“Scarcity is an Illusion!” Big Sean’s SECRET to Becoming a Money Magnet

You could really be a magnet for whatever it is you're after in life, and that includes money isn't off the table. So one of the things that I had to adopt is that there's enough money for everyone to go around. You don't have to look at it as like a you're in a desert and there's like a glass of water and you have to, you know, it's not like that. I don't quit.

Big Sean has gone from rapping on the streets of Detroit to selling out stadiums.

Multi-platinum artist.

Big Sean in the building. Big Sean. How did you learn to trust in the universe that you would manifest something when there's nothing happening for years.

You can't trust everything you see, but you can trust everything you feel. If you feel it, if you trust it, then you also have to let it out in the world and know that it's gonna happen at the right time. You just gotta prepare for it. One of the cycles I broke in my family is the illusion of scarcity. It really is an illusion. I had to, over time, just make an agreement with God that I always have all that I need, period.

I love this man. Our mutual friend, Mike Posner, I was just FaceTiming him and I said, Tell me something about Big Sean that most people don't know. He said there was like a six month window where it was dark for you. Yeah, it's pretty dark.

That's right.

And then he saw you maybe six months later and you were glowing. What was that for you? Do you know what-- yeah, I'll tell.

You what it is. It's two things.

Hey there, Lewis Howes here, and I am so excited about today's episode. We have Big Sean, but it's Big Sean like you've never seen or heard from him before because he dives deep on the emotional side of going from a scarcity mindset to an abundance mindset. He talks about the differences on how to navigate and manage fame, success, and extreme wealth and opportunities. How to create healthy boundaries in your life. and really he talks about the relationship with money and setting goals in a completely different way. I am so excited. If you're a fan of Big Sean, make sure to like this video, click subscribe to our channel as well, and leave a comment on the biggest thing you learned from this episode because there are so many golden nuggets. I couldn't stop taking notes and taking mental insights around what I was learning from the lessons from having nothing to where he is at today and everything in between. Also, if you've been struggling around creating financial abundance in your life, I've got a brand new book called Make Money Easy, and it's all about creating financial freedom and peace in your life around money. So if that's something you want to unlock in 2025 and beyond, make sure to click the link below in the top of the description to pre-order your copy. And again, I'm so excited about this episode. to one and only Big Sean. Welcome back, everyone, to the School of Greatness. Very excited about our guest. We have the inspiring Big Sean in the house. My man.

What's up, bro?

So excited that you're here.

A couple Midwest kids.

Midwest, it's too bad you're from that state up north, but it's okay.

But Detroit doesn't feel like Michigan to me, though.

Detroit is its own thing. Well, trust me, bro. Go Blue. Okay.

It's too bad. It's all right. This year, it's happening. We're coming back this year. I know. You know, I have had one of my best shows of my life was at Ohio State. Let's go.

It was.

It was. Even though I am die hard, go blue, I did perform at Ohio State and it was turnt. Why was it one of the best shows ever?

Was it like a spiritual vibe or what?

Well, it was spiritual, I guess, in that sense. But it was just turned up. It was like wild, like chaotic. Chaotic. They know how to really party. They go hard, man. They do.

It's not much else to do in the Midwest, though. You go hard when you love someone coming to your town.

You're like, ah, I got a little screaming for you. Yeah, I know. But, man, I'm happy to be here, man. This is, I've seen a lot of great episodes and congratulations on, I know it's been like 13 years. Yeah, thanks, brother. Thanks, man.

You are multi-platinum artist over 185 million records sold is what you just told me. That is insane.

Yeah, how many records sold that is.

I know. And you have this new book out that I'm fascinated by because I wouldn't think of you writing this type of book. If I just heard some of your earlier music, I wouldn't be thinking that you'd be writing this book called Go Higher: Five Practices for Purpose, Success, and inner peace, which I want to dive into. But there's a quote that you talk about in the book on page 24 that says, I visualized being on a cliff. My higher self was saying to me that there was an invisible bridge in front of me that was going to take me to the other side. It took a lot of faith to walk over that bridge, but that's what I did. It took four years, but during that time, I never lost faith and I kept writing. So when my next shot came around, I was ready and I had a ton of songs. I was asking the universe at that time to provide me with the people who could help me get to where I needed to be, as well as people who I could find a way to help as well. I wanted it to be mutually beneficial. This is powerful, and I wanted to start here because the thing you say is, I visualized being on a cliff. I visualized, and this is a time where you had gotten signed But nothing was happening for years.

It happens to so many artists like this.

So you're excited. Something is big. I just got signed. I'm gonna make it big. The next thing I do, it's gonna happen. But four years essentially, nothing's happening.

Right.

And I'm curious, how did you learn to trust in the universe that you would manifest something when there's nothing happening for years? How did you continue to trust the invisible bridge that would take you from where you are to where you wanna be.

Well, you can't trust everything you see, but you can trust everything you feel. You feel me? So it's one of those things where I didn't know how it was gonna happen. And I think that's one of the things we don't have to worry about all the time is the how. I think we get racked up on those details of like, how is it gonna happen? How? But if you feel it, if you trust it, then you also have to let it out in the world and know that it's gonna happen at the right time. You just gotta prepare for it. So that's kind of like was always my mentality. And even like in my early music, like I do make like a lot of fun music, party music, but I always have a sense of like my essence and my spirit in some of those songs too. Like, you know, even songs like Bounce Back or even one of my first songs was I'm gonna make a million and one dollars. It was like still like manifestation, but it's like, yeah, it was like I was applying it to like my stuff, you know, but I also was just like having fun with it. But I think that's important too, to have fun with it. I was blessed to have like all of these guardian angels, like my mom and, you know, a lot of my friends and just like, I feel like, I feel like God and the universe and all of these things that you, if you believe in it, they talk through other people or through instances or a song you hear and, you know, I'm really, One of the first books that really taught me to pay attention to the omens was the Alchemist. And it's like, you gotta pay attention to the signs and the omens. And when you are grateful for that, when you entertain it, when you get more energy to it, you act like a magnet. You know, you magnetize it to yourself. So it's like, that is, you know, just how I think. And I think that however we think is the truth. You know, there is no right or wrong way to do things. There's no right or one of the, biggest misconceptions. It's like, I don't know how to meditate. You know, it's like, there really is no right or wrong way. It's really just about you believing in it.

Absolutely. We were. I was just talking about before we jumped on our mutual friend Mike posner. I was just FaceTiming him, and I said, tell me something about Big Sean that most people don't know. And he said.

And he said, he said he has a real huge heart.

Exactly. Yeah, he said. He said you changed his life and you're the one who brought him into spirituality and God. He said he wasn't into God or spirituality until- He wasn't actually. He wasn't. No, he wasn't. Until you. And he said there were a couple of moments that you brought him this. And it was the moment when after years of you being signed but nothing was happening, he said there was like a six month window where it was dark for you. It was pretty dark.

That's right.

And he thought, I don't know what's gonna happen with this guy. And then he saw you maybe six months later and you were glowing. And he said, I want whatever this guy has. What does he have? What is he doing? What is the thing that he did to transform from going to the darkness and into this glowing energy? And what was that for you? Do you know what?

Yeah, I'll tell you what it is. It's two things. You gotta realize that everything isn't together. So what I mean by that, everything isn't singular. So what I mean is that because things weren't working out for me, that doesn't have anything to do with my happiness. Because my dream was taken longer to happen because things weren't going my way. At first, I was letting it dictate my life. I was letting it, like, tear me down and be depressed over it, you know, and be like, and then you realize that, yo, hold up, this is my choice to be happy. And then I realized that, okay, if I choose that, I'm operating at a different level of just consciousness. So that's how I'm gonna get this. I'm not gonna attract nothing I want by being depressed or down because things aren't going my way. Bro, life moves on.

How did you learn? How to separate them when most people, they have a bad day, they have a bad month, a bad year, it dictates their happiness, their joy and their peace. How did you separate things not working out for you to it not affecting you emotionally and your joy?

It does. So it does affect me emotionally, but I don't let it overtake me. You know, like when Mike Posner was talking about he would see me and it was dark for me. that's because I would let something affect me and I would hold on to it and I would be blaming that for next week. I'm still blaming that the week after, I'm still blaming it three months later, oh it's because of that, you know? And it's like, I still go through all of these, you know, life can be like hurtful. It could be like getting punched in the face, you know what I'm saying? And, but the thing is, I don't let it linger. I still might be hurt about something. I still may be disappointed, but It's like, that's the point of it. It's like it teaches you something. You always learn something from these situations and you come out and realize that, okay, that was just a moment. Now I'm on to the next moment. You go ahead. It's like when you look at the greatest people in a category, all right? So let's pick like Denzel Washington, right? So, or Will Smith or whoever. It's like, say they have a awesome movie and it does well, say they have a bad movie and it flops, they're not gonna be like, I quit. It's over for me. They're gonna be like, all right, we on to the next one. What's the next thing? You know? And I think that we have to remember that life is just full of all these amazing moments. And when you look back on it, you'll see the beauty in everything.

Yeah.

You know?

Absolutely.

Yeah.

Do you think you can manifest your dreams from a depressed state energetically?

Can you manifest your dreams from a depressed state? It depends on if the depression fuels you or if it cripples you. You know, just like stress, there's you stress, which is a motivating stress, and then there's distress, which is the stress that makes everything harder. And, you know, so I feel like you can feel, you can use your, you can use any aspect of life as an opportunity. to get to where you got to go, you know what I mean? So I'm sure there has been times where depression has fueled someone. I'm sure there's been times where depression has led someone to the end of their life, you know, obviously, and like so on and so forth and everything in between. So I do think depression can fuel you. Fuel you. It just depends if you're aware that like, okay, you know, my thing about when you feeling bad or have anxiety or depression, to me, it's an awesome indicator that you're just not aligned with what you're supposed to be doing right now. So it could be an indication that, hey, I'm meant for something greater. I'm meant for something more. I'm meant for something better, as opposed to, like, life sucks.

Yes.

You know what I mean? Yeah.

Or it's also, we were talking off camera about how if you're feeling depressed or if you're feeling overwhelmed, you may need to look to where you need to create boundaries in your life. because when you are giving your energy to so many people without the boundary, it's gonna make you feel like you don't have anything left to give.

That B word.

Boundaries, baby.

That B word.

When did you learn about boundaries in your life? Did you ever feel like you were a people pleaser growing up or when you started kind of in your career feeling like you had to do everything for everyone?

Yes. They make you feel like that.

Really?

Yeah. You know, my dad who's in here, he's like a real nice guy.

Nice guy.

And he's a real nice guy, but he knows that he's let a lot of people walk all over him in a sense. Really? Not in a bad way. That's just his kind natural spirit. He has a kind heart. And I have a kind heart in a similar way. And one of the biggest lessons that I learned literally this year for me, and I have a song on my last album called boundaries was setting boundaries because it's uncomfortable sometimes to speak up and say what it is you need, you know, because it may go against your like, what you've been through already, it may go against like, oh, that's not necessarily right or wrong. And you realize that right or wrong is kind of more so opinionated in a lot of cases, especially when it comes to the feelings, you know what I mean? So for me, setting boundaries has definitely created a lot of rifts between me and like, especially people I grew up with.

Really?

Yeah. Because you, it's, it's harder to, live offsetting boundaries when you've established a relationship already with someone. So it's like when you come and say boundaries, it's kind of like they looking at you different. It's like, yo, what's up with you?

Yeah, you're changing. Who are you? Yeah.

And so, yeah, it has been quite a thing, but the people who are meant to be there respect you and understand you and know your heart, and they know that you're doing this out of necessity and that that's the way it has to be.

What'S the hardest boundary you've had to set for yourself this year?

The hardest boundary I've had to set for myself is the boundary of not being overwhelmed, having to say, like, yo, I can't do that. Or, like, I'll take on as much as I can and then be like, I need. I like, hold up. I need to. I need time for this. Or if I get back from a trip, I know I'm supposed to do this, or I have to get some rest, you know? that's wise, man.

Even with this interview, we were supposed to do it, I think, on Halloween.

For whatever reason, was scheduled then. I had to set a boundary because my son is two year, was, was one years old turning two at the time, and, and I had to take him trigger treating, man.

Absolutely. And I respect, I wasn't, like, mad about it, but it's like the people, when you set a boundary, you know, people can either be offended or they can understand it. Yeah. You know, I understood it. I was like, yeah, of course. I was excited to do it, but.

I, oh, we're gonna reschedule. It'll happen when it's supposed to happen. Yeah. and that's a. Yeah. And that's, man, that's an important lesson right there. It'll happen when it's supposed to happen.

If it's supposed to, it'll happen, you know?

And we get caught up in a lot of things not happening on our time. And I know a lot of people say God's time and Cairo versus Chronos, I believe. But it's like, I think that there are a lot of things that I want to accomplish in my life that I haven't gotten to yet, you know, that, like, But it's not that, it's not like nothing to be like, they're mad about her, depressed about her, or like thinking that, you know, my life has no value, you know, even if I hadn't sold one record or anything, you know, even if I was still just, I would still be doing music even if it was just one of my passions. Really? You know what I mean? Just like how I watch anime, I don't get paid to do that, but I take real time and I be watching anime because it's a passion of mine. Yeah. You know, so, I don't think that, you know, when things don't happen on your time, that it's necessarily like the end of the world because it always happens at the time when you need it as opposed to when you want it. And sometimes what we want and what we need isn't always at the same time. Sometimes it is and sometimes it's not. And it's kind of hard to see, you always see things in 2020 hindsight. But, you know, it's hard as you're going through it. And that is one of the biggest lessons I learned this year. I'm still learning, still applying along with setting boundaries, along with the balancing, you know, life and, and just like realizing that I am in control of how I feel, you know, for sure.

No matter what you're creating or what's happening, you're in control of how you feel. Speaking of our guy, Posner, I'm sure he's gonna get a few shout outs here. He said that early on when you guys were in your teens.

Yeah.

Back in Detroit that there was a group called Finally Famous.

Yes.

That it was like five or seven dudes.

It was like probably like 11.

11 dudes. 11 of you guys just kind of hanging out, making music in the basement or people's garages or whatever and rooms.

Yeah, it was me and Mike Posner and Jay John, say it ain't tone, Brandon, Earl Mack, Earl Mack, A-Dub, Key Wayne, Key Wayne. Pat Piff. And I'm sure, like, suckers, it's a pride, I'm probably, you know, guys coming in. It's kind of like naming every member of the Wiz Khalifa.

But he said that, you know, all those names that you mentioned, a lot of them have successful careers, mostly because of you, in some way, shape or form. And Mike Posner said that you were the one that welcomed him in the group. He came later and you launched a lot of people in some way down the line to having some type of success in their life through your influence. And I liked the first quote that I talked about. You were searching for people in your life that could add value to you, but also where you could add value to them.

Absolutely.

And it sounds like from what he said, this group you guys were always talking about manifesting, like, here's the dream we want with our music.

Yeah.

Your first album was called the same thing as the group, right?

That's right.

Isn't that interesting that you manifested and you created the thing that you were always creating from that group.

Yeah, I had to. It was a representation of a lot more than just like a first album. It was like my life up until that point. And yeah, I empowered a lot of my people around me, like my friend Lawrence, who just did directed his first movie, and he did a lot of my videos, you know, like, I don't f*** with your video. And me and Janae's I Know in 2088 and all these great videos. and he's also my son's Godfather. He did a video from a song about my son as well. He's into movies now, or, like, he Wayne, who was in the group, is like a, like a All-Star Mega producer, you know, produced for not just me, but Beyonce and Drake and Jasmine Sullivan, all these amazing artists. And then, yeah, so, you know, the list goes on, but it was. It means a lot. And, you know, Mike Posner being one of those guys, we used to make music in his basement with his parents, you know, there. And his dad ended up getting brain cancer and died pretty, like, it was a very, like, quick thing relatively. And I remember when I had Coachella and I brought him out at my Coachella performance. and we, I felt the energy of his dad. I felt his, the spirit of his dad, because it was such a, his dad has such a warm, welcoming Spirit, almost like Angelic already while he was alive. And just him and his mom, you know, his dad and his, his mom both. So it was really a, it was a full circle moment.

Yeah.

To be on that stage together like that. And it was, like, one of the biggest shows of my career.

Really?

Yeah. It was, like, a huge crowd. It was like me and Harry Styles had, like, this split Coachella literally evenly at that moment while we were performing. It was amazing. It was amazing. Spiritual experience.

I love that.

Yeah.

Coachella and Ohio State, spiritual experience. You know, there's another great quote that I saw this, you know, as you started to kind of build your career in chapter eight of your book called Hitting a Wall. And the five strategies are accepting, strategizing, trying, trusting, and manifesting. But at the start of this chapter, I think you share a story that everyone needs to hear because most people don't know what it's like being on top or accomplishing all of their wildest dreams. And you say the most depressed I ever got was in 2017. Until then, the worst period was when I got signed and then nothing happened for me for more than a year. But this time, everything was happening for me, so I found it incredibly confusing that I was so unhappy. You said, I was rich and famous. My career was going great and I was on tour. I had everything I ever wanted, essentially. But nothing ever felt like enough. And you talk about the pain of this situation. And I think there's a great quote by Jim Carrey. I've always wanted to interview him, so I love this quote where he's like, I hope, I wish everyone would get rich and famous and realize it's not the key to happiness. Kind of paraphrasing it. Yeah. But you were that. You would accomplish kind of like, you got a lot of things. A lot of things. You got a lot of things.

You were doing music with everyone.

Yeah, that's right. We sold 100 million, you know, records by then.

You were crushing it.

Yep. But you weren't happy.

Yes.

Why? And then part two, everyone thinks they're gonna be happy and fulfilled when they become rich and famous. Mm-.

But that didn't seem like it's the case. Well, you gotta remember that, like I said earlier in this interview, everything is separate and you don't realize that. so you think that things come with other things. So you're thinking that because you have money or because, you know, you live in Beverly Hills and, you know, you got all these things that the happiness equates to that. Now, I'm not saying I'm not about to be one of these people that has, you know, that has made money and be like, oh, money doesn't buy you happiness. Money is an amazing resource and it can make you happy temporarily. what I mean by that is it's a dopamine hit. So it's like, yeah, getting money is awesome, and it can make you happy. But you realize that there's a lot of other things in life that has to deal with, you know, to deal with. That's why you see, you know, that's, you look at people who committed suicide, who were on top of the world, you know, from Chester to, you know, people who OD to, you know, it's like, you can't be the, you think you're like the lead singer of Nirvana or something, and then you commit suicide or, you know, Lincoln Park or all the anybody or let me just not even use them as an example. I'm sure there are tons of people, right, who are in that type of, have reached a wild level of success and choose to end their life. Right. So you realize that those things are not the same thing. Now, that doesn't mean that you shouldn't, like, if you want money, you shouldn't go after getting money. I think that's important. If that's like something that your heart desires, I know I wanted to, and I probably really didn't understand if somebody who has made millions of dollars say, oh, money isn't everything. It's like, mother, it is everything. Like, it'll change my whole situation. Yeah, but my, what, what I realized in that situation for me personally is that that had nothing to do with how I felt. and it's because one, I was abusing, I feel like I was abusing Adderall at the time. And Adderall, you know, they don't tell you that, but it's really synthetic heroin and all sorts of craziness. It's just a lot to that, a lot of layers to that, right? So I was taking that type of stuff. I was not taking care of myself physically. you know, I was super skinny at the time, too. I was, like, malnourished. I was high a lot, you know, I was drunk sometimes. A lot of times. Not all the time, but, like, a very occasional Drinker. Not just like I wasn't drinking every night, but, like, every time there was a function, you know, I would abuse it. Not abuse it, but I would. indulge in it.

Sure.

So all of those things add up and they have a long-term effect on your brain. They have a long-term effect on the dopamine your brain creates that leads to your creativity, leads to your happiness, at least to your living a, you know, your mind. My dad said on my album Dark Sky Paradise, your mind can be a trickster, and it'll make you really believe that you aren't that you aren't meant to live. You know, it'll make you really feel like you're not who you are.

Really?

You know what I mean?

Sure.

And so at that point in my life, I was confused. I had put my. I had my head down and was working, working, working so much that I had to be on Adderall, working so much that I had to go from one thing to the next thing to the next thing to the next thing without doing satisfying myself. first by like doing what makes me happy. You know, like I let go of all of my passions that I love. I let go of no free time. It's like, this is the time to get money. You know, we come from a place like Ohio, right, or Detroit, or like, you know, the Midwest in general, where when you get an opportunity, it's like, you gotta take advantage of it. You gotta keep your foot on their neck. You gotta like keep your foot on the gas. Like, you don't let up. Like, don't let the opportunity pass. And you kind of take that idea and it's implanted in you. and it's one of those things that you just, like, move forward with, right? And you take it with you, and you're like, I gotta do this. I gotta do that. I gotta do that. I gotta do that. Or else I'm gonna fall off and.

And go back to be irrelevant or something. Yeah, whatever.

Or just go back to living with, you know, it's like you create these stories. Like, I'm gonna go back to living where I grew up at, right? Like, for me, I grew up in. I grew up in the hood, and, like, I remember when I was. analyzed it. I'm gonna go back to the point where I analyze, like, yeah, what if everything didn't work out and I moved back to the hood? I was happy there, too. Like, I figure it out still. Like, you know what I mean? So I'm not scared of that. Like, you can't let anything. You can't live a fear-based life for sure, you know? So point being is that, you know, when I. When I realized that all of those things weren't separate, I knew I had to make a change, and I just quit doing everything. you know, I quit, I like canceled everything I had to do, canceled everything that I had coming up. And I was like, I gotta figure out why I feel like this.

Interesting.

And it took a long time and somehow the universe was blessing me. Still, like, I never like was really low on money or low, like the universe was providing its means for me to figure it out. and that's how I knew it was in alignment with what I needed to do.

Wow. You know, it's hard to say no to money sometimes and big opportunities, though, right?

It is.

Got this artist or this person or this TV show that wants to do something with you and you say no.

Yeah.

But that's a lot of power, too.

It is a lot of power. And, yeah, because you're not coming from a place of scarcity. You know, your. Your character, your person comes first. you got to know the order of operations, you know what I'm saying? And you're at the top of that. So, yeah, it's great. You know, there are times where my team looked at me like, yo, you passed up on this amount of money because you were, I was like, yeah, I was exhausted and I was this and I had to be here for my son and I had to do that and more will come. I believe in that. I really truly do. And it does.

Yes.

So you have to have that faith in yourself. You have to have that. invisible bridge below you and know that you're gonna walk across it and get to the other side. You're not gonna fall flat on your face.

Did you ever have a scarcity mindset? And if so, how did you learn to switch it into an abundance mindset?

Yes, I really feel like that. I talk about that on a song I have called Break the Cycle with Charlie Wilson, produced by my boy Leon Thomas. And I say, like, one of the cycles I broke in my family is the illusion of scarcity. 'Cause it really is an illusion. And you could be like, no one can't, you know, I'm not, I didn't have any type of advantage coming into the world, you know, necessarily. Like, I didn't have, like, any padding financially. I didn't have anything. Like, I did have a grandma who worked real hard who was a female Black captain in World War II, and then she was a, one of the first female cops in Detroit, and then a teacher and a counselor was an historical woman. and she did all these amazing things and she worked her off to give us a great, you know, the best life that she could provide her and my granddad. But we still financially had a lot of troubles, you know? So I think it was something that a lot of us get taught early, like, oh, money's hard to come by. That's a concept that's not really true. Even the concept of, man, playing video games is a waste of your time is play a video game, making millions right now.

Bank.

Yeah, tens of millions, hundreds of millions of dollars. It's like that really in hindsight teaches you that just do what you love. There's a, there's a audience pool and a necessity for anything, especially if your heart is attached to it. So my thing is I had to over time just make an agreement with God that I'll never have to worry about that. That meaning, like, I'll always get provided with what I need. I'm as long as I'm operating from my heart and I'm of service, and that's what then, then that's, I always have all that I need, period.

I love this, man. Everything you're saying is resonating with me and there's so many questions I want to ask you about that. But before I do, in chapter four, again, we're talking about your book, Going Higher. This is a game changer. Make sure you guys get a copy. In chapter four, you talk about the fluidity of fortune and how you had to really unlearn some of these things about money. I'm curious then, how did you learn to reprogram your subconscious mind to manifest money more when you weren't taught those things early on?

Man, this. I have to give it up to Deepak Chopra because the seven spiritual laws of success.

Such a good book.

That. That actually was the first book that broke down money as an energy. And when I first, when I read it, I was like, what? And he was just saying, just like anything, like, you can attract it. It's magnetic. So you could really be a magnet for whatever it is you're after in life. And that includes money isn't off the table. and, you know, so one of the things that I had to adopt is that there's enough money for everyone to go around. You don't have to look at it as like a, you're in a desert and there's like a glass of water and you have to, you know, it's not like that. Money is getting printed every single day.

When did you learn this? How old were you?

Like, when I first read that book, I was 17, I believe. So that's when I was like, okay, I tried to, like, obviously I didn't have a dollar to my name, so. Yeah, I mean, besides the $20 I would get for allowance every week for doing chores and stuff.

And when did you first put it into practice? You learned this new concept. It was something completely new. Money's all around me, right?

I had to learn the concept from experience.

And how did you put it into practice where you said, oh, it's actually real what this means?

At first it was like, Hold on to your money. Hold on to it, right? It's like, that's like the thing. You get your money, hold on to it. And it's like, I remember when I got my first advanced check for $15,000. and I took my girlfriend to get ice cream and it went down to 14,970.

And I was like, oh, it's going away.

Yeah, it's like you felt it and like that, the reason that it felt like that is 'cause that's not in alignment with how it should be. You know, I really feel like that, like it feels good when you can like provide and like, you know, because you are, you are. You're like a vessel, man. And it's like, whatever you choose to activate. And by the way, my life now doesn't go exactly how I always wanted to go. I don't like. There are times where, like, things happen, and I'll be like, I did. This is not how I wanted this to go. This is not how I wanted it to happen. But then you just gotta move on, man, and just go to the next thing. But my point is, is when I started. When I started to implement that, was around the time, like I said, around 19 when I got my first advanced check. And then, like, every time that I was like, oh, wait, it's getting low, there's always an opportunity for something else to figure your way. And that's when you do right by yourself, and when you do right by everyone around you, and when you're empowering people, and when you're trying to just be who you are meant to be, the best you, it's like things, I promise you, is going, is going to happen for you.

So when you get money now and when you're, when money comes in and when money comes out, how does it feel for you emotionally when you receive and spend money?

Lately, I need to, I've told myself, like, I need to be a little more grateful for the money that does come in. I've kind of have gotten like, okay, cool. Used to, okay, this. Oh, we got that check. Okay, cool. Oh, that came in that. that deposit hit. And I don't, I told myself, like, I, by the way, I do affirmations every day. So it's like, I'm grateful as one of them. I'm thankful for my life and every aspect of it, like, but I do want to just put, I do want the God to know because I always like to think that God gives us everything we need, right? And, and like, and a lot of times what we want as well, especially when it aligns with what we need. And one of the things that I want is money, right? So, and then when it comes in, I shouldn't just pretend like it's supposed to be like that. I should really acknowledge it and be grateful for it more. So I've actually, and that kind of comes with just having a busy schedule. I'm still a new dad, in a sense. I'm still you know, a lot. I have a lot of hats as a person, and you kind of, like, lose the importance of a lot of things. So I've been. I've been meaning to, like, really Moment by Moment, be grateful. You know what I mean?

There's an amazing book called Happy Money by Ken Honda. I think you'll like it, where he says it's. It's about the Japanese art around money. And when I had him on the show, it really helped me fortify my. abundance mindset around money. And he said, when money comes to me, I don't care if it's a penny or a million dollars or anywhere in between. I say thank you to that money. Thank you to the dollar. Thank you to the twenty dollars. Thank you to the money I found in the streets. Thank you to the million dollar check. Thank you.

Yeah.

And I say thank you. Where do you want to go? And it says, where do you want to go now? Do you want to go to my bank account and sit there for a while? Do you want to go into the stock market? Do you want to go into this business deal? Do Should I give this to someone for free? Like, where do you want to go? And he says, and when we look at it as energy and as abundance, and we are appreciating it, it appreciates in value.

It does.

And we don't hold on to it, but we say, Where do you want to go?

'Cause I know more is coming to me. Oh, I'm gonna use that. Where do you want to go? It flows. It flows. Everything, man, that gave me goosebumps, man. 'Cause everything has a life to it. Even like making music, it's like, I sometimes, like when I'm on a beat, I ask myself, like, okay, what does this song want to be? Where does, you know, where does it want to go? What do you want me to say on it? And sometimes I'll get it then. And that should go for everything. And I do have a very diverse portfolio when it comes to finances and stuff. I do have stuff in the stock market, stuff in crypto, real estate. I invested in businesses that worked and didn't work. I made money off some.

What's the best investment you've ever made in your life?

Best investment I've ever made in my life. Currently, probably the return was probably Bitcoin, I ain't gonna lie. I also invested in Uber, which has kind of been a long play. I kind of got in a little bit late with Uber, but I think one day it's gonna pay off. But really the whole point of my portfolio is to pass on to my kid while I'm having one now or my kids, you know.

What's the best investment you've made in yourself?

Probably spending all my money on studio sessions growing up. That was probably the best investment yet because it was it trained me to like be in a studio, be on a mic, to write music, you know, and I've written music for like not just myself, but I've also written some stuff for other people. Like I've written stuff for Janae, I've written stuff for I remember I got to write with Anderson Paak and Bruno Mars and like some other people. Um, obviously for Ye as well, like, I've gotten a chance to like, be a writer in that sense, not just for myself and not like, I'm not saying I wrote like people's albums. I'm talking about just slightly contribute as a writer, investing in that just early on, you know, being 11 years old, 12 years old in the studio.

What's the best investment you can make in yourself today that you haven't spent the money on yet?

Time is the, most valuable currency that you can spend and you can't get back. You know, that's the biggest investment is to put time into something. You know, that is, you know, what you put time into is worth more than anything because it can bring you, you know, all of these things can be a byproduct of it, like money or happiness or you know, impacting someone's life, which is the main goal is to really impact someone else, you know, to be of service. And you let, you let the, the laws of the universe apply to you, you know, and it comes back to you in a way you may not expect. But I think that when we realize how interconnected we all are, when we realize how you take away the Singularity of a job, the Singularity of a house you live in, the singularity, and then you go within and you realize that not only are we all operating on the same system, we all are very much so alike. And everything that's alive, everything that's flowing in nature, every animal, everything, it's like we all come from this certain energy that we all are empowered from and we all are made from. It's like the, some people call it Prana, some people call it love, some people call it whatever it is you want to call it. We all, when you boil it down through all the layers, we all are interconnected. And you see it, you see it as examples, like for instance, when we're in traffic and everyone's moving at the same pace and like stops at the same time and this, and you see, it's like you see us, even during a pandemic, everyone's shut down. It's like you see how we all operate. When you take away all the layers, we all have to operate on the same. wavelength and it goes deeper than that. But, you know, invest, investing time to me is something that we all have right now. Some people have more time than others.

Yeah.

And that, that is probably the greatest investment.

You mentioned a little bit earlier about how when you had everything, but you.

Also felt, I don't want to say everything. Well, you were, I think I labeled it as everything, but I didn't have everything. It wasn't like Thanos with the rings on.

When you have, when you had, okay, when you had everything that probably your 18 year Sal had dreamed of.

Yeah, that's right.

And famous on tour, working with every big artist that you would, you know, you were looked up to, all that stuff.

1000% yeah.

All the money you could ever dream of, you know, it's like everything playing in front of sold out arenas and you weren't feeling good. You mentioned how you were doing, you know, drugs, alcohol, weed, things like this.

And people made it to seem regular, but yeah, go ahead, you know, that's not regular.

Where do you feel like your frequency was when you were doing drugs, alcohol, weed? versus when you're not doing that.

I don't really get, like, blasted anymore, so I'm trying to remember how that was my frequency. I was happy at the time. I was definitely happy, but I don't know. It's like. Like I said, it's not the same as, like, a high off a life feeling, you know? It's not the same. It's, like, synthetic. Yeah. Versus the real thing, you know?

I've never been drunk or high in my life.

Wow. Amazing.

And I played college football, so I was always at like the frat party type of stuff. And so I never knew what that's like to be drunk or high.

Yeah, it's kind of embarrassing, I'm not gonna lie.

But every time I'd go to the parties, everyone was like, I can't, you have to drink, you have to drink. It was like very forceful, like you have to drink. And I was like, I can get high on life.

I don't need this, or I can have a sprite or whatever, or just.

Like, some people may think that sounds cliche or corny or whatever, but I feel like it's the, the natural high of just, I love my life. I'm grateful to be here, all these different things. I could get to that space. So I never felt like I needed the alcohol or something to get there. So I don't know what it's like, but is the frequency different when you're high or drunk?

Well, let me tell you something. So I stopped drinking for like years and stuff. And like, so when I'm at an event and I see everyone drunk around me, it's so funny to see people high and drunk and you're like straight sober. yeah. And the frequency, obviously. Yes, obviously. It's tremendously different, but it just also is like, you don't need to be have you. It's like the frequency matches the environment, too. So it's like you may not have to be, like, at a high frequency when you're in the middle of a club and you just want to get drunk and, you know, it's. It's. I do think that, like. the long-term effects of, like, you know, I've had friends that was alcoholics. I've seen it ruin people's lives. I've seen it, like, ruin. I've seen people not be able to, you know, it affects a lot of things. It doesn't just affect your body physically. It. Alcohol affects your brain for, like, weeks after, months after, years after insane. Well, like, especially these pills and things like that.

So I would also say it affects your soul.

I think it affects your soul too. So yeah, I do think that 100%. I do think that the frequency is not the same as when you're like, for instance, sober and you're high, experiencing high of life, which I've experienced and that's can't beat that. You know why you can't beat it? Because you are the drug. It's not like you're taking something to feel the effects of it. It's like you are the source of it. So it's like you are creating the high.

Yes.

You know, and like you're in alignment with what is going on in the world. so it's like, you can't beat that.

Let's go.

You can't even buy that. You know what I'm saying?

You can't buy the other. Can't buy that.

And you have to tap into something.

Deeper to create it. Exactly.

You have to tap into that ultimate power within you to create it. Yeah. And, you know, when you say, like, you have to tap into it, I think people get a sense, like, it's a lot of work or it's, like, very hard. And I'm not saying it is or it isn't. It can be more work for everyone is different. Everyone's on their own path, but. It doesn't take much. It really just takes being real with yourself and finding out what works for you to be able to tap into the life that you deserve, that you can experience and really enjoy, you know? But it starts within. That's the point.

Enjoy.

Enjoy. Oh, you know what I'm saying?

I like that.

Yeah.

Do you smoke or drink a lot.

Right now or just? No, not at all.

Not at all.

Not at all.

No Adderall. No.

No.

No drug, no weed, Nathan. Why did you decide, you know, when you were making money and doing drugs and everything was working out, why did you decide now not to be on drugs or alcohol?

Well, I'm still making money. So that. That's a. That's another thing. Like, those have nothing to do with each other. You know what I'm saying? There are. There are people who are on all those type of things that are way richer than me, but that don't mean they're more successful than me. People tie all these things together. They'd be like, oh, because you got $150 million, do you think you're more successful than me? It's like, that has nothing to do with it. That's just a concept that we tie to that. You know, that just means you have more money than me. That's all that means, is that you have more money. That don't mean that like, you get to me holding my baby, that's like me going trick or treat with my son. That's success. Yeah. That's successful. that didn't cost me hardly anything. So it's like you, what is people tying everything together and you're going to be a victim of these conditional things, like thinking that money is success. Now, success brings, does bring money. Success also brings a lot of other things. Success can, can bring, but it's not that. And that's what I mean by, like, separating it all. you know what I mean? So I don't, I didn't, I didn't tie like, you know, I, I used to, I used to be like, oh, this is the reason why I'm successful is because I'm taking this Adderall, you know? Yeah. And then that's when I realized I had a problem when I would go to the studio and I couldn't do the studio without taking it. So that's when I, I had to check myself and be like, no, you know, like that, this don't, this isn't right. Like, this is, I'm, mirrors falling apart thinking, thinking that I don't have what it takes when I'm the one who got myself here. Yeah.

100.

Yeah.

Did you ever make agreements with God?

Yes. I talk about that in the book as well. I made agreements with God about one of the agreements I made is that, like, we talked about Financial. I don't want this to be, like, a big Financial episode, but one of the agreements I made is that, yeah, I always you know, well, when my son was born, I made an agreement to be the best dad I could be, you know? Another agreement was that when I'm pursuing, you know, my passion or my purpose or having my heart in the right place that I never have to worry. Like, I always have the means needed, you know, no matter what. That's an agreement I made. I'll never. I never have to worry about. about money or whatever it is, you know, that has to do deal with that. And there are some other ones that are, like, kind of a little more personal.

Sure. Yeah, no worries.

But, I mean, those are very personal, too, especially my son is as personal as it gets. But, yeah.

What was this moment like or moments like where you said, God, I'm gonna make an agreement with you. And did you hear anything in return?

I feel like God talks to you in a lot of ways. It's not always. where you hear it in that sense, sometimes you feel it and feeling it is like hearing it, you know, like goosebumps when you get goosebumps and, you know, whatever it is, you know, or something happens in synchronicity with that. There was one time in my life where I heard the voice of God, though, one time. And it wasn't when I was, like, meditating. It wasn't when I was like, you know, I've done, like, intense meditations, like, on top of mountains and, you know, or like, wasn't when I was like peaceful on a walk. It was when I was like, it was between, it was like late at night or early in the morning rather. And I heard, it's really so personal. I don't even even know if I want to share it all the way. I definitely heard the voice of God and it said something that resonated. It was a voice I never heard before that sounded so familiar. and it's giving me goosebumps, man. It was, like, very real. And I knew exactly what it was. It wasn't like, what? Like, I wasn't dreaming. I was very conscious, and I heard it twice, and he. And I had got a message, and then I was like, what? And then I got it again, and I. And it was very loving, but it was very. heavy, and it was very, like, present. It was very clear.

Wow.

I know.

Was it giving you wisdom or guidance or just kind of like an affirmation for you to remember something about yourself or.

Yeah, it was like, definitely. It was like, just per. It just was personal that related to me, you know, and it's something that I'll always remember and always apply and.

Is that when you said, I'm gonna make an agreement with you?

No, that was another time. So, no, when I said an agreement, you know, God is something you feel more so than something that is like, you see, even though this is all a testament to God, me, us being able to talk, communicate, it's all a miracle.

It's all a miracle.

It's all a miracle. You know, you realize that because, yeah, like we get so desensitized, so we're used to life. until we aren't here no more. You know, you got to remember. So one of the things having a kid taught me is, like, the sperm and the egg, you're. You're fighting impossible odds. It's like the odds are, like, a million times crazier than winning the mega millions that are billions. You know, it's like crazy astronomical eyes that you beat to get here, that you fight through, that you get to, and the. And then you're the one that makes it into this. into this egg, right? The one out of all these hundreds of billions of sperm and yeah, yeah, it's crazy. So you got to realize that on a level, we probably, we fought to be here. You, this is something, this is a privilege to be here for real. Not just saying that, trying to sound like positive. It's really a privilege to be in this, it's like for real. And you have to understand that, you know, we, we, we succumb ourselves and get used to this life, but it's miraculous every day. You see it. It's like you, we see the sun give life to all of these things. We see how everything works in such a system that if one thing was off, if the sun was a little bit closer, if the moon was a little bit closer, we wouldn't be able to survive if the temperature was a little different. If, you know, Earth could survive, but we couldn't survive. So you got to understand that we're here for a reason. If you're on Earth, you're here for a reason. It doesn't mean you're meant to be the president of the United States or whatever, because we think, oh, that's a reason worth living. No, your reason could be to impact somebody, your reason to be could be to enjoy the beauty of life. That's a reason and that's fine. You know what I'm saying? So, I know we got a little bit off topic, but I think one of the things that people should keep in perspective of like, yo, we here and we in it right now, right? We're lit right now, we're in it, you know?

Right, for sure. There's two things we were talking about. One, you heard God's voice a couple of times. When you heard God speak to you, did something in your life start to change? Did you do things differently? Did you make other agreements with yourself on how you're gonna live your life? Or did it just remind you about what you're supposed to do next?

Well, I really appreciate you bringing that up because you reminded, it's like I love getting reinforcement.

It's all synchronicities, man.

It is. I was meant to hear that, you know, today, because it's like, yeah, I gotta remember that. that what I was told that day, you know?

You don't have to tell me or us, but yeah.

Yeah.

But what was it?

It wasn't like the deepest thing. Yeah, yeah. Something personal. Something personal. Some stuff is personal. And some stuff is like, you know, you gotta like hold on to some stuff, share some stuff. 100%. Yeah.

But more like, what did it tell you without telling us what it said? But what, what did you feel you were meant to do with that information?

What I'm doing, not be quiet, not trying to be too cool. you know, share, share what I have to offer and be a, and be of service and, you know, have fun. Yeah. Also. Yeah. You know, that's, those are the things that I got from what I heard.

That's cool.

Yeah.

So when was this? This is years ago. It's.

No, this was like a year ago, probably. Yeah. As of recent. After your, after my son was born. Yeah. After he was born, which. That's a real miracle right there. No. Wow. having a kid or like, by the way, it's very, very, it's a lot more than you could. Do you have kids or no?

Not yet, but we're.

Oh, yeah. Okay.

Hopefully starting.

It's a lot more than you could imagine. My hats go off, especially to moms and mothers.

What's the best thing about being a dad for yourself?

I love being a dad. I'm a. I'm not just a father. I'm a dad, too, so I'd be like, baths. diapers, this, that, spending time playing. Like, I don't play about, like, when it comes to that with my son. Because, you know, one of the coolest things, like, having my dad around is I could talk to him in a different manner now. I kind of understand him differently. And there are times where I have other things to do, and I'll put things off that are important sometimes for my. For my son, you know? And I remember I said, man, it's crazy. He's one years old. He's not even gonna remember this. And my dad was like, yeah, his. His DNA is gonna remember it, though. That hit me like a lightning bolt. You know what I'm saying? It was like. Like, yeah, he may not con, like, his. He might not have a memory of it, but his DNA is gonna. Is so knowledgeable that he'll remember it. And not. And, like, your guys's Bond. is gonna, his, your bond is gonna outlive his memory. You know what I'm saying? Like, for as long as he remember, he's gonna have a bond with his days. It's not like you meet somebody and go on a date and it's like, oh, you're, you're great. Like, let's be friends or, you know, whatever. It's like, no, he's gonna, that's, that is like, you're setting up the building blocks. And that's when I was like, this is always productive. Wow.

Always productive. I was asking your dad beforehand when you left the room for a minute, I was like, what's the thing that you're inspired by the most about son.

Oh, what do you say?

And he said that you treat everyone as if they're special, whether they're someone or they're nobody. You treat everyone with kindness, respect, generosity, and you have a big heart and you want to serve people. And I thought that was really cool to have your dad say that about you. What's the thing that inspires you the most about your dad?

Oh, man. His heart. You know, I talked about it. he has such a. A giving heart. Such a. He's a. He has a pure, like, Soul to me. And he was just a caring. He did. He was caring. And, like, one of the things I vividly remember growing up is, like, our rise to school. I like how real he kept it with me. I like, like, just how, like, like, what? that's how I learned about like the birds and the bees with my dad. Like I just appreciated him like really just keeping it real with me and also like, you know, we would do like a word of the day sometimes on the way to school, you know? So he was a special guy and I feel like he, he like approached everything with love, you know? And I appreciated that.

I saw an interview online, I don't know who this was, but I saw a clip of an older man who had billions of dollars, successful entrepreneur. And someone asked him, like, what his definition of success was. He's probably in his 70s. And he said, my adult children wanted to hang out with me today.

That's success, right?

That was success for him.

Yeah. Not the B. Not the B he had in his account.

Exactly. But, like, that my adult kids wanted to spend time with me, not for my money, but they genuinely loved me and they wanted to hang out. and it sounds like, I don't, it seems that way. I just met you guys both recently, but it seems like, you know, you guys are hanging out together and it's.

Yeah, that's got to feel good for both of you, you know? It is.

And, you know, life is short, man. And a lot of people don't have good relationships with their parents and there's, you know, traumas and challenges.

So, and I'm not saying you guys have a perfect relationship, but it seems like, and to that, to that point, I do feel like we get, I believe this, you know, you argue with me all day. I do feel like we get to, we choose our parents coming into this world. so what that means is some people might be like, oh, I hate my mom. Like, I did not choose her for my mom. Right? Or, like, I hate my dad. Right? But my thing is, is like, it goes back to the concept. But God don't give you what you want. God gives you what you need. Like, say, if we here to progress our souls, if we're here to. To learn, you know, we don't know what it's like to learn on a soul level. That's something that the experiences can only teach you. And the person you're you're sculpted to be. That comes from experiences, right? So sometimes people learn from having great parents or whatever, or great role models in their life to be like them. And some, some people even learn better from not what to be. And some people realize later on the lessons that they are taught from dealing with things that they did not want to go through, you know, because it may switch a whole something around or it may inspire something or we never know what we never know really we can make these assumptions and plans and God gonna laugh at us because it's like it's never it's never as linear as we think it is all the time. Yeah.

On page 93 of your book, you say make three agreements with the universe. Write them down and sign your name underneath with the words, so be. it.

Yeah.

Why do you like that practice? And why. Why do you recommend people making three agreements with the universe?

Well, I just chose the number three because that's a good number to me. Like, you could do 10 if you want, or you could do one if you want. Or, you know, I just chose, like, three just to get your mind going. But I signed it at the bottom because to me, it's like a contract, you know? It's like, that's how I sign my business deals. I sign it at the bottom. I put the so be it there because that's like a declaration. That's like you like, that's like you activating it to me. You know, it's like you sign it and then you hit it with a so be it like, or it is, or it is done. Bro. To me, it's like, I don't want people to think that's like witchy or anything like that is not to me. To me, it's more like, it's more so like business. that's how business may be operating. They signing that signature right there.

They are, you know, so it's making it a stronger bond with energy, God, the universe with your destiny.

And that's how serious you're taking it. You're taking it serious enough to write it down, sign your name, letting know who it's from and. And solidifying it. So that's how I look at it.

Something I did in my early 20s was when I was broke, I was living on my sister's couch in. In Columbus, Ohio. and the Columbus Sea Bus, baby. The greatest performance of your life was in Columbus. I like that.

I don't know about the greatest one ever, but it was a good one.

It was a good one.

Yeah.

But I was at a dark phase for about a year and a half, and I was trying to figure out how to develop self-worth I was playing Arena football, and I was chasing the NFL dream. I got injured, and I was never good enough to make it. But I. I lived my dream in terms of getting paid 250 bucks a week to catch a football. and play in front of audiences. For me, that was like part of the dream as a kid. Got injured on my sister's couch for a year and a half, and I realized my ego was much bigger than my self-worth. And I thought I had things figured out, but I really had no skills besides catching a football. And I was actually a scared little boy inside. And I remember thinking of these things. I was like, what is the goal and the dream I wanna accomplish? I would write these things down. and I would create a certificate of achievement. I would write the goal down with the date I wanted to accomplish it, and I would sign it and frame it and hang it on my wall. And that gave me something to look at every single day. And I said, who's the man I need to become in order to accomplish this? I have low self-worth I'm in a lot of self-doubt and fears. I need to go conquer these fears and develop these skills to accomplish this dream. Has there ever been a time in your life where you felt low self-worth? so how did you learn to develop more worthiness for yourself?

Has there ever been a time you.

Had low self worth and that I.

Had low self worth? Yeah. Yeah, of course. I'm human, man. Like, I think we all go through those times where we kind of like doubt ourselves, question ourselves, like, yeah, like when you're, especially when you're after something and when you know you like, when you know you can do better, which is a lot of us. We know we feel like we can do better. We feel like we're made for more, or we get that confused. Well, maybe we don't know that, but we get confused of, like, feeling bad and wondering why you feel bad. It's like, if you realize that, like, you're an antenna and, like, you're like a. Like, it's like tuning the radio station. If it's off, you're gonna. You're not gonna get the message, so, like. those times are meant for you to just, like, fine tune yourself and get on the right frequency so you could really get to where you need to be. Right. The ego part that you were talking about, your ego is bigger than your self worth. To me, a lot of people say you need to kill your ego, blah, blah, blah. Right. To me, I feel like your ego is a part of you. You can't really kill a part of you. You got to work with your ego and you got to understand, like, be like, ego. yourself is all of these different things. You know, you're like a mental person, spiritual, emotional, physical. Then there's, like, the ego that's a part of it, right? And then there's, like, your heart that's a part of it, your gut. All these things I feel like are, like, the makings of, like, it's like the team of you that lives in this one being your soul, right? I feel like you can't just let your ego be in the driver's seat all the time. There are times where it needs to be in the driver's seat where it's like, oh, the cameras are on you. What you gonna do? That's times where it's like ego. Like, we about to, I'm never, you know, but, you know, but to me, as far as that goes, those are just the learning experiences that only life could teach you, man. You know, like, you go through those moments and they make you who you are. It's like you wouldn't be who you are if you didn't have that time where you slept on your sister's couch in Columbus. It's true, man. You know what I mean? and the willingness to want to do better, that's like, it's different if you were satisfied with that, if you were like, this is it. This is good. This is what life is. But you weren't. And I think that's something to really embrace is that willingness to want to do better. And I know it hurts to people out there. I know it hurts. It could be you could want to take your life over it. You know, you could want to like, just give up and be a terrible person to people. But I'm telling you, man, that's like, it's just all part of it. And nothing lasts forever. Even if things do last a long time, nothing lasts forever. So that's true. Embrace it. Let that be your fuel. Let it be your fire. You know, I can't give you the directions on how to be successful. I can only show you what has worked for me in some situations, or, you know, you can only tell us what has worked for you in some situations. and you apply it to yourself, but you do, I can 100% know that you got what it takes. I'm gonna look at every camera, you got what it takes, you got what it says, you got what it says, I promise you.

In your book, we're talking about Go Higher, which is a powerful book. You mentioned that some of the early books that you got into, the Four Agreements, the Secret, I got to interview Rhonda Byrne, the creator of the Secret, a couple of times. And it was really powerful. She talked about the law of attraction, manifestation, I'm curious, what is your formula for manifestation in the law of attraction for you? Is there a definition for you? Is there a code for you on how to manifest better?

There have been times where I've attempted to manifest things and it didn't happen. And there are times where it did happen. And then there are times where it happens at a time where I didn't expect it to happen. And then there are times where it's like, oh, I put that, you know, I let that go and it ended up coming to fruition. So everything is different. Um, but for me, what works is like just having clarity on it and being realistic with myself or embracing the unrealistic.

185 million records is kind of unrealistic to think about.

It's unrealistic, right? But it feels realistic to me though.

You made it real.

Yeah.

But if you're 18 and think, I'm gonna sell almost 200 million records, like, is that real? Is that realistic? It's kind of an unrealistic thought. It is like that time of life. But then I sold a hundred million.

Well, that's just because you may not be there that yet.

Yeah, exactly.

You know, we kind of sometimes that's kind of like where anxiety and depression comes from is that we try and like put ourselves forward in our story and then by the time you get there, you'd be like, oh, this is it. Like, it's like it's natural. Right? So it's like, and sometimes that anxiety and all of that, like looking forward to something, it can hold you back from just naturally being like, look, it's gonna happen when it happens. I'm gonna be ready. And, you know, everyone's situation is different. So that means it could be like, say you fail the bar exam five times. Like, it's like you're gonna, you're not gonna go your whole life failing the bar exam. You're gonna eventually get it because your preparation is going to meet the opportunity. As long as you are being aware, as long as you are being like, okay, this, that's probably where I messed up at. Let me really do my, you know, the time you put in is never wasted. Yeah. You feel what I'm saying? So.

Yeah, going back to posner, I I said, what else about big Sean that, that everything inspired you? And he said, during that time when he was glowing, he talked about a book called Ask and It Is Given.

That's one of the ones by Esther and Jerry Hicks, the teachers of Abraham. Shout out Esther and Jerry Hicks and Deepak and... What did that book, Ask.

And It Is Given, have to do.

With... Yeah, they're all great.

I love all those books. What did that book, though, teach you, or what did it say for you about your life? Ask and It Is Given.

Ask and It Is Given taught me to... Um, I guess it taught me to manifest things by putting yourself on the frequency of whatever it is you're desiring. You know, I don't, I don't remember what book taught me the, I try not to say want so much when it relates to the things that I really want in life because I don't like acknowledging the lack of so much. So I like, there's something out there.

That you want to create though.

Yeah. So I'll say I desire it. It's my desire. you know, I want it. It's like, I'll say I want sometimes, like, oh, I want some pizza. I want that. Things that I know are obtainable. But for sometimes when it's really one of those main goals, I don't like to say I want to be. I like to say, like, I can't wait until, like, I desire my, you know, it's one of them. I desire that. Or I don't know why this is a personal thing.

This is really interesting. You're saying this because I think a lot of people, I think we need to talk about this for a moment because words matter.

Words do matter.

And how you desire or want something puts you on a different frequency level.

It does.

How you speak the word.

It is the frequency for me. That's what it is.

So if you say, I'm lacking something, so therefore I want it. Based on how I'm interpreting you're saying this, you feel more separate from that thing that you want to create and draw closer to you.

Like an example is like, I want that new bands. And the example is like, man, it's gonna feel good when I get that new bands, man. Like, it's gonna feel. It's. It's like when I, like, it's gonna be like, man, I can't wait to rock. Like, it's like, you know, it. I don't even like using can either. Like, I'm excited about the new bands because it's mine.

And it's just a matter of when.

Yeah, it's a matter of when.

So it puts you into more of an abundance frequency versus scarcity or lack of reason.

So that's what. asking it is given. Taught me by Austin Jerry Hicks. It taught me to be on a, put yourself on a frequency and just see how life changes for you. You know, I can't guarantee everything you ever want will happen, but I can guarantee that it will. My life will change if you really practice putting yourself on that frequency and keeping yourself there as much as you can, because it's hard. It's a lot of work, man. And I don't do, like, life isn't meant to just be work every day. You know, these aren't. It's not Miss. You're not like, we're not in school all day long to, like, manifest our goals. It's like you have to find what works for you. Some people prefer therapy. Some people prefer yoga. Some people prefer meditation. Some people prefer writing things down. Some people prefer saying them out loud. Some people, it's like, you gotta find what really works for you and, like, see how it goes.

How do you balance taking action to create what you want versus attracting and allowing it to come to you?

I feel like you do always have to be proactive and you realize that, you know, I feel like you put your attention on your intention. You're proactive, meaning that you take action and then you also have to be able to let it go. gosh, it's so hard for people holding on to something. Holding on to it. It's like. It's like you gotta let it go and have that trust, you know? And you're in the middle of trust. You are in the middle of trust. So you have to trust yourself that that's your. Whatever your process is, you know?

-Huh yeah.

It's hard to trust, though.

Heck, yeah. If you want to create it now, and when you feel a lack, you feel separate, you're like, how do I.

Make it happen now? I know.

I know.

It can be hard. I don't agree with you because that's a concept that I don't want to, like, take on. I don't think that it's hard to trust.

I'm saying for some people, it's hard.

Yep. It is. It is. Yeah. For sure. It is. And it has been hard for me a lot of times in my life.

What's the thing that you've desired the most that took you the longest to attract or actualize or create in your life that you had to trust?

The longest definitely being I've started rapping when I was 11 years old so I didn't get a record deal till I was 19 ish 20 19 or 20. so that's probably the longest one but when it comes to like numbers and sales and stuff those that's all beautiful you know what I'm saying but that is just like it's so Momentary, moment, it's so moment. It's just that is what it is. So it's like you, that's something you can't control, meaning it's all the way. Yeah. And you can put your energy on it. You could put your intention and your attention, and it may go the way you want, it may do better, it may do worse, but that's something that's out of your control if of is how people consume your art. The real win is that you got to make it. The real win is that you got to create it. And that's then that's the win already.

And putting it out in the universe. Yeah.

So it's like all the other stuff is like sprinkles on top. It's awesome. It's great. Success can be like, I feel like that's a can be a part of someone's success is like achieving the goals that they wanted to achieve on a project. And but like I said, when that doesn't happen, which that's happened to me. There have been times where I've sold records on the album, not sold as many as I would like to, and so on and so forth. And it's just, you gotta just go, keep going and, and, and have fun with it, you know?

Yeah.

Yeah. Sometimes, like, sometimes you get to take things too serious, and it's like, you know, you realize that you already want by getting to do what you love to do 100. Like I said, if, like, when you look at anyone else, like, you think Will Smith gonna be down and out there? His movie didn't do as well as he wanted. Then the next one does amazing, and then the next one doesn't, and then the next one does. Like, these people, it's like we get to be, you know, you're a thin artist.

Yeah.

You know, like, every. Every Van Gogh wasn't the Van Gogh. You know what I mean? It's like every piece is like. that's, that's one thing. And that's the beauty of it. That's really the beauty of it, man.

You've got a whole chapter in your book about therapy. I'm curious, what is the thing that therapy taught you the most? And what is the healing that you've created for yourself that has given you the most peace and freedom?

Therapy was just a way of being able to communicate things. You know, therapy has a way of being able to communicate. things that you wouldn't normally talk about, things that you wouldn't normally touch on with a friend or family member necessarily, or may not be as deep in that sense, you know? So to me, therapy was just a great way to unpack certain things. And, you know, communication. I said this before, like, communication is the bridge to Salvation that God is holding our hand to walk across. And just like any Bridge, you can't skip a step to get to the other side. So it's like, when you are in therapy, you is really uncovering so many amazing and hurtful and emotional things about yourself. But it really helps so many aspects of your life, man. It really can help you unpack things. It can help you. It can help you let go of things. It could help you forgive someone that you've been holding on to. And that stuff is like, it takes up real estate in your mind, body and soul, you know, and that may could be holding you back from something, really, truthfully. There are a lot of things that I've had to clear in my life, you know, I feel like therapy. Yeah, there are a lot of, like, mindsets, a lot of Concepts that I used to believe that I had to communicate and realize that that is not the truth. And, you know, I learned from one of my mentors a while ago, Christie Sheldon. I haven't talked to her in years, but one of the things she used to do is like when you have a concept of something that you've been applying in your life, she would say, whatever, whatever, whatever it is, delete, destroy, uncreate and transmute across all time, space, dimension and realities. It is done.

Like, wow.

Done. It's over with. It's behind you now. and sometimes you have to say it like more than once, but yeah, like I definitely, there were so many, I don't even, I can't even remember because I've gone, I'm over- Removed him. Yeah, removed it. But there have been times where I've had to say that multiple times in my life and that I still do to this day as well. Like if there's something that is like striking me and like I have to delete, destroy, uncreate and transmute that across all time space dimension and realities.

Wow. that's powerful, man. That's a good kind of, like, Mantra to reinforce with yourself. What would you say is the biggest mental block that you've had to let go of to create more abundance in your life?

I deserve it. That's one of the things. It's like you're thinking you're not worthy, like you said, to create more abundance and to create more whatever it is you're after in life. You can. I guess abundance is a good word to label whatever it is you're after. is to empower yourself and know you do deserve it, you know? And that may, like, that's one of the things that, like, therapy, that's one of the things that, for me, meditating or just like, or just reminding myself who I am, you know, I'm not better than anyone, but I deserve whatever it is I desire. that's just, that's a fact. That's really a fact, you know what I mean? So once you get rid of those concepts and of thinking you, you know, how can you be unhappy you don't have something when you don't think you deserve it?

How do people who feel very anxious, depressed, stressed out, overwhelmed, life's just not going their way, going through a breakup, going through trauma, they feel like everything is against them. How do they learn that everything is actually in their favor and that they are deserving of abundance?

Yeah, that's kind of what this whole book is like. Not the whole book, but that's kind of like what I try. It's. It's. It's. First of all, I gotta acknowledge that you're not alone. We've all have been there. We've all have been there where the world was against us and one bad thing happens after another and you're like, well, I guess I'm not meant to be doing this or I guess this is like, you know, where you, it's brought you to tears or brought you, you know, and the best part about those moments is it teaches you something new about yourself, but it also is temporary. Then you could use that for fuel to your fire. and also you have to make a switch in your mind. You have to realize what you're creating. Everything is a reflection of you. So what are you, you know, instead.

Of blaming everyone else, how are you manifesting it?

Yeah. Instead of pointing that finger when you realize it's three fingers pointing back at you, you gotta realize that, okay, I let me, let me change. If I'm not happy with how things are going. Let me change. Let me. Let me realize that I'm the source and let me change what I'm doing and see if that effect and see how that changes it. You know, you're not gonna get. You're not gonna get what you desire by, like, being, like, up. Yeah. Or, like, being angry at the world or all these things, like. I'm not saying you can't take that anger. There's infinite possibilities. You can't take that and let that fuel you, but if it hasn't been working for you, then yeah, you gotta change up. You gotta change up your mentality because your mentality is everything. It really is. It's the beginning of everything. Faith and then the mentality, you know?

Yeah, that's kind of like what Posner said. It's like you were kind of down and out for a while or in more of like a lower state, and then all of a sudden he sees you a few months later and you're glowing. so you change something within you.

Yeah.

You didn't take a pill and make you feel better. You changed something within you. You transformed the way you think, and then you created from a space of joy and possibilities and freedom.

Have you ever read that book, the Secrets of the Hidden Secrets of. I've read it, and I can't remember the name of it. It's like talking about speaking to water positively and speaking to water differently. And, you know, you look at the water down to the crystal levels because they're like, and you see that, like, it'll be like a beautiful snowflake when you're speaking to water positively, and then it'll be like, oh, like, deformed looking crazy thing when you're, like, saying, like, you suck. You don't deserve this, like, this and that, as opposed to, like, you're worthy. I love you. It's, you know, instead of. And you see the difference of how in water, right? And you realize that we're, like, 70, 80% water. and you realize how important it is to speak these things onto yourself and to say them out loud. It has an effect. What that book taught me is not only is that like, people could be like, oh, that's woo woo. That's like an opinion. No, that's scientific research that the way you use what you say, what you put out in the world literally has an effect on your, the world around you.

100. And I think your inner words also, even if you don't speak it out, but you're thinking it also has the effect. You're just thinking, I suck. I'm nobody, but you're not saying it. It's still gonna impact you.

Yeah, it is. Because that's your subconscious. And to me, your subconscious mind is like the secret to. That's like one of the secrets to manifesting is really because your subconscious mind can't tell what is like. real and what isn't. So, meaning, like, you might be like, oh, I don't know if it's gonna work, but let me just do it. And then you'll be like, I am this. I am that. I am that. The fact that you took the time out to acknowledge that your brain is going to believe anything it tells you. So even if you're like, oh, I, like, you know what I'm saying? You're subconscious. Gonna be like, oh, okay. It's like you have to treat your subconscious mind like it's the. your best gullible friend in the world.

100%.

So you feed it, you give it all of the nutrition so it could be the healthiest possible. You know what I'm saying?

In your book, you have a couple questions for people. And the question is, what are you avoiding in your life? Is it possible that this thing might serve you in your development? What's the best thing that could happen from it? Curious for you, Sean, what are you avoiding in your life right now? What's the thing you're avoiding the most right now? that when you address it, it's going to really help you unlock that next level of abundance and freedom.

You know what? That's something I might have to take with me and think about. That's a great question. I think that I kind of need to take time out a little more to live my life all the way. What I mean by that is like, go, like, whatever it is, whatever I feel, I feel like I have to really accept that I deserve that and that I have the means to do it. And like, you know, I can't say like, oh, I should, I'm held back by this or that. So that's one thing. There are a few things on my list that I know that, that are kind of personal.

Sure, sure.

Yeah, yeah. But I appreciate it.

Reflect on it.

I appreciate you because that is that is something that that is something that I I'm going to actually I hope somebody wrote that down out there because.

Well, you got it in your book.

Yeah, I should have brought my journal to take notes. Really? I love that you do that.

Yeah, of course. What do you need to make peace with? These are questions that you have in your book for us, which I think are powerful. You're a deep, wise human being, and I appreciate how you challenge anyone who's getting this book again, get the book, go higher, but one of the questions is, what do you need to make peace with?

Oh, that was a question in my book.

It's your book. Yeah.

Which, by the way, the answer I gave is just that some of this stuff is personal, so I just don't want to say it on camera. It's not like I didn't have it. Like, I know what the thing is.

100%.

So what was the next one you said?

What do you make peace with? Yeah.

I'll give an example of something that I, need to make peace with is there's a friend at home that was one of my best friends growing up that hurt me in a sense of overstepping boundaries, try to do business with them, trying to put them in things. And, you know, I don't want to get too many details because I don't like embarrassing people, but that's one of the things that I need to make peace with in a sense of knowing how to move forward with that, but also letting go of that, letting go of that hurt.

Not holding on to it.

Yeah, not letting me apply what our situation was to other situations, you know, of like maybe being a little bit having a reservation of doing certain business with people because of that situation. And that has nothing to do with that. you know, I have to practice that rule of separation that I've been talking about of like, that has nothing to do with that.

What's the next three steps you need to make after this conversation to support you in getting to a peace with that conflict?

Well, one of the next three steps is one, I have to take time out to actually address these things and respect that, you know, a lot of times if we're not making money, or doing things we think that it doesn't matter.

Wasting our time or whatever.

Yeah, it doesn't think that it deserves that much time. So I have to realize that I need to take time. I need to take responsibility. I need to be confident in my decision. That's one of the things that I lacked my whole life was confidence in my decisions. I had confidence as a person, but being confident in my decision doesn't matter what the outcome is. The confidence in the decision is already a win, you know, because that is the quality of man, and that is the quality that I want to pass on to my future generations. That's something I want to see in my son and his son. and his daughter, my daughter, whoever, you know, so. That's beautiful, man.

I'm gonna. I'm gonna follow up with you in a couple weeks and see how you're doing.

I would love to.

We gotta do, like, a part two of this. I'm down, man. I'm down, man. I've got a few final questions for you. I don't want to respect your time. What's the thing you are most proud of that most people don't know about you? We know you've got, you know, multi-platinum 185 million records. You know, you've collaborated with every big artist in the world. You're, you know. a superstar. But what's the thing that you're proud of? Most people don't know about you.

Well, besides making, like, the best kid ever in the world, that's one thing I'm for sure proud of. Another thing is being able to achieve something that a lot of people told me wasn't possible. you know, a lot of people and achieve it by not believing them. That's one of the things I'm most proud of because it's so easy to believe what someone says. But to bring it all the way back around, you have to believe what you feel always and, and not always believe what you see, but always believe what you feel. and that is the one thing I'm proud of that I've been able to do. When you, yeah, when you do think, like, you know, you get to collab with your favorite artists, people you consider the greatest, you know, from Yay to Jay to Eminem to Nas to Lil Wayne, you know, all my favorites that are alive still and have, like, plaques with them with their names on it, like, oh, you know, this me and Kanye song went seven times platinum. Oh, me and Jay's oh, me, Jay and Kanye's on five times. Oh, your song went this or you this or you, you know, going diamond and all these things. It's like something I'm really grateful for and proud of, but the, I'm not as proud of that as just like believing and like, you know, believing in myself that I could do it means more than the actual thing. Yeah. Does that make sense?

Of course, 100%. I mean, you've collaborated with some of the, you know, most iconic artists of our generation, and I'm sure you've learned incredible lessons from each one of them and have inspiring stories from each one of them.

Yeah.

But which one of those names really taught you something that would just blew you away of those artists that you got to work with, whether through interacting with them. seeing how they created art, just being in their presence, how they, you know, performed on stage, like, what was the lesson one of them taught you that really inspired you?

Kanye, for sure. He was the one who let me be a fly on the wall in the studio.

Really?

Yeah. Well, actually, there aren't a lot of people who would let a kid come up to them, rap for them, eventually, you know, sign them. build a bond with them, give them opportunity. It's not a lot of people who would do that. And that's just been, he did. He did. Yeah, for sure. And yeah, that's, that was, yeah, that's, that's, that's been awesome. Eminem too, really.

What was that like, being a Detroit kid?

Yeah, crazy.

And Eminem's the, the king.

Yeah, crazy.

In Detroit.

Crazy.

What was that like?

Well, one of the things I've been talking about this whole interview, the separation of. I learned that just because you're the biggest rapper of all time in the world doesn't mean that, like, you're taking it easy. It's like he's. His passion and his. Has nothing to do with his success. In a sense, it's a byproduct of his passion. But at the same time, like, he's in the studio every day. He's hungry. He's, like, trying to do his best, and he's like, has sold a trillion records. And, you know, I said it in another interview, like, he cares about rapping, like, how Goku care about fighting, you know? And I really learned that, that, that, that passion is its own Beast that has nothing to do with, you know, a lot of people be like, oh, you know, is this. I guess he taught me to just really go with how you feel. you know, that's what he feel like doing. Yeah.

I got, I got two final questions for you. I've got a dozen still on here, but I want to respect our time here. But I want people to get your book before I ask the final questions. It's called go higher. Five practices for purpose, success and inner peace. This is a game changer. And you wouldn't expect a lot of things you're going to read out of this from, from a guy like Big Sean, but it's extremely, extremely deep. wise, spiritual and profound. And I want to acknowledge you, Sean, for putting yourself out there like this. I know you do this in your art and your music, and there's undertones of this as well in your music.

Yeah.

But you really went all in on this book. And I think it's one of your greatest pieces of art because of the impact it will continue to have for generations and how it's truly feeding the soul for so many people. when they dive in and start consuming and capturing some of this. So I want to acknowledge you for taking the leap of faith to put this out there, to put your heart and soul into something like this, and to be willing to talk about all these concepts that I don't really hear a lot of artists like you talking about. I don't hear people talking about manifestation and setting a frequency and letting go of the past. You know, you hear about holding grudges and getting back at people and all these different things. or you're speaking about boundaries, learning about how to love yourself, self-worth therapy, recreating bonds with your parents, loving your child, being a great dad, being proud of being a father, being there for yourself, like all these things, it's just not typical conversation, I think, with that industry. And maybe I'm wrong, but that's what I think a lot of people might be thinking. So I want to acknowledge you for-.

Thank you so much.

-And using your heart again, what you said, using your heart to be of service. And I think that's the greatest gift that every person can, can give to the world is whatever's in their heart. Use it to be of service for others. And I acknowledge you for doing that with this book, my man.

Thank you so much, man.

Two final questions for you. I want people to go get the book, follow you on social media. Where else can we be of service to you today besides getting a couple copies of the book?

But I just, you know, I care about the product of what the book teaches you more than you getting it. Like, you can get it and pass it on to somebody or you know, and passing on to 10 different people, you know, I really love the. It's not about, like, the amount of the books, but, man, I just really appreciate those kind words you said. It's. Sometimes it is. Gets a little lonely walking the road I'm on, you know, but I gotta just keep it real with myself. So what I can say is that I'm very grateful, you know? of course, anything you hear from me, you can indulge in, you know, just be. Be the best you, man. Like, that's. That's the way you do it. You know, you go higher with whatever it is you got going on. This is a question I ask everyone at the end, these last two questions.

It's called the three truths. So it's a hypothetical scenario. All right. Imagine you get to live as long as you want to live on this Earth, but it's the last day. It could be a hundred, 200 years old, whatever it is. You get to live and you get to accomplish and manifest all your dreams from this moment till then. but you got to turn the lights off and go somewhere else. Your life is over. On this last day, you have to take all of your work with you. So no one has access to your music, your art, your book. This conversation is gone. Hypothetical. Okay. But you get to leave behind three final lessons. I call it three truths. And we would have access to these three lessons. What would those three truths be for you?

One is sounds very cliche, but you are the source of your happiness. Be happy. You don't have to chase it. It's already there. You just gotta choose it. Another is to have fun, see yourself and everyone else. Because everything that comes into your existence. It's just a reflection of you and vice versa. So see yourself in everyone because that will really create a lot for you. I promise.

100% man. Final question. What's your definition of greatness?

To me, it's the act of doing your best, right? So to me, the definition of greatness is like living at the highest frequency in every aspect, getting the most out of life. Whatever that means for you, you know, like getting the most out of it. It's that's that's greatness. Yeah.

I'm a big shot.

Hey, appreciate you. It's been a true pleasure, man. Yeah.

Powerful, man.

Thank you.

Thank you so much for being here. I hope you got some value from this episode as much as I did.

If you did.

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