The Aftermath of a Love Bomb

Welcome to the Love Life podcast with me, Matthew Ise and my brother, Steven Ise.

Now, have you been watching Ted Lasso? Is that what that is? Are you trying to capitalize on the Roy Kent female fantasy?

That's not Roy Kent.

Oh, isn't it?

That was more, I would say that was more Ray Winston.

All right, I think everyone's going to think you're doing Roy Kent.

No, this is Roy Ken.

I get it in the bloody stick it in the bloody go.

You're talking Roy can't. It's much more like this.

Do you play that up in La when you're getting your coffee?

No, because Roy Kent has a voice unlike anyone else in the world. It's. It's sort. bizarre. It's a bizarre voice, even for an English person. No, I I I don't. I don't ham it up. I forget sometimes that I have an English accent at all.

I guess in La, they're a bit unimpressed, aren't they?

They're over it, Steve. They're over it. If you need. If you want to be impressive with an English accent, you need to go to somewhere, like, you know, Baron and, you know, somewhere. where there's no civilization, like where Jameson's from. Sacramento.

Great, you said it.

I was gonna try to defend Orangevale, but then I realized your accent when murder in Orangevale.

So, yeah. I'd kill it, mate. Yeah.

Yeah.

But then they all think I'm Australian. Steve, I get Australian all the time here. I don't, they think I'm Australian more than they think I'm English.

Yeah, I can see that.

You know what I like to what I like to gauge it off of is who stars as the leading man in these, these movies clearly written for women. And there's a, there's been a streak for about five years where it's just always either an Aussie or an English guy or a New Zealander, just never an American guy leading for, like, there's always an American woman and her biggest love interest is going to be Some non-American man.

Exotic, in it. Or it's a Brit, it's exotic being from Graze London. It's suddenly become an exotic thing.

Or it's a Brit playing an American, like Jamie Dornan in Fifty Shades of Grey. I think he's Irish, but you get the point. It's like British Irish Aussies playing Americans if they're going to use an American accent.

So go figure. And you know what? I think we're okay with that. I think we're quite We're quite comfortable with that as Americans.

We gotta get we gotta get something, mate. It's the land of opportunity. We gotta come and stake our claim, haven't we?

Well, Steve, we've had an email in.

Go on, Matt. Is it from Sacramento? I hope not.

No, don't worry. Nora, who sent in this email, is definitely from somewhere else. She says, I have followed Matthew's work for about five years on YouTube and had no idea about the podcast. so I was delighted to discover the brotherly love life team during lockdown. I want to say a huge thanks to Matthew for his ever positive, funny and kind words. He has a great source, or he has been a great source of comfort and a voice of reason during a really tough few love life years, and he'll probably be seeing me through the next few. The podcast is awesome, and I love all the random ramblings on about stuff like Steve's bath snacks, You do you, Steve. It's lovely to have met Steve this way. I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels like part of the family at this stage. Huge love to you guys. Now, Steve, she says that she loves all the random ramblings.

Thank you, Nora.

And, well, she mentions your bath snacks, but we haven't actually brought up your bath snacks in quite some time.

For new listeners, I spent quite a bit of the pandemic having two hour long baths every day in which I would take a handful of tangerines, a bottle of water, a cup of black coffee, and a copy of the Economist magazine.

Like it was some sort of Christmas dinner he's eating in the bath.

Now, Steve, are we to believe that you didn't have any bathroom breaks with that big old cup of black coffee in the bath for two hours?

No, I did.

You're telling me that you got out of the bath to go to the toilet. I don't believe you.

That happened occasionally, yeah. I'd never went- you- got out of.

The bath, dried off your little arse, and went to the toilet. You're trying to make us believe that.

Well, I didn't sit in my own urine, if that's what you're implying. No, I didn't sit and do a toilet in the bath. But I would, if sometimes if you're using, you're peeling oranges, you just dip your hands in the bath to wash them after. after you've been peeling oranges.

So you're sitting in your own finger bowl.

Exactly.

Yeah.

And I don't believe. I love how you try and make it past tense. Like, during the pandemic, I used to take two hour baths. You haven't. I've seen you when I come home. You still disappear for hours on end to the bath.

That's it.

Doing whatever it is you do up there.

If I go home to mums, I do. I take advantage of the bath. a bit more. Yeah, that's true.

Yeah.

Well, thank you, Nora.

But we've all got a ways. Thanks, Nora. Thank you, Nora.

That's lovely. If you want to email in, email podcast@matthewhussie.com. all stories, questions and thoughts are welcome, including any commentary on Steve in the bathtub. well, Steve, there was just in, in a bit of sort of dating news, did you know that Kevin O'Leary just agreed to a 300 000 shark tank deal for a dating app for cat people?

I have seen that. And clearly Kevin is going for contrarian bets. He's not, he's not getting into the cryptocurrency. fever right now. He's going, no, this is the play now. Cat dating apps.

Because. Because cat lovers are timeless. You're never going to have a world without cat lovers. Crypto may come and go, but cat lovers will always be here. The app is called Tabby, which I think. I think it should have been called cat flap and. And. And I think flap should have been spelt with two P's.

Right, okay.

And it just feels catchier to me.

Yeah, it's a bit like you're going through the, you know, like you are an animal then. Like going a little cat flap to date. Yeah.

But if they're cat lovers, they probably love that.

Yeah, that seems more like a dating app for furries.

But.

Well, the reason this app exists is because the Colorado State University and Boise State University asked nearly 1400 heterosexual American women between the ages of 18 and 24 to rate a group of men's photographs, some holding cats and some holding dogs. The study found that men pictured holding their cats were viewed as less dateable. So what do you make of that, Steve?

Well, it's a great thing to get them on a dating app then, isn't it, since they're doing so well. It's really...

I like the idea that this is born out of such a negative idea that we're going to take people who have in this study shown themselves to be less datable and put them all together in one place so that they're not bothering anyone on these other apps.

Yeah, women don't seem to like these men. Well, yeah, that's it, isn't it? I've seen this before in several articles how men holding cats is apparently, I get the cliche is that men holding dogs, men cynically sometimes hold a dog because the women love it. And even that in itself has become a little bit of a cliche now. But apparently men holding cats, it's the opposite.

Why doesn't it work with cats?

Oh, yeah. What is that? Is it that cats are- you- love a cat, Steve. I like cats and dogs. I don't think I'm one or the other specifically.

I thought I did.

You've always had a soft spot for cats, haven't you? I think I used to like them more when I was younger, and now I'm sort of equal on both. But I do love a little cat. I mean, when they're cute and kittens and- yeah, lovely little things. But I, I don't, I guess it's just the image, isn't it? It's seen as, Is there something seen as unmanly about holding a cat, or is it just that cats are so such a divisive creature where they're seen as aloof and cold and unpleasant in that way?

A cat people wouldn't agree with you on that, Steve.

I don't agree with that, but that's-.

Some people have lovely cats.

I don't agree with that, but that's the personality type. That's what is seen as for cats.

I wonder if it's to do with the fact that you don't take cats for a walk. So, a cat sort of suggests, you know, you could say there's this implication that you don't get out as much with a cat, but if you've got a dog, then you might do manly stuff like go on hikes and get out there and be in the world and do things, whereas you're not taking your cat for a hike.

Yeah, I think there's something of that, isn't it? Like, you're not doing those macho things. You're not an outdoorsman.

Or actually, you could imagine that that person is just looking for the least possible amount of responsibility. With a dog, you have to be a little bit nurturing. You have to like actually, yeah, you have to take ownership of, okay, well I am going to walk this thing at least once a day. I got to make sure, feed it at a certain time of day with a cat, you know, just throw in some food, throw in a kitty litter.

I'll see you next week. Can we get the women listening? I know we have men listening too. Can we, maybe we should get some views from both sides. Men, do you find it unattractive? Does it bother you if a woman has a cat? And ladies, why do you think this study showed that men who held cats are less dateable? Why do you think, assuming this study even has any validity, Steve, but why do you think it could be a phenomenon that women find men holding cats Less dateable than men holding dogs. Oh, by the way, send in your responses to that question to podcast@matthewhussie.com so.

Here'S my question, Matt. Do you think people connecting on one mutual interest, does that help with matching at all? It's kind of like that movie cliche of we have so much in common. But it's only one thing.

Well, I think that you can sort of like I've always struggled a little bit with the idea of someone else having an animal. Only not because I don't love animals, because I genuinely do. But I just never got one because I didn't want, I wanted that freedom of being able to travel and not have to constantly think about coming home at a certain time of day to feed a dog or whatever. And I'd sort of, it would scare me to invite into my life someone who had all of those responsibilities that meant that now, if I fell in love with that person, they sort of would be mine too, because they would have an effect on me. So I think that if I were to reverse that and say, part of the reason to have a place where people can meet that have something in common like that is they understand each other. They're not gonna. There's one less hurdle to get over in helping someone understand what life is like with a dog, because they already have one or they already have a cat, so they get it. I think there's possibly some friction to be eliminated by putting yourself in a pool of people where they get it. The other argument is if you have a dating app that just gives people a way in to conversation, right? That if you make a Lord of the Rings dating app, not a bad idea, Lord of the flings, it was what it would be called, and it would be for Lord of the Rings fans. That would be just a way in. It's just like, hey, you didn't know what else to talk about. Here, start on Frodo.

See, I wonder if it's more like, do you do the... Is it the purpose of it that there's some things that you're so into that it's a part of your identity? And that's the real difference, isn't it? Because some things you can have, I love Lord of the Rings, you love Harry Potter more, I wish you loved Lord of the Rings, but we're going to get on anyway. It's not a deal breaker. But for some people who love, love, love pets and specifically cats, it might be for them like it's such a big part of my identity being a cat lover that I just want to meet other cat lovers. I don't want to meet a dog person. I don't want to meet a no pets person.

Well, that is sort of the idea, isn't it, behind religious apps? Right. But apps based in religion is that for a lot of people that I just don't have any interest in meeting someone that is not from the same faith as me. Right. So that's just off the table and this just makes it far easier to find my pool of people. I suppose what we're saying is that cats are like a religion.

Well, I mean, in the UK, UK is obsessed with dogs and pets in general, and you live in LA, Matt, and people bloody love their pets in LA. So it basically is an identity for a lot of people.

What this, to me, brings to light in general is that there might be, we all have these preconceived notions of what it is we want and what we don't want to have to deal with. and they can dictate a lot of our dating life. Me, for example, saying, I've got no interest really in being with someone who has an animal, right? That to me, like my girlfriend just said to me the other day, she was like, I thought of getting a dog when I was 25 and I thought, oh, thank God you didn't, because we're like six years on now and it could have been, That could have been in my life at this stage, six years on, that could, that would have been still alive.

I've often joked with you, Matt, that nearly every girlfriend I've ever had at some point has brought up us getting a dog.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've experienced a lot of that, and that's, I mean, talk to Audrey now. She wants a dog. But we've had that conversation, and it's, we'll do it in 50 years. The point is that we all have things we think are our criteria. And I have come to believe, I've been humbled enough times, Steve, to realize that what I think are my criteria are rarely my actual criteria. That we come up with all of these constructs of what we must have. And what our heart actually needs is often much more simple than we ever give it credit for. And when we go out there and constantly exclude people based on these things that we think we must have or definitely don't want, we're actually excluding a lot of people that could bring an extraordinary amount of happiness and connection into our lives. People we could have a wonderful relationship with just because of our preconceived notions. And we could do that. A woman can do that with height. A man can do that with a woman's age. We've had, I've coached people where they're, I know they're doing it on religion. And I don't mean even necessarily, Steve, that they're not entertaining people outside their faith. I mean, I've coached people who have decided how much faith a person in the faith that they're in has to have, and just how rigid that person has to be in their beliefs. So now they're not just saying, I want someone from my own faith. They're saying, I want someone from my own faith who's just as strict about their faith as I am. And I always wonder if. If that's just a sort of another. Another way to be unavailable, if it's just another way to not entertain people that could actually teach us something or that we could teach them something. Part of the beauty of a relationship is that we get access to. To worlds and things we don't know. You know, you don't want to. Why do you want to date? someone who's exactly like you. You know, that to me, this seems to me something incredibly boring and stagnant about that. Dating someone whose values are aligned with yours, but who has made some different choices, to me, is part of the richness of combining your world with somebody else's in a way that enriches your own and theirs. And that's what I think is the danger of criteria based apps. is they assume that we're an expert in knowing what we want and don't want, and I don't think that we are.

One counterpoint I will say is you might, I'm a book lover. I don't have certain things I hinge my identity on, like a hard political stance or, you know, religious stance, but, like, I am a book lover and I would need, I don't think I could properly be in a serious relationship with someone who doesn't love reading.

Oh, Steve, you're going to eat those words, mate.

Why is that?

You're going to eat those words.

What, you think I'll date someone who's never read a book?

Or what if she really likes podcasts?

I don't count that as reading, Matt. I say I'm very passionate about books and reading, and that's something that's a deep value to me.

And what if you sit there on your couch, it's a Sunday, you're sitting there on your couch reading your little book and she's next to you and she's popped on her headphones and she's listening to her favorite podcast that's no less intellectual than the book you're reading. She's just taking her information via a different medium.

I'm not sure I really believe in that, but, you know, I heard.

I heard Steve's. Steve's head nearly popped when you said, no less intellectual than reading.

I just don't. I just don't believe it, Steve. I don't. I. I think that what you need is someone who stimulates you. intellectually and you can connect with in conversation about all sorts of different subjects. And that's the true thing that you need, not someone who reads books.

I would say reading is a necessary but not sufficient criteria. I'm not saying books and that's it. I'm just saying I think I think I would have to be with someone who reads books. I don't think that's big. That's not some high, that's not some demanding unicorn I'm after. A person who reads books.

That. That. That's like saying I. I have to have someone who has a cat.

But pet lovers, I. I can get the idea. They might want someone who. Who loves pets. They might have to love cats. If you're someone with six cats and you love cats, you might need someone who loves cats. Well, right.

I. You're. All you need is someone who respects how much you like books and doesn't mind you sitting there reading and they make. Can keep themselves busy while you do your reading. And they're more than welcome to. They're more than open to entertaining the conversation about. book you're reading. I think that's what you need. I don't think that's going to matter to you. I think that's one of those things. And I've done this with plenty of things in my life where you've convinced yourself it matters. But if you met the ideal person tomorrow, I don't think it would matter to you how many books have you read in the last year.

Jameson, whose side do you weigh on this?

I think it's when I was your age, Steve. I love doing that. I don't know what the age difference is, like three years or something, but I'm on Matthew's side on this. I've actually become way more open-minded on this front. And what Matt is saying, from my understanding, is that there's always a level deeper. So it's not like your app, Steve, would be Respects intellectualism. Like, that's what's underneath.

I'm not saying... Your app would be called Bookups.

I'm not saying you're saying, like, I've.

Made such a big demand.

Nothing, Jameson? I was laughing, but my mic was.

Off, but Bookups is good. Bookups is good. I'm good at coming up with app.

Names, is what we're learning. You should go on Shark Tank, mate. But you're acting like I'm saying such a highfalutin thing, like, oh, she better have read Moby Dick. I'm just saying someone who likes books. It's not that big a thing.

I know, but there's something in your point that I'm glad Matt is pushing back against, which is like, if you're too dogmatic going into it, and I get it, books is a low bar, I suppose, but actually, I think people read a lot less than people say they read in general. I know you read a lot.

Of a hundred people that say they read. one does.

Kind of.

Yeah. They, they, they pick up a book, they read a page, and then they go and watch their favorite Netflix show or they listen. How many people these days say they read a lot, but they listen to, to, you know, audible a lot.

Yeah.

That's me. I read a lot, but it's listening to audio.

I, I listen to audible, but, yeah, I, yeah, I like Netflix as well. I just. I don't think I'm asking for a lot there.

All right. Well, look, I, for one, will be looking out for someone who reads a lot on your behalf.

Your girlfriend reads books, Matt.

She does.

So, made you look like a fool, haven't I?

I don't think that was the point, but, Anyway, I think this was interesting. If you've got any suggestions for great apps, let us know podcast@matthewhussie.com, but don't you dare send it in if you haven't got a pithy name to go with it for that app. Well, before we go any further, Steve, I would be remiss if I did not point out to everyone that, well, A, we have a virtual retreat happening in March for those of you that have not signed up yet. And B, there is a Christmas special going on for the virtual retreat. And what that means is there's a bit of a discount for Christmas. We want you to give yourself that gift. This is a month where you're taking care of everybody else. It's a month where you're worrying about presents for everybody, making everyone else happy, all of the responsibilities you have to show up for other people. You are people. You're a person and someone needs to show up for you. And who better than yourself? This is a chance to get yourself the greatest Christmas gift you could possibly give yourself. The gift of your growth in 2022. The virtual retreat is a three day immersive coaching experience that doesn't just focus on one area of your life. It's about transforming every area of your life so that you can get the most out of this precious thing that is life. We're not here for very long, are we? We want to make the most of it. We want to be as happy and as peaceful as we can be. And of course, we all want to reach our full potential. That's what the virtual retreat is all about. It's not only about creating the success you want on the outside, but it's also about creating the relationship with yourself that makes you happy on the inside. And that's the most important work you can possibly do. There are no shortcuts in life. We have to do the work on ourselves in order to be happy. And the things that plague us, the things that make us suffer, the things that make us unhappy, they don't just fix themselves. We have to go in there and fix them. And that's the work that I am going to be doing with you live for three days during the virtual retreat. Of course, you can do it from anywhere in the world. You can do it from home. It doesn't matter where you are on the globe. We're going to have people coming in. Last time we had 54 different countries represented. We want to represent you too. And for the Christmas special, not only do you get a discount, but you also get a bonus package of New Year tools to get you started with an amazing January. So it's not just about waiting until March for the live event, but also these things that are gonna get you going immediately. So in January, I'm gonna be doing a week of what I call one great hour. where every day we get together for an hour to focus on our goals together. This is literally a time where for an hour we sit down and we work together like study buddies across the world. You'll see me on camera, you'll have an hour to just focus in the company of other people and myself who are doing the same thing. That accountability changes the game. So we're gonna have one great hour every day the second tool you're going to get is a masterclass that I am going to do on creating a great day. So I'm going to show you what my structure is that I follow every single day to master my time management, my productivity and my mind. I'm going to show you the rituals that I go through. There's three specific rituals I do every single day. that I am going to show you. And I'm going to show you my system for organization that allows me to do as much as I do in a day while still maintaining a healthy mindset. So I'm going to show you all of that in the one great day tool. So you have one great hour. That's going to be a week in January. We're going to do one great day. I'm going to do a masterclass with you to show you how I do my day every day. And you can take from that what's useful to you. And lastly, there's going to be a Q&A in the first quarter of the year with me where you can bring me the things you're struggling with in your life right now. That's a bonus all for joining the virtual retreat in March. So none of those things are the main event itself. They're just extras that you get when you grab the holiday package for the virtual retreat. All you need to do to get it is go to mh virtualretreat.com and grab your ticket now while it's still December. The offer ends on December the 23rd because we want to give all of our team a break so it doesn't run till the end of the month but until the 23rd this offer stands. Go grab your ticket at mhvirtualretreat.com.

We.

Had a topic that we wanted to get into today, which is love bombing, a big topic because a lot of people suffer the effects of being love bombed. Shall we just briefly talk about what this phenomenon is?

Blow it up, brother.

Love bomb or a love bomber is someone who comes into your life and immediately has an incredible intensity. about them. They shower you with praise and attention and affection and maybe even something that looks like love. They want your time, your energy. Maybe they do things very quickly like introduce you to family. Maybe they immediately give up their whole week. They want to see you every single day. They want to know where you are all the time because they miss you. It is someone who is very grandiose in the beginning. You may even feel in the beginning with this person like the pace of it makes you slightly uncomfortable. You enjoy the affection of it, perhaps. It is very flattering. Maybe it even makes you feel very loved. But underneath all of that, something about it makes you feel uneasy. Because it feels like this amount of love, attention, affection, this level of feelings, this intensity, cannot possibly be organic. So, Stephen, many people have experienced this with somebody. And the reason it's called love bombing is because someone comes in and drops this bomb, but then they disappear just as quickly when they're done. And that's what so many people experience, is the pain of feeling like they had something that was so intense and felt like it was so important and it really felt like it was going somewhere very quickly. And then as quickly as that person came in and showered you with that affection, they disappear. so what do you think about this, Steve? What, what, what do you think that people need to hear about this? Who have either suffered from it or don't want to fall prey to it?

I think the first thing for me, and this is a topic that's always strange for me because I don't think I understand the psychology of guys who do this. And maybe you can Enlighten me. Like, why would a guy Is it ego? Why would a guy shower someone with tons of attention and pronouncements of love and lavish them with attention if they didn't want to actually be with them?

Well, I think there's a generous interpretation of this and also a less generous interpretation. And I think that they're not always the same person. So, if I were to take the most egregious kind of love bomber, it would be someone on the spectrum of narcissism somewhere who really enjoys someone falling in love with them. They want to come in and make you fall in love with them as quickly as possible because that's where they get their validation. That's what makes them feel good. So, it was never really about loving you. It was about overwhelming you so much with their affection and how wonderful they are that you fall for them immensely and they now feel validated. And once they feel validated, once they feel like, ah, I did it. I made them fall for me. Look how wonderful I am. It's confirmed. They can then move on.

But see, like, I'm human.

That's one person.

I'm human. I like that attention. I like that validation. And I totally get that. It's nice when people are attracted to you. But maybe this is my own avoidant tendencies coming out. But I would be worried if I go too far in over lavishing someone who I'm not that into with attention and stuff, they're gonna feel really attached and it's gonna be really messy. to get out of that. And, you know, if I suddenly change my mind or if I decide this isn't the one for me, I now have created this scenario where they think we're in love and we have something special. And I think, oh, God, I'm really in it now.

Well, I think you're being unkind to yourself there, Steve, because I think that that's a sign of having a moral compass. Because for those without a moral compass, they don't see it as a lot of work to extricate themselves from that situation. They just say, I'm never going to text them again. I'm just going to disappear. I'm now going to ghost them, essentially. Because that's not something that you would ever default to, because you realize that for you, extricating yourself from something like that means carefully untangling it in a kind way. and you know the amount of work that would take, you don't want to put yourself in that position in the first place. But someone, a lot of people don't have your, that, that moral compunction that you would have in that situation. But that, that's one kind of person. And I say it's the most egregious kind for exactly that reason, because they have no conscience about disappearing as fast as they came into your life. The second kind of person is someone who it really enjoys the idea of falling in love. You know, they they it's not it's not just about them being loved by you as a way to feel important. They truly enjoy that feeling, that high, because falling in love is this. It's a drug, right? It's a literal drug. So I'm. I'm going in to enjoy the high of that drug, not to build something sustainable when it gets to be real effort, when it gets to be that I actually have to. put some work in, some structure, when I have to wake up and continue to put in effort with this person to love them. And the high in that same dizzying way is no longer there. The drug has worn off to me and it doesn't feel how I think it's supposed to feel anymore. So then I move on and that suggests Not it certainly can suggest a kind of selfishness still, but it perhaps more so suggests an immaturity and an unevolved perspective when it comes to what a relationship actually is. So for that person, I would argue if we could broadly say the first person shows narcissistic tendencies, the second person shows a tremendous amount of immaturity and lack of awareness about what a relationship actually is. Yeah. And then I think you have the third category of people. There's a Chet Baker song, Steve. I fall in love too easily. I fall in love too fast. I fall in love too terribly hard. for love to everlast. And when I hear the lyrics of this song, I hear the third person. And the third person is the person that immediately projects onto someone everything that they want in their ideal person. As soon as they feel a hint of chemistry, they immediately start to take the five percent they know about someone and fill in the other 95% they don't know with their fantasy. What's the movie Jameson? Weird Science? Is that where the guys, the two geeky guys build their dream woman as a computer, you know, as a robot, you know, and they design what they think is their dream woman. well, I think that people do that, right? They, they design in their head their dream person based on the small amount they know about someone, and they fall hard and fast for that projection. And then when someone doesn't live up to the projection, because how can they? They now feel like this must not be the right person after all. And this is still a kind of lack of awareness, perhaps a kind of relationship immaturity. And it's a lack of understanding, I believe, of how so many people who come to be in strong relationships actually end up in strong relationships. This idea is kind of born out of this societal myth of love at first sight.

Yeah.

Is it kind of shiny object syndrome? Shiny new object syndrome?

Well, I, I think it can be, but in a way, that falls a little bit into the second category. Right. That I, I'm, it's exciting as long as it's exciting, as long as it's the drug High. But I think in the third category of people, the projection, it's. It's about that love at first sight myth that I'm supposed to meet someone and be absolutely bowled over by everything that they are instantly. And that's the indicator of whether how much potential this has and whether we're going to go the distance. And that's incredibly dangerous because anything that feels that good that fast has the potential to let us down. because so much of it is based on emotion. It's not based on true compatibility because we can't possibly seek true compatibility at that stage. But in addition to that, it's neglecting, and I think a lot of people genuinely don't understand this about so many couples. It's a lack of understanding that love grows. Love doesn't start. Love grows. You find someone who you feel is worth going on another date with. Not someone who, from the first time you meet them, keeps you up all night because you're like, I can't stop thinking about them. That's the thing to be suspicious of. That, because now you're probably basing their value on something that's not real. Love grows. When you find someone that you think is worth going on another date with, you're giving love a potential, the potential to grow. And the more you connect with someone, and the more you invest in them, and the more you tease out the wonderful hidden parts of them, and they do the same for you. The more you come to realize what an incredible human being this is and what an incredible partner this could be. And of course, you. It's hard if you start with absolutely zero chemistry, if there's not even a basic attraction there at all, that's hard. But having a basic kind of attraction for each other. It isn't the same as I can't eat, I can't sleep, I can't breathe without them. I immediately, I left the date and I just, I can't wait another day to see them again. That's the dangerous part. Love grows over time, and that's something that the third kind of love bomber doesn't appreciate because they feel like if it's not immediately the most compelling thing in my life. It must be a sign that I'm not that into this person. And. And that is the love at first sight myth.

Yeah.

If it's not roller coaster, then I'm not having the high. So something's wrong.

I think there's one other category of guy that I think. I think you haven't slotted in yet, Matt. and you know, like, there's the. I think there's the stereotype of just, oh, single guy. A single guy. We all know what that single guy is like. He's this player type. He's, like, out there playing the field, meeting lots of people. And in general, I think that's a very small percentage of guys. More likely, someone you meet is going to have been in a couple relationships. for a while that didn't work out. And so now this guy that's newly single, he probably doesn't know how to be a player, but he knows how to be a boyfriend. And he knows like, well, if I'm trying to, when I was trying to impress my girlfriend, I would have done this. I would have done this. And he starts kind of acting innocuously, or at least without bad intentions, kind of like a boyfriend. And that's just how he's sort of binary. Like that's his one default. That's his one default move. I can kind of dangle this sort of idea that I'm a good boyfriend material in front of you as just me making a good impression. And that can and then if he discovers maybe he doesn't want anything more, then he's like, -oh. I didn't have Steven's foresight to know that this was going to work. but I'm not that interested. And now I've just love bombed.

Yeah, that's really interesting.

Yeah.

And I think that guy can also be the kind of guy that because all they know is being in a relationship, there's kind of find a relationship at any cost mode. And so they're not necessarily truly evaluating whether the person in front of them is right for the relationship. they're just putting wanting a relationship ahead of anything. So they go in hard and fast and to love as intensely as possible. But then if they ever stop to catch their breath and actually evaluate whether it's right, they may find out it's not. But like you say, they've just exercised all of their boyfriend tools immediately because it's all they know.

Yeah.

And maybe it's just they wanted attention. And this is literally the only tool in their toolkit that they had available. They didn't know how to be suave. They didn't know how to do all these other things that those other cool single guys are doing. They're just default love bomber.

They didn't know how to have a different intensity.

Yeah.

Or a lower intensity. And I suppose that's a good juncture because people may say, well then, my God, how do I, you know, Do I have to sit there and try and decipher which one of the categories that you've just said someone falls into? No, you don't. You don't. The answer is actually very simple for you when you're in the early stages of dating. The first is be distrusting of.

Any.

Situation that has reached a kind of unsustainable level of intensity. That doesn't mean, and maybe just trusting.

Would you say unearned intensity, like early intensity?

Unearned intensity, but even just an unsustainable level of intensity. I, you know, no, no relationship is going to stay at that crazy intensity. So you may enjoy it. but be wary of it. Be just be careful and understand that you dictate the pace. You don't have to just go along with somebody else's pace, whether it's the narcissist type who is trying to do all of these grand things and take up all of your time and attention because of that reason, or whether it's the person Jameson is talking about who's doing it because they only know one speed. You can dictate the pace. If someone wants to see you every day right now and you've just met them, you can slow them down and say, you know, I make your own decision. I feel comfortable maybe seeing this person a couple of times a week at this stage while I'm getting to know them. You know, I'm not suddenly going to free up every night for someone that I don't know. You can decide that. And when someone does things that perhaps you wouldn't do that soon, because they introduce you to their family and you think, Wow, if I was introducing someone to my family, that would be a big deal to me. Therefore, if I'm being introduced to their family, that must be a big deal to them. Don't assume that something means the same thing to somebody else that it means to you.

Yeah.

Because it may not.

That's a big one.

And that's the danger is when we assume that without them having actually said it, we assume, oh, that must, it's the same as a woman saying, well, if I sleep with someone, that deepens my connection with them. So I wouldn't sleep with someone unless I was ready to deepen my connection with them. But you should never assume. And I know so many women who get, we coach so many women, who get in trouble because they assume that sex means the same thing that it does to her. And in some cases it does, but in a lot of cases it doesn't. They have a different association with what sex means. Assuming that whatever is happening right now is something they've attached the same meaning to as you have is a recipe for unmet expectations. that's why we have to bring conversation into the mix and talk about these things. Be willing to have the conversation. So, number one, be wary of a pace and an intensity that's unsustainable. Number two, don't assume something means the same thing. Oh, and I should say for number one, you be willing to set the pace. So, number one, be wary. of a pace and intensity that's unsustainable and be willing to take the pace back. You can dictate the pace, even if they're trying to speed it up. Number two, don't assume something means the same thing to somebody else as it does to you, just because someone's doing something that feels intense to you. It may not be intense to them. It may be what they do all the time. And number three, measure consistency over intensity. It's easy to think that because somebody is being grandiose in their actions, because they're being intense in their actions, that that must be a portent for things to come. We have to say no, no matter how good this feels, no matter how exciting this appears, and no matter how dramatic their words and their actions seem to be. I have to stay very grounded and measure consistency of action, of words, of behavior over intensity in someone's words and actions and behavior. Suffice it to say that love bombing is, I think, Steve, possibly one of the great red flags of early dating that people should watch out for. And we know that you love anytime we talk about red flags because there's always a huge amount of discussion anytime we bring up the subject of what are red flags. And I suppose, Steve, that's because no one wants to waste time. No one wants to waste time unnecessarily, especially when they're looking for something serious, and especially when they feel like they don't have all the time in the world to find something. serious. And no one wants to go through unnecessary pain and suffering by finding themselves in a situation where they're now emotionally invested and they've invested a ton of time and energy and their heart is on the line. And all of a sudden they learn things about someone that mean they're about to get their heart broken or that they're constantly suffering whilst being in love with this person. so for anyone out there who wants to know what are the major red flags, what do I do when I come across them? How do I have the conversation with someone?

And.

What are the amber lights? In other words, if you, if red flags are something you should run away from, Amber lights are an invitation to a conversation. Amber lights are an invitation to actually talk about something with someone that perhaps has made you feel uneasy or something that's made you a bit nervous or insecure. But the difference between an amber light and a red flag is that an amber light is actually an opportunity to build a relationship. Entire relationships are started on the basis of a really productive conversation about an amber light. So if you want to learn more about this, I'm actually running a two hour deep dive masterclass on the 7th of December. and it's going to be live, it's going to be immersive, and we're going to talk all about this. And it's not just going to be a deep dive masterclass where I talk about the things to avoid. I'm actually going to be talking about all of the ways that arguments, disagreements, and differences in early stage dating between you and somebody else can actually be the things that strengthen you. and bring you together. They can actually be the things that are the makings of your future together. That's what's exciting to me. But you have to know them when you see them, and you have to know how to communicate when that opportunity arises to go and discuss an Amber Light with someone. We're going to be doing all of this in this two-hour deep dive masterclass. and you can come and be a part of this as long as you're a member of my Love Life Club. Now, the good news is if you're not a member right now, there's a 14-day free trial, meaning you can actually try out being a member of the Love Life Club for 14 days without paying a dime. Just see if you like it. And the good news for anyone listening to this right now is that the two-hour deep dive masterclass is happening within your free trial. Now, I am saying that with it being the beginning of December 2021. So, if you're listening to this episode late, that offer will have expired, but you can still become a member. But if you're hearing this in real time right now, you can come and experience that masterclass as part of your free trial. So, if you try it and you don't love it, which you will, but if you don't love it, you can always cancel with no fees at all. All you need to do to join is go to askmh.com to sign up for that free 14-day trial and then we'll send you all of the details of how to access the masterclass. And if for any reason you can't access it live, you'll get the replay as well. Go to askmh.com to sign up and you'll also notice on that page you get the chance to ask a question that you would like me to answer in one of the up and coming Q&A private member sessions that I hold in there for my members every month. So don't miss a chance to ask your question and sign up for your 14 day free trial at askmh.com Now, Steve, before we go, we have had a bit of a tradition on the podcast of reading out iTunes reviews. You can go and review us on iTunes at any time. And Steven and I read the reviews. The podcast, well you know this, it's Love Life, the Love Life podcast on iTunes. If you go there you can review us. Our latest review is from Jay Thomas who says, and this is his review of our episode Getting Over your Biggest Regrets. If you didn't listen to that Definitely go back and listen to that if there's something that's causing you pain from your past. This episode has given a lot of people a lot of closure and catharsis and the ability to move on with a clean slate. Jay Thomas says, Guys, seriously, I have been listening to you for a few years now post divorce. This by far was the most moving, eye-opening episode I have come across yet. Thank you, Stephen and Matthew, for your insights, sincerity, and even playful banter that make this podcast so real and applicable. Your approach to being the person you are right now just clicked for me in this episode. It's so apparent that you both care for other human beings and want to help others become the best they can be. That was from Jay Thomas. Thank you so much, Jay Thomas. That means an incredible amount to us. And I think, Steve, you and I were both, I think we both felt moved by that episode, didn't we? The content of that just felt very important.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And thank you for all your messages, everyone, going through things they've overcome and all your lovely words. It really does mean a lot. And, yeah, we really appreciate it.

Well, Steve, this has been a great episode. Thank you so much, sir.

Thank you so much, everyone. And be careful of the old rom-com love bomb.

Be well, guys. Have an amazing day and an incredible week, and we'll be with you again in the next love life podcast.