Tips to Build a Portfolio That Delivers Financial Freedom

Okay. I think we are live for another Boostly podcast. So if you are tuning in either on the podcast or on the live, we are going in multiple places at the moment, so welcome along. And this is the Boostly podcast. So this is the podcast that gives you the tools, the tactics, the trainings and most importantly, the confidence to go out there and get yourself some more direct bookings for your hospitality business to Today we've got a host with us today, so we're diving behind the host of another interesting and inspiring host to see what we can learn from their journey and see if there's things that you can implement in your business that they're doing in their business. As with hospitality, it's one of the few industries where we really like to share and really we can learn so much from each other. So today we're going behind the host with Michael Chang from Trust bnb. Michael is a former investment banker and he loves to share his social journey online to help others really how, how they can understand how to do short term rental and a path to long term wealth. So I'm really excited today to dive into your business. Welcome along, Michael.

Liam, thanks so much for having me this morning.

Thank you for, for joining. So let's dive in with, with the question we always start with, which is do you mind introducing yourself? Tell us a bit about where you host and what kind of model you use.

Absolutely. So again, Michael Chang from TrustPNB, she started this business with my wife in we really started in 2016 as a side hustle while we both were working full time. And you know, we formally incorporated a business about five years ago and we've grown it now to 26 units in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, in the US and in Tennessee by a, the most, the most popular national park in the US actually called the Smoky Mountains national park in Tennessee. So we do a mixture of rental arbitrage where we, where we rent the apartments and rent them on Airbnb, direct bookings on the other platforms and we also own property and all our own properties are in Tennessee.

Nice. Nice. There's a few hosts I know who have got properties up in the Smokies. I know that is so, so popular. So, and to have 26 is amazing. So take me back before you start Trust bnb. What, what did you do? I mean, you mentioned you were an investment banker, but how did you get started in hospitality and why?

That's a great question. I, I fell backwards into it to be candid. I, you know, had spent a career on Wall Street. I was An M and a banker at Citigroup here in New York, working on big transactions with big companies. And it was, it was a great experience. But I always had an entrepreneurial bent, always wanted to build my own business. And I give credit to my wife. She is from a luxury goods background. Her career was at Tiffany's and it was much more, you know, she loved real estate. So we always thought about how we could grow a business for ourselves, grow a portfolio for ourselves. And we found Airbnb. And after we started, we just saw the returns and then it was like, okay, well this is, could be a real business that can replace our jobs eventually. And you know, know, we just took that path, just one unit after another after another after another. You know, for us the emphasis is always on quality, the quality of the listing, how much money it can make, not just getting listings for the sake of increasing revenue. So you know, we've done it, we've done it in a very kind of purposeful way so that we could get cash flow to support our, support our business for our lifestyle and also, and then eventually take that, take those profits and buy property that our goal is always to accumulate, acquire as many properties as possible. We believe that's the true path to long term sustainable wealth creation.

That's, that's the path which we see time and time again that if you can build assets and cash flow from those assets, then it seems the, the best way, doesn't it, to get the long term wealth. And if you can use high cash flowing strategies like rental arbitrage in, you know, to get you started or to, to really build up that cash pot to buy, then, then that's amazing. You mentioned there that you make a place higher qual. Have you got any examples of the type of thing that you do to make them sort of higher quality?

Well, the way that we, from my perspective, what we do is we make sure we find the right product, right? So the right location, the right layout, the right building, for example, in Philadelphia. So to make sure that you know, the building has the right amenities, right? Has, you know, nice gym, has parking, one has a swimming pool, for example. And then once they get inside the apartment, then you're just making sure that king beds in all rooms, for example, really strong Internet. You know, there's a wow factor, there's a design factor within the property so that when people see it first, when they see it online, they see the pictures like, wow, this is a very nice place, I'd like to stay here. And then when they get there you know, it's a, it's a nice experience for them. So that's what we mean by quality. You know, the location, the product and then once you're inside, you know, the guest experience, the design. Those together create a product for us that, you know, we can, we can achieve that 85% occupancy on air DNA, for example. And although you know, other is more competition generally the more the competition is centered around the middle of the curve, you know, as you go up the quality, if you can maintain that level of quality, you know, I think for us you'll be protected against volatility in your market. So that's the best way to protect yourself is have a great product and people will book. For example, you know, if you're, if you're in a market that's consistent travel demand, people are still going to go to Philadelphia. Whether times are good, times are slow. If you have the right product or the Smokies, for example, if you have the right product, people will come, people will book, your people will book with you, people come back.

I like that because it's something that we see time and time again that the hosts that do the best are the ones who don't just think of a guest as a number, as a, as a sort of dollar sign or whatever to come in that it's really the end experience. And you've mentioned there by having higher quality stay a better experience for your guest where things like gyms are on access or high quality Internet, it just makes such a big difference to then the reviews and then you get more people. So the demand is just generally higher. And time and time again when we speak to hosts on behind the Host, it is the hosts which are focusing more on their guests experience that just tend to do better than the ones who are just getting more and more units just for the sake of having more and more units. It is about that end guest experience at the end of the day, which is cool. So you mentioned that yourself and your wife started the business. Are you both in the business full time and if so, what does your day to day sort of roles look like? And yeah, we'll go from there.

Yeah. So we've been, we've been lucky enough or been fortunate enough that the business supports both of us quitting our jobs. We have a very young daughter as well, she's just turned 1 years old. So the ability to, to be at home, to you know, to have that location freedom, that time freedom has been, has been truly a blessing. And the way that we I mean now after a few years we've built the systems, we have a, we have a four person VA team for example that just focuses on operations. So the business generally runs itself operationally at least. It's probably five hours a week of work, of actual work that we have to do. So I'm very focused on growing the business and you know, and the financials. And Liz focuses more on the guest experience, making sure everything's okay and she also works on property acquisition as well. So we're really focused on growth in the business, you know, and I think that that point there is important. I want to emphasize is once you've built a, you know, 15, you know, 10, 20 unit portfolio, you're able to build the team that can operate that business for you all the day to day. Dealing with the guests, the vendors, you know, the cleaners, maintenance. All that can be done without, you know, all that can be and can at least should be done if you're operating a proper business because you should always be focused on working on the business and you know, less so in the business when you can. That, that's been, that's been our operating philosophy. Like Jeff Bezos from Amazon, I think put it the best where he said the business should operate without me. If I'm not there, it should operate just the same. If I'm needed, then something's actually wrong because then I haven't done my job to empower, put the right people in there, put the right processes, right processes in place so that the business can operate independently.

If, if you're struggling on how to get direct bookings and overwhelmed on where to start, then I recommend you go and book in a call with Boostly and our team right now. We can walk you through exactly what we're offering, how we can help you and give you a portfolio of websites that we have worked with that are matching not only your niche but could be in your location as well. Boostly has helped over 2000 hospitality businesses all over the world increase their direct bookings. And if you are interested then all you need to do is get is go to Boostly. B o o s t-l y.co.uk call and book in an appointment with one of our sales team.

I think that's definitely true as you grow especially I think I know from the early days I was so, I mean most people are doing everything, aren't they in their business when they first get started. But it's important to plan long term as hey, if somebody else was doing these different things Then what would this task look like? Can I write down this, you know, sop the stand operating practice, you know, how can you get that information to the people you need to get that to so you can free up your time to do like what you've just said, which is go out there and find more opportunities at the end of the day.

Exactly. And like technology makes it so much easier now. You know, you don't have to write it down anymore. You just pop on loom and hit record and do what you need to do. Hit save and write it down, put it in a folder and that's it. And you never have to deal with that ever again. Because if anyone ever asks you just refer them to the, refer them to that folder. They can watch and, you know, 90% they can figure it out.

So I want to. And just to underline that one, that loom. For anyone listening to this, if you haven't ever gone on to Loom and recorded a video. I remember and that sticks with me. I mean I found it a few years ago and I was still, I think, why is this, you know, why is this free? Why is this so easy to do? You know, is literally, you've got no excuse not to be able to record what you're doing in your business day to day. It just takes seconds to do. And it makes such a difference to recording business practices, doesn't it?

Yeah. And it's free, you know, it's free. I mean, it's free for the base package. Even the pain, it's like 20amonth. It's one of the best. Yeah. Unlimited videos, a limited length. It's a great product.

So. And I've got to ask this, working with your partner. I probably couldn't work with my partner in the business. How is it day to day working with your partner? Do you, do you get home and talk about, oh, we've got this place, you know, sort of being filled with guests or this is. Or, or do you leave work for work and you, you keep it separate? Home life separate?

Yeah, I think so. You know, working with my wife, the good thing is we started it together and we both really worked in it. So we both did everything. So, you know, we really, look, it's really a partnership, right. Because we both, you know, a lot of blood, sweat and tears, especially in the beginning. So I think one that kind of puts, you know, everyone's kind of on equal footing versus one person comes in after another and then it's like, oh, well, this is mine, you know, so there's not that dynamic so much. I think it's helpful. But answer your direct question. It very much is. We think and talk about work all the time, right? It's, it's our livelihood. So we, you know, after we come into office, obviously after we leave the office, excuse me, we now have a child, so we take care of her. But when, after we put her down, you know, we sit and we'll talk about, um, you know, what, what's next, you know, what we're gonna do next day and what happened during day. And a lot of times it's just like, well, I don't know, what should we do about a certain situation and, and having to talk that out. Other disagreements? Absolutely. You know, different. We have different operating styles, we have different philosophies. But I think one thing that we both agreed on early on was, you know, we have to make a decision, right? There's no excuse to not make a decision because do you disagree or you're angry with each other, whatever it is, like. So I think we've always like, okay, well, you might disagree with me, I might disagree with you, but we need to come to an answer. And it's either you, I care about it more than you, so I'll make a decision, vice versa, and we both care about enough, then we'll, like, we'll hash it out and, but we're going to make a decision on this point. And I think that's really helped us carry forward because the hardest thing is like, you get in a fight, you stop talking, and then three days later, nothing happens. And that's just not the right way to operate a business. And I don't think we'd be where we were, where we are now if we, you know, didn't have a, a way to make decisions efficiently.

Yeah, and you make a really good point about making decisions efficiently because the quicker in any business, you make that decision and then take the action. The business only moves forward through taking the action, doesn't it? So by making a decision, rightly or wrongly, as long as you've made the decision, you've moved in a direction. If it's the wrong direction, you can quickly change course and go back the other way. Just by making a decision is, is just so important.

So, and I think just, just to double click on that point, because I think it's important, is most decisions aren't binary and they aren't irreversible. So you could be kind of wrong and then like, figure it out and fix it later and kind of be in the right place. But if you never do anything, just kind of stay there. So even if you're. Can be a little. If you're kind of wrong, it's okay to move forward. And you just, you know, you see what happens. Like, okay, well, this is wrong. Let's do it this way. Okay, let's. Okay, great, I'm glad we did that. And a week later you've solved it, or a few days later you solved it, versus, like five days later, I go, well, I don't know, like, who's right? Well, you don't know, let's figure it out. So you just saved yourself that time. And those decisions really compound, too.

I love the.

And those indecisions really compound. Excuse me.

Definitely. Yeah, indecisions cost, you know, cost so much time, doesn't it? But I love the word. You said they're not so binary. Binary, are they? It's not a case of. We get asked all the time, like, which PMS should I go for? Or is this the right PMS for me? And there's never a yes it is or no, it isn't. It's always, to what degree does making this decision move the business forward? And if it moves it forward, even just a little bit, a few degrees, well, you're still moving forward at the end of the day. Whereas a lot of people, I certainly am guilty of this in the past, of being one of the people who go, well, it even needs to be this or this, and it's got to be right. And that's that kind of perfectionism trying to. Trying to show through. Whereas if you're making a decision and this, you know, it moves your business a few degrees. You know, this PMS helps you do a few more things than the previous pms, or, you know, this new cleaner is better than the previous cleaner. She's, you know, she or he still isn't right for the business, but it's still better, you know, it's just moving the business forward at the end of the day. That was a really cool little tangent down to. To go on. So you mentioned some of the people on your team before. You mentioned in maintenance, who are the people who help you succeed? And what would you say to somebody who's listening to this conversation, say, hey, go and make sure these are the people you've got on your team. You know, if you're going to scale to 26 units like yourself.

Yeah, that's a great question. I mean, the way our team is now is, you know, we have the cleaners we have Handyman, we have, you know, a runner. Although runners aren't as important anymore with the advent of online apps like UberEats and Stuff, especially not as important. And then on our. On our internal side, we have the VAs who handle a lot of the guest communications, and then we have a bookkeeper. But I would say, you know, for someone who's starting or who has, you know, only a few units now, the most important person is your cleaner. And treat that person with respect. Treat that person as a partner. I think a lot of times people feel their vendor, they are the absolute. They're the absolute most important person in your business. They see your properties every day, they turn it for the next guest, they tell you what's wrong, they tell you there's damage so you can go get reimbursed. That person is extremely important to you. So pay your cleaners well, pay them on time, be very kind to them, because without them, your success is really built on their hard physical work. So I, and I, you know, I get this question a lot, and that's always my answer because we've been lucky. We've had the same cleaners with us in Philadelphia, at least since we. Ever since we started as a young couple. We met in 2019 in a coffee shop, and they've been able to grow their business with us and buy home, start a family, get married. So it's really nice to kind of like grow along with someone else that you have respect for. So, you know, that's a really important decision to get right early on and, you know, fire quickly. If they don't do well in the first month, you gotta get rid of them, find a new one, because it's too important?

I think it's a great answer. It is just so important. So you mentioned you've gone from 1 to 26 units, which is by no mean feat. Is there any sort of moments when you look back where you go, well, you know, there was a definitive moment between say, I know unit 8 and 10, which really made a difference to your business. Is there any steps where you could look back and you could say, hey, these were the steps which really helped me to grow to 26 units?

Yeah, I think after the first five units, you need to have a PMS system. You need to have a VA. I think, you know, we. We didn't have that until probably later on, maybe like eight or nine. And, you know, I think after you have a handful, you really need to spend the money and the time to figure those. Those things out. Because if you figured out those systems at, you know, five listings, you can grow to 50 pretty easily. So I think that is kind of, that, that is the key pivot point for, to simplify for us. It's, you know, get a right PMS system, get a VA that can help you because as the business grows, you just need more help. There's no way that you can do everything on your own. And then, and then as you grow, you'll build the processes and procedures to, to make sure that everything runs there without you. And then after you pass 50, I don't have any direct experience, but I do know a lot of people that do. You know, you just, you, you'll need to hire more expensive help as you scale past that 50, 50 unit mark. But I think for most people, you know, 25 is you can build a really good lifestyle for yourself. You know, in the US is just saying, you know, life doesn't start until $20,000 a month. So once you get there, you know, life, life becomes a little easier and better. So it's, you know, you just got to grind to, to get there.

Definitely. Definitely. And I mean, one of those things that you mentioned there was, was both the pms. So I'd love to know, which PMS do you use?

I use HostAway.

HostAway. Awesome. And we'll, we'll come back to, we'll just park that and come back. And then you mentioned VAs as well. So there's going to be people listening to this right in that moment where they've got between five and 10 units and they're thinking, well, I could do with some help. You know, I'm kind of doing everything. I haven't got time to do the guest communication. How did you hire your VA and what advice could you share with people on, on how to get started with vas?

Sure. Well, we found out there are a couple websites that you can use Upwork Fiverr Online Jobs ph. A lot of people hire from the Philippines, which is a great place to find good talent. But I think that probably the best advice and this is, you know, you can find how to do that. A lot of. There are a lot of resources online, but I think the most important thing is the fear, getting over the fear. A lot of people are afraid to pass this role to someone else because they've been doing themselves and they feel that they'd be disintermediated from their business without it. And I'll tell you that you got to get over that fear because that person that is sitting There full time, well is going to do a lot better job than you are, especially if you just train them properly, using loom, writing stuff down, having automated messages. But that person's going to do better than you because they're going to be fully dedicated to that. And then you can take your time to grow the business. That's ultimately the only way you're going to grow your business is freeing up your time in order to focus on growth. Right. If you're answering guest messages 24 hours a day, you're never going to grow the business. You're too tired, you don't have the time. So get over that fear, hire the va, grow your business, make more money.

Love it. So tech wise, the you mentioned Host.

It's true, it's, it's, it's true. It's, it is. That is one of the, that is one of the key truths in this business.

100%. 100%. And there'll be people listening to this and that's me, that is, I need to, I need to go out and do that. So I think it's a great bit of, great bit of advice. One of the pieces of tech you mentioned was Host Away and what I'd love to know is what are the top pieces of tech that you even use in your business or social media apps or what is the stuff which really helps you to run and automate your business? And I guess we can start with Hostaway. How does it help and is there anything else that you know goes alongside it that you use in your business?

Yeah, I mean Hostaway, their PMS system is the central nervous system and the brain of your, your entire operation. So getting that right is important. And we like Host Away, we've looked at others, it has a one, it's very stable, doesn't go down, doesn't break, which is really critical in this business. But it has all the features that you need. Channel manager, calendar, syncing, automated messages, a unified inbox mobile app. So we've been using the product since 2019 and it's done very, very well for us. So we're very happy with it and it integrates well with other pieces of software. So if you were to build a direct booking side, it has the widgets that you can use to incorporate, you know, it can integrate with smart home technology, et cetera. So you know, I think it's a really important. It is that along with a VA are the two key parts of your business that operation operational and you want to get right.

That's cool. And I must just jump in and just say that Hostaway is one of Boostly's partners and we have an API connection for those who have seven or more properties. We've got an API connection which really makes it easy for your website and the PMS to talk to each other. But there's such a good PMS and it's definitely one to go and check out. I know they're doing a lot of good work on webinars and things like that and we're actually, we've had them on the sort of. Mark's had them on the podcast recently. So really one to go and check out and just to just cover that one in total. Is there any other pieces of tech that you use?

Yeah, I mean we use. The other probably key piece of software that we use is Discord actually for communications within our team. So I think it's important to have a communication platform that you can use that anyone, anywhere can use and it doesn't go down. And we like, you know, Slack, Discord are both very, very good. We like Discord a little better just because some functionality, I think just think it's more modern software, but that helps us coordinate with everyone in the team internally being able to make sure we know where things are, you know, find, find messages easily, be able to find all the materials that we need to offer to business. So that, that's another. I don't, I don't think people talk about that as much. But having that nice internal communication software is really important as you, as you scale your business. We don't use, you know, Turnover, BME or any of those other kind of cleaning software. We think it's actually really important to find someone that you can work with all, you know, kind of exclusively or, or, or, or primarily. And then you just enter, you just coordinate your calendar with them separately, which is what we do and I think we've done it with, with decent results.

That's cool. And Discord is one that I haven't heard mentioned too many times. I mean the go to Is Slack or WhatsApp are the various ones. But Discord is a great shout because you can have the different threads on there and keep the messaging really tidy, which is a good one. So what would you say? Obviously you've scaled for quite a few years now up to 26 units. Has there been any challenges along the way and how did you overcome them?

Yeah, I mean, you know, we, we, we survived Covid. So that was obviously a very, or, you know, in March 2020, that was a Very tough time for everyone, at least for the, for those few months. I think what's, you know, what's made our business resilient, I would say is again just making sure that you have the right properties and the right, you know, the right products so that even when demand really collapses like that, where it's like a 90, you know, 90% of market goes away, we still were able to get it booked a little bit and you know, just be able to survive. You know, that was, you know, that was a really key challenge. And you know, another one of us is just like managing remotely. We, we started in our backyard here in New York, but now everything is hours away from us. So being able to get over that fear a little bit and have the confidence that like you can, like this can be done because others have done it and that you can do it. I think it's an important mental, you know, a lot, a lot of this is also mindset too as an entrepreneur. Having the mindset that not letting fear hold you back and that you can do it. And to make to your point earlier, just a few degrees of process of progress Daily weekly just makes such a world of difference. And that's, I think those, as I look back at challenges like those are those things that I remember and things that I think have helped us move forward. And we're not like, we're not, we're not huge, right? 26 is. There are people with many more. But again, I think us is just building with the 10 intention. There's a, there's a number we want, we get there, we're happy with it. And if we want other goals, well, you know, we will aim for those. But you know, having a number in mind, having a lifestyle that you want in mind, again, I think it's another important thing.

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I remember mindset being such an important thing because when you've got zero, getting one is the biggest challenge, isn't it when you've got one you start to go, well, might be unmanaged, 3, 5 and then you look at towards 10 and as you scale up, I never wanted, I mean at the moment we, we look after 21 properties. Myself in separate hospital hospitality business, easy for me to say, but it's one of those things where I never intended to necessarily go to, to any particular number. But once you reach a certain platform you start to look and go, well, actually if I can do this well, I could manage 50 properties, you know, and yourself. So that mindset is a major one. That point you've just made about mindset is just something which you just constantly look to make sure you're not being too fearful and that you're resetting your mind and making sure you're pushing your business forward. So that's really cool. So one of the things which we like to talk about with Boostly is how to get more bookings, particularly direct bookings. Is there any actionable tips or advice that you could share about how your business TrustBnB has got more bookings either via OTAs or direct?

Yeah, on, you know, we definitely recognize that we can't just live forever on the OTAs. We have to, we have to make the people that come to our properties our customers, not their customers. So I think we very much understand that strategic problem. So I think what we've done, we've done a few things. One is obviously just making sure that we collect all their contact information prior to booking and then, or excuse me, when they book and then being able to get all their contact information when they're at the property. So figured out some clever ways to do that that don't require third party software or hardware. And you know, I think that that's been, that's been really good being able to have an email list of people that have stayed there to know our properties and being able to market them directly and then have them, if they want to come back, come back and book directly with us or if they have a friend, you know, just incentivizing them with coupon codes and whatnot so that you know they will come to us directly instead of going through one of the OTAs.

That's cool. And just to expand on that, you mentioned that you've got a couple of ways to do it without using software. I know there's a couple of softwares which does it is, is it something you're able to share or is it something which is how do you get the email address basically so you Know.

There, there are other platforms like StayFi which are great, right? You have to, you have to include your. Everyone that wants to log on to WI Fi has to provide their contact information. It's a great product for us. It's more management of another. None of the thing we have to worry about. So we just thought about like what's a better way of doing or what's a different way of doing this. And now with the advent of QR codes, right, the first thing you do when you walk into property is what's, where's the Internet? After you put your stuff down or your ready to relax, okay, like what's the Internet? And usually a lot of people either will have a guest book, they will have it in, they'll ask the person that booked it what's the WI Fi? Or people will have it around the house. They'll have like, hey, this is our WI Fi. So we're like okay, that's great. Is there a better way of doing this? So then we thought about well why don't we just do a QR code and then instead of it, you know, have a QR code instead of the WI FI information. So people log on and it can either go to a link tree, like a link in bio kind of thing, or it can go to a spot, it can go to a landing page that asks for your information. And then you know, you can link to your mailchimp or other email software and that's a very, very seamless process. So you basically replace third party hardware and software which is a QR code that goes directly to the Internet and you control kind of where that link redirects to. And you've elegantly solved that problem because everyone that wants Internet wants have to do that. Plus and the other kind of benefit to that is if you link to a link tree or something, you can, you know, put on referral codes for, for Door Dash or Uber Eats. You can offer coupons, you can have a link for your guidebook, you can do, you can have your direct booking site, you can do anything you want. Right now it's completely flexible. You before you would just end that collecting your information and having to market to them again through email. Well, you can still do that, but you can market them now directly during your stay. So you know, I think better on costs, better on functionality, better on reliability, better on usability, tough to see the downside of that. And you're not relying on one platform, right? It's as long as the Internet works and that QR that Link to the QR code works. You're good. And I think there's always these kind of elegant ways of learning how to, as you get more experience, these elegant ways to, you know, boost returns on your business that I always find very fascinating and fun.

I love that. I absolutely love that. It's genius because you're diverting the guests attention to where you want. And there's something very specific. Specific which I wanted to bring everybody who's listening attention to, and that is that it's not always about increasing the number of softwares. You don't have to have a software for every single thing. Sometimes you can empower yourself to have these solutions using technology which is free, you know, like for the most part, which is cool. So, yeah, absolutely. Love that, Michael.

So, yeah, the tech bloat is real with, you know, cameras and locks and thermostats and everything. It's real. So, I mean, you have to. I mean, and I think that's a great. That's a great point. And I think everyone should really know that, like, there are other ways to do things instead of buying another piece of software for 15 bucks a week or a month or whatever it is your cost. So, you know, just kind of take a second think, you know, network would watch really cool podcasts like, like loosely and, you know, just to learn from other operators, because people have thought of unique ways of doing things and it'll save you a lot of time and money and headache.

Exactly. Exactly that. So what does the future look like for TrustBnB?

You know, look, we're going to continue to grow our arbitrage portfolio in 2023. That is a big growth initiative for us as rents come down. We think that's a very good market for us to. Or very good strategy for us to double down on. So we're very much going to be focused on that over the next 12 months. Nice.

Nice. And if there's other people listening to this who want to learn what you've learned and really expand their knowledge, is there anything, any services that you offer where you could help them do so?

Yes, we have a. We have a course and we have a mentorship program that we can offer to people that want to learn how we've done it. I think for us, it's. We offer a differentiated approach based on, I think, one age, we're slightly older. You know, we're very much focused on how to build sustainable wealth to support your family. And you'll get the benefit of our experience in Airbnb as well as Our, you know, Tiffany luxury experience for eight years for my wife, for me 10 years on wall street, that finance, that fashion, you know, those learnings that we've done that we've had over the last years, building our business, putting it down in our course. It's been really helpful for us to actually just put everything down on paper and we think it'll be helpful for the folks that are interested. So if you are, please find me on social media. Happy to talk more to you more about. Happy to talk to you more about it.

Awesome. And we're going to find out obviously how we can follow you in just a second. But before we do, Michael, we love to just do a couple of fun quick fire questions as we reach the end of these podcasts. So answer can be short, as long as you like. Do you prefer working from home or from the office?

For working from home. But we actually just rent. We actually just signed an office so we actually now have our own office which is nice 10 minutes away from the house. So we walk back and forth. So definitely home with the kids or with the kid. But it gets too loud. So you need a quiet place to work.

Yeah, it can sometimes be the, like you say, the place of quiet and safety and peace where you can go to sometimes the office. But so a bit more of a random one here. But if you could transform into one animal, which animal would it be and why?

That's a great question. Why don't we come back to that?

We'll come back to that one. Is there a movie, book or TV show that has had a big impact on, on your life or one that you always is, you go to?

Yeah, it's actually a book. It's very, very short. It's called the Richest man in Babylon and I really love that book. It's, you know, there are a bunch of parables in there but you know, it really helps you think about how to, how to build wealth, how to preserve wealth, how to invest your money and your time. I think it's really, really important like not chasing everything, not chasing the fasting, but you know, things that are sustainable, that really build long term wealth, build your health, build your family. Like those are the things that are, I think are most important. And that book puts it in very, very succinctly so you can read it in the afternoon. It's a great, it's a great little book. Love it.

It's one which is still on my audible list and I come back to every once in a while. So great, great. Shout the Richest man in Babylon, I don't know who was by. But yeah, is is a fantastic book, easily findable if anyone searches it on Google. So. And lastly, we like to ask what is a motto or a mantra that you like to live by or one that really means something to you?

For me it's, you know, doing, it's more of a philosophy. It's doing things with intention. It's easy to be busy, appear busy. I think it's really important to have, have a plan on what you want to accomplish and your energies can drive towards that. It's so easy to get sidetracked, distracted by the newest thing out there. But if you have a goal in mind, just, you know, it really will help orient your actions, focus your energies and you'll get there a lot faster and be a lot happier. I think for me that is something that, you know, really, I still struggle with that and, but you know, having, having a defined goal of what you want really helps with getting up and, you know, driving towards that goal every day. So great question.

That makes sense, that makes sense. And what a great way to, to draw things to a close. So there's going to be a lot of people wondering how they can follow you, how they can get in touch and find out more. Michael, what's the best way to do.

So the best way is on Instagram. You can find me at Michael Chang bnb. That is my handle. So M, I, C, H, A D, L, C, H, A, N, G, B and B. That's and I respond to DMS on there. So any questions or you know, want to get on the phone, please find me there.

Awesome. Thank you very much, Michael. And yeah, that sort of brings it to a close. Just before we go, the last thing for me to say is to thank everybody listening watching on the live tuning in on YouTube. I know there's a lot of different places you can put your attention and I thank you for spending it with us at Boostly. I hope you've learned a lot today. I've certainly learned some really cool little tricks and tactics and really enjoyed speaking to Michael from Trust bnb. Go and check out, go and follow him, Go and check out his, his business. And yeah, if you're a host who would love to feature on the behind the Host Boostly podcast, then what you can do is if you go to boostly.co.uk blueprint and you purchase one of the copies of the new Blueprint book which has just been released as we record December 2022, then what you can do is send me proof of purchase to coachoostlead.co.uk and, and we'll cover a few things and you can be considered for the podcast. You could come on and do what Michael's doing now. So thank you so much for listening. It's been great. And Michael, was there anything I missed or any closing thoughts just before we switch off the live?

I think the most one thing I want to mention is just how important it is to have the right technology boostly, you know, obviously a very, very good technology for, for direct bookings, but just making sure that you have the right, you pick the right technology and that will really help you grow your business. And again, that mindset, you know, getting over the fear, making progress every day, even if it's a little, even just an inch or centimeter, will help you. And it's helped us. And this is a very, very viable path to financial freedom. And, you know, we hope that others can join us on this journey.

It's beautiful. Thank you so much, Michael. And yeah, that's bye from me. Bye from Michael. Thanks everyone for tuning in.

Thanks, everyone. Thanks, Liam. Appreciate you having me on.