0131: The Benefits of Self-Directed IRA’s with Terry White

Ea interviews episode 131 inspiration, transformation, success stories and the imperfect action round. Seven days a week, join Mario Ficcini for today's Expert Authority Effect interview. Alright, so business is going well and you have a successful company, but have you ever thought about the future? I know I have and there's times I'm going, oh, I'm so excited about it and there's other times going, maybe I should be doing more. And that's why I'm excited to have Terry White, author, trainer. He's a podcast host and he's the CEO of a retirement company where he specializes in helping people with self directed IRAs. And he's going to be sharing with us today how we can have a better future financially from all the hard work that we're doing today. I'm going to bring him up right after we thank our sponsor.

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Here he is, ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Terry White. Terry, how are you feeling today?

I'm doing great, Mario, how are you?

I'm excited to hear what you have to say because so many people are working for today, working for this year and everything, but I mean, I got to admit myself, I haven't always put the future first and foremost and I know it's an important thing. So tell us why future planning and how did you get into it?

You know, why future planning? That's just a really easy question because we're all going to get there. I know you're a young guy, so you've got several years, but when you get to be my age, I'm 59 years old and you start thinking, how am I going to take care of myself for the rest of my life if I want to retire? I'm not the type that's ever going to retire probably, but most of us are. And so if you don't start thinking about that when you're younger, you know, it'll get there before you know it and then you'll, you'll think, well, how am I going to make it? You know, and then we end up, you know, being a greeter at Walmart or something like that. And that's, that's just not what we want for people.

How long have you been doing it?

Well, I started, I started an escrow company, I graduated from the university here in New Mexico and went to work for a title company. And I did that for four years. And then I started what's known as an escrow company here in New Mexico. In New Mexico, an escrow company is a, for lack of a better term, it's a mortgage servicing company, but for owner financing. So if someone's going to sell their house and they decide to be the bank themselves, my company accepts the monthly payments and disperses the money to the seller and takes care of taxes and insurance and that kind of thing. So I started that company in 1987 and then in about 2003 I decided we needed to have another line of business. And so I had already knew a little bit about self directed IRAs, so I started a trust company, Sunwest trust. And in 2004 we opened for business. And here now 15 years later, we service about 8,000 accounts for people all over the country.

That's impressive. Congratulations.

Thank you.

Have you seen some changes in not just people but the market in the last 30 years?

Yeah, you know, so since we specialize in non traditional type assets. So you know, when people think of an ira, they think of stocks, bonds, mutual funds. And that's simply because the banks and the brokerage houses have had more money and they do a much better job of advertising than we do. And so people just don't even realize that they can invest their IRA in, in something like real estate or precious metal or private companies. I'm not sure about it, but I've been told that some of the investment money that started Facebook way back when was an individual retirement account. So people have the opportunity to invest in their neighbor or their buddies budding new business using their retirement account and they simply just don't know about that. So we've been very fortunate. Over the last 15 years.

We ran across a really good search engine optimization person that helped us out. And so people are looking for us and they find us on the Internet and then set up their account with us. So it's worked very well for us.

Yeah, it sounds like it's going well. I want to touch on the. You said the retirement account for Facebook. There's no penalties for withdrawing if you want to invest in someone?

Well, no, you wouldn't withdraw though. That's the cool thing is you take your Iraq. So the majority of people end up with a sizable IRA and I'm talking, you know, 30 to $100,000 in it because they worked for some company and then they quit or left for whatever reason and they had a 401k there. Well, you can roll that 401k over into an individual retirement account and then that's what people did. So when I say an individual retirement account, what was. Maybe this is what I've heard. I mean, I don't know this for a fact, but in any situation you can take your individual retirement account and invest it with your next door neighbor who's starting a fintech company or some kind of a new.com company or something. And so that's what happened. And it never leaves your ira. It stays in your IRA and you just invest, your IRA invests in that and then the returns that you get from that come back into your IRA and either tax deferred or tax free. So that's the exciting thing about it.

For someone who doesn't know, what would you say is the main pro and con to a IRA versus a Roth ira?

So what you're talking about is you have what's known as a traditional ira. And I don't mean when I say traditional, I don't mean traditional investments. But that's the first IRA that was started by Congress. And the idea behind that is the money that you put into it tax deductible. So you put that money in pre tax and then you don't pay taxes on that until you start taking it out. And you can't take it out to your 59 and a half and then you have to start taking it out when you turn 70 and a half. So at that time you would start paying taxes on it. That's a traditional account. And then the next one that came along later, I believe it came along in like 1984, was the Roth account. And the Roth account, you put money into that that you've already paid taxes on. So I put after tax money into the Roth. But the really cool thing about the Roth is if you've had it five years, if you had a Roth account for five years and you're over 59 and a half, all of the income that builds up in that Roth over time comes out tax free. So again, you know, we talked about at the very beginning of the program about when to start. Man, if you start when you're in your 30s or hopefully even in your 20s, I mean, just think how much money you could have built up in that over the years, even without a huge return, just the time value of that money, you get all that out tax free. I mean that's like a gift that the government's given us is to use that Roth account.

Now if someone's going, well, I don't want to pay taxes down the road. Or someone else is also being devil's advocate saying, I'd rather pay them now or not pay them now. I'd rather pay them down the road. Do you think taxes would be more or less 30 years later?

That's a great question. And you know, before I started my trust company, I have a degree in accounting. And so when I got out of school, I kind of planned on being a financial planner and helping people that way. And what they always told you then was, you know, you save money and you try to avoid taxes. Now you try to defer your taxes because when you get old, you're going to have a lower, you're going to be in a lower tax bracket. And what, what was typically meant by that was you're probably going to make less money. So your tax, you know, we're, what is it called, a progressive tax rate where the more you make, the higher percentage you pay. So if you're making less money, you're going to pay a lower percentage. But man, we've all seen over the years the taxes don't go down. And I don't know about you, Mario, but when I get older, when I retire, if I ever retire, I, I'm planning on making more money and spending more money because I want to enjoy myself. So, you know, it's not a bad idea to pay the taxes now and put that in a Roth account and then have it tax free later.

I appreciate the expert authority insight on that because this is a great topic that I think less than majority of people talk about and discuss. And two things about it. One, when you're considering these things, I love that you said that you want to be making more because I've heard that too. You know, fixed income, this, I actually saw it on something or hurt someone said it in the last week or two and I googled, I'm like, what the heck is fixed income? Because if you're referring to, you know, you're on a fixed income when you retire, the mindset is you, your monthly check from what Social Security is only so much. And I'm thinking, how is that any different from a job you had for 40 years where the check is the same, it's just less but potentially. But who wants that? So what would you say to someone, you know, like yourself that wants to make more down the road then less. And the second thing I got to ask is, do we need to make any disclaimer? I'm not a tax advisor. You know, I don't know what you have to do. Feel free to say, I'm not a tax advisor or attorney, but I want to play one on tv.

Yeah, no, you're exactly right. And I am not a tax advisor. I don't do. You know, at one time I wanted to be a financial planner, and I used to have a Series 7 license and all that stuff, but that's not what I do now. And so the information that probably you and I both are putting out here, people need to. And I would encourage them to do that anyway. They need to figure it out for themselves. They need to research it. You know, just because you hear it on the Internet, you read it on the Internet or you hear it in a podcast, doesn't mean it's true. So it's just, you know, we're giving people the idea to go do the research themselves and figure it out for themselves. And, man, education is the most valuable thing you can do in this is get out. And, you know, there's tons of available things out there to read and a lot of other people out there besides me that probably know a lot more about it than I do. So get on YouTube and watch the videos and, you know, do the reading. Do the research for yourself.

Yeah, I remember when I set up and learned about the Roth myself years, years ago. I was excited for down the road. I'm like, I don't want to have to wait till I'm 59 and a half. But it made. I mean, that little piece alone, that's a big difference. You know, 30, 40 years later, when you're going, oh, I have to pay taxes on this. No one ever told me, well, what do you do at that point versus, oh, now it's playtime.

Yeah. No, like I said, it's a gift. And I'm kind of surprised that the government, in fact, they've actually, over the last few years, I say the last few years, when in 2010 and 11, they literally encouraged people to convert their traditional accounts to Roth accounts because they wanted them to pay the taxes on it. Now, the interesting thing about the government, and probably most people don't know this, they don't look out past 10 years. And so me, as a business person, I was looking at what they were doing and saying, well, what's happening is you're getting people to pay taxes now, but you're giving up all that income when they start taking that out. But unfortunately, I think the government doesn't. They don't care. It's what happens in the next 10 years, we got to get as much income as we can in the next 10 years. So we should all take advantage of that and start those Roth accounts.

I totally get where you're coming from because I also think down, down the road, but don't say it too loud because it's still good.

But to the point of after the recession, they probably, like any business would, would want the money now, so they can use it too. But it's also from a business standpoint, I also feel it's a reactive state to always be in. It's fun to go, you know what, I might not profit for five or 10 years from this, but look out 20, 30, 40, because I'll still be here.

So be proactive. You're exactly right. I mean, instead of being reactive and how many people do we see, you know, they get to be in their 60s, they get close to 65, which everybody thinks that's when you're supposed to retire. And then they look and say, well, how am I going to do that? You know, how am I going to retire and maintain the lifestyle I have? And you know, I don't know, but I sure don't want to retire and have to, you know, move into a smaller house and any cat food or whatever. I want to be able to go out and travel and enjoy myself. And so, you know, if nothing else I can get across on this podcast is if you're young, no matter how old you are, start saving for your retirement now. Whether you use a self directed account or you just put it in the bank, or you put it in a mutual fund, start right now. You know, and if you work at a company, you know, my company, we provide a 401k for our employees and we match it to a certain extent. And, you know, it took me a few years to convince everyone that, hey, you'd have to lose 50% of your money in the stock market to even break even. If you just put Money in this 401k, I'm giving you some money. And if you lost half of everything, you'd still have your own money there. So it's a no lose situation, you know, to start putting money away.

Now again, great expert authority insight. What does it take to retire? Age or income?

Income. Income, definitely. Because if you, you know, you and I both heard of people that are in their 40s that retire or you also heard of people that are in their 80s that still can't retire. So that's the key thing. And you talked about fixed incomes and I understand what you're saying about what? That. Why that's not any different than a job. But what people want to be able to do is have a large enough sum of money that that fixed amount of money that they're able to earn on that is enough to live on. And so that's what I meant by saying, you know, I want to spend more when I retire. I want to have a big enough nest egg, if you will, that the return that I can generate on that is enough for my wife and I, you know, to travel together and sometimes take our kids with us and enjoy that stuff together. So the whole idea of trying to, you know, saying, well, when I get older and I retire, my income tax will be less, you know, number one, I'm not positive that the rates are going to be lower. I think they'll probably be higher, number one. And number two is if you've still got a decent income, you're going to be in the upper, upper parts of that tax bracket anyway. So sometimes it does. You know, I'm sorry to interrupt you, but I, you know, I don't want to really take. Say that a traditional account is bad because anything you do to put money away is better than nothing. But if you're in a position to pay the taxes now and put it into a Roth, that would be a smart thing to do.

I think that's more great insight and I appreciate you for clarifying that, because as much as I was somewhat making a joke, because all I've ever heard it from the way it was described was not that eloquent, let's just say that. And it's been numerous times the other way. I'm like, it's the same thing. But what you're saying makes sense. You want to have so much that the dividends are the fixed amount, and that's what you're living off of.

Yeah. And that's a number that you can. That you can afford to enjoy yourself with.

Yeah. And I appreciate you using the word expert all the time. I don't know that I consider myself an expert, but it makes me feel really important. So thank you.

That's how I know you're an expert. Because all the ones I talk to, they're not going around, go and look at me, look at me. They're actually trying to help people.

Yeah. Yeah. Cool.

So speaking of helping people, let me ask you, who do you help and how are you really helping them? Because there's something you do differently. And we made the joke about, you know, we're not advisors. But why don't you tell Expert Authority World about that?

So I'm not exactly sure what, what you're asking.

Who are you ideally looking for to help?

Well, so in my business I think that there's only. So we talked a little bit off air about the number of IRAs there are out there. There's said to be about 42 million IRAs in the United States right now. And unfortunately the majority of those people probably don't have the desire or the knowledge to self direct them themselves. So the client that we're looking for at Sunwest is the client that is interested in investing on their own. They understand a particular investment and they're willing to do the research and put in the work to educate themselves about that investment. The people that I see, that I worry about and I'm afraid end up just losing their money are the people that jump into something because it promises a huge return. And then they find out they don't understand how that investment works or how it's going to pay them back. And that's a tragedy because they end up losing their money. The other thing I would recommend to people, I don't care what kind of investment you make, don't put all your eggs in one basket. I mean that's an old saying that we've heard for years, but it holds true. I mean, you know, I've seen situations where people find this investment that they think is great and it's going to be the next big thing and they put their entire IRA into it and then it's not the next big thing. And if they had, if they had only put 10% or 15% of their investable nest egg into it and it went bad, that wouldn't be good, that would suck. But it would at least you'd still have money left over, you know what I mean? So I would encourage people make sure you're diversified, I mean truly diversified and don't put all your money into one investment.

Is there an amount you'd say is the threshold of somewhat safety? I heard you say 10 to 15%. Would you ever recommend 20 over 5 assets?

You know, I'm not an advisor, I'm not a financial advisor. So I think that is all going depend on my opinion is it's going to depend on your age. I mean if you're young enough and you lose 20% of your retirement account and you're still in your 30s, you've got a lot of time, so you can make that back. If you're my age at 50, you know, 59. I don't know that I would put that, you know, I would maybe diversify it a little bit more because I don't have the time, if I lost a part of it, to earn that back. So.

It'S really not possible to give a set number simply because it depends on each person's. It depends on their risk tolerance and it depends on their age. And it also depends on how much they want to have at a certain time. I mean, I'm getting to the point where I'm looking at my own personal financial.

You know, my own assets. And I'm thinking, you know, maybe I want to put maybe 60% of this in something very, very safe. That may not make that big a return, but I know it's going to be there. So when I'm, you know, when I'm 75, it's still there. I didn't take a chance of losing it. And I may have not made a whole lot of money, but it's still there.

But the fact that you're keeping it, I know that's a big thing. I tell my clients it's not how much you make, it's how much you keep. Because, I mean, that's a whole other topic in itself. But you could argue that keeping it for another 16 years is making it because you didn't lose it.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think I would agree with that.

Let me ask you about some of your clients. You don't need to say their names or anything, but what's the biggest success story or transformation you've been able to give someone?

You know, I've got a couple of success stories that I think about when people ask me that question. One of them is a friend of mine here locally in Albuquerque.

Took his. He had a rollover of a 401k and put it in his IRA, and he bought a house free and clear. His IRA owned that house completely. And he was, you know, he was in his 30s at the time. And so the rent coming in from that house built up. And when he built up enough money, he bought another house and another house. And now, last I checked, I think he had seven houses free and clear houses in his Iraq, and they were generating about nine grand a month. So he's got this asset that probably here in Albuquerque, realistically, seven houses is probably worth a couple million dollars. And he's making 7, $8,000 a month income that he can start taking out. He's about my age, so he's not ready to retire yet. But that was a great Success story, I think. And another one that I think of is a little older lady that I've talked to on the phone. I've never met her in person, but I talked to her on the phone and she had a nephew that flipped houses. So, you know, I don't know if anybody knows anybody who's a house flipper, but those guys are always looking for money, always looking for places to borrow money. And so she had some money in her ira, and so she uses that money in her IRA to lend money to her nephew. And it's at a better rate than he could get from, from a hard money lender, but it's also at a better rate than she could get somewhere else. So it works out as a win win situation for both of them. She's really happy. I think last time I talked to her, she even got another of this kid's aunts. So these two aunts both lend him money to flip houses and he, you know, he pays them a good return and he's able to do his thing and they make a good return on their investment.

That's awesome to hear because I've heard stories where people, you know, it's interesting because the banks, they don't want to lose their money either. But there's so many people that want to pursue something and I get why they're cautious because if you're not established and can prove yourself, essentially they don't want to lose the money either. But at the same time, there are so many people out there. I'm thinking back to when I started my business. I never took a loan for it or anything, but it was just like, I know knew I was going to make it. And it's like, how do you convey that? How do you look 10 years down the road and tell everyone else? It's like, just prove it. You know, you gotta wait. But there's so many people out there that want to do this and they are good, reputable people, like you're saying. So I'm happy to hear that, you know, she could help him and he could help her. And I'm sure he only had to do it one or two times. And it's just going to keep continuing. And I don't know what the rate is, but it's not like the banks are paying 10, 15%.

Yeah, absolutely. I think at the time, and I don't remember this, so don't hold me to it, but I think he was paying her 10% or something, which was more than she could earn in the bank. And was less than he would have to pay if he went and borrowed it from, from what we call, you know, hard money lender or something. So it worked out very well for him.

That's, that's an interesting scenario because when you were saying you want to be more cautious, the older you get, you might find a situation like that where she might be able to make more in these 10 years than the previous 20.

Absolutely. And the nice thing about that, you know, you mentioned family and friends. I mean, where a bank wouldn't lend him money because they don't know him and they don't know his. You know, I'm thinking about you saying you started your business, the people that knew you, they knew how, you know, how tenacious you were and how hard working you were, and you know, you weren't going to give up. Well, the banker doesn't understand that. And that's not his fault. It's just the way things are. But friends and family that have known you all your life, it's not as risky a bet in that situation. Now, you know, I'm not going to say that this lady's nephew couldn't make a bad deal and lose his money, but number one, he's going to be a lot more likely to work his tail off to make sure he pays his aunt back than he is a bank. Maybe. And, you know, just because of the fact that she believed in him, he's going to work harder to make sure he gets the money back to her. So.

Yeah, and that's the fun thing about business is you can do whatever you want, whether your family supported or not, because it's not like everyone's like, oh my gosh, here you go. That wasn't the case at all. Yeah, but business allows you the opportunity to serve people and create sales.

Yeah.

If I, you know, one of the best things I ever learned when I was young was mom and dad go, you can have anything you want as long as you pay for it. And dad always said, need more money, make more money. I'm like, I'm getting my WaveRunner, which I did in high school. Cash.

Yeah, yeah. No, and that's you. And I sound like we were both very fortunate to have parents that explained that to you, you know, that, hey, you can have whatever you want. You just have to work a little harder. You have to figure out how to go out and get it yourself. And, you know, I didn't have a waverunner, but I was always the type that I wanted things, you know, different things. I wanted a new Car and stuff. And I. And so you just figure out if it's important enough to you, you figure out how to make it work.

It sounds like you're a lot like me. Greedy. You like clothes and food.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

All right, so with all the people you've helped, what would you say is. Been the most rewarding for you overall?

You know, I think because it's closer to me. I think the most rewarding thing for me is my employees that I've helped. We don't have a lot of employees. We have 25 employees. But I've got the very first employee I ever hired. She's worked for me for 32 years. She's my vice president and she runs this company for me. And we have other employees.

One. Another one that's been here 22 years, several that have been here over 15, 16 years. And so because those people are close and I see their families and I know them, those are the ones that are most rewarding, the people that they help, basically. I mean, I don't really. I don't do any of the work around here. They all. They do the work and make sure things get done. And so, you know, maybe.

They would be more able to tell you about an individual and how they felt because they helped them on the phone and helped them set up their account or something. But I just really enjoy helping those people and knowing that we provided a livelihood for them and we provided a nice place to work where they enjoyed coming in and hanging out with people that they liked.

Well, that's a huge testament, because you might say it's only 25 people, but that's a pretty decent, decent sized company. And the fact that you've had the first one the whole time, that's a huge testament.

Thank you.

So one question before we go to the imperfect action round.

Where do you see yourself with the.

Company 10 years from now?

That's a great question. I have three boys that work with me, and we're doing some other things, and so I don't. You know, we'll see how it goes. I am not the type of person to retire, so I might. I might continue doing this. We're. We're getting into a lot of other things that I know that I. That I don't know much about that I'm learning about. We opened a tap room here, and we're gonna start a winery and stuff like that. So I see myself just doing something new when I'm 75, 80 years old. I just. I love what I do, and it's not that I love this particular business. I just love business. You know, I love being coming in and not knowing what's going to happen every day, who's going to call on the phone. I'm going to get to talk to you today and, you know, tomorrow I may talk to somebody else and it's just a lot of fun. So I enjoy that.

I can definitely relate to that. When you're doing something that you really, truly enjoy, it's like, yeah, there's some official business in there, but most of it's like, I get to live my dream that I had when I was 18. Not bad.

Yeah. And, you know, not to make anybody think you go into business for yourself and every day is just great. I'm sure you've had struggles and you have months, maybe weeks that you're really having to struggle, but you get through them. And the nice thing about it is you can, you can look on the other side of that and say, I got through that and I did it. And, you know, I've been, I was very fortunate. My parents were very supportive and my wife's very supportive of, of being in business. So it's worked out well for me.

Overall, though, we get to beat the spread.

Absolutely. Yeah.

All right, we're going to thank our sponsor and come back for the imperfect action round.

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We are back with the imperfect action round. Terry, are you ready to take imperfect action?

I'm not sure what that Means, but let's see what happens.

I'm sure you've done it just once or twice in your business.

Oh, I'm sure.

I've got three rapid fire questions. 60 second answers. And the first one is what is the fastest path to the cash?

The fastest path to. I don't know that there is a fast path to cash. It's hard work and perseverance is what I think I would say.

Number two, what is the biggest problem you see your prospects making the fastest way they can fix it?

The biggest problem I see my prospects making. You mean people that are like potential customers?

Yes.

Okay. The biggest mistake I see them making is not doing their own due diligence and making sure that the investment that they want to invest in is a good one and that they understand the key is understanding what you're investing in and how are they going to give me my money back with a return.

Very good advice. Number three.

What is the best way to maximize customer lifetime value?

I think is to treat your customer the way you want to be treated. And I try to do that. You know, I try to get that across to my employees. I say, think about a company that you had a good experience with, that you enjoy dealing with and then treat people the same way that person treated you. I just made a call yesterday. Can I mention names of other companies.

At&T DirecTV? And it was the most unpleasant experience I have had on the phone in months. And so I would use that as an example. Don't treat people that way. But you know, it's kind of like the golden rule, actually. It's the golden rule, but with a little twist. Treat people better than you want to be treated.

I like that. And that's the thing, is there's so many companies out there that you can put anything you want in the marketing and you know, the whole 5G thing. I was just talking to my, my company I've been with for 13, 14, 15 years, Verizon, and I go, what's the spectrum? I was asking them different things because so many companies are going, oh, we have five ge and it's just branding. It's not technically anything different.

Yeah, you know, it's kind of like with 4K TVs, I mean, you can get a 4K TV, but most things aren't, aren't broadcast in 4K.

Exactly.

What good does it do you?

You know, I'm happy you brought that up specifically because guess what? This is recorded in, in 4K.

You look beautiful on the screen. You know, I'm telling you, it looks great. So.

Well, I appreciate that. I have it streaming in 1080 and that's Facebook and YouTube's own doing. But I wanted it again that future focus, three, four or five years from now, you'll be able to share this and it will be right on par.

Awesome. That's great.

Speaking of future focused books are a great way to foreshadow and have a vision for the future. What are some books you could recommend to Expert Authority World?

And you know what? I am not a huge reader because I don't. I don't. What about audiobooks? Audiobooks? I listen to a lot of podcasts, you know, so nothing wrong with that. I get them. I love to understand and know what other people do to make a living. So one of my favorite podcasts is How I Built this. It's a NPR podcast. I listen to that a lot. There's another one called Growth Everywhere that I listen to. That's really good. And for me it's. And a lot of people may not be interested in that, but I just am fascinated by the way people build a business. And that was what my podcast was, is just talking to business owners about and to try to get across to people the fact that you don't have to be a genius to have a, you know, build a nice business. You, the normal, average everyday person that is willing to work hard and has a good idea can build their own business.

There's at least one book you got to recommend.

You know, this is maybe going to sound a little corny for some people, but I think the book that I read the most is the Bible. So anybody who's of that mindset, I think that's a place with some great advice.

I'm happy you said that. That's a great one I'd recommend also. It's not corny at all.

And we just, you never know in today's world if that's going to be how that's going to be accepted. So I guess that's why I said that that's.

That's not our personal problem, that's theirs.

True. Exactly.

I have to modify what I said and not the last comment at all. There's two books you have to recommend.

One of them is yours.

Well, that's true. I don't, you know, that. I guess it's a good book. I don't know. It's. My book is strictly about what we've been talking about, self directed IRAs. And I'm sorry that I'm so. It took me so long to figure out, you had to actually prompt me for that. But yeah, my book is called if All I have is a Hammer. And the idea behind that was that people don't know that they can use their IRA to invest in these other things. So if you think all you have is a hammer, then you're looking for nails. But a self directed IRA is another tool that you can use to invest in other things. So people, people can get that book. I think they can download it on our website@sunwesttrust.com or if you go to our website, you can order it and we'll send you a hard copy of the book for free. So anybody who's interested in that, feel free to reach out to us and we'll get that to you.

Excellent. And you don't need to apologize for that. Like I said earlier, there's so many people that may not be qualified and they're going, look at me, I'm the greatest. And then there's, I found a lot more people.

It's just very impressive what you've done and you're like, who me? Yeah, you. So I believe there's a happy medium because it's, it's a, it's a thin line. Like you need to promote your business and what you do, but you know, you always want to be humble about it, so no apologies needed. I'm glad you did mention it. I was going to mention it either way and it was an easy segue into where would you like people to learn more about you?

Well, so the best thing to do if they're interested in self directed IRAs is go to sunwest trust.com There are some links to my videos there. You could go to YouTube and our channel is called Sunwest IRA. We have I think 240 videos. The majority of them you have to look at me and I'm the one that's talking. But some of them, my son is in and he's much more attractive than I am, so. But they're all just short three to five minutes, so you're not going to waste a lot of time. You listen to it. Hopefully the description is, you know, that the title is descriptive enough that it's something you can tell if you want to listen to it or not. But even if it's not, you're only going to waste a few minutes and then you can go to the next one.

So I would argue that they're making a good investment into the future because they are knowledge. Applied knowledge is power.

Yeah, no, I agree. I guess what I meant by that is if, you know, you may not want to listen to one about investing in a private company if you're looking to invest in real estate or something like that. But, but that's why we kept them short, because I just don't think, you know, it depends on what you're listening to if you want to invest 20 or 30 or 45 minutes or something. But these are short and they get the point across. And the more you, you know, the more you can educate yourself, the better off you're going to be.

Excellent. Well, it's been an absolute pleasure and I appreciate you for sharing with Expert Authority World.

Thank you.

All right, Expert Authority World, we have another great episode here today. I will see you tomorrow. Have a great day and God bless.

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