee. They got used to having coffee every once in a while because they were swimmers. And so they're up very early in the morning for practice. And so they knew that the way that they could you know, be incentivized. I'm like, you can have a cafe mocha, you can have a cappuccino. I'm like, I worry less about the milk than I worry about the sugary stuff. And they knew that. I was like, don't even ask for frappuccino. I'm like, I don't know how many grams of sugar is in that. That is like a jolt of poison. I'm like, no, thank you. I'm like, coffee you can have. I will accept that. But the other stuff, no way.

Wow. Yeah. Well, since we're into to sugar, let's. Let's move over to sleep. Woof.

So I know it's kind of the witching hour in my house. My dogs like to sit on patrol, but hey, it's.

This is reality in life. I'm just waiting. I remember we were doing a podcast and I didn't have a headphone in so you could hear the dog. So of course someone's dog's barking. So then Daisy had to chime in, and then it's like a barking party. So.

And I am completely by myself in my house. So usually what I do is I'll, you know, like throw a pen to distract them. The dog that's barking, parking downstairs is too far away. I'm sorry, you had asked me a question when my dog.

And then the dogs went wild. Yes, I asked. So you, you said a little bit about this. And I think this is so such a good one to bring up because, you know, one of the biggest things that you hear about, about sleep is waking up at 2 or 3. So let's talk about how, how, you know, how does fasting help or hurt sleep? How does sleep help or hurt fasting? Like, how do they work together?

Well, I usually look at it this way. If someone is already sleeping through the night and they add fasting and they stop sleeping through the night, okay, then I know it's probably the fasting that might be driving that. And the question is always, did you get your macros in? Do we need to change your macros in your last meal? Do we need to add some fats right before you go to bed? So just kind of thinking through things. So that's one separate issue. But I see a lot of middle aged women, perimenopause, menopause, that have had crappy sleep for years and years and years. And then they start gaining weight and then they're like, I want intermittent fasting to be the thing that's going to fix this for Me. And so I remind everyone that sleep is foundational to our health. Ultimately, we have to find out why we're not sleeping and address that before we start adding in intermittent fasting, because our body perceives that as a stress. Stress is all about, you know, the benefits of stress. A little bit of stress is good. Too much is not a good thing. And so whether it's, you know, cold exposure, infrared sauna, high intensity interval training, fasting, all of these things are hormetic stressors. So beneficial stressors in the right amount for the right person. So the first thing I think about when someone tells me I'm not sleeping through the night is, okay, we have to have sleep hygiene. Much like when our kids are toddlers and little people. And we have to kind of get them, you know, they had a bath and they got lavender rubbed on their feet and they got a book read and they knew these are the things we do when it's getting ready for bed. And the same thing for women. And so, you know, getting off of electronics, wearing blue blockers, making sure your room is cold and dark. And for everyone that's listening, my family knows that the air conditioning or heat is at 65 degrees or lower year round when I go to bed. And that's how I sleep really well. And so I always say everyone else bundles up and they just have accepted this is the way things are. Because if I don't sleep well, I'm not a happy person. So making sure the room is cold and dark and ensuring that you've got some type of a ritual like getting off electronics is a legit issue. The blue light that we get from electronics, whether it's our phone, our tablet, our computer, et cetera, the TV will dysregulate the secretion of a hormone called melatonin. And if melatonin is suppressed, cortisol is up. And cortisol is going to tell our bodies it's time to party. So really being diligent about that, you know, for a lot of people, there are specific adaptogenic herbs that I will recommend. Things that are very calming to the central nervous system, like rhodiola or even relora, which is derived from magnolia bark, but really lovely. You know, maybe someone has some chamomile non caffeinated tea before bed. Maybe they soak in magnesium or take magnesium supplements. And so sometimes those things alone can make a huge impact on sleep quality. And if that doesn't work, maybe that improves things, but people are still waking up, then we really have to dive into what are their macros like? Some people don't frankly eat enough food and their bodies wake up because their blood sugar drops or, you know, they've depleted their glycogen stores, you know, their stored sugar, because they're working out way too intensely, too much. You know, the mindset for so long has been eat less, exercise more. And a lot of women take that to an extreme. They really restrict their calories. They really over exercise. You know, their adrenals get stressed out. And it's not a super sexy topic to talk about our adrenal glands, but as we kind of transition into middle age, you know, our ovaries are producing less progesterone, and that, you know, causes us to lean more on the adrenals. So if you're not managing your stress, and managing stress may look different for every one of us, but that means meditation and gratitude, journaling, getting out in nature, and exercising the right way. I'm sure, jj, you talk a lot about this, but gone are the days of doing intense crossfit five days a week. I mean, you can't do that. Your body will not be happy, and you may not get enough recovery to be able to, you know, allow your. Your adrenal glands to really not be so stressed out. So managing stress is another really critical, important thing. I myself am a big fan of box breathing. You know, when I'm in bed at night, if I wake up in the middle of night, which thankfully doesn't happen very often, I will kind of get in this meditative box breathing, which will tap me back into my parasympathetic rest and repose side of my body.

Walk us through box breathing. You're the second person that's mentioned it. And just for anyone listening, walk us through what box breathing is.

Okay, so it's really. This is like super, super simple. You inhale for four seconds, you hold your breath for four seconds, you exhale for four seconds, and that will stimulate the vagus nerve, which is one of your cranial nerves. And that will kind of get you out of this fight or flight, you know, where you're being chased by a saber tooth tiger, and kind of get you into this rest and repose side. And I can almost guarantee everyone if you do that for four or five sets, you will be much more calm. It's my trick when I get ready to talk on stage. It's my way of, like, controlling my, you know, my. Not anxiety, but just that feeling. Like I get excited when I'm going to speak on stage. And so that's one of the ways I will also. I wake up in the middle of the night and my mind's kind of racing and I'm thinking about all the things. It's like, box breathing will get me out of that, and I will fall back to sleep. So Macros stress management. You know, a lot of people love melatonin. I don't love melatonin. And here's the thing. I've come to realize that most melatonin supplements really overshoot what our body can make intrinsically. So, you know, you're trying to shoot a mouse with like an elephant gun. So instead of, you know, intrinsically, our bodies make way less than 1 milligram of melatonin is secreted during the day or in the evening. And we're giving ourselves 3, 5, 10 milligrams. And people say, well, I still wake up and I'm like, that's right. You know, you're overcompensating for a problem, and that may not even be what you need. So, you know, really tiptoeing into this now, you know, beyond that, I always say it's like peeling the onion. Sometimes people don't sleep because they have mold exposures in their house. I had one woman who is absolutely lovely but had mold exposure in her house, hadn't slept for years and years and years, and it wasn't until she got her house tested for mold. So there are a lot of things that can mitigate. Obviously that's more the minority, but you kind of start slowly and work forward. One of the things I also really like is a product called Calm down, but it's an amino acid. It's gaba. For a lot of people, that can be part of that nice kind of evening ritual of things that they do for themselves. But really digging deep and acknowledging that the sleep piece, you got to get that on board before you start adding in, cumulatively, more stressors. But that's. That's the usual kind of direction that I go with sleep. Welcome to Walgreens. What can I help you with today?

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All right, so we've got, we've got the start out of all the benefits and that women need to approach this differently than men. We're going to get a little bit more into the hormones. But you talk about clean fasting because I think there's a lot of stuff out there, especially when we get into more keto just like this. I'm like, whoa, what is all of this pork rind butter, bacon diet going like? So when you look at like when you recommend these macros and focusing on protein and fat, what are, what are typical meal recommendations for you when you think of clean fasting?

Yeah, I mean, I'm a huge fan of animal based protein. So whether it's like a fatty fish like tuna or salmon, I'm a huge fan of beef and pork and bison. I'm a huge bison advocate because it's like such a nice clean protein. Chicken or poultry are really great options. And then I will always be thinking strategically about a healthy fat. For me, it could be butter on some broccoli, it could be extra virgin olive oil on my salad, or it could be some nuts that are tossed over a salad. But always very strategic. And if I kind of build my meals with animal protein, anywhere from 4 to 6 ounces depending on what it is, you know, I find things like salmon in particular are very satiating. So I don't need six ounces of salmon. I'm not sure I could finish all that. But 4 ounces of salmon or like 6 ounces of steak, I do really well with adding in some non starchy vegetables and then creatively thinking about fat, fat sources. And the one thing that I think is really important and why people get keto wrong is it doesn't mean that you eat all the bacon in the world and all the, the cheese and all the nuts. Fats are more calorically dense. And although I'm not a calorie counter, I am a macro advocate and I remind people that the density of the of fat macros are much more than protein or carbohydrates. So just being smart that if you have, you know, a cup of broccoli, which would be great with a tablespoon of butter and then you've got six ounces of a steak, I mean that's, that is a normal kind of plated meal and that should be very satiating between the protein and the healthy fats and you know, some salt. I'm always an advocate of adding, you know, high quality salt to my meals, but you know, that should be Very satiating. You should be able to finish that meal and walk away and not feel like your kitchen is beckoning to you versus we're a very carbohydrate focused culture. If you have a big plate of pasta and you have a skimpy amount of protein on there and you load it up with cheese, I can guarantee you, you are going your appetite, you're not going to be satiated. You're going to keep going, keep wanting more and you're going to, you know, your macros are going to head and shift in a different direction. And one thing that's really important, and it's an uber not so sexy topic, is that the older we become as women, the more we have to be mindful of our portions of carbohydrates. And I know that triggers some women in very bad ways and obviously we're all individuals. But that means that you have to really shift your focus to protein and healthy fats. And I know you're a big advocate of fiber as well and shifting away from, you know, lots of pasta, lots of rice, lots of grains, lots of gluten, because that is not satiating. That is going to dysregulate your blood sugar and you just can't get away with it. And that's the unfortunate effects of being middle aged and beyond is that you have to be more mindful of those things.

I don't think it's just middle aged anymore. If you look around and you know, it's funny, I, I had a, one of my sons, we've never had things like cereal in the house. Of course they go to grandma's house and I'm like, great, mom, you just wrecked them. You know, and one of my kids said, gosh, mom, you know, I eat cereal and get hungry. Like, well, there you go. Yeah, my whole thing is protein, fat and fiber.

Yep.

You know, and fiber from loads of non starchy vegetables and small amounts of slow, low carbs and just really looking at it that way and I think pretty much any of us can, you can see you start to load up on, on those carbs and you're like, it's quick. It's amazing how quickly it shifts. It's like, wow, what happened? Right? And you just don't feel good.

No. And it's interesting for me, so, so for full transparency with everyone, last fall my thyroid medicine got recalled and I went on the journey of not being the provider, being the patient, and being really stuck in what I considered. It was like this turmoil of. I was put on Compounded medication, then another medication. Nothing was agreeing with me. I was gaining weight. I was becoming insulin resistant. I'm a tiny person. I was tracking everything. I was on a scale. I was on lumen. I had a continuous glucose monitor. I was tracking everything. And I looked like. And I felt like a wackadoodle. But it was really valuable for me to go through that experience because it just goes to show us when our hormones are not properly balanced, no one's happy. And I was not happy watching all of this kind of go on. So for people that are listening and saying, you know, something seems like it's off, you know, what I used to do is no longer working. It's all hormones. I think it's Sarah Gottfried. I was reading a statistic that she had in an article that I was looking at. It was like, 95% of weight issues are related to hormones being imbalanced.

It's so important. It makes me so. I got to tell you, when I first started saying, your body's not a bank account, it's a chemistry lab, it was like I was saying the earth was flat and. But I could just see it. I didn't know at the time. I just was like, wow. You know, my women who are 45 plus are totally different than men and women in their 30s, like, what the heck's going on? And, you know, and it's. They can be eating exactly the same things. And I think that's what's important. Important is you could be eating exactly the same stuff, and all of a sudden your hormones shift and bam. You know, and so then you get a little crazy and you go, I know what I'll do. I'll restrict more and I'll exercise more. Even though, you know, that's not the right thing to do. And it makes it worse, not better. So that's why this is so key. Important to understand is that if your hormones aren't in balance and you are trying to do all this stuff and massively restrict and overwork, it's just going to make you worse. So kind of final wrap up on how these. How hormones really contribute here, because I just think that we can never hear that enough, because no matter how many times you hear it, when you're struggling with your weight, I think the first thing people look at is like, oh, I'll just eat less, exercise more. Even though you can pretty much see quickly how much that can just make things worse, not better.

Absolutely. And I think it's also, you know, this is something you and I have Talked about quite a bit is, you know, trusting. Trusting your body and what it's trying to tell you and finding a healthcare provider that is sensitive to what you're experiencing and can validate what you're experiencing. Because I knew for myself, you know, when I got transitioned to a compounded thyroid medication, you know, I'm. I'm a tiny person, but, you know, you know, when something is not. Not agreeing with your body. I suddenly became hyperthyroid and really didn't feel good. And someone said to me, oh, well, you know, that's actually one of the hardest hormones to compound. And I was like, I'm a healthcare provider, and I didn't know that. And so for everyone that's listening, acknowledging that sometimes you have to balance these basic hormones before you can move on to other things. And blood sugar is a good one. Cortisol, melatonin, you know, our thyroid hormone, sex hormones, all of those things really mitigate how we perceive the world and how we sleep and how much energy we have. And, you know, all these very simple things that we take for granted until they don't work right.

And then, boy, very humbling. However, this is where things. It's, you know, if you're listening to that, going, oh, my gosh, the cool news is you will figure it out. It's why you keep food journals and you use a scale. And I think if we can move from using a scale as a judgmental mean tool to a tool that's just telling us if things are working or not, you know, take the emotion and all that stuff out of it and just. Just do that stuff and start to really track. Because that's. We are ultimately our best healthcare provider, like, because we're the ones that really understand if it's working or not. So that is an important piece of it. So, parting words for someone considering. Because I know one of the things you're going to be gifting everybody is your. And this was really cool of you. You're giving everybody your sleep ebook. And I'm going to put that@jjvirgin.com fastsleep and that's a $29 ebook. So Cynthia is gifting that to everybody, so you'll want to make sure you grab that. Parting words to someone thinking about doing this, what would you say?

Yeah, I would say, you know, this is intrinsically the way our bodies are designed to work best. I think there's a lot of fear about not eating more frequently. You know, people worry that, you know, I'm going to mess up my metabolism I can't work out fasted. I'm not going to be able to have energy to get through my day.

And I lose muscle.

Exactly, exactly. And so I remind people like you spike human growth hormone while you're fasted. So that helps you maintain lean muscle. But one of the really important things is slow and steady wins. No one's in a race. Really critically important that if you're snacking, just remove the snacking. You know, restructure your macros so that you're in a position where you feel confident. And even if you're doing a 12, 13, 14 hour fast, you're still doing benefits for your bodies and, you know, kind of slowly opening up that fasting window. There's so many ways to support your body while you're fasted. I know we didn't touch on that. But you know, knowing that you can hydrate, you don't have to do a fast dry, you know, plain coffee with some, you know, Himalayan sea salt is one way you can take away the bitterness. Bitter tea. So like green and black teas, I mean those you can consume while fasted, they're not going to break your fast. And I'm a clean fast advocate so I always have to kind of plug that in there. But hopefully the sleep book will be beneficial. You know, I love JJ's listeners and hopefully this information will be really helpful to get your sleep habits on track.

Awesome. Thank you so much. I super appreciate it again. Jjvirgin.com fastsleep you will be back because I feel like this could be like a part one of part 10. So we'll bring you back to continue the series and I just super appreciate you hanging out with us and sharing so much good stuff.

Awesome. Such a pleasure.

All right, Foreign. I hope you loved that as much as I did. And make sure that you subscribe to JJ.com it's that easy. Just go to subscribetojay.com so you don't miss these awesome Deep dive bonus episodes. You know, I've got my weekly everyday daily Ask the Health Expert and then I'm going deep with experts on the top topics that you want to know more about. Of course, intermittent fasting is always one we get asked about a ton. And one more time, Cynthia's download of her Sleep Strategies $29 book is free for you being an audience member. Jjvirgin.com fastsleep all right, be sure to subscribe so you don't miss an episode and I'll see you next time. Foreign.

Hello listeners, this is Ann Bogle author, blogger, and creator of the podcast what Should I Read next? Since 2016, I've been helping readers bring more joy and delight into their reading lives. Every week, I take all things books and reading with a guest and guide them in discovering their next read. They share three books they love, one book they don't, and what they've been reading lately, and I recommend three titles they may enjoy reading next. Guests have said our conversations are like therapy, troubleshooting issues that have plagued their reading lives for years and possibly the rest of their lives as well. And of course, recommending books that meet the moment. Whether they are looking for deep introspection to spur or encourage a life change or a frothy page turner to help them escape the stresses of work, school, everything, you'll learn something about yourself as a reader and you'll definitely walk away confident to choose your next read, with a whole list of new books and authors to try. So join us each Tuesday for what Should I Read Next? Subscribe now wherever you're listening to this podcast and Visit our website whatshouldireadnextpodcast.com to find out more.