What Success CAN'T Do | Ep. 5

Gordon B. Hinckley said, no success in life can compensate for failure in the home.

What's up everybody, and welcome to The Rising Tribe. I'm Jared, and I'm Austin, and our goal is to inspire young men to build strong families and discover their potential as men, husbands, and fathers.

And we'll do this by having authentic conversations about our faith, family, health, and business, as we strive to level up our lives and the lives around us. Welcome, everybody. We're stoked to have you guys again here at Rising Tribe and really excited to just kind of vibe today. Sometimes we kind of go in with like a set game plan, but there's a couple ideas that we wanted to kind of bounce off of each other and give each other an update. This is one of the cool things about this podcast is it kind of formed from Jared and I's monthly calls where we just kind of check up on each other. And we wanted to share those conversations because they edify us so much. So we're learning a lot with this podcast too. Like, you know, technical difficulties last— like, we just tried a little bit. I tried to record some and I forgot to plug in my mic. And so it just goes to show— we'll talk a little bit about like self-limiting beliefs today, but yeah, you're not always perfect when you start out, man. And it's okay. Trying new things in life and, uh, learn. So absolutely, yeah, I'm just excited to be here.

So yeah, well, um, let's just do some quick updates, um, since, yeah, since you and I haven't talked in a while. Some, some big things have happened. Um, so I am, I'm no longer going to Africa this week. I am going to be going in May instead. Um, so how long do you get to see your family for now?

Like, you get to go back?

I get to go home on Friday, so I'm pretty stoked. I'll, I'll leave tomorrow, won't get back till Friday. And then I'll get to be home for about 6 weeks before I leave again.

Oh my gosh.

And then I'll be gone for 4 weeks. So it's been, it's been about 4 months since I left. So we are very happy to be going home. And I've got, you know, I got the approval and everything to shift the training. So I'm not, I'm not just going to be missing out. It's just getting delayed a few weeks.

So what do you do when you get home? Are you working while you're there? Are you training or is it like a— it's a break, right?

Uh, so I'm— I have a lot of vacation days, so I'm gonna take— I'm gonna take a good number of those. I'll go back into work on Monday just to kind of touch base with everybody and see kind of what the plan is. It looks like I'll be changing assignments when I get back, so, um, I won't be working in the same shop I was working in when I left. So we're not exactly sure, especially now that I'll be home for, you know, I'll probably take a couple weeks of vacation and then, uh, go into work for a little bit and then leave again for a few weeks and then come back. So, you know, I'm not sure what they'll have me do, but that's, that's kind of the game plan right now.

You guys had a— don't you guys have a trip planned to go to Greece or something like that?

Yeah, and we are trying to figure out what to do about that. So that we— it's possible that we can still go on that trip. It is, it is actually the week and a half just before leaving. Like, I would, if we, if we can still go, I will fly back. We will fly back to Venice, uh, from Greece, and then I will turn around and get on a plane and fly to Senegal that same day.

So at the airport, just stay at the airport. Airport.

Um, so we'll see how that works exactly. Um, but if we, yeah, if we don't go on the trip, then we'll lose, uh, we'll lose a, a small chunk of change for all of the flights. I think we could, we could get the point points reimbursed for the hotels that we got, but the flights are kind of the expensive part in dollars. So, uh, we might lose that.

But I wonder if you have extra protection being military with some of those things. I know that some airlines are way more forgiving if you're military.

Yeah. Um, in the US, in the US, that is the case. Like, I could take my orders, um, if— because, because I have, I have travel orders. So if I had to cancel because of those orders, then, you know, with United or Delta or American, I think even like Frontier and Spirit and all of them, for the most part, they would— they'd be really flexible. Um, but as far as foreign carriers go, not a clue. I have no idea how that works. I think we're flying with like— yeah, so we'll see, we'll see. But we, uh, we can wait until, uh, you know, a couple days from now to, to figure all that out when I'm, when I'm home. So pretty happy about that. But on your side, dude, you have had some huge changes or some huge things that have gone on. You, you just finished your office, you ran a Spartan race. Walk us through a little bit what's going on over there.

Uh, yeah, so I had my— recently I had my aunt, my uncle, my two cousins, and my sister come out to visit here in, here in Winder, Georgia. Uh, we— I don't— and I mentioned this before, but we live in Winder. It's a like little town an hour and 15 minutes away from Atlanta. Really cool town. It's got— this is totally random, but it's got some crazy history with like the Dixie Mafia, these guys that were pushing whiskey out here. Like I literally grew up— I literally live 4 minutes away from where like the most dangerous man of Georgia grew up. So it's kind of cool. There's some cool history out here in Winder. But long story short, my family flew out to Atlanta, picked them up from the airport, took them out here, and we just had a fun time, man. And I know I've talked to you about this, but, you know, my dad passed away while we were out in Chile. And then a little while ago, about a year and a half, two years ago, my aunt, so my dad's sister, passed away as well. So really right now, like, I just have my two uncles left on that side of the family. And that kind of makes you stop and really just appreciate life and, and, and not take for granted, you know, the time that we have with each other. And so we made it a priority to get together as a family. And we, we decided to do a Spartan race together out here in Conyers, Georgia. And we bought tickets on Black Friday. Got together and, uh, and made it happen. It was so cool. So one of the best ways to get together with family is just, hey, just, uh, buy a ticket for something and get together. And we were kind of talking about that, about how like, hey, we, we ought to get together more often. So we, we did it again. We bought, we bought a ticket to do it, go do a 30-mile Spartan race up in New Jersey in September. And, uh, Cool thing. This is all going to come full circle here, here. But cool thing here is just getting to connect with people and that, that knew, that knew my dad and my grandpa. So Todd, my Uncle Todd and Aunt Kim had some friends over that grew up that, that were two houses away from my dad and all of his siblings and my grandpa and grandma growing up. And they're Mr. and Mrs. Kazookily, and they live two houses down from my dad. Um, and they apparently live out here in Roswell, Georgia. And one of the nights they came over to, to just visit and have dinner with us. And I heard stories about my dad and my grandpa that I have literally never heard before. And it was so cool, like one of the coolest things in the world. And, uh, one of them, like, they talked about how my dad really liked to do magic tricks as a kid. And there's a box of like magic tricks somewhere around there. If it's still, if it's still floating around there, it's, it's around here. My dad gave it to me when I was younger, but apparently he loved magic. And so they told a story about him wanting to go over to their daughter's birthday party, and he went over. My grandma was super supportive of like him trying magic tricks, went over with a bird, and in, in an attempt to do a magic trick, released a bird inside of the Kuzukuli's house. And that was like the event of the party. But like Dude, that like, I was getting emotional, like hearing this stuff because like, my dad was alive at the table right there, you know. So, and then apparently, and this is kind of interesting too, like, I learned a lot about like my grandpa too. And, you know, from New York, a little bit more rough around the edges from what I understand, he was military, Army, but I can't, it's weird. Like, my dad never really talked a whole lot about my grandpa. At all. Um, you know, said he was in the Army, said that he worked at IBM, but I didn't hear a whole lot about Grandpa Jack or Gordon Mazer, right? And, uh, you know, the one story I'd hear all the time was like when, when my dad and, and older brother Mark were getting into it, you just hear him yell like, Scott, Mark! And then he would just hear stomping and then a belt would just slide out from the pants, you know, brrrp. And then he just starts snapping it, right? But like the harsh reality was like that, that's kind of how things were back then. I don't think it was as frowned upon to like, you know, hit a kid with a belt. And so, um, just kind of get making some connections is like my grandpa wasn't a bad man by any means. Um, but it's just things were really different back then. And so all I know is like my dad, like never, like he never grew up hitting us, but like just to hear like some stories about Grandpa Jack. There was a time he, I think he said, like he said, a little rough around the edges. There was a time where people were like fooling around the neighborhood, running their cars into trash cans. And I guess my grandpa had had enough and he was like, I'm done with this. So he, one night he put his trash can out and filled it up with cinder blocks and let them run their car into it. And, uh, you know, just, just crazy stuff then. Like, and I'm like, wow, like that is the first time I've ever heard that story. Right. But like, my grandpa was an incredible guy, like served our country. And but it just shows like things, times have changed. And no, I don't want people to think, oh yeah, like my grandpa was a guy that like hit his kids. But like, yeah, that's the story that I heard, you know, the belt growing up with Dad and he would always try to like mimic the— with the snap. Right. But anyways, long story short, man, it's a— it was a really cool weekend. Got to connect with my uncle and my aunt and we made memories together, man. And that stuff is invaluable. Um, it is, it's crazy how, how healing that was just to connect with my family, man. So, uh, timed perfectly because I'm about to go into another big year of work and I literally have done everything I've wanted to do in these past 7 months of kind of down, more downtime, right? Um, yeah. So yeah, I just, I feel grateful, man. Feel blessed. And I really was happy to have family out. We ran that Spartan together, got super buddy and got, you know, got, got, uh, separated on the race. Uh, Kaya ran ahead with my cousin and we thought that my cousin fell inside of a swamp. And it's like, we're like, where's Jake? He's gone. But he had, he had run, he had run ahead. But, uh, cool thing about that, and I'll, and I'll kind of wrap this up on the little update on life, but, uh, we decided just because it was such a good way to get together as family, we decided that we're just going to do another one and, uh, earn the trifecta medal for Spartan. So we did a 10K, so we have to do, uh, we're going to do a 50K and then, uh, we're going to do some other races throughout the year. But like I said, just a great way to connect with family is to pick an event and say, hey, we're doing this together so that it's no longer this up in the air, like, hey, maybe we'll come out sometime in March, you know? Yeah. So a little bit of update on my end. I start knocking doors again on Monday. And my goal for the summer is to do 1,500 accounts, which has rarely ever been done by— it's been done by about 2 or 3 guys in the industry. But all I need to know is that it's possible, right? Yeah, that's, that's it. Like, I believe I can do it. And it's possible to do. Got all my ducks in a row. I have— if you guys are new to this podcast, I do door-to-door pest control. So I literally just knock on doors all day and sell people bug spray. And, uh, I ride around on these little Segways so I don't get tired in this Georgia heat. So I've got like 3 Segways ready to roll because they always die or, you know, one of them breaks. Got multiple iPads ready to go, different service providers. Um, and I'm making my game plan to, to have one of the best, to have the best year of my door-to-door career. So what more can I say, man? Georgia's getting older. She's running around. She's the cutest little baby in the world. And Kaya is an incredible mama. So just, I'm grateful. Yeah, that's a little update on life.

So, dude, that's awesome. That's awesome. Well, so we're talking a little bit about limiting beliefs. This is— yeah, this is something that's— it's been top of mind for the last year or so, maybe even a little bit more. Um, because I remember, I remember a while back I was interested in something that Les Brown had said. He had said that you, you will most likely make within $2,000 to $3,000 a year of your, you know, 5 closest friends. And, um, and so his recommendation was to take a look at your friends and figure out like who's, who's around you. And, and that can be taken in, in completely negative senses. And that's, that's not the objective here, is that if your friends don't make a bunch of money, you should ditch your friends. That's, you know, that's clearly not, not the point. But, um, what he was, what he was getting at was the influence the, the people around us have and the beliefs that they have about us, around us. And, um, it got me wondering, you know, what kinds of things do, do the people around me believe? You know, if I'm, if I'm reading books, if I'm listening to podcasts, what kinds of things do these people believe? And am I absorbing those beliefs? Well, the answer is you are, you are almost certainly absorbing the beliefs of whatever people you're listening to, whatever information you're consuming from any sources. It is impossible to be listening to something or to be reading something over and over and over again over extended periods of time and it not shape the way that you think. So yeah, it had me— it kind of opened my eyes to the question of like, what do I want to be capable of achieving? And so I put some feelers out to a lot of my friends in lots of different walks of life from different, you know, different phases and stages of life and just ask them like, you know, hey, you know, you got lots of plans for your life. Out of curiosity, how much do you think that you would be, you know, in terms of income, just monetary income, how much do you think you could earn in, you know, one of your highest earning years? And I got responses all over the place. And I remember that my older brother was the one who responded with actually the highest, with the highest number. And I remember talking to him about it and it was really, really eye-opening. You know, I had several friends who were like, you know, if I can do some side hustling here and if I can take on this extra work, then, you know, maybe $80,000 a year. And someone else is like, you know, I think I've never really thought I could make more than, you know, just, you know, entry-level six figures, you know, just maybe over $100,000 if I stick at this job for 20 years. And Um, and yeah, there's just kind of a lot of people right in there. I let several friends who are pilots for the Air Force, and so, um, several of them were like, well, once I get out, you know, I can fly for American, I can fly for Delta, I can fly for United, Southwest.

They pay great. Yeah.

And so they're like, yeah, so if I can fly for them, maybe once I've been with them for about 5 years, then we're looking at, you know, $250,000, $300,000. And, um, and then, yeah, some other people were like, actually, you know, honestly, like, I could probably make— my brother, he was like, you know, honestly if I pursued this very specific thing. And he kind of explained it to me. He was like, probably about $400,000 a year. And then in combined income with, with my wife, who's a pilot and whatnot, over the course of X number of years, you know, we could actually probably be pulling closer to $800,000, $900,000 combined. And I, it just got me thinking, man, like, what is, what is out there and where do I fall? What things do I think about myself?, and how clear or how vague is my conception of, of my possibilities and by contrast, my limitations. And that was around the time that I actually started knocking doors for, for solar. And it was insane what it was like when I talked to those people. I remember talking to, I remember talking to the, the, the manager there, uh, John, wonderful, wonderful guy. And I was like, look, so I, I've only got a few months, uh, then I have to leave again. And, and so like, this is what I'm looking at. I can, I can dedicate this much time and whatnot. He's like, okay, based on these numbers, I think this is what you could do. And he kind of just like wrote it all up, you know, math on the board. And he was like, okay, so this is, this is what we're looking at. And I didn't, I didn't come close to that in the end, but it was one of the best things that I've ever done for myself and for my, for my personal development and for opening my eyes more than anything is opening my eyes. And he asked me, he's like, so what happens if you make $150,000 this summer? And I like choked. I was like, wow.

Yeah. Yeah.

What do you, what do you mean? And he's like, well, like, you know, he was in the military too. And he was like, look, like there, there's some real potential out here. And I'm not saying you need to leave the military by any means, but what would you do if you made enough money that you could literally pay for your separation from the military? And I was like, I've literally never thought of that ever, because why would I, like, why would anyone think of that? And He wasn't— yeah, I don't think he was, he was trying to, you know, get me to leave the military to make a bunch of money. Like, that, that isn't, you know, the, the sole focus. But he was the first person around me to ask the questions, the, the questions that I hadn't thought to ask. And he and all of the, the wonderful people that worked there at that, at that office, like, they really opened my eyes to what, what your potential— that, that your potential is like, what you can achieve is entirely dependent on you. That's it. Yes, there is good luck. Yes, there is, you know, fortunate circumstances. But if you open yourself to the possibility and the opportunities that come your way, and you're like looking for opportunities, they will be there. They will absolutely be there. And if you are ready to jump on them when they cross, when, you know, when they sit in your chair, when they cross your doorstep, like, then the, the possibilities are endless. And, you know, in terms of just— I know this is just like financial or like monetary aspect, but like, you know, several of these guys made $1 million last year.

Yeah. And they're young. They're young guys.

Yeah. These dudes are late 20s, early 30s. Like, not, you know, these— yeah, extremely, extremely young guys. And they are doing some incredible stuff. I mean, I just like listening to those conversations when we were in our trainings, just talking to them, knocking doors with them. Like, these men inspired me to be so much more and to look at myself as being worth so much more. And I don't think I could have ever had some mental breakthroughs of what I'm capable of and, and like my own potential if it hadn't been for the guys in that office.

That's so cool. It, it makes, makes me think just who, you know, in that, in that specific career field, you know, that career that you're talking about, like sales is like an unlimited, uh, like there's no, there's no cap to how much you can make. It's all about, hey, like you, you basically set a goal and then you reverse engineer it to hit that goal and that's it. Like you, that's it. That's it. Take it day by day. Um, but it is, it is really cool to to think like there's, there's so many things that you can do in life like that, that can make a great living. I, it's weird because I don't, I never pictured myself ending up where I am right now, like doing door-to-door pest control. But it is one of those careers where it's like, hey, if I wanted to go make, you know, $1 million in a year, there'd be a way to do it. Or, you know, you know, there'd be a way to do it through recruiting and through selling a lot. But it is really interesting because you will end up being the average of kind of who you surround yourself with. And to a point that you made earlier, you made a point where you're like, yeah, you never want to like look at your friends and say, oh, these 5 people make the most amount of money and I'm going to hang out with them because sometimes they're not the happiest people either.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

I was just listening to the Ed Mylett, most recent Ed Mylett podcast that came out., and it talked about the happiness threshold kind of slows down around like $70 grand. Like once you hit $70 grand, that curve of happiness goes, you know, kind of caps out, uh, because you've achieved your basic needs. Like you've achieved food, water, shelter. And so you look at—

where you mean the additional, the additional money after that. Yeah. Isn't going to bring you the same amount of happiness.

Exactly, exactly. So thank you for clarifying. You're not gonna, you're not gonna have exponential amounts of happiness when you make $150,000, $200,000, $300,000. And I do have personal experience with this, man. Like, I mean, making, making great money in door-to-door pest control, I had a really difficult time where I had the most amount of money I'd ever had in my bank account. But I was the most unhappy I'd ever been. And it was really kind of a scary part in life because I had a lot of money. My wife was pregnant with Georgia. But I had tied up my worth into the income. And because I wasn't working at the time, I was so like depressed. So what I'm trying to say here is, yes, you will make what you believe that you deserve to make. The only precaution is don't get tied up in the income so much that you allow it to become you, that you allow the income to become your identity. Um, I, and I, and I don't, and I just, I just feel the need to say this just because there's so much, you know, the purpose of our podcast is to connect, to be better husbands and fathers. And if you do make a million dollars a year, you have the freedom to be an incredible husband and father. Absolutely. But you also, I mean, it's not the determining factor of happiness. No, money is an incredible tool. Like, and I think it amplifies who you are.

It does.

If you're, yeah, if you're unhappy without money, I think it's an amplifier for making you way, way more unhappy, you know, if you have a lot of money. But that's just kind of where I wanted to go with that. But yeah, I mean, this summer I am gunning to make over $500,000 in income doing my pest control stuff, and it's going to take a lot. But at the end of the day, I can't even tell you what I would do with that right now. I just— I quite frankly am more excited with, with just the process. I love my job. I think it's incredible to, to try to hit— we talked about this last week, last month with our podcast. With like, what fascinates me is just people trying to push the limits. And yeah, so just some thoughts there, man.

Like, yeah, I'm sorry.

Yeah. No, that's just some thoughts there on, on that. And I think my biggest thing in life is, is still striving to be present everywhere I am, while pursuing these big goals that happen to have high income as a reward. You know, but, but the people— I never even thought this stuff was possible until I met people that were like, yeah, you could do this if you want. A lot of people that I'm inspired by are guys that have done multiple Golden Doors, you know, they— it's like, it's a standard for them. And so they've kind of paved the way, uh, for me to be like— they've given me permission to think big because I've seen somebody else think big. So there's just some thoughts there.

Isn't that so interesting? That we, we are subconsciously seeking permission to do things and seeking permission to think big, to dream big. It wasn't, it wasn't until I started talking to these guys that I realized just how big I was allowed to dream. Because, yeah, like, the, the people around me didn't have dreams that big. And it's, it's not a, it's not a knock on, on family members or on close friends or anything like that, but Uh, because they're like, you're saying, like, you, if you're not a good father with $5, you're not going to be a good father with $150,000 or with a million dollars. Like, that, yes, opportunities might open up to you because of the money, but that's not going to change who you are, because wherever you go, you got to take you with you. Like, you are still going to be the one that's going to be there, and if you suck, then you're still going to suck. Like, the money isn't going to solve your problems, it's just going to amplify your problems, or amplify your successes if you are Like, if you are an incredible father with $5, with $10, with $100,000, like, you will continue to be, um, to be that great father or that great husband or that great man.

I'm gonna drop a quote here from Gordon B. Hinckley that ties in a lot about what we're talking about right now. Um, and for you guys that are not like, that, that, uh, aren't familiar with, uh, Jared and I, we're both members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. We believe in prophets. That speak for God today. And, uh, my favorite prophet of all time, right, uh, Gordon B. Hinckley, said, no success in life can compensate for failure in the home. Such, such an incredible thing, man. And I think as men, we're driven to accomplish, to achieve. And if we're, if we're not being, if we're not being the best husband, fathers we can be while doing that, there's, there's literally nothing you could do that would compensate for that ever.

Absolutely nothing.

Yeah.

Because in the, in the final judgment, we believe that we'll stand before, um, we'll stand before the Savior and he will ask us like, what did you do? Like, how did you, how did you treat your wife? How did you treat your children? Um, that is your primary responsibility is to take care of them. And if you are not doing that with every resource that you have available to you, then it does not matter. The rest of it does not matter. And, and the part that I think that, that I think we, we fall— that the trap that we fall into is, well, then if none of that other stuff matters, then why pursue it in the first place? And, and the thing is that, like, there's— I firmly believe that God wants us all to be successful.

Yeah.

You know, everywhere we go. Because why, why, why would, why would there be a God who says I want you to be successful in your home with your, with your wife and with your children. But I want you to be a big fat failure out there in the world. Like, this doesn't make any sense to me. So I know that he wants us to be successful. He, he's just asking for us to get our priorities straight. And perhaps that means there are certain sacrifices that we have to make. But by no means does that mean that we can't have both, that we can't be a good husband, a good father, a good man, a good son of God, and, you know, a good contributor in our community, a good person to the people around us, and also like make more money, achieve, you know, have these accomplishments or these successes in the life. Because in the end, like, this world was created for us to come and to experience. We didn't like just come to have a family and then, and then die like that. It wasn't just that. It was probably the, the largest portion of that was, was to have the family But the whole world was created for mankind. You know, Adam and Eve were given dominion over the entire world, over the animals, the plants and everything. And they were told to, you know, to till the land, to bring children into the world and to work day in and day out. And, you know, God created the world, the universe, and he's asked us to continue creating it with him like we are. We are co-creators in all of this world. And I think that's part of the human impulse to create that creativity. Yeah. And And why? So we were talking about your office, dude. Like, you just built your huge desk and your shelves and everything. Like, I want to— like, there's something about us that just wants to build, that want— whether it's physically, whether it's digital products, whether it's, you know, music, art, um, like all sorts of things. Like, we want to be creating and building. And, and so, and I think that is a tie to the divine, that is a tie to divinity, because God himself created the world. And he's put that creative spark inside of us too.

Huge. Like, I'd probably just go back and re-listen to that to like, to like take notes on that, just because it's like, create— like what you said is just like, you gotta let that sink in. But we are, we're here to create. Like, I, I firmly believe that we were made in the image of God. God is a creator. And so when we tap into that, I think we really experience like our divine potential, I would say. And I think the greatest creation that we can create is a family. Like, we can— whether you, whether you, um, and I, I have friends in my life that are infertile, like, you can still adopt, you can still do things in life that like allow you to build family. A lot, you can still get married, you can still build like a small family, like, building those things are, is what it is, what is exciting. Building up to a goal, or building things and creating things is so much fun. I think, you know, looking back, buying this house with Kaya, buying the house didn't really change our happiness. Like, it was amazing to be inside of a home. But it's kind of go— there's my, one of my favorite quotes is, where you go, you were, you were, you go, you have to go with. I just butchered the quote incredibly. That's okay. But, but, um, where you go, you must go also kind of thing. Like, if you're unhappy, you must take that unhappy self into that next realm of your life. But, um, having that— getting the house was exciting because we got to create a home. We got to create memories here. We get to create a day-to-day life here. We get to do projects here. Um, and just a quick story about limiting beliefs, and one of the reasons why I wanted to kind of go this direction today is because I had a lot of— about a year ago, I had a lot of insecurities surrounding my ability to build or to fix things. And I think there's a lot of— there's that stereotype where the man must fix everything, the man must be handy. And that is like, that is what a man does. And I'm going to challenge that a little bit, but I'm still going to encourage men out there to learn how to do things. The funny story, Kaya and I, after we had just gotten married, she is very good at building stuff. And I am very, very— there's no other way to say it. I am very anal about keeping things very, very clean. Extremely. Like, that is how I am. And so there was a point in our marriage where I was doing all the dishes and like cleaning the countertops. And like, I'll look at the countertop from an angle to make sure there's no crumbs. Like that is where that is. I get that from my mom and my Uncle Todd, who actually came out to visit last week. Like, that's how we are. But it was funny because I was, you know, doing the dishes and I look over at Kaya and I go, she's building a bookshelf in our, in our basement apartment while we're living with her grandparents. And she's putting together this IKEA thing, screwing things together, and I'm cleaning everything. And I go, kind of funny how we kind of reverse gender stereotypes here. I'm the cheerleader and I'm doing the dishes and you're the weightlifter and you're building stuff. But okay, so to my point, though, I don't think that men should know how to build things just because that is a manly thing how to do. I think that men ought to challenge themselves to figure out problems. That's it. Try to, to try to solve problems, like, and try to figure things out when things get broken, or figure out how to build things, or figure out how to create. And that's kind of how I changed my perception on things.. And without going into full detail on the whole story, I kind of caught wind one time that someone had made a comment about how I— and there's no ill feelings with this story at all. It's just me relaying kind of what happened. But I caught wind that somebody in our network had made a comment about how I didn't know how to do much building. And it hurt my ego a ton. And I took offense to it. But the reality, because my perception was, oh, I don't need to learn how to do that stuff. I've got my Benjamins, I've got my $100 bills to hire it out. And that, and what that really was masking was a massive insecurity of my own to be able to fix things. And, you know, I kind of hyped it up with this, oh, I've got my money, I don't need people to help me. But the reality is, if, if anything ever did happen, and the world went sideways, I would be toast. I'd be so screwed because I had a limiting belief that I couldn't do it. Now, in that, in that case where if I needed to learn how to do it, that's— I'm sorry, desperation is a necessity, is the mother of all learning, right? Like, we, we do what we need to do. And I just decided to change that, change that identity, change that self-belief that I had. And it started with my neighbor who said, hey, we're going to build a deck off your back patio. And I was like, I don't know how to do that. He said, no worries, I'll teach you. So we spent a week together, 2 weeks together in total, building a deck together. He taught me how to use drills. He taught me how to cut things. He taught me how to measure. And after that project, we have this beautiful deck on the back of our house. But after that project, it's like, because somebody believed in me and because somebody taught me, instantly had this pride in, I know how to build, I know how to do this stuff. And so it took somebody to kind of help me and nudge me along in that direction. And it's funny now, because like every single time I build something, I like, or I'll take the drill and I'll like, you know, run it a couple times and I'll blow, pretend to like pretend to blow smoke off the top and I'll make this sexy pose and look at Kaya. And it's like, I am so proud of my ability to build things now. Kaya in our projects is more of like the mastermind of how the how, like, you know, she's very gifted in measuring and like, coming up with a concept. And now I find a lot of joy in putting things together, painting, staining, and I built a beautiful office with her. And it's one of the funnest projects we've done as a couple. Didn't come without us fussing with each other, or like arguing, like that stuff's natural. I feel like, hey, you need to do this, you need to do that. But we've learned a lot. And I feel like I've become We've become a better team building this thing together. And I'm talking to you in my office and Georgia comes up here and she plays while I am on my computer and I can get her like boxed in, in my office, like, and she hangs out with me. She was laying down at my feet yesterday while I was doing work. It's so cool, man. Like we created something together, but it all started— nothing would have changed unless I had something, somebody kind of challenged my ego. And challenge my identity. Just being really vulnerable there, like, I, I really put up a mask and I masked my insecurity with money. I think a lot of people do that. I, I really do, man. So how did we mask our insecurities? I mean, it can happen with other things too, dude.

Well, um, uh, masking Okay, before I jump in, I wanted to share, uh, it's funny that you talk about, um, the dichotomy between you and Kaya.

Oh, it's crazy.

That skills, like when Marisha and I got married, um, the week before we got married, um, I had built, I had found this cool like table that, um, that like opened up for you to put a leaf in and then the wings kind of like folded up. So it'd be like a big outdoor table, super rundown, got it for free from someone who was doing like a yard sale thing or whatever, but it didn't have a leaf and for the middle. And I was like, dude, I, I could probably build a leaf. Like, you just— it looks like you just slap some 1x4s on here and you just, you know, just screw some things. Like, I'll probably figure it out. Um, and I'm— I, I don't know, I would say I am— I'm not, I'm not really trained in a whole lot of handyman work things, but I know how to use a drill and like a handsaw, and that, you know, that's about it. Can kind of figure everything else out. You know, I, I believe I can learn anything. I firmly believe that. And I can get pretty creative and resourceful with, with things. And so I end— we ended up not having the tools to like— I think we had a circular saw, um, to cut the bigger boards. But then as far as like, there was some like ornate part of the wood and I wanted it to match the table, and I— we only had like this, this tiny little saw, like a just like a— I don't even know what you call it, a handsaw, manual. So it's like— but it was like 8 inches long, like this tiny little blade that at the tip was like a quarter inch wide, or like the blade, like the flat part of the blade at the shortest end was only about a quarter inch long. And then at the tallest end was like 2 inches. I mean, this tiny little thing and it was like super bendy and wobbly. And so like it was— but I cut probably like 10 feet of wood. With this tiny little thing, just like trying to, trying to make this. And then I'm— I just like went to Home Depot. I was like, dude, I don't know what kind of brackets I could get to, like pieces of metal to try and like hold all the wood together because it's all loose. And I'm just wandering out. I don't know what anything means. And I'm just like looking for pieces of metal that are just like flat and sturdy enough that I could screw some stuff into it. And I was like, I think this will work. Ah, this might work. Who knows? Um, and I put this table together. We ended up getting rid of it because the table kind of just like broke after that.

It was pretty old.

But I made it. Like, I made this, you know, I made this leaf and I stained it the wrong color and it didn't quite match, and it was just kind of okay. And then we never really ended up using the table except to put some plants on it for a while. But when we got married, it was really funny. We were sitting at a reception and somebody comes up to me, a longtime family friend of mine, and he goes, um, hey, I saw that you put, you know, you put some power tools on, on your registry. That was a great idea. Because we had a— I think we had, we had our impact drill, uh, we had a heat gun, we had a, a Skilsaw, and, sander, and just kind of some like some basic stuff. And I laughed and I was like, actually, I didn't put any of those on there. My wife put them all on there, um, because Marisha used to build barns for the summers, uh, for several years. They— she was like living out of an RV for a lot of it, and they would just go build barns out in, in Colorado. Um, so she's, she's extremely handy in that aspect. I hadn't even thought to maybe put, uh, power tools on our registry. What I thought of when it was like time for the registry was like, dude, like, we could get a, uh, I think we should get like this dish rack for the kitchen. I think it would like dry our dishes super well. I was like, dude, we could also get this like funky look, this like bottle brush that looks like a cactus. I mean, just like not even— they're just like totally opposite ends of the spectrum. Um, but there, there's something, there's something— I know it's kind of bouncing back and forth, but as far as like being handy, it's interesting. I wasn't offended by the remark or anything. But I think that's because at this point in my life, I had this firm conviction that I was able to learn anything and that I really enjoyed the process of like, we have limited resources, but you still need to make this thing happen. How do you do it? And that like creative aspect of—

MacGyver.

Yeah, kind of this like, you know, what do you do? I've got, you know, I've got limited resources here at my mom's house. I'm like in the backyard and just like like trying to figure this stuff out, where I get really excited by that prospect. But when it comes to like masking insecurity, going back to what you were mentioning earlier, I, you know, I don't— I think, I think maybe a lot of it I do with— I'll use humor and laughter to kind of move past it or steer the conversation away from, from exposing those insecurities. And then I just let that track play in the back of my mind all day long of, you weren't capable of doing this, you can't do this, you're not, you're not good enough at this, you, you know, you're incapable, you're never going to achieve X, Y, and Z, like it's, it's not going to happen, like you just think too highly of yourself. And that just, that track just kind of plays in the back of my mind. Um, I don't, I don't really know where I was going with that, but that's just something that's been on my mind.

I— it's, it's, it's, uh, interesting to think about. Like, we have— we do have soundtracks. There's a really good book called Soundtracks that talks about that. Like, what do we say to ourselves? Um, I, I think that sometimes, like, masking insecurities could look like putting other people down. I mean, that's the classic one too, where it's like people who— a lot of times bullies in school are, uh, are just kids that are having a rough life. So like, they, they need to like get that out somehow. Um, or they're insecure about themselves. That's one of the reasons why some people think that if they put others down, it'll somehow make them better or make them feel better. And it doesn't. Um, it's a very false sense of, um, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's false, you know, that you're not going to feel better by putting others down. But, um, yeah, I think, I think specifically in men, it's worth talking about. It's like sometimes when we are insecure, like, we can, we think that being hyper, you know, stoic or hyper manly will, will overcompensate the fact that we have emotions. And that's not necessarily true, right? Like, there's times where I am a very emotional man, you know, like, that is part of who I am. And, uh, there's a time and a place, like, to, to deal with emotions too. I don't know how we even got here, but there's a time and a place too. Like, I'm not going to become hyper-emotional during my summer, like, during my work season, during my working hours, because it doesn't benefit me in that current moment. But there— it's really important to find times and places where you can just be human and, uh, and express what you're feeling. That's one of the reasons I work with, like, a mindset coach where I can talk about, like, hey, this is what I'm experiencing, this is what I'm feeling. He actually challenges a lot of my beliefs to help me think bigger too, you know, but, but just, just some thoughts. A lot of the progress I've made in life has come through, like, challenging my identity and like, what all these things that I think like make up who I am, like with income at that one time in my life where I thought income was like, that is who Austin is. Even though I didn't say it, like, that's what I was thinking internally. And so when I wasn't working, I was very miserable. And, uh, a lot, yeah, it's a lot of, a lot of who I am now. And like, really who I am, you could say, I have heard people tell me that like, yeah, your role as a husband and a father is temporary because at any time, like, heaven forbid, but at any time, like, you could lose your, you could lose your life or their life. And like, life is so short. But I firmly believe that that is an eternal thing. Like, I have I am— that is an eternal principle. Like, I am a father to my daughter, and I am my wife's husband forever. And that's something cool about our church, is that we believe in eternal families. That's not just something that ends if I were to die, or if anybody in my family were to die. It's like, that doesn't end. Like, a family is an eternal, eternal thing. So, um, without going too far down the rabbit trail, it's just— it's, uh, really, what is your identity tied up in? And what, what things— and this is a question that Jared and I would pose to you guys— is what things are you telling yourself that's actually just holding you back? It could be about income, it could be about your fitness. Some people— I firmly believe that some people are not in shape because they don't believe they deserve it, or they don't believe that they can have it. They believe that that's just for those other people that are in shape, like, that's not what I deserve. And that can be like a— that can be a really fast catch— that can be a really fast downward spiral where you're like, I don't deserve to be in shape, I don't deserve to have this, therefore I'm gonna go stuff my face with, um, McDonald's. And then it only further supports that belief that you're not deserving or you're not the type of person that would have that. So everything does start, you know, it's like the chicken or the egg. What has to change first, the behavior or the belief? And just pick either one.

I, I don't, I don't want to be like, yeah, they influence each other immediately.

Yeah, pick one.

Interesting. Yeah, sorry, go ahead.

Yeah, that's what I would say is, is we could sit here all the time like, what comes first, the, the belief, the belief shift, or the behavior switch? And they both support each other so much that you just have to start somewhere. And I think the easiest thing to do for us, because we're such behavioral creatures, is just start with a behavior that supports the identity that you want to start living. So I don't know what you would say.

And every, every little action that you take in that direction is a vote for you being that kind of person. And you don't need a unanimous vote, you just need a majority vote. You just need some votes moving in that direction. So every time you go and exercise— no, you may not exercise every day, and no, you may not stay as long as you would like to or need to or whatever— but every time that you go exercise, you are voting for being the kind of person that exercises. And yeah, then you start to adopt that with time, and with those data points, you start to believe that you are the kind of person that exercises. And you're— so your belief is changing and your actions are changing. And because your belief is changing, there's a higher likelihood that those actions are going to take place, and you will be more likely to continue those actions. And it's more likely that the cost to doing those actions goes down. It gets easier to do those actions over time. And so that it, it is a— is it a positive feedback loop there? Um, that I, that I think is so strong. And interesting, when you were talking about, um, believing that we cannot have this thing, like, I, I do not deserve to be, to be healthy, you know, to be fit, to have this kind of body, to whatever it is, we will turn towards, uh, I think initially we'll turn towards just like, you know, to binge eating, to eating crap food, to, to whatever when it comes, let's say, to fitness. But then with a long enough time, I believe that, that is, it is very likely that that belief will turn towards judgment and even resentment towards people who do have what it takes to, to get fit and to be healthy. And then you're starting to, you know, starting to resent those people who, who have clawed themselves out of the hole, or maybe didn't even have as big a hole to dig themselves out of in the first place. And, uh, you know, maybe they didn't have as hard a time getting in shape and, and getting on the healthy train But we, you know, if we start to, we start to tear down those quote unquote ideals when someone else is where we want to be, there's always an option for us to just tear them down because there's— if we can tear them down or bring them down to our level, then the disparity between us and them goes away. And then we don't have to feel as bad about ourselves because that ideal is no longer judging us. And it's not to say that all healthy people are judging unhealthy people, but we won't feel like they're judging us because they're no longer there. And so we feel better about the situation that we're in. And I just— it's crazy to me. It's crazy to me that we don't want the success for everybody around us. Like, we, we might say that we want everyone around us to be successful, but then if someone else is, oh, is, is besting us, is, is achieving more than us, then we, we start, we turn to the defensive and we say, well, there's all these reasons why I am in the situation I'm in and I can't be where they are because I have all these barriers that they didn't have to face in their life. And it's totally possible that it's true, that it's entirely true, and that they had a way easier time getting to where they are than you are. But what that really means is that you're just going to have to work harder to get there. And it's, it is, it's not impossible. But if the story you're telling yourself is that you are a victim of all these things, then it's not pushing you to where you want to be. It's keeping you where you currently are. And if you're unhappy with that, then you're just going to stay where you are and you're just going to stay unhappy. You need to get out of that and you need to start looking up to people who are where you want to be and taking action. Start taking actions in that direction. Otherwise you're never going to make any progress and you're just going to be unhappy.

Yeah, a couple of things stack like I was just thinking of like stacking dubs, like you're just stacking little victories. Like little votes towards becoming the person that you want to be. Uh, but, but to, but to really kind of dive into that principle of pulling others down because we're uncomfortable with their greatness, I think it's kind of like the, uh, is it, is this a Jordan Peterson thing where the lobsters will pull each other back down in the boiling pot if one starts to crawl out? I don't know who I grabbed this.

I don't know if I don't know. I know lobsters was his thing, but I don't know if that one in particular.

Well, Well, and maybe it's a different animal of sorts. I have no idea. But there, there is an animal where if like, if you put them in a boiling pot of water, I think it's crabs, and one starts to crawl out, it just gets pulled, sucked back down. Right. So it's just so important to surround yourself with people that are supportive of you. But, but then again, there's going to be times in your life where maybe nobody supports you and you kind of— this is what it's something that I've been working on with like my mindset coach. It's like, what's going to drive you when nobody supports you? And that's where you can go when things really get tough. Because like, for example, like a summer, big summer goal, um, uh, big summer goal. Like I have a big goal to hit. Um, I, I can have my wife on board. She's the most supportive person in, in my whole network, in my life with a lot of goals that I've set. But there's sometimes too where like maybe Kaya's not as sold on the vision as I am, or maybe I'm not like, there's times where I lean onto Kaya. And I can't always lean on her sometimes just because I share this story. Cause there is a time Iron Cowboy was doing his, you know, 100, 100, uh, Ironmans in a row. And there was a day where like his wife was like, hey, like you can stop. And it was right then where he's like, shoot, like I can't always rely on other people. Like I have to be able to find that drive within myself to keep pushing. Um, But to just relate to the crabs, you know, pulling, if somebody is, someone's escaping that box, like, for some reason, we like to pull them back down, like, get back at my level. It's because we're uncomfortable with seeing what's possible, because we know that we would be required to do the things that those people are doing to get to that level. And we just get uncomfortable with that thought. But the most happy people I've ever seen, and I think hopefully when you listen to this, you're not like, oh, like it's all about income. It's not. It's just about doing things on a daily basis that make you happy and make you better as a husband, as a father, as a man, as a businessman, right? Like, that's all it is. You know, there's, there's, it's not all about income. It's not all about the cars, the houses, or, you know, what you have. It's about who you're becoming. That's what I would say to people, anybody listening here, is just what are you doing on a daily basis to just take care of yourself and love yourself? Because when you love yourself and when you take care of yourself, you're in a way better position to do what I think we're here to do, is to serve others, is to put others as a priority. You know, you're, you're in a way better position to serve others when you invest in yourself.

So, um, yeah, and going with that, the, the story of the lobster and the crab. So they're the the famous, um, monkey ladder bananas story, um, or study that was done is that they put a bunch of monkeys in a room and there was a ladder and like a bunch of bananas up at the top. And when monkeys would start to climb the ladder to go towards the bananas, the researchers would spray the monkey with water and the monkey would get off the ladder. And then— and they would do this over and over again to every monkey that was climbing the ladder. Um, and it got to the point where, um, a monkey would start climbing the ladder and the other monkeys would pull them down. To save them from the water.

No.

And little by little, they swapped monkeys out. So they take monkeys that had been shot by the water— not shot, hurt, you know, sprayed with water— they pull those monkeys out and they put a new monkey in who hadn't seen what had happened. And with enough repetitions, you know, the new monkey's like, oh, bananas, starts to climb the ladder. Other monkeys who have been sprayed by water before pull the monkey down until that monkey believes that there's something dangerous at the top of the ladder or something. We don't climb the ladder. And they kept replacing the monkeys until there were no monkeys from the original group in the, you know, in the, in the room anymore. And still, when monkeys would go to climb the ladder, they'd pull each other down. And not a single one of those monkeys had been sprayed by water. And so the question is, you know, when it comes to limiting beliefs, are we these monkeys? And are we pulling people down from climbing a ladder that we've never tried climbing? Like, have we tried it before? Have we been sprayed by water? Did we try maybe faster to climb the ladder before we got sprayed with water? Are like, are you, are you gonna give up at the first obstacle? And are you gonna tear people down when they're trying to overcome these obstacles? Because like you're saying, if, if people, um, if somebody in our circle is in a similar problem, uh, or a similar scenario situation as us, and they go out and achieve something great, and we get upset that they achieved that greatness, because what that means is we— one, we are capable of doing that. We are capable of leaving the scenario we're in. And what that really means is that we're in our scenario because of our own doing. It is our own fault that we are where we are, because if we have the power within us to leave the scenario, to become better, whether that's fitness, whether that's earning greater income, whether that's— whether that's reading more, becoming more educated, getting a degree or starting a new job or whatever it is, if we are capable of leaving our own situation, our own scenario, and we don't do it, then that's our own fault. And we don't like to be compared to other people who are in similar scenarios as us but still overcome all those obstacles. And when I say we don't like to be compared to them, I mean we don't like to compare ourselves to them, so we try to tear them down so that we don't have to. Um, and if we're— if we're stuck in that boat, dude, like We're a, we are a sinking ship.

This is really interesting that you bring this up because like identity and like who we are, I think that also has a lot to do with like our relationship with God. Right. I think, and I really am trying to get closer to God this year as one of my, as one of my focuses, like one of the things that I'm doing on a daily basis, I've got this little binder here and each page kind of has a reminder of, hey, this is where I want to go this year. This is where I want to be. Whether it be with my marriage. I have, like, for example, like, and I'll tie this back to God, but like marriage, I realize that I can, like, I can be very critical and I am critical of myself and it's something that I need to work on. But instead of having like expectations and being like, why didn't you do this? Why didn't you do that? Like, I'm going to do my best to just have appreciation, right? So whenever I feel the urge to criticize, replace it with something else. This is something I'll share with Kaya too. I just built this whole binder up, um, and it's something that I quite frankly like struggle with because I love having the house super clean and, or stuff like that. So I'll just say things and it adds up and I know it puts stress on Kaya, you know. So, but like doing small things daily, like one of the big things for Kaya is getting a foot rub in the morning, which quite frankly, that's, that's taken a hit because it's, instead of doing that for my wife, I've done other things like taking care of Georgia in the morning. Whereas that used to be like a staple in our marriage. Like, I didn't— like, it's not as big of a focus anymore. I used to take a lot of pride in that, and it's not been as big of a focus. But like, just some— those are just a couple of things. Another marriage goal that's not so like, man, I'm effing up big time right now is, hey, I want to build my wife a gym, right? Like, and invest that money to build my wife a gym. But— or praying together as a family when we eat dinner at like a set time.. But to bring it back to like spirituality and, you know, like, I— hold me accountable and ask me how I'm doing with that. Cause I mean, then I'll share it with Kaya too, cause I wanna be better. I wanna be a better husband. That's it. And I think a lot of things I'm sharing, we, we all fall victim to sometimes. But, um, some of my goals for like spirituality is just fasting once a month. Like I sat down the other day and I was like, oh my gosh, I don't do that. Like, I, I don't do it. I kind of, go through the motions there are like personal prayers in the morning and then attending the temple. Shit, quick story, and Jared, I've talked about it before, but members of the church, we have these things called temples where we'll go and it's a sacred place where we'll perform ordinances, spiritual ordinances for the church, right? And make promises with God. And I, last summer, I went there at the very end of the sales season. And going there was like I'd been holding my breath for 5 months and I finally got to breathe. And I asked myself, why did you go all summer without this? So it just made me think like, I got to recenter those things and change my identity that I have with God, you know, because change my belief about the relationship I have with God and grow closer and invest time. And when I have a buddy named Talon who's like, yep, I'm spending time with God this morning, like literally spend time with God and, and grow in that relationship with him. And, um, but to tie it back to like comparison, I think that we struggle with this within the church. Um, have you ever noticed like when somebody's like going out of their way to like really try to live their beliefs, we sometimes within the church will be like, oh, well, they're being a Peter Priesthood, or they're being a Molly Mormon. It's like, no, like, they, they could just be trying to live out their beliefs and we feel uncomfortable. And it's interesting, I don't know, you know, if you remember me super well from on the mission, but I used to swear like a sailor. And this is terrible to say, but like, I used to swear like a sailor even while I was in Chile. And I was dealing with a lot, like my dad was, you know, my dad was like, had, was going through cancer and he had passed away. And I feel like a lot of the ways that I kind of like masked that was just by swearing, you know, I was like, oh, like, it's just one of the ways I let out frustration. Right. But it sounds terrible. Like I was a cursing missionary. Right. But, but then when I moved and when I got back to BYU, um, I kind of had, I still kind of kept some of that identity and I hung out with some friends that were big avid swears and stuff like that. But when we moved to Georgia, nobody knew who I was. So I kind of had the opportunity to kind of reset. I had the opportunity to just be with people that had no idea who I was. And I can't say that I'm perfect in that category now. Like, I still do swear occasionally, but it's like occasional. It is dramatically less than when I did before. And quite frankly, a lot of the reasons I think I swear is just because I hang out with some people. That swear, you know, but it's interesting. And I just, I just point that out because I think within the church, sometimes when we're trying to be better, we're going to be like, oh, well, they're, they're trying to be a Peter priesthood. And it makes us feel uncomfortable sometimes when people are really trying to live out their dreams and their faith and their fitness. And, um, just some thoughts, man. Yeah.

Because no one wants to change. Like, we all like doing exactly what we're doing, and we also want to believe that what we're doing is the best that we could possibly be doing. And that's, yeah, almost literally never true at all. Um, but we don't— if someone else decides that, hey, I'm, I'm gonna take this more seriously, um, and I'm gonna, I'm gonna set some boundaries for myself and I'm gonna start living that, if we, if we start tearing them down for it, it's a clear indication that there is something wrong with us and that we notice, whether consciously or subconsciously, we notice that there is a, there is a distance between us and the sublime, between us and our, and the ideal, between us and the savior. And we don't want to acknowledge that. So anyone who gets any closer, we're going to tear them down too. Like, they're climbing the ladder, we're going to pull them down. And like, we, you know, maybe, maybe we've never even tried, um, and maybe, and maybe that's part of the reason why is we just, we've never gone out of our way. We've never put forth more effort towards a specific thing. Or maybe we've kind of started up the ladder a little bit, but then it was, we seemed like it was really hard. We couldn't focus, we didn't set goals properly, whatever. And we just backed down. We're like, I know, I like being down here. It's fine. It's all good right here. I don't need to make any changes.

Yeah. Cognitive dissonance is something that we can experience is when we, when we, when we feel like we ought to be doing something, but we're not. And it's like we can lash out and be angry. Um, but it goes, it goes back to that, that concept of like, if someone, if we, if, if we're lashing out for some reason, maybe we're hiding an insecurity. Maybe we are doing that. And so I think, and you know, to leave this on like a positive, like to be on a positive note here is just, I think it's simple awareness. Is like, I guess, what, what steps could we give people, or what tangible things could we give people to help them change their identity and to help them challenge maybe some of these negative thought loops that are going on in their head? First one that we've spent a lot of time on is, who do you spend your time with? Like, if, if, uh, I know a big thing nowadays is like vaping, or, you know, stuff like that. If you're trying to quit vaping and you hang out— your closest 4 friends are all vapers. They're not bad people. If that's just— it's just, if that's not something that you want in your life, limit your time with those, those people that are doing that. Um, like, it— and it's the same applies if you're doing something good. Like, if you're hanging out with people that are doing things that you want to be doing, eventually you could, you could pick up some of those habits just by osmosis, I would say. Yeah.

Um, or just seeing the way that they— seeing the way that they, they view the world. You know, like we were talking about being in, you know, when we first stepped into the door-to-door sales industry, you start to be— it might be the first time that you've met anyone who is— who thinks bigger than you do. And yeah, maybe that's what, you know, if you spend even just a little bit of time with them, it's going to change the way that you see the world. And yeah, and I know I was kind of framing it in a really negative way of like, well, if we're tearing the people— if we— if we're tearing the people around us down, then that means that we recognize this distance between us and the ideal and we know it's true, I think. Yeah, but, but the positive spin on that is that you are capable of making the change. It is entirely within your possibility and also it's your responsibility to do it. So if you can take responsibility for that and to just decide for yourself, you know, this isn't like, yes, there are probably a billion different reasons why I am where I am today, and most of them are probably not my fault. But if I stay here, it will be my fault. So why don't I try to take charge of my own life and lead it in a direction that I want it to? And you can do that. You can absolutely do that. And the first, the very, very first step is to recognize the areas in which you are lacking and that you could make change on. And if you come out and you come out and you say like, I've recognized every area where I could improve but it's all out of my realm of possibility. It's like it's outside of my control. I am 100% a victim of my circumstances. Then I think you need to think harder. I think you need to look harder and it might require some bigger sacrifices. It might mean you need to, you need to stop hanging out with certain friends. It might mean you need to cut some relationships off. But if you really, really want to get to where you like to, if there's a goal that you want to obtain, a different life you want to be living, then you've gotta, you've gotta evaluate what things you can be doing right now to move yourself in that direction.

Yeah. A couple, couple things is like, of all people that can talk about this, man, like one of the, one of the things that I, um, I'll just use like one of the, one of the, I'll just use the word admire. One of the things I admire about you is like my friend, man, is like you have, if you were to be like, oh, if you wanted to be a victim, you could come up with so many excuses, right? You could be like, oh, well this happened with dad and you know, I, we didn't have the best start or like, we didn't have the best family life while I was on my mission, and therefore that affected me. And, and there, it's just all about the spin. You talked about putting a positive spin on things. It's all about the spin that we have on things. It's all about the perspective that we have on things. And that's one of the things that I love about you, man, is that you have chosen to, to change that, change the narrative. What I think a lot of the, a lot of times is a default of like, I am a victim of what's happened to me. It's like, no, like you've, you've decided not to do that. And I think one of the things that's cool about this, man, is, you know, both of us have our father figures aren't in our lives right now for different reasons, but it's cool, man, right now. Cause I feel like it's the first time where like I'm trying to, it's one of the times where like I'm trying to like make, put a positive spin on that and encourage other men to just live great lives. And I think just props to you, man, just for being a good example to me in that, in that realm of just. Even, dude, in our mission, man, like that was the biggest time where like I would look at you and I'd be like, wow, Jared. And dude, I'm sure you didn't have everything in order. You were not perfect. Nobody's perfect. But you were an example to me when we were out in Chile. Dude, it's weird. I get emotional talking about this, but like you were an example to me while we were in Chile of just like, hey, like things can get hard, but it doesn't mean that you just give up. And so, like, it was so cool, man. Like, that's just something I got to point out about you. So thanks. Yeah, I'm grateful for you, man.

I really appreciate it. And I'm so stoked for you this summer, man.

I—

Yeah, I think, you know, you were one of the few people I have in my, in my close circle who, who has big dreams, big, hairy, scary, audacious goals. And I absolutely love it. And it is, it pushes me to think bigger and to be open to the opportunities. And, you know, I would love, I would love to make half a million dollars this year, you know, like, obviously, like, that would be wonderful. But when I, when I hear you say, look, we're on track to do that, if I achieve my goals, I, I don't look at that with, with this, like, jealousy of, oh, I want the monetary success that Austin has. I want you to have it. I want you to have the— I want— because you, you're putting in the work. You are willing to put in the work, and I think that is incredible. And I, I just, I want you to achieve your goals, um, and your dreams. And I think you totally are. I think, I think you are totally, completely capable of doing it. And I think it's going to be just an incredible year for you and your family, and it will have its highs and lows. And, um, and I'm sure we'll, we'll get to keep talking about what those highs and lows are as they're, as they're coming across. But, um, I'm just really grateful to have someone like you in my circle that we can, we can have these conversations and, um, and just put them out there for people to hear. Because, you know, like you said, like, we don't have, we don't have our dads in our lives. And I'm sure there are lots of other people out there— well, I know there are lots of other people out there who also don't have their dads in their lives. Um, And, you know, no, maybe we're not trying to be other people's dads per se. No, we want to have these conversations, you know, like we want to work together to lift each other up and maybe strengthen in an area where people don't have that support. Because, you know, neither of us can look to our dads for advice on being good fathers, on being good husbands, on raising a strong family. Like, we don't have that option. So Aside from having other father figures in our lives, I think the next best option is to have these conversations with other men that, that, you know, we admire and we look, we look up to and, um, and try to push each other upwards and forwards in, in every way that we can. So I just, I love having these conversations with you, dude.

Yeah, well, and I, I think on, you know, to kind of wrap things up too, it's like Jared and I don't profess to be like the dads, you know, definitely not. It's this cool journey that we're kind of taking right now, just, I was just kind of talking about what we're learning and how we're striving to become. And so on that note, if there's anything that you'd want us to kind of chat about or like share thoughts on, just, uh, message both of us on Instagram and we'd love to kind of like pick apart some ideas and, um, but it's a, it's a pleasure to be able to do this, man. It's, it's, it's weird because I have all these other, like, it's not weird at all. I have all these other things I'm doing in life right now with like my career and my pest control stuff. But like, this is, this is up there and the things that bring some of the most fulfillment right now in my life. You know, aside from just being a husband and a father right now, like this is really up there, man. So really grateful that we're able to have this and please share it with any friends or family. And feedback is appreciated. I know we've had people give us some awesome feedback on the podcast itself. Uh, Clayton from, I get from church, thank you, like gave us a lot of feedback.

Thank you so, so much. Yeah.

So any feedback's appreciative.

Yeah. And on, and on Spotify, you can, um, uh, well, please, we would ask you, please leave a 5-star review there on Spotify. And then also at the bottom, Spotify now does, um, uh, questions. You can, you can ask a question right there in Spotify. Oh, cool. Which is really helpful. And then, um, in Apple Podcasts, we would really appreciate a 5-star rating and a review, please reach out. We would love to, um, to get to talk about whatever, you know, whatever things people have on their mind. But, uh, looks like we got to wrap up now. Austin, thank you so much for hopping on this call. And, uh, we'll catch you next time, dude.

Appreciate it, brother.