From CEO Groups to Team Breakthroughs: Leo Bottary’s Peernovation Blueprint

Welcome to Founders Future, a podcast powered by closers.io, where we dive into the journeys of innovative entrepreneurs and explore the road ahead for them and their companies. I'm your host, Michelle Said, and in each episode, we uncover the stories behind impactful ventures, the challenges faced along the way, and the strategies driving their future growth. Today, we're thrilled to have Leo Bottary, the founder and managing partner of Pure Innovation, joining us. Leo is an author, a keynote speaker, and also a podcaster whose delivered over 500 programs worldwide, has helped leaders build high-performing teams through peer advisory principles. Primarily, his podcast has also inspired countless organizations to embrace collaboration and clarity. We'll explore his founding story, really how peer innovation is transforming team dynamics, and what the vision looks like for scaling this mission-driven firm. So with that being said, Leo, welcome to Founders Future.

Hey, thank you very much for having me today. Pleasure seeing you, Michelle.

Awesome. Well, take us back to the beginning. What inspired you to launch PeerNovation?

So, um, I think it kind of goes back to, um, a real connection with the subject area that I kind of deal with. Um, so I went to college in 1983— talk about dating myself, right?— when I graduated. Now, when I went back to graduate school, it was 2006. So back in 1983, the educational experience was a very individual endeavor. You know, it was shielding your paper from other people. It was taking notes. It was taking exams and writing papers and all that kind of stuff. Very little, if any, group or teamwork or anything like that. Going to graduate school, it was a completely different experience. It was collaborative learning, which basically would have been called cheating back in 1983. But here we are, we're all working together. We're all having fun. But we were mid to senior level executives who had a lot to bring to the table, I think. And the program was designed so that we could learn most from one another, second from the material that we were provided, and third, the professor said, hey, and if you can pick up a few things from us, that's great too. They would applaud that characterization. It's exactly what they were trying to create. Now, by the same token, okay, I graduate from that program, and because of that experience I had, because I found it so transformative in terms of that collaborative learning environment that I became aware of a position available at Vistage Worldwide, who Vistage, of course, assembles and facilitates peer advisory groups for CEOs and business leaders in 40 countries now. And I'm thinking, wow, what a great opportunity to work for an organization like that that does what I've been kind of introduced to, you know, I think so elegantly and brilliantly at Seton Hall. And so once I arrived, there and really saw firsthand the incredible benefit it provides to CEOs and business leaders of all kinds, really, you know, it became evident that after— well, it started during my time there, of course, but after, I really wanted to dive into the area personally and recognize that what I really want to do is not necessarily be an advocate for any one company who does this over another one. What I want to do is shine a light on the entire category. So there are people who are aware that not only are groups incredibly effective for CEOs and business leaders, and they should think about joining one, but also to look at the fact that what the highest performing peer groups around the world have been doing so brilliantly for so long can be applied very successfully to create higher performing teams and quite frankly happier teams in the workplace. So, So I've written 3 books, just finished the second edition of the latest book. It's, you know, "Pair Innovation Forged by CEO Forums, Perfected for Teams." And Amy Edmondson from Harvard Business School, who obviously a bestselling author in her own right, but also she coined the term psychological safety back in 1999 and was kind enough and generous enough to write the foreword for the book. So I think, The content itself, we're shining a light on it. We're getting some work done there. But I could not be more thrilled that it just has gone down this road because I've never had more fun professionally than I have right now. And of course, I think because of the work and how it changes people's lives, that's become obviously a huge motivator to want to extend the reach and scale this business.

Yeah, I mean, incredible with the book launching, all your accomplishments thus far. I mean, Let's dive into the nuts and bolts for the listeners tuning in. I'd love for you to walk us through really how Peer Innovation generates revenue today, the core offer. I know you have the workshops, the certifications, there's the consulting. How do you structure what you do for some of the clients you work with? And then also, who is like your ideal client, if you can share with us?

Wow. Well, you know, it's interesting. Any, any client that tends to have people becomes an ideal client. And I'm, I'm not being flip when I say that. I've worked with companies that have like 10 people, and I've worked with companies that have had over 100,000 people. And so when you really start diving into it, see, part of what peer innovation is all about is it takes models and frameworks that have been created from, again, what these peer advisory groups have been doing so well, you know, for so long. So it's not prescriptive. The idea is that we apply these models and frameworks to whatever size company, and we use them to help them discover what it is they want for themselves. And then they have ownership over it, and which is what makes it, you know, I think, A, something that they have a hand in creating, so they want to have a hand in its success. But also we build intentionality into it to make it sustainable. I think sometimes there's a lot of great training programs and a lot of amazing content out there. And sometimes, unfortunately, people take in that content and talk to them a month or two later or whatever, and it's just like, that was great, and it's a— but it's— we're on to other things now. What peer innovation does is it helps teams keep things front and center so they keep it intentional. And once you're able to do that, you can start creating really great habits and make something sustainable, you know, going forward and get better at it, of course, over time. So that becomes a really important part. So on one hand, yes, the certification, because I want more people doing this than just me. There's a online course aspect of it that is in development really right now that are going to provide some asynchronous opportunities and ones that don't necessarily involve having me or a certified facilitator involved. There's certainly the consulting/coaching aspect of it. I like to think of it as more coaching than consulting, largely because again, it's really about helping people reach their own conclusions and their own understanding based on what's right for them. Is really what that's about. And then, of course, there's just the speaking aspect of things, whether it's keynote speaking or things like that. So there's various ways, and I use them not only to reinforce one another, but again, it's so important to me, maybe more than anything, just to extend the reach of this work so that the more people who do it, the better. In fact, the certification program is set up, I think, in a unique way because What I'm really looking to do with it is get a bunch of certified facilitators. They pay to be certified, but then I don't want revenue from them going forward. I want them to take it and run with it now, and they stay connected to a cohort, right, to people that they go through it with. So we bounce ideas off each other and we talk about, you know, various challenges or questions or things that we get out there. But, you know, it's And, and it's also designed in a way where, and this basically comes from the very first time I delivered the certification to the first cohort and went through it. And just before the first session, someone said to me, you know, I'm feeling a little skeptical about this because I'm reading this stuff and you've created this stuff, and it's like I'm never going to deliver it like you, you will. And I thought it was kind of interesting because we probably all experienced having to go to some meeting and deliver somebody else's PowerPoint presentation or whatever. And that never goes well, right? So I can understand the reluctance on that. But by the same token, it made me think, well, I don't want people to present it as I would. I wanted them to present it as I never could. So the idea is from the very beginning, we help people take this content and connect it with their experiences, their stories, their strengths. And once we're able to do that and they can come at it through, walk through that door in presenting the material, it's not only a heck of a lot easier and smoother for them, but it's also more credible, I think, from the audience perspective as well. And for all the participants in any workshop or any program that they deliver. So it makes it, I think, work that way. And that's on one hand how I at least— there's one aspect of scaling the business and then there's the other aspect of scaling the content. And to me, they become two different things.

Yeah, absolutely. So really, from what it sounds like, a lot of your intentionality right now is placed on setting up, you know, the asynchronous model, right? Which is like, really, how can we enable a lot of these facilitators to implement on themselves, essentially, right? With the certifications and with everything going forward. And is that sort of the directionality for you as a founder that you're taking? Will we be focusing on scaling that, building that out? What does that next step look like for you as well? I'd love for you to share more on that.

Yeah, so there's identifying how granular we want to get into the course aspect of it just from an organizational standpoint. In other words, there are 3 very specific workshops, well, 4 really, that I do. And but within that, there are, you know, topics that you can really blow up, you know, even something as simple as the courage to ask for help. It's so amazing how many people that when I ask them, how does asking for help make you feel? Makes me feel stupid. It makes me feel weak. It makes me feel incompetent. It makes me feel all of these largely very negative things. When in fact, through certainly most of the research I've done, you find out pretty quickly that successful people, they ask for help, and in large part because they don't see it as a sign of weakness. They regard it as an act of resourcefulness. And once you can look at it that way, that becomes really powerful. So I think there are lots of topics inside of the larger body of work that can be really, really helpful for people in terms of grasping what this is all about and putting them in the place where they can start, I think, embracing the values and behaviors that are important to making care innovation make that much more sense to them. So There's a little bit of that work I'm doing right now. On the certification side, the kinds of people I want to certify would be people like, like if someone is a Vistage chair or they're a forum leader for another group or something like that, and they really want to take this content because it gives them a different lens about how to think about their groups and how the members can think about their group and the value they create for one another. So I think that's one audience, certainly. The second is for HR professionals who If, if, yeah, you could hire me to come in and do it and spend all kinds of time with you, or you could get certified yourself and, and have an incredibly cost-effective way to bring this content into your organization and keep it front and center and doing all the things that would be helpful within your culture. And then of course, there are just executive coaches out there who might do a lot of one-to-one executive coaching but don't necessarily have a team offering. So this gives them, you know, a, I think, a mechanism for that. And let's face it, you know, there's certainly lots of stuff out there for teams, right? Whether you're talking about, you know, Patrick Lencioni's work or a whole host of other people who do stuff on teams. And I think in many respects, a lot of it kind of brings you to a lot of the same place. That said, there's a reason why all of those things exist though.

It's—

there's a reason that when you type leadership books into Amazon, it's— you get like 60,000 entries. You get something crazy like— so do we need 60,000 books on leadership? I don't know, but I know that someone will read one leadership book and it really connects with them. Maybe they've read 10 others prior to that. There was something about the way that that author walked through the door and it connected with that person in a very powerful way, makes that content thing for them. And I think in many respects that's what peer innovation does. It will, I think, be something where people may have read all kinds of stuff on teams, but they may look at this and go, aha, that connects with me in a way that Lencioni's work may connect with someone else and all that. And I think that's all healthy. I think that's all great that you've got a lot of different people approaching things in different ways. And, you know, it's kind of healthy for everybody.

Amazing. Now, building on all this growth, I mean, I would love for you to walk us through really how you're acquiring some of your clients right now consistently. Whether it is paid ads, you know, social media, referral, word of mouth, what's been working best as far as like the lead gen side of things?

So that's a great question because I struggle with this a little bit. I have tried with different lead gen places who I thought I kind of have based on my experience in my prior career would have had a pretty good, I think, meter on how to evaluate who would be really good. And it just failed miserably both times. And largely because, you know, there's something, and part of it's on me too, because when I see how some of these things are marketed, whether it's through LinkedIn or something, it's like someone's trying to sell a used car and it's got to have a different level of sophistication and elegance to me for that, for me to be comfortable in terms of the brand. And I think who we're speaking to, and I haven't really quite found the answer for someone who really understands how to do that well to the audiences that I'm speaking to. So I think that's certainly one aspect of it. I also, because I'm doing so much work on the content, I don't have a lot of the time to do the biz dev that I could be doing. But at the same token, I'm also very lucky because I speak to so many CEO peer advisory groups that I get in front of a lot of people all the time. And so yes, it becomes word of mouth and yes, it becomes referral and all these things. And I certainly have you know, as much or more than I can handle right now. But by the same token, if we're talking about scaling the business, there has to be, you know, a remedy for that. And again, to me, it's not even financially motivated. I'm not in an age where I'm going to do this for another 30 years. Okay. So there's going to be a point where I just want to really be able to put this in a place where this can be self-sustaining, where someone may be able to run this someday. And make sure that the, that the work continues and, and, and it grows and develops and advances and all of these wonderful things. So that's a huge priority for me right now.

Yeah, absolutely. So a lot of what you're thinking about now is how do we build predictability per se as far as like a lead engine in your business to where you probably can't be in all the rooms, right? Even doing these engagements, trying to figure out how can I start to get my message out there. But niching down in a way to where you have a CTA and then you can create reputable results and consistency with the lead gen. So yeah, that's a lot of where your mindset is from what it sounds like. As far as like sales goes, I mean, talk to us a little bit about that. You know, what is your process? You know, if a client does come in, let's say it is word of mouth, right? You know, primarily that is your main channel right now. How do you go about really converting them into a paying client? And is it just you right now or do you have like a team in place handling some of those components?

No, that aspect of it is basically me in terms of the stuff that, that I work on, um, specifically. Now, other certified facilitators have their own process and they do their own things in that regard, um, but for me— so first of all, for the most part, um, by the time someone feels like they're ready to have a conversation with me about this, once we do, I will close them most of the time. And it's not about me closing them in terms of selling them. It's about once you, I think, reveal kind of what's available to them and how this really works and the freedom they have to create here. I think it's really attractive for a lot of folks who want to get into this, but it's a very bespoke offering in many respects. So there are aspects of it, again, models, frameworks, all of that, those things don't basically change. However, someone may come in and say to me, well, I've got to work on our level of engagement, or I've got to work to remove silos, or I've got to try to get greater alignment against a strategic initiative that we're working on right now, whatever that may happen to be. And because oftentimes when people say, well, what does compare innovation do for my team? And I'll say, well, what do you want it to do for your team? And it truly is that simple. I mean, it's the idea of we're going to direct these models and frameworks and these resources and this approach to whatever it is you're looking to accomplish, and we're going to be laser focused on that. So the outcomes are really clear. They set what success looks like right out of the gate. We both have clarity on it, and then we go and deliver on that. And I'm very fortunate now, and as you know, you'll talk to a lot of founders who I don't care how confident you are in whatever it is you're putting out there for everyone. In the early stages of it, you get your fingers crossed, still thinking, I think this should work. But you're just, you know, you're doing your best and getting out there. And fortunately, and, you know, as you mentioned, it actually, that number has eclipsed 800, you know, programs right now for groups and teams. And so that's when you start getting a little comfortable and feeling like, okay, this really works. And that's, There's kind of no substitute for that in terms of people feeling as if, yes, this is something available to me. And guess what? It's not just another thing that we're going to forget about in 2 months or 3 months. This is something that we can sustain and we can do so and be intentional about it. But it doesn't— it's not a huge lift. It's a lot of little small mindset shifts in so many respects.

Yeah, 100%. So as far as like scaling and growth goes, you know, that next step being, you know, maybe even getting someone to help on the sales side of things. What does that look like for you as far as like building that out? Delegation, especially as a founder, you're probably wearing all the hats from a fulfillment standpoint and also doing sales, figuring out the marketing component. I mean, what's your perspective on that?

So I'm talking to someone now who both knows me really well and knows the business really well. Who really understands the CEO Forum space and what it does and how it connects to teams. So it could very well be that that becomes that person who helps me on that side of things that I neither have the time for nor would I be as good at as they are. And I think that's a big next step for, for me in terms of making the final decision on that and moving forward.

Is this like another consultant that you've worked with that you, you know, outsource work to primarily?

Yes. Yes.

Got it. Cool. And then as far as the runway for this year going into 2025, what does that vision look like as far as like goals, performance milestones? Paint that picture for us.

I think it's really setting things up for 2026. I think I want to really hit the ground running. you know, in Q4 to, to really sail into 2026 at a, at a much different, much higher level in terms of what we're doing. And again, the scale of what we're doing and the reach of what we're doing and, and who we're doing it for and what that looks like. So you can just get that many more examples. I mean, you can go on my website and you'll see, like, I only have like a half a dozen or so testimonials that I've actually, you know, put up there, but they represent a nice little you know, range of organizations, some really large companies, some smaller organizations. And that's great. But I think I've got and can do a lot more work in there to, you know, people can sell things and that's all well and good. Providing real proof and real evidence that stuff works and it works over the long term, that takes more time.

Yeah, 100%. And essentially you can use that to flywheel a lot of your content, especially on LinkedIn, creating that thought leadership, you know. So yeah, full circle moment there on that front. As far as like, you know, I want to get your thoughts on this. How do you see the pure advisory industry evolving in the coming years, especially with a lot of your focus on, you know, maybe even collaboration in the AI space? How is Peer Innovation positioning itself for that type of future?

So, pair innovation definitely is going to be, and I spoke to it in the second edition of the book as well, where we have human intelligence and artificial intelligence creating a level of collective intelligence that I think is really powerful. I think also we're at a point in time where we've got to get the people part right as we start figuring out, you know, how best to make AI part of our future, you know, in the most positive way possible. And so, you know, I think, you know, at this stage of things, there's kind of that content piece of it where I look at peer advisory groups in general, it's definitely growing. There's no question about it. Look at the number of people who are leading peer advisory groups for CEO business leaders around the world, the number of organizations today versus what it was 10 years ago. I mean, it's not close. I think the organizations that have been doing it for a while, they are getting larger, but there's a lot of other organizations out there that are also meeting different needs. Needs. You know, they're— I think you're going to see a lot more virtual groups, you know, coming up where people, instead of just connecting with the CEOs in their neighborhood, want to connect with CEOs around the world and really make it an international conversation. But there's so many iterations of it, and I think people are adapting and meeting whatever marketplace challenges that are out there and showing how connecting with people that are going through just what you're going through can be hugely, hugely helpful.

Yeah, 100%. Um, and now on one last note, for the listeners, founders looking to follow in your footsteps, what's like one tool or resource, maybe a framework or like a team building strategy that's been a game changer for peer innovation?

You know what, I think that— not to not answer your question, but to me, the game changer for peer innovation is you have to have— and I would say this for any founder— you really have to have a passion for what you're doing and the difference it can make in the world beyond the financial aspect of it. I think it's is such a key driver. You know, it's— that's what gets me up in the morning. That's what gets me excited about the difference it can make in people's lives. And, you know, the idea— because everything else is just hitting a number. There's nothing that's ever going to feel great about hitting this number, hitting this number, hitting that. And is— you have to attach that number to something that matters to people. And, and I think that has been the big driver for me and the big game changer.

Incredible. And the best piece of advice you can leave to our listeners on one last note before we do wrap up.

It kind of speaks to the same thing. Love what you do. Just love what you do. There is, there is not a time in my career, and I've enjoyed my career quite a bit, but nothing's close to how much I love what I'm doing now. And it's fantastic and it's great, you know, you know, at, at this point in my life to be able to, you know, I'm in charge of my own schedule. I get this work that I absolutely love to do, and then I get the value and the benefit of getting to see the difference it makes, you know, for people. And that's a pretty cool way to kind of close out a career.

So, yeah, I mean, that's incredible. And, uh, it's advice that resonates with the listeners. I mean, if you're waking up and you're not loving what you do, how are you gonna get to that success and that end goal at the end of the day? Right? So, Passion fuels profits. You know, that's the same. So invaluable. And then the best way for the listeners to get in touch with you and potentially work with you, Leo, what would that look like?

Sure. I think two ways. Certainly feel free to connect with me on LinkedIn and reach out to me on LinkedIn. I'm very active there. And also visit the website at perinnovation.biz, and you can always reach out to me through there as well. I think it gives you a real sense of what the value proposition is all about before you have to go. you know, feeling like you've got to schedule a call or something like that. And, but yeah, happy to come, come see us.

Amazing. Well, on that note, thank you so much for joining us today and being a guest on Founders Future. We're so excited to follow along and see the runway shape up for 2026, as you were talking about. So looking forward to seeing that success. To our listeners, if you enjoyed today's episode, of course, don't forget to subscribe to Founders Future wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts. You can also follow us over here at closers.io, where we're dedicated to helping businesses scale and accelerate their growth through trained appointment setters and world-class marketing and sales systems. Until then, everyone, keep climbing and we'll see you all on the next one. Leo, it was a pleasure having you on the show once again.

Oh, delightful. Thank you so much.