How to Break Free from Overwhelm and Take Back Your Time with Michelle Gauthier

Foreign. This is Busy Getting Better, the podcast for women who are committed to prioritizing their own personal growth. I'm your host, Madison J. A mindset and money coach, a first generation wealth builder and a woman on a mission to help you master your finances and live your best life. Money is not all we are covering though, because in order to live your best life, you have to become your best self. So we are diving deep into all things personal development and bringing you the mindset that shifts money, tips and inspiration. You need to go out there, be bold, and build the life you can't stop daydreaming about. It's time to get busy, babe. Busy getting better. What is up? Welcome to the podcast, you guys. I think today's episode is going to be something that we could all benefit from a little bit. Today I've got Michelle Gothier on the show and Michelle is a life coach and host of the Overwhelmed Working Women podcast. Michelle helps high achieving women step out of stress and overwhelm so they can create more calm, more balance and more joy in their life. Her work is all about letting go of the constant pressure to do more and instead building a life that actually feels good. I'm so excited to dive into how the tool she teaches for reducing overwhelm can also translate into how we can think about and manage our money. This episode we get into tactical tips and tricks that you can implement to identify if you are in overwhelm and how to get out of overwhelm and how to be a girl that is grounded in her nose. I promise you we're going to get so much out of this episode, so let's go ahead and get on into it. What is up, you guys? Welcome back to the podcast. Today's episode is going to be such a good one. I think so many women are going to relate to. We've got Michelle Gothier on the podcast today and Michelle is a life coach specifically specializing in helping women get out of overwhelm. And I know personally I suffer from suffer from overwhelm a lot and I know a lot of listeners do too, because we are all high achieving women. We want to accomplish a lot of stuff and that unfortunately means saying yes to a lot of things and ending up in states of overwhelm. So selfishly, I'm so excited to have you on and talk to you about this and I just know that all of the listeners are going to get so much out of it. So, Michelle, welcome to Busy Getting Better.

Awesome. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me.

Yeah, absolutely. I. I first just am so curious. How did you choose overwhelm as your specialty? Like, why did we niche down to this? Let's get into that really quick.

Yes, because I got to the point in my life where I sort of had everything I ever wanted in theory, but it really didn't feel good. So I had, like, the job I had been working towards for years. I really wanted kids, and it took a super long time, and we ended up adopting our kids. So I had the kids and the husband and the nice house, and I had everything in theory, but it just didn't feel good. And it took me some time to figure out why not. What is happening here? What am I not appreciating? And I figured out that it was essentially because I was totally overwhelmed. And when you're overwhelmed, you know, it can be slightly different for people. But as a general rule, when you're overwhelmed, you just have too many things on your plate. It's very hard to be present anywhere. For example, when you're at work, you're thinking about your kids or your other responsibilities outside of work. When you're trying to have fun with your friends on a Saturday, you're thinking about what you should be doing at work. So it's really this struggle of never being present but always moving, being busy, and doing things. And so when I realized that the source of my problem was overwhelm, I thought, I cannot be the only one. And what I found out is that most overachieving A plus type women suffer from this, because we have always been given a pat on the back for being successful and doing a good job and getting A's in school and working really hard. And so we just do more and more and more. And you think that's gonna get you happiness, but it gets you overwhelmed instead.

My goodness, that is so true. It's like this badge of honor that we wear, right?

Yeah.

I can do a lot and I can accomplish a lot. And, like, look at me. Look at all this stuff. But then behind the scenes, it can feel like absolute chaos. I'm curious, how would you describe overwhelm? Because I feel like, like you said, it could be different for all of us, but how would you describe being an overwhelm and maybe, like, how to start identifying. I'm approaching overwhelm, right? Like, how can we start to be more clear on that?

Yeah, that's a great question. So Brene Brown, who, you know, is the woman who can define every single emotion and the way that she defines overwhelm versus stress. I think is a really good one. So stress is when you feel pressure. But stress can sometimes be good for you. And it may feel like, okay, let's just say, for example, you have a day where you've got like, six meetings, and you know it's going to be a lot. And it might feel kind of stressful, but, you know, you have the ability to do it. Overwhelm is the combination of many stressors. And what the result of overwhelm is is that you almost always end up doing nothing, kind of being frozen, or you end up doing something like, you know, cleaning out your Tupperware drawer, like something that has nothing to do with the actual problem, or I love shopping online or things like that. So you're taking action, but it's not in the direction of solving the overwhelm. And kind of the hallmark of overwhelm is when you just know there's a million things I have to do. I'm not. My mind is not clear enough for me to actually do any of them.

Yeah, I'm nodding my head because I feel like this is like, I found myself in that so often where I'm like, there's all these things I know I need to be doing. And also it feels like a really good time to deep clean my entire house. How about we do that?

Yeah.

Even though that would be on my to do list. Yeah.

Yes, exactly. And it's not like there's a bad thing to do, but it's not gonna fix the. The overwhelm. So I think the first thing that people need to do when they are thinking, oh, I just don't feel good. I don't like how I feel right now is to identify what is this feeling that I'm having? And usually overwhelm, people can tell. Like, I. I do workshops, and the first question I ask is explain the difference like I just did to you. And then I ask them, how do you know when you're overwhelmed? And people can almost always say for themselves. So for anybody listening, think about when that's you. I just mentioned that I might be in the midst of a busy day, start shopping online or do doing something like that. Other people say, oh, I'm really short with people. I'm kind of snippy to them, or I don't want to do anything, so I just go take a nap or hide in my room. So everybody kind of has their things that they do when they're overwhelmed, but most people are able to identify. I don't know. Do you know yours, Madison?

I feel like, mine is doing everything that's not on my to do list. Like, it really is like finding an excuse to do other things.

So I think when you are doing that, when you're noticing like, oh, okay, I'm giving my house a deep clean and like cleaning my baseboards with the toothbrush, you can say to yourself, wait, what feeling am I having right now? Oh, I'm feeling overwhelmed. Okay. Sometimes you can even feel it in your body, like a pressure in your chest. Or some people say it feels really heavy in their brain. Like there's a million thoughts running around. But just being able to identify it is the first step to really being able to gently move out of it.

Yeah, I think that's good. I also think disassociation. Right. Like you mentioned the scrolling. I feel like definitely, like, this is a lot. I'm just gonna go ahead and scroll for a little bit and then that scroll turns into like hours of just like. And now I'm even more overwhelmed. Cause I have less time to accomplish the things on my list. So I definitely noticed that that's a cycle that I've been actively trying to break and spending way less time scrolling way less time on social media. And that I feel like is that helps a lot. I think that that's probably a big contributor to a lot of people.

Yeah, I definitely think so. And the goal, I mean, life hands us situations all the time where we will get overwhelmed. And so the goal of being able to recognize it and know a couple of the steps to move out of overwhelm are just to shorten that cycle of overwhelm. To know you're in it, to take some steps to get out of it. And instead of it being a whole day or days or a week that it's maybe an hour or even sometimes I can catch it very early and be like, okay, that was 15 minutes. Good, I'm back.

Yeah, I think that's so good to talk about because it's going to happen. Right. I don't think we can avoid it, especially if we identify with being a high achiever or someone that's trying to accomplish a lot of stuff, trying to expand our capacity and expand, like what we're doing. We're probably always going to bump up against overwhelm. But I think I heard maybe it was Leila Hormozi talking about this and it stuck with me in this clip of mental strength. I don't know if that's how she categorized it, but the ability to be able to bounce back faster is actually like what our objectives should be. So it's not. Not experiencing it, but almost exactly what you're saying. How do we identify it for what it is and then understand our own way to work through it and kind of get back in the saddle versus letting it be, you know, days, weeks, months that go by before we can actually move through it and get back to the goal? So, yeah, what are the quickest ways to pull ourselves out of overwhelm? Like, what are some quick steps that people could implement?

I think once you realize that you're in overwhelm, the first thing to do is just to check and see what was I thinking? What were the thoughts that I was having before I had this feeling of overwhelm? So, for example, when I'm overwhelmed, the thoughts that I think, I'm a single mom, so I always think, there's no one to help me. I have to do this all on my own. Another one that I'll think is, I have to get this all done right now. Like, I can't prioritize because. Because everything is super urgent to me. Or like, I don't have the capacity to do this. I don't have the capability to do this, any of those thoughts. So once you realize what you're thinking and realize that those thoughts are coming into your head and just sort of observe them without judging them, that can just be helpful too. Another step in noticing. And then for me, for example, the step of I don't have anyone to help me isn't even true. Like, I have a business, I have an assistant. Because I'm a single mom, I have all these things in place. Someone comes and picks up my laundry and brings it back to me, clean and folded. I have friends, my parents will help me, so it's not even true. What I do is I replace the thought with, I actually do have a lot of help. I just need to ask for it. Or this doesn't all have to be today. What's the first step that I have to take? The way that I think about it is when we're overwhelmed, we want to take some kind of action. Before you take the action, it's more important to figure out, what am I thinking in my head that's causing this feeling of overwhelm? Because our thoughts always create our feelings. So if you can get down to the deepest level, it's like going to the true source of the overwhelm and trying to change that thought into something that also feels true. You can't be like, ah, no problem. I can get all this done, that won't work. But something for me, one that works really well is I can figure out the first step to take.

That's one of my favorites.

So after you do that and you can come up with a new thought that sounds reasonable, then you do just try to take that first small action. For example, I'm saying I have to get all these things done and I switch to, I know the first thing to do. Then I would say, okay, let's prioritize. Let's figure out exactly what is that first thing to do. And anytime a step feels too big, like I was just talking to a client this morning who was saying, I just really need to have a conversation with my husband and we need to talk about this, this and this. And I said, okay, but what's the step before that? Well, I really need to think about what I want to say. Okay. How much can you spend five minutes writing down a list of the things that you might want to say in that conversation? So just making the steps smaller and smaller and smaller. Because if you're like, oh, I have a problem with my partner, it needs to be fixed, all these things aren't working out. That's too much. You just have to keep making it smaller and smaller until it's a bite sized step that you can actually take.

Yeah, I think that's so good. And I think I talk about this too with finances, right. Because obviously money is a source of overwhelm for a lot of people. Right. And so it's just the same thing, like, how can we dial this down to like, what's just the first next step? Because I also find, right, that taking action in the direction of where you're going, it creates so much clarity, it creates so much momentum. So, like, whatever we can do to just take that first step. And I love something that you said in there of not feeling like we have to do everything today. I'm like, I have all these ideas, I have all these things I want to implement, right? Gotta, gotta get it done now. But that's so untrue, Right. I think often we might get into this fight or flight mentality, right. Of just feeling like everything is so urgent, everything needs to be done now. And so how do we start to identify, like, what's urgent versus what's important, what needs to get done versus what, what can wait? Like, how do we start to actually prioritize those things when we're figuring out what is that next step?

Yeah, I think that's great. And I think your money example Is perfect one, because if you think of a money goal like I want to pay off my credit card or I want to start saving, or I want to invest in something that feels so overwhelming no matter what the amount is. But the first small step is to like skip my Starbucks once a week or you know, whatever it is to save that money. So that concept can really apply to just about anything in life. So I think there are two sides to overwhelm. One is when you're already in it, how to get out and to start taking those steps. But I think that there's a lot of powerful work that can be done pre overwhelm so that you can kind of overwhelm proof your life. And so it differs for everyone. But for the most part, overwhelm is a volume problem, which means we have too much on our calendar, too many thoughts in our head, too many commitments, all of those things. So from a practical perspective, doing things like planning your week, looking ahead for the whole week, and that you could totally apply this to money too. Where do I need to spend money? Where do I, what do I need to do money wise for the week, to plan ahead on that and then see ahead of time, it's almost like doing a time budget for yourself to see, oh, I'm triple booked at 3 o' clock on Thursday. That's not going to work out for me. Or I have absolutely no white space on my calendar. And of course that's going to make a person feel overwhelmed when you have no breathing room. So that's a great example. Then when you get down the next level from that, like, well, how do I start saying no to this stuff? A lot of women are people pleasers and, or say yes as a default. I think many, most all. I don't know if I can make that proclamation. But most women are really raised to be people pleasers. Not necessarily on purpose. I think it's a societal thing. But it's really hard for us to say no. And we feel like we need to step into the role of being the solver, the person who can do everything and do it well. And so backing down from that, you have to learn how to first evaluate. Do I actually want to do this? Usually when I work with people on how to say no and we, we walk through a lesson on how to say no, what I find out is that most women aren't even stopping to evaluate if they want to say yes or no. That if someone asks them to do something, yes is sort of their default answer. And so just learning to say, okay, I use this tool called the Love and fit test. So I have people ask two questions to themselves. Let's say you get an invitation to do something and maybe it's to take on an extra project at work, or maybe it's a social thing or whatever it is to ask yourself, do I love this idea? So, for example, I love getting together with my friends, but I don't love going out during the week at all. So if they said, hey, do you want to go to happy hour on Wednesday? I love the idea of being with my friends. But the second question is, does this fit into the type of life that I'm trying to create? Not on my calendar, because if you look on a random Tuesday night, my calendar is going to be blank. But does it fit into the type of life I'm trying to create? And the type I'm trying to create is one that is free from overwhelm and full of like peace and relaxation and ease, especially in the evenings. So in that case, even though I love the idea, it doesn't fit. And so for me, that's going to be a no. So if you ask those two questions of anything, usually you'll get your answer, even if it's like a yes and a no. But if you get two no's, like, I don't love this idea and it doesn't fit into the kind of life I'm trying to create for myself, that's a definite no.

I think that's such a great, like two step process to just do a gut check because I think you're spot on. I know learning to say no was a revolutionary moment, I think in my own personal development journey. I vividly remember starting to say no to going out to the parties, to the drinking, just putting boundaries in place. When I got personally got started on my like personal development era, if you will, and I remember it felt so uncomfortable because I was so used to saying yes to everything. I had so much fun FOMO if I wasn't there, like, I wanted to be invited, I wanted to go all the things I wanted to fill my calendar. But to your point, when I started getting really clear around the life that I was trying to create and kind of filtering in and out these individual experiences. As I started to say no to more things, the way that helped me say yes to the things that actually lit me up and like that helps so much with forward momentum. I want to talk a little bit about the people pleasing, the perfectionism, like I feel like women, specifically, to your point, really Fall into that. Right. First of all, why are we like that? Why do we have to say yes to everything? And why do we want. Why do we feel like we have to do this?

I don't know. I do know, actually. I think we're just taught that that is how we are supposed to behave and that our job is to make other people happy first before we make ourselves happy. And in that case, anything anyone asks you to do, you need to say yes to it. So I think that's how we got there. But the fact that I'll speak for myself that we don't stop and evaluate that and think, does this work for me? Is that how I want to be? Do I want to be the yes woman to who asked me anything? No, I definitely do not. But I think it's a little bit tough at first. The other thing is, I really wore it as a badge of honor that I was the go to person. If you need anything, I'm your girl. Nothing is too much for me. I can get a million things done in a day. It was almost like I can do more than anyone else can do with a smile on my face. And that was like the proudest thing for me. And then I'm like, what kind of sick, twisted story was I telling myself there? Because that wasn't making me happy. It's true, I could do a million things in a day, but it doesn't give me the opportunity to experience life. It's not helping me create the kind of life that I want to live. Yeah.

Oh, my gosh. Okay. What do we say then to the girl who's just like, my calendar is chronically overbooked. I say yes to everything. I hate saying no. I hate putting boundaries up, because it does. It feels good to be invited. It feels good to be thought of. It feels good to be included. It feels good to be able to provide value to people. Feels good to be able to be seen as someone that can be counted on. Those are all things that are innately, like, want that to be part of our identity. So now we're going to start saying no to some things. Like, how does that impact our identity? And how do we start to, like, stand ground and find power? From this process and from this. This decision.

Yeah. I think the first thing to do is decide if the way that you're living works for you. So is it working for you to say yes to everyone? If it is, go ahead and keep on doing it. But usually when people come to me and they're talking about how people Pleasing is slowly killing them. It's because they just can't keep up with it anymore. And so there's a certain level of discomfort with doing that, with being the person who's constantly overwhelmed. And then on the flip side, there's the discomfort of saying no to someone or feeling like someone might not be happy to you. So I always like to say, just which brand of discomfort do you want to choose? Personally, I think living in constant overwhelm is worse than feeling like you might disappoint people at some times. But it's really important to know that if you have never been a person who says no, yet everyone has the potential. It's just a habit. And you can change that habit, that it will feel very uncomfortable for you to say no at first. And I think going into it, knowing I'm trying on a new skill, this is like, if you're just going to all of a sudden learn how to surf and you've never tried it before, it's going to be uncomfortable. You're probably going to be bad at it. You might think, what the heck am I doing? Why am I even trying this? But once you start saying it and you start. One tip I do tell people is when you say no to something, still put that thing on your calendar as a. This is what I would be doing if I had said yes to this. So you can get that positive feedback of like, oh my gosh, I created this free hour for myself, so now I can write a podcast, or now I can, like, call and catch up with my mom or, you know, whatever it is that you want to do in that time. So I think just knowing that it will feel uncomfortable at first is one of the big things. The other thing is we're sort of taught that being a people pleaser is nice and that it's kind. And in my opinion, what we're doing when we're people pleasing, let's say you ask me to do something that I don't want to do when I'm saying yes. What I'm really trying to do is control the way that you see me. So I want you to like me. So essentially, I'm not really being nice. I'm trying to control the way that you see me. So when you see people pleasing as more of a controlling versus a nice, I think that can be really helpful too, because that's a hundred percent what it is. We're really just trying to control the way that other people see us.

A hundred percent. Ooh, that's such a good Flip there. Because it is. It is. I want you to think I'm nice. I want you to like me. I want you to think all. All of these things. Right? But if you're not in it, you're not in it. And I think when you. You mentioned something that I think has been very helpful for me, and this is getting really clear on like, what my ideal week and what my ideal month looks like and starting to just. And you learn this over time, right? By saying yes to too many things, by saying no to too many things, but trying to figure out what my level of like, exertion of energy for a week or for a month can be. Honestly, learning my human design has been very helpful for me with this. I don't know. Are you into human design at all?

I know what you're talking about, but I don't know it.

Okay. I. I honestly think it would be interesting for you to learn, especially in Overwhelm, because that has been something that's been helpful for me, understanding my human design and how I operate and how I like to do a lot of things. But I also really need. I have a part of it that's like called a hermit. Like, I need a lot of rest and recharge time. I'm such an extrovert. I love to network, I love to socialize. And also I need like just downtime, you know? And so if I'm looking at my week in my calendar and I'm like, I already have two events, I already have three social things, like, is this gonna push me over? And to your point, knowing how else I would want to be spending that time, and I think this is critical, especially when we're trying to change habits, is not just saying no or trying to take something away, but replacing it with something that is more supportive of what you do want in that place, I think makes it a lot easier. So kind of what you were talking about, what else could I do with that time? And does that excite me more? And the other thing that I'll mention that's been really helpful and this kind of plays into the human design. Like the somatic side of things too, is listening to how it feels in my body, trying to get really in tune with if I am really excited about it, trusting that and if it just feels heavy on my chest or if it just feels like if there's any sort of eh in it. I just started trust myself more and more to say no to those things and learning to just trust my intuition more on if things are going to be the right yes and the right no.

Yes. That's so perfect. Because to the question of do I absolutely love this idea, you're getting the answer from your body. Your body's like giving it to you for free. You don't even have to think about it. It's just like, here you go. And for anybody listening who's like, I don't know what you guys are talking about with feeling it in your body. I really believe that all feelings show up in our body somewhere, but sometimes we just aren't used to paying attention to them. And I used to live very much in my. And not really attach my body or my feelings to them. So if you're a person who doesn't really feel that today, just start noticing it. When you feel a feeling like joyful or happiness, see where you can feel that in your body. When you feel sad or upset, see where you can feel that in your body. And it's. To your point. Matt said it's a great skill to have.

Yeah. I think as women, learning to lean into intuition and just trusting gut instincts on things, that is a superpower when you can learn to practice that. Yeah. So I want to ask you about. We want to be able to do more. Right. So, like, how do we practice this expansion of being able to do more without getting overwhelmed? Without getting overwhelmed. Does that make sense? Like, how.

Yeah.

How do we expand our capacity to be able to do more? Because I don't want to be capped at the same amount of things overwhelm me every single week. Like, I hope I can grow to be able to hold more. So how do we work on that? That.

Yes, yes. Well, first of all, I think doing less is a very important part of not being overwhelmed. But let's say if you own a business. Well, you do own a business, and you see a certain number of clients in a week, and that's kind of the max that you can do until you feel overwhelmed. Are you asking, like, how do I get to the point where I can see more clients or do more things? Is that what you're asking? Yeah.

Like, if you're like, okay, I'm overwhelmed at this stage, how do I become a bigger version of myself so less things overwhelm me?

That's a great question. So my answer to that would be going back to that overwhelm, proofing your life. So if you're. I'm going to tell you the things that I just do on a regular basis in order to not get overwhelmed. So I work out almost every Morning. I meditate every day between work and home. I have kids, so, like, my commute, quote unquote, is meditation. So I meditate. I plan my week religiously. Every Sunday, I spend an hour planning my week. I know exactly where I'm spending my time. I see if there are any problem areas, I fix them. Just have to, like, press play on my week because I know exactly what's going to happen. And then I practice mindfulness in my thoughts. So immediately picking up on this is too much. I can't do all this to switching to a different thought. So I think if you're focusing on that, I'm also relentless about where I say yes. The good thing is when you are friends with or become a person who says yes when they want to say yes and no when they want to say no. It's so clear and easy. If you ask me to do something and I say yes, I 100% want to be there, and I will be there and I will do it. But I used to be maybe 50, 50 on that. I would say yes to things out of guilt. So if you're looking for more ways to expand yourself and more time, you've got to get religious on the rest of all that stuff so that you have your week planned out. The things that are on your calendar are there because they pass those two tests that we talked about. Do I love this idea and does it fit into the type of life I'm trying to create? And then you will have space and your mind will be so much calmer. For me, the exercise in the meditation, even if I have a busier day than I would normally like, it can keep me. They're like my bookends for the day, and it can really keep me on track.

I love that you hit on so many things that I feel like I always harp on, like getting in control of the story that we tell ourselves and how we talk about the situation, situations that we're in, the words that we use to describe that are just so hypercritical to how we feel. And then planning your week out, it's the same. The parallels, right? From a personal finance perspective, you have so much more control when you have clarity about what you're up against and when you actually are in front of it. Right. You're in the driver's seat of your financial future. You're in the driver's seat of your week by you sitting down and actually controlling and blocking out. Right. I've been trying to get a lot more intentional about time blocking my week On Sunday as well. And in those time blocks, I'm blocking in me time. I'm blocking out lunchtime. Like I used to never do that. I'm blocking out lunchtime, I'm blocking out relaxation time. Right now I'm in like an insane two week sprint where I have like no free time in my business. But after that two week sprint, I have a couple days blocked off. Or it's just rest and recharge time. And so that helps too. So I love that. And I just think it makes so much sense the way you're talking about being really intentional about your yeses and being really intentional about your no's, because no's drain so much more energy from you than yeses do. So being able to cut more of those out obviously would help with the overwhelm. Because if you're just doing things that actually light you up, that's gonna feel so much different than these things that you just feel like you have to do. Because somebody said you want all of that. So I love that so much.

Yes, yes, exactly. And if you think about your example of taking lunch, I do the same thing too, where I'll. I sit in my kitchen and I eat lunch and maybe I'll listen to an audiobook or you know, just do something that feels fun to me. And it like, well, I could be working at that time. But the truth is, the productivity I get out of my afternoon work is so much better because I have taken that break. So it's kind of counterintuitive that doing less actually makes you able to do more.

Yeah. Okay, let's talk about this really quick too, because there is this, like, I should be doing this, I should all of that. Like, we just should ourselves right into thinking that we should be somewhere where we're not, or we should have accomplished these things, or I have all this time and when I have free time, like something that I've been trying to be so intentional about these last couple years is having guilt free time. It's just exactly what you're talking about. Right? So when we have all of these things that need to be getting done right, and they require our attention, how does someone actually carve out guilt free me time?

I would say the same way that we carve out being able to say no at first. It feels really uncomfortable and you try it out. I would say look at it like it's an experiment. So I'm gonna just check and see if I sit down and have a 30 minute lunch and eat a healthy lunch that makes Me feel good and I feel relaxed and I'm eating on a real plate and I'm not standing up in the kitchen and all of that. Let's just see how that plays out. So just try it for three days in a week and see how did my afternoons feel when I did that? How do my afternoons feel when I work out? So just. Just over time, testing out things that work for you and throwing out what doesn't work and keeping what does work. And the other thing is, I'm working with someone right now who's changed a whole bunch of her habits. And she was saying the other day, if I would have started coaching and you would have told me, okay, you gotta get a better system for your email. You've gotta plan your week every week. You need to be walking every morning. She said, I would've thought, oh, my gosh, I'm quitting right now. You know, that total overwhelmed feeling. So I would say add each one of those. Those things one at a time until it feels like, okay, that's a system that works for me. For example, maybe you check your email twice a day or check your bank balance in your coaching world once a day and just see how that feels and see if that's a good way to manage it going forward and keep what works and get rid of what doesn't. Hmm.

I love that. Do you think overwhelm is a fight or flight response?

Sometimes I think the behavior that we see happens when you're in overwhelm is. Sometimes I think that's what that, you know, I'm so overwhelmed. I'm just gonna take a nap. Feels a little bit like freeze or I'm gonna scroll on my phone is like flight. So I definitely feel like when you're in overwhelm, the behavior that you could see would be fight or flight.

Yeah.

Okay.

That makes a lot of sense because I talk about fight or flight a lot from like a. The money perspective. And we talked about people pleasing, and that's usually fawning in my world of like, giving it all away, not feeling good, holding it, wanting everyone to think that you're, you know, not greedy with your money and all of that. So you're talking different things. And I'm like, this feels like a lot of fight or flight response.

Exactly. It's what we were talking about earlier, that when you're giving away money so that other people will think you're generous, you're trying to control the way that they see you. If you want to give away money because you want to give away money. Awesome. Do it.

But yeah. Yeah. No. I think my biggest mindset shift from this entire conversation is I actually want to be the person where, you know, if I say yes, I really 1, 100 wholeheartedly mean it. And if I say no, it's just because, well, one, I guess it's a no for me. And I have to be grounded in the fact that no is an okay decision. And also, everything in my life, like, everything I like everything doesn't have to be a yes. Like, you can't possibly say yes to everything.

Yeah.

So, yeah.

And I'm sure you probably have a friend who could be an example of both of those. You know, I have a friend who says yes, and sometimes I think before we do stuff, is she, like, dreading this? Does she really want to do it? Does she not where with the other friend? It's like, I know if we're doing something, we're doing it. And if she doesn't want to do something or it doesn't work for her schedule, she's going to be like, no, we can't do it. One other thing, you were just talking a little bit about people pleasing again. And you know how other people are seeing us and that we're really trying to control how they're seeing us. A lot of times people will say, well, I'm worried that they won't like me if I say no. And I always say, now, clients don't love when I say this, but it's true. What if they don't like you right now? Now, what if they already like you? Right. And so that's helpful to think, honestly, like, I can't control how someone else feels about me. We wish we could. We think we can, but we can't. So that person might already dislike you or they might love you. And even if you say no, they're going to love you the same. Or maybe they will be disappointed, but it's all out of your control. So we, we're, like, sacrificing ourselves for the idea that we're going to get someone to like us when they might already not like us or they might like us either. It's just a crapshoot. So why not protect yourself and do what you really want and let them feel how they're gonna feel a hundred percent.

Trying to not control other people's emotions and expectations. I think that that's huge.

And also, as Mel Robbins would say, let them. Right. Let them feel however they feel.

And also, it's like, we don't we can say no to people that we do like, right? Like, it doesn't. Like, oh, I just don't like them. So I'm gonna say no. I started. Like, I say no to people that I time because it's just like, my week. My week's crazy. Love you. But, like, that will throw me out of balance. Right? So it's. It's okay to say no to people that you love, too. And I do think that people gain a little bit more respect for you when you have boundaries, when you. When you know what you can and cannot take on or be at. Like, I don't know. I have respect, and I think I've gotten good feedback when I'm like, hey, I'm just not in a place da, da, da, da. And they're like, hey, actually, thank you so much, and thank you for just owning that. Right. So I think that there is a level of appreciation for somebody who knows what their capacity is.

Yeah, I think it's great. And I think the more you do it, the better you get at it. And the better you get at it, the better your schedule feels. The better your schedule is, the less overwhelmed you get. It's just like a rolling. It just keeps getting better.

It just keeps going. And then. And then that is how we continue to ascend to new versions of ourselves and being able to become this bigger version who can handle more, who can do more projects, who can bring your vision to the world. World is putting up boundaries. Like, we think of boundaries as, like, this bad word, but it's actually protecting you and funneling you closer and further towards the reality that you're trying to create.

Yes, exactly.

I love that. Okay, what else? Like, what's a hot take on overwhelm?

Yeah, I feel like my hot take is that overwhelm is a choice. It's a choice that you're making every day. And the way that you're choosing overwhelm is by saying yes to too many things, having a schedule that's way overbooked, not changing your behavior, people pleasing, all of the things that we've been talking about. And that's not really an accusatory tone. It's just, if you want to take radical responsibility for your life, say, I am creating overwhelm for myself, and I'm going to stop creating overwhelm for myself. So it's really completely in our control. And there are things that happen, circumstances that happen to us that we have no control over, but there are so many more that we do.

I love that. I think that's such a good, hot take, because it really is. It really is our choice. And you can't maybe get out of it in that one moment, but you implement some of these things, and as you free up your space and free up your calendar, then you really are in control of that.

It's just. Overwhelm is a series of choices that you have made, and calm is a series of different choices that you have made. Like, you can create either one.

Absolutely. And I love that radical responsibility, because I saw something that was on your Instagram, which was optimism is your superpower power.

Yes.

That just goes to show you and I both, right. Like, how much mindset is so important. And when you own something like that, then that gets to become your reality. And when you start to create these habits and create these boundaries, then you really get to be in control of everything.

Yes, exactly. My boyfriend Will teases me that I'll just be like, oh, I'm gonna manifest whatever it is. You know, I'm just gonna think positive that that's gonna work out for me. He's like, I'm sure, babe.

You are.

And it does. And then I'm like, see, you're just. You're creating not getting good things in your life because you're just, like, not believing in this, and you have the opportunity as much as I do. I don't have any magical powers. I just choose to believe that things are always working out for me. In fact, I know this isn't going to be a video podcast, but, like, my home screen on my phone says everything is always working out for me, and I see a thousand times a day.

Mine says, I'm so lucky. Everything works out for me. Miracles happen to me daily. That's my phone screen. Oh, my gosh.

That's so funny. I knew we were kindred spirits a.

Hundred percent when I saw the optimism is my superpower. I'm like, that's funny. I can always find a silver lining. I'm always looking for the positive because it's true. You create your own reality based on the lens that you look out of.

Yep, yep. Exactly. And that's really powerful.

Amazing. Michelle. Thank you so much. Can you please tell everybody, they want more. Tell them about your podcast where they can listen to you talk about overwhelm. Talk to them about how they can get into your world. Go ahead and share all of that with everybody.

Yeah, absolutely. So my podcast is called Overwhelmed Working Woman. I have episodes. I decided to drop them on Monday morning because that's the time when I used to feel the most overwhelmed. So it's a story and one take takeaway that you can do to make your life feel less overwhelming. And then one of the things that I've talked about a couple times is trying to plan your week. I have a tool called the Calendar Clean out, and it has a podcast that goes with it, and then there's a worksheet. So if you want to give it a try. If you're thinking, well, how do I even do that? How do I plan my week ahead of time? I have a free tool, so I can give you the link to put in the show notes for that as well. Otherwise, everything's on my website, which is just michelleguier.com amazing.

And you do such a good job. Can I just shout you out for a second on your Instagram of highlighting your podcast episodes? Like, it was so fun to look through and just see such quick highlights and super easy to tell. Oh, I want to listen to this one. I want to listen to this one. So if you guys are like, I need more overwhelmed tips and tricks. She's got so many good things on her podcast. Thank you.

Thank you. One of the ways that I don't get overwhelmed is by having someone who does that for me. So I will pass that along.

Yeah, I can definitely attest to outsourcing some things, and the way that that has freed up so much mental capacity.

For me definitely helped my overwhelm, for sure.

Absolutely. Well, Michelle, thank you so much for being on. I feel like I got so much out of this. I'm definitely going to be so powerful standing in my nose and so excited to stand in my yeses, so.

Oh, good, good.

That's awesome.

Thanks for being here. Thank you so much.