Episode 067: Tips for New Managers

Welcome to the Fleet Success Show, a podcast dedicated to talking about the fundamentals, standards, and best practices that empower today's fleets to achieve fleet success. Let's get into the show.

All right. Welcome back for another episode of the Fleet Success Show. I'm your host, Josh Turley. Uh, today running solo. I'm going to excuse my co-hosts, Jeff Jenkins and Steve Salzgauer today. Doing a little solo podcast. So today it was interesting, we were kind of talking around the company and things as we're growing as a company, you know, we're adding these new layers of management. And so we have a lot of new managers that are kind of under our stewardship and under our guidance. And I thought about what are things that I would want to know as a new manager. You know, when I think back, oh gosh, probably 7 years ago, What are things that I would tell myself back then? What are things that, you know, if we've got a new manager in the shop that I would want them to know as we kind of groom and shepherd in this next generation of leaders? We've got a lot of fleet managers that are in the middle of retirement that are looking at moving on to the next phase of their career. How do you make sure that that next layer on the bench is ready for it? And ready for the moment. So I wanted to sit down and talk about like, what are some tips that I would have for new managers? You know, people that are new to leading people, not necessarily, you know, new to the company or anything like that. These are people that are just, this might be their first ever leadership role. Maybe they were, you know, out turning wrenches and they've been promoted to become a shop foreman or a shop supervisor. What are some things that I would coach them to do? Now, what I might coach them to do might be different than what you would coach them to do, but these are things that I have found are timeless principles. They're principles that should cross multiple industries. And so these are things that I would share with them. The first thing that I would say, you know, and I would tell my past self this, right, is that you need to be eager to learn but not eager to please. I know for me, I struggled a lot with that second one, is that I was always trying to make friends and be the best leader that I could be, and I was constantly looking for the approval of everyone around me. And I had to learn a really painful lesson, is that you can't get it. It's impossible to, to really have that, that approval from everyone. And so I set myself up to fail just by going after that. The first thing I said though was be eager to learn. And one of the things that I found is that if I were to just slow down and pause and listen, just ask questions, be curious, you know, go up to your new team members and ask them about their jobs, ask them about the company, ask them about their role. If you've been with a company for a while, ask them about their lives. Be curious. You know, what are they frustrated by? What are things that maybe, you know, if you're taking over for somebody else, what are things that they don't like about what that person did? What are things they did like that that person did? Learn, right? Just be eager to learn. Be hungry, but not eager to please. There's an awesome little quote floating around from a show on Apple TV called Ted Lasso. And if you haven't watched it, I know half of my team has watched it and I cannot recommend that strongly enough. I love that show. It's just a great leadership development show. There's some amazing story, there's some amazing character arcs, but there's this scene and it's a really pivotal moment in the entire season 1, kind of like the entire season shifts on this moment. And there's a scene where Ted Lasso is at a, you know, at a pub and he's throwing darts and he talks about this idea of be curious. He talks about the bullies that he had to deal with as a kid and how if they had just stopped to ask questions, they would have learned so much more about him instead of just assuming that they knew everything and were just imposing their will on him. And he goes on to, in this clip, you basically see that he's throwing darts and he's down by quite a bit. He's getting kind of his nose rubbed in it a little bit. But what we don't know and we learn in this scene is that Ted used to play darts at his dad's bar for 6 years. And so he's an expert dart player. What do you call a dart expert? Dart player? I'm going to find that out. But he's throwing these darts and he hits the exact score that he needs to win the game. And he basically just kind of rubs it back in their faces of, you know, if you were curious, you would have known that about me and you wouldn't have agreed to the wager that you agreed to. That set the stakes for this game. And you wouldn't have messed with my boss, and you wouldn't have messed with my friends. And it was just an awesome moment, and it taught me that, you know, like, I need to sometimes stop and ask myself that question. Like, have I been curious enough today? Have I asked enough questions and just listened? Or am I sitting here and just headstrong and ready to go, and I'm gonna impose my will on the world and you're gonna listen to me or else, right? And I've had that moment. I've had that moment where I was sitting in a review, a performance review with an employee, and I was this young kid, and this is just after Dad died, and sitting across the table from this guy that was at least 20 years my senior who'd been at the company, you know, 15 years longer than I have. And he, you know, and he didn't have respect for me, and that was okay. I hadn't earned it. But he basically said, "Why should I listen to you?" And I said, "Because I'm the boss." And to this day, that's one of those— I talk about bricks in my past episodes— that's one of the bricks that I carry with me is that I said that to him and I shouldn't have. Instead, I should have just been more curious and I should have repeated the question to him as, "Well, why should you listen to me?" And I should have made him answer his own question. And it's that curiosity of, "Well, why shouldn't you listen to me? Why should you listen to me? Why wouldn't you want to listen to me?" Maybe we don't agree on this, but, you know, like, hey, this is the situation we're in. Is there a better way? I think this is the right way. It's interesting as you think about that, you know, how many of us were so eager to prove ourselves when we became a brand new manager. We wanted to show our bosses that they made a good choice, right? We wanted to prove ourselves to the world that we deserve to be at the table. And so we end up being so eager to please and so eager to perform that we don't really take the time to listen. You know, just stop and listen and ask questions. The other part of that is you're not going to make everybody happy. Listen, but then you're going to have to make decisions too, and your decisions are going to upset people. You have to be willing as a leader to deal with those consequences. I have found myself as a young leader, I was afraid to make decisions. I was paralyzed by the perception that other people had of me, and I I would refuse, I would sit on a decision forever and just wait and wait until I was absolutely sure it was the right decision. And unfortunately, what happens is that sometimes the moment will pass you by and you won't be able to make that decision in a timely manner when it matters most. Sometimes you're gonna have to make decisions that involve which people to keep and which people to let go. I always think back, there's a scene in, oh gosh, I don't remember the name of the movie, But I want to say it had Matthew McConaughey, and they were— U-571, I think, is the name of it. It's a submarine movie from World War II. And he had to make the call. He had to seal his own submates in a chamber of the submarine that was flooded in order to save the rest of the submarine. Sometimes you're going to have to make that call. You have to be willing that there's going to be decisions you make, and hopefully they're not as drastic as that, but there's going to be decisions you make where, A, you're going to get it wrong. So you may as well just screw it up now, get it wrong, and then figure out the right way later. You'll do that a lot faster if you just fail fast. But the second thing is that not everybody's gonna agree with the decision you make. As long as you believe it, as long as you are confident that you're making the right decision, then go for it, right? And if you need to seek input from others, then I would definitely seek input from your boss. But don't go to your boss with all of your problems. Come up with a solution, go to your boss and say, hey, I'm thinking about doing this. I've got this, my problem, this is the solution I'm thinking about implementing. Do you see any red flags that I should be aware of? Because I know I'm new and I'm inexperienced. Is there anything that I'm not thinking about here? What you're looking for there is just maybe some validation. No, I think that's a great idea. Or, ah, that's not exactly how I would do it. And it's okay if it's not exactly how they would do it because you're not them. At the same time, they're gonna be the ones that have to have your back. So you want to make sure that at least you've got them on board with what you're planning on doing. But do that, you know, like recognize you're not gonna make everybody happy. Just commit to your decision, believe in it. And if you believe in it, then, you know, things usually will work out more often than they don't. The third thing I'll tell you as a new leader: hit the books, right? Leaders are readers. We've said that on this podcast several times. We've recommended a couple of books. My first book that I would throw at any new leader is gonna be Extreme Ownership. The second one is gonna be Five Dysfunctions of a Team. And even if they've read it before, I'm gonna have them reread it. If I were to give them a third one, there was a book that was probably really instrumental in my leadership development, 'cause it helped me realize that I needed to do things differently. I couldn't just wield my authority like a hammer. And that was Five Levels of Leadership, and that's from John Maxwell. And it basically just talked about that, you know, there's 5 different levels of leadership. One is permission, where it's basically just like you have the title, you have the authority, and so therefore people have to listen to you because, you know, you've got the position. Sorry, it's not permission, it's position. The second one is built on relationships, and that's where people give you permission to lead them. You know, you establish a relationship with people, you establish that rapport, and that helps you lead them because they want to follow you. They like you. The third one is performance, and that's all based on results, right? It's where, like, you're actually doing something for the company and you're pushing and you're showing that you're successful. And people want to follow winners. They don't want to follow losers. They want to follow winners. He goes on and he talks about, you know, like, the fourth level and the fifth level. It talks about replication. You know, the leaders grow leaders underneath them, and then they get respect, you know, where leaders get respect from across the industry. And I've seen this in our industry. You know, when you got guys from like Rob Gordon showing up and basically talking about the things they do at their county shop and how they mentor these kids. And you know, you start seeing them present in multiple different places, and that's the kind of thing that you start replicating yourself as a leader, and you grow yourself and you grow your influence outside of just your own little area. So that was a really helpful book for me, at least for those first 3 levels, for me to really understand that I couldn't be the one that would just come in and swing Thor's hammer around and beat on people. Yeah, I was trying to get results, but it wasn't the right way to get results. It was just dysfunctional. It was abusive, is honestly what it comes down to. So teaching a young leader that, that, hey, like, I know you're eager to prove please, and you know you're eager to prove yourself, but just slow down, stop, listen, build that relationship, right? Build the relationship with your people. So Eager to learn, not eager to please, and here's how you do that. The second thing I usually look at too, be humble. You know, just because you're in this position as a leader doesn't mean you're gonna have all the answers. So don't act like it. I've seen a lot of leaders that come in and they say, "Oh, I know all the answers and I've done this before. I know what I need to do. I've done this job for 10 years and I'm ready for this leadership. I've seen all the wrong things to do and I didn't like how that boss did them, so I'm gonna totally do them separately." I'm gonna flip them on their head and I'm gonna do it different. Look, you don't have all the answers. You don't need to act like you do, right? Let some of that insecurity show. Be vulnerable. Be real with your team. Let them know when you're scared. Let them know when you just don't know. Ask for feedback. How am I doing? And be open and receptive to that feedback. There's gonna be so many times where you get it wrong. You just got to be willing to admit it. What you'll find is that people respect you so much more if you have the courage to be vulnerable, if you have the courage to be wrong and admit it, than if you just try to act like you're perfect. And as you— this is the one thing about leadership I don't think many people realize, is that leadership doesn't exist without followers. If nobody is following you, you're not a leader, you're just an explorer, right? A leader of an expedition has people that follow them. And as you grow that influence, as you show people that you're worth following, that you can admit you're wrong, that you build that vulnerability, you build that trust, people will naturally gravitate towards you as a leader and they'll listen to what you have to say and they will follow you and your influence, 'cause that's all leadership is, is influence, will grow. And it'll grow not just within your team, but it'll grow across the team that you're a part of. And so you'll be able to start leading horizontally. And then your influence will grow vertically and you'll start being able to lead up and down the chain of command. And that's really what it comes down to, is being able to be real, be vulnerable, be genuine. And of course you've got to get it right most of the time. You know, Amazon talks a lot about that in their operating principles. You do need to make the right decisions, but it's okay to get it wrong. As long as you get it wrong, you recognize it, you admit it, and you learn from it. If you don't learn from it, then it's a wasted opportunity. So you don't have to have all the answers, so don't act like you do. And then just listen more. Always listen more. Be willing to listen to more feedback. The next thing I would tell a brand new leader, right, so eager to listen, not eager to please, be humble. The third thing I would tell them is love your people. You have the greatest calling on earth to be a leader of people. They are giving you their most precious, un-renewable resource, and that's their time. You owe it to them to love them, to care about them, to show them how much they matter, that the work they do matters, that they're not anonymous. Just love your people. They need to know you care. One of the things I really like to do is I get to know them. I get to know who they are, who are the people that matter to them in their lives. What's, you know, maybe they don't have any kids. I will ask them about their dogs, right, and their pets. Maybe they're a fur baby family. Well, what's the name of your dog? Oh, well, you know, how are they doing today? And I get to know each one of them. I get to know how their parents are doing. You know, what are your mom and dad's names? I get to know them on a personal level. This does two things. One, it lets them know that they're not anonymous, right, that I know exactly who they are, what they're doing. But it also when it comes time to make one of those hard decisions, you know, like a Matthew McConaughey, and I've got to seal the door shut, I know exactly who I'm affecting and I know exactly how it's going to affect them. Do you think that for a moment, if there were going to be layoffs at RTA, that I would pull a Better.com and just fire 900 people at once on a Zoom call? There's no way I could do it. Why? Well, it's because I know every single one of these people individually. And every one of these managers, you know, that I promote, they have to do the same thing. They've gotta know their people. So if you get to that point where you have to make that decision, you know exactly who's going to be affected. You know how it's going to affect the people that they are around, and it just means that you're going to care about them. Now, you have to be careful with that level of care that you don't cross any boundaries, but you also have to be careful is that you don't let that care stop you from making a really hard decision where you sacrifice the entire mission or you sacrifice the company for the benefit of one person. It won't do anybody any good. So you do have to kind of balance that out a little bit, but you do need to— if you want to be a great leader, you have to love your people. Get to know them, know their dreams. I could tell you, you know, what my people hope to achieve one day and how am I going to help them achieve that. You know, like it might not be something that they can do at RTA, but it's going to be something that I might be able to help them grow a skill that I can use for a little while while they're learning. It might be something that maybe financially I can give them some incentive and say, okay, well, you want to go and retire in the woods, you want to have a cabin out there and up in Munds Park or something. Well, how are we going to get there? All right. Well, what if you did this instead? And what if we built your compensation package around this thing? You know, and you get to find out what their dreams are and what motivates them. What keeps them up at night? What are their passions? And you find ways to tap into that, and they know that you care about those things. And I would tell you what, as a leader, when we talk about leadership as influence, your influence with that person will not only grow, but your ability to get the most out of them and tap into their potential will grow exponentially. And so you talk about high-performing teams, it's that kind of stuff where you're tapping into that person and you're finding out exactly what makes them tick. You're finding out exactly where they want to go and what they want to be. And you're going to unlock something within their heart that can't be touched without love, without a leader who genuinely cares about their people. They will run through walls for you if they know how much you care. Right? So love your people, care about their lives. Fourth thing I would tell you, speak the kind truth. Do not be afraid to speak that kind truth. We've had episodes on this. Go search, listen to the Speak the Kind Truth episode. Paraphrasing it here really short, don't be nice, right? Don't be the nice manager. Be willing to be mean. Be willing to— and not mean, but speak the truth. Do it kindly, do it gently with love, but do it because they deserve to hear it, right? Be kind, be clear, be honest-blouse, be genuine. They need to understand if they're not meeting your expectations, they need to know it so quickly. You can't let it sit and fester and just wait it out, right? And hope that it gets better. You have to bring it up to them. Hope is not a strategy, people, right? Like, you got to bring it to their attention and say, hey, this last week— and you got to do it in a timely manner. I had somebody that they sat on something for 4 months. What do you think that did to their mindset and their mentality and their work output for those 4 months, right? Like, it just It takes a toll on you. And you don't, you're not putting out at the right levels. So speak the kind truth, do it, you know, be nice about it. But don't sit there and try to avoid the conversation because you're afraid that they won't like you. So go find that episode. That's a great episode. But speak the kind truth is a huge skill that every new leader needs to learn how to do, to speak that truth kindly. Another thing that I would recommend as a brand new leader, if you've never led people before, And this is going to be like a learning, you know, work in progress because you're a work in progress. It's find your own leadership style. All right, what do I mean by that? It means that you don't have to be Patton. You don't have to get up in front and march and bark the orders and do all that stuff. That worked for Patton. It doesn't necessarily have to work for you. One of my favorite examples is you think about Winston Churchill and Mahatma Gandhi, right? Two historically reverenced leaders, right, in the, in the history of our world. Two people that had a great influence, that had a great following. But if you were to reverse their styles, right, would the style of Churchill work for Gandhi? Absolutely not. It wouldn't have worked at all, right? And Gandhi's personality wouldn't have worked for Churchill. The idea is that you want to find what your genuine leadership style is. Maybe you're more quiet and reserved. I kind of fall into that camp. Maybe you're more outspoken. You like to be kind of the center of attention, right? And that's okay. We always, we kind of think about when I say leadership and say, what does a good leader look like to a lot of people? Traits that I usually hear will be something like, you know, they're a great speaker and they're clever and they're charismatic and people like them. Well, that might not be your style, right? Like you might be more of a soft-spoken, reserved type, and that's okay. Lean into that. And just say like, well, this is just how I do things, right? Be willing to change a few things, but recognize your own natural leadership style and lean into that. And don't feel bad if you're not Churchill, right? Recognize that you might be more of a Gandhi, and that's okay because they were both great leaders. But just find your style, be genuine. You just need to figure out what that is. The last thing I would tell you is find a tribe. Find a tribe, find a group of people that are in the same situation, maybe a young, you know, young group of managers. Maybe they're new. Find a mentor, find somebody that, you know, has gone through and done this before, either within your organization or at another organization. This is where things like the NAFSA community boards are super helpful. Government Fleet has a board system that you can go on as well. Come to the expos, you know, come to NAFSA Trade Show, come to the GFX, come to NTEA. Shoot, if you're looking for a mentor or a tribe, just email podcast@rtafleet.com. I am happy to take some time out of my day and respond to questions that you guys have as young leaders, you know, and find people that are like-minded that want to grow and want to develop with you. You know, like there's a couple of different groups that I'm a part of that help me and I can kind of bounce ideas off of. And it's other CEOs. Now, they don't know anything about my business. They don't know about what I'm doing. But they know what it takes to make hard decisions. They know what it takes to, to kind of go through that process and what it takes to think strategically and be in my position. And so when I've got ideas or I've got challenges, I can come to them and say, hey, how would you guys handle a situation like this? Oh, well, let me tell you about a time that I actually had to do that, right? And I can learn from their examples. I can learn from their mistakes without having to make them myself. So that's, you know, some of my advice on that is find a tribe, find a community that that reciprocates, that gives freely. And I will tell you what, if you're in fleet and you're a new leader, this is a great industry to be in. Why? Well, because we are so open. This industry has been one of the most welcoming, friendliest industries I've ever seen. And it's one of the things that I love being able to work in this industry is because people are so genuine, they're so real, and they just want to help other people succeed. So That's going to do it for us today. If you have any new leaders, you know, be free, feel free to share this episode with them. Recap again: eager to listen, not eager to please, be humble, love your people, speak that kind truth, find your style, and find a tribe. If you want to learn more about this and other different things that you can do as a fleet success manager, helping your fleet be more successful, you can go out to fleetsuccessplaybook.com and email us for a new copy of the book as we're going through and getting ready for our second round of printing. You can also email us at podcast@rtfleet.com. And we've got Fleet Success Summit 2.0 coming up March 21st and 22nd in Las Vegas, Nevada, in 2023. So we're going to be over at the Luxor. You can go find more information on that, sign up, get registered, fleetsuccesssummit.com. Until next time.

Thanks for joining us on this episode of the Fleet Success Show. If you liked our show, we'd appreciate your 5-star review. Be sure to subscribe anywhere you listen to podcasts and come hang out with us anywhere on social media @FleetSuccess. See you next time.