Stop Making Sales Hard: Jillian Murphy’s No-Fluff Approach to Making Money Online

Foreign. This is Busy Getting Better, the podcast for women who are committed to prioritizing their own personal growth. I'm your host, Madison J. A mindset and money coach, a first generation wealth builder and a woman on a mission to help you master your finances and live your best life. Money is not all we are covering though, because in order to live your best life, you have to become your best self. So we are diving deep into all things personal development and bringing you the mindset set shifts, money, tips, and inspiration. You need to go out there, be bold, and build the life you can't stop daydreaming about. It's time to get busy, babe. Busy getting better. Oh, my God, you guys, I am so excited for today's episode. I have one of my favorite people ever on. Her name is Jillian Murphy, but you can probably just refer to her as the sales queen, and I think she would respond, am I. Am I correct on that?

You are. It's funny, my friend Shelby Clement just called me a sales monster the other day, and I was like, you know what? I'm gonna own sales monster two of these days.

You know what? We need both sides. It's kind of like the devil and the angel on your shoulder, right? We've got a monster, we've got a queen. Both probably giving us advice that we need, that we need to hear, because that's one of the things that I'm obsessed with you, is that you were just, like, blunt. You say it how it is and you give the girls the. The shit that they need to hear, which is, like, so important, especially in sales. So I love that. Can you please tell everybody a little bit about you and why the heck you are obsessed with sales so much that.

Yeah, absolutely. Number one, I'm so grateful to be here. I. You are literally one of my favorite people. Back from the minute I met you, I was just like, I want to be in this girl's world. I want to be in her energy. And I remember literally when you started your podcast, I was like, the world needs to hear from you. So, number one, so grateful for you and thank you for having me on your show. Yeah. My name is Jillian Murphy, guys. I've been in sales for 20, 28 years, which means I'm aging myself a little bit on your show. But it's literally all I've done my entire life, and I'm literally obsessed with it because just like Madison with money, I think that there are so many things that people don't know, they don't understand, and they over Complicate it, and they overthink it and they overanalyze it, and it's literally one of the simplest things that you can learn. And when you learn sales, you learn how to make money. And I know this podcast is all about making money. So, like, the two go hand in hand.

Everyone here knows this, but when I graduated from college, I was so sick and tired of being a broke. I was like, what can one do to not live in this cycle anymore? I'm gonna go into sales because, you know, there's usually uncapped commission. There's an opportunity to make more money, but it's also just one of those skills that is one of the most universal skills that you can have that is going to help you in so many pieces of life. From whether you're an entrepreneur, whether you're a business owner, whether you're just like a girl out here trying to get by, sales skills are the one thing that you should spend money on.

It really is exactly what you said. I tell people all the time, when you work with me, yes, I'm teaching you sales, but I'm literally teaching you a skill for life. I'll give you guys a really quick example. I live in an apartment here in Scottsdale, and your girly ordered some furniture and did not measure. Okay. So when they brought their furniture here a couple of weeks ago, guess what? It did not fit in her living room. And the guy's like, well, we have a restocking charge. And I knew how to negotiate with someone. I knew what to say when I called, Actually just made a reel about this. I knew what to say, and I literally was able to getting $1900 refund back on someone who said, we do not do a refund and we do not do an exchange. Because I have really good negotiation skills, not because I was, like, scamming the system. So again, I teach people skills for life, not just, like, how to sell their products, programs, and services.

Yeah, 100%. It's always beneficial. I love that you're like, you guys don't do this, but, like, give me a second. Who can I chat with really quick?

Like, what are the chances, Joey, that you're going to make my day today?

Yeah. Oh, my gosh. I love that. That's like a little Chris Voss in there, right? Where you're just kind of, like, playing around. Yeah. Okay. I know that you work a lot now in entrepreneur, but you obviously had your background in corporate, and obviously I have a background in corporate. How did you end up moving from the corporate space into helping entrepreneurs scale their business. And I know that you had an incredibly successful business very, very quickly. So I would love to hear a little bit about that transition for you. And just like, what do you think made your business so successful so fast?

Yeah. So I will tell you guys a little bit of a backstory. Cause I think it's really important, especially if you're like a newer entrepreneur and maybe you haven't invested in your business. But I was a ride or die corporate person. I was not someone who was ever thinking about being an entrepreneur. I could have, like, tattooed my company's name across my forehead like I was a ride or die. So also just remember that maybe you're in a job right now or you're in a corporate position right now. That feels really safe. Nothing is safe. I never, ever, ever thought that I was going to lose my corporate job. I was the golden child at our company. C suite, exec, company car, the things, right? And guess what happened? Covid came. And when you make a lot of money in an organization and they have to downsell and they have to cut expenses, guess who gets cut first? Not the janitor, not the people cleaning the bathrooms. The people that are making a lot of money. Right? So the top 10 people in the company were actually people that got cut. CEOs, CFOs, CMOs, VPs of sales. We all lost our jobs. I'll never forget. I was literally walking out of the office and I lost my entire identity. I lost my car, I lost my laptop. I lost literally everything that I thought I had. I walked out and I called my dad, who's a very successful businessman and an entrepreneur. And I said, I don't know what to do. And his words were, you know how to sell. So you're going to be absolutely okay. Call your sister. She'll pick you up. Go grab a pint of Ben and Jerry's if you need to go watch some friends today and tomorrow, we'll figure it out. And that's literally what we did. But the backstory to this is I had actually just attended a Mastermind about six weeks ago, and. And I had no idea what this was. I had some friends that were going to la and they were like, hey, do you want to come to this Mastermind with us with Chris and Lori Harder? And I was like, sure. I literally went to this thing for three days. I didn't even know, like, who Chris and Lori Harder were. Didn't know any of these entrepreneurs, and literally didn't even pay Attention. I was just there to like, hang out with my friends. And I had lunch with Nick Harder, who is Chris Harder's brother. And he said, what do you do in corporate? And I said, I help people sell, I do marketing, I run a sales organization, all these things. And he said to me, you know, there's a hundred entrepreneurs in this room that need your products, programs and services. You could literally probably build a million dollar business in this room. And that went in one ear and out the other. And I lost my job on a Tuesday. On a Thursday, I slid into Nick Harder's DMs and I was like, hey, I'm in this mastermind. I've never even really attended anything. I think I have access to coaches and stuff. I need help. And he was like, okay, let's get you on a call. I literally hired my first business coach on a Thursday. So again, I just lost my job. I just lost my income. I. I had no idea where my next business was going to come from. And I made an $8,000 investment. And from that point, I had the same coach for the next four years. He's literally still my coach. Way more than $8,000, I'll tell you that. But he's been my ride or die for the last four years. And what I did was a couple things. I took massive action. I moved quickly and I knew that there wasn't a plan B. And I was never going to put my job or my income or my family or my finances in the hands of anybody else ever again. And then we can talk about what I actually did if you want to. The actual, like, tactics.

I love that. Well, I love that so much because you just, I love how fast you moved in that. Right. I think that it's super easy to be woe is me in a situation like that. And you were like, nope, not even going to fall into that trap. I'm actually just going to take all of the skills that I already have and I'm going to pivot into something and I'm going to build it. And there is no plan B. I think we talk about that a lot in entrepreneurship from a mindset perspective. Being half in, being half out. You've got to just full on commit to this shit and you've got to just go for it.

You guys, there has, I've been, I've been in the online space for four years now. It has not been sunshine and rainbows. It has been up, it has been down. It's been a hundred thousand dollars months. It's Been no sales months. It is not sunshine and rainbows. And if you guys follow me, I show you the good, the bad, the ugly, the great. I always move quickly. Now, I don't move quickly out of, like, scarcity. I don't move quickly out of, like, panic, but I move quickly because that's how you. That's how business operates. If things change, I move quickly. So the first thing that I did when I came into the online space was I was like, I need to figure out how to do this. I need to figure out how to build this. And what I don't have is time, because I need to get clients. I need to build an income. So I don't have time to dick around and figure this out and DIY it and YouTube my way through it and canva my way through it. So I'm going to hire someone that's already done this and literally give me the roadmap. I'm trying to build a house, and they're going to give me the blueprint. And that's exactly what I did. I will say I did grow my business very quickly. Six figures in six months. Half a million dollars in 18 months. We hit seven figures. Year two, which I'm so grateful for, but also because I have a service that everyone needs. I've also been talking about that same service for four years. So it's very clear, it's very concise, and it's very consistent. I've been showing up over and over and over for four years. If you listen to a podcast of me four years ago, it's literally the same thing I'm talking about today. So clear, consistent, and concise. My audience has built insane trust with me. I'm not talking about something different every day. I'm not floundering. I don't have a bajillion offers. Like, they know exactly what they're getting when they come into my world, and.

I respect that so much. You and I have talked recently about the way that entrepreneurship has been kind of glamorized on the Internet and how you had an incredible result that so many people are after, but unfortunately is not necessarily the reality for so many people. Because, like, I'll speak for myself. Like, it can be so hard to show up on the Internet and not want to feel salesy. Right? These are all, like, the common things that I know you handle, right? Not wanting to feel salesy or sleazy, not wanting to feel like I'm being redundant or talking about the same thing over and over and over again. Also it's really easy in this world to get so excited about so many things. I fall victim to this of, like, the shiny object. Of like, oh, I want to do this and I want to do this and I want to do this. And so just hearing you talk about that, it's like, who cares? Repeat yourself. Literally nobody cares. People probably aren't even listening. And you almost need to hear the same message 13 times now before a message even clicks with someone. And then also just getting so clear on, like, your. What your one thing is, and just turning it into such an incredible offer that has such good results and screaming it to anybody that will listen.

Yeah, if you guys look at my content, I've been in the online space for four years. I found you to go look at my content from a year ago, two years ago, three years ago, four years ago. I'm talking about the exact same thing. The only thing that's changed is maybe my hair color or, you know, maybe I've changed my body a little bit or I wear a different hat now, but it's the exact same thing. Like, it's. It's the same thing. I don't worry about being annoying. I don't worry about being salesy because anybody can unfollow me. I want to also talk about the shiny object syndrome because people tell me all the time, oh, I'm getting bored in my business. I'm getting bored talking about the same thing. I'm getting bored with that. Literally, go get a hobby. Your business is not meant to entertain you. Your business is not here to create a ton of joy and happiness and all these things. Yes, it can, but it's not here to entertain you. And that was one thing my mentor Kris told me very early on, is that if you build a very boring business and you do the same thing day in, day out, day in, day out, you will be collecting a lot of money. And guess what? I run a very boring business, but we collect a lot of cash.

Okay. I love that. That's actually such a good nugget. Let's get into your business because I want to know from the sales queen some things. First off, is sales more mindset or more strategy?

Yeah. So I personally think it's 80% strategy and like 20% mindset. I know all the sales gurus are going to think differently, but the thing is, people will stay in the mindset way too long, and you just gotta bust through that stuff and you have to get to the strategy. You cannot sit in the mindset. I see people sitting in mindset for years, and they're not getting the strategy. I also see something else that happens in the online space. I talk about this so much. There's so many people teaching sales that have never even had a sales job. There's so many people teaching sales that have never sat in a room, like, quit taking sales from sales advice from people that have never done it. If you want to learn sales, go hire people that have built incredible sales careers, because those are the people that actually know the strategy. You know, I use the example right now, like, we're selling right now in an uncertain time. We're selling in an uncertain market. We're going through what people are calling, like, a trust recession. We're going through a time that economics are a little bit tougher. I've sold through a recession. I know what that feels like to sell through a recession. I know what it sells like to do those things. There's a lot of people out there that have never even sold through that. So, yes, strategy is important, and strategy is important at different times of different economical times in life.

Yeah, I think that's so good. Is there something super consistent that you see when people come into your world that they are lacking within their sales strategy? Because I know you talk a lot about, like, I can see your sales funnel and just know, like, so fast what you're missing. And also, this is like, the oxygen to your business. Right. I know that's a lot of what you talk about. So I'm curious, what's the most consistent thing that you see that people are just constantly screwing up when it comes to their sales strategy?

I would say the three things spot on that I see every single day is their messaging is so off. Their messaging is so unclear. Their messaging is so inconsistent, and it's not concise that I have no idea what people do. Right. You tell me. You transform someone's life. Unless you're Tony Robbins, does not work. Right. You tell me. You stop the food hunger. What does that mean? You tell me. You help me live your best life. Like, what does that mean? Like, people's content is literally fucking garbage. And if it's garbage, then people don't know what you do. Like, when you walk into Starbucks, you know exactly what Starbucks does. They give you an experience of coffee. You don't have to guess what it is. So when you don't have clear and concise messaging, it doesn't do the heavy lifting of sales. So that is number one. I bet you I spend 80% of my time on messaging and Marketing. I will call myself like a marketing ninja, because I can come in and, like, fix your marketing so quick and so concise, and then it makes people actually buy from you. That's number one. Number two is you are talking so far in advance from where your clients are. They have no idea what you're talking about. Right. Especially my people that are very educated. My doctors, my nurse practitioners, my gut health people, my financial advisors. You are talking about things that your people have no idea what you're talking about. That is number two. And then number three is you are not bought into your offer. So I want you to ask yourself right now, if you saw your sales page and you saw your Instagram story or you attended your webinar, at the end of it, would you be dying to pull out your credit card? Yes or no? I know, like, I saw a $6,500 offer. I know at the end of my webinar, I would be 100% sold. I'd be like, how the hell do I work with this girl? But I work with a lot of clients that I look at their sales page and I'm like, I would not buy this. I don't know what it is. And also, they wouldn't buy it. So you got to be so sold on your offer that you're willing to talk about it day in, day out, day in, day out with such conviction. So those are the three biggest things.

Love that. I think those are all spot on and all. Yeah. 100 things that you got to nail in women. We're really good at selling. Like, we're really good at being able to convince other women, specifically, I think about just in general influencer market. But this was what really clicked for me. I can't remember when I had this conversation, but it was like, when you are not even trying to sell something to a girlfriend, like you and me, perfect example. Fashion pass. Right. We were just talking about. I was so excited about it. I'm loving it. You were so quickly to sign up for it. When you're so convicted around the value that it gives to you or the joy that it brings to you, and you're just talking to somebody else, like, you need to try this product or you need to do this. Like, you need to have that for yourself and for your business, and it doesn't feel like selling at that point. And I think that that's when you are so convicted in the offer, you're so convicted in the transformation. You're so convicted in the joy or the happiness or whatever it provide for somebody, that's when it starts to not feel like selling. And I think that this is the problem that a lot of people have when it comes to selling is they feel like they're being sleazy. They feel like they're being pushy. They feel like they're trying to convince somebody to buy something that they don't need. Right. That's kind of like that old school style mentality of the used car salesman. And it doesn't have to be like that. And it shouldn't feel like that. Right. You should just be so excited about what it can do for somebody else that you naturally emulate, like, all of this positive energy through the way that you're articulating it. That I think is what you've got to try to get. And that's exactly what you're talking about. Yeah.

I always tell people when they come into my program, like, I have a program called Infinity. And I'm like, tell me about your favorite thing that you're, like, obsessed with right now. Right. Maybe it's Fashion Pass. Maybe it's these new pair of Lululemon leggings. Maybe it's this dry shampoo from Amica. Tell me something that you're literally so excited about. And I have them tell me on the screen in front of the whole Zoom Room, tell me what it is. Right? And it's exactly what you said. They're so excited. They're so convicted about it. They're, like, sharing about it. I can see their energy. They're so lit up. Right. And then I'm like, like, all right, time about your webinar. Tell me about your offer. Time out. One on one coaching. And I see the energy dip. I see the transition dip. I see them looking around. I see them not being as excited. Why are you so much more excited to sell Lululemon leggings or Fashion Pass or dry shampoo from another company than you are about your own offer? I need you to go back and get in that same exact energy or find something that you're that excited to sell in your own business. There is nothing, you guys, that I am more convicted to sell and excited to sell than my own stuff. I will go on a street corner and tell you about Infinity. I think it's the best thing ever, and every single entrepreneur should be in it. That's the level of excitement, the same excitement that I have about this hat that I'm wearing from Madison. Right. It's like literally everything. But if you don't have the same conviction as you do about someone else's products. You guys got to go back to the drawing board, because I'm telling you, people can feel it. Especially if you're someone that talks about products and then you flip to your own. So imagine someone's flipping through your Instagram stories and you're like, oh, my God, you guys, let me tell you about this new black dress I'm wearing. It's literally such a fit. Like, look at my booty in it. Look at my body. I'm obsessed. And then the next slide, you're like, are you guys. So I have this webinar on Wednesday, and I really think you should come. And people can feel it. Yeah, you gotta have that same energy when you transition from your stuff to someone else's stuff.

It's literally an energy thing. And we talk about that. Money is energy. Sales is energy. Every. Everything in this world is energetic. And people can feel that and tap into that. That what? When you have your. When you have your clients that are sitting here, you can just tell they're not in love with their offer or they're not convicted around it the way that they need to be in order to sell. The way that they need to sell. What are some things that somebody can do to tap into that? Is it something. Do they need to get testimonies? Do they need to pour more into their offer? Do they need to do something from a mindset person like, what is that shift that somebody can actually do to feel that convicted about their own offer?

Yeah, I think, number one. Also, speaking of Fashion Pass, I just got a text. Your Fashion Pass order has arrived. I'm like, pretty. Speaking of Fashion Pass, also, thank you to Madison user code. It's amazing. Little shout to Madison. So the number one thing that I think people need to do if they're not excited about their offer is ask themselves, why are you selling this? Because what I find is most people are selling something because somebody else is selling it. Well, I'm selling this masterclass because I see that Madison's doing a masterclass, or I'm in a mastermind and everybody has a membership. I think I should have a membership or I started this podcast because Jillian Murphy has a podcast. Well, why do you want to sell this off offer? Let's talk about why you're excited about an offer. I normally see, number one, such misalignments in people's offers of what they're selling, because it's not even like, what they want to be selling. And you guys, I fall into trap of this too. I Sold a membership for a year and I was like, I hate this membership. But all my friends were selling memberships. And guess what? We end up shutting it down because I couldn't sell it because I didn't even like it. So, number one, you have to ask yourself, why are you selling it? Number two, are you convicted on the price that you're selling this for? Because most people are selling something and they're selling it because everybody else is selling it at this price. So do you believe in this price? Do you believe in this offer? I'll use my own offer for an example. I sell it at a price that I believe literally in the core of my body is a great price that everybody should buy it at. If it was a little bit higher, I might not feel the same. If it was a little bit lower, I might have resentment. So you got to find a price point that you're like, I feel so good about this price point too. I think just like what the offer is and the price point you got to do some work around, whether it's with yourself or with a mentor, to ask yourself those right questions before you even start selling it. Even coming down to the name of something, Are you naming something because you found it in chat?

GPT?

Are you naming something because someone else names something? Another real life example I have this program is called Infinity. It's amazing. Yes. I don't love the name of it. My CEO named it. It doesn't even really make sense. It's not on brand with anything. Right. But now I've built a brand around it. I'll tell you, in the beginning, when I first started selling it, I was like, this doesn't really, like, make sense. Doesn't really go with my brand. But at that point, I had a CEO that told me to sell it, so I did. Now I have a story around it, so I can sell the story around it so it feels a little bit better. So even like the name of things that you sell things, or even like the price in which you say it, make sure it flows when you say it. Like when you say the number, yeah.

100%, you've got to be excited about it. Like, if you're going to show up and talk about it every day, you've got to get the vibe and you've got to be able to convey that. Because so often people can't see or feel the message or the vision. Right. Until you've really built something. So you've got to be able to have that. Do you feel that you find A lot of this worthiness conversation around price point when you are helping your people sell. Because I would imagine there's a lot of, how do I land on the right price? Am I worthy of charging this? Like, right. There's a lot of that mindset stuff. So I'd love to hear your perspective of that. And what. How do you help. Help your clients kind of navigate that world of pricing?

Yeah, that's a. It's a really great question. And we, we do that a lot. And I think pricing is something that's very, very personal and it's work that you have to do. And also knowing that you get to arrive at different price points. You know, you guys, when I first started coaching four years ago, I was $200 a month to work with as a business coach. And you got four calls a month with me. I'm $5,000 a month now to work with one on one. So think about the transition of what that has looked like. Also who I had to become in order to receive that amount of money now. Like the work I had to do around that, the work I had to do around asking for that, the testimonials I had to get, and also the results that I better deliver if somebody is paying me $5,000 a month to work with me. Right? So again, it goes back to that conviction. What do you feel like you can deliver? When I first started, I had never sold anybody online. It was very different than the brick and mortar business. I was like, I don't know if I can get somebody results. It's work that has to be done right now. If you feel like you can get somebody results at 300 bucks, charge 300 bucks don't go off what everybody else is charging. And this is the other thing. What you hear online is not the truth. Okay? I'm going to be like the first one to tell you in case no one's ever broke this down to you. Everything you hear online is literally like 99% not the truth. Okay? What people are charging, what people are making their profitability, like, all those things. So what you charge is such a personal thing because you also don't know what other people are paying. So again, let's just use me for an example. You might be like, oh, my God. Well, Jillian Murphy's charges $5,000 a month, but you have no idea what my team costs. You have no idea what my ads cost. You have no idea what my tech cost. You have no idea what it costs to run my business. Right? So I might be making no Profit in my business, I mean we make a hell of a lot of profit, but you don't know that. So don't pay attention to what people are charging because you don't always know the backstory of what it costs to run their business.

Business. Yeah, I think that's so good. There is just so much, you know, highlight real energy on the Internet and being and like that's what people's job is to sell. Look how much money I'm making. But that's so true. Revenue does not equal profit. It just, it takes time to get to a point. So I love that. Being able to tap in, start wherever intuitively feels good for you. And as you gain more confidence and you gain more conviction, up your prices. You could sign one client at one price point and then immediately be like, well, that doesn't feel that great. I'm going to go ahead and move on to the next price point point. And you get to be able to work your way up to a point where it feels really good. And I love what you said there where it's like, if you charge too little, you'll feel resentful for the work that you did. If you charge too much, you're going to feel a shit ton of pressure to deliver at a level that you might not feel called to do both of those if you stay in those energies for too long. Recipe for burnout, recipe for disaster. So you've really got to find that wiggle room and then know that you can consistently up your prices as you go.

It's so true. And I'll even talk from like my own personal experience. I work very, very, very hard. And I'm not saying that every entrepreneur doesn't, but when people are paying you that am to work with you one on one, you work for them. You know, I work for my clients. They are literally my bosses. I answer their calls, I answer their emails, I answer their slack. It's a very different energy than if someone was paying me a couple hundred bucks, right? I might, I might be able to slack off. I mean, I had a client Last night at 11 o' clock send me a crazy long Google Doc and was, hey, I need this done before tomorrow morning at our call at 9am and I got out of bed, walked to my desk, desk and got it done before today because guess what? She pays me a lot of money to deliver results. I can't be, hey, I don't want to do this. So if you don't want to deliver those kind of results, then charge a lower Price point. But when you're charging a lot of money, you work for your clients and I work for my clients every day.

Yeah. Okay. Such a good perspective there. I love that so much. And definitely something to consider when we're looking at prices. I am curious, so when you're looking at like lead gen and visibility, these are two areas that you really love to help with, right? You already hit on helping with like content messaging. But in your opinion, what are two to three things that everybody should be doing daily to attract leads and to make more money in their business?

I talk about lead generation every day in my business. I think it's the most important thing you should be doing. I just want to also say I've been in the online space for four years. I do not delegate lead generation. I do not delegate my social media, I do not delegate my content, I do not have many chat set up and I do not delegate my DMs. Even at the level that I'm running my business, even at the level of busyness that I have. No one touches my social media other than me because this is where I make sales, this is where I connect and nobody is going to do this better than me. You will never have a robot in my business. You'll never have an AI, you'll never have a manage at any of those things. This is so important, I feel like for people to hear because this is where connections are made. I've sold over a million dollars through the DMS and 0 of it has been automated. So the reason why is because I spend one hour every day, non negotiable, doing outbound lead generation. So what does this look like? I'll give you two very, very simply. Number one is I want you guys to ask yourself how many people following you? Maybe it's a, maybe it's 5,000, maybe it's 500. The number doesn't matter. I also just want to say this. I have a ton of clients that hire me that are at 50,000, 70,000, 100,000 followers and are making no money because they went viral and they got followers and they didn't get sales. So if you're trying to go viral, please stop because it does not equal sales. Little side note, but you're going to go and you're going to ask yourself how often are you talking to your current followers? Not the people that are currently engaging, but the people that are not watching your stories. I want you to go through your following and I want you to start talking to them, literally connecting to them. Madison, I saw that you were just on vacation. How was it? My gosh. I see that you just bought an order from Fashion Pass. I'm thinking about buying a fashion subscription, you guys. Yes, this takes time. Yes, this is unsexy work. Yes, this is boring work. But the amount of conversations that I have with people that turn into a 5, 6, 7, 10, $56,000 sales sale, you'd be shocked. So go start talking to the people that are actually following you. That's number one. Number two is get off of social media and go talk to people in the wild. I call it. It doesn't matter where you are. You can be in a small town. I came from Oxford, Michigan, which had population of like seven people. You guys, when I was an entrepreneur, there was nobody there. I still found opportunities. There's BNI's, there's network working. There's other cities that you can travel to. Go outside of social media and go be a human and go talk to people. When you're getting Botox, when you're getting your hair done, when you're dropping your kids off to school, when you're sitting at soccer practice, when you're dropping your kids off at daycare, let people know what you're doing. I'm going to use Madison's hat for an example. If I had this hat in my business, I'd be wearing this hat every single where I went. I would make sure that I was having conversations with everyone about, oh, my God, I love your house hat. Thank you. I'm a money coach. What does that mean? Let me tell you, I would be wearing this hat as a billboard. Everywhere I went, I have a hat, it says scale your sales. I literally wear it everywhere. People are like, oh, my God, I love your hat. I'm like, think you have a podcast called scale your sales. Really? What do you do? I'm a sales coach. What do you mean? Let me tell you, because I'm out in the wild talking to people. Go buy yourself a sweatshirt and put your logo on the back or make a cool hat on Etsy. Just do something to get conversations starting in the wild. Child, those are my two things for lead generation. And you probably have hundreds of thousands of dollars in your following right now that don't even know what you have to offer.

You love that. Okay, approved. Everybody go make your own merch for your business just so you can simply rock it. It's honestly such a hack. Or you get a friend like Jillian, who rocks my hat for me and DMS me. Hey, by the way, people are asking about your hat, why I'm at Pilates, just so you know. Which if you can't, you can't see us right now, obviously. But we are both rocking my hat, my money and vibes hat, so we look pretty cool right now.

Let me give you another really quick example. I have a client, her name is Lauren Gary. And Lauren Gary has a wellness brand called Lauren Gary Wellness. And every single time she gets a client, which I'm sure a lot of you guys get clients, and you guys send them client gifts, whether it's box box or flowers or whatever. Lauren Gary sends them a Stanley, which is etched in Lauren Gary Wellness. And she sends him a sweatshirt that says Lauren Gary Wellness. And she sends them a tank top that says Lauren Gary Wellness. So guess what, guess what. What are her people doing? They're at the gym, they're at, they're at Pilates, they're at yoga, they're healthy, they're health conscious people that are in the wild doing what she wants to do. And I'm one of her clients, even though she's one of my clients. So every time I go somewhere, people are like, oh, what's Lauren Gary Wellness? I'm like, oh, follow her on Instagram. She's amazing. She has all these minions wearing her billboard out in the wild. So instead of sending your client a piece of flowers, give them your brand and have them go wear it out in the wild. It's literally the biggest, biggest hat.

I love that so much. I think that's so smart. Okay. And I know you obviously talk a lot about. Okay, so we're messaging people on the Internet. One of the things that I love about you and your business is the closing in the DMS. Like, you are such a savage in the DMs, right? You're like, I don't want to do a sales call. I don't want to waste anyone's time. I want to get shit done as quickly as possible. What's your advice to somebody closing in the DMs? Not making it feel awkward, not making it feel pushy. What is like one to two tangible things that the people can do to feel better about naturally merging that reach out conversation to the closing conversation and never getting on a sales call, because that sounds chill.

Yeah. So number one is you have to believe that you can do it. So right now you're probably listening to this podcast and you're like, that's not possible for me. My business, we have to get on sales calls in my business. We have to fill out applications. I'm here to tell you, you absolutely don't. I've worked with over a thousand entrepreneurs, and I have literally busted this myth for everyone. It doesn't matter what your business is, what your niche is, what your price point is. My clients are selling up to $56,000 in the DMs without ever getting on a sales call and without ever filling out an application. Because guess what? Your clients do not want to get on a sales call. Your clients do not want to fill out an application. And you were actually making it harder for people. Because there's something that happens in sales. There's something that's called a leaky faucet versus a bursting pipe. And when somebody reaches out to you, they are in a bursting pipe moment. And when you tell, sure, let's get on a call next Tuesday or let's get on a call next Wednesday. By next Tuesday or Wednesday, it has now gone down to a leaky faucet. And they're like, it's not really that important anymore. So you need to get people, when they are in their bursting pipe moment, their life is falling apart, their jeans don't fit. They're not having sex with their husband, Their kids are driving them wild. They are in their bursting pipe moment. So that's, number one, is you have to have the belief that you can do it again. You guys, I've sold over a million dollars in the DMs. No sales calls. Okay? Number two. Two is you have to not go into it like you're going to sell it. So so many people have what I call golden retriever energy. And you're like a spaz. You're trying to sell everyone in the dms, and you're trying to move the conversation so quick. And think about it like a golden retriever when you come home and they're all over you and they're spastic and they're licking you, and the energy is crazy. Stop. Literally, stop with golden retriever energy. I had to back in Michigan, and they drove me buck wild. Okay, what you want to have? I love you, Bentley, but you drove me crazy. Okay, okay. What you want to do is you want to have what's called, like, black cat energy. And this is where you're very laid back, you're very chill, and they're trying to find you versus you trying to find them. So you have this energy switch. They're actually chasing you versus you actually chasing them. And the way that DM selling works, and this is why I talk about Messaging and marketing so much. Your messaging and your marketing does 90% of the selling for you. Okay, When I'm in the DMs and I literally teachers, I have a webinar every single Wednesday. If you guys want to live, learn it free, shout out, come to my webinar every Wednesday. I teach it how to master DM selling. And I walk you guys through real conversations. Every conversation is the same. I never tell people I'm a sales coach. I don't have to tell people I'm a sales coach. I don't tell people what I do because my content is telling them. And because my content is so good, they're reaching out to me. So if people aren't reaching out to you and people aren't asking you how to work with you, then you have to go back and get your content to work. And when your content works and it's speaking to them, you're going to get messages like, how do I work with you? Are you taking clients? Is infinity open? What does it look like to work with you? All of those things. So if that's not happening, then we have to fix your content first, which is part one of my webinar. And then number two is then you move the conversation into closing in the dms. And again, I want to also say this, you guys. I don't have a webpage. I don't have a sales page, I don't have a landing page. I literally close in the DMs with a stripe link and a voicemail demo. That is it. So also, if you're spending time on all of these things, you literally do not need them. And that's what I teach in my world.

No offense, I feel like I personally needed to hear that. I'm like, over here trying to get all my landing pages and sales pages up, and it's like, I almost had this thought last night, literally. Does any of this even matter right now? Am I spinning my wheels for no reason? So confirmation. You just want my priority list. It's giving cool girl. It's giving black cat cool girl vibes. So, yeah, I could tell you about it, which I think is important too, because I know you talk about commission breath, and this is so real. In any sales job, if you are like, somebody needs me to buy this, I all of a sudden, no part of me wants to buy it. Like, your body can viscerally, like, we can tell you can feel that energy. And you know, you might not be able to like, put a name to it, but your body knows you're like, yeah, I don't know. I just feel like something's not right and it's usually because the other person is like, so do you want to buy it? Do you want to follow up? Da da da da. What's your stance on? Hey, just checking in. Hey, just want to follow up on this. What's your follow up strategy and verbiage when somebody maybe hasn't responded to a message or is kind of giving you that? Are they going to ghost to me or are they not? How do feel you keep Cool Girl Black Cat energy while also being effective in your follow up strategy?

Anyone that says to me, hey, can you tell me about infinity? Do you have a sales page? No, I don't. But I can literally send you a two minute voice memo and tell you everything you need to know and then let me know what questions you have and we can keep riffing here in the dms, like, that's literally how I sell it. You guys have sold 53 people into a $6,500 offer without a sales page, without a landing page, without a website.

It's giving, it's giving cool girl. It's giving black cat cool girl vibes. Which I think is important too because I know you talk about like commission breath and this is so real in any sales job. Like if you are like, somebody needs me to buy this, I all of a sudden, no part of me wants to buy it. Like your body can viscerally, like we can tell you can feel that energy and you know, you might not be able to like put a name to it but like your body knows you're like, yeah, I don't know, I just feel like something's not right and it's usually because the other person is like, so do you want to buy it? Do you want to follow up when. Yeah, all of that stuff. What's your stance on, you know, hey, just checking in. Hey, just want to follow up on this. Like, what's your follow up strategy and verbiage when somebody maybe hasn't responded to a message or is kind of giving you that, like, are they going to ghost me or are they not? Like, how do you keep Cool girl Black Cat energy while also being effective in your follow up strategy?

Yeah, so this is really a really great question because I am actually like a follow up ninja because I do believe that people are busy and it's not as important as we think it is. And they've already told me that they have a problem. Right. So if medicine's in my DM. DMs. And she's like, hey, I'm really stressed out about these landing pages and I'm really worried about if I should get them up. And I think I just need more help on this. I just heard that she has a problem and it's my job, my job to help her fix this now. So I do follow up with her and I do, and I do ask her, but not in a way that's like, hey, just following up. Hey, just checking in. I go back and I say things like, hey, Madison, I wanted to circle back. Last time we talked, you said that you were looking for some help on your landing page pages. Just curious, did you get that taken care of or do you want to continue that conversation? Right. The other thing is, and I think a lot of people don't do this, and I will say I'm very good at this. I do not just talk to you to get a sale. So I'm talking to you at all times. Right? So let's say Madison tells me that, you know, one day she wants to work with me in infinity. And then a week later she has a really cool outfit on from Fashion Pass. I'm talking to her about her outfit from Fashion Pass, and then maybe I'm like, hey, I have a webinar coming up. Do you want to come? Come. So I'm sprinkling in real life conversations with following up because guess what? People buy from people they like, know and trust. So if I'm getting to know her as a human and I'm getting to know her as a real person when she's ready, because people buy when they're ready, not when I want them to buy. When she's ready to buy. Whenever that is, whether it's this month, next month, 10 years from now, whenever it is, Jillian Murphy is going to be the only and obvious choice for her because a real life relationship has been been built. And I'll also say one more thing. I'll talk about this. When clients are done working with me, I do this exact same thing in reverse because a lot of my clients come back. So if you're working with someone right now and you notice after the coaching relationship, you never hear from them again, that's literally gross. When someone is done working with you, stay in contact with them. I'm a birthday card. Reach out to them on a holiday, all of those things. I sent a client a birthday card today. Her birthday's on Saturday. Because she was a one on one client for a year year. Because guess what? She's going to need help again, she's going to need business help again. And if she doesn't, she's going to tell someone else about me. So staying in someone's world, following up in retention is so much more important than just following up during the initial sale.

That you mentioned that. Because I think this is something from a mindset perspective, you have to recognize the fact that sales is such a long game. Like you, you might not, you know, you might meet someone who's just, oh my God, you're exactly what I've been looking for and you're going to sign right now. But a lot of the time it is relationship building. And you mentioned the beginning of this. There's kind of this trust recession happening right now on the Internet. And so being there and caring for somebody outside of just needing a sale is huge. It's a game changer. Also, you mentioned just like being human, just be a human, make friends with people, figure out ways to provide value, figure out how ways to support somebody to lift them up to like buy their merch. Right. Whatever it is. So that when the time comes, you said it's an obvious decision to work with you because you have a solution that they're interested in. And also like you're just a, you're just a girl. Like you're also just their friend. Right. I think that I'm curious your perspective because there's, there's this border. Right. You know, they talk a lot about on the Internet not getting friend zoned with someone. So what's your perspective of doing the strategy, building relationship with someone but still remaining that authority figure so that they know that they can come to you. Do you have a thought on how to navigate that balance?

I think that it's important that you do that. But also if you're just getting friend zoned, then I feel like you're not showing up as an authority, authority again in your content and even in the energy of what you do. Right. I'll use just me and you as a real life example. Right. We're friends. I would say we're friends in real life. I would go to you for advice, I'd ask you to hang out and grab some brunch. Right. But when we're together, I'm still an authority in my space. Right. There's still a thing. Just like you're an authority in your space when it comes to money, you still should show up in the energy of what you are an expert in. So I think that if you're not doing that the next work that you need to do for yourself because again, you can be friends with someone but also still be the expert. I have a lot of friends, you guys. I will tell you. Some of my best friends are in infinity. Some of my real life best friends are my one on one coach my clients. My sister is a one on one coaching client. She owns a huge hair salon back in Michigan. So you can still be an expert and an authority and sell to your friends and sell to your family members members and have them still pay you in all of those things because you're showing up in that energy.

Yeah. 100. I love that. Okay, I want to know how has sales changed your life? When you think about being able to now make all of this money, what has that done for you? How has your life changed because of the skill that you've developed?

Money has been great, I think because I've always been able to create my own income of whatever that's been. You know, life has thrown a lot of challenges at me. I've been divorced a couple times. I've gone through some chronic health stuff. I've had some moves that were unexpected. And because of that, my life has never flaunted, it's never shifted. I've never felt an impact because I've always been able to keep the same income. I mean, you guys, even when I lost my corporate job, I never felt, I never felt it because I was able to really pick it back up super quickly. So that's one thing. And then because I've been in sales, I've always been able to create income. So I'll give you a really great example. My daughter just got married the monthly ago and we went to Vegas and I footed the whole bill for her wedding. So grateful to be able to do that. But while we were there, there was other expenses that came up that she wanted while we were in Vegas. And I don't know if you've been to Vegas anytime recently, but Vegas in the last 10 years has like skyrocketed in price. Everything was like three times as much. What I thought it was literally crazy. I was like, why is breakfast like 300? But I was able to be like, yes, McKenna. Yes, McKenna. Yes, McKenna. Because I know that I can go make that money money. I know that I can go make a sale. I know that I can go ask myself to be on stage somewhere and create revenue. So when you know that you can create money out of thin air, you can create different opportunities. I think that's been like the best thing is I've been able to give other people a really great life because I've been able to create an income. Money is not important for me for bags or cars or any of those things. I know you're a bougie girl. I'm really not. But the things that are important to me is being able to. To gift other people really nice things and let them have a lifestyle that maybe they wouldn't have.

I love that. Do you have any advice on, like, shifting your energy if you want to be able to magnetize more money? You want to be able to show up like we talked about, it's so energetic. Do you have a quick. How do you shift that energy when you know you need to start selling if you're not feeling it?

What is your income goal right now? So let's say Madison. And Madison's income goal right now is $500,000. Let's just pick that number, right? And she's like, I want to make $500,000 in 2025. I encourage you to add a zero to. To that. So now I want you to show up as a $5 million business owner in 2025. And I want to ask you, how differently would you show up? How different would your content look? How different would you operate? How different would you hire? How different would. How different would you do everything? So that's been my biggest shift. Even before I made any money in the online space, I knew I wanted to be a million dollar earner. So I showed up as a million dollar earner before I ever had a client, before I ever sent an invoice. So I made decisions that like that. And even right now, I'm doing this webinar 300 times, and my goal is to make a million bucks off this webinar. I had to make a really big decision this week about a big expense in my webinar that cost me a lot of money. I said to myself, what would someone do whose webinar was already making a million dollars? They would not be stressed out about this 15 grand. They'd be like, all right, I'm making a million bucks, so I have to make decisions from where I'm going, not from where I'm at right now. And for me, that's been the biggest shift. And what I tell all my. My clients quit operating like, you want to make 60 grand, operate like you want to make 600 grand and watch your business skyrocket.

I think that's, that's like, so good. And I know we both believe tapping into that be her now energy. That was a big movement. Talk about merch. That was the first thing I bought of yours. And rocket on the rug. I love that. Okay, pimp yourself out, please. Where can everybody find you? Where can they listen to you? Tell us more about this webinar. I'm going to link it all in the show notes. If you guys have not already been able to tell by now if you need sales help, you need to be in Jill's world. So please let everybody know where they can find you.

Of course. Yeah, I love pimping myself out. So, number one, I have a podcast. It's called scale your sales. Come over and check it out. We just had Madison on. She actually recorded in studio. The episode was fire. So go over and check out that episode. First and foremost. It was such a great episode called scale your sales. Number two, I have a webinar that I do every single Wednesday, totally free. It's called mastering DM selling so you never have to get on a sales call again. You guys, this is not a fluffy webinar webinar. It is literally a million dollar training. So come over and check it out. And then always on Instagram, I am a content ninja. I put out content every single day. So come over, check out my content, and you will literally learn something every day just from my free content.

Yeah, she's not lying. You guys literally learn something all the time. So, Jill, thank you so much for being here. You have just been somebody that I've looked up to for years now. I feel like I've known you for what, almost three years at this point, and I just am constantly impressed in the way that you show up and you serve. So I appreciate you being here today.

Thank you much. So, so much. Thank you, Madison.