Allyson Felix on Breaking Olympic Records, Shattering Stereotypes & Unleashing Greatness

Success doesn't always mean the gold medal. You know, like, you can do a lot of work along the way and you can be successful without having the thing that is typically defined as the ultimate.

Hey guys, thank you so much for being here. A quick message before we dive in. You may be watching the show but haven't taken a moment to click the subscribe button below. So if you've ever gained value from this show, it would mean so much to me if you click the subscribe button right now. And not only will this allow you to see these messages first, all this great content we have, you're going to get notified first when it comes out. But the bigger our subscriber base grows, the more people we can impact and the bigger the guests we can get on this show as well. So again, thank you so much as always for your support. It means the world to me. Make sure to click the subscribe button below and let's dive into this conversation. I'm so pumped about this because I'm a fan of track and field and I'm a fan of you and all you've done to really inspire not only the United States, but the world in your last 20 years of competition. Showing up as an elite world class athlete representing the USA proudly and also representing women around the world and empowering women to be great in their own endeavors as well. So I'm just grateful that you're here. Congrats on everything.

Thank you.

I was talking to you just off camera how I was a decathlete and just an average track and field athlete myself. So I just love being around people that are so disciplined like you've been your entire Life. It's been 20 years. You've been a professional at the highest level. One of the things I wanted to ask you is about now that you've had a little bit of time off from being a professional, how have you navigated the identity you once had that is still there in your past of all your records and all the medals and all the accolades you have and the memories, but you're not living in that currently anymore. You've transitioned your identity into a new stage of life. How are you navigating shifting the old you into the new version of you?

It's hard. I mean, I have a lot of friends who have gone through it and I always heard that it was hard, but I didn't realize how challenging it would be. In one sense, I feel really fulfilled with the work that I'm doing now and so that's great. Feel really Blessed that I kind of moved right into that, but I didn't realize just the sense of loss that I would feel. And just, like, this thing that I've loved and I did for the past 20 years, like, all of a sudden, it's just. It's gone. And I would have loved to, you know, to keep competing. And, you know, if I could have done it forever, that would have been amazing. But I think it does. Like, I've had to do work on identity and, like, who I am apart from, like, what I've done. And that part has been hard, just showing up as me, not the Olympian, not the runner, and just understanding, actually, who I am. So I think I'm still very new into it.

You're figuring it out?

I'm figuring it out, yeah.

There's an amazing documentary called Weight of Gold. Have you seen this?

Oh, I have seen Weight of Gold, yeah.

It's essentially about Olympic medalists or gold medalists that have trained their whole life to have the chance to win the gold, but then go through a lot of depression and anxiety and sadness. And unfortunately, some of these Olympians take their lives after, you know, because they can't manage the pressure or they don't know what to do once everything's done.

Yeah.

Once they're not training for the Olympics anymore. And it seems like you're in a very good state mentally and emotionally. But how have you navigated that? Like, seeing other athletes struggle.

Yeah.

Whether they're training or they're done with their Olympic journeys. How. What have you seen, and how have you been able to make sure that you're in a healthy state mentally?

Yeah. I mean, I understand it because for the majority of your life, you focused on this one goal. You know, you've trained year after year for this opportunity that comes every four years, and you've given everything. And when it comes to the end, the sports just keep going. It's on to the next. And so I think that can be really challenging to kind of understand. For me, I think, something that helped. I think earlier on, I did feel like my purpose was, like, winning medals, and it was like, okay, can I get this world record? Can I do this or that? And then I came to a place where I understood that I was here for more than that. You know, like, that's amazing, but I think I have more to offer than just running fast, and I think I can have some impact in this world. And so now, as I'm transitioning, like, I'm holding on to that. Like, I know that I have a purpose here, and it extends beyond just, like, what I've done. And I think it's hard because constantly you're pulled back into that, you know, because it's what you've done. But I think I. What I try to do is just fight it with fact and fight it with work that's purposeful, and you just. Sometimes you got to keep pushing.

So if you're not the most decorated American track and field athlete of all time, who are you?

My favorite title is Mom. I'm Cameron's mom. And I love to show up in that way. I also love to show up for other women. I love to try to create, change, to. I really found my place, you know, being passionate about that and pushing there. So those are two places right now that I love showing up, and I'm really enjoying, you know, fulfilling those titles.

But if everyone wants to keep putting you in this old identity, this old box where you've been celebrated so much in, how do you navigate that?

Yeah, it's difficult, but I appreciate that. I mean, I still. I love the sport. I want to advance the sport, so there's all of those things. But I think I have to also, you know, be authentic to who I am in the moment. And I'm really. I think also I needed a break.

20 years, a long time.

Yeah. So being so just like, tunnel vision, hyper focused, I had to step away. You know, that's. It's really demanding mentally, physically. And so it's almost refreshing also to like, be in these new phases where I'm learning, like, as an entrepreneur, like, I'm. There's so much to learn, and I think it also fulfills some of those competitive drives as well.

Yeah. How did you learn to mentally prepare for something as simple as a practice, to prepare and train in one individual practice, like a champion, but also to prepare four years out for a goal, eight years away for a goal, 10 years away for a goal. How did you stay so focused day in and day out on being great today and also to prepare four years away?

I didn't always. I think it was experience over time. I started, you know, in this sport as a teenager, as a professional, and I got it wrong a lot.

Really.

I. Yeah, in. In my mind, like, it wasn't like, just an instant thing where everything clicked, and it's like, okay, I know how to do all these things. Early on, I was figuring it out. Like, I'm. I'm a teenager. I'm. This is a new sport for me. I started in high school and so I'm just trial and error, and then eventually, you know, obviously, I had an amazing coach who helped guide and lead me, but I had to make mistakes before I started really dialing and clicking in and understanding, like, okay, this is what works for me. This is what allows me to focus. This is how I block out distractions. So it was definitely a process of getting there. And then once I kind of got, you know, my team together and what was good for me, then I could keep taking it further.

When were you the most nervous in competition?

I'm always, like, every single time.

What was the one where you were, like, inside, you were just shaking so much, or maybe externally, you were, like, trembling?

Well, probably every time I race the 400, but, I mean, I'm being nervous is, like, a part of just the process for me. But.

But you always look so calm.

Do I?

I mean. I mean, you're, like, kind of pacing or breathing, but you're not, like, scared.

I mean, not to the point where I don't know how to handle it, but butterflies, like, excitement. Like, this is the. Like, every four years, 21 seconds. Like, this is the moment.

Oh, man.

So, yeah, I definitely was nervous, for sure.

What would you do to prepare in that hour before the race at the world championships or the Olympic trials or at the Olympics?

Yeah, I had a process, and so I would get in my zone. I would kind of like to be away from everybody, put headphones on, listen to my music. I would start to visualize. I love to run the race through in my mind, and I would just think of, like, what is the perfect race? How does that look? How do I feel? Run that through. And then I'd start warming up. You know, I'd get into, you know, the. The drills and the blowouts, put my spikes on. And I always had this moment where I would think back on all the work I've done, and I log everything in, like, a training workout, and I would go back through that and look at it, like, physically look back through the pages and just be like, I'm ready. Like, I have done the work. Like, this is like, it's already done. Now I have to just execute. And that always gave me a sense of confidence and calm. Even though I had the nerves. It was like, okay, I've done it. Like, let's just go out here and put it together.

Would you look at that? Like, the night before the race or.

The morning of kind of, like, leading up until, like, while we're tapering, like, those two weeks, you know, where it's like, okay, the workouts are in. Like, you're just. You just have to, you know, put it together now. And that always, like, made me feel like, okay, I'm. I belong here, and I've done the work.

Did you ever feel not ready for a race?

There were definitely times. I remember in 2016, when I was at the Olympics in Rio, I got hurt right before that Olympics, like, two months before Olympic trials. And training was going so well up until that point. And then I had this horrible ankle injury, and I tore all these ligaments in my ankle. I couldn't run. I couldn't even walk. I was literally in the. In the pool and on the bike and all this stuff. And so that time, I was like, the work isn't all there. You know, Like, I'm relying on trying to go off of conditioning. And so in moments like that, it's like, okay, I have to do the best I can with what I have, but doesn't feel great getting on the line like that.

How'd you feel or how'd you perform during that, though?

I got second in the 400 meters at the Rio Olympics.

And, yeah, after being injured two months prior.

Yeah. My coach always says, like, for him, that's one of the greatest performances. Just because of what I had to overcome and what challenges we, you know, we had to face.

That was like your Michael Jordan flu game.

That was my flu game, right?

It's like, absolutely. I'm not trained. I'm not prepared.

Yeah, that's right.

What do you think was able to get you to deliver that type of result? And how was your time compared to the rest of your times?

Yeah, I mean, my time was pretty much up there, consistent with what I had been doing around. Around that. And I think it was. We had a great base, great conditioning, and then we rehabbed around the clock. Like, it was. That was my job. Like, every single tedious thing, you know, we had to make up for what I couldn't do on the track, you know, in the rehab, in the pool or pool alter G, like, all of these different, like, tools that we had. And I think, you know, obviously being led by a great coach and putting all those things together and then just running with a lot of heart and trying to. Trying to get it done.

That's incredible. Now, when it's 15 minutes before and they're, you know, you're out on the track and you're ready to warm up for it, what else are you thinking about? To visualize the race, you run through the race in your mind, are you thinking of anything else?

Really technical thoughts? Because, you know, when I do have these nerves and, you know, I know it's a big moment, like, the technical thoughts really help me to focus in and block out the distractions. So, you know, when I'm there, I'm in the blocks. You know, I'm thinking about, like, what am I doing with my arms? Like, what do I need to be 10 meters and making sure my angles are right. And like, by thinking about those things, I'm not thinking about, like, oh, all these people are watching me, or if I mess this up, I gotta wait for such and such to do it again. So that was kind of like one of the things that really helped me to stay present in the moment and to execute.

What was the perfect race for you that you did?

I would say the closest to a perfect race. Olympic trials in 2012. It was my fastest 200 meter time.

Can you set the scene and walk me through the entire moment of that?

It was a really dramatic Olympic trials for me. I had competed in the 100 meters earlier in the week, and I tied with my teammate. We had this dead heat and we were supposed to have a runoff. And so everything was, like, geared for that. They were gonna, like, broadcast this. And they had never had a tie before. And there were no, like, rules in place to have a tiebreaker. And at Olympic trials, only the top three go. We both got third.

Come on.

So it was like this crazy.

So they can't stand four? No, it had to be a tiebreaker.

Yeah, it was either. Never. Never happened. And they actually had to go back and, like, put rules in place to figure out what they're gonna do.

And they're not going to flip a coin.

Well, that was one of the options, so.

Oh, no.

We actually, you know, we all met and, like, decided which thing we wanted to do. One of them was flip a coin. We could have a rerun. I don't even. Or someone could just offer to relinquish their position.

Who's going to do that?

Exactly.

Go to the Olympics. My 20 year dream. I'll just sit back.

Yeah. So we decided to have this runoff and it was going to be like this huge thing. And my teammate actually just decided that that's not what she wanted to do. And so it was just very emotional and dramatic and all of that. So that was like the first part of the week. And then I come to this race, which is the 200 meters. It's my favorite race. I called it my baby. Like I had two silver medals at my first two Olympic Games. So, like, here is the moment where, you know, I want to make the team, to get that gold medal that I've been missing.

And.

And I just. There was just such a drive within me. I think just everything that I had been through, I just wanted to just make it clear that I was gonna.

Make this team undeniable.

Yes. I just didn't want any question about it. And I felt ready. I felt prepared, and I felt excited. Like I'm ready to go. God in the blocks. And typically, I. The start is not, like, my thing. That's. It's just never been a strength for me. And I remember getting a really good start.

Just like, boom, explosive.

And I'm with everybody. So usually I'm back there. But if I'm with everybody, I know this is good. So I get out, and I'm with everybody. And I'm coming off the turn, and I'm like, I think I'm already in the lead. And for me, usually, I'm always coming from behind. It's the last 50 meters, and I'm in the right with the leaders, you know, coming off the turn, and then I just get stronger and stronger and start to pull away at the end, and I crossed that line. I was like, I'm going to the Olympics. Like, I.

That's amazing.

I'm going to be there to try to get this gold medal.

Wow.

That was a pretty. Yeah. Amazing race for me.

That's amazing. Whatever happened to the. The tie?

So she. Because she didn't come to the runoff, I got that position to run. And it was just so bittersweet for me because this is also my teammate that I've trained. Like, we're in the same training group, so.

So, wait, you ran. Did you run that race by yourself?

No, they didn't. We didn't have to run.

Disqualified, essentially, because she didn't show.

Yeah. And I just, like. Yeah. So I went and I just felt bad about the whole thing, and it was just kind of weighed on me, and it was. Yeah.

What was the event that you had the biggest letdown? Like, the. Like that you were so set on accomplishing this, and for whatever reason, maybe you slipped or maybe you just didn't perform as well or maybe something happened. The conditions threw you off.

Yeah.

That you didn't reach the result that you were like, I was supposed to get this.

Beijing. So my second Olympics. That was probably my most devastating outcome. And it'll probably sound crazy because I got a silver medal right and so, you know, yes, so that's not lost on me. But also, this is what I do. And my first Olympics, I was a teenager, I got a silver medal. So I am thinking, like, I'm four years strong. Everything. For four years, I've done everything that I could, and I'm also the favorite. And, you know, everything was set up for me to win this race. You know, it seemed like it should happen and I didn't. And for me, it was so embarrassing. Like, I just felt like, man, I'm supposed to be like this phenom. Like I wanted to make my country proud. Like, everyone is rooting for me. And so I just remember feeling like I just want to disappear. Like, I failed, like on the biggest stage. And for me, that was like the darkest kind of place I had been in. And feeling like, okay, well, do I keep doing this? Like, I don't know, do I commit myself? Like, at this point, I've already been to two Olympics. Like, what if it never comes together? Do I really want to give another four years of my life? So I think I had the most challenging time afterwards trying to, like, make sense of all of that and figuring out, like, do I still even want to, like, do this?

How did you. How long, how long did it take for you to get back to a place of either peace or acceptance or, okay, I'm still good enough. I'm going to keep going.

Yeah, I. It was a couple months. And it was, it wasn't me, it was the people around me. It was my family, it was my coach, it was my friends. Like, they were the ones that could still see the vision. Like, I was too in my feelings, like just down on myself, just like. And it was them pulling it out of me. Like, you can still do this. Like, you know, you. If you dedicate yourself, like, you can still get there. And so eventually I started listening to, you know, my circle and people around me and went back at it.

How important is it to surround yourself with a powerful circle of people that not only believe in you, but helped you build your own self belief?

It's everything. Like, for me, I. There's nothing that I accomplish by myself. Like, I lean on so many people. I mean, track is seen as like this individual sport, but like, we absolutely have a team. Everything from your training partners, your coach, your management, like, everyone is working for this common goal. And so, yeah, I go out there by myself, but I've been prepared. Like, everyone has poured into me. And so I, it's. It's critical and I Didn't always have the right team, like, I had to make, especially after 2008. That's when I kind of reevaluated everything. I was like, what changes can I make? Like, I've been doing this now, and if I keep doing the same thing, I don't think I'm going to have the result. So I looked at everything. I started working with my brother, he became my manager. And then we just started putting the pieces together. And for me, that was like a huge turning point. Yeah.

When was the time that you doubted yourself the most?

I think I've had to fight doubt throughout my career.

Really?

For sure. I'm trying to think, I would say probably, like the last Olympics is when I had the most doubt for sure.

On a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being you've got 100% confidence in yourself, you're, you know, zero doubt. One being you're doubting yourself all day long. Where were you on that scale?

I was probably like a four, I think.

Really? Going into your last Olympics?

Yeah, I think. And even before, like, trying to won.

A world championship, didn't you? Like, a couple years prior.

But I had become a new mom. Like, I had all of my. The whole ordeal with Nike. Like, I had what I felt like the whole world saying, like, you can't do this.

Really?

Yeah. And so I felt like it was only like my circle where I felt that, like, support and, like, belief and. And other than that, I felt myself listening sometimes to the voices of, like, you're too old, you're onto another chapter. You're a mom now. Like, you need to focus on that and that. Trying to combat that with, like, you know, fact of, like, training and result, like, that's a hard thing to navigate. So I definitely felt the pressure of that.

So you felt like you were at a four in terms of self confidence and belief leading up to the last Olympics. Did it. Were you a four at the Olympics or did it start to shift and go a little stronger?

Yeah. Once I finally. Once I made it to the Olympics. Sounds cliche, but, like, that was the victory. Like, that was just qualifying. Qualifying because nobody thought I could do that, you know, like, at this point, I'm 35. Like, I have this new baby. Like, there's all these things.

How many events you qualify for?

I qualified in the 400 and then.

I individual 400 and the relay.

Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah. So that was just like, such a relief even to be there. And then it really shifted for me. I think that was the first Olympics I ever Wasn't solely focused on, like, the time or the medal. Like, that was the first one where it was like, wow, like, I'm representing women like, I'm representing mothers. And like anybody who has been told they couldn't do something, like, I am showing them that that's possible. And that just gave me a different outlook and a different purpose than ever before. Because always when I came before, it's like, I am. I'm hyper focused on. Like, the only thing that matters is a gold medal.

Right.

Anything else than that is, like, failure. So this gave me a shift in that.

Interesting. And also right before then, you know, I don't know the full story, but essentially, Nike wasn't in support in some ways because you become a new mom or they weren't.

Yeah.

What was the whole situation that happened there that led you to saying, I need to do something for women with my own vision of this brand that you have now?

Yeah. So in track and field, for as long as I can remember, there has been this culture of silence around pregnancy and starting families. It's been really difficult in track and field. In track and field, specifically, in America.

Or over the world?

I think all over in the sport, for sure. In America. That's who I was in contact with. So basically, I was seeing my friends struggle through motherhood. I saw them either hide pregnancies if they needed new contracts. I saw their contracts get paused. There wasn't, like, this shining example of, like, a mother who's, like, dominating and, like, killing mother, like, doing all the things. It was more so, like, the struggle, not because they weren't capable, but because the support wasn't there. It wasn't in place. And so for me, when I felt like I wanted to start a family, I was really scared because I was like, I don't. I think that this could happen to me, too.

Even as one of the top stars, I was scared.

Yeah. But I did feel like I had waited. You know, I had already gone to four Olympics. I felt like I had accomplished enough where I'm like, okay, maybe I'm safe. That was like, my mindset. And so I'm like, I'm going to go forward with this. But my negotiations with Nike, who at that time I had been with almost a decade, even before I said that I was pregnant, the negotiations already were 70% less than what I had been making previously interesting.

So it wasn't a good deal.

Already already, you know, whether it was I was too old or whatever. The thing was, we were already at that place.

Okay, so they were kind of like, hey, you know, we'll keep you around essentially with this.

On to the next.

But we're. We're investing in the.

Yeah.

A generation that's coming up now.

Yeah.

Essentially.

So that just amplified my fear. I'm like, I've already seen what happens, and so I made the decision to do what a lot of women in my sport had done before. I hid my pregnancy.

Wow. Really?

Yeah. And it was crazy. I.

How long and now. How old are you at this time?

So I'm 33, and I am still competing. Like, I. At the beginning, I still try. Like, we're coming off the heels of, like, Serena, and I'm like, I can do this. Like, wow. So I'm still, you know, racing a bit. I'm training. Eventually I get to the point where I can't continue to do that, and I still. I train in the dark because at this point, I don't. I don't have an offer on paper, so I have a verbal 70% less, but there's nothing on paper. And so my fear is that they find out that I'm pregnant, and then that just disappears. Yeah.

So what, you're like, two months pregnant, Three months pregnant?

I started. So I stopped competing about two months, and then I'm still training. And, you know, this is. This is ongoing, so this is going over a long period of time. So I'm four months, I'm five months. I'm still in the dark. I'm rarely leaving my house. I'm wearing baggy clothes. Like, all of this for someone who's always wanted to be a mother, it was so hard because all these moments I had dreamed of, it's like I'm not experiencing any of that. The baby showers, like, any of the. Any of that.

So you're almost living in shame.

Yeah.

To have hiding the thing that you're most excited about, which is starting a family, you're living in shame. You're hiding it. You're going out, you're sneaking around in the night.

Yeah.

It's like. You're, like, crazy. You're like a kid trying to, like, break the rules from your parents. Almost like, you know, sneaking around because.

I'm growing a life inside of me.

Wow. How did that make you feel?

Hiding felt horrible. You know, it felt like it should have been this moment that was celebrated, and I felt like so much was taken from me, you know, so many. You never get to have your first child again. So it was really challenging. And in that time, I decided to really shift My ask away from the financial aspect of it and what I asked for was maternal protections. And basically what that means in track and field is our contracts are performance based. And so the Olympics, the world championships, you go, you medal, it's a bonus, but you don't, it's a reduction. Now if you have a baby during that time or if you just had a baby, there's nothing in place to protect you. So essentially what was happening in the sport is that women were just. Their salary is being cut and cut and they were pushed out of the sport. And so I asked for time to be able to recover.

You asked Nike or you asked USA Track and Field?

I asked Nike because the sponsor is your, that's your main income. We don't get paid, you know, from our federation.

So you asked them in the contract. There wasn't a new contract yet. So you're still finishing?

Yeah, I'm asking for terms in that contract. Interesting that it be laid out maternal.

Protections, even, even the 70% less. You were like, give me the money.

Was just like, I could take the disrespect of that, but like, I felt like this is something that could change things, you know, this could change the culture.

Right.

So I focused on that. I asked for that and they told me yes. Like, I'm like, this is great. This is what I'm asking for.

That's cool, that's nice.

But when the contract came back, it. There was no legal terms that tied the time that they were willing to give me for other female athletes. They weren't ready to set that precedent.

So they're willing to do it for you, but not for all female athletes.

So they wanted to take it on a case by case basis.

Interesting. Okay.

For me, that just, I couldn't, I couldn't accept that. Like, I felt like, you know, we need to change this for all women, for all female athletes. And I think also because this went over such a long period of time, I ended up having my daughter and I had, I had a very traumatic birth experience. I gave birth to her two months early. And I think all of that just like having a daughter and thinking about like her life and what she's going to go through, and that just made me feel like I can't accept this. And so I made the decision to write a New York Times op ed and to speak out about what was happening for me. And also other teammates of mine had done the same. And yeah, we pushed for change. And after that op ed came out, it was about two weeks, a little over two weeks later that they ended up changing their policy.

So Nike did.

Nike did, yeah. So I had parted ways.

So you had already parted ways.

For me, it was, you know, but for the women that, you know, were there and came after, it's amazing. And Today they offer 18 months of protection. So, yeah, it was great.

You know, so they were trying to. They were trying to. It sounds like they were trying to do it for you, but they weren't ready to do it for everyone yet.

Yeah.

Until you kind of pushed through in this message and the platform and speaking out, and then more women started to.

Yeah.

Get on board with that as well, which is amazing.

Yeah. So it was terrifying.

Congratulations, though. It was scary, you know, because it's your livelihood. It's your. Yeah.

And it's Nike. Like, you know, you don't want to upset them. Yeah. And so for me, I didn't know what was on the other side of that. Like, I. I was terrified. I knew I still wanted to compete. I wasn't sure what was next. So it was a really difficult time. I was, you know, obviously grateful. I wish it wasn't such a fight to get to that point, but grateful for. For that outcome. But that. That's what happened before my final Olympics.

Wow. And so how were you able to bring in an income after that if they weren't sponsoring you anymore? What did you do?

So after that, I had this meeting with Athleta. They're owned by Gap, and just. I kind of didn't think anything of it. I was like, you know, at this point, I'm just, you know, I believe in what I'm doing, but I'm not sure if I'm going to have another sponsor. And so our missions just really aligned. They're. They're a female company, female led. And I was like, oh, this is feeling really great. And so we partner together, and they're my apparel sponsor. And that was amazing. It felt really empowering because I saw just a different way to do business, but I didn't have a footwear sponsor. So at this point, you know, I'm training for the Olympics, and I don't have shoes to wear in the Olympics. And for me, I think I was just. Just upset and just tired. You know, I'm having this conversation with my brother, who's my manager, and. But I'm speaking to him as just like, my big brother. And I'm like, I am so just tired of begging companies to see my worth and value. Like, I can't believe I'm at this place in my career. And I don't feel like I'm seen. Like, I don't feel like anybody believes in me in that aspect. And so he was like, I think that we should just do this ourselves. And I'm like, like, do what? Like. Like. Like create shoes. Like, how does that work? Like, it's. And the more that I sat with what he was saying, I'm like, no, you're right. Like, we. We could do this ourselves. Like, here is our opportunity. Instead of begging somebody else to create the change, like, we could be the ones to create it. And so that's what we did.

What year was this?

So this is. At this point, this is 2021. 2020. When we're having, like, these, like, a.

Year before the Olympics. Yeah, we're right in the middle of the pandemic, too.

Exactly. Which is crazy to think of forming a company, a shoe company, during a pandemic with, you know, the supply chain issues and all. Just all of the things. But I think the thing about it was that, yeah, shoes, but also purpose. Like, this is about women deserving better. And if we have to be the ones to go there, then we have to do that. And what we thought we were doing was just making shoes that I could wear in the Olympics. Like, that's what our understanding of it was. And maybe other women would want to wear those shoes, too. But what we learned as we went down this research and, you know, this new industry is that shoes haven't been made for women. Tennis shoes. So a tennis shoe is made off of a lass, which is just a mold of a foot, and it's been the mold of a man's foot to make women's sneakers. And when I learned that, I was like, no, we cannot be an afterthought. And I think it took me time to even really, like, understand that concept, because, you know, you go into a shoe store and, you know, we've all been in a footlocker, and you see there's, like, a women's. A wall, right? There's like, men's and women's. Or we've been to the women's department. Like, we've seen shoes for women, right? And, like, it took breaking down, understanding that that's just marketing. Like, it's the exact same shoe. Like, they might throw some pink on it.

Right. Smaller.

Yeah, even. It's not even proportionally small. Like, it's. And there are differences, significant differences between a man's and a woman's foot. And so just understanding that and you Know, being able to run with that, it was like, okay, we're. We're doing this.

So you. You built the shoe for the Olympics was kind of like the first stage. Right. It's like, how do I build it so I can have my own shoe and be able to tell the story? But then launching a company and building something beyond that, that's. That's a lot of work, though.

It's a lot of work.

How did you. How have you navigated this?

Yeah.

And how can people get involved?

Yeah. I think the first thing is not. We didn't know how much work it was going to be, and I think there's a beauty to that.

You know, had we known just launch a shoe company. Yeah.

You know, Nike did it.

Let's just say we can do this.

But it's been challenging, you know, for sure. But I think knowing why we're doing it, you know, that we see women and we want to be different. Like, we have a maternity returns policy, which, when a woman becomes pregnant, her shoe size often changes, and that change in size oftentimes is permanent. And so in our company, if you have that happen to you, we'll give you a new pair of your shoes, of our shoes and your size. And so just saying, like, we want to push the industry. We want to do things differently. Obviously, we're making shoes specifically for women to fit the form of a female foot. But our purpose, we believe, is much deeper than that. It's to say that we see women and that we want to do more. We're all about community. That's a huge. It's just as important as the shoes that we create, you know, bringing women together and learning for them. And so I think the way that we can. People can get involved is to support. Buy our shoes. To me, it's a signifier that, like, I stand with women and I want. I'm a change maker, and I'm about this and be a part of our community. And we just. We want to push things. We want to push the industry and really say that women deserve better in. In all aspects.

I love that. I'm gonna. What's the. How can we go buy a pair?

Yeah, so it's seish.coms a y s h dot com.

I'm getting four today from my. My mom, my two sisters, and my girlfriend. So I'm gonna. I'm gonna make sure.

Yeah, I appreciate the support.

I'm gonna make sure to get those today for you. Something you mentioned there a minute ago about owning your worth now As a five time Olympian, Is that right? Five times. How many gold medals have you won?

Seven.

So a five time Olympian, seven time gold medalist, but more medals beyond that, World Championships. How did you lose sight in owning your own worth after accomplishing so much? Not even the accomplishments, but just the daily efforts you put in, which I think a lot of people forget. Like you have put in so much daily effort to get those results. Whether you got the results or not, you still put in the effort.

Yeah.

Which is meaningful. And I'm curious, how did you learn to remember your own self worth when you started to lose it? And for women watching who are thinking, if Allison Felix lost her self worth with all these accomplishments, I have no chance of gaining my self worth with all the struggles that I might be facing. What advice would you have to women who maybe don't believe in themselves, that don't feel like they have worth, or people aren't giving them what they feel like they're worth? How can we learn to own our worth no matter what anyone else does or says?

Yeah, for me, I think I was losing it because I was listening to what the world was telling me. Like when Nike offered me the 70% less, I think I got to this place where I was like, well, maybe that is what I'm worth. You know, maybe it is beyond me. Maybe I'm not capable. I start feeding into like these criticisms and I'm not listening and remembering, you know, what I've done, like you said, what I've put in. I'm starting to get distracted by other people talking who don't know me, who don't know my work ethic and all of those things. And I start listening to it. But I think more than anything, it's believing that my identity is a track runner. It's believing that all I have to offer is running fast. And I think when I start pulling myself away from that and I start saying my value is in being a mother. My value is being a daughter or friend or a partner. That's where I feel most fulfilled. And so I'm absolutely worth. I have so much worth apart from what I do. And I think we have to break down those barriers of our thought process. And what, you know, I think constantly, you know, you talk to people and the first question is like, what do you do? But it's like, that's not who I am. And for me, it was coming back to who am I? You know, because I'm not just what I do.

Wow. The thing that I'm hearing you say is you're talking about thought process and who to listen to. And it sounds like you were listening to the wrong people, which went back to the beginning of your career where you started to build a circle of people that believed in you and that spoke into your vision positive way. But somehow along the way, you started to hearing the outside world and the noises and the criticisms of others.

Yeah.

So which goes back to thought process in your circle.

Yeah.

The people you keep closest.

That would be my encouragement for other women is like, it's your circle, it's your tribe, it's your people who, who speak into you, who pour into you, who build you up. Like, you know, you want to have those people on your team and you want to be able to do that for them as well. You want to be able to celebrate, you know each other and uplift each other. And so to me, that's like, that's the game changer when you can have people you rely on.

I think you're in a great example to show people and for people to hear and listen this, that even if you reach the top of the world in something, if of an identity, of whatever event that you're in in life, you can still fall susceptible to criticism and voices. And how hard is it to keep a positive thought process for yourself even when you're at the top? How hard was it for you?

I think it's difficult. I think also in the moments that you think are going to be everything and at the ultimate top and the goal that you always had doesn't necessarily feel like what you thought, at least in my experience. For example, my third Olympics, I finally win the 200 meters. So I got this to. This is London in 2012. So those first two Olympics, you know, silver medals, I get to that third Olympics, and I'm like, okay, I've done it. Like, I finally put it together. I get that gold medal. And I remember feeling. I think the emotion I felt more than anything was relief. It was like, okay, that weight is off of my shoulders. Like, I finally did the thing that I, you know, that I hadn't done yet. And obviously, like, I'm happy, I'm joyful and all of that, but I had built it up to be so much that I just didn't live up. I thought my life was going to just be, like, completely different. I remember coming home from London and, you know, amazing, cool things are happening, but pretty much like everything is the same.

Like, after two months of press and the tour and people celebrating you, people move on.

You move on to the next thing and you're with yourself. And I think that I, you know, took time to unpack, but that was the moment where I really understood, like, it's about so much more than the track stuff. Like, there's got to be more to it than that. And so I think in the moments where you have everything, you know, it's that there's more purpose there, you know, that there's a bigger reason for it.

That's so interesting you say this. I'm going to, you know, relate in a much lower level than you because I didn't win a Olympic gold medal. But when I. When I heard my. When I was at the national championships in the decathlon, I was telling you this earlier and I. The last race, the second day, the cathlon, is at 1500, I was exhausted. Exhausted. I did not want to run. And I was not a distance guy. I was like, put me in 100, and that's about as much as I want to go. And I knew my coach said, you've got to. You can't let these guys beat you, these certain guys. And you can't let these guys beat you by this much, this many seconds. So you kind of got to, like, know where you're going to be. And I got to see, can I ever break my pr Like, I need to get this time. And I remember crossing and it was pretty tight. And she goes, I don't know. Like, it's tight because I was in ninth place, okay. Going into the final event and the top eight is the All Americans. And so I'm just sitting there for about 15 minutes as they're calculating all the numbers before they get the podium up and they start calling everything. And I knew that if my name was not called first because it went from eighth to first, I wasn't going to make it.

Yeah.

And thankfully my name was called right away. So I was like, oh, like this weight, this relief.

Yeah.

Because it was like training for so long to try to create this goal to happen. But here was the funny thing. I was happy. But late that night at dinner, I started to get like this. I don't know if it was an expectation hangover. I don't know if I was supposed to feel something different, but I almost kind of got a little mad and angry and had a little bit of an attitude energetically because I think I was supposed to feel something else and I didn't feel it now. This was a dream I had my entire life at that point as a 22 year old. To be, you know, go to the national championships and be an all American. For some reason, I thought, like, all my relationships would be better with my parents when they were there, when they were struggling, and I thought things were just gonna be fine, and it wasn't.

Yeah, I. I've been there. Right? Yeah. And to me, the crazy thing is, like, when it was the disappointment, I felt that, you know, that I felt like that was a devastating feeling. But when it was the success, it didn't feel as I thought it should feel. And I think, you know, every person is different, but I think oftentimes people who have success feel that way, you know, and you have to unpack what that is for you. And for me, it's like, it's the journey also, you know, it's this process. Like, that's where the magic happens, like, along the way. And I was able to kind of look back and say, like, oh, wow. Like, I've had this amazing road to get to this process. And that's where I. I became, like, the person that I wanted to be. Like, that was the beautiful part of it. Like, this is just the end result. But I think there's something about embracing those ups and downs, and for me, the silver medals along the way that, you know, that's a huge part of it.

Oh, man. Silver is.

It's hard to.

Yeah, silver is hard to talk about because there's so many people in the world that would dream to have a silver medal.

I get it. Yeah.

To go. To just go to the Olympics and win a silver medal is, like, unheard of for the most of the world.

Absolutely.

But when you're the best, a silver is probably one of the most devastating things. I'd rather get a bronze and a silver.

That's what everyone feels. Yeah.

Rather get third place and know, oh, I had a lot more training to do, or they were just way better.

Than they always say. If you look at the metal stand, like, the silver position is always like the frowning most unhappy, you know, because the bronze is, like, really happy, honestly, the gold. But, yeah, that silver is. It's.

You got it twice. Back to back, back to back. Oh, man. That's like a knife that just. Oh, the emotional wound.

Yeah. We're talking about hundreds of us, you know, like, oh, no. How do you improve that?

Gosh, it makes me want to throw up. And you're. It's like eight years of your life for two silver medals, essentially. How did you, after the second one, compose yourself and. And go back into the process and not Think about the result.

It was really hard not to think about that result. That, like, definitely, even to this day, like, when I see pictures from Beijing, like, it takes me back to a very not great place. But I think just pulling myself out of that, you know, was hard. I had to allow myself to feel.

It all, to grieve, to be angry.

This wasn't what I wanted to be. Like, I did. It was a disappointment. Like, feel all. Like, all those emotions are valid. But then once, like, I make the decision to take on the new goal, then it's like committing to that and saying, like, I'm gonna show up and give this all. And I think I also had to come to a place where maybe it wasn't gonna come together, you know, maybe that wasn't for me. I'm glad it was, but.

Yeah, it feels good to get that monkey off your back.

Yeah. But I think you have to have the acceptance that, like, success doesn't always mean the gold medal. You know, like, you can do a lot of work along the way, and you can be successful without having the thing that is typically defined as the ultimate.

I'm so glad you're saying this. And again, there's people going to be saying, well, yeah, but you got the gold medal. So it's easy for you to say this fair. However, I was telling you off camera that for nine years I was playing with the USA national team for team handball, and the dream was to go to the Olympics, and I haven't qualified for it yet. I'm not saying I'm not going to, but it hasn't happened.

Yeah.

And even though in nine years we didn't qualify for the Olympics, I have got to live experiences and meet people and travel the world and play against Olympic teams at the highest level and train and get hurt and get better and all these different things that happened to me. Even though the dream didn't come true, it was still a dream come true. Yeah.

I love.

And I get chills just thinking about, like, I pursued it. I was on the pursuit for almost a decade of something that I dreamt about that I felt like was calling me forth to go after this thing. And it has been a beautiful journey. Now there is still sadness that I haven't qualified for the Olympics. There's still some letdown emotions. There's still some bruises and pain that I've had to experience. However, I wouldn't trade it for anything. It's been incredible, the journey and who I became in the journey. So, you know, there's only one Champion in the Olympics or in sports. There's only, like, so many people who are number one at that thing for that season. It doesn't mean you can't become number one in your life in the pursuit of that thing.

Absolutely. And I think sometimes the dream isn't what you imagine. That doesn't mean that it's not fulfilling. It doesn't mean that you're not on the path that you should be. And I think that's true in so many different aspects of life. Like, we might set out to do this thing, but maybe that's not the thing that's for us. Maybe it's this thing over here, and you don't find that out without, you know, starting off on one path and you end up where you're supposed to be. And, you know, even in my life, in my career, like, yes, it was amazing to win a gold medal. Like, do I think that's my absolute purpose? No. Like, I think I'm living it now. Like, I think it's advocating for women. I think it's having impact. Like, those are the things that, to me, will leave a greater legacy and impact than, you know, just the gold medal.

Yeah. You talked about your circle of coaches and mentors and team that you had for the last, really, 25 years. Who is the most influential person during that time throughout the whole journey that really taught you valuable lessons that you still live with today after your track and field career. Such.

I mean, there's. I feel like there's so many people who poured into me and, you know, everyone from my coach, Bobby, to his wife, Jackie Joyner Kersey. She's been to.

Oh, man. St. Louis.

Yeah.

Yeah. I lived in St. Louis for a.

While, so an incredible mentor who just, like, made it real for me. Like, obviously, she's this, like, iconic athlete, but, like, the best person who just. When I got that second silver medal in Beijing, just like, constantly checking on me. Like, are you good? Are you okay? Like, like, that has been incredible. I think my. Obviously, my family has just been huge in this, but my brother is someone who, like, specifically sticks out. You know, we work together. He's my big brother. Like, he's a hero to me, but I think about, like, all the hard parts of my career. He's been that constant, and he's challenged me and he's encouraged me. He's. When I was going through the whole Nike thing, like, he empowered me. Even in starting. We started Sash together, and just him feeling like, you know, why wouldn't I be able to do this, you know, And I feel like we all need that person in our life who's gonna, like, speak into us and challenge us to do the thing that we might be scared to do, but that we're supposed to do. So. Yeah.

What's the thing you love about your brother the most?

Gosh, I think his. The way he sees the world, like, it's a very beautiful way. Like, he sees the positives. He's, like, very much a visionary in the way that, for me, I think I'm, like, the opposite. I'm, like. I see all the negativity and, like, oh, well, all the obstacles that could get in our way. And, like, he sees this beautiful, like, end result. And I think that's what, like, we work really well together because we complement each other well with those things. But I love just the way that he sees the world and that he sees people.

That's beautiful. I'm curious about. I'm a huge fan of Mindset. I've been studying it for a long time, from my athletic days, but also just in the business world. And everyone that I've interviewed here for the last 10 years, the last 1400 episodes, I've been fascinated by people at the top of their game, like yourself, who have been consistent with it for years. I'm curious, in your experience, what was the greater fear for you to overcome? Was it the fear of failure, the fear of success, or the fear of other people's opinions about you?

That's a heavy one. I think it would be the fear of failure. I think the fear of, like, dedicating my life to something and not reaching that point. And I think along with that also comes the fear of, like, what other people think, the embarrassment. Like, I think it goes hand in hand, but for sure, those were probably the things that stick out.

Were you never afraid of success?

No. Success was never. I don't know. I don't know if it's because I never really let my mind, like, go there or that's not really the metals. Never, like, the physical metal. Like, that wasn't really what it was about. It was like, can I do this thing? Like, can I accomplish it? And I. I guess I never really thought too much of what would happen when. If it happened, it was more so, like, if it doesn't happen. Weight of all of that.

Yeah. Who was the. The athlete that you either trained with or against or, you know, men's and women's team in the world in track and field that you felt, like, had the most incredible mindset like just the eye of the tiger killer mindset. Every time you'd see them on the track, maybe you. You trained with them, competed against them or watched them, men and women. Who was it in the last 20 years that was the ultimate competitor, mentally?

I mean, for me, it's Kobe Bryant, like, outside of my sport. Like, you know, I've just, ever since I had the pleasure of meeting him, just the ultimate mindset, you know, and just even trying to like, break that down a bit. And just the way that he approached and loved the game of basketball, to me, that just fascinated me. Like, there was something just so pure about the pursuit of that and the pursuit of only kind of accepting this greatness and that excellence and just bringing that to every single time he touched the basketball.

Yeah, he was incredible. What about track and field? Who is the athlete that you.

The athlete that in track and field.

That you got to watch or witness or you're. Or maybe it was just one performance where you were just like, you witnessed an energy before race, during and after that was like, unbelievable.

I competed a lot against Veronica Campbell Brown in my race like that. When I got those two silver medals, she got gold. But I always just had a really great respect for her. I felt like the way she approached it, like, always bringing her a game and in return, I felt like it pulled more out of me. And so to me, there was always just a mutual respect there and of. Of the craft and of how you approach, like, the sport. Like, that's something that I could really appreciate and that I. That you didn't always see.

Sure. And what about on the men's side?

The men. I mean, obviously I. I think the way that Usain ran, like, there was always something that was like, that I just couldn't grasp because, like, there's obviously like just the talent level alone was.

Blows you away because would they race first and then you guys run afterwards.

Or it's a flip flop sometimes. But I've been.

If you're doing the 200, it's right after each other, right?

Yeah, yeah, usually, I mean, but I've been in the stadium, you know, some other times when he was competing and I wasn't. And you know, just to be able to like, witness the things that he did. I think the thing that always stuck out to me is like, it seems so effortless. Like, it was such a different experience than myself because I was like, I gotta be like, dialed in, in the zone. Like, one thing can't go wrong and like, you know, he's having fun he's.

Just bumping people right before the blocks. He's hanging out, he's falling over himself.

He'S got hands are up before, you know, way before the finish line. So I just, to me, I was always fascinated by like how he was so great and did it so effortlessly and had so much fun. Like, I just, yeah, it just really was interesting to me.

Did you ever ask him or get to connect with him on his philosophy or just his mindset?

I think he was having fun, you know, I mean, I don't want to speak for him, but yeah, we, you know, came into the sport at the same time and competed against each other. I mean, not against each other, but at the same time for a very long time. And I think that's what stuck out to me is like, that's who he is. Like, he's genuinely just like being himself and showing up in that way. And it was a really cool thing to be able to see.

That's amazing. What's the vision for you now again, after this, you know, 20 year inspiring career, accomplishing so many different things, now you've got this, this women's shoe brand that you're. Which is more than that, it's a bigger purpose and a community behind that. You're a mom. What is the, what is the mission and the purpose you have for your identity in your life moving forward?

Yeah, to me now it's, it's about impact. Like, that's, to me, impact is success. Now it's really shifted away from these performance things, of course. Like, I want my company to be successful, obviously, but I think deeper than that, I want it to have impact. Like, I want it to change things for people. And to me, if I can, if that can be successful, if people can feel something different, if they can feel seen, that's what I want it to be about. And so moving forward, I think that's really where my focus is.

Why do you think people struggle with being seen?

I think that's just hard in this world. You know, as a woman, there are so many hardships. You know, whether it's you're doing the same job as a man and you don't feel seen, you're not making the same amount of money, you don't feel seen, you're having a baby and you have to hide it because you don't feel like your worth is going to be seen. So I think that there's all these different ways that comes out. And for me, like, I've been able to talk to so many women When I wrote that op ed, there was just a pouring out from people who had their own stories. And to me that was encouraging in one aspect, but heartbreaking that so many people aren't being seen, you know, aren't being able to show up as their full selves. And I think that was just the eye opening experience that like there's, there's more work to be done here.

Yeah, it's beautiful. I've got a few final questions for you before I ask them. Is there anything we can do to be of service to you today besides making sure we support the brand, buying some shoes, getting the message out, how else can we support and serve you?

I think celebrating women, you know, celebrating other women for me, like that's something that I really enjoy now, coming from a sports background of like a feeling that there could only be one and there's so much competition now. I like to uplift other people, you know, and I think that's something that in our circles we can all do, you know, we can support the women in our lives who aren't feeling seen. That can be a small act of just, you know, an encouragement or it can be something bigger, you know, and amplifying someone's story. So I think that's something we all can do every day.

Yeah, that's beautiful. S a ysh.com is where we can go. We'll have that all linked up for you guys to get some shoes and support there. This is a question I ask everyone at the end called the three truths question. It's a hypothetical scenario, but I would like for you to imagine for a moment that you get to live as long as you want in this life. But then it's your last day. You get to accomplish, be, do, create whatever you want to create from here, moving forward. But for whatever reason, in this hypothetical scenario, you've got to take everything with you that you've shared with the world. So this conversation is no longer here. Every interview done is gone. Anything you write is no longer around hypothetical. But you get to leave behind three truths. Three lessons that you've learned from all of your experiences up until now, but then for the many years that you're going to live, and that's all we have to remember you by are these three lessons. What would be those three truths for you?

I think I would say you are enough. I would leave that embracing failure is a part of your success. You know, I think that's been a theme throughout my life. And you have purpose. You know, we, we have a bigger purpose. And why we're in the spaces that we are.

I love those. Those are beautiful. I would acknowledge you, Allison, for being purpose, you know, not. Not letting your past identity be your purpose today, but being a generous human being, being kind, being giving, being thoughtful, being a great mother, a great friend, being creative, using your gifts in other ways than your physical talents. So I really acknowledge you for being purpose, which doesn't have to be tied to an athletic talent. And before I ask the final question, when I had Kobe on, he gave an answer to this question, which I thought was really powerful. And he talked about greatness being the impact you make on other people. You mentioned impact as equaling success. He said greatness is about impacting the person next to you by essentially being a good person and then them impacting someone next to them and just being in that ripple effect. And I. I see you doing that in so many ways over the last 20 years, but also doing it in another way now, through your brand, through your message, through the community that you're building in a different way. So I really acknowledge you for the gifts you're bringing, these unique gifts you bring beyond your athletic talents. I appreciate that as a human. Yeah, it's encouraging, of course. And I'm curious for you, what is your definition of greatness?

I think my definition of greatness is pursuing the process. You know, I think it looks so many different ways because we all have different journeys. And I think that when you honor how you get there, when you honor the things that you go through, I think that's a part of the greatness, you know, And I think doing more of embracing that and more of accepting the different definitions of, like, what greatness is for you, you know, it doesn't have to just look like one simple way. You know, I think there's so much greatness all around us, and for me, it always comes back and to that journey and to the path that you're on.

Stories is what moves the world. Whether it's an inspirational story, it's an informational one. Nothing in this world moves without story. You know, from the political world, sports world, Nothing that we have moves without story. And so I think that is the root of everything.