Quality over Quantity: A Holistic Health and Skincare Discussion with Dr. Eric & Sabrina Ann Zielinski

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About the gut microbiome ad nauseam. Everyone's talking about the gut microbiome for years, but you have as many, if not more bacteria on your skin. So when you look at the microbiome on our skin, it's being annihilated by the products that we put on our sk and so what it's causing is micro slits. Little like what we think of as leaky gut. Leaky skin is causing chemicals to penetrate into our bloodstream.

Welcome to the JJ Virgin Lifestyle show with celebrity nutrition expert, fitness hall of famer and four time New York Times best selling author, JJ Virgin. JJ is a warrior mom whose knowledge and expertise have helped change hundreds of thousands of lives. With over 3.5 million podcast downloads and appearances on Dr. Phil, Dr. Oz, the Today Show, Rachael Ray, Larry King Live.

Whoa, whoa, whoa. This show is about you, not about me. I want to help you find practical, real world ways to dial in your health and mindset so you can finally lose that weight and feel strong and energized. Stop settling for less than your personal best. It's time to find out how to look and feel better than any ever. And I'll be right here with you the whole way. Hello and welcome to today's show. I'm bringing back a buddy of mine. I've got Dr. Z and today I've got Mama Z on with me as well. That's Dr. Eric Zielinski and we are going to be digging into a really interesting topic. We're going to be talking about essential oils. We're going to be talking about toxicity and how toxicity can impact your weight and some of the oil things you really need to pull out of your diet, but more importantly, some of the things you want to put into your diet and then also how you can use essential oils topically to help with all of this. In fact, they gave me one hack that I had never heard of before that is so exciting for helping with weight management. Something that you can both use kind of like as aromatherapy but also you could actually use topically as a body wrap. So I'm not going to tell you what it is. I know that's not very nice, is it? You'll have to listen. But this is a great interview and I have the perfect pair to do this. Now I've never had a husband and wife on the show before and it was really exciting because Sabrina literally just got crowned Mrs. Georgia and she is going off to compete in the Mrs. USA competition. So let me tell you a little bit about Dr. Eric Z and Mama Z. They have pioneered natural living and biblical health education since 2003. They are the authors of the best selling book the Essential Oils Diet and the founder of NaturalLivingFamily.com which is now visited by more than 6 million natural health seekers every year. That's just crazy. Natural LivingFamily.com has rapidly become the number one online source for biblical health and non branded essential oils education and they are just one of my go to's out there for everything around essential oils. They've really got that down. So I'm really excited to share this with you, but before I do that, I want to share this with you as well. And this is from Aerobic Queen from usa. She gave me a four star review and says evidence based health info and concise. I really enjoy this podcast because as a health coach myself I hear a lot of misinformation out there and really appreciate JJ's experience as well as her dedication to provide high quality science based health information. I only wish it was a little longer because I have to stop my workout to find another podcast to listen to. All right, so here's the deal. Aerobic Queen I am starting to do. I always thought, all right, I want to make these podcasts perfect for drive time. But you know what I've decided is I'm going to let them go a little longer when it feels right. So you're going to find that we're doing a little bit different stuff here now at the JJ Virgin Lifestyle show where I'm doing, I'm letting the interviews go a little longer. I've also got once a week I've got a cool interview with someone amazing or in this case today, an amazing couple. And then I've also got my show where I'm just digging into a topic so some topic that has come up a lot. I'm going to dig into that deeper. And then also we're doing Q and A Friday so I will also be doing those as well. So again, love getting these reviews because I want to give you what you are asking for. All right, now, before we dive into this week's amazing episode on essential oils diet, I've got something else cool to share with you. Be back in a minute.

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All right, welcome back, Dr. Z. Good to have you here. And we've got Mama Z on too. Welcome, you guys.

Thank you. Great to be here.

Yes, we love it. We love you, jj. So excited.

I don't think I've ever had a husband and wife on the show. So, like, this is super exciting to have you both on and especially with the new announcement. So Mama Z, as we all know her out there in the social media world, just got crowned Mrs. Georgia.

Yes. I'm so excited. And we're gearing up now for Mrs. America in August.

Very, very cool. So I'm excited about that and I'm also excited about your new book that you guys wrote together. Right? You wrote the essential oils diet together.

Yeah. And Sabrina covers her pageant protocol. And I gotta brag on my wifey pooh, who's about.

You go right ahead.

About to turn 41. All right. And she won the swimsuit fitness competition competing with girls half her age. Mama Z is a hottie. And her. Her how to be a hottie protocol is in the book. And that's what people. Jj, people kept on asking us, sabrina, how are you doing this after four natural home births? How are you doing this? How do you get back in shape? And how do you live a life that's healthy and tasty and worthwhile? And so it's like, yay. And so we're just so excited to be able to, you know, just to see just her hard work and perseverance, because it doesn't, you know. And you know What? It's like, J.J. doesn't come easy to accomplish the thing that we love this.

Because it's going to bust a lot of myths of like, oh, well, you know, I'm getting older. Hey, I'm 56. So as far as I'm concerned, it's. It's 40s and 50s are in the new 20, right? And yeehaw. And you can, you can look and feel better in your 40s, 50s, and 60s and 70s than you ever did when you start to apply some of the stuff I know we're going to talk about today. So that's super cool. And you know, that whole thing of, well, I had kids, so, you know, I can't get rid of my belly or, you know, I'm too busy because I have kids, so I can't put my health first, are like, let's just blow those ones all up. And I know that you've probably talk a lot about that in your book, because those are excuses that I see a lot of women putting out there, and I'm calling them out for what they are. They're excuses. It doesn't have to be that way. You may not even recognize them as excuses. So let's dive in to. And I think this is the perfect segue over to kind of people thinking wrong about weight loss, maybe asking the wrong questions when it comes to weight loss. So what, where should we be in all this? What should we be thinking? What should we be asking?

You know, I want, first of all, wanting to give people food freedom. I mean, we really want to give people food freedom again, where we have that balance. I mean, somewhere we've gone on the total end spectrum of the pendulum, and now people are Freaked out about eating an apple, even organic, healthy apple, because of too many carbs or like, it's gonna spike my blood sugar. I'm gonna gain five pounds. I'm gonna feed my cancer if I eat fruit anymore. And there's fear. I mean, and there's fear. A lot of it is based off of just fad diets. A lot of it's based off of ignorance. But, you know, jj, we're still recovering from the baby boom generation. And before that, we're told that f. Bad for you. Right. So you still got older people that are on margarine. And then it's like, what's. What's right. Fat carbs. How do I deal with this?

Do they really still sell margarine? Like, I haven't. I haven't been to a normal grocery store. I know they don't have margarine at Whole Foods. So for years. I mean, do they really actually still sell?

Yeah, they really do. And. And when you, you know, dive deep into what that actually is, it's. It's so like a rancid. Adding flavor back to stuff. And people are still picking up the I can't believe it's not butter and.

The vegetable oil and the Crisco and.

They'Re using the canola oil and all of this other stuff. So it's like, we know that education still needs to be had out there. And some people's pain point is through their weight. Some people's pain point is through their extra skin. And so it's really reaching people at where they're at and then helping them overcome in their own health journey so they can not only reach their goals, but be a better human.

So what is going on right now? I mean, you started to talk a little bit about some of these damaged fats. I do blame, I mean, big time blame all of that ridiculousness about fat and being afraid of fat. But there are. I mean, let's face it, there are kind of some foods we should be afraid of, like artificial sweeteners and margarines, like, because they're not food. Yeah, they're not. That's not food. But what do you think? You've mentioned a couple. What do you think is going on that's created this health crisis? Because I see issues with weight just merely a reflection of, you know, poor diet and lifestyle and other stuff going on. So what's going on?

Well, a, we're not victims of our metabolic function. Metabolism is no longer a scapegoat, and that's something that we hit hard in the book jj, even the Mayo Clinic, for crying out loud, goes on record and actually says a slow metabolism is not linked, has never been linked, cannot be linked to weight gain. In fact, overweight people have a faster, a higher metabolism because it takes more metabolic function to keep them alive because they're so overweight and they're putting such a strain on their body. So first of all, it's just to realize what's going on here. And what really puts a burden on your metabolism is toxic overload. And the body doesn't know really the details. The body will see food, the body will see aromatic chemicals in the air. The body will see whatever you're putting on your skin as something life giving or something toxic. And again, whether it's makeup, whether it's food, something you're drinking, something you're thinking, even the body will perceive it as very similar to a toxin, like a fungi, a bacteria, a virus or something good. So it's that simple. Reduce the toxic overload and stop the onslaught. And that's where essential oils come into play with the aerosols. And that's where making Mama Z's DIY recipes are so critical, because you got to stop putting the chemicals on your skin. Because we know that will be linked to weight gain. We know that will be linked to stress. Stress, eating, depression, cancer, anxiety. It's, it's crazy when you think of it. So it's about a balanced approach, a food freedom approach to help people realize, okay, what's bad. And that takes some time. Like you mentioned, like the vegetable oils, the canola oil, the conventional dairy, the conventional meat products, the conventional whatever, all this stuff, the processed food. Like you get back into the slow food movement where you start making your own food again. You start focusing on the organics, non gmo, you start focusing on the right kinds of animal protein because there's a lot of bad kinds of animal protein.

I'm glad you brought up the animal protein thing because one of my frustrations out there is that when we talk about animal protein, I keep seeing it, we shouldn't eat red meat. I'm like, well, wait a minute, we cannot call conventionally raised red meat and all the factoried red meat. We can't call that the same as all the grass fed. We can't call it the same thing. That's crazy. So what is your feeling about. Because I know the organization. We're in mindshare together and I always laugh that we've got the only organization I know where. We've got vegan Keto Paleo, like, you know, Breatheterians. Everyone's hanging out together and getting along and no one's fighting over bacon. But, you know. Exactly right. And it's just kind of a personal choice. But what would you say to someone? Because I, I find that argument that I see out there about, you know, whether or not to eat animals is they're directing it the wrong place. Where we really have to look at you are what you eat. 8. So let's talk, dive a little bit more into the. When you talk food freedom, I think you're talking about eating all of the right types of foods. What would those be? And what are some of the things you definitely want to stay away from?

Yeah, I mean, the thing is that there are certain foods that are just naturally more polluted than others. And the environmental working group has done a great job on the produce aspects. You can go to the Environmental Working Group, EWG.org or we also have the list in our book, the Essential Oils Diet. There are certain foods like strawberries and berries and kale that are just heavily ridden with pesticides just because of how they're grown in America and around the world. Other foods like cantaloupe, pineapple, avocado, banana, you really don't need to, quote, waste your money on organic because these products don't need, these produce don't need to be sprayed like the other ones do. So first of all, just realizing that and also like you mentioned too, huge, huge difference between grass fed, wild, caught versus conventional. And at the end of the day, nothing conventional should touch our lips when it comes to animal protein, period. Especially dairy and whey and collagen and quote, this bone broth craze. And here's the thing about bone broth is what's the source of the bones?

Yeah.

And this is scary. And you know this jj, A lot of the stuff that we see in the market is based off of the byproduct of the conventional chicken industry. And these chickens are fed trash and you're getting that in the bone marrow and then you're potterizing the bone and then you're consuming that. So to find good organic non GMO fed is absolutely critical. And also I think it's balance. Like on the other end we have this carnivore diet and it's like, where do we lose balance? And I do think there's somewhat of a lack of balance in raw vegan too. It's like, okay, let's kind of go back and let's see how our ancestors have eaten and let's see how we've thrived. And you know, you want a diet full of fruits and vegetables and nuts and legumes and dare I say, healthy grains, like good organic, non GMO quinoa. It's not going to kill anybody. But here's a problem though. Is your diet full of that? Are you eating organic non GMO oatmeal for breakfast, lunch and dinner and having a fruit smoothie and fruit juice? Like you're going to obviously blood sugar spike out. I mean, you're just going to carp yourself out and you don't want to do that. So it's about the healthy balance of fats, carbs and proteins where you're not even thinking about the numbers anymore. And that's the freedom. We don't think about numbers. None of. We have no nutritional facts. People ask us why because it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. When you're eating a well balanced diet and when you're in tune with your body, you'll know. Like, if I were to have oatmeal with a glass of fruit juice in the morning, I would crash. I would actually start to have shakes in within half an hour. And people don't even recognize that's not normal when they feel that way because they just take a pill or they do something to get through that.

Yeah. Amen to all of those things. Yes.

You want me to blow your mind? Just a minute. So we had a guy work for us to help build our fence and stuff like that. And he worked for a company, this is local. It's a billion dollar industry around the world. And his job, he'd get to work and he would power wash his body and put a hazmat suit on chicken. And well, this company provides the animal feed for all conventionally raised animals, all different kinds. So his job was to, while he's wearing this toxic chemical suit, to take the liquid formaldehyde, two other toxic chemical powders, combine them together into granules, and then add them to whatever animal feed that they would put it in. And this, this company's like 30 miles from where we live. And you go onto their Facebook page and you almost don't even believe that this is even possible. And so many of the people he said had to leave. They were getting nosebleeds, these intense migraine headaches, and they're wearing these hazmat suits and then they're power washing off. But this is all from conventional stuff. And this is what the animals are eating. They say, oh, this protects you from having things hatch, you know, in the feed and from salmonel. But what about all the toxic chemicals that the animals are taking in? And, you know, for people who just, you know, see an interview or whatever, and they're like, oh, I just need to eat more animal products, but they're not really looking at what. What actually they need to do, so they're just going and getting whatever at the store. You're consuming all of this and just completely destroying your toxic load.

Ugh. That is frightening. Frightening. Yeah, this is. I actually did a talk a couple years ago at Parker Seminar in Vegas where I came out in a Hazmat suit. Oh, my God. Yeah. When I was talking about toxins because, you know, when you look at this, it is really the scariest thing out there are toxins and they're sneaking. And I always talk about sugar sneaking into places, but toxins are one of the key places that they're sneaking in. Let's face is a lot of our beauty products, skin care products. So I'd love to go there a little bit with you, Sabrina, because here you are, you just literally, literally just got crowned Mrs. Georgia. And you are flat out gorgeous. You're 41 years old, so you gotta be using something.

Absolutely. So we make a lot of our own products, and we're blessed to use Anna Maria Skincare. And also both of my makeup artists are very conscious with all of that. And so everything that we use on my face is organic. Most of the time, it's vegan. And if you even just think about one product alone, let's look at. Just talk about mascara. You're putting bat poop on your eyes. It is. If you are using conventional mascara, you're putting bat poop on your eyes. And, you know, I'm sure anybody that's vegan is probably, like, freaking out right now, but so there is no.

I think everybody's freaking out right now.

Not just forget just vegan.

So the thing is, and I've done the research, and there are so many other good products out there that we can use and utilizing. The Environmental Working Group is a great place for people to start finding a company or companies that you. That you really like. Because the biggest thing that people ask me is, you know, there's this cross between wearability and, you know, the natural components. But when we as women are leaving our house with hundreds of chemicals on our body, we have to just think, you know, like, our skin is the largest organ of our body. So, like, we have to be very conscious of what we put on our skin. And then it's also important to straight up wash your face, because so many people leave their makeup on their face at night. And, you know, again, that mascara, if you look at an eye that has had mascara left on overnight, the mites that grow within that nighttime, it's actually disgusting. It's a microbiology experiment right there on your. Your eyeballs.

Oh, boy.

Yeah. Don't go to sleep like that. So, you know, utilizing essential oils, you know, we've created a lot of different products. I make my own eye makeup remover, and it is absolutely amazing. It smells like Thanksgiving. And there are so many different things that we have at our fingertips these days that 15 years ago, just, you know, we just didn't know or we just didn't know that that was an option. And if we focus on using those natural products on our skin, we are taking a great stride to making our bodies more receptible to the foods that we eat and being and living a more healthy, natural lifestyle.

And that might have sounded like this total. Like, where's JJ going with this? We're talking about the essential oils diet. But if you are using these toxic things on your skin, your skin's a sieve. They can interrupt your hormones. They can make you store fat. They can make you more insulin resistant. They can lower your thyroid function. So these things matter. And that's why I was so excited when I saw this. I went, oh, my gosh. All right, you're. Because you guys have been doing essential oils for years. You're one of our go to experts here at the JJ Virgin Lifestyle show. And so I love this whole idea of this essential oils diet and showing some of this d do it yourself stuff you can do. So let's get dig a little deeper into the essential oils and how they can help here and why you wrote this book.

Yeah.

You know, it all boils down to what we call leaky skin and. Right. Have we talked about that yet?

No. Why.

Why aren't we talking about leaky?

I don't know.

You know where I'm going with this, right?

Oh, yes.

You have the gut microbiome. We all know about the gut microbiome ad nauseam. Everyone's talking about the gut microbiome for years, but you have as many, if not more, bacteria on your skin. I mean, that is what your skin is. I mean, so when you look at the microbiome on our skin, it's being annihilated by the products that we put on our skin. And so what it's causing is micro slits. Little like what we think of as leaky gut. Leaky skin is causing chemicals to penetrate into our bloodstream. And this is the problem. Okay, well, what's the big deal? Inflammation. And that's another buzzword that we really try to educate people. Like, inflammation isn't bad. Like, first of all, you cut yourself, which I have a tendency to do. I'm that guy who doesn't use a cutting board. I use a knife, and I have an avocado in my hand, and that's just my nature sometimes. And so I cut myself. Well, thank God for inflammation because blood shunts to the area, it oozes, it starts to puff up. The. The brain signal says, hey, there's pain, there's damage. Be careful. Don't do this again, you idiot. And next thing you know, things start to heal. Well, inflammation is the body's natural response to an assault. So the problem is chronic inflammation. And when you're in, when you're putting on your skin, when you're consuming things that create this toxic something, SOS911 response. That's the bottom line. SOS911, the body responds via inflammation. It's a healing mechanism. And it's. We've only been designed to have that healing mechanism temporarily. Again, you cut your finger, if you keep on cutting your finger in the same spot, it's going to cause a significant problem. Like, significant problem. And so what happens is we keep on putting these skin care products on our body, keep on eating the foods that we shouldn't be eating. The body becomes essentially destroyed internally from chronic inflammation. And that's what we're trying to help people recognize is, is let's use these natural physiological mechanisms to our advantage and stop the onslaught, stop the abuse. And that's a hard word, but coming from alcohol abuse, drug abuse, my own life, I use that word because it scares people. We're oftentimes abusing ourselves and we don't know it. And part of the book is about emotional detoxification, falling in love with yourself again, realizing you're worth it and doing the things that you need to do so you really stop this onslaught and so your body can start to heal from the inside out.

So what are the. What are a couple takeaways from the book that you can share that maybe have people going. Because I think it's already. You've already talked about bat poop mascara. That's definitely aha. And the idea of this leaky skin, which I just love, and the fact that these things that we are putting in our body and putting on our body can actually be causing us to not be able to lose weight or even gain weight. What are a couple of the tips that you have in the book?

Oh, you know, for people that need a help over the hump. And there's, there's a hump, there's a plateau. Maybe you've, you've tried whatever. You've, you're on keto, you're doing paleo, you're vegan, raw, whatever you find yourself, like, plateauing, you're not reaching your health goals. We have really found that essential oils can help people get through that. And so a bunch of different things, like using peppermint to boost your energy, using cinnamon bark to balance your blood sugar to help with cravings. You know, it's really fun. It's kind of exciting, too. And one thing that Sabrina has used extensively during her training for the pageant is using citrus essential oils to boost your body's natural antidepressive and fat burning mechanism. Like literally just smelling lime and smelling grapefruit. Smell lime. Smell. Grapefruit has been proven to stimulate lipolysis, which is fat breakdown. So just by incorporating these little things. Now, I'm not saying, I'm not saying that if you open up your bottle of lime, it's gonna cause you to drop £50 next week. But we've seen, we've seen people just helping them through that little hump, that little area. Applying Mama Z's fat burning wrap over their thighs or underarms or tummy. Whatever the problem areas might be, incorporating these essential oils as part of their daily life can really make a difference.

Wow, that is super cool. Now, I'm sure all of this is in the book, right? The essential oils diet. Yes, of course.

With recipes and everything.

Yes, yes.

Yay.

And I know. Awesome. Plus, when they buy the book, you also have a special bundle where they get all sorts of cool stuff. Let's walk through what they get and I'm going to share with everybody. You can get this at jjvirgin.com forward/EO diet. That's for essential oils diet. And when you buy the book, you'll be able to get this awesome bundle of cool stuff. And what's the cool stuff they're gonna get?

Well, videos, Mama Z walking you through how to make some of the recipes. Mama Z walking you through how to do every one of the exercises. Because we have an exercise program, a couple ebooks, all that's cool. But you know what the best thing is? We have a 60 day challenge group group over 2000 people. A private group coaching program that we have started that anyone can start. It's open enrollment anytime and we walk people through a 60 day journey. And research has shown JJ and whoever said it takes two, three weeks to develop a habit's a liar because research has shown it takes 66 days on average. So, yeah, one person might be able to stim, you know, change their way of life in a day like me. Other people needs to take a couple months. So you give us two months. Two months. And I'll tell you, your taste buds will change, your hormones will balance. Your way of life, if you're willing, will be transformed. So you will enjoy a lifelong, sustainable, healthy, tasty way of life that you could be happy with. This isn't a diet, yo, yo. This isn't a merry go round. This isn't a cheat day mentality. So we want to give people a 60 day group coaching gift because what's the point of reading a book if you can't implement it? Right?

Right.

And the great thing about it is, is that they have all these other people that are going through the same process progress and they're going through the same things at the same time. And so they can not only just lean on each other because they may or may not have the support at home. And so it's so important to have a group, a community, a natural living family that they're able to grow and learn together because that's where the magic happens.

I so agree with you. In fact, people ask me, well, how do I, how do I make sure I get the results? I go, you go find people that are where you are or ahead of you and you spend that time with them.

Them.

That's the, like, one of the biggest keys to success. So I love that you put that in as part of it. And again, jjvirgin.com forward/eodiet and hey, first of all, big congratulations, Sabrina, on your win and we will all be cheering you on in August for your conference.

What about me? I'm Mr. Georgia now. Come on.

Yeah, there you go, Mr.

There's no Mrs. I'm training. I'm training for Mr. America, y'.

All.

You should have heard him after I won the evening gown competition. He said, did you see how I handed you off? I won that competition.

They had the husbands escort them off and it's like, you know, oh, that's so cool. It's a family win.

So I may put, I may put that award on his dresser.

Thank you, new sad.

There you go.

Okay.

I bet you looked awesome in the tux, right? Said I'm gonna take what you said. I'm gonna make some action steps so people can just take action on it. So stick with me. Okay. So now I want to give you just kind of send you off with your, what is it called? Your marching papers. Is it called marching papers? Anyway, I want to make sure I give you some action items to take from this episode. First of all, definitely want to grab the essential oils diet and when you do, you'll get all of those awesome bonuses that Dr. Z talked about. And you can find out more about that@jjvirgin.comeodiet I'm also going to put there the link to the environmental working group so you can check that out as well as links to a couple of my favorite non toxic products. Now Sabrina mentioned Ann Marie Gianni skin care. We, we love us that over here. And in fact when I was moving to Tampa and moving my new place, it was like I got the big love box of that and my goodness from my green fills and my buddy Stephen Azell. So I'm going to link out some of my favorites there as well because what I thought was really important. One of the key takeaways here is to really understand that weight loss is not a calories in, calories out issue. And I've talked about this so many times. You've been around, you know, I say my your body's not a bank account, it's a chemistry lab. Weight loss is a hormonal issue. And one of the things that can really mess up your personal chemistry lab are toxins. And one of the key places we get those is by what we put on our skin, especially for women. I want you to really go in there and look at what you're putting on your skin. What are the skincare items you're using, what is the makeup you're using and are you putting bad poop on your eyelashes? This was an eye opener to me and I'm like, oh my gosh, bad poop. So let's look at what you can do to start to make those transitions if you haven't yet. And I'm going to share some of my favorites with you again in the show notes. You can grab those@jjvirgin.com eodiet now little quick reminder to subscribe so you do not miss any goodness especially with all the new stuff we are doing around the community here with our friends, Q A Friday and extra shows. And while you're there. I'd love to get your input because again, I design these shows based on the feedback I am getting. So if there's something you'd like to know more about, if there's, you know, a guest you'd love to see, etc, just let me know and I will go track them down. All right, thanks so much for tuning in. See you next time.

That's all for this episode of the JJ Virgin Lifestyle show, which marks another step towards a healthier body and mind. Don't forget to rate, review and subscribe to the show and we'll talk to you next week.

Hello listeners, this is Anne Bogle, author, blogger and creator of the podcast what Should I Read next? Since 2016, I've been helping readers bring more joy and delight into their reading lives. Every week I tag all things books and reading with a guest and guide them in discovering their next reading. They share three books they love, one book they don't, and what they've been reading lately, and I recommend three titles they may enjoy reading next. Guests have said our conversations are like therapy, troubleshooting issues that have plagued their reading lives for years, and possibly the rest of their lives as well. And of course, recommending books that meet the moment. Whether they are looking for deep introspection to spur or encourage a life change, or a frothy page turner to help them escape the stresses of work, school, everything, you'll learn something about yourself as a reader and you'll definitely walk away confident to choose your next read, with a whole list of new books and authors to try. So join us each Tuesday for what Should I Read Next? Subscribe now wherever you're listening to this podcast and visit our website what Should I read next podcast.com to find out more.