0004: Helping You Understand The New Music Business with Music Industry Expert Rick Barker

Ea interviews episode 4 what's Shaken expert Authority Nation have you ever wanted to break into the music industry? Are you curious what it takes to go from the songs in your head.

To songs on stage?

Well, Rick Barker is the president and CEO of the Music Industry Blueprint in Nashville, Tennessee. He is a manager, entrepreneur, author and consultant focusing on the recent changes in the music business. He's going to be sharing his expertise in insider tips to the same ones he shares with his clients and in his program. And he likes to take the people from where they're at to profitability like he did with Taylor Swift when he was managing her. But while those describe his business life, what he's most excited about is being a Christian husband, father, and being sober. Rick's motto is, your past does not define your future. And he's living proof of that. I'll be bringing him up after we thank our sponsor.

Charity Music has been providing musical instruments and music education to at risk and disadvantaged youth wishing to explore their hidden musical talents. To learn more information, go to charity music.org Once again, that's charitymusic.org well, ladies.

And gentlemen, here he is, Mr. Rick Barker. Rick, it's good to have you here.

Mario. I appreciate it, man. It's like I've been following you since we met. I think it was possibly at a Brenda Burchard event or something a few years ago. And I'm like, who is the sharpest dressed man in the room? And that's what attract. I'm like, that was you. You know, it was like you've always, you've always been a pro, you've always been supportive and I love your spirit and what it is that you're. You're accomplishing. I'm not going to say trying to accomplish because you are accomplishing it. And I'm honored that you wanted to have me on your show. So thank you.

Well, the pleasure is mine. I've seen what you've been doing and you were honestly one of the first people I thought of. And when you replied back to the email and I called you, I was like, this is freaking awesome. I knew we were going to knock it out of the park. So let's jump right into it. I deal with a lot of entrepreneurs and people come to me for coaching and wide different backgrounds and everything. And everyone wants to make more profit, everyone wants to grow their company. But let's talk a little bit about you, because one of my favorite things is the story, the person behind all of this. And I gotta be honest, your bio brought me to tears when I was reading it. I'll let you share how much you're comfortable with.

But what you said and how you ended it, we're on the same page with that brother. And so what is your inspiration for getting into the music industry and ending up where you are now? You know, what's the behind the scene?

Yeah, the thing for me is that I've always had an interest in music. You know, there's pictures of me at 3 and 4 years old at my grandparents house where they would put headphones on me to listen to music, to fall asleep. Growing up from a broken home, my mom was married five times, my dad was married five times. I never really was in a position to afford music lessons or things like that, but honestly, I don't know that I have the patience or personality to learn an instrument. I also realized early on that unless the Motown bands were coming back and they needed a baritone, there probably wasn't a place for me. But I'd always loved and was passionate about music. When my mom moved us to Muscle Shoals, Alabama. There's a great documentary on Netflix about the Muscle Shoals music scene. And the guy she was dating was actually a part of that. So I've always been around music. My stepdad, you know, used to play guitar. He was in a band. But what I realized is I loved listening to radio, but I listened to it because I loved the disc jockeys. And that's what I always wanted to be. I always wanted to be the person announcing the songs. I always had an entrepreneurial mindset. I would always befriend the rich kids and we would take my crazy ideas and create businesses. And one of the first businesses that we had was a mobile DJ company back in the late 70s, early 80s in Alabama. And you know, I'm in high school playing college parties and you know, was that was fun back when you still played vinyl. It was a great time, but music was always my thing, unfortunately. I say unfortunately, but it's probably the most fortunate thing that ever happened to me on a personal level is I went to three different high schools. So every year it was whichever group took me in. You know, my sophomore year it was the jocks and the Christians. So I played sports and I went to church in the same way my junior year. Then when I moved to California, it was the, the stoners that took me in, you know, and I had a half brother. My dad had remarried a gal with six kids and I had a half brother right around my own age. And you know, he was a partier. And I got introduced to drugs. And unfortunately, but fortunately, I ended up addicted to crack cocaine on April 4, 1989, after living on the streets for a couple years with this addiction, I basically got on my knees and asked God to let me die. You know, I was. It was the 80s. It was Hollywood, California. It was just bigger than me, and it almost brought me to my death. But for whatever reason, I think God had other plans. I'm not here to put religion on anyone. That just happens to be my story. And I was given a second chance on life. And then I needed some more humbling that took place in my life. I got sober, realized that there was more to it than just not drinking and using drugs. I ended up doing some jail time in my sobriety. And that's what I call hitting my second bottom, which God just basically explained to me that you're no better than anyone else. And if you don't take these talents that I've given you, and the talent that I have is the. The ability to coach, the ability to teach, the ability to teach other people from my mistakes. A lot of what I teach is your past does not define your future. And I'm living proof of that. You know, and then fast forward, here's this guy with zero experience that get asked to. Gets asked to launch one of the biggest stars of the world and be a part of Taylor's team. And I learned early on as well that as you don't necessarily need a formal education, you need to be knowledgeable. I've always been a learner. I had to speed up my process because at the time I would have been in college, I was strung out on crack. And drug addicts don't make the most reliable students in the world. So right when I got sober, I started taking marketing psychology and all the things that I knew could help make me a better person. And ultimately, it's allowed me to help other people achieve their dreams by being able to listen, by being able to ask questions. It's just been absolutely amazing, and I dig it. You know, it's like every day I look at it as a gift, and I'm supposed to go share that gift. And that gift is helping others, and that's what I love to do.

Well, I sincerely appreciate you for sharing that. I know you're not pushing religion on anyone. I'm not either. I encourage people, and I do let them know that God is for you and it's my show, so you can say whatever you want.

I always tell people you don't have to believe. Just believe in something, you know, don't believe. You don't have to believe what I believe. Just believe in something. Yeah.

Especially for anyone who sees this that feels alone. That is not my story. I had a great childhood growing up, but there were still times I felt alone and you know, even getting older and everything. And I would say inherently as an entrepreneur, it's you're. Whether you have a team or not, you can't always share everything. And I will tell you that I'm also still here because God is for us, not against us, whether, no matter how you take that. But I sincerely thank you and this is not coincidence. I don't believe one bit. So. So that's a little bit behind the scenes. So I don't know why I'm looking at this. I've done this before and I'm the one who wrote the questions. So as far as you're past that now and you have your great business, you put on great videos and I've been following you for years, so I know the answer. But who do you help and how?

What I always tell people is that I try to help those that have a message that wants to be heard. There's so many tools and opportunities, many that we didn't have. When I was launching Taylor, you know, as I took on the role of her manager, basically one of the things that her dad said when I had originally said no to the process, he says, look, he says, you believe in her, you'll show her the work that needs to be done. You'll roll up your sleeves and you'll do the work with her. He said, one of your biggest strengths is that you're not afraid to ask for help. So after spending a while with Taylor, first couple years, my last year with her, I was gone 187 days and I had a 4 year old and a 2 year old at the time. And I was like, all right, God, what's the plan? I'm going to make more money than I've ever seen in my life. But at what expense? Going out alimony as a. Going out in child support. And at the time I was able to help one person. So as I thought about it, I'm like, wait a minute. It's like there's so many people out there, there's so many parents with talented kids, there's so many independent artists that have amazing music, they're willing to do the work, they just don't know what work to do and what they didn't need was a manager. They needed an advisor, they needed a coach, they needed a mentor. So I read Brendan Burchard's book called the Millionaire messenger, and the premise of that book was make a difference and make a living sharing your knowledge and experience with others. A lot of exactly the same thing that you do. And I'm like, okay, wait a minute. I've got 15 years of radio experience, I've got management experience. I launched the biggest star in the world. I currently consult, you know, Sony Music at the time, currently, now consult Big Machine Records. I'm like, why don't I start learning from these digital marketers and figure out how to take my 25 years plus experience and put it online. And that's when I found Jeff Walker. That's when I found Brendan even deeper, started investing in his programs. Jay Abraham, Gary Vaynerchuk. You know, I always tell people if Gary V J Abraham and Brendan Burchard had a baby, it would be me.

So that's kind of what I did, was I realized that I can help change the world with music and not write one single song, play one single note. But by teaching the creatives, you create it. I'll show you how to get rid of it. And the best way to be able to get rid of it is to make sure that you're trying to serve the right audience. Too often people are trying to serve everyone, which means you don't serve anyone. So I really try to help people hone in and focus on who their audience is. I say, let's go find a hungry audience and feed them.

I love that. You know, I tell my clients the same thing. If, if you're doing this just to get the sale, don't even talk to me. I'm not going to let you in my training. But if you're sincerely doing this because you have a servant's heart and attitude and you want to make a difference, oh, it's going to be fun.

It is. And that's one of the things Jeff Walker and Brendan and everyone talked about was give people for free your best stuff. And then they'll say, wow, if that's what he's given away for free, I can only imagine what's behind the paid wall. I can only imagine if he's given me this kind of attention that I don't have to ask for. I can only imagine what happens when he's a part of my team and.

It'S worked and I know it's worked for you. And let's touch on the psychology because I Know, you know what it the difference between the scarcity mindset and the abundance mindset. Because have you ever ran into someone that goes, I don't want to put my music out there, I don't want to put my music video out there. They just, they have that reservation because it's for free and they're not getting paid for it.

I do. And a lot of times that's an excuse. That's a cop out. You know, right now the way that technology is is that we. Music has never been consumed more than it's being consumed now. It's just the modality on which we consume it is different. So what I try to share, artists, is that when people invest, they're investing in you and the relationship that you've created with them because they can hear your music for free, they can watch your videos for free. So if you don't put it out there, someone with less talent is and they're going to build a relationship and ultimately, you know, engage in the commerce part of the business with this person when that relationship's ready. So a lot of creatives just end up making excuses. They're fearful, they are afraid what people are going to think. So great. I always tell them, hey, just stay out of the way, man. It's so crowded anyway. And right now you can't be good. You got to be great. You know, we, we see good everywhere. Great is what we're attracted to for everyone watching.

He said it, you've heard me say, and I agree and stand in agreement with him 100%. You know, put it out there, let people know you, experience you, you know, what's the result of that? So the specifics of I just showed you my sax before we were getting ready, let's say I want to make, actually I have made music videos and they're fun. But how do I get out there? How do I get in front of a jazz club? How do I get in front of here? What do I do? The metadata you were telling me about.

Sure. Well, the first thing you have to do is master your craft. Too often someone thinks just because they play, and I'll use you as an example, just because you play a saxophone doesn't mean you're ready to put yourself out there. What you need to do is master your craft. You need to find out if there's an audience for what it is that you're wanting to bring to them. The biggest thing that you can do as an artist is to go out and get involved in as many conversations with people as you can that you feel ultimately you can share your music with. And when the time is right, then share your music with them. Too often, artists make the mistake of just showing up and going, hey, look at me. Buy for me. Do for me. I know you just met me, but I got a song on itunes. Here, watch my video. And I'm like, whoa, slow down a second. We're maybe not quite there yet in the relationship. So I think the key is you've got to put out a lot of content. You got to put it out often. It has to be competitive. You know, one of the things that people will. They'll. They'll be okay with not perfect video. I mean, we have filters on every app to screw up the video, but the audio, we won't put up with bad audio. So first, master your craft. Two, make sure that the audience that you're going after wants to consume your products. Once you've built an audience, then maybe approach a jazz club in the area that the data shows you from the insights on your socials that you have an audience in that area. Because you got to remember, you always have to show up telling them what you bring to the relationship, not what they can do to help you in the relationship, but what you bring to the relationship make their life easier. I can put butts in the seats. They love the music that I play. And here's my proof. Now you have the ability to have a right conversation with that person. Looking at the data is very important. You know, you brought up the metadata. That was a different conversation we were having as far as sync and film. And I'm not going to go into that on this particular conversation. But there are so many places for you to put your music. It will blow your mind.

Well, I appreciate you for it piqued my interest, honestly. And, you know, I think that's the biggest thing is whether it's the music industry or any industry, Are you a taker or are you a giver? That quote, Thomas Jefferson, was it, ask not what. No, John F. Kennedy. Ask not what you can your country will do for you, but what you can do for your country.

Yeah, it's the same concept.

Yeah. So many people are, I'm going to this event to get something. I'm going here to get something. And it's like, oh, my gosh, you know, what can I get your friends.

That only show up when they need things? The answer is usually no. So don't be that person. You know, it's like, be that person that everyone wants to be. Around because you're an active participant. And I always like to live by the premise that I want that person to be better because of the engagement that we had. Not leaving, going, holy crap, if I never see that guy again, you know, it's like, I want them to. Cannot wait till the next time that we get to spend time together. You know, Jeff Walker and Brendan share this a lot. I want people to feel that when I'm with them that I'm present, you know, that I'm not just there to show what I can do and talk about me. I know about me. I want to know about you. You know, I want to know what your strengths are, what your weaknesses are, what makes you laugh, what makes you cry. The more I know about you, the easier it's going to be for us to have a conversation, to build a relationship and ultimately to earn your trust. Because a lot of times, you know, and you do private coaching as well. It's not that people can't afford your coaching. It's that they just can't justify it yet. So what I try to explain to people is they'll say, well, Rick, I can't afford your program. I said, well, do you really need nine guitars? You know, do you really need five amps? No, you can afford the things that you feel you want or the things that you feel you need. So. So we're just not there yet. So let me keep earning the right to one day become part of your commerce, to where you look and say, okay, now I'm ready. And a lot of times, too, like with you, the mindset has to be right when they enter into the relationship with you, because you're going to be asking them to get out of their comfort zone. You're going to be asking them to do things that they normally wouldn't do. But that's why you hire a coach or you hire a trainer. It's like going to the gym. If you. They say do 10 reps, you're going to do 10 reps. But if there's a guy pushing you to do two more and he's motivating you the right way, you're going to do two more.

With your coaching and your training programs, you take them through the whole process. What is one of the biggest success stories you've had from the music industry blueprint?

Well, I have. I've had a lot of different success stories. First and foremost is that I sit down and determine what does success mean to that person? What would they like their business to look like if someone Comes to me, who has never written a song. The goal might be that they want to write five songs that year. So if they write five songs, we've had success. I had a couple come to me, a husband and wife, and they wanted to be able to pay their bills and make a living. And for the last three years, they've done over six figures, almost hitting $200,000 with no song on the radio, no manager, no booking agent, with about 3,000 fans that they love on and they've created and they tour in about five different states. I've had artists, most recently Maddie Newton, someone who actually works in my office part time, who's also an artist. She's been with me for a long time. She just got her first sound exchange check, you know, for almost $3,000 from a place she got on Radio Disney based on a relationship that I opened up for her. But she worked hard to get to that. You know, we had to make sure everything else was set up. You know, I have artists that have received publishing deals. I have artists that, you know, do go very far on the television shows. It really depends on what the success is. The only guarantee that I give anyone who works with me is that I will prepare them for whatever opportunity comes their way and I'll be honest with them and I won't let them get in the door unless they're ready. Because it's such a crowded industry, we're looking for reasons to say no because it's so crowded, let's not give them any. So teaching people patience, helping them understand that they're trying to function in a dysfunctional business, because in the music industry, your rewards are not in direct proportion to the work that you put in. And that's hard for people to handle sometimes.

Well, I appreciate your transparency and honesty because like you were saying, just because you play, play a horn or because you, you started a business, whoop dee doo, right? You're going to be a millionaire this week. You gotta do something and not not be a taker. So thank you for the behind the scenes of that.

So it's interesting, I want to interject one more thing, is that I did a survey recently and I asked people, so how much money did you make with your music career last year? And 78% made less than $5,000 because they don't know how to monetize the business. So If I take 10% of those folks and they make $10,000 when they never made 5,000 before that success, everyone seems to think, or they're not even Thinking as much anymore is that, well, unless I'm on television or I win a Grammy or I get a record deal or my song's on the radio, that's success. There's a lot of those people that have had that, that don't have careers. I'm trying to help people build careers. And what I tell them is this. If you can make $50,000 a year doing what you love, you make more than a lot of teachers, than a lot of nurses, than a lot of civil servants, and you're getting to play music. So let's, let's keep it relative to where you are. Everyone says they want to be a millionaire. Well, that's hard when the majority of people don't even make $60,000 a year. So why don't we start there first? You know, why don't we get to six figures, then why don't we get to mid six figures, and then, then we'll get to seven? But everybody thinks, well, unless I'm a millionaire, I, I, I failed. Well, 1% is over $400,000. Most of us aren't in the 1%, so we want to go straight to a million. And, and that's the biggest mistake I think entrepreneurs make. That's the biggest mistake that I think people coming into this is they set the benchmark way too high that they're not in a position to experience and enjoy those little successes along the way. We've got to crawl before we walk, and walk before we run. I know it's easier said than done, but most people fail because they set their goal too high.

I'd have to agree. And when you said she. I'm not sure what Sound Exchange is. It sounds like a royalty Commission for Music.

SoundExchange is the company that collects. Here's where a lot of artists make the mistake is they sign up for their performance rights organization, BMI, ASCAP. People have heard of CSAC. SoundExchange collects Internet radio royalties like Sirius, Pandora, Radio Disney. So unless you also sign up with Sound Exchange, there's, they call it the black box. There is billions of music royalties that have not been paid to because people don't know where to send the money. That's one of the first steps that I teach in my program is let's register your business properly and make sure your music is registered properly. People just record it and put it out there in the world and then wonder why they're not making any money. A lot of times it's because they haven't set up their business Properly.

Well, thank you for that tidbit. You're welcome to take this video and chop that into a little segment right there. But honestly, that's the thing about it is there's so much expertise and wisdom that people disseminate and they're like, oh, how come no one's seen it? We'll chop it up to make it more digestible. But what you were saying about the first $3,000, I mean, when you're launching something like a book or a video, I remember years ago, I was like, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do it. And you have nothing. I had to overdraft an account to get any training. I was like, negative. Hundreds of dollars. And the next month I made over eight grand.

That's right, that. And you'll never forget that.

That is a bigger thing than going, oh, you know, I did 10, 20, 30, 40 grand this month. It's like when it's normal and that, that's the new norm, you know, bfd. But when you have nothing and you go here, that's a bigger transformation.

Well, it shows that it can happen. And then what you have to do is figure out what's the process to multiply it. Now the multipliers come into effect. You know, you can't. Timing and luck are not duplicatable. And there's a lot of things that you'll see with artists. I'll use Taylor as an example. You cannot go back and recreate when Kanye west walked up on the MTV Video Awards and took the trophy from her. We can't recreate that. But what. What happened was she was prepared for that opportunity. You know, that's the stuff you can't duplicate. You can't duplicate Eric Church getting kicked off the Rascal Flats tour by week that her album comes out and her getting added to the Rascal Flats tour that month. So when people say, well, I want to do it the way Taylor did it. You can't. You cannot do it the way anyone ever did it. No two persons path to success will ever be the same. Dot for dot for dot. It's just not possible.

But you can prepare for it. Like you're saying.

Correct. That's the key, is you have to be prepared for success. I remember when I was at 10x Empire at Brendan's event, we all spent $10,000 to be there. There was about 200 of us. I was in a small group with Jeff Walker and JJ Virgin and Darren Hardy from Success magazine. And Brendan asked the question, he says, how many of you would love 1 million qualified eyeballs to land on your website today? And everybody raised their hand. He said, great, let me ask you a question. How many of you have the next 45 days worth of communication on already set up in automation and everybody's hand went down? He said, that's the problem. Many of you are wanting to grow too fast. Make sure that you're prepared to handle what it is that you're searching for. And he shared the story of a young lady that went on Oprah. Oprah found this woman, fell in love with this woman, she brought her on her show and she had no book and no website. And that woman will never be able to go back and recreate that moment that was created for her with Oprah. She was not prepared for her moment. So the key is to make sure that you were prepared for your moment and not get your moment too quick.

That is awesome. So as far as you're kind of indirectly telling people, make sure you're prepared. Have the website, have the book, have everything buttoned up. How would you say your book has helped you?

Well, my book is interesting. I didn't graduate high school. You know, I'm terrible with grammar. What I did was, is I'm a talker, I'm a communicator. So I just put my phone up and I live about 25. At the time, it was 25 minutes from Nashville. Now we've grown so much as a city, it's like 45 minutes. So my branding was thrown out the door. But I had a YouTube video blog called 25 Minutes from Nashville where I would just talk about situations, whether it be questions that people ask me things about the industry. I'm a solutions person. So I would always address talk about the problem, but I would always come at it with a solution. And a gentleman came up to me one time and he said, hey, I'm going to start writing blogs for this music industry site. He said, I would love to have a book to give away. Would you mind if I took 10 of your blogs and 10 of mine and created a book? So I said, well, they're just in video. So I went to can't remember what it was at the time. It's called something different now. But I found a gal in India who was an attorney by day and she transcribed by night. So I sent her the YouTube links. She transcribed my videos. I handed them to another person in my office who was a grammar freak, and she cleaned it up and we Gave them to Wade. He put 10 of his together, 10 of mine, and I ended up calling the book the $150,000 music degree. Now, there was two reasons for that. One is that's what Berkeley Full Sail Belmont charged for a music degree. And unfortunately, it's a degree on theory, because things change so rapid in the industry that they could never keep their accreditation up if they were changing textbooks every six months. So that's why you get a degree on theory. I was able to bring a degree on reality, and $150,000 was my salary when I launched Taylor. And everything that I know about the music industry, I learned from doing so. Having that book has been fantastic. I use it. I give it away on my website for people to come into my world. I also, you know, it's a great calling card. You know, author, podcaster. You know, it helps having that kind of content. But I just felt that it was interesting that I never wrote one single word. And I'm a published author and have a book that's available on Amazon, or you can get it free from my website@rickbarker.com that is amazing.

And I remember those videos. I used to watch them, and I'm like, I need to get a mount for my car. I still never have. I just use my arm, and it freaks out my friends in California, because they're safe.

Yeah, right.

But I got long arms. But I just remember I was in. What I liked about it was, you were so giving with the information, but also your expertise and your productivity. Most people just sit there and, you know, they're jamming out in the car, and I. I'm probably doing this. I do both. You know, you heard me jamming out before we got started here. But they're just listening, doing whatever this. That. The other thing, not realizing someone can be listening to their show while they're driving or listening to their videos, listening maybe to an audiobook, maybe, you know, anything. And they're just.

It's the University of Ford. I used to go to the University of Chevy, and then I traded in my Tahoe and ended up with a hybrid, a Ford Fusion. But what I do is I at least record. I produce two podcasts a month or a week, excuse me, that go out eight a month. I can say safely that 60% of them are from my AirPods while I'm driving, because I talk to myself like most entrepreneurs do. There's so many things that are going on in our head, so I use that time to be creative. I also use audible. I'M a huge Audible fan. You know, I haven't read a book in years. I've listened to probably two a month on average. Sometimes more like when we're out on the road, as I was just recently with one of my artists, you know, I was able to listen to another one. I'm listening to one right now called Running Down a Dream. A gentleman reached out to me on Instagram, said, I'd love to send you my book. I love your stuff. I said, hey, is it on Audible? I got credits, you know, Turned out his book was $4.98. I didn't waste a credit. I bought it for five bucks. And I'm enjoying the heck out of this guy's book. All the Gary Vee books. I've listened to the Grant Cardone books. I've listened to the Tony Robbins books. You know, it's like, Simon, you know, start. What's your start with?

Why?

You know, all the. All of them. It's like, that's where I get my knowledge and education. The I love marketing podcast, Perpetual Traffic podcast is off the charts. If you want to know everything you can about running Facebook ads, which all of you entrepreneurs should be, there are places out there to get this knowledge for free. It's what you do with the knowledge that you get that's important. You know, a lot of it's like knowing it's one thing, doing it is another.

Absolutely. So turn your car into a rolling university.

Absolutely. Absolutely.

So, last question before we go to the sponsor. How has video helped you with your business?

It's changed it completely because we hear with our eyes. We live in a video world. And now it's like video with transcriptions and the fact that you can be on all social media platforms by way of video. People are going to be able to consume this conversation that we're having anywhere in the world. They're going to be able. I think video also brings more trust because when you're able to see someone for whatever reason, we're more comfortable with things that we can see versus things that we hear. It's an absolute game changer. Streaming, unbelievable. Building relationships, Unbelievable. I am all in on video and I hope it continues to grow, which I think it will.

Very good. Well, thank you for sharing. We're going to cut to the sponsor and bring Rick back up after that.

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And we are back. So we're gonna jump into the imperfect action items because here in entrepreneurial land, you don't need to do everything perfect. Perfect. It's just a matter of taking the action. I personally didn't pass English, I failed it seven times, and I published a book myself. So when you were sharing about taking your blogs and taking all that, I mean, if you want to do something, you can do it. So imperfect action item number one. What is the biggest problem you see in the music industry and the fastest and easiest way to fix it?

First off, Ryan Levesque from the Ask Method says it doesn't have to be per. You don't have to get it perfect, you just have to get it going. And I completely agree with that. Now, the bigger problem that musicians make is that they put their music out there before it's ready. You are now competing with the best in the world. The greatest thing about technology is it's allowed anyone to get in the game, but it's also made very noisy. You want to make sure that you have it right. You want to make sure that you do your learning behind the curtain. You do your relationship building on the other side of the curtain. So one of the things that you need to do first is remember that you're getting into a business. All businesses that are started up need to have. You need to understand the business you're getting into. You need to understand and educate yourself on that business. So first and foremost, make sure that when you're getting your stuff out there that it's the best Representation of who you are. And at that moment, if you notice that people aren't sharing your stuff, if you notice that people aren't commenting, that's their way of saying and telling you it's just not there yet. I'm not going to put my stamp of approval on it. You don't go and recommend terrible movies to all of your friends. You just don't say anything. But when you hear something or see something that you like, you're more than happy to share it. So you really got to make sure that your craft is on point and that you master your craft. Once again. We're not curing cancer, so we'll be okay if you don't show up with your song tomorrow. If you've got a cure for cancer, we want you here right now. We needed you last week. If you're just delivering music, it's out there. There's no shortage of pretty people that can sing. There's no shortage of ugly people that can sing. There's no shortage of skinny, fat, whatever. Now, good music isn't finding its way to the top. It's great music, so go work on making it great.

Love that. All right, shortest path to the cash. What's one thing the music industry could and should do to increase their profits?

I think what they have to understand is to stop fighting change. It is what it is right now. And there's so many different ways. We were talking about this earlier. There's so many places for your music in the traditional music industry. You know, we'll just talk about major labels and Nashville as an example. And is they're still all fighting for the same 40 to 50 slots on radio. There's hundreds of songs being written every day, sometimes thousands. Probably there's thousands and thousands of places that your music can be heard, but everyone seems to think that it has to go in this particular route. So start exploring a lot of the other ways that are out there for you to monetize your music through licensing, sync, film, television games, YouTube videos, wedding videos. You know, there's so many different places that your music can be heard. The key is, is if you're doing this for all the right reasons and you say to yourself, I just want my music to make a difference. Prove it. Because most of your actions are not matching up with your work. You're saying that's what you want, but you're not doing everything that you can to make that happen. So start getting your music out there. Let it be heard. Let it make a difference. And then when the Time is right. Create an opportunity for people to, you know, spend money on a $5 bracelet or a $10 T shirt, or come to a concert or a ticket. Don't be afraid to use your music as the marketing tool that it should be used for. And then it's that bigger consumption later that's going to lead to, you know, where the monetization is at. The monetization, unfortunately, in most of the music industry is on the back end. It's not on the front end. With music licensing, you get paid on the front and you get paid on the back. So I'm a big proponent with that. My buddy Michael Elsner with Master Music Licensing has shared with me and opened up my eyes to that whole world that's out there. And I've been able to share that with my clients, and I'm absolutely blown away by the opportunities that are out there.

Very good. So, last thing. Customer lifetime value. What's one way your clients could maximize their customer lifetime value?

By getting to know their customer better than they do. One of the things that you have to understand early on is you can have the best hamburger stand in the world, but if you open it up in a town of vegetarians, you just screwed yourself. So it doesn't matter how great you think it is. It's like when I say, find a hungry audience and feed them, that's what I mean. It's like, get to know as much about your audience as you can. What movies are they watching, what books are they reading, what else are they talking about, and create opportunities to get in the conversation. And then when the time is right, if. If you're inside that conversation and you hear something, create a piece of merchandise that goes along with it. Hell, listen real good and write a song about what it is that they're talking about. But the cool part about country music is those. Those fans seem to. To grow old with you. You know, there's certain. Depending on your style of music, some of it's a fad, some of it are phases that people go through. But, you know, lifetime value, it's not. I don't think it's as easy to quantify inside the music industry because things change so much. But I think take advantage of the value that you can bring today, and that's where your focus should be. And if you do that, I think that these people will move on with you. But I. I wouldn't even know how to put a lifetime value on a. On a fan, because the technology will change. Maybe people stop going to tickets shows live and the tickets aren't 500 like they are now, but they become $50 and you're wearing a pair of, you know, virtual headphones or iPhones or whatever. You know, with technology, you never know what it's going to be. So it's really hard to put a number on that. At least I can't figure it out.

Well, I think you've said it great and you're right, it is. You know, as things change. I told people years ago when I changed my company name for the third or fourth time, I go, this is the last time when we're. You're holograms 10 years from now for marketing. I don't want to have to call it, you know, such and such, whatever, you know, IWD now holograms. And I just saw an article recently at an upcoming event where they're bringing back Zig Ziglar as a hologram to present.

Yes, yes.

So you said it best with be great. Good isn't good enough. That's how I would say is you stay focused on that. It doesn't matter what you're going to do, you're going to be able to have the people follow with you.

So absolutely.

Thank you for sharing with us. So let's tell Pete you alluded to it earlier. Please allude to it again. Tell people where they can find your stuff and get their free copy of your book.

Yeah, just go to rickbarker.com while you're there, grab a free copy of the book. You can also click on the podcast link and go back and listen to past episodes. There's a lot of great stuff in there. Most of them are anywhere from that 8 to 12 minute mark. Occasionally you'll get a longer one if I'm interviewing somebody or I just think that the value is so tremendous. Once. Once I feel that we're not bringing value and we're just chatting, I cut it off. So know that every minute you spend with me, I try to bring value to you because I know your time's important and there's a lot of people that you could be listening to and a lot of things that you could be doing with your time. So I try to be very conscious of that and respectful of that. So it's like I tell my people, if I send you an email, it's bringing value. If it stops bringing value, unsubscribe. But I do everything that I can on a daily basis to bring as much value to as many people as possible, to let them learn from my mistakes, to let them, you know, understand that you know your past, like I said, does not define your future. And to know that today it's never been easier to make money. As long as you start with a servant's heart and and a servant's mindset, people are willing to pay you for your time. Don't be afraid to earn that right.

Thank you very much Rick. And that's why you've created the Expert Authority effect in your business. And I appreciate you for coming on and sharing with this. I've got a ton out of it. I can't wait to go back and re listen to it. So thank you again and we'll see you again.

Thank you sir.

You're already successful.

You've worked hard to get where you are. We both know it wasn't overnight and.

It hasn't always been easy.

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