Should You REALLY Call Them Before The First Date? Here’s My Answer… | Rewind

It's not nice if you're a person on a dating app pretending to be single and then someone starts calling you.

Wow.

And you're with your girlfriend. That's a very inconvenient thing to happen. Now we did have a voice note from Emily Peel, not just telling us how wonderful we are, but posing a challenging question. So here is Emily Peel.

Hi Jams, it's Emily from Melbourne. I'm doing a voice memo because it's relevant to my question, which is for Matt. So a little while ago, Matt I've suggested that we ladies have a phone call with someone we've been chatting to on a dating site to get to know them a bit better. And so I've suggested this to some guys, about 10 of them, and two of them have had a chat with me and the rest of them have either ignored me or completely deleted me. I've now asked the guys I'm currently chatting with, you know, what's the problem with a phone call or a video chat? And they said, oh, well that's very intense. And so now I'm wondering what Matt's thoughts are about that feedback and whether he would stick to his original advice or reconsider. Thank you, appreciate you all the best.

Now, Stephen, I have some thoughts on this because I think this forced me to kind of really sit and reevaluate. I didn't want to just brush this off. I wanted to really think about is there a point here that We might have to go back and revise some of that advice. As a single man, what's your opinion on someone trying to get on a call before a date?

I think it says a lot about where we are as a society that we would rather actually get ourselves out the door, go to a date, have drinks with someone we don't know, a total stranger, than hear their voice on the phone. There's something very odd about that.

Well, let me ask you this. If you met someone in London and you knew that it's you could actually go out on a date with them this weekend, would you, and they said, Hey, why don't we jump on the phone and say hi? Would you then find that intense knowing that you might be able to see them as soon as this weekend?

No, I feel that would give me some comfort and reassurance hearing their voice, how they are on the phone, speech patterns. Do we get on? Is it awkward? that would give me some re- because when you're first going on the date with someone you've just been texting, that is, the fear is, oh no, are we gonna get there and realize there's no real chemistry?

Thoughts, Audrey?

Well, my thoughts are that if, you know, she specifically said guys that she'd met on a dating app, and I think the reason why 80% of men haven't responded well is because to go from talking to someone on a dating app to jumping on the phone, I think can feel a little intense. I feel like it's all about the way that you graduate in communication. So if you go from a dating app, the next organic step feels like adding each other on WhatsApp or getting each other's numbers and switching to text messages. The next sort of organic step after that would be a voice note or a phone call. If you are talking a lot and there's a lot of back and forth and you know that they're sat there texting you, not doing anything because for the next, for the last 20 minutes, that's what they've been doing. Then it makes sense to sort of say, are you free if I call you for five minutes or something like that? I think the intensity comes from not actually having earned the level of intimacy where you would just jump on the phone because I think I can understand how it would feel intrusive. So I think it's not about the phone call being a bad idea, but rather. there being an organic progression towards the phone call.

I think the progression matters. And many apps are encouraging more voice notes now. Like Hinge has a thing where you can leave a voice note on your profile, and a lot of people do that now. So I think, like, warming someone up to, we got each other's number, and I left you a voice note that was 10 seconds on WhatsApp. Then it's like, I've heard their voice. They're a human like me. They're not a weirdo. these things do, you're having little comfort tests as you go. And then picking up the phone isn't such a weird idea.

Yeah, or even, I always think calling someone when you're on the way somewhere and you're just like, Hey, I'm about to join up with friends in a couple of minutes. I just thought I'd say hi while I'm walking. You know, that, I always think that kind of call is much easier even for someone else to receive. For sure, yeah. For you to be like, just at home, what's up? Then there's no time limit on the call. But if you say to someone, Hey, what's up? I have to go in a couple of minutes 'cause I'm meeting up with friends, but I thought I'd just say hi while I'm walking from the station. That then gives someone the relief of, oh, okay, it's just a couple of minutes. And, oh, look, they're busy and they're doing something. So you can have that kind of a phone call. I do think there's a difference between if you know you can meet up for a quick coffee date with someone this week, then there may be no need for the call. And in the past, I have said that I would rather get on a call with someone just to be able to find out, as you said, Stephen, if there is a little bit of something, if we get on, if there's a bit of banter or a bit of, you know, just good conversation. But I also acknowledge that Coffee isn't that time consuming. You don't have to give up a whole evening for a date. You can just meet someone for a quick coffee somewhere. And if you do that, then you don't necessarily need the phone call. I do think what gets weird is when you're speaking to someone that you have no hope of seeing anytime soon, either because they're in a different city or a different country, or they're traveling right now and you're talking to them. But weeks later, you still only texted.

I totally agree.

That seems weird to me.

I think it's weak and odd.

And as Audrey said, a good graduation, a good interim step is if someone is sending you mess, if you've been texting with someone back and forth as a pattern break, send them a voice note back as an answer to one of their questions. be like, hey, what's up? I'm just walking to meet my friends. Basically, I guess I prefer this because blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then you, you answer your question, their question by voice note. It's a pattern break. They're hearing your voice. You stand out to them. You're three-dimensional and you're appealing to another one of their senses. Right? You're hearing, you're appealing to sound, not just or to hearing, not just visually through a text. So that's a nice way of putting yourself on someone's radar and getting them a bit more comfortable with you. If they hear your voice now, that feels you feel more intimate, it feels closer. And then having the call feels less of a big deal as a graduation from that point. You're also, by the way, saying to them, it's also okay if you leave me a voice note. That's the whole point of the word reciprocity in communication. When you do something, you're also giving someone a green light to do that thing with you. So don't be afraid of the voice note. It doesn't have to be the first thing you leave, but a few messages in. If you feel like texting has become a little bit, if there's been a lot of texting, it's a nice way to break the pattern.

And I would like to add as a very small point that I think a phone call is a really good way to build momentum with someone after you have been on a date or a couple of dates because It almost links you up in between those times and it does make the connection feel like it's progressing in the right direction. Because I think when you go on great dates with someone and then you're just texting in between, it can almost slump. And I actually think the phone call at that point is a really useful tool to connect to you and make you feel closer to that person.

I love that point because it can feel like a downgrade. I think if we're gonna evolve this rule at all, It's I think it's what you said, Matt, where it's like, it's not necess I wouldn't necessarily use the phone call as like the testing ground for like, do we get along well enough to go on the coffee date? I think phone calls have become so intrusive. I think just because everyone gets like robo calls now, it just feels like it's not necessarily the greatest feeling when your phone rings. It feels like some kind of obligation. I would say the most important thing is to just earn it. So, like you said, Audrey, transfer from the dating app to the WhatsApp, to the text, to the voice note. And when you leave a voice note, don't feel like, what I wouldn't do is say, in the same voice note, say, Hey, leave me a voice note. It's like, no, no, no, just leave the voice note, let it be. And you have to kind of earn each of those steps. As silly as it sounds, I think.

We kind of have to evolve a little bit with the times. 100%. Don't overthink the voice note either. If it sounds too scripted and too.

Thought out, then it just comes across as a little creepy. Don't George Costanza the voice note. He would like in Seinfeld, George Castanza would like write notes about what he's gonna talk about on the phone on his hands. But yeah, don't George Castanza the voice note.

Well, thank you so much, Emily, for sending that in and for forcing Matt to upgrade and evolved with the times.

Which, hey, I'm always happy to do it. I think what's great about our content is that it grows with us, it grows with the times. It's not stuck in time. that's hopefully where we build trust and credibility with everybody is we're never, never afraid to say we don't agree with ourselves.

Absolutely.

Or as Steve would say, that makes us look weak and we should never capitulate like that.

I've actually, it's funny, I've actually been on many, you know, when I've done dating apps, have mostly not called people, but it's been nice when We have spoken first on the phone, but mostly it has been we just end up going for coffee.

It's not nice if you're a person on a dating app pretending to be single and you have a girlfriend already and then someone starts calling you.

Wow.

And you're with your girlfriend. That's a very inconvenient thing to happen.

I think you're gonna have to explain where that thought pattern came from because it sounded very random.

He's the master of segue.

I was thinking, well, when Emily sent in this voice note, I was thinking, I bet you some of the guys that instantly deleted her had a panic because they had either a girlfriend or they had a little more going on in their love lives than they wanted. They had someone they had the potential to hurt and the last thing they wanted was their phone actually ringing while they were with someone. Thanks for listening. And before you go, if it is a priority for you this year to find your person, I have a practical roadmap for you in a free training I did called Dating With Results. It's a 60 minute training. It is helping so many people right now who are going through it. And you can be one of them by going to datingwithresults.com I'll see you over there and enjoy the training.