0204: The Sweet Side of Gifting: [Part I] with Trevor Martin

EA interviews episode 204 inspiration, transformation, success stories and the imperfect action round. Seven days a week, join Mario Ficcini for today's Expert Authority Effect interview. The Sweet side of Gifting I don't know what you're doing with your prospects and clients, but do you have a gifting program? Do you have a customer satisfaction program? If you don't, you should. And that's why I'm excited to have the owner and founder of Noms Bakery, Trevor Martin here today. We're going to be talking about the sweet side of gifting and how it's going to increase your profits. I'm going to bring them up right after we thank our sponsor. Every business needs a book, including yours. Visit freebusinessbookpublishingcourse.com today to learn the seven steps to publish and promote your nonfiction, lead and profit generating business book in eight weeks. Once again, that's free businessbook publishingcourse.com Here he is, ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Trevor Martin. Trevor, how are you feeling today?

Doing well, Mario. Thanks for having me.

I am excited to learn more about the sweet side of gifting. And I want to ask you, why is it so important to have a customer loyalty program and reward those who are investing money with you?

Sure. Well, it's all about keeping with communication, right? So, you know, unfortunately a lot of companies bypass this and don't, don't do this enough. And your top clients should always know they're your top clients. Right. That's the question I always ask is do your top five clients know that they are your best clients and if they don't, why don't they? Right? So by utilizing a proper gifting program, these people know that you appreciate them and it's a lot easier to retain clients, Right? Because the old adage it's always easier to retain your clients than attract new ones. Right. It's seven times more expensive. So that's what having a proper loyalty program will do for you with the.

People that you're focusing on helping. How many of them would you say know who the top five clients are?

When I ask that question, I typically, I would say less than 30% and can rattle it off just like that. And that's a scary thing because when somebody asked me that question three or four years ago in a networking group, I had the same answer where I didn't know. And so we really kind of flipped that and used it as a marketing tool. So it's pretty surprising that really should be on the tip of any business owner's tongue. Right. Who's paying your employees paychecks right now?

What about once you know those five? How often would you say most people are following up with them to let them even know they exist?

That's a great question. I think you know the answer to that. It's very few. So we find that most of our clients are really in two camps before they come and become clients of ours. They really don't like to gift because it takes a lot of time. Right. So part of the issue that most people have is, look, I'm working in my business, I'm working on my business and I don't have time to gift. Right. I know I should be. I know all the top performer and the 1 percenters around me are gifting and they're utilizing these programs, but I just don't have the time to do it. And so what ends up happening is they end up sending the gifts at one time a year, at the end of the year, right. And they end up sending the same stuff that everybody else is. And it's not personalized. So biggest issue with that is that it gets lost in the mix. And so you spend this money, the average small business spends about $1500, sends to about 20 or 25 recipients. And that money is really going down the drain because it's getting lost in the mix with everybody else's gifts.

What are some examples of bad gifts you shouldn't send? And let's keep it under 10 because I, I've got a few dozen in my head again. And if anyone needs a pen.

Yeah. So, you know, we, we all joke around here. It's. We, we typically, instead of, you know, framing it, of all the different bad gifts, I'd like to frame it with what you should be doing, right? And so you want to, you don't want to ship anything that's going to offend people, right. So shipping booze or wine, any type of alcohol can be a risky proposition, especially if they're sober or they don't drink.

I don't know, it depends who you're sending it to. You might just make some new best friends there, depending on which one it is.

Hey, and I didn't say this. Me personally, I love getting a good bottle of bourbon, right. And if you know your client, I think that's the point, Right. If you know your client and you know they're a bourbon drinker, there probably isn't a better gift to send them out there than a really great bottle of bourbon.

However, which one would it be for.

You.

Man, my Buddy just got me on to Angels Envy. If we're, if we're going to go on the lower end. But Blanton's, I mean, I typically default to Blanton's, usually.

So you would like that. But you're saying if you accidentally send it to someone who's been sober for 25 years, this may not be a good thing.

Right. So the main issue is sending gifts without knowing enough about your client. Right. And if you're doing one on one prospecting or client appreciation or you really know your clients, I think that it's easy to do to know your clients. But, you know, when you're sending out 25 or 50 or 100 gifts to your top clients, you really want to make sure that base and that foundation is something that's going to go over well with everybody. And that's why confectioneries are such a popular item, is because even if they're a health nut, they don't necessarily eat them. It's easy to give away and to pass out to other people. But that's one of the reasons we started the company.

They also. I've seen some people that are completely healthy. Completely. And they're like, oh, my gosh, that's a.

Cheesecake, brownie cookie, whatever the case is. Carrot cake, just pick something. It's like.

I'm a little bit Italian.

So cannolis are freaking delicious. And I'm thinking of someone, they're like, how many are in there? I'm like, well, how many you gonna take? And it's like, you know, they'll enjoy it, especially if it's around the holiday season or something, or if it's out of the ordinary. I mean, if you're hitting up the local ice cream shop every day, hey, no shame in that. But if that's not you. I still see people partake on occasion if it's out of the norm. And I'm just willing to bet when you're sending gifts to them, you're probably not going to email them right away. Like, it's kind of fun to surprise people, right?

Absolutely. And on your point, my wife, who does our marketing here, is actually a bikini competitor. So you can see the dichotomy there where she's, you know, getting up on stage and lifting weights and preparing for this show. But she works in a factory where we have, you know, 100,000 cookies in the freezer behind us. Right. So it really just. Even, even if they are health and fitness focused, you know, everyone usually enjoys a good cookie.

Yeah, that's awesome. And that reminds me of early on when I started my business and was learning marketing. And you know, I remember hearing from a co worker at time.

Probably one of the most profound pieces of advice and it was, you know, if you're trying to sell a burger to a vegetarian, it's probably not going to work. So sell them the vegetables. And it's like you can sell the stuff and still help just because you don't like it. I'd say this is the, probably the biggest thing that most people get wrong in business. And it's, they're like, well, I don't like doing it that way. Okay, well that's like someone saying I don't like cell phones or I don't like this. Well, cool. But the other 99.999% of people on the planet you're going to appeal to, you can still have a business. It doesn't need to be a passion project or maybe it is, but it doesn't matter what it is personally for you. You can incorporate it or you can't, it's your call, but it doesn't mean there's not a market for it.

And before we got into this, we assumed that the only market for doing these business to business gifts was going to be client appreciation. And what we found was there was really a huge resurgence in direct mail, especially when people were using them. Using direct mail for prospecting. And so that was kind of a big surprise. We really, I mean our business has been tripling every year and I would say a very large portion of that is due to a lot of tech companies using us for top of the funnel prospecting. And the reason they're using baked goods. And we're not the only company doing this. Right? The reason that they're using baked goods or other baked goods companies is because it works and it has a very large appeal.

I gotta ask you, how did you get into it? Because you've said you've alluded to some things earlier and I, you know, when you were at that networking event, you didn't have this company, did you? At that point?

It just started it. In fact. The reason, so I'm not, not a big networker. This is not something I like to do in my spare time is go talk to people and go network with people. And I've kind of grown to enjoy it. But the reason that I, I started was because we had just started this business and my background is more in the operations and, and scaling things and not necessarily in the sales. And so I Said, okay, we've got this bakery, we've just invested in this equipment, we've just started this business and we know our product is good. But outside of doing farmers markets and outside of selling to friends and families and just having organic growth, I didn't know how to do anything with sales. And that was really my main reason behind joining networking group initially.

And it's smart that you did because myself included every business in the world. If you can't do the sales and marketing, no one's going to know about the product and story.

I wish you were here to tell me that about three or four years ago because I probably would have started with sales and marketing as opposed to building a fantastic operations side first because with that comes an immense amount of overhead.

Tell me about that. You can get as specific or keep it as private as you want, but I want to know what were you doing prior to this and how did you bridge the gap to go, I want to have 100,000 cookies in this whole, this whole operation. I mean you didn't just say I want to offer someone and I really don't want, I'll use websites because it's something I started with, but it wasn't something you could do on your own pretty easily. For what it sounds like you started a whole operation. Why didn't you just go with something you could have done easily on your own, controlled it and kept costs down?

Yeah, I'm a bit of a masochist, so anyone that knows me knows that I like to do things the hard way. So my background's in finance and graduated ASU and went out and did real estate investing. So bought my first house at 18. Didn't go well. That's a story for another time. I bought it probably at the very worst month you could have in 2006, but that ended up transpiring into a real estate investment company in a real estate analysis company. And that was the only area where I felt like I really succeeded. And the fun part about that, my real takeaway was that I really enjoyed finding a problem and then figuring out how to scale that. Right. Especially from an operation side. So fast forward to five years, I met me, my lovely wife, I'm trying to impress my in laws and my dad who is a retired computer programmer says hey, you know, I, I, I like baking, I like making these gift baskets for the neighborhood. And so he's been doing this for the past few years and I'm like, I really want to impress my, my future in laws. Can you make them A gift basket. Now, they're big entrepreneurs here in the valley, they have thousands of employees. And when they got a hold of this gift basket with these baked goods, they. I'll never forget the look she gave me. She goes, you got to start selling these. I don't care if they're in our call centers or online or in farmers markets, you have to start selling that. And that really coincided with the end of the year. Like I said, they're executives and they get a ton of gift baskets. Right. A lot of these go unopened. And so we really found that there was a niche and a void to be filled where we're like, okay, we need to provide good product because a lot of this was freeze dried fruit and nuts. You know, 80% of the stuff looked like it was coming from the same factory. So we said, we gotta have a good product and we have to have some personalization because the only gifts that they really cared about were the ones that were special or personalized to them. And so that was really the inception start of Knob's base shop.

That's pretty inspiring, I gotta be honest. That's pretty inspiring because I don't know if I would have, you know, I'd like to think I'm very courageous and I'll do anything, but it's a big jump, especially if you weren't in the space before. And I was going to make a joke and go, oh, real estate, that's real. That's. That lines right up with, you know, confectionery. But the reality is you had all that, you know, how long you said, I'm just guessing, 10 or 12 years of real estate all combined.

Combined, yeah. Right, right. I would say right at that. Right in the 8 to 10 year mark. And so that was a big decision to end up leaving real estate because when you, you have all that accumulated knowledge, you know, I had a couple of deals that didn't go the way that I wanted to, and the people in the industry itself, I decided to start distancing myself. But it was a big decision because when you've got that much time and that much energy, you don't want to.

Just give it up right away. But what I'm hearing, joking aside, is I know there's people that have reached out to me. I want to be on your show, I want to do this, you know, we should partner this and that. And I'm like, I don't even know you. You didn't even say hi yet. And you wanted me to give you 10, 1520 years of what it took for me to build up these relationships. You had that, though, with your own, you know, you already had people that you knew you could market to your new, your new business and product. And it lines up ideally with it.

Yeah, surprisingly well. Right. So one of the verticals that we, you know, go after is real estate, realtors and mortgage, because that business is, is about relationship building and maintaining relationships. Right. So like any business, they have to prospect and do client appreciation gifts, but it's so important because such a high percentage of their business is based on referrals. And so that's really where we got our start, is in the real estate and the mortgage industry. But that also led us to another interesting problem that we didn't know we were going to face. When you're starting out in any business and you're new, you know, you try to figure out, okay, well, who's our target demographic? And it's tough because, well, everybody eats cookies, right. And so we started going after everybody, which, anybody that knows business.

You got to narrow that scope a little bit. And the problem we were having was some of our best clients were accountants and photographers along with real estate and tech companies. And so we're like, this is all over the map. And the one commonality we seem to find between all of those customers is that they were in the top 1% of their field. They understood the power of gifting and staying top of mind and staying in communication not only with prospects, but people that they were trying to re engage and then people that they were thanking for new deals. And so it was these 1% people at the top of their industry that were just amazing at what they did. They had a gifting program in place. And that really, that's when it began to make sense to us. Okay, let's go after the people at the top of their industry.

That's smart. That's smart because so many industries can use it. But should you go after them? I mean, and I was gonna say, yeah, everyone eats cookies and everyone, like maybe not everyone. If some fact checkers out there, okay, 99.9999. Like, majority, most people eat cookies, but the deal is how many people appreciate it. Like if you send free gift baskets to 100 different people, cool. But from a business standpoint, how many of them will appreciate it? Instead of just going, I'm a taker, and just eat it, they'll enjoy it. But then what other percentage will actually convert to, these are delicious. I want to re up and tell other people about it.

Yeah. Don't get me wrong, there's always going to be those people that are, whether you're prospecting or saying thank you, where they don't appreciate it, or they'll just take the cookies and blow you off. But for the most part, what we found is that step one is actually taking the right step to send something to initiate what depends on where they're at in the funnel and where it makes sense. But after you actually send them a package, that's really powerful. The law of reciprocity. If you can imagine, when you get a box of cookies or anything on your doorstep, even if it's a package, pair of socks, right? And it's like, wow, this person spent money on me. Right? That's the. The first thought, this person. I was important enough to receive something. And then when you take it that next step further. And the gift was personalized, whether it was based on your tastes or whether the. The box itself has your name on it or your logo or a picture of you and your family. Now, obviously, that depends on how well you know the person. But then that really goes to show that, okay, this person not only took, you know, spent the money on me, but they took the time to personalize this. So it's. You almost always get a call back, you know, if you're sending it as a thank you gift and if you're sending it to try to book a meeting, people have very high success rates doing this.

Yeah, I can imagine some people going, make sure. Looking forward to the meeting. Make sure there's some more of these, Right?

Yeah, exactly.

Send us another box and we'll book a meeting.

So let me ask you about some of the biggest success stories you've had from people using your product. Who's the biggest one that comes to mind?

So it's interesting because I was just thinking about this story. This story happened about four years ago. 3. Four years ago, when I joined that networking group. And I was the new guy there. And there was one guy that befriended me. Shout out to Joe Pascal. He's a realtor in Arizona. And you know, when you're in a networking group, a lot of people are talking, right? Nobody's really listening. And he came up and he said, hey, you know, what do you do? And hey, well, I make cookies. Right? That was. That was my sales pitch at the time. And he goes, okay, cool. Well, he goes, look, I like you. I don't know what I'm gonna use these for, but I'm gonna buy some. And so two weeks later, I See him, and he doesn't even talk to me. He gets up in front of the group and he shares this, and he goes, you're not going to believe this. I was in an open house. I had some of Trevor's cookies, and this couple was walking around as a mother, father, and a child. And I was at an open house. I was trying to engage with them. They were kind of brushing me off, you know, And I'm getting a picture. Like when you go to a car, a car lot, and all the car salesmen try to swarm you, and you're just like, get back. You know, that's. That's the impression he was giving me as I'm trying to engage with them. And he goes, they're walking out the door. And I said, hey, before you guys go, can I. I've got these cookies here. Can I give your son one of these cookies? And they said, sure, why not? And he goes, that was enough. That was enough to open up the conversation. He goes, 15 minutes later, I find out they've got three houses they're working on listing. And he goes, six. And, and. And fast forward six weeks. He ended up making $49,000 in commission from that one cookie. So it's really cool story as far as, you know, just opening up that dialogue and the lines of, you know, communication.

Yeah, that's fantastic. Congrats to him and you.

Thank you. Thank you very much. Yeah, it was a really, really cool story.

So I just got to ask this. In that batch of cookies, what was the secret ingredient to make that happen?

You know what? I. Now I gotta call him and ask that. But his favorites, the berry shortbread. So we've got a. We've got a very shortbread cookie. And I. Growing up, I always didn't like shortbread because they were like the Lorna Dunes. They were always really hard until my dad started making these. Right. These are majority are my dad's recipes, and he makes a really soft shortbread. And the secret ingredient in that specific shortbread is almond extract. Right. And so bite it. It's this. It's the shortbread. And it's got this amazing almond flavor, flavor that runs through, and it's got some berry jam in the middle, so.

Oh, shoot. That sounds good.

Well, yeah, hopefully you got some wheat outside your door.

Looking forward to it. I. Okay, show's over. I'm gonna go eat now.

So with all the people you've been able to help, is there any new markets you're breaking into? Are you still strictly focused on real Estate. I mean, who is your ideal prospect your looking for that should reach out to you.

You know what, One of the really, one of the really neat areas we're getting into is video, right?

Oh really?

And I know. Yeah, right.

Tell me more about this.

And this is going to be no surprise to you, but video is very powerful and it's even more so than just getting, you know, a box of cookies. So one of the things we're actually looking at is, okay, how do you incorporate either a video within the gift message where they can scan a QR code. And so not only can somebody write you a gift message, but if you're sending to, you know, your, your nieces or nephews or grandchildren or whether it's a business partner, right. Whether you're sending it to a prospect and in the gift note you say, hey, enjoy these cookies. You know, feel free to, you know, scan this QR code. I made a quick message for you that buys you a little bit of extra time through, through video to communicate an additional message. So we're playing around with that and we're playing around with actually incorporating video screens within the boxes, which again, very powerful. The nice thing about that is, you know, you have that person's attention for the entire length of the video, right. So even if that video is two, two and a half minutes, if somebody sends you a box, it's got cookies and it's got a video, you're going to watch that video once. So a couple of new projects we're.

Working on right now that is very smart and you're going to see huge success with it. I will tell you stuff that in the past you can get cheap Amazon Fire tablets, just anything with a screen, preload it with a video or use a Perl personal URL link and send them to a secret or hidden unlisted YouTube page or even better yet, have a custom page on your website. Website where you could embed the video and it takes them right to it with all the message. And you can track it with the copy, you can track the copy with the tracking pixels to see who's opening it, who's watching it. Check the watch times.

It sounds like I need to set you up with my CTO and we need to get a meeting going there.

There. There's some cool things that have been around in direct mail you could easily incorporate, especially if you have the other. I mean you already have. Have the other side of the house done.

Yeah, yeah, we're really looking forward to it. So I think there's A lot of huge potential with video, especially with trade shows. Right. So a lot of these mid and large size companies, they've got a budget set aside every year for conferences and marketing. Right. Well, they're not getting to spend that. And what better way to interact?

Buy iPads for everyone and preload them.

Exactly right. Yeah.

That's what people I'm thinking about.

I'm going to say the year because this is evergreen. I'm not going to say that how many years ago it was. But back around 2010, 11 and 12.

I was having private conversations with other marketers about this stuff. And the biggest thing, and it's great when you're listening to this, screens have dropped in price and they're probably going to continue to. That was the only obstacle. But they were literally. One of them was a dental and chiropractic client and what they were doing was they were literally buying iPads because it was the only thing at the time. And they were, it was worth it to them because the average sale was worth 2 to 5 to 10 grand. They're like, what's 3, 4, 500 bucks? But if you need to do 10,000 of these, well, okay, you better have the budget. But the bit, the biggest thing was the screen. Once you get it across the screen, all you got to do is preload the video. Video with something or put it on a microchip or you know, hardwired in there. Amazon Fire tablets drop down to the 40 or 50. But once you get past the screen thing, you can incorporate it in the boxes and just redirect them to any, you know, vimeo. Wistia would give you the tracking stats of private. There's a lot of, you're on the right track with it and you're going to be able to pull this off very, very successfully because I've seen and done some myself without the cookie side of it and without the other stuff.

Thank you. Yeah, we're, and you know, we're really not reinventing the wheel here because there are other companies that do this. However, the issue with this is it's really not open to small and medium sized businesses because there's usually a 10 or 15 or $20,000 minimum investment, right?

Oh yeah, there's a high buy in just because of the cost of everything.

Right. And so one of the things we're looking at doing is okay, how we do we get this in the, in the $75, $100 range? Not only that, how do we turn this around in 24 hours? One of the Biggest value propositions that our company has is that we can get custom boxes. You know, no minimums. If you order 100 boxes, every single box can have a unique design and we can get it out the next day. And there's not a lot of companies that can do that. Now if we can do that with video, which is the plan, that now opens it up to a whole other gambit of not only use cases, but smaller businesses as well.

Okay. I know I need to continue the show, but you got my wheel spinning, and this is legit exciting. And I'm very excited for you because I know exactly where it's going to go.

Thank you very much.

I know you've been successful already, but you're definitely on the right track, so we hope so. I think it's time for the Wheel of Whatever. I think it's time for the Wheel of Whatever.

Awesome.

All right.

If you could.

Have anyone as a spokesperson for your company, who would it be and why? Oh, wait, stop. There we go.

Wow, that is a great question.

Yes. Brand new one. Never asked before, too. That thing's magical. It always tells me what I need to know right when I need to. To know it.

Let me see.

You know what I would say?

I would say somebody that had. Because the majority of our business is B2B. Right. And a lot of people. My one. One of my idols is. Is Warren Buffett. Right. And so I believe that if. If we could get him up there in Omaha during that Berkshire Hathaway meeting holding a box of one of these things, I think that's. That's. That's game over. So I would love to have Warren Buffett as a spokesperson. I know he's not the most lively. I know he's well into his 80s, but I think that'd be huge for our company.

Well, you have the perfect gift option to send to him with that video screen you were just talking about.

There we go. Right? Exactly.

It's possible. It's. I believe it's possible.

That's awesome. I. Look, Warren, too. I thought you were gonna say Virgin Atlantic. Richard Branson.

You know what, man? That's.

He's cool, too.

Branson as well. He's. He's very cool and he's super. Because I was thinking about. I'm like, do I want someone more eccentric? And we're actually. I'm not a big cruise person, but my in laws are in the cruise industry. And one of the things they got us for Chelsea, My wife and I share a birthday. It's two days Apart. So they get us these joined birthday presents and they got us the inaugural sailing on this Virgin cruise. And supposedly Richard Branson is going to be there, so hopefully get to meet him. But of all the videos that I've seen of him, he would be a very close second.

Nice. Excellent. Sounds like fun.

Yeah. Yeah, we'll see, right? I mean, this, this whole Covid thing, which, that's a whole other other avenue when you're talking about direct mail and gifting. You know, we could talk about that for another hour, but what that's done to the cruise industry has been incredible.

Well, I appreciate you for sharing this. We're going to thank our sponsor and come back for the imperfect action round. You've heard me say every business needs a book, including yours. And it's true. And that's why you should visit freebusinessbookpublishingcourse.com today to learn the seven steps to publish and promote your nonfiction lead and profit generating business book in eight weeks. But you know what, don't take my word for it. Take it from a few of my authors like Lori, I went from having an idea and a possibility to actually.

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I've worked with Mario over the phone and online and he's been very helpful in getting me where I needed to go with promoting my books. Rocio, there's no way in the world I would have been able to do this with somebody else again. I've attempted it in the past. It didn't serve me. As a matter of fact, I ended up more frustrated than anything. So this has been a very seamless process. Adele, if you're looking for an amazing business coach, I highly recommend Mario Ficini or Bill Benner. I can, I can't make a higher.

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Hey, their words, not mine. Visit freebusinessbookpublishingcourse.com to get started now. And I look forward to hearing your transformation as the next video success story. Once again, that's freebusinessbookpublishingcourse.com and we are back with the imperfect action round. Trevor, are you ready to take imperfect action?

As ready as I'm going to be. Let's do it.

All right, Rapid fire answers. The first question is, oh, I Need a drum. I so should get a drum.

I so need a drum. Note to self.

First question is, what is the fastest path to the profits?

Fastest path to the profits. What gets measured, gets managed. Right. And so I would say, oh.

Should I go into.

No, go for it. You're in a. I love this. Go.

Okay, so that's a great answer with anything. You know, prospecting is no different. So we have people that will just send out gifts rapid fire, top of the funnel, and they don't measure anything. The fastest way to the profits, especially through using gifting, is coming up with a strategy using a sending platform if you have the money, and managing the spend and calculating the roi.

Solid gold right there. Number two, what's the biggest problem you see your prospects making and the fastest way for them to fix it?

Not starting. Right. So as we alluded to earlier, people, there are so many people that don't gift, and when they do, it's at the end of the year with everybody. So the one piece of advice I'd have for them is start now, give us a call and send something personalized because that's what's really going to make an impression.

Excellent. Number three, what is the best way to maximize customer lifetime value? Ooh.

Man, everyone loves this one. This question will never leave the show.

Maximize customer lifetime value. I would say staying in touch with them. Right.

And anybody in the referral industry, business is going to agree with me where, you know, just because you have a client, you need to nurture that client. So you need to be in, in real estate, they even have a term for this. It's called Popeyes. Right. So whether you, you separate your clients into abcd and the, the ones that give you the most referrals are higher up and you end up sending gifts or visiting or calling these people more frequently because it's important to stay top of mind with these people that are continuously helping you out and creating lifetime value.

Excellent. All right, what are some books that have made a big difference in your life?

You know, on the topic of Warren Buffett.

He has a biography called Snowball that I probably read this 10 years ago and it still sticks with me, hearing about all of his trials, tribulations, and growing a family, getting into the business. And so that was really interesting to see how he was able to juggle it all and where he succeeded and where he failed.

Excellent. Well, I have appreciated you for sharing. Where would you like people to learn more?

Go to getnams.com or feel free to email me directly. Trevoritnams Excellent.

Well, Trevor, it's been a pleasure. Thank you for sharing again.

Thank you for having me, Mario. Appreciate it.

All right, Expert Authority World. We have another great episode here today. I'll see you tomorrow. Have a great day and God bless. You're already the expert, but have you transformed your expertise into a tangible asset that will generate and qualify leads while increasing profit for you 24? 7? And if so, how well are you promoting it? With the Expert Authority Effect publishing method, it's easier and faster than ever. Visit freebusinessbookpublishingcourse.com today to learn the seven steps to publish and promote your nonfiction, lead and profit generating business book in eight weeks. Visit freebusinessbookpublishingcourse.com to get started now. Once again, that's free businessbook publishingcourse.com hey, thanks for listening to today's episode. I hope you got a lot out of it. I know I sure did. If you haven't done so already, I invite you to subscribe to the show and also be sure to check out eainterviews.com for complete show notes, the full interview, video experience, links to the resources we mentioned, and more. Have a blessed day and I'll see you tomorrow.