Food: What the Heck Should I Eat? with Dr. Mark Hyman

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All right, welcome to today's podcast. I've got one of my oldest, dearest pals on the podcast today. Known him for 20 years now and tell you that the person I'm about to introduce you actually you already know him if you've been around my community. He's been on my podcast. I've promoted him because he is it. He is, besides being one of my favorite people on the planet, he's a crusader, he's a pioneer. He is really the person who's put functional medicine on the map. You probably guessed who I'm talking about here. I'm talking about my buddy Dr. Mark Hyman, who's with everything he's doing. He's still practicing out out there. He's a 10 times New York Times bestselling author, about to be 11 with this next book and this next book, what the heck should I eat? I still remember talking to him and he goes, gosh, you know, we were laughing about the biggest question we get asked is what did you eat today? So and what should I eat? So he's got that answer for you in this book. And when you hear what's in here, like this is one you want to run out and get. He has really been pivotal in getting functional medicine and out there. He's a chairman, the chairman of the Institute for Functional Medicine. He is now setting up. He is the director at the Cleveland Clinic center for Functional Medicine created that, which is so huge. And he's the Pritzker Foundation Chair in Functional Medicine there. So it's really at the college there, the College of Medicine there. So it's really cool because he has just moved forward with this and he's moved forward with this when he was, when people were just bashing him, telling him he was crazy. So, you know, I'm so thankful for all the work he's done in helping everybody out there. And besides that, he's the medical editor of the Huffington Post and he's on all sorts of TV. He's on Dr. Oz all the time at Good Morning America, CNN, CBS. You know, you've seen him everywhere. And now today we get him here and he's delightful and super fun as always. Now in the interview, we have a super cool gift from Dr. Mark Hyman for you. I'm going to tell you all about it. It's this quiz that really helps you, you know, what's going on with you and then like in terms of the toxicity in the food that you're eating. So super cool quiz. I love these. You know how much I love these. And you can get that@jjvirgin.com food Dr. Mark Hyman, welcome back to the show. I'm so glad you're here with me today.

I'm so glad to be here.

Well, I know that we have talked about this one on and on and on about how the biggest question you always get asked is what the heck should you eat?

Right?

Completely.

Gosh, why the heck is everyone so confused? What is going on?

Well, you know, I, I spent a lot of time thinking about that because, you know, I spend my life like you do, thinking about how food plays a role in chronic disease and why so many people are so confused. And I, I began to understand as I dug into the research and as I dug into the patterns that are driving our food system, that are driving this horrible food, that are helping people be so confused, I realized that it was a combination of, you know, somewhat poor science early on that guided us in the wrong direction, like low fat. And it's the funding of research by the food industry, which, for example, if Coke funds a study on soda, it's going to find that it doesn't cause obesity. Right. If dairy funds a study on milk, then they're going to find that it's a health food. Right. So regardless of the truth, they manipulate the data and then they hire scientists and they write the studies. And if the industry sponsors the study, it's eight to 50 times more likely to be positive for industry. Second, they influence public health organizations like the American Health Heart Association, American Academy of Nutrition, Dietetics, American Diabetes association and more by funding them and infecting their policies. So if you look at, you know, the American Heart association, you know, says that high sugary cereals are heart healthy.

Yeah. Their little stamp of approval. I mean, what it's like I'm Captain Crunch. I mean, come On.

Yeah, it's frightening. And so, so, and then they, then they get into corporate responsibility, quote, social responsibility, by funding things like the NAACP or the King center, which then support, sorry, oppose the soda tax. Right. So, and then they practice, you know, corruption of the media as well, by, by using advertising to little kids and by pushing the wrong foods and by confusing us. And it's, it's really corrupt. And then of course, the policies that we get are really driven by lobbyists who, you know, make our food policy completely corrupt. So we fund all the commodity foods like processed oils and from soybeans, high fructose corn syrup and corn flight flour, which is wheat. And then we, we then pay for that food to be delivered to consumers through food stamps. We have $7 billion for food stamps, for soda, which is kind of crazy. It's the number one item, bought food stamps. And then we, we make the process for school lunches. You can't have a school lunch if you don't give a kid milk. And then usually it's sugary milk. And then on top, on top of that, you know, they, they, they pay for Medicare, Medicaid on the back end. So we're corrupting the whole system. And then the government. So the guidelines are confused, the media is confused, the scientists is confused. And so we end up with this mess where one day, you know, eggs are bad, then they're good. One day butter is bad, then it's good. One day, you know, you shouldn't eat cholesterol. Now you can, you know, oatmeal is healthy now. It's not like it makes people crazy. And so, you know, my book Food what the Heck Should I Eat? I essentially took on that question and analyzed one, why we're confused, Two, how corrupt the food system is and how the food industry funds public health organizations, scientists and policymakers driving policies that perpetuate the system. And then, you know, I looked at what are the good studies and trying to understand the difference between like population studies, experimental studies, and, you know, what we know and what we don't know. So this is essentially what the book's about. Takes each group of food, meat, poultry, dairy, vegetables, fruit, nuts, seeds, beans, grains, and just goes over, you know, what do we know about each of them? And you know, what is the truth about what the science says and what's the latest research? And, you know, it was really satisfying to go through it because, you know, so many people are just totally, totally in the dark about what the heck they should eat.

Yeah. And those that aren't like those that have a specific. It's like a diet religion, man. Yeah, right.

Yes.

Between the Paleos and. Because it's. It's bloodshed out there now. I know. I love this. I love this so much. You know how much I love. I love this pegan diet you came up with. I think it's just like, this is. I know you thought you were just joking, but this is the most obvious thing that we should all be following.

Yeah, it's kind of funny, right? I was sitting on a panel with a cardiologist who was a militant vegan and another guy who was a hardcore Paleo doctor, and they were arguing back and forth, and I was like. Was like, ping pong. And I'm like, hey, if you're a vegan and you're Paleo, I must be pagan. And I was sort of joking about it. And then I realized, actually there's a lot in common between the two. There's a few differences that are, you know, big things like animal food or not, but other than that, you know, they're pretty similar. You know, both are no dairy. Both are low glycemic foods. Both are tons of plant foods. Both, you know, agree on no processed foods. Both agree on, you know, no chemicals added preservatives. Like, there's a lot in common. Both agree that we should be eating nuts and seeds, and there's some, you know, differences on the grains, beans, and the meat. But, you know, when you look at the overall recommendations, they're not that different. It's just where you get your protein and from. So I think. I think that. That, you know, I came up with this as a way to sort of poke fun at it, but also to sort of realize that there's a balance here and there's a lot of different ways we can eat. And there are some key principles that I think everybody agrees on. You know, it should be low glycemic. It shouldn't spike your blood blood sugar. And you've written a lot about that, jj. And that's a key thing around aging, weight gain, heart disease, cancer, diabetes, dementia, all really related to that. So whatever you eat, it has to be that.

There is still so much confusion around that. Simple. To me, that is such a simple concept, and yet we still have people doing these smoothies loaded with fruit juice. Right? And I mean, so there's still even that concept, which is of all the concepts like lower your sugar, you still hear people going, but it's honey.

Yeah. I mean, I go buy these green juices and then I go, I'm gonna have the green juice. And I look at the bottle and I'm like, wow, this is more sugar than a can of soda.

Soda. And you look at like any of these diets still have room to become problematic. Like you look at Paleo and they have now all those Paleo treats. I'm like, come on. All that honey, honey treats. And then you look at vegan and you've got all these gluten free cupcakes and cookies, you know, and it's like, right, right. So you have to look at all of this stuff and go. I think probably because I'd love to talk about some of the core principles. I would think one is unprocess your diet.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You know, I like 12 main principles. And they're, they're pretty, you know, nobody can really argue with them. They're just kind of common sense that the problem with common sense is not too common. So.

Right.

You know, well, what are some of.

The surprising ones Now? I know and I'm going to tell everybody. This is obviously the book you have to have and I just love that you actually called it what the Heck should I Eat? So food. What the Heck should I Eat? But let's throw out. Even though we think these are so obvious, there is still so much confusion. I mean, some of the people I talk to, Mark, they think eggs are dairy products. They think corn is a vegetable.

Yeah. I've never seen a cow lay an egg, have you, jj? I don't think they're d areas from cows. Eggs are from chicken. But they're in the dairy section of this grocery store. That's why.

Right, that's why.

Right next to the milk and the butter.

Yes. And then you've got corn out in the vegetable section. So you see where this could come from.

Totally, totally. It's so confusing. I think, you know, I think the, you know, the eating a diet that's like low, like eliminating processed foods and chemicals and additives, I think that's just ground zero. We average American eats about 5 pounds of additive a year. You know, we, we are full of pesticides. The hormones and antibiotics and food do affect human health in adverse ways. We, you know, we're consuming tons of artificial sweeteners which have horrible effects on your gut flora and your metabolism lead to weight gain. I mean, we just, we're just eating so many chemicals and then, you know, I think the second thing is, you know, if it was made by food, the food industry, it's probably bad for you. You Know, there are some package or processed foods that are okay, you know, like a can of sardines, you know, a can of tomatoes, you know, a can of artichokes. Like, those are fine because, you know.

Like a food with one item in there, it says artichokes.

Right.

Water. Right, right, right. I'm just wondering, Mark. I. I remember I went on Rachel Ray and I was talking about not eating dairy. And then I had to do a disclaimer because I got in trouble, because they're like, well, what about the Dairy Council? So I'm wondering, as you go out and start to say this, shoot, how the heck. You know, I know that you'll probably be able to roll it on to Dr. Oz because they go along with this stuff and he's behind us. But, you know, this is. This is going to be tough to get out into the media.

Well, I got to tell you a story, actually. I. I was on Martha Stewart once on her show, and the, you know, I had my segment and there was, you know, about detox and getting healthy, and then they had her trainer on. And, you know, when, you know these, you've been on many shows. You know, the. The person who's doing the show has usually a teleprompter cheat process. You got to know your stuff, and, like, you don't get a cheat sheet. And so the producer was like, well, we're gonna do a whole thing on dairy. And this we're gonna say. I'm like, listen, this is not right. Like, dairy is not a perfect sports drink. And here's all the literature. And I sent it to him. He's like, you know, I know, but the show is being sponsored by the Dairy Council. And so the trainer on the show literally read from cue cards prepared by the Dairy Council of talking points on what to say. And I'm like, watching this, and I'm like, oh, my God. I mean, the Dairy Council convinced the government. They were furious because it wasn't a recommendation. The original guidelines to eat dairy. They put so much pressure on the government that the government formed a research group and a dairy. I think it was a promotion research board to partner with the Dairy Council. And they funded a lot of the Got Milk ads.

Remember that study, though, that came. Remember that bogus study that came out about that dairy and weight loss? And at the time, I was on Dr. Phil and I was taping teen, like teens, how they could go and eat healthy at fast food restaurants, which is a joke, because the answer is, you can't. But you Know, especially maybe some of the things like the Mexican ones, but not. But not McDonald's. So I'm at McDonald's, and I've got three of their top people standing behind the camera that's pointed at me, standing at the checkout place. And they are. First of all, they're all obese, including their dietitian, with their arms folded, waiting to see what I was going to say. And I'm like, great. What do you do? You know, that's what I think people don't realize, is you will get edited straight out of these TV shows when you say these things.

I know. It's crazy. I mean, so I think, you know, we. We really been bamboozled by the Dairy Council. I mean, David Ludwig and Walter Willett, who the. Some of the top nutrition scientists in the world at Harvard, they wrote an editorial saying the dietary guidelines that tell us to drink three glasses of milk a day are completely unfounded in science. And they went over and over, like, skim milk makes kids fat, and it doesn't protect you against bone loss. In fact, it leads to more fractures, it promotes cancer, promotes allergies, acne, gut issues, lactose intolerance. I mean, it's not nature's perfect food. And yet, you know, most Americans, you know, still believe you have to feed your baby after you wean them, you have to feed them milk, how are they going to grow strong? I mean, it's. It's this cultural meme that's so powerful. And, you know, and then we, you know, we took all the fat out of milk, made skim milk, we turn into cheese, and, you know, all this processed cheese that's part of so many foods, they just add cheese to everything.

Yeah. It was amazing. When I was writing the Virgin Diet and finding out where they were hiding, where they were hiding dairy and gluten, I'm like, why would they put that there? Yeah, it's crazy.

It is a bit crazy.

So we got the dairy situation and obviously all these additives that it's always incredible. I go off to Europe, I eat anything I want there. I always lose weight. I come back, I eat less here. I'm super careful. I choose everything, I gain it back. And it's not the walking, you know, it's just. It's always these additives. It makes me crazy. So what's another one that might be a bit surprising to people? Even though these are, to me, pretty commonplace, I'm sure for a lot of people.

Yeah. I mean, I think. I think the whole idea that you Know, meat causes heart disease and cancer is a big one. I think, you know, we've been taught that red meat is bad. We've reduced our consumption of red meat dramatically. We've dramatically increased our consumption of dairy and poultry, which actually may be a bad thing. And I'll explain in a minute. But you know, we, we were, we were taught this and we, and we still are taught this. And I think that, you know, there's a number of issues here. One is, you know, how, how are the studies done? Like, what were the studies that proved this? Well, the studies that were done that quote, prove this were population studies which don't prove cause and effect, just correlation. So you can see a pattern, but you can't prove anything. Second, people who in the studies, you know, during the time of those studies were in the era where meat was considered bad for your health. So they didn't eat meat if they were health conscious. And the ones who didn't give a crap about their health ate tons of meat. And also, by the way, didn't exercise, weighed more, 800 calories more a day, more processed foods, more sugar, less fruits and vegetables, didn't exercise, smoked, drank too much. Of course they had more disease. Right. It wasn't the meat. It's like we call it the healthy user effect. So people who are healthy, like in the Women's Health study, we found that hormones actually seem to reduce the risk of heart attacks and cancer. But it turns out that when they actually did the experiment, they found that, oh no, it wasn't the hormones, it was the woman who went to their doctor and cared about their health and took the hormones, were just healthier overall because they had good habits. It wasn't the estrogen that was protecting, in fact, it probably made them worse.

But that's the kind of mark are they also looking at? Because this is the one that's always driven me crazy. You can't compare, you know, factory corn fed hormone injected beef to grass fed grass, finished beef.

Yeah, exactly. So yes, the studies were not done on, you know, bison or elk or they weren't done on grass fed beef or. No, they weren't. So I think that that's the other part of the issue. And I think when you look at experimental studies, you know, paleo diets improve all the biomarkers of health and aging and cardiovascular disease and cancer markers and diabetes. When people are testing diets that are, you know, include healthy meat and I think if you're going to eat meat, it should be sustainably raised, it should be Free of hormones and antibiotics. It should be grass fed, it should be humanely raised and it should be ideally in a regenerative process. There's a new book that came out called Kiss the Ground. It's I think coming out soon and it's essentially a book about how animals play a huge part in the ecosystem in soil restoration and climate change is a huge factor in animal, animal factory farming and we have to address that. And, and this is actually showing how raising animals in a traditional way, it's based on grazing practices, actually can restore grasslands where there's deserts and they can actually sequester enough carbon if it's done at scale to take us back to the pre industrial era. So this is like a, you know, the environmental issues need to be addressed for sure and the health issues I think can be mitigated by having grass fed meat which is more expensive for sure, but you can have less. And I, that's why I call it Pegan. It's not, you know, a giant 16 ounce steak every night. It's, it's, you know, smaller, healthier protein and most of your plates should be plants. You know, you should have most of your diet as tons of veggies and fruits. And it's not fruits and veggies, it's veggies and fruits because you know.

Thank you.

It's not like five, it's not like eight or nine servings of fruit and like one serving of veggie, it's like one serving of fruit and eight or nine of veggies.

And by the way, I know when you're talking about veggies, it's what makes me crazy in that in, I guess it's now called my plate is that they made fruits and veggies the same and then they also made non starchy and starchy vegetables the same. And I'm like, gosh, if someone thought that a head of broccoli was the same as a potato, was the same as apple juice or raisins, you know, what are they going to have? They're going to choose the broccoli, they're going to choose the potato or something like that. So I'm guessing you're meaning eat lots of non starchy vegetables, load up like that's probably the only thing you could get a group of us together and everybody would agree on. Even you know, the Paleo's versus the vegans. Right?

Totally. Yeah. You know, and I think Paleo can go bad too. Like, you know, you can end up eating tons of sugar and natural sugars and date sugar and all this crap, and it's, it's just sugar.

I'm like, all those paleo treats, I'm like, guys, so you stuck some bison with a bunch of dried fruit, made it a paleo bar, and you think it's okay? No.

Yeah. Yeah.

So you clear up the confusion in this book, which I love. Not only do you show people how we went so far astray, but you also show people really the guidelines that they should follow so they can eat a healthy diet. Do you feel like there's like, the one way or how does, how does this work with, with, you know, bio individuality?

Yeah. So, you know, we're in the air of personalized medicine and nutrigenomics. And, you know, there's a huge variation in, in diets that humans can eat. You know, from the 80% carb diet of the Pima Indians in Arizona to the 70% diet of fat from the Inuit and in northern, you know, northern regions of the world. And so I think we, we really have to understand that humans are greatly adaptable. But if you follow the foundational principles, you know, all cultures had low glycemic diets, all cultures had good fats, all cultures had lots of fiber. All cultures had eight, you know, tons of plant foods. I mean, we, we used to eat 800 varieties of plant foods. And we're hunter gatherers now. We have like 12. And, you know, the top two are, you know, French fries and, and, and tomato sauce on pizza. You know, like, that's, it's not really where we should be going. And I. Yeah, so I think that, you know, we, we know so much now. I mean, way more than we ever did. So we can use metabolic typing and testing to help determine what's best for people. We can have people test themselves. You know, some people need more carbs, some people need less fats. Some people do great on ketogenics, some people do terrible on ketogenic diets. So you have to sort of experiment with yourself. Look at your lab tests, look at your genetics, your, you know, for example, your ethnic background. It matters. You know, I think this. Recently there was a study that came out that shows do soda consumption is going down in the United States, which is a great thing, but it's going up everywhere else. It's gone down by 25% in the US but it's gone up by 25% in the rest of the world. And they're exporting these horrible foods and soda. I just. And it's insidious, like they're insidious. I mean, I just went and read this article in New York Times that was about how soda companies in Colombia are really using same tactics as drug cartels to pressure opponents of, of soda. There was a group that started a soda tax initiative they were going to do, the government was going to do it. They, they got a funding from Bloomberg. This woman who was a doctor got harassed and threatened and you know, thugs came after her. They hacked in their computers. They, they in fact lobby the government and got them to take off an ad they put on television that was, you know, about the soda tax in favor of it. And then they got them not only to take out the ad, but they got them to make it an offense to actually mention the soda tax. So they would be fined $250,000 by the government if they said anything in the media about this. I mean, that's like a police state. And that's all driven by the food industry.

I know you have, and I just, I know this is the slang, the code name for it, the Feel like Crap quiz. I know it's not actually called that, but you have something, because I always love when you can connect the dots between what you're eating and how you feel. Right. So one of the things that you're giving everyone listening today is you're giving them your toxicity quiz. Tell everyone what they can find out by taking this quiz and how they should use this quiz.

Yeah, well, you know, most people don't connect the dots, like you said, between what they eat and how they feel. And we know this in functional medicine. We've seen it, you've seen it. We've known each other for 20 years. And this is just complete aha for most people. And also most people don't understand that the symptoms that they think are normal for them, whether it's irritable bowel or migraines or bad skin or asthma or sinuses issues or anything. Pretty much joint pain, depression are related to what you're eating. And that by quick changing your diet, you can quickly transform this. You know, I just gave a talk and clean the other night and this woman, it's like, listen, I did your 10 day detox, which is essentially getting off of all the crap and putting in the good food and it's eliminating inflammatory foods. And she said, I was scheduled for bilateral knee replacements. I was feeling so sick, I had headaches, I couldn't sleep more than three hours a night. I was overweight, I had skin issues, congestion, my gut was a mess. I said I did the tending detox, I lost a huge amount of weight, I canceled my knee replacements. And I'm like, whoa. I'm like, I even, I'm impressed by that, you know, and, you know, this is something that just doesn't happen. And there was no drug that could help her prevent her knee replacement. So that's why food is the most powerful medicine out there. And, and it works fast. It's like, you know, 10 days, you know, like. So I encourage people to do the toxicity quiz to get a score of like how bad they feel. And you rate your symptoms from 0 to 4 in terms of frequency and severity. And then you see your number. And if you're like over 50, 60, 70, you know, that means you feel like crap. And if you're over 100, that's a more serious version. That's called FLS, which, you know, it's a more serious version. And so people, you know, have profound experiences just changing their diet for 10 days. And I encourage you and I love that.

So you do that before because your 10 day detox is just fantastic genius. And you know, we have, we've known each other 20 years and you are the person out there who I absolutely. It's like most people, you go, Yeah, I love 90% of what you do, or 70% or.

Not.

You like, we are totally in sync. Your stuff is. And I love that someone can do this because I think the more we can learn to take responsibility for our health, to self identify, to go, oh, when I eat that, I get a headache. You know, headaches are not normal. You know, having gas and bloating, not normal. And the fastest way to change is change what's at the end of your fork. And I just love that you are not only clearing up the confusion with this book, but also showing people how it got insane in the first place. Because, you know, that's the challenge is we go, who do we believe? And then when you start to realize how this all happened, you're like, oh, okay. Because the science can be manipulated. It's like the totally. Biochemistry doesn't lie. But science can lie because you can create. Gosh, that's what I learned in grad school. It's like I could create a study to say anything. It's called a pilot study. You figure it out and then do it so well.

The truth is doctors aren't even well trained because I remember I learned how to read it studies, how to analyze them. And I had this naive vision that all studies went through a peer review process, were Independent were basically quote, scientific. And then I began to realize that, you know, a lot of the research we have is industry funded, that they have an agenda that this way the studies are designed and written up and the data is manipulated even with statins is getting out of control.

Yeah. And it's super. I mean it's expensive to do studies. Someone has to pay for them and it should always be, you should always follow the money back. When that whole thing came out with the Dairy Council, I was on Dr. Phil at the time doing his weight loss challenges. He was out with the big milk mustache on. Right. He was like one of the key dads. So you know, of course it was supposed to become part of the challenge. And Mark, what I did was he had a chapter in the book called Weight loss Resistance. I'd say, you know, everybody else can do milk, but not you. So I took all the challengers off of milk and gluten because I could. Yeah, I cheated. So. All right, I know we're up against the time and I want to let everybody know how they can take that quiz because this, this quiz should be in your toolbox. Same with the book. You want to get the book food, what the heck can I eat? But you want to take this quiz, go to jjburgeon.com food you're going to get all the show notes from today. You will get the link to the quiz so that you can use this to track yourself because you want to look at this. Go on the 10 day detox, go off of it, take the quiz and see what changed. Because you know, haven't you found over the years people forget how crappy they felt? Yeah, right.

No, I, I, it's true. I mean, I, it's just unbelievable and it's, it's like so within reach for most people. And yeah, some people have more serious stuff. They'll, they'll need more intensive treatment. But 80% of people just have extraordinary results just changing their diet for 10 days.

And I think the foundation anyway for everything walking into the doctor you should have done this first. You should walk having cleared.

Yeah, it's absolutely true. And in food, what the heck should I eat? I go through, you know, an abbreviated version of the 10 day detox for people and then kind of talk them how to transition out of that into a more variety of food and a wider diet, which is a pegan diet. And it, and, and each chapter just goes through the science of each category of food and, and just goes through it in a way that's clear at the End of each chapter, go eat this, don't eat that. Like, if you're gonna eat meat, these are the meats to eat. If you're gonna eat meat, don't eat these. Or, you know, if you're gonna eight vegetables, these are the ones that are better, these are the ones that are worse, and so on and so forth. For every grains, beans, and I go through every category so you can optimize your diet and use the latest science to figure it out.

Thank God for writing this book. We've been waiting for it. I know this was a big and I know that you sequestered yourself and worked your butt off on this book. So thank you so much. I know you did a ton of research on it, so super appreciate you doing it because we all needed all of the health experts out it needed as a resource to give all of our clients too. So they really get this. So thank you, thank you, thank you. And I want to remind everybody to go to jjvirgin.com food take that toxicity quiz, the feel like crap quiz. So it really gives you that starting point so you can see the impact as you shift your diet and you start to eat better. So thank you, Mark. I super appreciate you're awesome. I appreciate you jumping on the interview. I appreciate all the work that you do. I appreciate you just being the massive pioneer and spokesperson out there and taking the bullets.

Yeah, I got a few. I got a few bullet ones.

Yeah, you heal fast, right? So. All right, thank you. After the break, I'll be answering a listener's question, so stay with me.

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Welcome back. This is the time. The the time rather where I answer a listener's question. Today's question comes from a guy. Yes, we do have men that listen. Thank you. And this comes from Joe in Houston and he says, jj, I'm confused as to what I should be doing. High fat, low fat, how do I know how many carbs I should be eating? How Much protein, How much fat? All right, Joe, I'm glad you asked this question. This is one that comes up a lot and this is one where I do believe you need to go through your own personal discovery process. Now it's interesting if you do either gut microbiome testing, the biome test which we will link to in the show notes has information on this. And also the some of the different genetics tests like the pathway fit will give you an idea of where you need to fall. Like I know that I'm a low carb genotype and then when I just did the biome I found that I do better with higher fat, higher protein and low carbs. That I have this unique disposition which allows me to use protein easily for energy. And I kind of knew that intuitively. And so here's what we do and this is why I loved that Mark had that quiz is I think the most important thing is to really take it and become your own personal health detective. Because just what I told you how I, how I did these tests that showed I was a low carb genotype, I'd actually already gotten to that place just really paying attention to my body. So here's where I start. And if you read the virgin diet or the sugar impact diet, both of those have in there my plate, not the USDA my plate, we bashed that during this interview. But my plate that has cleanly protein, healthy fats, loads of non starchy vegetables and then a little bit of slow low carbs which would be starchy vegetables, legumes, gluten free grains and fruit. And the way I teach people to eat is ideal amounts of or optimal amounts of clean lean protein for them. And for most women that'll be about 4 to 6 ounces per meal. Most men more around the 6 to 8, even as high as 10 ounces per meal. And it's going to depend how much fats in that. A fattier piece of fish or a fattier piece of grass fed beef, you can actually eat more because you're eating less protein grams. But basically I'll dose it at about 0.75 to 1 gram of protein per pound of lean body mass. So you get on a body fat scale, you check it out and that's how you dose it. I put you, I put more in if you're training hard or recovering from say a surgery or healing or recovering from being sick and otherwise you can do it at the 0.75. I do better with higher protein. So I do 1 gram per pound of lean body Mass for me. Next up, you're going to eat one to two servings of slow, low carbs at each meal. And you might even say 0 to 2 because sometimes some people do well on keto. I don't. I do better when I eat a little bit of the slow, low carb in the evening. I don't tend to eat much of that at all during the day, but I'll do it in the evening. So 0 to 2 servings of a slow, low carb at breakfast, lunch and dinner. So that could be berries, it could be legumes, it could be wild rice, it could be a sweet potato. And a serving size of that is about a half a cup of the slow, low carbs or a cup of fruit or squash. Okay, Next up is loads of non starchy vegetables. 5 to 10 servings a day. So each meal. Yes. Even breakfast. Put it into your JJ virgin smoothie. You're going to be eating some non starchy vegetables. That's spinach, all the deep green leafies, broccoli, cauliflower, brussels sprouts. I just did the biome test and they said, wow, you eat a lot of sulfur rich vegetables. I'm like, yes, I do. I do. My broccoli, my brussels sprouts, my cauliflower, lots of it. They could tell I'd been, I'd been good. I got to get an A on that. And then the rest of it's healthy fats. Generally it's two to four servings per meal and that's like five to ten nuts, half of a small avocado, some of the fat from the grass fed beef or the wild salmon. Could be ghee, could be olive oil, coconut. And then you, you start there and then you start to play around. I discovered I do better a little lower in carb. If you find that you go lower in carbon, your energy crashes and you don't sleep well.

Bring it back up a little bit.

If you feel, you don't feel. And by the way, if you're not feeling good, the other thing I highly recommend is to take some protein and fat, digestive enzymes, because that can help tremendously as well. So there is not a perfect answer. There's some, there's some bioavailability here. Your body does adapt and it's really up to you again to connect the dots between what you're eating and how you feel, because that's the most important piece of this at all. And the fastest way to feel better is to change what's at the end of your fork. Now, if you'd like to submit a question, just head on over to my Facebook page @jj virgin official or or Instagram jjvirgin. We stalk those. We answer them, of course, all the time. And I answer them on my Facebook lives, but then we also stalk them because I'm always looking for those awesome questions I can pull on my podcast. Now, the other awesome things that we look for to pull on the podcast are reviews. And it means the world to me when you leave a review. So this is a big ask to say, hey, if you like this, if you're listening, I would super appreciate you leaving a review. And you know, just, hey, whatever you want to rate it, whatever you feel, I would super appreciate it. It helps so much. Helps other people kind of go, should I watch this? Should I listen? We can't watch it, but should I listen to this? So your review means a lot and it means a lot to me and all my team too. So this one is from Lady Alberg from USA. 5 stars. So great. I listen religiously to JJ. With the shorter length of the podcast, it's easy to listen to in the car and she gets right to the point in delivering such great information. And if you know me, you probably figured this out. I'm super direct. She offers a wide variety of topics, so it always keeps me listening. This is super valuable. Thank you so much, Lady Alberg. I super appreciate it. And again, if you feel so compelled, I would really appreciate your review as well. You can just head on over to itunes while you're there. Subscribe, and if you've got pals that you know would benefit from the show, share it on over to them. All right, until next week, thank you.

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Hello listeners, this is Anne Bogle, author, blogger, and creator of the podcast what Should I Read next? Since 2016, I've been helping readers bring more joy and delight into their reading lives. Every week, I take all things books and reading with a guest and guide them in discovering their next reading. They share three books they love, one book they don't, and what they've been reading lately. And I recommend three titles they may enjoy reading next. Guests have said our conversations are like therapy, troubleshooting issues that have plagued their reading lives for years and possibly the rest of their lives as well. And of course, recommending books that meet the moment. Whether they are looking for deep introspection to spur or encourage a life change or a frothy page turner to help them escape the stresses of work, school, everything. You'll learn something about yourself as a reader, and you'll definitely walk away confident to choose your next read, with a whole list of new books and authors to try. So join us each Tuesday for what Should I Read Next? Subscribe now wherever you're listening to this podcast and visit our website what Should I read next podcast.com to find out more.