Ep 66 Breath, Trauma, and the Fear of Being Fully Seen A Conversation with Matt Ritchey

Welcome to Remembering the Forgotten, a space where leaders think out loud without polish or performance. No scripts, no performance, just 2 people thinking out loud. These conversations aren't about delivering insight. They are about thinking together in real time. Because the There are moments where you can feel that the answer is already there, but you can't quite reach it. And then something shifts, and suddenly it's simple. Not new, just clear. That's this space. There's a point where conversation stops being about expression. Saying things, explaining things, being understood. And something else begins, a different orientation. Not speaking to be heard, but listening for what actually holds. Today I'm joined by Matt Ritchie. Matt is the founder of Inner Circle, a community built around bringing together leaders who are not just looking to grow, but to do so in a way that holds under pressure. On the surface, it's a network, a membership, a place for collaboration. But underneath it, there is a sharper intent: to create an environment where trust, accountability, and real alignment are not assumed but tested in how people actually show up. Because his work isn't about access. It's about what happens when people are placed in proximity and can no longer rely on positioning, status, or performance to carry them. And at some point, the conversation shifts. It's no longer, what am I building? But rather, what actually holds? when I'm in the room with others who see just as clearly. With that, Matt, welcome to the show.

Thank you, Markus. Appreciate you having me on here. Excited to dive into our conversation.

Really good to have you here. So before we begin the story, just go ahead.

Yeah, I, uh, you appreciate the, uh, the introduction there, and, um, thinking out loud really triggered something for me. I sang the song Thinking Out Loud to my wife to propose to her about 11 years ago or 12 years ago now. Are you familiar with the song Thinking Out Loud by Ed Sheeran? And whenever someone says that, thinking out loud, that always just triggers for me because that was such a powerful memory, such an outside of my comfort zone to get up and sing in front of a group of about 100 people and, you know, Sarah Nathan asked me to marry her. Exactly. And it was a very powerful conversation or powerful experience. And, you know, anytime I hear thinking out loud, you don't hear that term very often. It's like always just triggers that memory for me. So I just want to say thank you for bringing that beautiful memory back for me.

That's beautiful. You're welcome. Absolutely. So, you know, you just actually used the bridge, which couldn't have been more natural, by the way. Because what I want to start with is with the question, where can you just be yourself, untouched by expectation or performance?

Well, I am a father of 2 young kids, so that's probably the arena that I can, you know, the most be the least amount of performance and the most just presence and just showing up. And honestly, it's where I get tested the most as well. I feel like the business stuff and the work I get to do on a daily basis is kind of easy by comparison to being a father and having young kids and a now pregnant wife and dealing with all the challenges that come with raising a family and working from home and all these things that bring us outside of our normal zone of genius, if you will. Say my normal zone of genius is leadership and connecting with people and having conversations. That seems to come a little more naturally than being a father. I've been a father 7 years now and still feel like I'm learning and getting my stripes every single day in the sense that I feel like I'm— as much as men are fathers, of course, I think there's just a natural inclination for women to be a little more comfortable in the role of parenting. So I've been leaning on my wife in a way of learning and, you know, modeling and mentoring because she's, you know, an amazing mother. And she's been such a great source of love and joy for our family that it's been, you know, easier for me to kind of open up to that and to be a great father without the performance, without the expectations or anything that's, you know, external from the world.

That's beautiful. And you know what's interesting? So when I watched you, I could see you gleam because this seems to give you joy. This seems to give you confirmation as well because it's a direct feedback from your kids.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, I've done a lot of things in my life from racing motocross to, you know, traveling the world and building businesses and making lots of money and kids been by far the most joyful, humbling experience that I've ever had in my 42 years on this planet. So the essence is real in a sense that it definitely churns up the— as much as I'm here to build businesses and help other people, I think my main role actually is a father and how can I steward my 3 young children to make an impact or just to be themselves in a world full of people who are trying to be someone else. So that's been a And they're— and what I realized as a father is they don't listen to anything you say. They just watch what you do and they just see how you show up, see how you handle situations. And I see them doing the same thing from the same exact language to the same exact way of being, especially my daughter who's a little bit older. She's about 8 now. And, you know, the way she works, you know, the way she works with my son who's about 4, I can see her parenting him just the way we parent her in a certain sense. So it's like humbling when I see her do certain things like, oh yeah, I think I've done that for her. And it's probably not a great you know, model, but we're not perfect and we're all, you know, all getting better and learning every single day.

So. Beautiful. So this leads me to an interesting question, which I believe will dive quite deep. Whenever I ask this question, and this is always my same opener, by the way, with every guest, there are always a couple of instances where someone can be themselves untouched by expectation or performance. Isn't that sad?

Hmm. I mean, I think it's the, uh, the Instagram world we live in, right? People want to look perfect and feel like they— other people, you know, have a good showing for other people, right? Because we have a, you know, an ego of wanting to look good and/or to feel like we're successful or to say that, you know, I'm a good parent or I'm a good business person or I'm this or that. And we're all essentially kind of performing to a certain degree, right? This, this game of life, the stage we're on. I think the most people, the people I think have the most joy and the most success in my experience is the people who are the most authentic, the people who show up, you know, not wearing their mask. They have kind of their own who they are, and they've done a lot of work to wear that mask or to not wear that mask, if that makes sense. In a sense that, you know, most people, myself included, I've played a lot of roles in my past, and I've worn a lot of masks. And, you know, in the last 15 years or so, I've been doing the work to shed those those layers in the onion, peeling the onion back to, you know, get deeper into what's here and what really drives me and, you know, not spend my day doing things that aren't— that isn't lighting me up and isn't joyful and isn't actually making impact in my life or the people around me. So I think most people are, you know, caught in the game of life to a certain degree. And it's a status thing to a certain degree, as far as we're all chasing more money or more, more power or more status or whatever that is. And you know, looking good and having that performance is part of the greater game that a lot of people are playing. And I've kind of opted out of that game, to be completely honest. Interesting. I, you know, growing up, you know, in Pennsylvania, and I had, you know, I had a lot of things that would have moved me in that way, from making lots of money to, you know, I was voted best dressed in my high school, stuff like that, where I was very concerned about external appearances. And I still like to wear nice clothes. I still like to look good, but it's for me now. It's not Before, I had a hole of trying to fill, you know, do they like me? Are they going to accept me? Are they going to make sure that I'm part of the group, right? Well, now I don't really care, especially as you create your own little tribes of family and business people and whatever. You just don't really care what the external people think. And that's pretty freeing. I think it's— is it Mark Mason? The book— oh, geez. What's his book? Basically, like— what is it? Mark Mason's book. I read it a long time ago. not giving a fuck about what people think. It's essentially like the art of not giving a fuck. Yeah, that's it. That sounds very crude and whatever, but it's like the whole essence of like, hey,

like— It's a fitting title.

You gotta do you, right? And you gotta, you know, not worry about what other people think because you can't control what other people think. And that's where we get these, these, um, stress and these, these, you know, unwanted emotions where we're trying to control other people or what they think or how they think about us. And we worry about that, and it just adds all this, this stress and emotion that isn't serving us. So the more we can be aligned with who we are and to show up powerfully and, like I say, be unattached, I think that's where psychedelics actually come in and really help us, help me become less attached to the external world and/or anything, you know, currently in it.

It's an interesting aspect because, you know, if we look at modern psychology, how much do you think other people really think about us? What we think other people think, which is us thinking about ourselves and judging ourselves.

Yeah, that's crazy, right? As I got older, I realized that, that people are so worried about what other people think about them, they're not even thinking about you.

No, they have no time because they're so self-concerned.

Generally, yes.

Yes. You see, when you speak about the Insta generation, right, So what year were you born?

1983.

Okay, so I'm '72, so we have a little gap, but more or less we are in the older generation compared to the new Insta one, right?

Sure.

So if you look at it in terms of, how shall I put it? It's kind of fitting because when you say that somebody wants to present themselves always at their best, And I'm not sure, is it actually still as bad as it was, let's say, 5 years ago on Insta, that there is all this glamour and influencers, shiny stuff?

I think it is. I think it's the same. I don't know. I don't honestly, full transparency, I don't really play on the Meta platforms, on Meta and Instagram. We use them for certain things for business, but in general, I don't post there personally. But I think so. I think it's still, I mean, I hope people are realizing that the Instagram is not real life and that people are actually just putting out their highlights, not their full scripts.

Right, and the filters, right?

Yeah, exactly. And then you get the filters.

It's just crazy.

Yeah, I'm hoping that it's getting better. Better means better, meaning people are using less filters and are being more authentic. But I don't know, honestly, you know, the people I track and whatever, it seems to be You know, we're more level-headed, we're less doing the IG thing. But, you know, I live pretty close to LA here, and definitely a lot of people who are doing it for the 'gram and doing things to just get attention. And it's hard to argue against that for people who don't have other things going on, whether, you know, don't have family or don't have this or that. It's like, how am I filling my cup? And I get it, certain people wanna be important and wanna be seen as a, you know, whatever influencer or just an important person. Like, that's a very dry, you know, Tony Robbins talks about the 6 human needs. Like, importance is such a big one, right? To feel important. Mm-hmm. to feel like we matter. And that's— people go about that in different ways, right? Certain people go to the gym, certain people just post stuff on Instagram, or both people go to the gym and post things on Instagram. So it's a, it's an interesting generational thing. Like I say, you're Generation X, I'm the, you know, beginning of millennials here. You know, then we have Gen Z, and I think Gen Z has been the most online generation, of course. And then I say, you've got my kids, they're gonna come up in a whole nother world with AI and all these different things. And it's going to be— a whole different, we'll say, challenges and different things they get to worry about or to get confronted with. So I'm cautiously optimistic that it's getting better, but I don't really have any data or anything externally proving that in the sense that, you know, seems like I still see a lot of people who are doing it for the gram and just, you know, considering continuing to live the way they've always lived. And that's okay. I think everyone's on their own journey. I'm not here to change people's journey. It's about, like I say, What I mentioned about my kids, like how can we just show up and be that light, right? And be an example for people to even say, hey, like maybe people can do it a little differently or maybe he's not just flexing for the gram. And that's, I've been for about 15 years, 12 years now, I've been sharing different things on different social medias to kind of allow my bad things to be seen as well. From talking about previous traumas and pains and stuff like that to going through all my psychedelic journeys and my healing work with that. I've posted all that through 2012 through 2016 through 2017. Wow. And with that, I felt a little bit of completion. And since 2017, and since my daughter's been here since 2018, I really haven't posted at all, like personally for stuff. I feel like I've almost like— it was almost like a therapeutic journey process of like letting myself be seen by other people, realizing that it wasn't going to kill me, and realizing, like I say, that they weren't even thinking about me anyway.

Right.

That was the whole thing. Like, oh my God, they're looking at me, or they're going to think about this about me, or this, you know, this and that. It's like the whole stories we have around you know, ourselves and people. It's, uh, it's kind of laughable when we, when we zoom out and actually see them from an elevated perspective.

You mentioned something interesting, Matt, sharing about your personal life in a way how you did it. You know, you mentioned trauma, you mentioned psychedelics. I assume they very much intertwined. You got into the other because of the one, and I believe if someone really does that, I think it is serving a higher good. Because quite often I wonder, how many people really get to read my stuff? And then I meet this one person one day who says, Markus, what you shared there made a difference. So this is why I'm a bit of a proponent in terms of, because so many people right now walk around and say, Is this it, or is there more to life? So I believe we cannot fight that void for too long that's in us.

Yeah, I think that's why you see depression and, you know, suicide and all these other things, because they've tried to fill the void with other things. You try to fill it with attention or food or sex or whatever, drugs, anything. And, you know, I'd be lying if I say I wasn't at that point at one point, you know, point in my life. So I get it. But yeah, for me, psychedelics was the gateway in a good way to opening up my subconscious and to healing my trauma and to really, you know, getting an inside look to the blueprint of what our mind and our subconscious and our whole, you know, spirit, if you will, is. And

would you mind sharing a little bit how you How you went into psychedelics and how this therapeutic healing journey began without going too much into details.

Yeah, and I'm sure this is part of my journey. I've made videos about it in the past. It's nothing I'm not sharing. But yeah, the journey really started in 2010 when I had my first cannabis experience. Cannabis is a mild psychedelic, right? And I had cannabis experience. I'd probably used cannabis 2 times or 3 times when I was like 11 or 12. When I was— I used to race motocross, then I got into— I was in snowboarding, so I had a bunch of snowboard friends who would smoke weed and we'd snowboard. So I did that maybe once or twice, and I was like, yeah, it just wasn't for me, and it just wasn't really a thing. Anyway, fast forward 15 years, I was 27, had my first real cannabis experience. And, you know, it takes away the veil of your subconscious mind, kind of like a psychedelic does, in the sense that it lets you see things that are hidden in your mind that you were repressing or just, you know, not consciously thinking about. So after my first cannabis experience, I was like, holy crap, I had a bunch of memories that I had never thought about for 15 years. And I'd been sexually molested by—

That's a good place.

Yeah, yeah, 'cause I had been sexually molested by a friend's dad when I was like 11, and I just basically put up a wall and never thought about it again for 15 years. Never thought about it, never even realized it was there. And I was like, wow. So then, you know, cannabis was kind of the door that, I'd say cannabis was the gateway in a good way. And from there, actually, I did a bunch of personal development work around that. And honestly, I did my first psychedelic experience was breathwork. So I don't know if you're familiar with like holotropic breath, but you can trip your own DMT and have a very, very psychedelic experience. So that was my very first experience in 2011. I did breathwork. I didn't know it at the time that was like a psychedelic experience because I'd never had psychedelics. And, you know, that was between that and doing some of the work, it was kind of helpful. And then I did Ayahuasca. Sat down with ayahuasca in 2013, and that was very, very deep. And, it's definitely not a party, not a recreational thing. If anyone's had that medicine, they know grandmother is— she's very kind, but she's very strict in that sense. So, she makes you eat all your vegetables, so to speak.

Okay.

So, ayahuasca was definitely the journey that kind of really allowed me to heal and see myself from that third-party dimension and to really forgive myself, to really see all the things and honestly to forgive the, you know, the people who hurt me. Because, you know, holding on to any kind of anything, energy, is just that, it's just hurting me, right? So for me, it was a really energetically, spiritually cleaning experience to feel like, you know, like I'm whole and complete, right? Going into that, I felt, you know, not whole and complete, I will say. And so from then, you know, ayahuasca was the bigger journey. And then, you know, I have I've had— I've been a part of a men's group for quite a long time. We would do nature journeys where we go out, you know, back into the mountains, and we would all do some mushrooms together. And between the consistent work, you know, just when I say the work, the work is just, you know, when anything's coming up, we don't just push it down. It's kind of like, okay, what does that mean? How am I expressing this? And what is this, you know, really, how's it serving me? Because, you know, everything we do serves us in some way or another, whether we believe, you know, whether we see it in real time or not. Like I say, my subconscious mind was holding that memory back and suppressing it because it was serving me to be safe and to feel like I could be— Mm-hmm. functioning, you know, teenager, right? So the point that I was making is that, you know, continuing to do the work in and out of the medicine, I think, was the biggest, you know, thing for me. Of course, the psychedelics really give you that inside thing. But if it weren't for the integration and the continual growth work that I was doing, I wouldn't have had the, you know, the breakthroughs and the, you know, I wouldn't be the person I am today. I wouldn't say if it weren't for all of that, I would not have met my wife, I would not be married, I would not have you know, now almost 3 beautiful children, right? So for me, medicines have really changed my life in a good way, in the sense that I was— prior to that, I was, you know, was not really good with women. I was very just— I just kind of closed off, that my sexual energy was very closed off. And that affects everything. Of course, your relationships and that side, but it affects your business, it affects your creativity. That's all the same energy. That creative, you know, chi energy is just— it's, you know, it's life force energy, right? So I was shutting down a lot of energy that wasn't it wasn't available, or I was just, you know, not allowing that to be available to me. So going through all that has really kind of opened up my energetic, you know, field, if you will, and allowed me to, you know, become a more, you know, a brighter lighthouse, if you will, and not necessarily dim my light in ways that I was previously doing that. So, you know, these medicines are not for everyone, and like I say, not, not to be done lightly. And they are a medicine if you need to have some sort of healing and transformation. And, you know, we all have certain traumas, whether it be like, say, we're working with people from veterans and police officers and first responders and stuff like that. They have, I don't want to say real trauma, but they have very traumatic—

PTSD, right?

Yeah, exactly. So, we're all dealing to a certain degree. Everything's a scale, everything's a gradient, right? My trauma here, and then not to say one's more or whatever than another, but we're all experiencing trauma at different levels and different capacities at different times. And, all I have to say is that potentially everyone could use psychedelics, even microdosing, right? So, for now, I have kids and I just got businesses, I don't have time to be doing deeper psychedelic journeys very often, but I do microdosing. Yesterday, I microdosed. Today, I'm off microdosing. Tomorrow, I microdose again. So, putting that into the mix just to keep your brain pliable, to keep it neuroplastic, to keep the— essentially, they're little nootropics, right? So, we're using things to basically help our focus and help our day-to-day activities where previously my whole brain wasn't online, if that makes sense, where I was basically hiding certain parts of my memory and my function just was not at the level it is now. It's like night and day, to be completely honest. It was a very different experience living in that, we'll say, sheltered world that I'd made for myself. It was a cocoon that I'd built myself so I would be safe. And I hate to say it, but a lot of people are living in that cocoon just to keep themselves safe. And they're living kind of in fight-or-flight mode, right? What's going to keep me safe? What's going to keep me fed? What's going to keep me comfortable? That's the main things that we want as humans is to be safe and comfortable and feel like we're not going to die. Something's not going to get us, right? And that's the The beauty of living in a modern world, like there's no lions coming to get you. There's no, you know, predators. You know, we are the predators in that sense. In a sense though, how can we let go of those fears and those defense mechanisms that, you know, aren't probably really serving us and not really giving us the, you know, the outcomes we want? And, you know, even like I say, standing on stage, I was never able to really do things on stage as much. I tried prior to that. It was just, it was, I felt very, very closed off. Since then, like between, I say between you know, serenading my wife in a song in front of 100 people to, you know, dancing on stages to speaking on stages to whatever. I never would have been able to do any of that. And I say I completely owe all that to the transformational work that I did with the medicine.

This leads me to an interesting question then. Would you say that it's accurate that your experiences, which served as a, um, as a gate, actually opened the channel for your real purpose. Because you know what's interesting? When people tell me, Markus, I am so fearful on stages, I often wonder what is their intent to go on stages? And to be honest, most people I say, you should not go on stages, you should do something else.

Mm-hmm.

But people who have the intent of, let's say, sharing a message, as soon as I say, look, imagine yourself Being at that event, missing the opportunity and not sharing your message, how does that make you feel? People will be there who needed to hear that message, but they can't. And then suddenly their fear kind of transforms into purpose. And it almost sounds a little bit that your experience when you were a teenager versus what the, what the psychedelics did as a threshold kind of opened up that as well in you. Because I know you are driven, but not just driven by driven, but you're driven by purpose.

100%. Yeah. That's, yeah, the, we talk about quadruple bottom line a lot. We talk about people, planet, profit, purpose. And that's generally the types of entrepreneurs and people we work with because, you know, A, they're just more driven and in a sense, not more driven, but they're driven from a place of love and a place of, you know, it's not just discipline, not just chasing money. It's not that. It's driven from a purposeful place, right? And that's huge. Like, so you mentioned about going on stages. I think most people are afraid to go on stages. I know, you know, for me specifically, it's like I'm afraid of my light more than I'm afraid of my dark, in a sense that I'm afraid that I'm gonna shine so brightly and what are people gonna think of me? They're gonna think, oh my God, you know, and it's that whole narrative, right? Like, what are people gonna think of me? But as you mentioned earlier, and this has happened for me as well, um, you know, just hearing that one person saying, hey, That thing you shared, yeah, it really helped me. That was really something that I could take away. It was really transformative for me. Thank you for, thank you for sharing that. I've had, you know, lots of people share that with me over the years from, you know, talks I've given or videos they've watched of mine. And that's the, you know, the kernel that you need— I should say, I don't need— that I love, that really keeps me moving forward in a sense of feeling on purpose. It's not about me.

Mm-hmm.

And when you're up there and you're talking and you're trying to make it about you, it feels different when you're talking

Performative,

yeah. Exactly, it's a little more performative. So the idea that you feel nervous on stage is, well, maybe you're— and there's nothing wrong with performing. I say we see people perform all the time and it can be entertaining and that's great. But the reason you're so nervous is because maybe you're— or maybe you're so nervous because you are going to share your gifts. And that, you know, when you first start that, for me and for most people, it's very, very frightening. Like, say, what are people going to think of me? Like, this is my truest and, you know, this is my unfiltered, you know, human. And, and most people aren't showing that. So most people have fear of sharing theirs because it's like, hey, show me yours and I'll show minds. Like, well, no, someone's got to go first, right? And, you know, that open kimono, that transparency is very frightening for a lot of people, myself included. And, you know, I've definitely transcended that to a certain degree because once you get it out there, like, say my worst stories are already out there, you know, my perceived worst stories, we'll say. And, you know, I didn't die and I didn't— I wasn't, you know, I wasn't relegated to the corner and I have a tribe and I still have people that love me. And okay, okay, I'm rewiring my brain to think that these aren't that scary. They're actually They're actually energetic and they're very like empowering for both me and the people who consume them. So it almost feels selfish not to share them when it comes to that point. It's like, okay, you know, if I'm— if everyone's there and they want to hear my message, is it selfish of me to not share it? I think it is, right?

Mm-hmm.

So when you reframe that and you make it about them and not about you or your story or your ego, then it really changes the dynamic of why you're standing on stage and then how your energy

One of your quotes you just made before reminded me of the poem Our Deepest Fear by Marianne Williamson.

That's where I got that from.

Yeah. That's what I thought.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember hearing that, that quote about 15 years ago, and I was like, it just kind of hit, and I'm like, that's me. And this is when I was just starting to do my work. I was, I was so afraid that people were gonna know my story, that I was gonna whatever. I had all these fears, right? Like, but it was my fear of being seen, of my light being seen, not of that I'm a bad person or that I'm not going to be successful. It was actually that I was going to be too successful. That was kind of one of my fears I had to get over. And I think that holds back a lot of people. The fear of success is real. The fear of changing, the fear of change is real. You know, whether you want to, you know, change a habit that you hate or make more money, it's all in that unsettling category for your unconscious mind, which is trying to keep you safe, which is trying to keep you comfortable, which is trying to keep you normal, right? Normal being that You don't stick out in the tribe so you don't get knocked down, right? What's the— there's a Japanese saying about, you know, the, the large— the highest nail gets knocked down, basically, right? And there's— that's an unconscious thing for pretty much everyone, right? We don't want to be standing out in the sense that we'll get knocked down or be, you know, be dismembered from the tribe, right? So I think that's a—

And you know what's really interesting for me? So how I grew up, this was the image I had from the US. And you know, I grew up in Switzerland. So for me, the US was the country or the place where everything is possible for everyone. Mm-hmm. And then I came here 2 years ago and I realized, huh, yeah, there's truth to that. However, it doesn't work because most people I met, Matt, have the same limiting beliefs as we did back in Europe. It's not different. It's not different. But if you think about the potential there is here in the US in terms of possibilities and opportunities,

Mm-hmm.

and if you compare how many people Have stage fright or whatever. It's crazy.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, going back to what you initially said there, I think, you know, we're all human. Our environments definitely shape us. And I think that's why we do have more being built here because the narrative over the last, we'll say, 100 years even is like, hey, this is the place of opportunity. Anything's possible here. And to a certain degree, but that's almost kind of true anywhere, right? Not everywhere. You can't go to Iran and do certain things. You can't go to North Korea and do certain things. But in general, we're all humans in the same flesh and bone, right? And yeah, I think the environment is that X factor though. And when you come over here and you're born here, or not even born here, when you come over here and you're immersed in the culture or certain cultures, it can be very empowering and inspiring, right? And being around— Yeah. you know, an entrepreneur group, or you're just, you know, connecting with other builders or whatever. I have friends all over the world, and it's not like that everywhere in a sense. There's not— it's hard to find these groups, or there's not very many of them, or there's very, very hard to get into, whatever, right? It's a little more democratized here, right? There's just more people building, there's more people in it. So there's more people at every stage for you to connect with. So, yeah, I'm curious what you said. You said meeting people here, have you met More builders here, or more people doing things, or you think it's just about the same as everywhere else?

You see, what's interesting? I definitely have met more builders. However, I have met more solo builders than anything else.

Solo, yeah.

So I came from Europe. As you remember, I started out with five people. Those five led to a hundred plus introductions in eight weeks. And another 8 weeks I had 500 people Rolodex. So it's me coming from Europe, starting to connect those people and basically help them to understand that, yeah, actually 1 and 1 equals 3, maybe even 5, maybe even 10. So there is something to the environment which I was not aware of.

Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you can't grow crops in bad soil, right? And not to say that Europe's bad soil, but it's just, you know, there's different nutrients in different soils, right? And I think the entrepreneurial spirit is more nourished here from what I hear. And, you know, I say I talk to people all around the world. I've never lived anywhere. I've visited a lot of places and it's very different to visit. So, but the entrepreneurial spirit is a little more alive here and it's a little bit more nourished here.

I definitely, definitely believe that.

But definitely still got to do the work, still got to do all this stuff, and you still got to overcome all your limiting beliefs and/or stories of, you know, whatever you get to.

Yeah, that's the life. Yeah, that's life path, right?

Okay,

so I have, I have a few questions for you. I'm curious how you answer them. So if you consider where you are right now, what's something in your life that doesn't fully make sense Even though it should.

What's something in my life that doesn't fully make sense even though it should? Interesting question. Trying to wrap my brain around that one.

Take some time.

Well, I'll give you one. I grew up in central Pennsylvania. My whole family is obese, overweight. I'm perfectly fit. Grew up in the same environment, spent 22 years there. Now I've lived here for 20 years, but my, my, you know, background, my genetics, everything's there. Doesn't really make sense for me to be this fit other than, of course, I've always, you know, been active, but I was overweight at certain points when I was active. But it's been the mindset. It's been the, the belief systems. And that's where I think hold a lot of people back around weight and or just achieving any objectives. The belief, right? If you believe you can or can't, you're right. And so for me, the the the thing that I'm the the the ironic thing here is I feel like I shouldn't be this fit. You know, just my given my circumstances, my environment, you know everything I was learning, everything I learned and was taught, and then you know coming to California and learning a whole new way of being, learning all about food, about energetics, about meditation, about you know. how we— how the mind-body-spirit connects. I feel like I've got a grounding and a grip on my, you know, my 3D reality here from my mind-body-spirit that I never thought possible. And looking at where I came from, probably shouldn't— it doesn't make sense that I actually did all this, right? So I don't know if that answers your question in the right way, but that's what just kind of hit me in a sense that I feel like I was destined to be fat. I was destined— like, that was my destiny.

Mm-hmm.

And you could say, you know, it's in my genes, right? It's in my genes. Well, I don't pull the trigger.

It's an interesting aspect you just mentioned. So the follow-up question is, what sits underneath that for you?

Hmm. First thing that came up was the belief that I can mold my reality, right? That I can change both me and the reality around me, because that's actually been my reality, that I've been able to do that. From physically changing my location to physically changing my, my body, my, my temple, to, you know, building things, whether it be physical, you know, sheds, or, you know, building relationships. Yeah, that underlying belief of Anything's possible, like that thing you said about coming to America. Like, anything is possible, but it's really around our beliefs and our limiting beliefs is what's shaping our lives.

Yeah, you basically defied society's reality.

Well, yeah, exactly. I defied the narrative, right? The narrative is where you grow up, the genes you're given, the mentors you have, that should set your life, especially for the first 20 years. You know, that's a big— that's a hard nut to crack. Um, you know, if it weren't for psychedelics and certain things, maybe I won't— maybe I don't crack that nut. Maybe, you know, there's a timeline where I don't get introduced to cannabis and psychedelics, and then I don't do my transformational work. And honestly, probably continue to gain weight, and I'll probably continue, you know, 20 years now, I'd probably be overweight and unhealthy and whatever I'm doing. But I would just be— because

I'm holding on to this. Yeah.

I'm just holding on to that energy. You're holding on to something that You need to release. And I think there's— I think, I think a lot of weight is emotional, right? Of course there's emotional eating, but there's just the emotions. Are you familiar with The Body Keeps Score? There's a book called The Body Keeps Score. It talks about trauma. It's all stored in our cells.

And

I think there's something about that where, of course, there's the feedback loop of eating to forget it or whatever, but there's like that feedback loop of basically, you know, you're holding on to this trauma and it's showing up on you physically.

So. You know, you mentioned something initially Um, when you said that the negative stuff basically stuck with you to protect you, there's this theory that if we are overweight, it's protection of our own core, which I personally believe.

Like a physical protection that you'll be more physically protected?

Yes.

I'm actually not familiar with

that. Not so much physical, but it's more like, I'll give you an example. I have this one client and that person lost enormously much weight after what is called a gastric bypass or something like that.

Sure.

And that person could not deal. Yeah. That person could not deal with the new reality because the weight she put on was based on trauma. And that weight put on trauma has a function.

Yeah.

That's why I'm always interested in hearing people's backstory when they're obese, because that gives me a lot of answers. And removing that too fast Can be absolutely detrimental.

And removing it without doing the work. Like, if you can take GLP-1, and I'm not— there's nothing wrong with that, it's a tool. But if you're only doing the, the Western medical and not the, you know, the Eastern integration, then I personally don't believe that's sustainable.

Yeah.

No, because you're right, I think that's, that's, you know, that's, that's half the battle. Like I say, people are, uh, Seeing themselves, like say it's part of their identity, especially if you're overweight. Like I'm overweight because I'm like it's part of my identity, and I've known people who have specifically held on to certain weight, physical weight because it sounds a little weird. You know they're they're very spiritual, and basically when they're when they're too thin, they almost feel like they're untethered, not grounded.

That's an interesting.

They channel energy, and you know they're like. They're just— they, they get— it's almost not trauma, but it's almost like they don't want to experience that much of it. So in order to, to keep the, to keep the energy out, they must put weight on themselves in this 3D reality. That sounds weird, but I've talked to a lot of people about that and they—

It's grounding. No, actually, I do, I do second what you just said. Yeah.

No, it's interesting. I think, you know, obviously our physical vessel is very, you know, attuned to what we're experiencing, whether we're experiencing trauma or we're experiencing whatever. It's definitely You know, it's going to react to that in a lot of different ways. So I think there's, there's a lot to unpack there. And I said, I'm not, you know, I'm not a weight expert per se, but I've worked with a lot of people, you know, because I've worked with my family. And, you know, full transparency, my sister's doing great. She's been on GLP-1 and doing the work, and for a year she's lost over 100 pounds in the last year. Wow. And, but she's doing the trauma work. She's doing more of that emotional, spiritual work where, you know, the GLP-1, of course, is a tool that helps, but it's not, you know, Not the only work you're doing. So anyway, I just definitely—

I love that you were a proponent of using the tools while doing the work. Quite often that can become the gateway to the work, right?

Right, right. Yeah, exactly. There's a fine line there. But like I say, you know, we live in a modern world and whatever tools we have to use that it's, you know, beneficial, I say use them. You know, I'm not gonna say we should go out and hunt with knives. We have a gun, right? Or I'm not saying we should you know, put boots on the ground when we have, you know, drones or whatever. You know, there's always better technology. And not that any of that technology should be used. I'm just, you know, there's always a way that you can use these technologies where, you know, they're benefiting and/or they're, you know, parallel. That's what I'm hearing from you. And that's the goal is like you don't want to just take the GLP-1s or just get your stomach stapled. And because you're right, I think there's definitely an emotional component that if you don't address, it's not going to, you know, it's not going to change. It's not going to get better.

It's always a cause and an effect. And when we ignore the cause, we're screwed. That's the yo-yo effect. Absolutely. And you know what you said before triggered something interesting in me because I wondered at one point a similar question, not in terms of weight, but in terms of genetics. When I looked at my family, you know, even a couple of generations back, like grandmother, I was fortunate to meet my great-grandmother when I was a child. I often wondered, am I adopted? I don't fit into that club.

Hmm.

Or have I been found at a corner in a little basket? They took me home. Yes, I do resemble my father looks-wise, but definitely not in terms of personality. And that's when I came across the word of epigenetics.

Mm-hmm.

I love epigenetics because so many people who I worked with and talked with, they were stuck with the genetics because genetics can absolutely become a crutch and become a jailer. But when you look into epigenetics, you realize, yeah, genetics is genetics, but no reason to hold me back in the slightest in any area of my life.

100% agree. And the, you know, the steelman devil's advocate to that is like, well, I'm probably not going to be able to play in the NBA, right? There's only certain things I can do with my genetics and/or my physical, right? But Is that even true? I don't know. I probably could play in the NBA, you know, if I had that desire and/or the commitment and the discipline, right? So I agree. I think the epigenetics, I think I mentioned earlier, right, you know, genetics loads the gun and our lifestyle pulls the trigger essentially. And that's, I've come very, you know, that's been my experience, right? I can't, you know, live that. I have many other people who've lived that as well, both, both sides of it, like say pulling the trigger to be unhealthy and then pulling the trigger to be more healthy. But it's even like, it's good to know. And I think we'll get more clear with this, you know, with AI and all this, all the stuff we can do with, with data. But it'll be good to know which things we are predisposed to or not. Because certain people, like I have friends who are just predisposed to addiction and/or, you know, gambling or whatever, just like it would be gambling or sex or drugs or whatever, they're just predisposed to addiction. I'm not, you know, just not. That's not How I would, you know, just I don't know. Just I'm not wired a little differently. But that's you know. But my point being, if you know that's your predisposition, then you don't do certain things, you know, or you don't partake in certain things or whatever. But you can't just blame your genetics and then just go down this rabbit hole and say it's all because of my genetics. I mean, that's

that's exactly it. You know, it's a cheap it's a cheap out society delivers you so easily today. You know, show me your family history and I show you your predisposition. And of course. Of course you are a victim of that. I personally don't believe in

that. No, no. Yeah. Especially when you had like Oprah and all these people coming on and talking about it. Basically, during the Biden administration last 2 years ago, they were talking about how basically how it wasn't your fault that you're fat. And I'm like, what are you talking about? It's not your fault. I mean, everything you're experiencing is your fault, good or bad or indifferent. You're creating it. And I know people don't like to hear that because that makes you the beginning and ending of all your challenges and/or, you know, wins. But that's the truth, right? I fully believe that, of course, certain things happen, but it's 90/10. 90% is how you show up and what you do, and 10% of, you know, that external forces. You can't change that 10%, but you maneuver around it, whatever. But it's the mindset. Is it— are you a victim of whatever's happening, or are you the creator and empowered and inspired, right? There's very different mindsets there.

I'd like to add something to that. When I was a child, I had some great mentors. And one of them said something very poignant, which leads to what you said and adds a little bit to it. Even if it wasn't your fault at all, that you became and turned out who you are today.

Mm-hmm.

Even if you can blame the entire world for who you are today, That's very relaxing for many people. But what follows next is the hammer. The moment you recognize that it wasn't your fault, you are guilty of staying who you are and how you are right now. And that changed my life and perspective. Right. And I realized, okay, I can literally— he said, look, We can have a 12-hour pity party, and you can name every single soul that wronged you in life, that you ended up where you are right now. The moment comes where we press a button, and it becomes absolutely your prerogative and responsibility how you continue from here. Because once you recognize Okay, here I am right now. It's all everyone else's fault. That's when you cannot look forward and say it stays like that. And that was a deep exercise for me at that moment.

Yeah, you mentioned that was from a mentor. One of my mentors gave me this and it's been sticking with me. It's everything happens to your maximum advantage. Everything, whatever you're experiencing, is for your advantage. You know, someone shit on you? Well, what's, what's there to learn? Maybe you don't trust that person. Maybe you do this, maybe you do that, maybe you set up differently. I don't know. You win? Oh great, what are you learning? Okay, this is how you do it, but don't get too high. Don't get, you know, stay humble. Everything's happening to our maximum advantage. When you can have that frame, I mean, it's really hard to hold sometimes, you know, and I've not—

I love what you just said is You know, when you say someone's shitting on you, it's not what is this good for, but it actually shows you maybe, for example, don't be so trusting.

Exactly. Yeah. Why am I getting shit on? Okay. Maybe I trusted.

Because most people say, yeah, there's a reason for it. You know, you needed to have that. No, no, no. I don't think you needed to at all, but there is something that's missing that this even can happen.

Yeah, showing you the spotlight.

Interesting.

But that's 100% responsibility though. And that's a very humbling and/or challenging, you know, frame to take in any situation. It's like 100% responsibility. Teaching this to my kids, it's very humbling for them because they're,

you

know, everything's happening to me and you're this and you made me mad and this and that. It's like, no, can anyone really make you feel anything?

You know, the easiest experiment is go out somewhere and put something out there which isn't nice. One person will yell at you while the other one can't stop laughing. It's not the action. It's the reaction to it that makes the difference.

And that's why we get to do our own work. So we're not triggered by everyone else's shit. Right? Oh, they have their own stuff going on? I'm good. I'm not triggered. That's— I don't— I've healed that in myself. I can reflect. And then that's the reflection we were getting from people. It's like, oh, I see that in them. It's triggering me because I'm mad because I didn't heal that, or that's still so sore for me, right? And don't get me wrong, I still have trigger points. We all have some trigger points, but I've done a lot of work and done a lot of, you know, mind hunting to desensitize those. And, or, you know, we, you know, used NLP. Are you familiar with the neuro-linguistic programming, NLP? You know, between NLP and these other things that you can reframe, change, and even kill the sensitivity. Like for me, talking about my previous traumas, it used to be very hard. Well, I've basically reframed all that and desensitized that, and it's empowering for me now. It's part of my journey, it's part of who I am, it's part of why I'm a husband with 3 kids and, you know, doing what I'm doing, right? So everything's happened in my life.

If you remove the emotional load, and that's what most people do not understand. When I talk about my trauma, I can talk about my trauma and they say, are you talking about somebody else? I said, why? You're not affected by it. I said, yeah, I can switch and I'm absolutely affected by it. That's when I let the trauma emotionally affect me, but it's not needed. Which is an interesting aspect.

It's not—

so we're getting to the very hard—

it's very hard to turn off and on without having unpacked it and, and essentially, you know, done the work, right?

I think it's almost impossible.

It's almost impossible because that, you know, without doing that, you're— I don't know, it's just your— I mean, we have an energy body here and we just have that energetic, um, you know, sensitivity that when it hits, oh man, it's just— because I was there, I know, and I'm still there for certain things. I'm not— I'm not definitely not perfect, so

This is something I learned previously for myself. Whenever I'm in a conversation that triggers me, I picture that this person sits at a neighbor's table and I have no relationship with that person.

Hmm.

And I just hear it pass by. So it flows through me. It might have an impact emotionally, But it doesn't stick. As soon as I leave the room, that whole thing has left me. This might be something for, for people who listen or, or watch this episode.

Yeah. And again, easier said than done. And, um, practice on— I'd say it's the closer you get to the people, the harder that becomes, right? If I'm talking to my kids and they tell me something, it can be hard for me to leave and forget that, right? But if I'm talking to whatever, and I can even be present, I can be empathetic, and I can feel them, and I can walk out of there and I have none of it, right? So it's, it's, it's a, it's a game of how close you are to the actual thing, right?

Absolutely.

Well, I'm curious. I don't know a ton about you. I think you have kids, right? You have a kid?

No.

No kids. Okay. I'm sorry. I've seen you had a kid. Yeah, I feel like that, that, that's for me has been like, say, the closest growth, because before, Previously, kids, I was able to kind of like separate myself. Even my, even my, you know, at that time girlfriend, now wife, you know, they're a separate person or whatever. There's something about my kids that like, they're, you know, of blood, they're of me. There's something more— I've had more attachment to them than anything, which is very normal. But it's just like, that's been my work over the last 7 or 8 years even to, yeah, I hate to say it, like create non-attachment to them. Because there's, there's benefit to non-attachment. Of course you want to whatever, but in general, to feel non-attached in certain moments, it's beneficial, like that emotional we were just talking about. So it's definitely been the hardest thing for me to surrender to or to not feel attached to is kids.

Yeah, that's the one area I cannot add much to it.

Fair enough.

So we're slowly coming to an end. So I'm curious about what are you taking away from this conversation?

I loved your question that brought out my answer around my family and my genetics, epigenetics. That's something I don't think about that often and it's actually come more forefront in the last year because my sister's been really taking that on. Mm-hmm. It's definitely something that's been on my mind. Of course, you want your family to be healthy and live a long time and you want the best for them. And, I've also had to be unattached and surrender any of that because it's not mine to do, and I can only show up as a lighthouse and, you know, share what I can share and be unattached and, you know, not— you know, especially with family, you can't drive that home in the sense that it's only going to drive division. So I feel like I've done a really good job with that embodiment, and even now, just the first domino to fall, my sister, you know, really taking on the challenge. That feels important in a sense that I feel like I've done my work and I've led that cause And it's actually made a ripple, you know, in my family, right? So it's like, just thank you for that reminder. And thank you for that question. Because I didn't really, you know, I really thought about that. What was the actual question you asked? I can't remember.

It's a— It's a good question. I asked you 3 questions in total. So the first one was, what's something in your life right now that doesn't fully make sense? And I think that's where it started, even if it should.

Yeah.

And you actually came up with something which you were not even sure if it really adds value to it. And then I asked the second one, what sits underneath that for you? And that started opening the door.

Yeah.

And then the last one, I think I didn't even ask, what do you notice as you sit with that? Because you went into it naturally.

Good questions. I'd say good questions are better than good answers, I find, is because not only can they be replicated and put to different people, but it's also— there's something evergreen and universal about a good question, right? It helps bring up, and it can help, it can help you in a different time or help you in a different way in a different time. Same question.

So

I love, I love good questions. That's why I was even circling.

Appreciate that. Thank you. Which brings me to my last and final question. If someone feels overwhelmed right now, which is very easy, what would you want them to return to?

Breath. This is what I teach my kids, is that our breath is our easy, most easily accessible, potent tool that we have. And as I mentioned previously, you know, I've done a lot of breathwork, and like I said, that was my first psychedelic experience, and I do breathwork classes here fairly regularly. Our breath is so powerful and it's so accessible at any moment, and it will— and it works for everyone. People try and say it doesn't work. It works because it's, it's just the physiological system we have. Now you could say it doesn't work as good, or this and that, or I've not done it. Well, practice. But your breath is the key lifeline to any time you're feeling overwhelmed. Let's say if you're going to get on stage, you know, fear is just excitement without breath. We're kind of got all this energy moving through us. We kind of, you know, we don't just stop. Take a breath, you know, usually in through your nose. That makes a difference, by the way. I'm sure you know, in through the nose is something about it going up through there as opposed to just straight down your lungs or straight down your esophagus.

Classical singing.

Yeah, exactly.

I'm pretty familiar with breathing.

Yeah. But yeah, that's the, you know, I'm teaching my kids that reluctantly because they're, you know, don't want to, don't want to listen on certain things, of course. But I show them, like, when we're overwhelmed, go, just stop. And breathe. And you just take 30 seconds. Like, we can, we can change our state in 30 seconds. You go from fearful or worked up or whatever to calm presence. You know, before I jumped onto this call, I took 5 minutes, sat here, 5 minutes of breath, a little bit of visualization at the end of kind of just this going great. And then just kind of go in and you feel, you feel light, you feel, um, you know, energetic. Where when you have— when your breath is, is, you know, inconsistent or you're shallow or that kind of stuff, you just have this— You know, this nervousness and this tension in your body. And anyway, we all get that. I still feel those nerves before I go on stage or to even speak on whatever, but it's more about using— yeah, if you lose it, then there's something wrong. I personally think that because it's a—

Any cool thing is performing. I'll never lose that.

Yeah, exactly. You know, whether I'm sitting on a starting gate, you know, when I used to race motocross, there's 40 guys going for one corner, and that's pretty nerve-wracking, right? Or if I'm ready to get on stage and speak in front of hundreds of people, it feels nerve-wracking. Mm-hmm. Um, but the breath is the one thing that's anchored me and been able to use it as a tool. And it doesn't cost anything. It's always there. You don't have to carry it. And it's, it's the most powerful state changer that we have. I think even than any, any, any external substance with your breath, you can do just as much, if not more. And that's the beauty that I think I've, you know, really uncovered for myself is that you don't need any external exogenous things. You, Me, I am capable of, you know, basically doing everything internally. I don't always do that. I will partake in cannabis or certain things like that to change my state. And breath is always here. And if I'm ever feeling overwhelmed, breath is the first tool that I use because it's just simple and it's easy. It's there.

It's the most natural thing. Honestly, if somebody would ask me, what do you look for when you work with someone? The first thing is always eyes, but the second one is the breathing because the breath is the absolute translator of what's going on inside.

Yeah. Yeah.

It cannot be trumped and it cannot be betrayed. It's just there. It's just there. So we could literally have a second session just about breath.

I, uh, I didn't know you were, you were an opera singer. Did you say that?

I, I started classical singing. I didn't go to opera itself, but yeah.

But yeah, the breath, as you know, then is, you know, I had a friend who was classically trained. She was awesome. She actually, she did the ceremony and the singing bowls at my wedding. But anyway, she, you know, we talked about, you know, she was early in my breath journey as well. Like, I was starting to do breath and she was teaching me about how she, you know, how they teach her breath. Like, wow, like I never got taught any of that, of course. Never did any, any singing or that kind of stuff. But yeah, the breath is just so cool. It's such

a,

such a powerful thing. And it's, it's so neglected.

And think about that breath is the core of a human being. It's the engine. We focus on body. We focus on anything else. Than actually, which is the core of us breath.

Yeah, yeah. The life force energy, right? That's what I always think about. Yes. Because you can go months without eating, days without drinking, but how many minutes can you go without breathing?

Exactly. Not many.

Couple minutes, you'll

be

in bad shape. So it's definitely the life force energy. I say most people just neglect it. They just never been taught that it is even a tool. That's nice.

Education bonds again.

Yeah, actually, I was very— between people who were classically singing, and I had, um, you know, a friend of mine was a monk at SRF. Are you familiar with SRF, Self-Realization Fellowship? Uh, you're familiar with Paramahansa Yogananda?

Yeah.

He was the guy who brought yoga to the West. Well, SRF was his first temple right here, just down the street from me here.

Okay.

And, you know, people come from all over the world to check that out, but, um, Point being, my friend that was a monk there for 10 years, and now he travels all over the world and teaches breath and holotropic breath and different types of breathwork, because that's part of what they, you know, the main things they teach you in there is how do we control our states, how do we use our breath, how do we, you know, manipulate the environments around us. People don't like that word manipulate, but it's essentially how do we change the environments around us, right? Um, anyway, there's— that's the ancient teachings that, you know, they're teaching, or that's been teaching for a long time, is that we're not teaching Our kids are— I'm teaching my kids, but most people aren't teaching their kids. They're not, you know, it's not in the education system. No one's talking about breath. Hopefully, um, I'm not super bullish on the current administration here in the US, but I think the Maha movement of, you know, you know, opening up certain things around alternative health and medicine and, you know, psychedelics, and hopefully this starts to open up a more holistic, you know, system. Like I say, my wife is a nurse, so I'm very familiar with the sick care system we have.

Mm-hmm.

We need a real healthcare system, which is, you know, what is it, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure, right? So if we can just shift some of the things, I think we can, you know, all that to say is that breath needs to be taught and needs to be educated for people to use as a tool. Like I said, I'm doing my best in my sphere of influence to do that. But it's something we need worldwide or something we need, you know, from the younger generations on to really start teaching and helping people utilize.

Please continue. And with that, thank you, Matt, for having been my guest today.

Appreciate you. Thank you.

This was Remembering the Forgotten. As you move on, notice what may have been quietly remembered. There are moments where you can feel the answer is already there, but you can't quite reach it. And then something shifts and suddenly it's simple. No force, no second-guessing, no internal negotiation. Just a clear sense of what's next and the capacity to move. If something shifted, let it stay. A few quiet pointers are waiting below.