Episode 068: The Stewardship of Leadership

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All right. Welcome back for another episode of the Fleet Success Show. I'm your host, Josh Turley. Flying solo again today. I'm gonna excuse my co-hosts Jeff Jenkins and Steve Salzgiver, as they're off working on other business right now. Today, the topic that I'm going to talk about is a little bit of this, this concept of loyalty, right? And what you have, what your responsibility as a leader to kind of encourage loyalty, but redefining what loyalty means to us, right? And what, as I think about leadership, I think about stewardship. And stewardship for me, it kind of implies like a responsibility. You have a responsibility and almost an obligation to grow and nurture the people underneath your care. Right? So what got me thinking about this is somebody asked me that question during an interview recently is, you know, what is your— what does the career path look like at RTA? What is, you know, what does our growth path look like? And we're really big on developing and growing people, but I'm also very clear is that Look, this is a short ladder. You basically go from the front line to the manager to me, right? And I'm not stepping down anytime soon. So unless your manager retires, that's one seat for 7 people. Now, as we grow, like, the company grows out wider, like, there's more opportunity, and there's been a lot of that lately. But the, the point is still the same. It's we're going to work really hard to grow you and develop you as a person. And if you want to move into another role, if you want to move in, you know, like, maybe you've got aspirations, you want to go from being a staff accountant to a controller up to a VP of Finance or a CFO. We will do whatever we can to help grow and nurture you through that process. But we also recognize this, and that's that loyalty has changed. It used to be that you would go and you'd sign up and be with a company and, and you would never leave. You'd be with that company for 20 or 30 years until you retire. And that was, I know, like a lot of the baby boomers, that was kind of their mentality about how they treated work, and you didn't see a lot of job hopping. It was very common when you look at resumes from that period is that they're at a company for 10, 15 years at each stop. That's because they're very loyal. They felt like they owed something to their company for the opportunity to work. And I think there's been a huge shift, especially as the demographics have changed, as millennials have come into the organizations, and especially as we get Gen Z coming in, right? There's been an overall shift in how employees and the employer relationship, how that works. So you're not really seeing that anymore where you have 20 or 30-year employees, right? You're seeing people that are very out, like, hey, I've got to make sure I'm taking care of myself, that I'm making enough money to make ends meet, that I'm growing and constantly pushing myself. There's like a different— instead of loyalty, it's very much more hunger-driven. And for me, I see that as kind of a two-way street. We have the— there's a common question or a common meme, I guess, that gets thrown out there, and the CEO CEO says to the CFO, you know, hey, we need to train all our people. And the CFO says, well, we can't afford that. What happens if they leave? And the CEO says, we can't afford it if they stay, right? And basically the point is that, you know, if you have people that are stagnant, that are doing the same thing today that they were doing 10 years ago, that they were doing 10 years before that, I tell you what, the world is changing, my friends, right? And you've got to be willing to change with the times. And if you've got somebody on your team that's not able to kind of keep up, what'll end up happening is the company will outgrow them. And you're going to get to a point where you have somebody on your team— and I know this because I've dealt with it— you're going to have somebody on your team that's been extremely loyal to you that can't keep up anymore, that can't do the job because the job has outpaced them, because they didn't spend the time to work and develop themselves, and they weren't pushed by a manager who cared and loved them. To see that end was coming, right? And so loyalty ends up being this two-way street. And what I usually tell candidates as they're interviewing with us is, you know, if you come work for RTA, if you come work for us, my goal is that I get 3 to 5 good years out of you. And the question I always ask whenever I have somebody leave is, are we better off than when they came in the door, right? Did they make a positive impact on us? Because that's honestly, you know, as we're hiring people, we're trying to uplevel and we're upskilling and we want to make sure that we're adding value to the organization. But then the second question is just as important to me as the first one, and that is, are they better than when they came through the door the first time? Right? What kind of impact have I had on that individual in their life? Are they a better spouse? Are they a better parent? Are they a better friend, right? Are they better at their jobs? Are they more skilled than they were when they came in the door? Do they know how to do their job better than they ever have? And even when you have to say goodbye to people that you really like and care for, and maybe sometimes it's too early. I've had people leave and you're like, "Oh man, I really wish I could figure out how to keep that person." But I still know, and I can sleep really well at night, because I look back and say, what did this person look like when they first came in, when I first met them at the interview table? And what do they look like today? And if I get to that point where I could say, wow, they are in so much better of a place, and you know what, we are too, then all I have is gratitude. I'm grateful for the opportunity that I was able to know that person, that I was able to work with that person, that I was able to, to have an impact on their life. And that they impacted me. There's a great musical. If you haven't ever gone out and seen it, I totally recommend doing this. And I hear they're making a movie of it, but it's Wicked. No, literally, that's the name of it. It's Wicked. And so it tells a story of the Wicked Witch of the West and the Good Witch from The Wizard of Oz, but it's the prequel. It tells you how they came to be. There's an amazing song in the middle of this though, that basically, you know, it says, "I don't know if I've changed for the better, but I do know I have been changed for good." And that line has always stuck with me as I've always thought about our employees. And at the end of the day, you know, and I like to think that I've been changed for the better, but at the end of the day, I always know that the people we meet, the people we influence, that we change them and they change us. And so we kind of owe it to them. If we're going to be leaders, we're responsible for their care and their nurturing. We're responsible to help them grow, right? And so in that moment, you recognize that you have to help train them. You've got to help mentor them. So one of the things I like to do is think about, like, where was this person 3 years ago, and are they better off than when they came in? If they're not, you have to look in the mirror and figure out what am I doing wrong as a leader that's not requiring them to push? Right? Like, are my standards too low? Am I not being clear in my standards? You owe it to them to push them. Right? Now, hopefully you're hiring hungry people and you don't have to motivate them. Right? You've heard me say that before. We don't motivate the people we hire because we hire motivated people. But sometimes you have people that you gotta kick in the pants a little bit. You gotta get them going. And that's okay. But are you having those conversations? Right? Do they have something that they're working towards? Do they have— something that is motivating them. You know, do they even know what they're dreaming for? You know, like, what's going to happen when you're fourscore and 20, you're done, right? And you're, you're, you know, kicked up in the grave. What are you working for? Do they know that? And so you got to sit down with them and find out and be that mentor to them sometimes. Right. And some of this is life coaching. You know, we've, we've had Rich Ruff, our life coach, on the podcast before. But you as the manager, like, this is part of your job too, is you're trying to help them get better at life, not just better at their job. Are you investing in things like training? You know, I think training, unfortunately, it's one of the things we've seen in our business is when the budgets get tight, when fuel prices go crazy like they are, training is almost the first place to get cut because it— for a lot of people, they see it as, well, it's not necessary. I'll tell you what, if you don't think it's necessary today, then next year when the next crisis hits, you're not gonna be prepared for it. Why? Because you didn't train. We talk a lot about how in moments of panic and moments of emotion, you fall to your lowest level of preparation. If you're not training and not drilling and not preparing, then you're not gonna grow and your team's gonna get stagnant and stuck. And they're going to feel it and they're going to say, there's no opportunity for advancement here. There's no opportunity for me to get better. And they're going to leave. They have to know that you're in their corner. They have to know that you want to do something. So I like to think about, you know, what progress have they shown me in the last little while? And am I doing a good job as a manager and growing them? Right. And they should know that too. They should be able to look back in the review and see how they've been doing. Now the next thing I'm going to look at is, is there somebody who is just amazing that I've loved working with and they're no longer happy, right? And if they're no longer happy, I've said this before on the podcast, but if their soul has left the building, their body should follow, right? You need to help them. You owe it to them because otherwise they're just suffering and they're being miserable. And life is too short, right? I say this all the time, like, life is too short. It goes by too fast. They deserve better. And so if they're not happy, you as the manager, point it out, bring it out to them, say, you know, would you be happier in a different role? Can I help you find that next role? Because it works so much better when you have somebody that says, I think it might be time for me to move on. Wow, okay, well, when are you thinking? Well, like maybe in the next, I don't know, 2 or 3 months, as long as it takes to find another job. Well, why don't you do this? Why don't you work for me while you're looking for another job? I'll get somebody in, you can train them, and by then hopefully you'll find another job. Now in this job market, it might not take them 2-3 months, it may only take them 2 weeks. But if you can leverage that while they're there, rather than them, you know, because by the time they get to that point, you think about how this normally works is they've already decided to start interviewing with other companies well before they actually turn in their notice, and then they give you the 2 weeks notice as more of a courtesy. But imagine if you could have used all that time while they were interviewing that you could start interviewing a candidate to replace them, right? And if they were willing to stick around and help you train that person while they're still going through the interview process, knowing that you've got their back and that you want to support them. We've had a couple employees here who we've gone through that with, that we've kind of gone through the inspire to leave type conversations. And they sat down with us and told us like, well, I think maybe it's time for me to move on. Oh, that's a great idea. I'm glad that you're thinking that way. How can I help you? And what are you looking for? And we would help them craft their resume. We'd want to make sure that it was up to date, that it was accurate, that it was readable and things like that. We'd help prepare them for interviews. We'd say, well, what kind of positions are you looking for? And well, these are some of the things you need to think about. And we'd give them tips and pointers as they're going on their job search. All the while, they're still working on our product and they're still working in our support department. And so we kind of go through this fun little process of like, we're still helping them even though we know the end is coming and at some point, you know, that the employer-employee relationship is going to end. The people relationships don't, right? And so we're treating them with just this absolute— because we're— it's like, I truly believe we're stewards. We're responsible, we're gardeners. One of my favorite films is Lord of the Rings, and I love the early part of that where they're watching, you see the hobbits as they're in Hobbiton and doing Underhill. You're watching them as they're tilling the earth and they're gardening and they're pruning and they're shaping. And they build these beautiful gardens because they're stewards of the land. They don't own the land, it's just, it's what they do. Right? And we kind of have to have that same mentality towards our people. It's like, we're here to cultivate. We need to make sure they've got the right nutrients in the soil. We're here to make sure they've got the right sunlight, that they're in the right position in the yard. We're here to make sure that they grow, right? If we've got things that aren't growing on our land, then all we have is weeds, and nobody likes weeds. We chop weeds, we kill weeds, right? We want things that are worth growing. We want trees, we want strong oaks, And so I love this parable, right? If you think about our people as, you know, something that we need to grow and nurture, and we're here as a leader, we're the gardener in the garden. You know, and yeah, we're gonna prune some things, and sometimes it's gonna hurt, and that's some of that kind truth, you know, like, hey, you're getting out of line here. But other times we're gonna feed them, and we're gonna give them those nutrients, and we're gonna teach them, and we're gonna give them tools and skills that they can totally take to another company. But in the meantime, they're going to use them here, right? And you know what, what happens if they do stay? Won't you be so much, you know, more happy or happier that they've decided to take those, you know, take that investment that you've put into them and now they're going to pay it back to you tenfold? Because now they're so much better at their job that you don't have to go find another person to do, you know, so you have two people doing a subpar job at the role. Now you have one person doing an amazing job at the role. And that's the kind of thing you have to look at. The other thing I look at too is if they're no longer happy at our organization, right, they're not going to give you their best effort. They're going to be disgruntled. They're going to be, you know, kind of sourpusses about it. You might have to step back and say, hey, like, you're dragging the boat, right? You've got an anchor in the water and you're dragging the boat. And that's where you've got to have that, you know, like, you, you owe it to the rest of the garden to get the weeds, you know, the noxious weeds out of the out of the garden. So as you're, as you're having those conversations, try to encourage that. Inspire them to leave. Inspire them to feel safe to come to you. We've talked about that in past podcast episodes. Until then though, until that decision, until that moment when they're ready to leave, like, you owe it to them to grow. The other thing I look at too is what happens when they're limited, right? You've got this really nice shade tree going, but there's just not enough room around them. Well, in that case, like, we have to uproot them. You know, if there's nowhere for them to go in the organization and we are limiting their potential, there's nothing more selfish than a leader who refuses to let go of an employee, who refuses to help that employee find that next thing. Because why? Well, the only thing that manager's worried about is themselves. If they truly cared about that employee, they'd recognize that, you know what, This person is ready and they're capable of so much more. I just don't have a spot for them. They need to, in that moment, help them find that next spot. You owe it to them. They've given you their time and their life, and you can say, yeah, well, they got a paycheck. Okay, well, they can always get more money somewhere else, right? You will not get loyalty at the company, but you will develop that personal loyalty. And it's that loyalty that, like, you build a relationship that lasts forever when you do things like that. And you build a reputation among the people too, is that you truly do care about them. And that is the ultimate definition of leadership is influence. And there's no better way for influence to grow than for you to show how much you care about a person, that you care about them enough that you would help them find another job somewhere else. That you would recognize that, wow, your talents are getting wasted here. How do I help you like grow to be the best you can? And maybe you need to take over my job. Maybe I need to go find a different job, right? How secure of a leader would you have to be to have that conversation? You know, I know a lot of us are, you know, like we have job security issues. Like, well, I don't know that I could go find another job, and what happens if I lose my job, and I've got to show that I'm worthy and that I can— Boy, what if we could just shut those voices up for a little bit, right? You owe it to them. You owe it to them as their manager to grow and nurture, and when they've grown past the walls of the garden, You have to help them get out. You have to help them go find that next thing where they can grow even more. And I'll tell you what, if you don't do it, then they will do it on their own. But if you do it, there's just so much more reward that you can get from that. And maybe that sounds a little selfish and a little self-serving, but I can't think of anything more intrinsically rewarding for me than knowing that I helped somebody on their path. You know, that I helped somebody find that next thing that they needed. That I wasn't selfish. And that's okay with me. Like, if that's in some ways a selfish motivation in and of itself, then so be it. But train them, right? You're the gardener. Train them, teach them, mentor them. Show them what good leadership looks like. Ideally, these people are going to go on and they're going to become leaders themselves. And you want them to look back fondly. There's a question I used to always ask, which was, tell me about your best leader. And tell me about your worst leader. Which category do you want to fall in? Right? If your people are interviewing for a job, do you want them to refer to you and say, oh, that guy Brad, he was amazing. He was terrific to follow. Or you know what, Lori over in accounting, she was my favorite boss and here's why. Or do you want to be on the other side? Man, you should have seen George. George was the guy who just like you never wanted to talk to him and he was always hard and nobody enjoyed him. And he always came in, he was yelling and screaming at everybody, and you know, something didn't go wrong, then it was F-bomb this. And you know, where do you want to be? What's your category? I know for me personally, like, I want to be reflected on as, you know, the greatest leader that somebody's ever had. And maybe that's a little bit of self-aggrandizement, but I hope that when somebody interviews at another company, that that's what they say about me, right? And you do that, and these people, when you have that type of relationship, they will be loyal to you forever. Even if they have to work somewhere else to do it. All right, well, that's going to wrap it up for us today. Again, thank you for joining us. Share this with your young leaders, share this with your, your teams. Fleet Success Podcast. If you want, you can go out and grab a copy of the playbook. It's at fleetsuccessplaybook.com. At some point, we're gonna have that up listed up on Amazon, I believe. So, and then of course, I can't sign off the episode without talking about the greatest event in fleet, at least I think it is. NAF is amazing and GFX are amazing, but I'll tell you what, you will learn way different lessons at the Fleet Success Summit than you will at any of those other organizations. And super awesome, one stage, 12, 13 speakers. We don't even know who's speaking yet. I'll probably be speaking. But you can go out and sign up for that, get registered. It's Las Vegas at the Luxor, March 21st, 22nd, fleetsuccesssummit.com. Com. Until next time.

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