BYOB Advanced Group Call 2024 05 09

Hello. Hello.

Hi. How are you?

Good, Good. How are you?

Good.

Are you out traveling?

I am. I'm in New York right now, and today's my final day, and I get to see my dog tonight, so I'm so excited. Oh, good.

I know. That's like. I think that's the hardest part when you travel and you go away. It's leaving the fur babies.

It is the hardest part by far, which, I mean, we're so blessed to have the fur babies that we have.

Yeah, I know. I'm. I'm thinking, been several weeks now in the US And I'm desperately missing my kitties, so can't wait to. To go home and see them in person at least. I have been getting my animal fill because everyone I'm surrounded with loves animals, so everywhere I go, there's been a pet.

Good, good. Yeah. That makes a huge difference.

Yeah. Good. Thanks for putting me in touch with your mom. She. It was nice because I. I talked to, you know, like, a lawyer, an attorney about it, but it's just a rando I found online. And it's nice just to confirm that what they're saying sounds like a good idea.

Yeah, I know.

She called me.

She was like, so Susan's lawyer seems to be correct, like, in what needs to happen. Should I just tell her that? And I'm like, yes, I think that would just be reassuring because really, I.

Mean, I asked people, and I mean, since my family so redneck, they're like, we don't have no lawyer. Why would we need a lawyer? And then it's like, someone's like, I know a lawyer from my drunk driving case. And it's like, yeah, not that kind of lawyer, but thank you for. For trying. Right. So it was just nice that the person that I found was like, make good suggestions, because you. I mean, you never know when you're just kind of finding somebody.

100. I'm literally sitting in my lawyer's office right now during this call, and, you know, the amount of times people come to him after getting really bad legal advice is just. It's so awful.

Yeah.

Knowing that you're getting good advice is just. It's very relieving, especially when you're. You're here and having to deal with this from another country if it doesn't get sorted right away, you know?

Yeah. And that's the thing. It's like, it's. Yeah, I need it done. I need all the paperwork done before I leave. And even then, I was even telling my partner, it's crazy. I know going through it with you and your parents and all of this because they are very on top of everything and already started when he was even younger than. Than we are now. They already set up everything. And I said, I know the French system now. I don't even know how our own system works.

Right. Yeah. And different in every state too, which makes it even more complicated. Anyway. Well, I'm glad. I'm glad that helped and I'm glad you're getting good advice.

Yeah, thanks.

Well, besides that, what are we celebrating today?

Not going crazy. Yeah. Usually when I come home, I go insane because my family is insane. And I really mean it. Like, I lose my shit because they are a special breed of people. And so I guess this is mainly the thing is I've been a bit disappointed in myself that I haven't been on top of so much work stuff. But at the end of the day, my partner was just telling me this morning, but look like you have not lost your mind. And last time when you were there, you were acting really kooky and you were acting like a maniac without a head. So he said, you have kept your cool, you've kept yourself in order despite everything going on. So. Right.

That's awesome. What do you think has made the difference?

Not seeing my grandma and my great aunt and my mom and like, not seeing them all together. I've seen my mom in small doses.

Yeah.

But they're just very southern and they have a lot of opinions. Like, for example, I'm wearing a crop top right now and I'm already showing my bra strap. But this would not be okay, even though I'm like 33 years old, right? No. So every little thing they have an opinion about, they can make you feel really, like very quickly about yourself. So I think that, yeah, my confidence hasn't yet taken a hit because I haven't really spent time with them because I've been. My parents are divorced. I've been dealing with all my dad's stuff, so I've been seeing my dad's family more and. And yeah, my mom's family is just. Yeah, it's just toxic.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, good. So that's. That's the difference maker. It's good to know that and figure out that you can walk that line. And it just takes setting those boundaries, those specific people.

And that's the bad thing too is they don't respect boundaries. So even when you set boundaries, they're always crossing them.

Yeah.

And you're always having to reinforce. And then when I Try then. Even then, when I pull back and say, okay, I cannot talk to you anymore because you're not respecting my boundaries, that then they pout. And then, you know, after a while, we try to reconnect again slowly, but then they still cross the line.

Yeah.

They've never had boundaries with each other. They've never practiced their own boundaries. And so this they just don't understand. And it's very much Southern culture. You respect your elders, so anyone who is older than you, you should just listen to them blindly do what they say, live like they live. And. Yeah, it's. I'm nothing like them, which makes it a constant battle. Everything I do goes against, like, the essence of who they are and how they do things.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

There.

There's a. A way in which, like, those systems are just inherently narcissistic, and it breeds codependency, and.

And they're all codependent on each other, all of them that have stayed. Yeah. I. I often find when my mother is guilting me, it's because my grandmother guilted her, and she's guilting me about the same thing.

Right, right. Yeah. So congratulations on not getting sucked back in.

Thank you. Yeah. So that is a plus. I think it helps, too, because I'm not staying with them. I decided, like, I wouldn't stay with them. So I'm staying with my cousin who has just a whole house of positivity and said everything our family did, I'm gonna do opposite. And so it's. Yeah, it's just always so nice to be here. And all of her kids are just so lovely and.

Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, you know, as. As you and I have been working on your relationship with money, like, I think this is such a cool example for you to see of, like, how cycles can be broken in different ways. Right. You know, like, here's your cousin. She's, you know, she's built this beautiful home full of positivity, as you said. And, you know, she didn't get sucked into the vortex of what was. What was handed her.

Yeah.

Now, and the same gets to be true for you, but in a different. In a different, like, flavor.

And even then, like, I mean, we both grew up. You know, we both grew up poor, and we both were very aware. We grew up poor and. And struggling, and she has a very, very nice life and a very nice house and doing really well, and her and her husband own their own business, and she's always telling her kids, look, we didn't grow up like this. You're very privileged on what you get. And even when I come here, I'm like, you guys did well for yourself. She's 10 years older than me. And I'm like, you guys did really well for yourself. And she said, yeah, but she said, I'm. We always remember where we came from.

Right.

And I think that's. That's also interesting to see that. Okay, maybe in 10 years I could also be in this place as well.

Yeah, I think. I think sooner. Why? Why in 10 years?

I guess it's more. So I was trying to be realistic. Some people say pessimistic. I. Yeah, I do. I have raised my price. I am confident about what I'm charging the 715 per month. I do still find people are telling me I'm on the fence about, is it because it. Is it because it really is too expensive for them? So I'm not. I'm still not attracting the right clients, or is it because I'm not doing. I'm not selling well enough. I tried to set the stage and kind of explain, you know, what it is, not so much about the program, what you're getting kind of thing, but really focusing on what do you want in your life? Okay, this is what working with me will allow you and help you to achieve. So I've been trying to really focus on what they can get out of it, but maybe I'm not setting it up as well, but it's hard to decipher some people, you know, for sure.

Um, but yeah, because you learn from Katrin. I'm actually not familiar with the sales process she trains on, so it's hard for me to, like, coach you through how to make it better if I'm not. If I'm not sure. Do you mind walking me through what the. What the flow is that you learned?

Yeah. Yeah. And that's why also, I thought it's one of these things I wanted to do and haven't yet had time since I'm running around and doing all this admin stuff. But I wanted to watch the sales portion of yours to see and to try that way because maybe it helps better. So Kathleen's is really all about don't focus on the steps of a program you're going to take them through. They don't care about program steps. They want to know, can you help reach their end objective? So what we do is we usually kind of have them explain where they are now and then explain their goal. What do they want ultimately? And not just. And not just I want a job in finance. Not just that. Well, how do you envision your life? What does a job in finance allow you to have? And maybe it's about financial stability. Maybe it's about. They feel good about themselves because they've always wanted to work in finance. Whatever all their end goals are. Looking at that and looking at how that will make them feel if they achieve that goal. So that they have in their mind, yeah, this is what I ultimately want. Yeah. How will they feel if they were able to obtain that? And then looking at if in. If in one year you're still in the same place that you are today, how would that make you feel? And then they start reflecting, and I feel bad. I would feel like I didn't make progress. I would feel really disappointed in myself, whatever it is. And you say, okay. And then you kind of connect it to coaching and say, well, through coaching, we work on this so that you go towards your goals and objectives so you don't feel like this in one year.

Right, right. Okay, cool. Yeah. So there. And then how do you. How do you present everything? You go through that. The slide deck that you showed me.

So I don't go through the whole thing. What I do is normally I just show them the process of the. Of the general process of what we go through, that we discover really kind of their specific goal. Because sometimes people tell me, I want a job in finance. And it's like, okay, job. And finance is really broad. What specific role do you want? What kinds of finance? What kinds of finance companies? Let's get very specific. So we set a specific goal, and then from there we look at what they need to do to set themselves up to go for a job like that. So I walk them through this process, kind of what the program takes them through, and then I explain that we do tailor the process according to their needs. And then I show them the slide of what's included as a part of the program and then the price. But then the rest I. But the rest I usually stop sharing. And then if they want more information, then I just send them the whole brochure.

Okay, cool. Yeah. So our approaches are very similar.

There.

There are some main differences. Why don't we just go through them right now? Because then we can, like, start melding them together. So holistic selling, as I teach it, in four parts. The first part is, like, the shortest, but it's the most important and it's setting the agenda. Right. And it's really essentially building trust. So, you know, you get on the phone with them, you have A little bit of small talk, like, where in the world are you? You know, how's your day going? Whatever. And as it like that little mini conversation comes to its natural end, you say, okay, awesome. So we only have about 30 minutes. How I like to use this time is a. I want to understand exactly what the big dream is here or what your big goal is for your career. What's getting in the way of you doing on your own. Right. And then if it's a fit for both of us, we can talk about different ways to work together. Does that sound good to you? So I'll, I'll reverse and kind of back out and tell you what's important about all this. So the last bit, does that sound good to you? We never do anything without consent in our sales calls. Right. This is not a manipulation thing. It's not a, I'm going to push you into whatever, whatever I want to do. Like I have to get buy in from you that you're ready to move forward with the conversation. Okay. The part before that where you say if it's a fit for both of us, we'll talk about different ways to work together. Builds a lot of trust because it's not like I'm going to try to get your money either way. And also tells them this is a two way interview mofo. Like you have to be on your best behavior as well. This is not just you grilling me to understand if this is the right fit. Right. And then it opens the door if it's not the right fit for you to say, you know, this actually doesn't feel like a fit on my end. But let me make some recommendations for other things for you to do. Right. Which like that out is gold for the people that you need it for. Right?

Yeah. You and I do. And I'm glad you mentioned that. And maybe I should mention that more because I don't accept everyone. There was someone who came to me and I just saw, I don't want to work with this person. Like it's not worth this money. It's not, it's probably not even worth any kind of money because I could say I. They felt like we were a good fit. I did not.

Yeah.

So I just told them like, you know, I think, I don't think. I am not confident I can really help you get there. So I would rather you find someone that you think, but maybe I should be more, more explaining this as well, that it's a time for both of us to see if we're a good Fit.

Exactly. And when you say that, people tend to relax because it's like, oh, cool. Like, we're going to have an honest conversation. And it's not about you trying to get my money. It's about us finding the right fit together.

Because for me, I'm. I mean, I'm at the stage of my life. No amount of money is. Is worth it if I don't. If I don't want to work with that person or I don't feel like I can help that person.

Exactly. But, you know, like, they're. They don't know you from anyone. They don't know that's your code. Right. They. They're used to talking to a lot of people who are selling snake oil. Right. And so you saying that will actually allow them to open up a little bit more on the sales call. Yeah. So really important to say that. And then, of course, the part before that. Yes, we want to have an idea of what they want, but also, you know, our clients don't always know what they want, so giving them the opportunity to say, well, what's getting in the way of me getting there? Like, here are all the things that get in the way. Sometimes they'll say, it's me, I'm getting in the way. And you're like, great. Like, that's awesome. That's exactly what coaching is for. But it also helps you kind of sort out, you know, what they're seeing as obstacles. Right. And then, you know, if they don't have any. Any advanced degrees and they want to be a doctor. Okay, well, a few steps to take first. Right. All right, so the discovery portion, which, from what you described, Katrin, taught you really well how to do that, like, going through and understanding what they want, why they want it. Something that. A few things that I would add, and this is just based on how you described it to me. So if this is redundant already, do it. Don't feel like I'm saying you're doing. Is like, yes, they want the job in finance, but, like, what's the impact that would have on their overall life? Right. Because then it's not just about them getting that job. It's about them, you know, being able to support their parents in their retirement. It's about all these other things that really matter. Right. Likewise, as they're describing what they want and as they're describing all the shit that they're struggling with, you just normalize it, you know, and you do that in a way. Like. Yeah, a lot of my clients deal with the same Thing. Most of my clients have similar goals. Many of my clients struggle with the exact same thing.

This I feel like I'm good at. But this has to do with never getting validation in my own life from your. My family, and then going to therapy and realizing I need validation. And so I do nothing but validate people all day long. So this I'm good at. The validating part.

Yeah, validate. And then you can point to a portion of your program. Right. So people. An idea of what the program is before you've gone into the detail of it. Right. And so you say, yeah, so a lot of my clients struggle with this. It's why I've developed, like, several different kinds of exercises to help you move through it. Because, you know, it's something that a lot of people bump into.

Yeah.

Anyway, so. And then you go through all that, and, like, as they're describing what they want, you're kind of playing. Not playing fortune teller, but you're using your intuition to kind of intuit what's the bigger thing that they actually want that they're not letting themselves talk about, you know, and so you can say it like, you know, from what I'm hearing, you want to have a really big impact with your family. Or from what I'm hearing, you know, I could see you as like a vp, as a. As a president of marketing or C Suite. Like, whatever it is that you think that they. Or that you're sensing they might want for their career, you just throw it out there. Because what that does is it opens the floodgate for, like, whatever it is that they actually want to come out, because it may be spot on or it could be completely wrong, and they're like, no, not that, but I want this thing. But the fact that you've opened the door and made it possible for that to be something that they want to work towards, you know, like in. In my work. Like, I could say, you know, like, from talking to you for the last 20 minutes, I could totally see you writing a book about X, Y and Z and having someone say, ah, I really hate writing. I don't want to write a book. I'm not a reader. Just feels. But I would love to be a speaker, you know, and it's like, okay, cool. And then whatever that bigger goal is, you know, when you make the pivot to make the offer, which is part three, you're saying, awesome. So if you want help building that or getting there, that's what I help my clients do. Right. Because it's like, it's here's the smaller bit is getting the job, building the business, whatever. And then there's this bigger dream that you. They've just given themselves permission to say out loud. Right. And of course, like, all this work that you're going to be doing, if they'd be signing up for you, is foundational to that. Right. They're not going to be able to get there if they don't do the foundational stuff first.

Yep.

Right. And so you say, awesome, if you want help getting there, that's what I help my clients do. And then you ask, you know, do you want to look at what that looks like or do you want to talk through what that looks like? And again, that's that consent moment. Okay.

Yeah.

Okay, cool. So at this point, you're going to get one of two responses. You're going to get, oh, yeah, I'd be interested to hear what the program is. Or you're going to get. I need, I need this. Yes. Let's, let's talk through the details. How do we get started? Right, so I'll talk through, like the. More like held back, like, sure, let's talk about the program. Curious about the details. So in both scenarios, you slow the down, go down to like half your normal speed of speaking. Right? Because when we're talking about numbers, people get nervous, Right? Like the person who's like potentially going to be buying gets nervous and you as a seller gets nervous. Right. And when we get nervous, our voices speed up when we speak higher. And, and whenever, whenever someone's thinking about buying something, if things start moving too fast and things start getting like a little high pitched, it's the verbal equivalent of fine print on a, on a contract. People see 5 fine print on a contract and they slow down because they're like, oh, there's stuff here I might be missing. I don't, I don't want to make a decision if I feel like there's stuff I'm not getting a moment to process. Okay. So we always start, we slow down and we always start with the commitment. Okay. So my clients work with me for a minimum of six months, and you stay silent until you get some kind of acknowledgment that they've heard you. And I want you to imagine with like, each little bit of information, you're handing them a jelly bean and they have to like, take the jelly bean out of your hand and they have to like, pop it in their mouth, chew it and swallow it. And they're like, okay, yeah, got that processed. And then you go to how often they speak with you, the cadence. And again, wait until they tell, like they affirm that they've heard you. And then you go into any bonuses you have, you know, if you have any personality assessments, if you do any like resume review, whatever, you list that off here. And you don't necessarily have to go super into detail. And then you go into. And this is when they're like, yeah, I'd be interested in the program. So it's not a for sure thing. So you want to. When it's not a for sure that they want to work with you, you go with the monthly price. It is $715 a month or euros a month. And then you stay silent until they say a complete thought. That is an answer. Not, oh, wow, that's expensive. Not a full thought, not, oh, okay, like that's not a full thought. And you really let them process because in their minds they're probably thinking, okay, well I have that, that money saved up. I could probably put that towards this. Or I wonder if my employer could pay for this and blah, blah, blah, you know. Now in the scenario where they're like, absolutely, I need this, like, let's talk about the details, but I'm in. Then you get to the price presentation portion. You say there are two ways you can pay. You can do the monthly payment plan, that's €715amonth, or if you wanted to pay in full, then it's X amount of euros, which works best for you. You get to be super fucking assumptive because they've already indicated that they're.

It.

Okay, okay. Part four is planning next steps. Okay. So there are three ways this conversation can go. It can be a no. And then the next step is, you know, you give them a recommendation for something that they should pursue next instead of working with you. Okay. The next it's a maybe. Say, okay, awesome. So what I like to do in this scenario is let's book a yes, no call. That way we have loop either way. And what are you going to be thinking about in between now and when we have that call? So you get really clear on what kind of objections might be coming up. If they have to check it with someone, then you always want to ask what questions will that person have that you haven't already asked?

What did you say when they, when they're on the fence? The first thought that you said, where. What was it that you were trying like that you were saying at first.

You want me to say it again?

Yeah, just repeat it all Sorry.

Yeah, no, it's okay. So if they need to think about it, then you say, okay, what I like to do in this scenario is. Or what I like to do is book a yes, no call. Right.

Oh, it's what they get stuck on. That's what you want to kind of know. But how did you phrase it? What's the question you asked them?

Oh, and what kinds of things will you be thinking about between now?

What kinds of things will you be thinking? That's what I wanted.

Yeah. Like, what are you considering? Right. Because it could be money. It could be timing. It could be, you know, they've signed up for like this in the past and haven't used it. You know, it could be that they're talking to another coach. They're. They're trying to find the right one. Right. It could be that they want to get the thumbs up from their partner or, you know, their boss might be, you know, willing to pay for some coaching.

Mm.

Right. So you just want to get really, really clear on that. And then they say, you know, I just want to check touch base with my. My partner, see if they're okay with the investment. And, you know, you always want to throw out there. Cool. Like, what questions will they have that you haven't asked yet? Right. Because this person so far wants this.

Yeah, some. Something that I did, where I did sign a client last week, and something that helped was that she said. She said, oh, I need to talk to my partner about this, because I know it's quite an investment for us. So I said, okay, great. I said, do you. Does he. Do you think he'll have. I did ask this one because I remembered you said this one time in a sales call that. Do you have. Do you know of any questions that he would probably ask regarding this? And she said, no, not that I know of. And then I said. Then I said, would it be better, actually, if we just scheduled a call? And if you'd like, I'm happy to have another call with you and him on the call. That way he can ask any questions. And she said, yeah, actually, that would be great. So we set it up, and we had a call on Sunday because that's the time that worked best for both of them. And we had a call on Sunday. And then right after, at the end of the call, she said, great, yeah, let's do it. This is. Oh, this is perfect.

So, yeah, you can absolutely offer that. Something that I also like to offer is, like, if, you know, because this is an investment for the whole Family, essentially. You know, if they have any questions or they want to speak to me, like, I'm more than happy to set up a call. But you did that beautifully. Yeah, so.

So I was happy that. Yeah. Because I saw that she valued and respected the partnership opinion and also was. Did see it as a family investment. And so I. I just realized, oh, yeah, but then maybe she would prefer to do it together. And I said, you know, you and me can have one to just alone again, to touch base, but also you can invite him if you prefer, and he can also join us. Yeah. So. Yeah, so that seemed to work well. And then, yeah, she signed up, so.

Right. Rights.

But, yeah, since then, I've just had several calls where. Yeah, I can't really tell if it was a money issue. And when I tried to feel them out on what the issue is, some people don't seem to be. I feel like I try to be vulnerable and open, and I try to give this. But I still feel like not everyone does. And they just say, I have to think about it. And I'll try to say, I. I'll try. I didn't word it like this, but I've tried to say, would you like to kind of discuss together out loud what you're. And we can. We can talk it through. And I don't know if they think then that I'm just trying to convince them to go with me, so maybe that's. That's some of the reason. But they just say, I just have to think about it. Then I. I back off. Because sometimes you can tell when someone's really uncomfortable. So. Yeah. Yeah.

So here. Here's where we want to bring consent back in is like, what I would like to explain to people, and this is what I train my coach clients to do, is to explain, you know, my job here is to help you make a really powerful decision for yourself, whether it's to work with me or not. Right. So do you want to talk through it with me right now? Because if it's not the right fit for you, I want you to have that as a powerful decision. And. But if it is the right decision for you, I want you to feel really empowered to make that decision. Right. And. And say, you know, do you want to talk through it right now? And if they're like, oh, well, not really, then you can say, okay, well, the door is always open. Let's book a yes, no call. So you have a time where we can close the loop either way. Right. And if you have any questions between now and that know that we can hop back on the phone at any time. Right. You know, especially when it comes to money. If someone's like, well, I don't think I can afford it, you know, this is a great way to kind of reframe that for them. Right? Because if they really, really want it and it's just like a money issue, then, you know, money issues can be figured out. Money can be discovered in lots of way. Well, lots of different ways. So I always like to say is to go back to that and say, you know, my. My whole job here, whether you work with me or not, is to help you make a powerful decision about what you're going to do next to fix this problem. You know, it's not a powerful decision to say, I can't do it because of the circumstances around me. I'm, like, trapped with the circumstances around me, whether it be money, time, whatever. So, like, you know, not. Not disregarding that. That scenario could be true. But let's find a better reason for you not to do this. Then. I just don't have the money. And you kind of join in with them to talk them out of it, Right? Because if there's no other reason, they're going to say, you know, there's really no other reason. Like, it's just. It's the money. Figure it out.

And sometimes. Yeah. And now that I've been doing this long enough, I start to wonder too, because for some people, I feel like they're using money as an excuse and it's not the real reason.

Yeah, exactly. And we want to get to the real reason, right? We want to get to, oh, I spent money on this, on stuff like this before. It didn't work. I don't trust it. Oh, well, I just discovered you. I don't really know who you are yet. I want to verify that you are who you are. You know, there's a bunch of different things. So, like, we want to get to that reason. We want to make it okay that they don't have money. We want to make it okay that they say no. You know, but, like, the most helpful thing for both of you is to understand what the actual reason behind the no is. Right? And if they do get to a point in the conversation where they're like, if I had the money, I would be handing it over to you right now. I want to sign up. Then you get to ask permission. You say, cool. Well, you know, part of what I do with my clients is we brainstorm how to do a whole bunch of stuff. Do you want to brainstorm some ideas as to how you can get the money. Right. And you open the door to, like, ridiculous things. Say, you know, let's just throw some spaghetti at the wall. And my favorite thing is to say, cool. Like, do you know how to make balloon animals? Can you. Can you set up and make balloon animals at the park? You know, three days a week for a couple hours? I said this once, and someone legit said, I used to do that in college and I'd make $200 an hour. Like, cool.

Never know. People be hustling in all sorts of ways.

Exactly. I'm like, okay, awesome. But, yeah, so anyway, you. You get to come up with random ideas with them, and sometimes it helps and sometimes it doesn't. But there's no. There's no. Like, the intent behind it is what is going to communicate that you're not pressuring them. Right. The intent is genuinely, I want to help you get what you want. If you want this, I want to.

Help you get it.

And the more outlandish the ideas are that you come up with, like, the more realistic ideas they're going to come up with and feasible ideas.

I have to learn, though, how to separate myself, because when people tell me it's the money and I feel like it might be a genuine issue for them, the nurturer comes in.

Yeah, yeah.

And I start feeling really bad for them. I start feeling like, you know, who am I to. To charge this much? You know, I've been poor. I know how this is. I've lived in my car, for God's sakes. Like, I've eaten, like, food out of a can. So then I start to think, like, oh, like, maybe I can do differently for them. Maybe I can give them a cheaper price. And so obviously, I know I should not do that because this is just screwing myself up from reaching my own dreams because I'm not making enough money, which is obviously the whole issue.

I'm going to pause you right here because that's not actually the way you get your nurturer on board.

Right.

Your nurturer doesn't actually give a fuck about you making more money. Right. The nurturer cares about helping other people.

Yeah.

Right. So let's look at it from a different angle. Like, for, you know, the whole thing. Like, you can lead a horse to water be. I'm sorry, no, you can teach a man to fish, but you can't. Or you can give a man a fish and elite for a day. Sorry, you know who.

I know exactly what you mean, so continue on.

You know, you can give away fish all day long. Is it actually going to help them in the long run? Right. Like teaching them to fish is going to be far more impactful. Right. They may not have the best fishing gear to start out with. Right. But if by day two they're getting a fish, a fish a day like their golden's way better than you going out and fishing and trying to hand them stuff. Right. For the nurturer, one of the things that's really empowering when it comes to knowing how to charge more money and how to like really believe what in what you're selling is to understand that when you keep your standard high of this is what I deserve to be paid, they're seeing that, they're seeing this modeled of, oh, I don't have to make myself smaller to have other people want me. I don't have to accept less to have people want me. Here I am wanting to work with this woman, she's holding firm on her price. Didn't realize people could do that. It's going to impact how they go into negotiations for their, for their salary. Right. And you also know that when they, they choose to believe in themselves enough to invest money that they would otherwise be stressed about to get something that they want, they're actually giving themselves proof they're really powerful. Like, for you to stand firm in your pricing even when they can't afford it is one of the most powerful things for people, especially when they want to get a higher paying job. I once had a client say to me, this is back when I did leadership coaching. She said, oh my God, you must spend all your time worried about me failing. And I said, I spend zero time worrying about you failing. I spend, I spend so much time excited for like what you're making for yourself.

Yourself.

Like I, like, it doesn't even occur to me to think about you failing because that's not even in the realm of possibility to me. And she's like that. And she's like, but you're not worried about like me being a certain way? And I'm like, no, like you're great the way you are. You know, I just like, I, I carry no responsibility for you doing your work because I know you're going to do whatever needs to be done to get to where you want to go. And she told me a couple months later that was like just hearing that that someone didn't feel responsible to take care of her was the thing that like allowed her to change everything. Right. Your clients are no different.

And, I mean, it is very empowering in the sense that. I mean, I paid for Kathryn's program. I paid for your program. I mean, it's a. It is an investment, but it is like you said, I invested because I trust myself. I know that I'm going to put in the work, and I know that it's going to work because I'm giving myself no other option. Right. This is the only option. But it's usually people that doubt themselves that is the issue, when really they're just thinking it is a price issue for them if they feel like they're not going to succeed. But it has nothing to do with me and my price. It has to do with what they believe their outcome will be. But it's them if they're not. If they're not putting in the work. Whereas I had no doubt that I would. Yes, it's more money than I had in the bank, but it's exactly like you said. Like I said, all right, I'm gonna pull this out my ass however I need to, because I need this in order to go to the next level.

Yeah. Yeah. And. And part of it goes along with when people say, okay, do you have any guarantees? You know, is there a guarantee that this is gonna work? And I mean, our answer is always, well, I can't guarantee that you're gonna do the work. The closest thing I can get to guaranteeing you're gonna do the work is by charging a lot of money. And if you're telling me that what I'm charging right now is not enough money for you to guarantee that you're going to show up every day and do the work, I'm happy to charge you more. And people. People love that. They've never taken me up on it, but love hearing that. Because you're like, oh, okay, well, yeah, that's fair.

I always. And I mean, I get it in the sense that I. I usually like to tell people that if you think about it, do you make a personal trainer guarantee that you're going to reach your ideal time on a marathon? No, because it's up to you. And I said, I can give you tools, I can give you resources. I can be there as a strong support for you, But I said, I can't do the work for you. At the end of the day, it's you who has to do the work. And investing in yourself is the biggest thing. And so, yeah, yeah, yeah, maybe I have to remind myself of. Remind myself of myself how I've done it. Even as a nurturer, you stayed true to your price. And. And I still paid for this. And I don't feel like you're a bad person or a mean person for not working with me, even though I don't have this kind of money or something. No, not at all. I understand. Because you value yourself, and that's what the price is, and I respect you for that. I should do. Yeah. And so. And yeah, and it's realizing that I'm still helping those people. It's just they're doing the initial investment that actually proves that they want to make this work. They're ready to do the work, even.

Yeah, yeah. And I will name that. Another thing that our clients come up against is that they have never invested in themselves. Right. And part of it is, like, it hasn't been modeled for them, but, like, another part of it is that they actually don't see themselves as worth investing in. Right. And that's a really hard thing to confront. And so one of the things that you can ask is, like, if they're. If they're waffling on the price, if they're like, oh, this is really expensive. I don't think I can do this. You can ask, okay, cool. What's the biggest investment you've ever made in yourself? You know, for mo. For most Americans, it'll be college, you know, and you can say, cool, like, was it worth it? What did you get out of it? And what did you go into wanting out of it? And then just work through the logic of, like, okay, cool, so you wanted a degree so that you could be a teacher and all this stuff. Okay, cool. And you got to the other side and you got to be a teacher. You realize you hated it. Great.

But you got. You got. You got there.

Yeah, you got what you wanted. Awesome. So this isn't as expensive as an American university, obviously, but, you know, we'll set the course for what you want next, you know, and this is. This is devoted time and energy for you to work towards this goal. You know, what would that be worth? Right? So, yeah. And of course, like, you know, objections, they're going to change. They have different flavors, and it's really getting curious about where they're coming from and giving permission, honestly, to say, no, I just don't want this.

And it was really interesting the other day. I got. I got, like, you mentioned before that sometimes we would think, you know, someone comes to us and they might not have the money for the program. I talked to a man in Congo, So Africa yeah, didn't bat an eyelash about the price. His hang up is he said, I'm working and then I'm doing an intensive English training program at the moment. So he said, I'm just a bit worried because he was really serious. I know I need coaching. I know I want to take my career to the next level. I just want to make sure I'm fully committed. And he said, I feel like maybe adding coaching on top of the intensive English course and work is a bit too much. So he said, I'm going to reevaluate after I finish the intensive program. And so. But yeah, didn't bat an eyelash at the price.

Yeah, yeah. In scenarios like that, you know, you can also say, okay, so how long is the intensive English thing? Oh, it's three months. Okay, cool. So we have May, June, July. So it sounds like you'd want to start in August. Cool. Like, is this, is it for sure that you want to do this? And if he says yes, you can say, okay, awesome. So why don't we do this? So for my clients who want to do delayed start date, what we do is we. I collect the first month payment, we do the agreement, and we set up your start date for however far out. If you ever want to move it up. You have your spot locked in. Like, you get halfway through your English intensive program and you realize I have enough time and bandwidth to add something else and I really want to get working on this. We can move your start date up to like, you know, late June, early July, you know, but if you're so like, super decided that you want to do this, I want to make sure you have a spot reserved for you.

Yeah, I think that's good. More so to even focus on the fact, because I, I don't really. I think this also better explains to people. I'm a doer. And I'm a doer, like, in silence. And I don't really tell people. And I think it's important maybe to tell people, like, hey, you know, I might not be available in two months if you decide at that point. So explaining that, yeah, you should reserve your spot rather than just saying, okay, yeah, let me know, because I did tell him. I said, I said in this case what I would do. And I don't even know why this didn't come natural to just say, because he seemed, he didn't say, yes, I want to sign up. He wasn't 100% on board, but he was already very sure and felt very comfortable. And I could have probably Brought it home if I would have focused on that. But instead I just said, okay, how about this? Because I was thinking more so from my own perspective. Maybe he is already overwhelmed, but he wants to do coaching. So I told him I would reach back out to him like in. Yeah, in two months to after, like before he finishes his English program. But just to double check, like to see how everything's going.

Right.

So. And. And he did he already. Which is a start because sometimes you have a call with someone and you. If they ask for the brochure, I send it for the brochure and then they ghost me. But he did respond from the brochure and said, great, everything still looks great. I really think that you can help me. I'll be like. He even said instead of me. I told him I would get back in touch with him and have it on my calendar. But he then said I'll get back in touch with you when it gets closer to time. So.

Yeah.

But yeah, you're right. I think I think this about capacity and already I just. And I'm done. Because I think, I think it has to do with. Also I don't think things. I'm not. I don't have a long term strategy which I need to put this into place because I. Then I don't think ahead. So when I have too many clients, I just stop marketing myself and then I go back to marketing myself when I need more clients. When really you need to market yourself every, all the time and then just tell people, hey, it's a delete to start because I'm over. I'm overbooked at this minute. But I don't know why I never share this stuff. I just. Which even makes me sound more popular, which I know helps people psychologically because they think, oh, she's already booked up, she must be good.

Right?

So I know it would help. I just am so used to being taught you move in silence. You do, you, you don't worry about other people. You don't need to tell everybody all the great things that are happening to you or what's going on. Going on when really I'm just kind of screwing myself up by doing that.

Yeah, well, and it's. You're not an idiot. Like, this is also like sales tactics, you know, it's a way to, to push people to make a decision. Right. Because if it's just like, oh, they're buying time because they don't want to say no to you right now if they really, really want it and you're Saying that it might not be available, like that pushes them to make the decision that they want it and they're going to get it. Right. If they don't actually want it, then they'll say, oh no, it's fine, I'll come back to you. Right. One thing I will say is like, next time I want you to book a call with them two months out rather than saying follow up.

Yeah, to make it work. Yeah, exactly.

Because then you can send them an email before just saying, hey, I'm confirming our call. We're reviewing X, Y and Z. And you know, if it's already on their calendar and they have back to you, it's, it's more of an impetus rather than, oh yeah, this lady followed.

Up with me and I like a passive thing. Yeah, exactly. And I, I think the reason why I didn't do that is because two times before this, like right before this, pretty much the same week, I had like negative reactions to the follow up call because I thought it was great you did this. I was like, ooh, that's a nice tactic. But one person on the call kind of just shut down when I said, hey, how about we just schedule a quick yes or no call? That way that we're, we're kind of on the same page about how to move forward. And the person just was like, no, no, I just, I just want to think about it by myself and I'll just let you know, I'll just send you an email. And I said, okay. Well, you know, sometimes people, you know, when they, when they say they're just going to reach out by email, they forget. Completely understandable. We're all super, super busy. So, so yeah, I just find that the call helps way more. And then people are just shutting down. They're just like, you can tell they're like trying to get me off the call. They're freaking out by this stage. I'm like, what is the issue with just, I don't know, people? There's been several that seem really scared about a follow up call. Yeah. Which seems a bit weird to me. So I had that response. Or some of them just say, yeah, okay. And then they just pick a day or time. But I feel like it's really almost like to appease me and then they send me an email maybe like a day later and say, oh yeah, I just decided I don't want to continue, so can you cancel that call? So I can't quite figure out. And so I was kind of curious.

Yeah.

If these, if you've Gotten this as well.

Yeah.

So a.

Those people, they don't want to sign up.

They don't. They just. They're just people that can't say no. Is that what it is?

Exactly. Yeah. Also, you know, you can. You can absolutely say, hey, you know, the energy just changed here. I. I'm sensing you just got really nervous when I said that. What's coming up for you? You know, and like, you know, like, whoa, like, the energy just completely shifted. What. What's going on for you when I said that, you know, because if there is anything where they're, like, worried you're going to pressure them into making a decision, you know, then you can name it. You say, no, no, no, no. Like, the no is totally fine. I just. I like having a closed loop, and I find that people feel more comfortable coming back later when they're ready if they know that they've given me an answer either way, you know? You know, there's also this coaching moment of, cool. How are you saying no to people?

Cool.

Like, let's look back at the things that are going wrong in your career right now. How much of that can be fixed by you practicing saying no? Right. The fact that you're backing off so hardcore on a simple yes, no call, that's going to be no pressure and just going to be a way for you to close the loop or start something. Like, let's practice. So if you're saying you don't want to book that because you've already decided no, like, why don't we practice you saying no right now? Because that's going to help you be better at saying no in your career. You know, maybe they're naming that they. They've been handed, you know, twice the responsibility but no extra pay. You know, they're not. They're never going to be able to negotiate more pay if they don't know how to say no to taking on more responsibility.

Okay. Yeah. Good. Yeah. And I think. I think maybe I. I try. Pacify the person by when I see they quickly just want to get off the call with me, I just want to end the call to make them feel comfortable. And so the minute I feel it, I try to shut it down.

Yeah.

And then the minute that I see that they're uncomfortable, if I'm pushing in a way that they. They don't like or that they. That makes them feel upset or conflicted, then. Then I can completely take my foot off the gas going forward, which is funny because I'm the complete opposite. When someone's My client, I know they need that as a part of coaching, and usually I'm like, oh, no, no, no. Let's keep poking here because there's something here. I know it makes you uncomfortable, but let's keep poking here. So it's funny that when it's. I guess because it is a stranger, it's not a client because it's the first time we're meeting. I'm just trying to make them feel comfortable and not make them feel pressured to book with me, But. But I think that I'm doing it too much, like, pacifying them, that I'm not actually really helping them. So.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, here's the thing about making people feel comfortable on a sales call is people can tell, and they don't. But they can't tell if it's a manipulation tactic or not. Right. So maybe a shift for you is to stop giving a fuck if they're comfortable.

Yeah. Because really, that's. Everything I do is directed. Like, the minute I see they're uncomfortable, I pull back. Minute that I see they want to get off the call, I'm like, okay, I'll let you go. And, yeah, maybe that's also part of the. The nurturer, even, is that I just want to take care of them. And so I'm like, oh, I'm making them uncomfortable. I just can, you know, not do that.

Right, right. Which when someone's your client, you have no problem making them uncomfortable because that's your job.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And that's the thing. I'm like, it is. It's a switch in my head because they put themselves here to do the hard work.

Right, right.

And. And coaching. Going through coaching is hard because it's growth. It's making yourself better. It's trying to work through something. So it's like those people signed up for that. So then it is a complete switch in my head. But with these people, I'm like, oh, it's okay. It's okay.

Yeah, yeah.

So.

But like, I want to back it up, too. These people signed up for a sales call with you knowing that you're a coach. They also signed up for it. Right. It's also, you know, that. That phrase that you're going to start saying in the beginning, like, let's see if it's a fit for both of us, and then we can talk about different ways to work together. You pushing back is a way for you to suss out if they're the right fit for you.

Yeah.

And you can even name that you can say, hey, listen, you know, I'm noticing you're shutting down right now. You know, I'm curious what's going on there. And you can say coaching, like there's going to be really confronting moments like this, you know, and you know, the clients that are most successful with me are the ones that, like, when it gets awkward or when they get uncomfortable, they don't shut down. You know, it's. It's a integrity based takeaway. Right. Because it's like, oh, well, you might not be the right client for me, but it gives them permission to lean into the discomfort of it and name whatever is making them uncomfortable.

Okay, well.

Yeah, so that's if they, that's if they're like a maybe. If it's a yes, then you always want to book their first session before you hang up the call. Okay. And then whatever you're onboarding, my, my onboarding practice that I, I do and that I train on is I'm going to book our first call together and then I'm going to send you your agreement and your link to set up payment and your new client questionnaire, and then I give them a deadline for when I need those things back.

Okay.

Okay. Because once they have their first appointment with you on the calendar, it's a deadline and it's psychological things like if, you know, I'm sure you've gone clothing shopping before, Right. And you know, there's a point where you're holding enough stuff that the salesperson will come over and say, oh, can I hold those for you at the dressing room or at the counter if you decided on these? Like, a good retail salesperson will actually wait a little while to ask to do that because it's really good service. But the longer you hold something like you're holding this thing in your hands, the more you start to believe it's already yours. Right.

Because they're developing an attachment. So.

Exactly. And the less likelier to leave the store without actually buying them. Right. And so it's the same thing when something's on someone's calendar. All right, I already have it. Right.

No, good point.

Yeah. Okay, so what questions do you have when it comes to sales? And now that we've gone over that.

I guess I'm trying to figure out what kinds of content I can do to attract people that. I was gonna say have money, but. But it's also. Yeah, I mean, yeah, I mean, well, there's people that have money and they just don't want to spend it as well. But more so that I am really annoyed by hearing people that are like, wow, that's expensive. Because I'm just kind of like, you're wasting my time.

Right.

With a call. And I feel like coaching is not one of these things. Oh, it's a nice thing. Like it could be cool to do. That's no, like, you have to be sure you want to invest in yourself because it's work. So there's so many people, I feel like, that call me and they're just. They're not. They're just like trying to kind of figure out more, and then they're just like, oh, wow, that's expensive. And so I don't want to attract these people. I want to attract people that do their research and that do their homework.

Right, right. Yeah.

So.

Okay, so to get to there, we're going to start with the people who can't afford to work with you, and then we're going to back it up to the people who can. So the people who can't afford to work with you when it comes to finding a job, what are the kinds of things that keep them up at night with worry? No, I'm actually asking. Sorry, I thought you were taking writing notes.

Yeah, I was taking notes. So, I mean, it's everything essentially that a job leads to. It's having money to pay the bills. It's having money to pay for their kids soccer. Here it is. It is worrying about stability because they are worried maybe they have enough savings now, but long term, if they don't find a job, what is going to happen? Financially? I find it's not. It's not the job itself, of course. It's the money that the job brings.

Right. Well, so that's someone who can't afford to work with you, who's really stressed about money, who just needs a paycheck. Okay, so let's refocus. Let's like set that aside and let's refocus on the person who has the money. They make a good salary right now. Their partner makes a good salary. They might own their home. And they really, really, really need to change jobs. Like, they just need to get out of where they are. And they, they want something so bad, but they just, like, they just don't know how to do it. What is the thing that's keeping them up at night?

Often the people that come to me and they want to change their job, it has a lot to do with. They are not valued in their current role and so they don't necessarily feel good about themselves. They don't feel good about what they're doing. They feel like they are meant for something more. So it's really this feeling, this. This unfulfillment that they feel, and they don't feel like that they're contributing to something. And there's also a lot of people who want to change their job, because I tend to work with a lot of millennials, and very on par for our generation. They want to make a difference in the world. I love when I talk to millennials. That's their number one thing. And so a lot of people will tell me they don't feel like they're making a difference in the world in their current role. So they want to change to do something more meaningful and impactful for the world or to have a positive effect on other people. So I would say that's common. Or some people come just because it really is a toxic situation.

Yeah. Okay. Well, so speaking to the toxic situation, that's one don't feel valued. That's kind of like fluffy coachy language. Right. So what's the moment they're replaying from their day as they're laying in bed trying to, like, you know, hopefully letting their melatonin kick in, where they're just like, oh, like, I can't believe that happened again. I can't believe that bitch said that thing, you know?

Yeah.

Like those moments where they've been treated like. Like they were sent out to get coffee again when they're a director. I beg your pardon? And just because I'm the only woman in the room doesn't mean that I don't. Like, I'm the. I'm the coffee getter. Right.

You know that usually it comes up on people that are working on a large project and they are putting in more hours and they're working really hard, and it's not acknowledged. The. All the extra work and all the hard work that they are putting in.

Yeah.

Or that work, the extra work that they're doing is just as expected. And so they feel then, wow, this is expected. Yeah. They. They tend to be like, that's not what I thought or what I signed up for. Also trying to think, oh, or another thing we hear about nowadays is since there's quite a bit of layoffs in different. Different realms, people are having to do two jobs and they don't even see. They don't feel seen for doing two jobs. They don't necessarily get a pay increase. They're now doing two jobs. They're stressed, they're overwhelmed, and they Don't. They're not even getting a thank you or a good job. It's just expected that they were supposed to take this on seamlessly. And there's. Yeah, there's. They feel. There's no validation that they're doing a good job or appreciation of their hard work.

Yes. Yeah. So all those things are the pains of someone who has money to work with you, and those are the things they bitch their spouse about. Those are the things that when they meet up with their friends for happy hour and are having a glass of wine that they're just venting about. Like, I can't believe I'm doing all this work right now. Like, they keep telling me they're going to hire someone. They keep not. But, like, also, they don't seem to have a problem with me, like, working 60 hours a week. So we want to, like, zoom in on the moments that are causing them a lot of pain. Right. Instead of talking about the general topic. Right. So we don't want to talk about not feeling valued. We want to zoom in on the examples of how they're not being valued. Right. We want to show, not tell. You know, as for unfulfillment, you know, wanting to make a difference in the world and feeling like you're not doing anything, you know, think of a job, any job, and that is not necessarily making the world a better place or being is actually like really harmful to the world in some way, shape or form.

A lot of clients that I worked for before, they would say, they often say some kind of nonprofit that far as like doing good in the world. And then things. A lot of people tend to tell me anything related to oil companies they don't want to work for.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I mean, like you. I don't know this is going to be a pain post or desire post necessarily, but. But you can absolutely say, you know, my ideal client would never fucking work for an oil company. Ideal client would never work for a fast fashion company. My clients give a damn about the world and they give a damn about their impact. And oftentimes they start working with me because they're working for a company that like, isn't having a terrible impact, but they want to. They want to do something that it has more of like a positive ripple effect, You know? You know, for your detail posts, one of the things that you could zoom in on is like, roles within companies that do have that positive ripple effect. You know, the marketing team at Dove, right. They have honed in on body positivity. You know, they're not just using like a one shape, one size woman for everything. They're using women who have all different kinds of bodies, who are all different ages. They're not photoshopping them at all because representation matters. And think of the impact that has on, on a young 8 year old girl who started to worry that maybe her cats are a little too fat. Too fat, you know, because that's when women, young women start to hate their bodies. Right? You could start zooming in on companies because a lot of companies have philanthropic departments where they actually go and make a difference. You know, if most of your clients are focused in on wanting to make a difference, then you get to zoom in on it and be like, hey, there are actually jobs out there for this. And the fact that you're talking about it and you're highlighting it means that you're the expert on it. Another detail post could be, you know, if you could give a gift to everyone in the world, what would it be like? Maybe it's the, the ability to see the.

Right.

You want them to be able to travel and see the world that, you know, they wouldn't have access to. And so you can say, you know, whenever I have a client who has a dream like this, one of our first looks is like to see companies that make it easier, cheaper, safer for people to travel. You know, what does that and how can we get you a job there without you taking a pay cut, without you doing this, that you can actually start doing this thing, that you're passionate about it, Right?

Y.

So as you're thinking about content, I want you to really think about like how, like who's bitching about this at happy hour? Who's venting about this when they've had a few glasses of wine? Is it the person who's worried about how they're going to pay their bills? Because if it is, that's not what we should be writing. Because they can't afford to work with you. Or is the person who is just feeling completely overwhelmed at work, this is not the right place. They feel like they're stuck though. They don't have time to interview, you know, and they're worried because everyone keeps saying it's a bad job market out there.

God, if I keep hearing this, I'm going to vomit.

I know. And that's another, that's another series of posts for you to say, I feel like I'm in a bomb. And if I hear one more person say, it's just a bad job market. Right? You get to Give your opinion on that, because that's something that people just need to hear right now. They need to hear that someone disagrees.

With that, because people use it a lot as a cop out so they don't have to do the hard work.

Right? Yeah. And you can say that, you can say, you know, the biggest cop out I hear from people who are wanting another job is that it's a bad job market right now. There's no jobs. It gives you a little in to say, you know, I've had X amount of clients recently who've gotten X amount of jobs or job offers. It's not a bad job market.

But.

It is a bad job market. If you're being lazy about is a bad job market. If you're trying old tactics to get job, it is a bad job market. If you're not highlighting all your strengths in the correct way, What else you got?

I struggled to talk about myself. I was telling my partner this yesterday. I said, oh, I'm super behind. I wanted to do this challenge that you have, like, that you mentioned about the social media. And I said, I haven't started yet, because, yeah, I, I, I even mentioned to my partner, I said, I know I'm super behind on it. So what I'm gonna do is I'm not really following the challenge along with everyone else, but I plan to use this as a basis to. To start and then to keep doing it. But I said, I'm struggling with the first thing about introducing yourself, and so maybe if you can just give me some questions to ask myself as an idea on what to write or what to say about myself. Because this goes back to, I'm a doer. I'm not a talker. So I'm just like, I don't know what to say.

Yeah, I mean, even that say, you know, I signed up to do a challenge, and I've been procrastinating the first thing, because I hate talking about myself. And the first step of the challenge was to introduce myself on social media. So, hey, here's my awkward introduction. And then share, like, you know, seven boring facts about you. You know, like, do it. Do it in the most imperfect, boring way possible.

Okay.

Right.

That feels more honest to me because, yeah, I mean, I'm like, you have to come up with something catchy to grab their attention. I'm like, I am a super boring person. Like, I'm like, your most basic ever. I wear comfy clothes. Like, I just, like, want to stay home with my cats. I like brunch and mimosas I'm like, I'm. I like to read. I'm so boring. So I'm like, I can't come up with something exciting to talk about.

All that stuff is so easy to engage on though, right? Anyone who has a cat will share a picture of their cat. Anyone who likes to read will be like, oh, do you like Romantasy? Do you like fiction? Do you like this? Right? It's the stuff that is the most boring about us that makes us the most easy to build relationship with. Right? There's someone I want you to start building a relationship with. And it's the fly that lives on, that lives on the wall in the back of your head and just watches everything that happens in there. Right? It's just, just watching as, like, you know, you. You have these thoughts of, like, well, I'm not. I'm not interesting enough. I'm a doer. I'm not a talker. I'm this. I'm that. You know, that fly is noticing a ton of stuff and, and it can write a post for you. You know, it's noticing that you're holding yourself back from starting something that you really want to do because you've made all these different standards and rules for how it's supposed to look, right? That fly, like, whenever you have writer's block around what you should write to get a client, oh, she has writer's block. What is she starting to believe about herself? What are the excuses she's coming up with? You know, when you get good at writing from that perspective, it's stuff that your clients go through all the time, right. Makes a huge difference. And we just normalize that. Like, yeah, this happens for us too. Even though we coach on this, right? Because especially if you have a hard time talking about yourself, your clients all have a hard time talking about themselves. It's one of the reasons they need help with their resumes and with COVID letters and with, you know, reaching out to people to ask for, you know, if there are any job openings. They have a hard time advocating for themselves, right? You saying, hey, listen, I coach on this stuff, and I still have a hard time with this. Like, you're not alone. It's just. It makes it. It makes you that much more safe to talk to, to admit that they're struggling with this.

Yeah.

Right. Someone who's 100 pounds overweight and in their mid-30s. Are they going to sign up for the weight loss coach who's 23 and has always been 90 pounds soaking wet?

Yes. Oh, my gosh I was just telling my friend this who wants to be a life coach, and she just keeps sabotaging herself.

Yeah.

And she wants to be a life coach and wants to really talk to people and really wants to focus on body positivity because she struggled so much with eating disorders.

Right.

And. And she said, you know, I'm not like one of these women, you know, that are so pretty and that is, you know, that. And I'm trying to talk about body positivity and I'm trying to talk about, you know, being beautiful. And I said, I don't envision a stick skinny yogi, Southern California woman when I'm trying to think about body positivity. And I said, that woman probably doesn't understand the struggles. I want to hire someone who's been through that shit, knows exactly how I feel about my own body and how I'm struggling with it. And I said, they're going to want to hire you, not the yogi that makes them feel like shit.

Yeah. 100. Yeah. They want cellulite. Who has hair in places you were not supposed to have hair. Right. Who struggles with it sometimes, who feels like, oh, my God, like, I want to lose 10 pounds. And also, doesn't that mean I hate myself? Like, oh, God. Why is it either or? The either or is killing us. Yep. So.

And yeah. And I have no problem being vulnerable. It's more so just if I know what to be, what to say and what to be vulnerable about, I'm fine. I'm fine telling people because I feel like if anyone can learn from me and learn they're not alone. I'm like, I'm happy to share.

I'm totally, totally. Yeah. And part of it comes from writing and just posting it. Other stuff, you know, you have access to me in between our calls through Heartbeat. You can go and post any idea you have and I can help you flesh it out.

Yeah, I think this is already good. Just even thinking, like, maybe trying to get out of my head. So. And just like you said, I have some, some of these thoughts. Like when you just said about the, the. It's just a bad job market. I hate when people say this to me.

Yeah.

But I. I didn't think about this as a possible post until you just said, you can write that. I was like, oh, yeah, I could. And then like, just even thinking about just being blunt and saying, I've been procrastinating on this challenge because I don't know what's right. I don't know why I didn't think I can just do that because I have no problem telling people I procrastinate. So. Right. Um, so yeah, I think I will try to get in order to get out of my head, try to think about the fly that lives in the back of my head. What is, what is this fly seeing that I'm doing? What is this fly kind of watching and if this helps to bring ideas. Because I think the main problem is just either have way too many. I know for post I never have way too many ideas. I always have ideas about coaching and my coaching programs and things I want to offer and help people and always what I want to learn next.

Right.

But post I just seem to flail.

Right. I know. I love it when the balloons go.

Yeah, yeah. What? But one time I was saying something, luckily it was just with a friend. But one time we're talking about something really, really sad and awful and then I just waved my hands and the balloons go off. I was like, that's so bad timing. I don't mean the balloons so and so killed themselves. Yeah, exactly. I was like, really like this. And I was like, oh God, first time ever.

Yeah. So I mean, funny. Yeah.

Funny ironic. Yes.

Yeah, yeah. And you know, the other thing that you can absolutely create content around is like go on to Reddit, go on to Glassdoor and see what you have reactions to.

And I'm someone with a lot of opinions, so it shouldn't be that hard. Yeah.

But those dependence, the opinions are not necessarily going to be your client getting content, but it's the get to know Susan content. Yeah, Getting to know like how you think through things, what your perspective is, how is it different. Right. Because that's going to be the stuff that people like. Oh, I never thought about it that way. I should follow this lady. You know, we're going to disagree with you and then you have engagement.

You know, I think I'm currently in a LinkedIn argument with someone at the moment.

So all for it. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. So. And it also like this is a muscle that you're just building. You're, you're flexing it, you're building it. It's going to get stronger. There will come a time where you'll wake up in the morning and your brain will just be like, oh, that's an idea for a post. And that's an idea for the post. And that's an idea for a post. And you're going to write them all down. You're going to write two of them and then you have two Days of content. Yep, it's coming.

I can't wait. Because, yeah, I think it already doesn't help that. I mean, I should have been born in like the 1800s. I mean, definitely not from a feminist perspective, because I'm super feminist, but definitely from the technology. I'm like a dinosaur. I'm so not into social media and I think that's what I struggle with. I know there's like a limiting belief that.

No, but that's a post tell. Like talking about that.

Yeah, yeah, that's about that.

That tells people so much about you.

Yeah. Because people will talk about social media because obviously even my face looks younger. So I was just talking to a woman that has four kids because, you know, I live it like my family lives in the south. And she's a year younger than me. And I was like, or kids. And then she's like, wait, you're older than me? And I said, apparently. And she was like, oh, you look so young. I thought you were, you know, in like in your early 20s. I was like, no child.

Like, yeah, this is what no children gets you. No wrinkles.

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. I sleep well. I go on holiday a lot.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I mean, that is a post. You talking about you being born in the wrong century. Except for the feminist, the lack of feminism.

You're also childless by choice.

Yes, yes. Well, technically I have seven children.

Yes, that's right. That was your fun fact. I loved it. Yeah.

But, yeah, no, no children. And I have a dog and I will get more pets, but that's it. I like sleeping through the night and I don't like being vomited on in the middle of the night.

Yeah, I know. And that's the thing. I love being here with my cousin. Like, I mean, I don't really like. Well, you know, I'm traveling around. I first went to see friends. I went to see my friend in Austin and she has a 2 year old and it got to be so much. I had to check into a hotel. Yeah, I. I couldn't. And then. But my cousin's kids are older, so it's. They're at the cute stage where you can do fun stuff with them. And you say, don't tell mom that I like fed you all this crap. And like, let's go and let's do this stuff. Because they range. They range from 7 to 16. So I'm like, good. They're not like two small children, but you spoil them and then you leave. Yeah, fabulous.

Get them all hopping up on sugar and there's someone else's problem. Yeah. Mm.

Yeah, definitely.

Okay. Covered a lot today. What is your main takeaway?

I'm actually. I mean the sales of course is really important because that's how you get clients. But I know that I've been struggling really a long time with post on LinkedIn. It's really. This is the thing I. I put off. I procrastinate and I struggle with since the very beginning. So I'm really happy that you just gave me some ideas on. Yeah, just being super real and just saying. Saying what I feel and then also trying to think in terms of. Yeah. Anytime I have an opinion, I can express it. Yeah. Yeah. Cool.

Awesome. Well, so I'm assuming your work is going to be social media content between now and next week?

Yes.

Want to assign to yourself?

I definitely am doing this introduction post for sure before next week and then I. I would say because I don't want to post on Friday because I only post on LinkedIn and I find on Fridays engagement isn't really good because people are already checked out. So. But I will do one the next week too.

Cool.

So yeah, two, two post. That's what I'm doing.

Perfect.

Awesome.

I will see you next week and you know where to find me if you have any questions about anything.

All right, thanks.

Bye.

Bye.