Your Next 5 STEPS To Escape The Rat Race & BUILD WEALTH | Dave Ramsey & Lewis Howes

This could be the best thing that ever happened to you. There's a lot of good that comes out of this much pressure because it forces. It forces you to reset. Yeah, it forces you to rethink. I decided I was never going to be the victim of the things I can control when one of these things that I can't control come at me.

This video is brought to you by wealth front, and i'll tell you more about them in just a minute. Why is A time like this, a great time to make money?

Well, it's a great time to be introspective and to pivot and to do resets and to try stuff you never tried before.

Yeah.

Because you might as well, right? We're all sitting at home, we got to do something. I mean, we pivoted a whole bunch of product lines here at Ramsey and all kinds of things and we could throw all these offerings out there. Stuff that we might have messed around with split tests for a year or whatever, instead we just dumped it on the street, let's just try it. to see if we can help some people and give some people something to do while they're at home with some digital products. And so that's exciting. You may have a situation where you hated your job. I mean, statistics tell us that 68% of Americans hate their job. And some of you don't have that job anymore. So you get the opportunity to get one you like now. And you might not have done that on your own. So this could be the best thing that ever happened to you. There's a lot of good that comes out of this much pressure because it forces It forces you to reset. It forces you to rethink. And, you know, two or three, four crises ago, I don't know, back, I'm an old guy now. I had a personal crisis, you know, of losing everything. I decided I was never going to be the victim of the things I can control when one of these things that I can't control come at me again. And so we got out of debt and we built an emergency fund and we were in the last downturn of 2008, we were in a position of we had piles of cash. and so I was able to buy real estate at a nickel and a dime on the dollar. It was a wonderful time. But there were other times I was broke and couldn't take advantage of stuff being on sale. But if you're in a position, you got money right now, the stock market's on sale, real estate's not moved much yet. But if you're buying even consumer items.

Other than toilet paper, most things are on sale. I know. How much deeper down do you think this will take in terms of, you said real estate's not on sale yet, but it probably will be. how far down do you think things are to go and for how long with your, just your guess on this?

I mean, you know, weather forecasters and economists, only people can be wrong all the time and still keep their job. So I have no idea, but I do know there's gonna be a direct correlation between how long we stay out and how long it takes us to recover. No kidding. It's kind of common sense. The obvious is every week that we're out, there's another series of businesses that will never reopen, that will close. And so, and that's a recession is two consecutive quarters of the gross domestic product, all the goods and services produced in the US shrinking rather than growing. That's all it is. It receded rather than expanded. And so, recession sounds like a big scary depression type word, but it simply means two quarters. We've not had one quarter yet.

Mm-.

Shrinkage. So it would have to be up into the fall before you can officially declare this a recession or what results from the corona shutdowns, a recession. So I don't know. But I'm sure hoping that the folks are not ill and that nobody dies and it's a horrible thing.

And.

The juxtaposition with that is the sooner we can get back to work, the fewer people are going to be you know, affected by the economics of this. And it's not saying I'm trading a dollar for a life, but today, actually, that we've lost about a hundred jobs per case of corona right now. Wow. So the Corona shutdown in America? In America.

In America, yeah.

We've lost about, you know, the Corona shutdowns affected a hundred families jobs for every case, not, not death for every case of the virus. And I don't want anybody to be sick. I don't want anybody to die. And I don't want the hospital bills, the beds and the ventilators run out. I don't want I don't want any bad stuff. I'm not a medical person. But I am an entrepreneur and I'm, you know, every day we're not working is a trade off and it is a good trade off because you don't want to kill people. Believe me, I'm not saying that. But man, it's painful to watch these people lose their businesses.

Yeah. From your, you mentioned you've been through three or four recessions. I don't want to say your age out here, but it sounds like you've been around the block. You've experienced some stuff. You know, I only went through really, you know, I guess it's my adult life when I was 24, I guess it was the 2008 to 2009 time frame. When I was just got out of school and I was trying to figure out my life, I had three credit cards I was living off of. Yeah. Living on my sister's couch for a year and a half. I was in college debt, and I didn't have any skills that I thought were usable to get a job or do anything. And when I look back, you know, 11, 12 years ago, that was actually the greatest time and the greatest gift for me to develop skills, to work hard, to hustle, to try to see how can I make a hundred dollars here and there and then turn that into a business. And it was the greatest, it was the hardest time and the greatest time for me. I'm curious with your experience in, in watching these over the years, what were the greatest lessons you learned from each one that you applied in the last three weeks with your, your Personal business.

Well, it is cliche, but cliches come from truth. That, you know, that, you know, it's the greatest time and the worst time in your life. You don't want to go back there.

No.

Good Lord, no. I don't want to go back there. I went bankrupt. I lost everything in my 20s. I don't want to go back there. But the lessons that I learned from that pain were so thorough. Pain is a thorough teacher.

Yes.

That, you know, I, it was a rich, Time, the fertilizer was everywhere, lots of place to grow stuff, you know, lots of poop. So, you know, and, and that's, you know, that's what you had there in 2008. There weren't any jobs. You couldn't like, you could just, I mean, there was a con, a contraction of the economy, a recession, and you're, there you are on your sister's couch. And so you found out that the secret sauce in your life is the guy in your mirror, that it's not some outside variable that's going to come and save you. The Calvary is not coming. Santa Claus doesn't live in Washington. DC, it's up to you, baby. Get up off the couch. I got to go leave the cave, kill something and drag it home. You found that truth in that moment. I found that truth that, you know, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. You know, that old saying, I found that truth. And so nowadays, now that I've been through, you know, Y2K or 911 or all these initials come at you, you know, the horrible thing of 2008, now the corona, the only thing I am sure is we're gonna get through this.

Yeah.

You get hope because you go, it's not gonna kill you. Well, I guess you could get the virus. I don't mean that, but I'm saying the economic stress that we're under, the fear that we have, the concern or the worry that we have, you don't die from it. But you feel like there's this hopelessness and the truth is that's unfounded. The truth is there's a lot of reason to have hope. By September, where do you really think we're gonna be? by this time next year, are you not 90 something percent sure that the economy will be roaring again and your life will be back to some level of normalcy? You think it's going to be 10 years for you to personally recover from this?

No.

That's absurd. And you know that once you've walked through several of them. And so it's just to me, it's like, yeah, you're going to make it. We're going to be okay.

Yeah.

And so your personal, I guess I'm just curious about your personal thoughts. Do you think to yourself, like, I'm fine because I've followed my seven steps for years and I've got cash and I feel safe and protected. So now how can I shift and adapt and pivot and serve my community and customers more? Or do you feel any anxiety personally at all?

Oh, no, none. I mean, we're in fabulous financial shape. It's not a... I've got a lot of money invested in the stock market. It's going down. I'm gonna put some more money in while it's on sale. I mean, if real estate goes on sale again, I'll buy some more. So, no, I mean, my personal stuff, It's not arrogance, it's just I've been.

Doing this a long time.

You're the king of it.

Yeah, I'm the little pig in the brick house, you know, I mean, huff and puff, baby. And so, but I do, it does put you in a position to serve then, and truthfully, you get more joy even in a crisis and serving than you do in sitting in the basement and counting your coins. I mean, so the opportunity, I got a thousand folks on our team and the struggle and the scratching and the scrappiness and the clawing to keep this place running and all of them not have their incomes interrupted in any way during this time. That's an act of service in leadership. The act of service of speaking hope and life into the communities around America right now is an act of service on my part. It's being on the air three hours a day, the Dave Ramsey Show, saying it's going to be okay, it's going to be okay, it's going to be okay over and over and over again. Right now, that's my job. That's what I do. And it's, that's just so much more satisfying than counting coins.

Yeah. Now, I followed your steps when I was, you know, 25, 26, when I started making some money, when I was like, it's hard to follow a step when you feel like you're living off credit cards and in debt and you're not making any money. You feel like this sense of helplessness, really. And I know I've listened to a lot of your shows with people where They feel helpless and it takes that initial momentum to kind of kickstart it and see little savings here and there and then pay off one thing here and there. But I tell you, once I finished those, I guess really the first five to six steps, I don't have a home still. I still rent for personal reasons, but the first five to six steps and then building wealth and giving, giving, once I got through these, it's just like, man, you feel so much more bulletproof. I feel so much more bulletproof now after 10 years of building into this recession. I feel safe, I feel fine, I feel protected. And it gives me so much more peace of mind since I did follow your steps. So I first want to acknowledge you for that, for creating something so simple for us and providing this three hours a day for everybody. I think it's amazing. You sound like a preacher and a motivational speaker to me in the last few minutes just speaking life and hope into us. So I appreciate that. What are you telling to people right now who are saying, you know what, I didn't follow your advice. I didn't do what I should have done. I still love off credit cards. I overbought, paid for my house, and I've got this expensive lifestyle and credit cards that I know, I'm wrong. I made a mistake. I own it, and now I'm screwed. And I just got 50% cut of my work. I might lose my job in two months. I got all these bills. like, how do you even, how do you even respond to something like that?

Yeah.

Well, I certainly don't say I told you so. That's not, that's not the message because I've been there. I've done stupid stuff, too, and that's not helpful. And it doesn't bring, it doesn't bring any healing. The thing is this. We all get wake up calls. We get wake up calls in our relationships, our spiritual walk, our leadership Styles. We get wake up calls in our finances and. Some people, the phones ringing off the hook right now. They're getting wake up calls on a bunch of things. They're at home with their family and they're starting to realize I was disconnected from my family. I haven't been plugged in, they got a wake up call on their relationships at home. They've gotten a wake up call on, you know, I don't have any savings and I'm deeply in debt. This isn't working. And so, you know, the cool thing is when you get the call, Then you have to make the choice. Are you going to answer the phone? If you pick the phone up, that means baby, it's time to change. And you can look back and you might be 27 years old right now watching this and you're screwed. You lost your job, you got no money, you got no savings and you feel like it's all over.

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I remember in 1970, I was 10 years old and I was in my grandpa's backyard. We were tearing down an old deck and I pulled some nails out of those old boards as we were taking the boards off and he taught me to put them down and straighten them with the hammer and save those used nails in a coffee can. Now, my grandpa Ramsey was one of my favorite people on the planet. This is 1970 and he was still answering the phone that rang in the Great Depression. It changed his life. He was frugal and careful and wise with money the rest of his life. And so someday, 27 year old, you're going to be sitting on the back porch with your grandkid and you're gonna remember back in alt 20, there was the coronavirus and it changed my life, you know, and that you're gonna be that guy. You're gonna be giving dad jokes, you know, and grandpa jokes, right? Like I am now. And you're gonna get that opportunity. I was 28 years old when I lost everything. It was my fault. It was the SNL crisis. The banking climate changed. I built a house of cards. I was stupid and the phone rang. It was my wake up call. Are you going to answer the phone? Are you going to change your life to where you say, never again, I'm going to control the controllables to where I'm the little pig in the brick house. Never again. That may be the only thing you get out of this crisis. And if it is, you got enough.

Preach to me, Dave. Come on now, I love this. What's the biggest wake up call for you that this has had? Maybe it's not the financial side of things or business because you guys are thriving. Is there something, you know, relationship, family, friendships, health, is there anything that's woken you up now or in the near future recently?

Well, I've spent the last 15 years pouring into our leadership team and the Ramsey personalities creating the succession plan of, and so, It's not a wake-up call. It's more of a source of pride as to how our leadership team and our Ramsey personalities are reacting in the moment here without me coaching them. They already knew what to do.

They're leading.

They're out there doing it. They're doing it. They're out there.

They're not waiting for grandpa Dave to say, what do I do? Tell me the steps.

They already did it. They already did it. And then I found out about it, you know, and that's, that's awesome. And so it's just a sense of, ah, this is starting to work, you know, I mean, when Rachel Cruz and Ken Hogan and these guys are doing, Ken Coleman are doing all these hits and Chris Hogan, all these guys are doing all these hits, these radio and TV and appearances and all this stuff everywhere and the networks are calling and asking for them, which is awesome. And so, you know, that kind of thing is, I don't know if it's a wake up call as much as it is, it's very satisfying to say, you know, all that work of the last decade and a half of getting everybody ready to win, because we were winning in a winning environment, but then when you get the pressures on, and you get squeezed, you see what comes out and it's good stuff coming out.

What was the last, I mean, what year would you say was the last big wake-up call for you around, you know, one of the main areas of your life? Do you remember when that was? We're like, oh, you know, i'm eating a little too many candy bars or, you know, my relationship or, you know, what? It sounds like you've had the finances down for many years, but is there another area where you're like, oh, you know what? I really didn't do as good as I should have done here.

I guess it's probably leadership and I probably get one of those calls every day. There's some days I'm a world class leader and some days I'm just a butt.

In what way? Like how are you?

I mean, sometimes I do a better job than other times as a leader.

And.

I own it. I get it. But you'd think as old as I am, I'd be doing better. So, but I know what I'm supposed to do, but sometimes I just just don't have the energy to do it. I don't care.

Yeah.

And I should just care more. I really should. I shouldn't be such a grouch.

Oh, no, you care a lot about a lot of people. I'm curious, what's the best dad joke you share?

Oh, Lord.

I can't. I don't have no idea. You got me. I'm not a dad joke guy, really. Other than just stupid stuff off the cuff that doesn't even make sense generationally, so.

Yeah, no good dad jokes. What? what is the most common thing that you're hearing with the people that are calling in for you right now? What's the thing that you hear over and over again that they need the most support with?

I think there's a sense, I think when hope gets gut punched the way it has for folks right now.

The.

Answers fall, a lot of them fall in the category of this is not going to last forever. Because there's this sense that stock market's down, do I take my investments out? Well, only if you think it's going to stay down forever.

Right.

Because you're 35, you're going to be investing for 30 more years. You don't think it's going to come up in 30 more years? I mean, really, you're predicting the end of America? I mean, that's silly, but your emotions tell you lies when they're based in fear and when they're based in anger. and they tell you lies and, and they tell me lies. We believe those lies in situations like this. So, you know, I lost my job. I know, but that's happened before and, and probably happened again. Just get you another one. Well, yeah, there's a lot of people hiring right now.

There are a lot of people hiring.

Amazon. Amazon's hiring a hundred thousand people right now.

Yeah.

So, I mean, there's jobs. It may not be the one you want, but you can get some food.

Yeah.

I mean, get you a leaf blower. And rich people are afraid of leaves, you know? I mean, you can make some money, so there's some stuff to do out there, but. so the thing that the sense that the thing you're afraid of is going to last longer than it is.

Yeah.

Whether it's the actual virus, whether it's the shutdowns, whether it's the economic repercussions of the shutdowns, whether it's the employment situation, whether it's the quarantine, it feels like it's going to last forever. But I mean, the chances of you being in the exact situation you're in, in a few months is almost zero. Your life is not a snapshot. You're not trapped in this moment. It's a film strip. The story is going to continue to unfold. And so when hope takes a gut punch though, and we get down in that fear or we're mad or however it is we manifest that stuff, that those negative things, the emotions that we all have in these situations, that's where a lot of my questions are coming. They're all built in that. I'm spending all my time going, Yeah, but it's not gonna last forever. Yeah, but it's not gonna last forever. Yeah, but let's visit this in May. I think you're gonna be okay. By June, are you even gonna remember this? It's the great toilet paper shortage of this plan. I don't know. I mean, what is it? You know, it's, you know, some people are gonna have devastating, horrible things that are gonna be life changing, but that's a very small percentage compared to the number of that are worried about it.

Yeah.

And so, you know, you- and you're.

Going to get out of it. You're going to get out of it.

You're going to be okay. I mean, you're going to be okay.

I like Preacher Dave, man. This is a preacher show. You know, I like this. What is the worst investment people should be making during this time? And what's the best investment they can make?

In my life, when I have become desperate, Right after that's when I become stupid.

Yeah.

And explain the other one. The other one is when I get, well, when you get scared and you go rushing towards something out of fear, that sense of desperation, this, oh, thing, when you do that, you're getting ready to screw up. I mean, just count on it. And the other time you do that is if you're greedy. If you think you, okay, I got this one. I can take advantage of this. And I mean greedy as a lack of virtue greedy. I don't mean greedy in a positive way where I'm being ambitious, okay? I mean the negative sides of greed. And so if you're functioning in desperation or in this no holds barred, I've I'm gonna just clean up on other people's pain thing. That's when you're getting ready to screw up and you're getting ready to make a major mistake. And, and so you're set up also for con artists when you do that. And so if you're, if you're functioning in high emotion, your brain just doesn't work good. My friend Art Laffer says, well, people, when you're panicked and when you're drunk, you don't make good decisions. And so, you know, you, you're When you're on high emotion, your brain is, it's your critical thinking skills shut down. And so that's when I've made the biggest mistakes in my life is when I was desperate and the few times that I was greedy where I thought, oh, I'm gonna slip in there and that's gonna be easy money.

And the reality is people think millionaires are trust fund babies, that they inherited everything or they got lucky or hit the lottery. None of the those are true. These are regular, everyday men and women that have worked hard over time, and they've been investing 25-28 years. And the way the book is structured, we've got the information from the study, and we've got the information I want people to know, but the stories in this book of people that were homeless and turned it around, people that had a million dollars or more in debt and turned it around. And so, Louis, it really goes back to a lot of the stuff you talk about. It's the mindset. right? It's the mindset. And when you get the right people with the right information, results can happen. Yes.

What are we talking about these myths that millionaires, about millionaires? What are some of the myths that surround millionaires?

Well, we talk about six in the book, but I'll tell you two. Most people believe they inherited it all.

Right?

You see somebody with money, you think, oh, mom or dad handed it to them. The truth is 79% of the millionaires that I talk to first generation wealth builders. They didn't come from anything. These are people that focused and built money over time. Next myth, well, if you're a millionaire, you make high paying job, right? You got big income.

Yeah, yeah.

Nope. A third of the millionaires that we talked to never made six figures in a single working year. Really? Think about that for a second. Dual income never made six figures. So that blows that myth out of the water. A third of the millionaires that we talked to.

Wow. Right.

Now you think about six figures nowadays, it's more prevalent than it's ever been.

But for people, a lot of people with six-figure salaries have nothing in the bank. Thank you.

Because they just spend it all.

That's exactly right.

And they're using credit constantly to buy bigger things. That's right. No, no, you're absolutely right. So what happens is, is people tend to think that income is so important. And I'll tell you, no, it's not. Because I was one of those people. I remember I was making about 30 grand. and I thought, all right, when I get serious, one year out of grad school making 30, 40 grand, I said, all right, when I make this amount, I'll start to get serious about my money. Well, you know that path, right? Well, when I make this amount, the next thing you know, lifestyle grows and you never end up taking control. But these are regular, everyday people that took control and were focused. It's amazing. So let me tell you this. Top three positions of the 10, 000 millionaires we studied. Number one was engineer, which doesn't surprise you, right? They're good at planning. Yeah. Accountants. Organized. Yeah, accountants, same thing. They were number two. They're good at counting stuff.

Number three was teachers. Teachers.

They're not making that much. Exactly. And you think they're the undervalued, underpaid. How are teachers doing this? Well, if you think about what it is, wealth building is a long-term view, right? Not a quick hit. And so these get rich quick schemes that we see on TV at late night, they get me riled up because they're preying on people. But these these people were people that built wealth over time, investing in their 401, their 403Bs. So anyway, the goal of this book is to let people know their American dream's not dead. It's alive and it's well, and it's available to people.

We just have to take action. Absolutely. What are some of the things that they do on a daily basis, these millionaires? What are some of the steps to take?

And how do they think differently than non-millionaires? Great. 97% of the millionaires that we studied feel that they control their own destiny. Now think about that for a minute, because we have a victim mentality issue in America today, where we want to blame somebody for us not achieving something or getting in our way. So these millionaires think differently. 94% of them live on less than they make. So that means if they're making $100,000, they're living on $70 or $80, right?

You can't build wealth if you live on more than you make.

That's exactly right. And that's where the credit cards people start extending themselves. using credit cards. But 73% of these millionaires never carried a dime of credit card debt. They never carried debt.

Debt. Yeah.

Right. You might use a card, pay it off every month. Pay it off. And so the mindset, and I love to give people an economics and a PhD in economics, interest that you pay is a penalty, right? If I use someone else's money, they charge me. Yes. Right, that's a penalty. Interest that I earn on my investments is a reward. Yes. Right? So why choose to penalize yourself? Don't use debt. Get yourself out of debt and invest and grow your money to reward yourself.

Yeah.

Powerful.

Now, how have you managed to, through all the stuff you've gone through, I'm assuming the last 15-20 years you've gone through some challenges. You told me before off camera that you have a child who has special needs and was told that they wouldn't live past a certain age. you know, I'm assuming you've had challenges in relationships with business partnerships, intimate relationships, family. The more wealth that I've accumulated and the attention that I've gained, there's more people with handouts expecting whatever it may be. How have you personally managed the emotional challenges that have come your way by not letting it affect your mindset around money so that you don't do things emotionally with your money.

Right. Well, I mean, I've been there. I don't know about you, but I made some mistakes.

Yeah.

Okay. And, you know, a mistake that you make one or two times, you can call it a mistake. But when you keep doing it over and over, it's not a mistake anymore. It's called a choice. Yeah. So for me, I'm very. I'm a man of faith, so obviously I'm rooted there. But I got good people around me. Yeah, I got good friends, people that have known me since my childhood, people that know me for who I am. So I'm not an author and speaker with these people. I'm just Chris. And so those people keep me rooted, right? Mama Hogan is no joke either, okay? She'll keep me rooted. And so I think it's really important to understand what am I trying to accomplish? Like, I don't want notoriety. I don't want to be famous. I want to be known that I help people think bigger, right? And so staying rooted in that, it helps me to be very, very clear on what I'm doing. People will come up and tell me, oh, Chris, you changed my life financially. And I go, oh, whoa. Uh-. Pump the brakes. I didn't change anything. I gave you some information. You did the changing. And so I think it's really important as we help people that we stay aware of who's doing what and our role.

Yeah, I think there's a story about Marcus Aurelius where he would go around the town and he had someone just walk with him beside him and say, you,'re just a man. I remember that. Every time someone would praise him, be like, Just a man.

Can you imagine that? I mean seriously, isn't that cool? How rooted does that keep you? You know, so, you know, John Wooden's got a quote. He says, you know, be careful of fame because fame is man-made. And if man giveth, man can take it away. Absolutely. You know, and so being aware of that, I think is really, really important. What's the heart behind what I'm trying to do? And so, you know, if I travel and I go speak to 10,000 people, if I get one person who is eyes light up and they start thinking differently, then I've done my mission.

Yeah.

Yeah.

What's the biggest challenge you've gone through in the last 15 years? Oh, personally, emotionally, financially.

Biggest challenge was definitely the diagnosis of my youngest son, case. At age two, they diagnosed him with this rare genetic disorder that could kill him. I could take away his speech, take away the ability to walk, ability to eat. and eventually end up on a feeding tube. It was the scariest moment of my life, sitting in that doctor's office holding that two-year-old boy, listening to that, and went to some dark places over a few years. Well, you know what us men do when we have challenges? We don't, we're not as smart as women. Women go share.

Yeah, we don't share.

Men don't share. We isolate. And then we internalize. And then we stuff.

Right?

And so you can imagine working through something like that isolated. It messes with you.

It does.

It messes with you. It does.

And.

That was the biggest challenge I've walked through in the last 15 years.

How did you get through that initial few years of stuffing or...

I just stuffed. You know, I didn't do what I should have done. Isn't it amazing how hindsight's 2020. I wish I would have sought out those close friends and they would check on me. And what would I say? I'm good, I'm fine, I'm all right, and I wouldn't. And so that was a learning lesson for me, that isolating is dangerous. That it's good to reach out and get help. It's good to have people you can be real with. And I came to this realization, we need four people in our lives. You need a mentor, this is somebody that's having some success and can guide you. You need a coach who will push you. Right, you and I know word coach means something to us, right? Because they will get on you, they will drive you because what's the goal to try to help you to get better? But you need two more. You need a cheerleader. You need somebody that believes in you. They're not worried about what you achieve, they believe in you. And that's important to have. And then you need a friend. You need somebody you can be real with that you can just say what's on your head, they're not holding it against you. You can be honest. So if you get a mentor, a coach, a a cheerleader and a friend in your side. That's awesome. But I want to encourage people to do this. Not only find those four, you need to be one of those four for someone else.

You need to be four of those things. That we're saying, you need to be a mentor. Yes. You need to be a coach. Yes.

A friend. Yes. And a cheerleader. Absolutely. For someone else. For somebody. And when you do that, now what it does is it takes the focus off of you. You know, one of the things you and I have in common is I firmly believe that if you've ever walked through a in your life that qualifies you to be a messenger. It does. You know, when you've gone through some stuff. You've gone through some stuff, you learn. That's right. And if you're willing enough to be transparent to share it, and you're not worried about people's opinions, the impact you can have on someone else to give them the courage to try, or to reach out and talk, that's a big deal, man. This life is hard. It's not meant to be done alone.

Yeah.

Wow.

Who is your mentor coach? cheerleader and friend.

Oh, yeah. Well, Mentor is obviously Dave Ramsey. This man has been an incredible Mentor for me, just guiding me. And then over the 13 years of being with him, my coaches, man, I've got a lot. I've got. I've got some people with. They're with walking with me spiritually. I've got people that are walking me from a business perspective. I'm constantly reaching out to learn. I'm like a sponge all the time. That's big. Cheerleader. Mama Hogan. Yeah, I mean that's my that's my number one fan right there. She's behind me. I've got all kinds of family, uncles and everybody. They're just for me. Friends. I got amazing friends, childhood friends, people at the office, people that care about me as an individual, not just what I do. They know me. Not the book. No, no, no. They'll call me out. Yeah, yeah. You know, they'll call me out. I got a call from a buddy the other day. He goes, Dude, how's the road? He goes, you,'re keeping your head clear.

Yeah.

You stay in focus. and he said, Don't believe the hype.

That's right.

And so what he's telling me is, is, hey, keep helping people, keep your heart in the right place, you know? And so it's good to have those accountability people to check in with you. It just keeps your heart in the right place.

Yeah.

Yeah.

What would you say is your biggest insecurity, fear, or challenge right now? You've been through different phases of life, and as you grow and expand, I'm assuming there's new challenges that you overcome and then new stuff that maybe you haven't overcome yet.

Right. I think my biggest fear is, am I doing everything that I could be doing? Right? I've got three boys. They're hilarious. 14, 13, and 11. And these boys are my legacy. I grew up with a single mom, so my dad wasn't around. He came around with birthdays and holidays or whatever, but he wasn't there. So when I had started getting ready to have kids. My goal was to try to be the dad that I wish I would have had. And so that puts some weight on you, right? But I was hanging out with my boys and we were somewhere and I saw a poster of a little boy at a bus stop with a duffel bag, right? And he was just sitting at a bus stop and I can't even remember what was under it. But I saw that little boy and I thought of me, right? Like waiting. And then I realized, Man oh man, in my own life, like, you know, somebody somewhere is waiting on me to become what I was destined to be. And so if they're waiting on me to become who I was supposed to be to impact their life, how long am I gonna make them wait? You know? And so what that means is, is that I need to do everything I'm capable of doing and some things some people say I can't do, just to be able to help that person somewhere that's waiting to hear an encouraging word. or something to impact their life. So that's something that drives me every day.

Yeah.

What is it that people say you can't do?

Oh man, I've had people tell me I couldn't write a book.

You know, my first book came out 2016, Retire Inspired. I told a good buddy of mine, I told him I was working on a book. He goes, Man, you can't write a book. Really? Yeah, we were in church, right? I wanted to punch him in the eye. You can't hit people. You can't hit people in church. I got a not a feeling that's a sin, right? Somewhere. But then later on, when I finished the book and at the book signing in town, he was one of the people there. And I realized something. What initially he said was that I can't write a book. What he was saying was, it's not something he's ever thought about doing, and it's not something that he could do.

It's his belief.

That was him, right? And so for me, that was a grow up moment. He wasn't putting a limitation on me, he was speaking his own limitation, right? And so I just remember that and I go, oh no, limitations. And so that's where I said, I'll accept compliments from anyone, but I ain't accepting limitations from nobody, right? And that's anywhere in my life. You don't get to put a limit on me. That's what I love about, you know, Dr. Martin Luther King. The fact that he had the courage to have a dream, but the courage to share it, you know, that's something I want us all to have that mindset of. Stop thinking about what people say you can't do, you know? I mean, opinions are like yesterday's, everybody's got them. what are you deciding in your heart to go do? Now start to go do that.

Yeah. Wow, man. So what do you do now in terms of your own wealth? How are you, you've probably learned a lot again over the last 20 years from the banking world, like selling services, you learned a certain amount to get to one level, and then you realize like, oh, some things work well and some things don't work well, and then you go to another level of your wealth, and then you realize, okay, Now I've got more wealth, some things work and some things don't work. You keep, I'm assuming, expanding.

Yes.

And I'm building my wealth, I realize.

Wow, there's always something to learn. That's exactly right. There's always stuff. Now there's taxes. Now I've got to learn how to invest my money. Now I've got to learn what's the.

Right places and all these things. So what's the phase you're at right now and what are the biggest lessons you've learned in the last couple of years? Okay, so the phase I'm at right now is obviously continued growth, right? Because with inflation, costs are going to go up. so you can't hide money in a cookie jar and just put it in the ground. It's got to grow. So with me, I'm always looking, but I'm understanding risk more, you know, this these latest crazes that come out, I just cringe, you know, cryptocurrency, right? Bitcoin, right? There's this thing out there, it's not even real that's been given a value by somebody that's not regulated.

Yeah. Right.

And so when you look at this, you would laugh at that. But we've had people seriously pursue that. Day trading years ago was a big thing. So for me, what I'm doing is I'm trying to be smart with what I do, but I need to be crystal clear on what not to do. Meaning, I don't want to take unnecessary risks. What are the things that are non-negotiable you won't do? I'm not doing debt. I am not doing debt. So what's that mean for people? That means I don't borrow money. I'm not looking to borrow money, to leverage, borrowing money from my home to put invest, no leverage schemes. I don't borrow at all. And I'm crystal clear on what it is I'm doing, meaning the longer range view. Louis, what I started doing years ago was I started making two-year decisions. I wanted to make a decision today that I look back on in two years and I'm glad that I made it. Now imagine some of those decisions. Oh, gosh, well, I mean, staying allergic to debt. I mean, I have people come to me all the time with business. opportunities. They're like, Hogan, listen, if you put in this amount, we're going to do boom, boom, boom, boom. And in looking at that, I have to be smart enough to say no. That if it looks too good to be true, we know it is. But I think it's more about making the, I think I've made more money by not doing things than I would have by going down a path.

And did you invest in certain things early on where you're like, yeah, that seems like fun and interesting. And you're like, I've never got my money.

Oh yeah, no, I learned my lesson.

I've been messing, I think, eight startups over the last eight years. And guess how much money I've made.

How much, Louis?

Zero.

How much did you invest? Give me a ballpark.

Probably.

Probably about 250 to 300. Okay.

Okay. That's not as bad. I wasn't going, like, big. I was like, let me just dabble. Yes. Let me just get in the game, play with it.

It's okay if I lose it. I met the mindset. Like, I'm gambling. Right. Well, and that's exactly what I did. But here's the thing. And you know what? you paid a dollar amount, but you learned some stuff. I learned some stuff. You know what you're not gonna do ever again. Exactly. And see, to me, that's valuable.

Yeah.

Because obviously, as things grow and profiles grow, the risks grow, you know, the bigger things come. So I just want people to take, that's why my website is ChrisHogan360.com I want people to take a 360 degree look at a lot of the things they're doing, their business, their life. Like, look at this and make decisions about what you want. like I'm crystal clear on what I want, but I'm absolutely certain of what I don't want. I don't want failure. I don't want negative attitudes around me, right? I want to make sure that I'm impacting people. Yeah.

Yeah. That's powerful. What are the things that you, so you don't borrow debt?

Nope.

And so what's that mean? It says you can't start something unless you use sweat equity, unless you have the money.

Pay cash. Pay cash. Pay cash. So that means real estate.

Right?

There's a property that I want to buy.

I don't go to a bank.

You don't get a loan out?

Nope.

I save up and pay. Now, what does that make me do? It makes me have patience. That means I'm not... I can get everything you want now. That's exact... Well, and that's... you have kids yet? No kids. Okay, so... oh, you got freedom and money. Okay, all right. I'm sending one of my boys to live with you. Exactly. But kids want what they want and they want it now. Yes, you're right. Give it to me now.

Right.

And so, as adults, we do that, that's dangerous. That's why the average credit card debt right now is 15 grand. People have 45,000 in student loans, car payments of $600 or more a month. So for me, I look at debt as a thing that limits me from doing what I want to do, not getting me there faster. Now, I'm old school, and I did my stupid. I did single stocks. I did all those things, and I lost a lot of money. But looking at it, what I was trying to do was to get get rich instead of building wealth, right? And there's a difference.

Between getting rich and building wealth.

That's right. What's the difference between getting rich and getting rich? Getting rich is where you want to quickly get money, right? And these are the lottery winners that I've talked to. They got money in really, really quick, but they also lost it really, really quick. So building wealth is a long-term view, meaning you can have some fun and enjoy some stuff, but don't get so focused in the enjoying that you forget to plan for the future. Right. What's the YOLO? That's the hipster phrase. You only live once. Well, in my mind, if you have that mentality and you believe that, you've grown for a long time. That's right, because you're doing everything for today. So anyway, I want people to have just awareness. Like you can have some fun today, but let's also make sure we're doing some things using the 401ks, using SIPS if you're self-employed, put some money aside so we can start to grow for you. Talking to these millionaires, the number one thing they said that caused them to build wealth was employer sponsored retirement plans, 401ks, 403Bs and Roth IRAs. So people out there that are self-employed, the SEPPs, solo 401ks, you've got ways to be able to invest. And that's what I want people to do. And so wealth building is a long-term view. Getting rich is a quick hit. I don't want a quick hit.

Is it possible for anyone to go from poverty level to extremely financially successful.

Absolutely. I think earning money is one of the simplest things I ever learned. And it's one of the most misunderstood things. Wealthy people historically have always had multiple sources of income. They don't have one. They have many.

Yeah.

I was cleaning floors. I thought the answer was work harder. Because I really want to earn some money.

Yeah, of course.

And I thought it was all important. Today, my attitude towards money has changed dramatically. But I thought the answer was get another office to clean. Well, I was working so hard, I passed out on the street. I would have been maybe 27, 28. I literally passed out on the street. I was working so hard. I came to, and there's a great big cop looking looking at me. I was laying there. It was scary. There was a group of people around me. I saw lights flashing. Then I saw a guy, a couple of guys in uniform with a stretcher, and it was scary. I had passed out. I guess they thought I had dropped dead. I had heck of a time getting away from them, but I did get away. They didn't take me in the hospital. I talked them out of it. I got away and I thinking, I'm not doing this right.

Working harder, working more hours is not the way. No.

In fact, Napoleon Hill wrote that in Think and Grow Rich. He said, if you are one of those people who believe that hard work and honesty alone will bring riches, perish the thought. It is not true. Riches, when they come in huge quantities, never come as a result of hard work. They come if they come at all in response to definite demands based upon the application of definite principles and not by chance or luck. So you've got to find a demand and fill it, but you've got to follow definite principles to do it. In other words, you've got to be in harmony with the law. You've got to give more than you get. If you're trying to get, forget it.

Well.

I got by myself and I.

Thought, I'm doing something wrong.

I was earning more money, but here I'm passionate. This is not normal. And it's like a little voice in my head said, if you can't clean all of them, don't clean any of them. So I got all dressed up. People now accuse me of sleeping in my suit. I got, I wouldn't take a suit off. It didn't matter where I was. Because I knew the cleaners were tired and I would go around, I got other people cleaning offices. And I knew pretty well where they'd be. So I dropped around, I'd bring coffee and donuts, and I would drop in and I would talk to them about goals, and then I'd go to the next person. But I always was stressed out because I knew how tired you get, and if I was in working clothes, they'd expect me to help them so they could finish and go home.

Interesting.

But when I had shiny shoes and a suit and shirt and tie, they didn't expect me to help them clean. So I'd go on to the next place, and then next place. And that's when I started to open offices. I went from Toronto to Montreal to Boston to Cleveland to Atlanta to London, England.

And you hired cleaners.

Aha.

Everywhere I went. Yeah. Yeah.

I had people cleaning.

What should someone think about if they're struggling financially right now or they feel like they're, they've been struggling for many years and it feels like they're just surviving week after week, month after month. They're not sure how to get to that kind of sense of freedom for at least a six-month runway or beyond. What should they start thinking about?

You know what you've just described, I believe the majority of people are living that way. The majority. Now that's rather sad, but I think it's true. And it's because we only have one problem in the whole world and that's ignorance. They're living in ignorance. They don't know that what they're doing is going to keep them where they are, and they keep doing because they don't know how to change. They're overwhelmed with the debt. People are saying, I need the money. They haven't got it. They want to take their family on a vacation. They don't have the money to go. So they may borrow it and go anyway. Now they've got more debt. They have to understand that they don't have to live that way. I wrote a book called youd're Born Rich. the truth is you are. Most people are just a little short of money, but you are born rich, rich in potential. Anybody can go to our site, go to BobProctor.com, you can download the book, you, Were Born Rich, free. It won't cost you a cent. And chapter two is how much is enough. It's described very well how to get out of debt. You've got to create a debt repayment program where it's all done automatically, and then you focus on prosperity. You've got to have a financial goal. You've got to work toward it. And you've got to understand that you can earn more than you're earning. And wealthy people don't have one source of income. They have more than one. I was earning money all last night while I was sleeping. You can actually earn more money when you're sleeping than you can spend when you're awake. You know, it sounds like a cute line, but it's true. There's no end to what we can earn. If you are not getting information from someone who is already wealthy, then you're probably getting information from the wrong people. Most people ask their brother-in-law, the guy next door, the girl they know, How.

Do I earn more?

Hell, if they knew, they'd be earning it.

They don't know.

And most people talk to people that don't know. Carlisle put it very well. He said he did not believe in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance. And that's where most people are getting it from people that don't know any more than themselves. I think you have to go, that's why these seminars are so important today. People have the opportunity to go and learn. Most people won't pay to go. I tell people, listen, you invest in this, it'll probably be the, borrow the money to do it, it's probably the last time you'll ever have to borrow money. We, our seminars are not rah rah, it's not nothing. Our seminars teach people about themselves. It's like when Bill Goff said, if I want to be free, I gotta be me. I'm thinking, I better know who me is. I didn't know who me was. I was doing a lot of things. I was doing them right, and I was earning mud, but I didn't know who I was. I started to study me. And the more I know me, the better I know you. You only have to study yourself. You don't know what everybody, because we're all saying. It's our behavior that's different, our results that are different.

I heard a friend of mine, Dean Graziosi, I don't know if he coined this or someone else said it, and he said it from someone else, but he said, those that pay pay attention. And when you invest in yourself, you're paying attention to your life.

I never heard that before, but that is the truth.

Those that pay pay attention. But if you don't pay for it, you're not going to pay as much attention.

If you pay more, you'll pay more attention to learn. I had an aunt and uncle who were as poor as church mice.

Me.

I mean, they just didn't have anything. And they had a whole house full of kids. And I used to drop by their house periodically. I was doing very well, and I was teaching seminar. And I remember it was around Christmas time, and he was rushing around trying to get credit cards from some big stores so they could buy presents for the kids.

Yeah.

And I said, you know something? He said, never mind. Next year will be different. I said, you know something? Next year is going to be exactly the same as it is this year. Because you never change you.

Wow.

I said, you should get into the seminars and learn something. I know something you don't know. Well, they came to the seminar. He got paid every two weeks. So that meant three times a year. I think he'd get paid three times, maybe four times a year. He'd get paid three times in a month. That one pay was extra because they were budgeted for two. pays. I made them pay to come to it. Something said, I made them pay. And I think they thought I should have clumped them into it. But, you know, Mark thanked me, my aunt. I don't know how many times that I charged them. She said, we wouldn't have kept coming. I didn't even know what you were talking about. I was running seminars. It was seven evenings from seven to ten. It was running over a series of nights years ago. And she said, I wouldn't have kept coming. But she said, because we paid, I came.

Of course.

He's right.

If they pay, they pay attention. That is so true.

And if they don't, you're not gonna care. When you hear something you don't like, this is not for me. Let me get out of here. I got something better to do.

Yeah.

Especially in LA. I wanna go to the beach. This is too hard work. It's confronting my ego. Ah, I don't need this.

Firmly convinced if a person doesn't understand a paradigm, a paradigm is nothing but a multitude of habits. They're programmed into your subconscious mind to control your behavior. It's got nothing to do with how smart you are. It's got nothing to do with what your formal education is. It's got nothing to do from which side of the tracks you come from. It has to do with your paradigm. The paradigm is a program in your subconscious mind. It's both genetic and environmental. that's controlling your behavior. Everyone that can hear my voice knows how to do better than they're doing. And they may wonder, why don't I do it? It's because you're programmed to do what you're doing.

Yeah.

And until you change the program, nothing's going to change. Paradigm has to be changed.

I love that. What would you say are the, if you could share three key habits for people that if they want continue to grow every day, be more prosperous, be more abundant, happier, joyful, healthier in their life. What are three key things, habits? Every day, not talking about morning routine, but just overall habits every single day. What should people be focusing on consistently?

They should study every day.

Study.

They should have a mentor, someone that has already accomplished what they dream about. They might not even know the person. They could get introduced to them and ask them, what are half a dozen things I should do every day? Ask them, they know. Most people are getting advice from people who don't know any more than themselves. And the third one, you've definitely got to have a goal and when you write it, you've already got it intellectually. So you operate intellectually, emotionally and physically. Well, your intellectual mind, the second you decide on it, you've got it. It tells you in the Bible, before you speak, I'll hear you. It's because the thought always precedes the word. The second you get emotionally involved, you've got it emotionally. You've got it intellectually, you've got it emotionally, it's only a period of time till you've got it physically.

We do have, yeah.

That's right, but the have comes in a period of time.

So it's not overnight?

Every seed has a gestation or an incubation period. When a woman gets pregnant with a child, it takes 280 days. The husband doesn't come home a month later and say, Come on, where is it? He waits, as James Allen said, as one who understands. You understand, there's a gestation period. Where I come from, if you plant a seed for a carrot, it takes approximately 70 days for it to manifest. All physical seeds have a gestation or an incubation period. We know that now, but we didn't always know that. We weren't always aware. No one knows what the gestation period is for a spiritual seed, and an idea is a spiritual seed. But we do know that it operates by the same laws. And the laws of the universe are precise. They can be studied. They can be understood. We operate by law. Our life is governed by laws. Like we know it's going to get dark tonight. We don't wonder if it is. You know when the tide goes out, it's coming back. Winter never follows winter. We know these things. That's all expression of law. Well, when we bring our life into harmony with the laws, we're going to enjoy more of life.

There's more money to be made now as an influencer than there ever was before. There's more opportunities, there's more models for making money, different methods, and you've got a couple of key themes and a framework on becoming an influencer, figuring out your message, the model, mechanisms, everything. And I want to kind of break them down. The first thing you talk about is the message. It's getting clear in your message is what I'm assuming, right? Yeah, yeah. As an influencer, is it important to know what your message is and how.

Do you find your message if you're trying to become an influencer? Yeah, because the death of most influencers they don't realize is their randomness.

Right.

You know, they're just excited. I'm gonna post everything, you know, and I'm gonna talk about everything, but they've never created a cohesive message that their audience goes, I get her. I understand her. It's not like you have to say the same thing over and over and over, but there has to be something that means something to you. Like one thing I admire about what you do, buddy, is how you talk about greatness. That theme and that messaging is so tight. And honestly, over the last three years, when I listen to your show, I'm like, he's just dialing this in. Yeah, right. You, you know your word choice now. You know your phrases. You know what you're saying. It's not just being repetitive on those, it's just that's who you are. And that integrity of your message is being shown, so you better be intentional about the kind of person you're trying to become. Because most people think about message, they go, oh, so I need to have a mission statement, Brandon. I'm like, no, no, no. You are the message. The integrity of who you are and how you show up energetically and how.

You treat other people, that's the message. The role model mentality.

Yes.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Become the role model of your message. That's it.

Yeah.

Yeah, because that's what integrity is. It's like people are gonna watch you and go, Are you congruent here and there? And if you're not, that message feels funny to them. But you and I both know a lot of influencers, they've never done any deep introspection. They've put on 50 different clothes and beautiful Instagram things, but they don't know who they are.

Or they got the mental health challenge, which is what we're gonna talk about later. But the message is getting clear on your message from kind of the theme of your brand. the theme of your influence, I think is key. And this cannot listen, it doesn't mean you have to be a perfect human being. You're going to make mistakes, you're going to learn, you're going to grow, but it's like trying to be congruent with your message consistently for you. It's high performance habits for your book, you talk about it in your podcast, you talk about it in your events, you live that and you showcase that. For me with greatness, it's kind of like what are the core themes of living a great life and business, health, relationships and everything involved and it's trying to do the best to live that all the time and talk about it consistently.

Including the failures. Absolutely. That's part of it.

Showcasing the failures. I think when influencers showcase their mistakes.

And failures, it makes them more real, more likable.

Yeah, that's why everyone likes me because I'm a hot mess all the time. Exactly. So you got to get clear on the message first. Do you have a mechanism for, it's like, well, I kind of like everything. How do you figure out what your message is?

Is?

Is there a process or just like some journaling that you could share with people?

Yeah, I mean first sitting down and saying what do you want to be a role model on? Like if you want to be a role model, what is it about? And how does that translate into a person's real life? Like what would you say to an actual person to help them or inspire them? And you just have to start writing those words like what would I say? Like what would I say? It's that old thing of like if you could put a message on a billboard or if Something was written on your tombstone, like what are those things? For me, a lot of people know it's like live, love and matter. Because when I faced my death as a 19 year old kid, I was like, oh, I learned I really want to live life. I learned because I was a heartbroken kid, I wanted to love again and feel my heart again. I learned that life is super short, so you better make your difference. So live, love and matter became central to everything I did for 15 years. Like every message revolved around that because that was me. and that was a unique experience I had. I think a lot of people have to go and dig down deep into their experiences of their life and say, what were some of the gifts of the lessons that I learned? Some of the awful things that happened to us or the challenging things, those struggles, there's a story there, and that story can reveal some lessons or things that you might be a role model to for people. And it doesn't have to be so finite that it's like, this is it forever. 'Cause you'll keep evolving, you'll keep learning. but there's hints there and you can go dig in your past to find some of those hints. You can also just ask, well, what are the passions that I really feel in my heart that I just want to communicate right now? Some people it's like, well, that's fashion for them. Some people it's health for them.

Being a mom.

Being a mom, being an educator, just showing everyday life. That's fine because ultimately, again, you are the message. So the most important thing isn't to figure out like, what am I going to say? It's the most important thing is who are you?

Who are you is the key.

Dig deep, man.

Answering that question.

Yes, who are you? One of the things we do is we, I ask people, you know, come up with three words that describe the best of who you are. Mmm.

That's great.

Like these are aspirational words. If you could think of like three words, when I'm at my best, these three words really define me. Yeah. And then I say, okay, now figure out what are three words that really describe the best of you when you're with other people? Like how do you treat them? And then what I have to do is I literally have them program in their phone as an alarm.

Yeah, I have that in my alarm. Still 8:30.

You still do? Yeah.

I need to change to like 6:30, but it's like an 8:30.

That's it. Mine's still in here. You know, I've been doing this for what, ever? There was my 9:00 a.m. Dynamic, bold, and confident. And that was for today. Because I was like, you know, I'm usually a little more reserved in Lewis's.

Interviews because I'll use the man. Be a little more bold and confident. I have loving giving Achiever.

That's it.

Loving giving achiever. So, I could probably change that too, yeah.

Yeah, so I switch mine every week.

So, three words that you would describe as yourself and then three words that you would want other people to describe.

You as or that you would describe yourself as. Yeah, so three words you describe yourself as, like the best of who you are.

Yeah.

And that's just you, like your identity. And then the other one is more like relationships. Like three words to describe how you are with other people. For example, my word there, bold. Like that can describe me as a person how I think, but I wouldn't want you to ever go, well, Brennan, when he's with me, he's real bold. Yeah, that's different. Like how you are with other people should have a certain definition and description and how you are by yourself should have a certain. And that's how you start to get to know yourself. Like, oh, I'm like this as a person.

And with other people, I'm like, this is a person. And it's like shaping your own internal identity of your qualities.

Yeah.

And reminding yourself of who you are.

Labeling yourself a little bit in a positive way.

Yeah.

Because most people, they take the labels the world gave them. Oh, you're just the athlete, Louis. Yeah, exactly. If you just took that and that was all you ever owned and you never explored beyond that, we wouldn't be here. That's true.

Right?

We're here because you explored, who am I? And you are still doing that. So am I.

Like, it's not like it's a thing that stops, but people want to see you working that through. I think like 15-20 years ago, like in teens, I used to say like, man, you suck to myself all the time. Yeah. Like, you're a loser. You suck. I hate you. You know, I'd say these words to myself, like, you're never gonna do anything better than this person or you're never gonna be a nut, whatever. I would say these things internally.

Yeah.

And those start to shape you as well. Yeah. And they start to shape how you treat other people, your reactions and how you treat yourself.

That's right.

So I think this is a very powerful, simple exercise that we've been doing for so many years now that we kind of forget the power of this. But I'm glad you made this reminder because I never say those things to myself anymore. It's always like, you're kind, you're loving, you're passionate, you're wise, you're giving, you're caring. I say these things all the time. I never even say anything negative.

Give yourself patience on the days you're not. And that's a hard thing for people because they're supposed to be kind and one day they're a jerk and then they're like, I'm a jerk and they go back to that whole bad label. But it's like what your audience wants to see if you're an influencer is you working through the development of you. They want to be on that journey with you and see like, oh, I see him or her becoming. Because they're willing to ask the hard questions about themselves and explore who they are. Because if you can't be an influencer, not explore who you are. I mean, even the great presidents of our time were always in motion of exploring who they are, the great business people. I mean, it's not like, you know, Elon Musk has been exactly Elon Musk exactly 10 years ago as he is today. It's like you're seeing this evolution, this change, and sometimes it's a hot mess and other times you're like, oh, this person's, you know, people want to be on the journey with you as you're exploring who you are. And if you're not exploring who you are, you're not growing.

And if you're not growing, the audience is not growing. It starts to die. They're not interested. So true. So get clear on your message, figure out your three words, And that's a great start there. Now the next thing is figuring out your market. What do you mean by that? What is a market?

Yeah, well one, I don't like that term, especially for guys like you and me who we do so many walks of life.

Yeah.

Listen to your show and my show.

Multiple industries and markets.

Yeah, I look at the analytics of the Brendon Show podcast. It's like, holy crap, all these countries, all these, you can't if you come to our events, I've gone to your events too, You can't do a demographic run of that audience.

Not like all 32-year-old male sales executives.

No, and that's the car industry. That's the old world of marketing. You had to speak to one specific person. What people don't understand if they've never studied the history of marketing is that the reason that niche marketing came out, that concept of just identifying one person to talk to, and some people now say, you know, identify your customer avatar. I'm like, no, you're identifying avatars. It's plural. Because the reason that came so popular in marketing back in the day was only for one reason because in the 20s, sort of the golden age of marketing and advertising, you only had so much budget to run a certain ad on one platform. So you really had to get super niche and narrow. Now we're able to reach a couple billion people. Now we're able to have broader conversations. So what you want to do with your market is try to understand What are the aspirations of the people I want to serve looking like? It's about the aspirations, not about the demographics.

It's the mindset.

Yes.

And I always talk about that like for me, school greatness is not about, you know, the 32 year old mom with two kids. Right. It's more of a mindset and a mentality.

Yeah.

And that's what we look for. Someone with a growth mindset. Someone go. I call them conscious achievers. Yeah. People are looking to achieve in their life, but in a conscious way. Yeah. They want to grow personally and they want to impact people around them.

I love that.

If they have that mentality, then you're a part of the community.

Yeah.

And that's who I try to speak to. Yeah. But it could be a 16 year old or a 60 year old. Yeah. Could be people from all over the world. But it's like this conscious achieving mentality. I love that.

And that's what I focus on. I love that. You got to have that.

Yeah.

You have to have that. And I, what I tell people all the time is like, if you're not out with your students, your fans, your followers, and you're not really getting to know them, at some point you're gonna lose that audience because you just don't know them.

That's true.

You need to know what's in their heart, not their age. You know it in their heart, not, you know, every part of their background or where they were raised and everything else like that. That kind of market analysis is overdone and corporations love to pay for that. And when they do deals with me, they're always like, Tell me everything about your people. And I'm like, they have the aspiration to go to the next level. For me, that's it. That is my market. I have always for the last 15 years marketed and talked to people who were in that transition moment of their life and ready to go to the next level. I didn't speak to those who were just starting. That was my audience. You know, who didn't know what person I always went high end in the sense of like, I speak to people who are ready to go to the next level. They've already got one level of, you know, security or sense of themselves or success. And now they're like, you know what? Next level time. So they're like in that phase where like gearing up, you know? They're like, here we go. They're not kind of like, oh, I don't feel motivated. I don't get... That wasn't my audience. My market was an aspiration to go to the next level and I was focused on that. And it's what made for me with our brands, like how did you do all those seven figure launches? 28 of them? I spoke to that aspiration specifically.

So people knew, this is for me. So if you're in like a 20 seconds, say you're doing a video to attract the aspirational mindset or the heart set of this individual. And you have a video that spreads out to the world and you know it's going to attract a certain type of person to come into your offering. What would you say in 15-20 seconds, a few key words that would be leading people into kind of where you wanted them to go. So it was the right kind of mindset. What would you say?

You'Re somebody who you've already, you feel like you've tried everything. You've been at this for years, you don't feel like you've gotten that breakthrough just yet. You're doing good, but there's too many days you don't feel as motivated or as driven as you really want to to go to the next level. And you feel like you need some more empowerment to really achieve that next level. Not kind of like just get inspired or motivated because that can come and go, but rather you're looking for real tactical solutions that will help you earn that will help you become more, that will show you step by step, this is how you reach that next level. And not from my opinion, it's that I've spent 15 years researching the highest performing people on the planet. What they do is very specific. And if you're honest, you haven't been very specific. You've been random. And because you're good, you already have some success, you're able to just go through the motions. But going through the motions is the killer of the high performer.

True. Right? Because-- Good to great, yes.

You can be good. But that's not gonna take you to the next level. So I'm gonna assume you're already good, but you sense inside that there's a restlessness and there's a struggle there that you don't know what that breakthrough feels like. But you also, you're very aware of this next level. You have a dream, you have something you want to achieve. So let's just dial in your motivation. Let's dial in your habits, but let's.

Give you the discipline and the willpower to make it happen. And that's why you need to go to Influencer 2019. He's got it. It's dialed in.

He's got the message dialed.

The market, the message is doubted.

-It'S fired up being around you all the time, brother, because we both really believe that we can help people do that because that's where our footsteps have been for 15 years to help people do this.

-Yeah, it's amazing. So get clear on your message, the market. Then there's a method.

What does the method mean? I always love to talk about method with people. -Method acting. -Yeah, yeah, yeah.

No, for real.

It's like Picasso had a method. Van Gogh had a method. Beethoven had a method. They were thoughtful about the art of what they did. And influencers need to think about that. You thought about, I want a podcast that's gonna be like this. And as you hone that in over the years, the podcast got better because you brought more intention to the method.

That's true.

Actors who just show up and kind of read the words, not good. but the greats, they're so thoughtful about the turn of the phrase and how they're going to do this. The great musician, the great artist, they obsess about the actual art of the thing. Because again, just showing up, especially when you're good, it's going to limit you. Now you want to be more intentional and say, what is this? It's like I've shared with you before, having the blessing of working with Oprah, she starts meetings by asking, what's our intention?

Yeah. Here.

Greatness requires a lot of intention.

It does.

It doesn't just happen by showing up. Yeah. You gotta get clear on the results and the experience you want to create.

Yeah, you see a really high achieving influencer do a photo shoot way different than somebody who's not high achieving. The intention and the placement of things of where this goes and how this closes everything. That's method. That's like bringing art to the method. When I wrote Motivation Manifesto, I was like, okay, I'm gonna write a book that's never been written before in its tone that hasn't been seen in hundreds of years. I was like, how do I figure that? I'm like, it was an art project. If what you are doing is an influencer, it doesn't feel like an art project.

You're just simply doing it wrong and you're gonna burn out and you're gonna quit. So give me examples of methods for.

Someone like a Rachel Hollis and a Jay Shetty. What's their method from your point of view? Yeah, Jay's super intentional about his videos. I sit them down and we did an interview. influencer day with him and we sat, I asked him like 40 questions. How do you do these videos? He's intentional from when the video is changing to the tone of the music and when it's lifting to when other people appear in the video versus just him. He's intentional about the length of the video. He's intentional about what day the video is posted. He's made it. Time, everything. Because what most people do, slop it together, throw it up. He's like really tried to dial it down to a very specific process that draws emotion from people. And so that's a method.

And his thing is viral video. It's artistic viral video that creates an emotional feeling for someone. It's not just like this scientific videos or how-to videos. It's like an emotional feeling that people want to watch and share.

And you've thought through that too as well. That's why you've got hundreds of millions of views. And it's just like, versus guys like me who sometimes just put up a very inspiring video, but we didn't put the B-roll in. We didn't put the music go up and down. We didn't clip it the right spot. You know, so that's a different method. It's a different method. Same, exactly. Different method results. And to those who put more into the method, they win. They're the better artists. Like, an influencer has to understand you are in the art of impacting people. And if you're in the art of.

Impacting people, you'd better focus on the art as much as the impact. You know what I'm saying? That's really good. What about someone like a Rachel Hollis? You know, someone who's skyrocketed over the last year and a half that seems like came from nowhere.

Yeah.

Right? We know that she's been working for seven years, written five or six books, and had a successful blog in a different space, but just boom, shot up one of the biggest selling books of the year behind, I think, Michelle Obama.

Yeah.

Kind of felt like overnight, like this influencer with millions of followers and huge business within a year. Quickly documentary books.

Now, she's great.

What would be, the method for someone like that that you see? Or is it kind of more... No.

It'S again, it starts with being intentional about the art and what you're doing.

About your message.

Yeah, I mean she still sends down every single morning. She writes down, here's what my dreams, here's what my goal is, here's what I'm gonna do. She came out to this, before everything really really took off, she came out to the house and we sat down together and it was so clear. She was asking me questions about where her career could go. that were really thoughtful. And people don't see that all the time because she might just post, you know, here's what I'm wearing today or here's a picture of the kids. But she's really thoughtful about where her career is going and she's super thoughtful about talking to the women in her market from a place that she's been there. Like she gets it. She knows that woman, she knows that person's experience and she's going to verbalize that and she's very thoughtful about the words she uses to connect. Because part of the biggest method in influencing is being very artful about your messaging.

-That'S true.

-She doesn't say a lot of things over here but she says these things over here all the time.

-Over and over again. It's like a formula. It's like every six posts you see this, you know, another kid photo that's talking about this something different. Yeah.

Yeah.

So, she's always in the audience's mind and using the words that use and describing the feelings they have. She's also part of her method, her real art is her vulnerability. To say, you know, start a book. I peed my pants. Like literally. You know, she, you know, this person dumped me. You know, I hated myself because I was like this.

I almost got divorced.

Yes. That takes a lot of intention to go, you know, I'm going to reveal some things here that I'm not comfortable with. just like you did with masculinity. That was guts. That took a lot of art versus just saying, Hey, here's a map. Let me tell you guys this. I'm gonna reveal this story and this vulnerability. That's art. And what people don't realize is the greatest artists of all time were incredibly vulnerable as much as they were telling you what to do. We love Bob Dylan not just because he told us what to do and made us want to throw our hands in the air and like march or get fired up. It was the vulnerability of the journey. That's why we love Kerouac. That's why we love Emerson. That's why we love some of the real greats is because they were thoughtful about sharing insight into their pain. Because people, you know, the influencers who fail always are bright and shiny and they don't realize a lot of art does come from pain. And a lot of the messages that actually does help people you know, is acknowledging things. Like, for years, I didn't want to tell people that at the beginning of my career, I went bankrupt. I told them how much I struggled. It was hard, and I had to get out of my own way and all these other things. But I didn't want to use the word bankrupt. I was like, oh, God, you know, because that was just like, here I am teaching people stuff, but I had this huge struggle. And I was like, no. And when I said, that just happened. So let me describe what had happened and not be afraid of it. I wouldn't know from that moment we would go on to build, you know, everything that we built by any means. But I wanted to avoid that because it was so painful to me. And at some point, real artists connect to the pain and they give it voice, verbalization or symbols.

Yeah. The greatest songs are not just like fairy tales. You know, there's, there might be a beautiful ending, but it's also like some darkness and struggle in there as well. Yeah. And that's what you can do in your business or as an influencer.

What would you know? The greatest art there always comes down to being almost an all is the method is you learning to fight for who you are.

Ooh.

Because right now, you think about the biggest memes that we see right now, it's always like, don't let them judge you, don't let them tell you down, don't let them tear you down, don't let them hate on you, don't let them stop you. And that whole, what's central to that, the architecture of that actual messaging is live your life, show your truth, be who you really are, not what everyone else expects you to be. And that's what always comes back to the message again. You are the message. And if you keep dampening yourself based on what other people tell you to be or how you're supposed to be, then all of a sudden one day you wake up unfulfilled and you wake up unfulfilled, guess what? Not easy to be motivated. Not easy to be motivated, then guess what? You're not going to create the content, the curriculum, the products, the programs, the business. Because you know, some people look at us sometimes and they're like, oh, well, you just as a podcast. They have no idea you have this empire behind that.

Right?

Right?

Brendan does some email, he's big on Facebook with quotes. Okay, and they have no idea of a huge, you know, 200 employees across my brands, you know, it's like the impact that we've had, let alone just what I do, it's all the other people we've mentored and, you know, like inspired, that can't come from a place of me being unfulfilled. I have to work so hard to be a happy, fulfilled, motivated, disciplined man. so that I can have that perpetuate across the brands and the business.

That's it. What would you say is your method then? And has it changed over the last 10 years? Is it okay to change your method?

Yeah, I think it always does. I mean, no actor does a movie the same way. And if they do, you're tired of them. I think it's a tremendous amount of diligence in sitting down and asking, what is it I want to convey here? And how do I want to do it in a way it's unique to me and different in the market. So what do I want to convey? How is it unique to me? How is it different in the market? And so like my greatest art piece so far was Motivation Manifesto. You read that and you're like, I've never read a book like this my entire life. It's written like it's from the founding fathers of our country kind of tone. It reads a little like the 1700s, but it punches you in the face every page.

To be or not to be.

It's like such a hard It's like you read it and you're like, Whoa, I really got to focus on these words here. This guy, there's no fat in that entire book. There's not one word you could take out. It's just, I worked so diligently on that. And I think what that was was an evolution of me saying, I don't want to just create books, to create books, to sell books, to make money, and to inspire people in this specific way. I want to be challenged in my own artistic process. I want to push the boundaries of what my art can be. I don't know how to write a book like this. It's not even my tone. I'm gonna figure it out. High Performance Habits. I've never done a full-scale psychological science research-based book.

And I was like... You went deep in that, like two years of research.

Three years of research.

Three years of pretty much every day of my life.

You didn't talk to anyone. You were just like in the hole. Yeah, in the hole. The largest study ever done on high performers, even to this day, no one's beat it, right? Two million plus data points, people from 190 countries. We had all these academics looking at my research, trying to make sure that we got our correlations right and our variables right and all these other things. Like, I didn't know how to do that. Yeah, but that was an evolution of me getting better and stronger and more nuanced at what I was doing. And I'm telling people, you know, you're in trouble if you keep going through the motions. Yes. The more you go through the motions, the more you get miserable about the work. The more you're intentional and you challenge yourself to push your boundaries, the more you'll stay alive.

Before we continue this video, make sure to subscribe below and turn on the notification bell right now so you don't miss out on these great videos every single day. What do you think for those who aren't happy right now? They may be listening and they're not happy with their financial situation. What would you say would be the first few steps for them? Is there some prompts they could go through and write down first to question or analyze beliefs? Is there, should they look at their bank account and see how many revenue streams they have coming in? Should they look at, if they're, should they invest in a coach? If so, you know, what should they be looking at as action steps?

I definitely think the best place to start is your thoughts, beliefs and words. So I have an exercise that I love that just was so sobering for me back in the day. Have you ever done that one where you write a letter to money as if if it's a person.

I'm not sure if I've done that exactly. I've written many letters to myself. Future self, past self. But tell me, tell me this.

Lean. Yes. I, yeah, it's where you write a letter to money as if it's a person and you do a very stream of consciousness and you just let it rip and It's so illuminating because most of us have such a push-pull going on with money where it's like, of course, like if you handed me 10 grand, I'd be like, thank you very much.

This is awesome.

But then we also feel dirty for pursuing money. We think rich people have no morals. We think we'll have to sacrifice the things we love. We think we'll lose friends and family if we get rich. We'll, you know, whatever. And so when you do it stream of consciousness and really treat it as if it's a person or a thing, It blew my tiny mind when I saw it.

What happened to you? What were your... Oh my God.

Well, my, okay. So, so I had lots of, I love you.

I wish I could, I love you.

I want to get out of my life. It was like a dramatic relationship. Yeah.

Yeah, it is. It's an abusive relationship. And they say if you take the money out and you replace intimacy, It's like man or woman, whatever you're into, samezies. Yeah, it's the whole thing. I mean, you got to be ready to be super humiliated if you're going to do any of this work. But mine was all, I love you, I wish I had more of you, I resent needing you, I don't trust that you'll stick around.

Ooh, man.

All that kind of stuff.

And how were your intimate relationships during that time?

Same.

I want you, but I don't trust you.

Yeah, really my hair is still standing up. So that's a real doozy. And then once you get all of your dirty laundry out on the page, then you can start questioning it, you know, like we were talking about before.

So how did you question personally what came up for you?

And how did you- you- know, yeah.

Take me back, Jen. Take me back to the painful.

I'm gonna go pour a drink. I'll be right back. Ah, you know, I don't remember. Okay, let me think.

Was there one thing that stood out the most where you're like, oh, I realized I've been doing this and why would money ever come to me consistently because of this thought?

Oh my God, I'll tell you the biggest. Just totally blew my mind. It actually wasn't from writing the letter. I did, I know I had a lot of things with the letter, but the one that just brought me to my knees was I was at yet another coaching seminar in Las Vegas or something and there was another brilliant coach speaking on the stage and his fee for an annual, you know, private thing was $85,000. And I was just like, you know, I come from Italian immigrants. My dad came over, you know, he's kept his money buried in the backyard. Like he had no idea what I was talking about with all this stuff.

And.

I remember because I was hardcore and not screwing around and I'd made that decision to figure out how instead of figure out why not, I was like, all right, how am I gonna get $85,000? to work with this man. And God, I feel like I'm going to throw up just telling you this. The thought of that, like opening myself up to that possibility, I mean, that's house money. That's like as irresponsible as it gets, right? And the fact just the mere act of opening myself up to that and making myself available to be somebody who.

Would find 85,000 And saying, if it were possible, how would I do it? Yeah. And so what did you first say?

Oh my God. Okay. I actually get a lot of my information through quick visual visions. And I had this image of my dad who's so sweet and not the best at showing intimacy, but he loved me to death. And the way that he would show me was by giving me a 20 or helping me with my rent that month or whatever. It was always through money is how he showed affection. And I had this image of him in his little yellow v-neck sweater, which I have now made kind of famous, but with his hands in his pockets, looking at his feet, so sad, because if I got rich, I wouldn't need him anymore. And that's. what was holding me back?

Really?

It was like, I literally, that vision like had slime on it. It's like I dredged it up from the bottom of my emotional swamp. Like it was, it was so profound for me. It really blew my mind. And it changed a lot of stuff for me moving forward.

So when you came to realize that, did you, this was all just unconscious. You weren't even thinking about it before, but you knew that's how you got love and he was able to express love in that form by helping in some way financially or something like that. So when you realize that, did you address him about it or was it more about you addressing with yourself and letting it go and realizing that he's still gonna love you even if it's not through that way? What was that process like?

It was awesome. I started visualizing him being really proud of me, which he totally was.

And.

Being happy for me and feeling relief that I wasn't Gonna be, you know, living in a gutter next week. And this was the biggest part for me, which I cannot believe I was able to do because I have issues around this with my dad, but I still let him give me money. Because in the old days, I was like, you don't see who I am. I just told you I got a million bucks for a book deal. Like, you're not listening to me. But he it's the it's all he knew how to do. So I would tell him all of my great successes. And at the end of the conversation, he'd always be like, you need some money. You need $100.

I can.

And I'd be like, sure, Dad, that'd be great. And it made him really happy. I was like to get 100 bucks.

Yeah. Yeah.

And it really healed our relationship. It was me. It was amazing on so many levels. And I think this is common for a lot of people. I think a lot of people don't realize that what's holding them back is they don't want to outshine their parents in some way.

Yeah.

Or their siblings or Abandonment.

It's abandonment.

It's hard when you're like, I think there's a lesson in the 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene. I think it's maybe in that book, which is not saying we should live by this book, because it's more about strategies of war and power, but there's some good lessons, there's some amazing lessons in there. And one of them is, I think it's never outshine your mentors. like always pay respect. Like you can, you can, you can do greater things, but make sure you're always paying respect to your mentors and not like belittling them once you surpass them type of thing. So I think it's a figuring out how do we, how do we continue to let our, our stars shine bright, but also continue to elevate the mentors that were there before us and, you know, give them the honor and respect.

Oh, yeah.

You're able to heal that, you feel like from that process of just discovery and awareness.

Yeah, yeah. And it was so fun after that, like seeing how much joy it gave him to give me money. I was like, oh my God, that's like, that's so dear.

So you didn't stop receiving money even though you didn't from him, even though you were like, I don't need to feel loved and I don't need the money anymore. You didn't stop it because it allowed him to express his feelings and emotions and yeah for you, right?

But how much of a sacrifice is that for me? I mean, whoop-de-doo. So he, that's, it's just all he knew, you know?

So that's beautiful. What was, so what were the steps on how you got the 85,000? Or is that something you invested in or no?

Yeah, I did.

I did.

85,000, that's, that's a lot of money for coaching. What? So, so you thought to yourself, there's no way I could do this, but then you started to shift and say, well, Okay, if it was possible, how would I do this? What did you do?

God, well, I love this process. Oh, my gosh. Okay, so this is why also I'm always screaming and yelling about you have got to do stuff that scares you.

Scares you.

Scares you.

If you are not scared, you are on the wrong track. It is so important.

And here's the thing, before you get into what you're about to say, if you didn't figure out a way to make that investment, what's good to like that process is going to accelerate everything because now you need to be in motion, you need to overcome fears, you're in action, you're creating mode as opposed to safe mode and like, well, I don't know how I'm going to make it, so I'm just going to stay where I'm at. So it forced you to get into creativity, action, value in the world. So, so what did you do?

Ah, after I Finished throwing up. I, you know, I actually, to be clear, and this is all such a long time ago that I don't remember all the details. I ended up not working with that particular coach, but then there was another coach who charged just as much.

Yeah.

And, and I ended up hiring that coach. I, you know, and I, and I remember, you know, it's, and this this. What is this saying? I can't remember the actual saying, but it's like when you desire something, when you really, really, really desire it, you can't have the desire without the means to make it manifest. If it's a real desire, because, you know, day sire is of. It's Latin, not Spanish, but day sire is of God, the sire, the father. So it's been given to you by the universe. So why would the universe give you desire? And they'd be like, psych! Can't have it, right?

Interesting. So if you desire something, if you want something deeply, you're saying that the universe has the tools and resources for you to manifest it.

Yes.

And this is going way out to the cosmos.

Bring it.

You literally cannot have a thought and a desire without the manifestation of without whatever it is already in existence because they are one and the same. Because time and space are not real and blah, blah, blah. I don't really understand it, but I've read it. Have you ever read the Science of Getting Rich by Wallace Wattles?

No, but that's what I think Rhonda Byrne read and created the Secret from. I think it was that book was.

The Okay, first of all, it's like this thick. It's so short, you'll love it.

Okay, the science of getting rich, is.

That what it is?

The science of getting rich by Wallace Wattles. I've read it 600,000 times. That was my go-to. I loved it. And there's a line that I used to memorize. What you think is to think the truth, regardless of your environment or something like that. What you think is to think the truth. So what you think is the truth, regardless of your surroundings. And it really goes into the fact that the universe is a thinking substance and when you impress your thoughts into it, it makes, and it's almost like it's a giant gooey blob.

And so the process of investing in that $75,000, $85,000, what were the action steps on how you were able to think, okay, how do I do this? I don't have the resources, I don't have the money. Right. What were the process of thinking, acting, creating value and attracting that money to invest in it?

So what I did was I really looked through everything I could sell and my, you know, really it was, and then I thought, so my car and.

My, yeah, my cat, everything.

Yes, literally my knitted things. And then I was like, I'm gonna have to borrow it from somebody and I'm going to have to ask somebody for it. And I'm not going to say who I went to because they asked me not to. But I had somebody in my life who really believed in me, who was much older, who didn't know anything, who totally thought this coaching stuff was malarkey and what the, you know, very old school. But I knew they had money and I knew they really believed in me. So I got on a plane the next next day, I called them and I was like, I'm gonna be there tomorrow. So I had to buy a ticket for the next day, which was like a thousand dollars, even in coach, which I was still flying.

Yeah. Yeah.

And for me, that was like, I thought, oh, the nose. But I did it because I was, I was just, and I just, I remember, oh, my God, this was such a weird moment where I was so nervous about all of it that I had a chocolate bar. And I am not an emotional eater. I have other freaky things I do, but I, I remember just like, shoveling this chocolate bar in our mouth, like, I'm emotional eating.

This is what it feels like.

I'm just eating this whole chocolate bar, getting on the plane the next day, flying out to see this person, and, you know, sort of spending the day and just being like, you know, I just, I want you to know everything's okay. Like, there's nothing to worry about. And, and then asking them and, and just sort of explaining, like, I've been working with coaches. I have had such incredible success, and I feel like to really get to the next level of where I want to be. I really believe I need this and I really believe in this person who can help me. And I mean, when I told them the price tag, I will never forget the look on their face. Incredulous. And we just sat there with it and I was like, that's what I'm asking. Oh my God, I'm gonna cry. And they wrote me a check.

Wow.

And I made the money back. Maybe, I mean, maybe that year, like.

I.

And I hustled. I was like, you know, this person so believes in me. I'm not, this is not, this is about not letting myself down, not letting them down, you know, whatever. But I made it back and kept doubling my income from then on. Yeah, so I can't tell you how much I did not want to ask them for that money.

It's the worst thing in the world when you don't have money for something and you ask whether it's even a parent or a friend, it's the worst feeling. I remember when I was 23 to 27, I was broke. I was living on my sister's couch for about a year and a half during that time. And every day I felt like a bum. because I wasn't paying rent for that year and a half. I wasn't paying for food. I really wasn't contributing in any way financially. And I remember every day I was mooching off my sister. I was just thinking to myself, I never want to have this feeling ever again. It's the worst feeling. Sometimes it's necessary, depending on where you're at in your life, and you might need a phase of a period of time, but eventually One of the greatest things that happened was my sister said, she was just too nice. She let me, it was supposed to be like a month, she let me stay for a year and a half. And she said, okay, Louis, it's time you start paying rent. And it was the scariest thing ever, but it was also the greatest gift she gave me because she was like, you either need to pay rent or you need to leave because I need to find another renter here, whatever. so I left. So I left because I didn't want to pay rent. And I went to my older brother.

Oh, my God.

Good thing you have a big family.

And I said to him, hey, I need a place to stay. I don't have any money. And he said, okay, but my wife is saying you got to pay something. So you got to pay 250 bucks a month. And for me, that was like, where am I gonna get 250 from?

And.

But again, it was a gift because. It got me like saying, okay, I gotta go find this. I gotta go like, I gotta get over myself and make that money. And I don't want to rely on like living in my brother and his wife's house every day. I need to get enough money to pay for my own apartment. So that gave me the energy and the clarity to start working and hustling. I'm curious, what were the action steps you took during that year to package or position or bring in new clients? what was the thing that allowed you to make that money back?

Hustling. And again, though, not just hustling, but creating big coaching packages. Like it's about the income stream, right? Like if it's about money, get your ducks in a row about income streams and how and ways to make the money. So, you know, because I was working with a coach who was at a much higher level than me, They could see what I had going for me already, what I was good at, what networking, you know, so so they and that's the thing that's so fascinating to me is like coaches, God, they yes, they often cost a very lots of money, but they save you so much money because you don't spend five years trying to figure out stuff they can figure out in a half an hour conversation. So, you know, figured out a couple income streams. It was, it was more, I did a lot more private coaching from then on where I would, you know, get these like six month coaching packages. I wasn't charging $85,000 yet, but I was charging a lot. And, and I believe around that time is when I started writing youg Are a Badass.

Yeah.

So, I mean, I had no idea. I mean, I got like $35,000 as an advance for that. That was not, I wasn't like, I will write it and it will be on the New York Times list. Yeah, hope, but no way.

If you're like 35 grand, you're like, this is great, I'll take this money. Exactly. And I'll help pay off some of my debt and it'll be a nice piece for me to showcase my talent.

And I'll bring in other clients. Exactly.

It was more of a business card than anything. Well, that business card turned into helping millions of people. So I'm glad you wrote the business card. I'm curious, A friend of mine, Dean Graziosi, who's a brilliant entrepreneur and coach, he says that you pay attention to what you pay for. And when we don't invest in something that isn't scary or that isn't at least important enough because you're like, wow, I just put this much money in something, you put your attention and time into improving, into letting go of something or in turn to making that money back, whatever that money was invested for it, you really start to pay attention to more of your time and energy when you invest more. Like you didn't say, let me try to like maybe make this money 75 grand back. Let me dabble in this a little bit here and there. Right? You went all in.

Well, I'll tell you, you'd think so, but it isn't guaranteed. There's that, do you know that whole 80-20 rule that they talk about? Like, yeah, so, 20% you know, 80% of people drop off and 20% actually do what they set out to do. And I see it all the time. I mean, I had online courses that were, I don't know, five or six thousand dollars, which is not nothing. By the end, 20% of the people would still be showing up for the calls. And these were like two month long courses. It wasn't like it was years and you had to stick around. It was like, seriously people. And it was just for a phone call every two weeks or whatever it was. But Absolutely, people, you know, it depends who you are.

I think you've got to want it bad enough. And you've got to be willing to say, this is not going to be easy. It's going to have painful times. And I really try to visualize in my days, you know, I try to visualize everything I want and, you know, it unfolding in a seamless way, the way I imagine it. But I also prepare for how am I going to respond and react when things don't go my way. When something gets in the way or I'm distracted or sick for a few days. Like, how am I going to arm myself with the tools or accountability or the coaching or the strategies to then continue to take the actions so that I don't go off the rails on what my commitments are, because nothing is going to be perfect in our journey.

Right.

So we've got to create those tools and strategies for when things go wrong, how you're going to keep showing up.

I love that. And, and the beautiful thing about being human is we are not very original when it comes to to our excuses and our distractions and all the ways that we try to knock ourselves off. So you know what they are. You know them by heart. So congratulations.

Exactly.

How do you think we actually make these habits stick? You know, we invest in a $5,000 course and it's only a couple months, but after three weeks, we lose excitement, you know, on whatever it is, our health, our relationships, our finances. How do we actually get these things to stick?

Well, one of the things that, one of the most important things I think is keeping that excitement up because it really is about staying connected to it and realizing that it's worth it when it gets sucky because as you said, it is going to. Don't be surprised that it gets sucky because it's going to. So I always talk about going to the spiritual gym, which is, you know, mindset and excitement are muscles. and like any other muscle, you don't get to go to the gym and get in shape and then stop going to the gym because now you're in shape. You have to continuously work it out. So the spiritual gym is constantly reading self-help books, constantly listening to inspirational speakers, meditating, listening to music that totally pumps you up, walking around in nature, having a mastermind partner, you know, getting a Coach, all of those things keep that muscle in shape because mind, I mean, how changing your mind. I mean, we do it like six trillion times a day. So keeping it strong takes a practice.

It does.

And even when you know, even when you've gotten results in the past or you've been healthy and fit for a while, it's easy to just say, I got this figured out and take a month off and realize, oh, I just gained 15 pounds and I'm, like, tired from walking now. It's a consistent thing you've got to do. I know from experience, it's a consistent thing you've got to do, is to pay attention to things that matter that you're excited about that you want. And you can't really take time off on habits to support you in accomplishing your goals. You can relax and take vacations and you can take moments and things like that, but in order to really continue to grow, you've got to keep putting in the work.

Absolutely. And I think, yeah, absolutely. And I think also with habits, getting into the habit of the habit is really important. Where, you know, so let's say you're working out every day and you go to the gym for an hour and a half, you know, there are going to be days when it is the last thing you want to do, but you just drag yourself there. And even if you just stay for 10 minutes, you're still in the habit of going to the gym. You're still a person. You still identify as somebody who works out. mm-. So that's, that's great. If you can just get into the habit of the habit.

And the thing that, you know, if you are a, a driven person, if you feel like you're busy and you've got a lot going on, for whatever reason, health seems to be the last thing on our minds to want to do at the end of the night. And so I like to layer the, the habit building or accountability, which is one. have an accountability friend or buddy that you have to go to do something with so that you're relying on them and they're relying on you. You're accountable to each other and you don't want to let someone down. Two, I think it's if you can invest in a coach, whether it be a trainer or something where they're showing up, you've paid for them, you're not going to miss it. You're going to look really embarrassing if you don't show up and you've paid for it. So try to layer the amount of accountability for yourself. so that there's just no excuse.

What you have to do to become unshakable is turn, when I, the metaphor I use is turn the snake into the rope. Meaning we all know the story, it's the middle of the night, you're walking through the yard or someplace and you see a snake and you freaked out.

You pull back, you come in the.

Morning and it's a rope. Once you know it's a rope, you're never afraid again.