12: Spirit Animals, Yoga Reaches Out and Finding Your Life's Purpose

Hello, friends, and welcome to Grief Guts and Green Smoothies. I am your host, Melissa Dugalecki, and I am so excited to be here with you all to chat about ways in which we can all get through different adversities, challenges, and loss, and how getting outside of our comfort zone and maybe having a green smoothie or two can help us do so. We will cover different topics, ranging from interviews to recipes to sharing my own stories of my grief journey and the loss of my daughter, Layden. And I'm honored to be able to share her light in hopes of helping you spread yours. Now, let's dive in. All right, Jackie, we are live. You ready for this?

I'm ready. You're always ready. I was born ready for this. No, I'm great.

Warm up question. The title of my podcast, Greek Guts and Green Smoothies. I just need to know what comes to your mind when you hear that.

Well, first, the greens smoothie comes to my mind because I love them. I think it's kind of like a guts and glory sort of statement. When I first think of it, it's kind of like a guts. Like, it takes guts to work through grief, and then there's like, sort of this other nourishing factor of the green smoothie. So I feel like it's a great name. You know, it's like it's both grit and glory. It's both challenging and nurturing, and I think that's essentially how you walk through Greece. You know, I haven't experienced it to the level that you have, but I would say that, you know, it's a masterful way to walk through grief.

I love that. Thank you. And the only other question to ask is, what is your favorite taco?

Oh, that's important. Okay. So lately, I've been really liking fish tv, but I'm a huge fan of fish tacos, especially at this place down in Hoult, Mass. Which is not open yet, but it's this place down in Home, Mass. And it's. I think it's called Daddy's. Yeah. And it's got the best fish taco you could ever have. Oh, it's Hell's Kitchen. That's what it is. Hell's Kitchen has the best fish tacos that you could ever come across in your entire life.

I think I have a rope.

I'm not afraid to say it.

Yeah. This is not sponsored, just for the record.

No, no.

Awesome.

No, it's so good. Good.

Well, for everyone listening, Jackie and I met more recently. Our work has crossed paths in different ways, both in Working in kind of similar fields in terms of supporting people, instructing yoga, doing work for Children's Hospital. And it wasn't until recently we met, and I don't even know if I've ever told you this, Jackie, but about a year ago, a friend, a colleague of mine, said, I'd love for you to come to this retreat in New Hampshire with me. I think it was a retreat or a workshop. I just know that you and the woman running it are, like, connected, like, at the soul. Like, you would just immediately click. And it was you. You were the person running it. And I didn't go to the workshop. I had a conflict that weekend. But we met in our own time, in our own way. And I just love the story and the way that you hugged me. And so I'm taking. Just wondering if you would kind of share what that was like for you.

Oh, it was amazing. I mean, I feel like. I don't even know if after I heard you speak that night, I don't even really feel like I can ever look at you the same again. And it's funny, but trying to figure out why it was so powerful for me when you got up and spoke, because I've been in social work my whole life. Like, I've heard exceptionally sad things, like, most of my life, you know what I mean? So, I mean, it's super sad, you know, what you had gone through, but I just. I couldn't understand, like, why it was hitting me so hard. And I think, a. Because you're just amazing and you're very captivating. And I'm really inspired when somebody stands up there and is passionate and is resilient and, you know, kind of like the, you know, internal Rocky. I really like the underdog. I want people to make it, you know, I want them to survive. I want them to get through. And you standing up there and telling your story and being able to laugh and being able to, you know, really hold the entire room's attention. And honestly, it wasn't that long ago, so I was like, wow, how the hell is she doing this? This is, like, incredible, because I really aim to talk about emotional stuff. I'm not really afraid to go there. Sometimes. It's challenging because as soon as you start to talk about your own feelings, you can start to feel emotional. When you're lecturing, you know, you're standing up there like a blubbering mess. Yeah. You know, so I thought it was really kind of cool also how you were. And even if you were standing up there crying, don't get me wrong, that would still be a sign of strength. So just because you were standing up there talking and you weren't, it wasn't really ruffling your feathers. Feathers. It was more impressed that it was almost like what happened with Layden reached beyond something in you and just created this, like, exceptionally resilient wisdom. And it was like. And I love Mother Teresa for that reason. I feel like she was so resilient, resilient. And there was something about it where I was like, oh, my God. Like, this girl's mission is so far beyond what has happened that she can stand up and talk about it. And it just happened recently. But I think the part that shook me the most is that most of this summer, you know, for about 41 days, I was in Children's Hospital with my niece, Annabelle McDonald, and we were, you know, really kind of feverishly working with China fundraisers for her because at one point, her situation was exceptionally dire. And it still is. She'll never get better, but she is comfortable right now. And she's comfortable because she's able to have her mom as a primary caretaker. A lot of the time we have children's history, which is, you know, such a blessing. Rena was in there a few days ago because she went back in and, you know, there's a guy in there from Washington, and he's there so that his daughter can have her esophagus reattached, and he's going to be here for three more months. And him and his wife switch off. One week. One comes, one week, the other one comes, and I'm like, oh, my God, we're so lucky to have this in our backyard. And so I really feel like a lot of why my niece is here is because we're located here near Children's. But I think it was because for 41 days, I sat in the very scary hell and the very place that I feared so hard. You stood up there and were like, oh, yeah, that place. I'm there. And I just feel, like, that level of helplessness that I visited this past summer, it was almost, like, cool. And even my own child, you know, it's like, of course she's mine. She's my niece. I love her. I'll eat her. And she's obsessed with her. But, you know, I still have, like, a range of helplessness. I haven't even visited yet. And so it was like, you got up there and you were like, oh, yeah, that place. I'm in it. And let me stand up here and Speak very entertainingly and very wisely. And let me, you know, I really love you, to raise my hand and say, I think you're amazing. So as soon as you started to walk away, everybody's, like, giving, like, a little clap. And I know everybody was and probably wanted to jump up and hug you, but everybody was just sort of sitting there, and I was like, I have to. I have to hug you.

And that's when I was like, oh. Like, I had already felt your strong energy in the room when you came in, but, you know, it is. It's not. What I share isn't always easy to receive, and people don't know how to respond. And so it was like, that clap. It was very kind, but I just will never forget how you just, like, stood up, just ball. Like, this ball of glowing energy, and just embrace someone you'd only known for, you know, not even an hour. And since then, we've used the term spirit animal. And I do believe in that. Like, for me, I do believe that we have certain people and souls that we're connected to at a much deeper level in ways that we can't understand at the current state.

I love it. Well, there's a great quote, and it says, when the student is ready, the teacher will appear. Mm.

Yeah.

And I think. Because I just stay scared the whole summer, you know, and I still am. I'm still, like, you know, I'm not, like, on the other side, really, of anything other than. She's not. She's not acutely in there, but I could. You know, she's been back and forth a few times in there, and you kind of brought back to that place and brought back to that place. But for you to, you know, the. What you have navigated, you know, in terms of helplessness and what you've done with it, and right down to a few days ago, running the marathon, it's like, who are you? And so I'm just sitting back and learning. I'm learning a lot from you. And what's really cool is that I spent a lot of time as the teacher, and I feel like you came along at a time when my, like, inner self needed to see that if it happened, I would be okay.

Mm. No, I think.

I mean, but it was like, okay, stop. Stop with this helplessness. Stop with this, this and that. Look at her, you know, and, like, when you feel like you can't. When you feel like you're in that really difficult place, like, I'll close my eyes and think of you, or I think of Laden.

Yeah.

You know, and I just find it so inspiring.

I love that. Thank you so much. Yeah. One of the things I talk a lot about is, like, that I learned from Laden to detach to outcome and attach to process. Because if I had only shown up for her and, like, fearlessly, and I don't even think it's really fearlessly because you're scared, but if I'd only showed up, like, courageously, I suppose, with like, the expectation she was going to be healthy, I would have missed her life and I would have missed so much learning. And so I've learned to really just attach the process of showing up powerfully every single day in whatever our truth is, whatever our reality is, and then just trust that you're gonna be okay. Right. And really attach to, like, feeling good every night by just doing your very best every day. Like, it's not that, you know, it sounds so simple and cliche, but it's really how. How I feel. So.

Yeah, now you. Yeah, it was so. It was so inspiring. So now I love you forever now you could do no wrong. Now you could sing Happy Birthday for the rest of your life and I'd be like, she's so great.

Well, I'm not a great singer, so.

Well, you're really good, Griever, so don't shortchange yourself.

Now, you alluded that your background is in social work. You're a yoga instructor. You're going to be leading at Yoga reaches out, which is unbelievable. A thousand yogis, for those listening who don't know, we'll talk more about it later. But it's a thousand yogis who gather together to raise money for Children's Hospital, but really to share in this incredible energy. And you hold that space so powerfully. So tell everyone listening, like, what do you do and how did you get there?

Yeah, I still think it's kind of funny where I ended up. I never. I mean, yoga breathed so much life into my life that I didn't even see it coming. You know, I'm a social worker by blood. You know, I grew up with a mom who's been committed to other people her entire life in addition to, you know, us. But I've been taught from a really young age. I'm a small piece of the bigger picture. And then I, you know, I can. I can have courage and confidence and drive within myself, but it's really all for not if I'm not pulling other people up one rung of the ladder right with me. So I was kind of raised by a Leader and by a teacher. So caretaking or, you know, broken bird, fixed swing, or, you know, reaching in and getting your hands dirty with society's needs was really something I was raised on. Even my biological father, you know, God rest his father, he was an undertaker. And so he was used to holding space with people who are navigating really, really traumatic things. So I was kind of cut from a cloth, I think, anyways, of people who were social workers just with different occupations or different titles. And so it was a very natural match for me to just go right into that, you know, I studied domestic violence and psychology in school. I graduated from the University of Rhode island and moved out to Ireland and started my social work career in Dublin. And going into the north side of Dublin sometimes and going into. They call it the flats, but it was kind of like the north side of Dublin was a little bit. Was struggling with some challenges around heroin and domestic violence. This was back in, like, 1997, when things were really blowing up. And so I was really exposed in that particular assignment to really the heartbreaking condition of addiction, of domestic violence, of alcoholism, of lack of coping mechanisms. But what it did was it kind of took my heart and made it grow to a level where I had to reach beyond challenging things that people had done, learn to have compassion for them somewhere in there, even though what they had done made me angry and get them to work with me. And so I feel like it made, like I had to have some of the most difficult people. I had to look at them and say, it must be challenging for you, even though they had done really wrong to other people. But if nobody does that, then that person just keeps hurting, Just keeps hurting, Just keep hurting. So it kind of made me reach beyond the layer of heart that I thought I actually had, because I've always been an empathetic and loving person, but really made me reach into people that I want to choke. And being able to step back and saying, okay, I want to choke you, but that's going to get me nowhere. So how can I help you? And what can we do? And in Ireland, I was, yeah, it's not cool. It really was. It was like, okay, I. I feel like social work made me most. Made me more empathetic than anything else, you know, just because I had to reach beyond anger, into maturity and into negotiation and into getting them to do what I needed them to do, you know, for the sake of the child.

What I'm hearing is like, your ability to almost, like, literally take that energy, like, that's on the surface and kind of shelf it like your own energy to be able to reach and connect with somebody. For the greater good. Right. For their greater good. And then for the children as well. But that.

And I think, like, one of the biggest things. Yeah, I think probably like one of the biggest personal hurdles that, you know, you have to get into sometimes when you're working with other people, period. It's just everybody has different wiring and, you know, you're both looking at a situation and somebody's coming at it with, you know, it's like Caroline Ms. Says, we're all walking history books. And it's like you come in with all your wiring and you look at a particular situation, you say, oh, this is. This is. This is how I'm going to react and this is what needs to be done. And I look at the same situation, I said, well, this is how I'm going to react. This is what needs to be done. And we kind of get upset with each other because we measured the world by ourselves and what we would do. And I had to really get myself the hell out of the way and really lower my expectations of people and sort of get over what I think somebody else should do and reach into depth of empathy to say, who am I to say what the hell anybody else could do? My only job is to love them and get them where they need to go.

Especially in my life coaching language, Jackie. I mean, that's the biggest obstacle. You know, I'm a life coach, and I think one of the biggest obstacles I see with other professionals in the field is the difficulty being able to not project how you think somebody should be choosing right onto them and really just say, like, what's the goal? How are we gonna get you there? Like, I love that. So strong.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think the other thing too is, like, when I look at it now, and I wish I had the wisdom that I have now when I did the job, because I didn't handle my stress very well in the job. I have way better balance now with giving or with, you know, being a social worker. But I was like, not. I didn't take care of myself at all. I was eating, like, Snickers bars, smoking Marro reds, you know, trying to handle my stress from the job because I just. I grew up Irish Catholic, so I never really had much of a mind body connection. We don't really talk about anything from the neck down. Yep. So, yeah, so I never really had a mind body connection. I never really thought, oh, well, my stress is eventually going to be my demise or the way I'm eating or the way I'm feeling, or the way I'm reading and acting or running around this place going to be a good long term goal. I just put my head down and did the job that needed to be done. But that's what humbled me into yoga eventually is just like, whoa girl, you got to slow down. And when I finally did, I think what really woke me up, which was like a really beautiful epiphany, is that most people aren't really giving you a hard time, they're just having a hard time. And I think as soon as that I step back and see that, I started to not take things personally. I started to see that people are just having a hard time and it made me look at them and much different way. And then I became passionate about recognizing that. Honestly, just because we hear about somebody having a hard time doesn't mean there everybody in their own way is having a hard time. So why not just treat absolutely everybody with a general prescription of respect and value and graciousness and empathy and understanding. And for the ones who royally confuse you to just kind of pray with your eyes wide open and to just say to yourself, okay, we don't really need to get. Doesn't have to make sense to you. You can just love them anyways.

Yeah, yeah, we're definitely spirit animals. And anyone listening who has been in my life coaching or in my program is probably, probably like, oh my goodness, I wonder if they talked about that. And I just want to clarify. We didn't. So one of the things that I coach is I don't know. Have you read the Four Agreements by Miguel Ruiz?

I'm familiar with them, but I have to go back in. I don't know them. Like, I mean I know what the Four Agreements are, but I don't know like intricacies about that book.

Yeah, so one of a long time.

Ago I read it.

But I like, yeah, one of us just not taking anything personally. Like that's just one of the four ways to live a life of freedom. And I think it's so important I learned it in my grief journey. I wish I learned it sooner. But like to what you're saying is it's not about us. Right. And other people when they are lashing out, I always use the example of temper tantrums. Right. So I see it as like adult versions of temper tantrums. Like they don't have the capacity to identify and express what's going on inside of them. Like what's out of alignment energetically, like, what's what need hasn't been met, whatever it may be. And they throw these almost like adult version of temper tantrums that can be very destructive. Doesn't make them okay. But like you said, being able to look at it, that light kind of compassion and then where you need to. Obviously drawing the boundary. Right. But not allow. Become angry or give all of your energy to why somebody's doing something a certain way, because that's. They don't have the tools in their toolbox right now to do it any differently. So I love that.

Oh, my God. Yeah, Seriously. And I think the other thing that, like, punched me in the face this past summer that I'm still sitting with is that I think a lot of people in life, I mean, as wonderful as the world and as much good as happening and yada yada, but, you know, I think a lot of people think that they just. They internalize everything. They do take it personally. And I think they don't understand that, you know, most of the time, anger or irritation is just coming from some other plate of helplessness that you're spinning.

Yes.

And that anger and rage. I remember Ralph Gates said this to me, you know, at, like, a really pivotal time this past summer when I was really struggling with, I think, rage and anger the most, because I really was, like, ready to give God a wedgie. I really had had it. And he was like, you know, he just. He said, you're just angry. Helplessness is just anger with nowhere to go. And I think when you see. Now when I see somebody angry, I'm like, oh, well, they're just helpless. So then it's like, how can I help you? And that's a way more productive question, I think, sometimes. And, hey, calm down, or what the hell are you getting upset about him? Shut up. You know, like, we could. We could bring ourselves into getting angry. And it's like, wait a minute. If most people are having a hard time and I'm on this path, like a spaceless, loving person, you know, which is the spiritual practice that I try, you know, it's pretty bare bones, then my job is to only step back and to say, how can I help you? Or again, you know, like, see somebody in crisis, even somebody who's screaming, even someone who's out of control, you know, as much as I might not agree with it. And yes, there's a boundary and safety you have to be mindful of, but it's like, wow, you must feel so helpless right now. You must feel so helpless right now. How can. How can I help you? And it's been great with parenting, too, because with my kids, you know, they'll get upset about everything, you know, and then I'll say, okay, well, how can I help you? And that's better than, I can't take it, you know, which I'd have those days, too. So, you know.

But of course, I love that. So you're, you know, you've been literally all over the globe as you've kind of found your way. And, you know, you have so many different roles, and you've held so many different roles, and you've shared how you weren't the epitome of health, right? With your, you know, caffeine, you know, you said you were, I think it was soda or whatever, coffee and running on Marlboro Reds and now, you know, leading yoga. And a lot of the people that I work with feel very overwhelmed. You know, they're, you know, maybe in their 20s, 30s, 40s, whatever it may be, but they feel very overwhelmed because they don't feel like they're aligned in their current career path, but not sure where to go. And also feeling like, well, I signed up for this, so this is where I should be. And I just think you have such wisdom and value to kind of share about how you've navigated that might help these people. So how would you, like, what would you recommend for them in terms of finding their true kind of life work?

Great question. I'm a huge fan of the book the Power of Intention, and it's by Wayne Dyer. And it came into my life around 2005, and it was a recommendation on how to sort of will the life that you want. I was in social work at the time. You know, I was on ulcer medication. I was feeling the shift of wanting to go into yoga. And at the same time, I felt really guilty leaving social work. And it's still a guilt that I have to negotiate with every single day. And I think what it motivates me, me in a weird way in that I feel like there's so much need in the world that I've been exposed to that sometimes the amount of help that I try to give will never be enough. And so that's one thing I have to definitely try to practice with is just sort of never feeling like I'm doing enough or feeling like I'm, you know, being okay with, you know, the guy that finds the one starfish on the beach in a sea of starfishes and throws the one back in the ocean and says, well, I can't help all of them, but I helped that one.

Yep.

You know, to try to like, sort of scale back my expectations sometimes. But I've always been a super hard worker. I'm a hustler. I'm a, you know, I'm a go getter. And I've just kind of always gone from like zero to Oprah with everything. You know, it was like, if I was going to be a social worker, I was going to be standing in your living room and talking in the court. If I was going to play field hockey, I was going to be the captain. If I was going to, you know, if I was going to be a yoga teacher, I couldn't just be a yoga student. I had to be like the teacher of the teachers. You know, it's like I have to take everything, you know, but it's like, so we have like, sort of fiery and this passionate side, and I have spent a lot of my time trying to will things to happen that are beyond my control, trying to make things happen in social work and get people things I need to get them, and then running up against roadblocks and obstacles with that. And, you know, money wise in my life, it was always sort of like, okay, paycheck to paycheck. I live paycheck to paycheck. And that was always sort of my verbiage. Anytime I would talk about money, I was like, oh, it's just so funny that I'm still in my, like, 30s and paycheck to paycheck. And I just throwing that out to the universe. So I was throwing out to the universe an exceptionally busy and exceptionally overwhelmed and exceptionally kind and exceptionally professional but very burnt out person. And it was like, I don't even have the bandwidth to even know what the hell my next move is. I don't even have the bandwidth. I don't even know. I'm just gonna run to like Siberia and live there because I'm overwhelmed and I don't even know where to begin. And he was great in this book, you know, sort of the Cliff Notes of it, where you have to sort of take your power back and realize that you're cut from a pretty creative cloth. You yourself were the size of a Tic Tac and weighed as much as an eyelash. Yeah. And you beat all of these freaking odds, you know, to get here now. And it's like, even. Look at Laden. Like, the odds were stacked against her, I believe, like in utero.

Yeah.

Yes. And she came out and still had like, I mean, you see her in her small, very short, you know, pocket of life, but it's like, oh my God, it's just incredible. So he was saying, you know what, you might feel broken, but you're actually exceptionally powerful. And if you think about an entertainment cloth that you're cut from, it's like, wow, all of this energy that's gone into the creation and the sustaining of me and of you, how can I start to use that? How can I pull some of my power back from underneath the rubble of financial fear of, you know, limited thinking of. Not really. I've always. I like the idea of abundance, but because I'm a hustler and I'm a worker, I could be like 98% universe, but I'm still always like that 2%, like, okay, well, universe here. You know, I was in my early beginnings, you know, kind of blue collar where it was like, you work, you work and that's what you do. And so I never really was in touch with anything about manifesting or using the law of attraction or trying to even talk to the universe. I mean, I'm a white lighter, but I'm feet on the grounder. So it's kind of funny. And for me to be sitting there and saying, okay, I need to co create with the universe. Yeah. And I need to literally start to get all of my thoughts and all of my energy and all of my thinking into what the hell I want to do and who I want to be. Ralph. Who's. If I say Ralph, I always mean Ralph Gates. I love him. And he asked, he asked the question pretty frequently, if you go like on retreat or something with him and just to kind of fit in, who do you want to be and what kind of experience do you want to have?

Yeah.

And I was like really thinking, well, I would love to be able to give, but like also have time for myself. And I would love to be able to, you know, teach some yoga. But I'd like to use yoga as a form of social work because it's not just people who are, you know, who are down and out or people who are struggling with addiction that are, you know, that are having trouble seeing just how big they are. It's the whole friggin world.

Yes.

You know, so it was just really cool to start to see like, hey, wait a minute, I'm going to use this fun little mental trick.

Yeah.

The hard part with Wayne is that he's no joke. You can't doubt anything. And I think our problem is we go to make change, then we doubt the hell out of it and then we sort of talk ourselves out of it or it's just not happening friggin fast enough.

I completely agree. And it's interesting because like as a life coach, that's one of the things, like I tell people you've got to bring patience. Right. And everyone wants change immediately or that fear voice starts kicking in. And I really think that fear voice you're referencing is like the biggest competitor to change or patience. Right. Like it's like they're going neck and neck in a race and you're either going to be patient, that change is going to come, or that fear is going to like kick in so much that you're going to, you know, kind of pull the plug and say, nope, not seeing results.

Right. And we've kind of lost. We've sort of lost the heart for the struggle. We've lost the ability to be. We can't even hang in there with a Facebook post that asks us to quit. Need more. I know, it's like we're like, you know, you gotta have us in like three or four sentences and we're out, you know, so it's like we're super impatient. We're so used to being stimulated that the minute we sit in anything that's not stimulated we're like, what the hell is this? You know, this is, this is boring or this is not happening or this is not entertaining enough. It's like a, you know, we have a mind on Google, so it's very hard to be like, I would like to be an astronaut, you know, and then, and then have the patience for like 10 or 20 years to really ride out that intention.

Yeah.

You know, it's like if five months down the road I haven't heard from NASA, I'm like, well, be a nurse. Yeah. You know, it's like I just sort of left out any opportunity because I just want to be patient with it. And I am like, I am like Flora frustration, you know, I am like, you know, Florence frustration, I should say. I am like, not really cut from a good frustration tolerance. I get. It takes a lot of mental energy for me to try to be patient with things. For me to, you know, I've always, I was raised on very quick wiring and things got done quickly and then went into jobs where things were done quickly at three in the morning, you know. And so any sort of slowing down or anything like that was kind of a joke. But I started to, you know, in terms of making Change started to realize this concept called the torment of change. And the torment of change is when you start to make a change and you look at the change like in the global picture instead of like more of a local lens and you're saying, okay, the mountain of effort and energy that it's going to take me to do this is too high a mountain to climb. So I'm just not going to do it. What the hell would I do that for? Because we know I'm not going to be able to keep up with that. We know I'm going to write everybody down in the process and then yet again I'll be disappointing.

Yeah.

You know, so it's this torment of change. And so it's like, how are you going to make change? Really? And I was like, well first recognize your friggin impatience.

Yeah, Clarity. Right, Clarity.

That's it. Like, and then love yourself unconditionally for it. Of course I'm impatient. I could have an answer in two seconds to any question. Of course I'm impatient. I'm raised on a society that could drive to five different stores for something that I needed if they're out of.

I know, and like Amazon prime for also really adding to our lacking level of.

Oh my God.

When I have anything shipped and it's more than like one day I'm like, what? Prime doesn't do this? Like what world are we living in? You know? But it's so true and so true. I love that.

And our mothers were doing smart things like layaway, you know, they didn't have credit cards. Yeah. And it was in, you know, it was, it was old school and I, and I bet in a way it was, you know, probably, I mean our life is convenient but a lot of that convenience has really made us lose that ability to sit with discomfort, to sit with boredom, to sit with inconvenience, or to really sit with the time that it takes some time to turn your ship around. And we think things are going to be overnight. And I think that's where the yoga practice really kind of comes in. Because I think if it's one thing that a yoga practice, a meditation practice, I don't care if it's a walking meditation practice, I don't care if it's sitting in your backyard quiet for a few minutes. You know, it's more like trying to give yourself space so that you even have the space to negotiate, to say, let's say I'm an alcoholic and I say, okay, I'm going to be sober. And then in Comes the invitation from my best friend's wedding and incomes. You know, somebody wants me to go and go to like a concert, you know, or all these opportunities where there would definitely be to relapse. And it's like, how am I going to make those certain events or how am I going to be able to do this and really stick to my sobriety? And a lot of what I loved with some of the Law of Attraction, also the work of Esther Hicks. It was basically saying you need to manifest the kind of life that you want. Talk about it like it already happened, speak to people in ways and with thoughts that this is the only direction you're going and you're not messing around. And to kind of use the power of intention, to use power of the crop that you're cut from and to use adversity as an opportunity to strengthen your commitment instead of having it like totally derail you.

Yeah. So you just shared like so many nuggets for our listeners. Like so many nuggets. I mean, people can go back and listen to that over and over and probably just take notes, but I think just to kind of bring it together, I think it's so important to just highlight like your point of you can't just muscle through. You know, I tried muscling through. You shared how you tried muscling through. And like, we might still do that a little bit in our own ways, but you got to open up to the universe. And I always say the universe will create, like, will force my hand to do the things that I'm too afraid to do. Like it happens all the time and. But being aware of that, I think that happens for a lot of people, but they may not even notice. So I love the awareness about if we're muscling through or forcing, you know, the bringing patient. Like that's a huge takeaway.

The.

Your term co creating with the universe, like, that's beautiful, right? Just this idea of like, we're here to co create and the fact that we are here, like you said, is absolutely amazing. And then, you know, choosing, making the choice to turn adversity into growth and really intentionally, you know, manifesting what you want. But that starts with awareness, right? I always say awareness and then action. And I see too many people take action without awareness. And that is one of the, you know, then all of a sudden they're in damage control mode. And you can't go in damage control mode. And Esther Hicks. Yeah. Everyone listening check out, because that's a gem.

Oh my gosh. Have you ever Seen her speak?

Yes. Amazing.

Oh my God. She slips into a trance and then she just starts spitting out this intelligent, intelligent and you know, this emotional intelligence that's like, oh my God. It's really a gift. I mean, you see, that's a gift in action. That lady right there. You know, it's incredible with every single thing that you just said. The last component that I would add in there is that you must walk beside every single thing that you just said, holding the hand of self compassion for, just for being a human. Because we, we will never go. We would never. Not one person without effort and conditioning would immediately walk into any situation and notice first what's going. Right.

Yep, yep.

They'll notice first what's going wrong because we have to, because we're in survival mode. Yeah. And it was really helpful reading the book Buddha's Brain, which I would recommend. I feel like if I could just have that book permanently attached to my forehead, that would be helpful because I already am like doing so much pushing of that book. It's so flipping good to wake you up to how you naturally operate as a primal human being and that if there's 50 smiling faces and one sort of snarky looking face, you'll dismiss all the people that are smiling and hang your hook on the snark. So you're still looking at all the other people and you're smiling and you're lecturing and you're doing whatever you're doing, but inwardly you've let go of every single thing that's going right. And you are really, you are dialed in like a meerkat, you know, on the thing that's going wrong internally. You know, we're presenting fine, we're getting everyday life done. But it all, we're constantly checking a short list of danger. We will go into stressful patterns of thinking. We will go into self sabotage. And when we do that, I think to be there for ourselves, to be like our own soft pillow, to land and be like, well, of course you're freaked out. Well, of course you are ungrateful and ungraceful in that moment. Well, of course you complain and you're kind of cranky today. Look at the way you're wired. Yeah, that totally makes sense. Yeah, it's like, so can you be nice to yourself and say, you know what, I'm being a bitch today because some of that is my wiring. I'm cranky, I haven't slept good, and I'm really kind of sitting in a lot of what's going Wrong. And I gotta shift and sit what's going. Right. And that's really what practice is. The practice is to be able for your grief, which you'll go for first, to hold the hand of your grace. Yeah, you know, it's like every single time.

Yeah, no, I agree. It's one of the things I teach is, you know, high vibes and low vibes and not high vibes, meaning everything's butterflies and rainbows, but high vibes, meaning like your energy is coming from a source of high vibration, like compassion, trust, love, joy, abundance, all these, you know, high vibration energies. And what happens, and I see too often is when we go into these low vibe places, which we all do, right, it's not the expectation that we're never going to go there, it's knowing how to get out of there. And the way to get out of there, like you said, is compassion. It's these high vibes. But too often people get in these low vibe places, self sabotage, fear, guilt, worry, angst, bitch mode, whatever it may be, and then add more low vibes because they feel so badly or ashamed of where they're at. And it's so counterintuitive. But I am so glad you added that point because we have to greet those lower vibrations, which are all part of the human experience, but we have to greet them with these higher vibes to pull ourselves out. So thank you for sharing that.

Yeah, no, it was interesting because I did a presentation in Las Vegas this past September, which was really cool. And I went in as part of the Fig Free Corporation, live well, be well panel. And the first question that they came up, they asked like, sort of right out of the gate is what has been inspiring you lately? It was at the time that Annabel had. She had just gotten out of the hospital a few weeks before I was in Vegas. And so I raised my hand to answer the question and I was explaining, you know, how I'm really excited right now about people, you know, which I love people anyways. I give them a lot of credit and I've always enjoyed the practice of that, you know, as much as they can be, you know, challenging at times. But people are unreal and I don't think they give themselves enough credit. And I. You don't think that either, which is why we're in the professions that we're in, to say, hey, hey, hey, you know, like X, Y and Z has happened. But look at you, you're still in there and you beat all these odds and you, you know, you're still Standing here now and all this has happened up until this point. And so let's just sort of roll up our sleeves and say, okay, X, Y and Z happened. How can we use them for your fuel in order for you to be able to create the kind of life that you want. But if you don't have space within you, if you're always walking around at maximum capacity, you don't even have the bandwidth to even know that you can even reach in there and make a change or make a shift.

Yes.

You know, so I tell everybody when you feel like you can't like Yogi way out of something, you feel like you can't power of intention your way into something that that's really music. And I will say that music has been a really powerful entity in order to be able to take gravity out of something that I might be giving in the moment.

I love that.

And so, yes, my whole talk is about sort of like how we give all this gravity. We think we're bad. We think we're this. We're actually really exceptionally powerful. And we plug ourselves back into that power and we start slowing ourselves down. Then we can. Then we can start getting sophisticated and efficient with our energy. Otherwise we're just exhausted. It's like a hamster running in a wheel.

Yeah, I know. I love that it's so powerful. And I love too, that you brought back Annabelle and just kind of like your mission of helping other people, making this world a little bit better. And so before we wrap up, I want to touch on yoga reaches out. So let's tell our listeners about the event, the meaning behind it. And I know you've had kind of a long standing history with it. So for those who have no idea what yoga doubt is, can you tell them what it is?

I think it's challenging to describe because it's probably more of a feeling than an event at this point for me, but it is. It's visible grace in action. It's people who are not just opening their wallets, which is amazing. And we definitely need that because, wow, health care is a lot of money. Oh, my God. So we definitely need financial help, which is, you know, which is huge. It's the power of showing up. It's the power of standing there amongst a thousand people who say, hey, I don't even know you, but I totally got your back.

Yeah.

And I had a T shirt made just to just tell you. You know what I mean? It's like, yeah, it's really sweet. And Sarah Gardner, I feel like Sarah Gardner And I are very similar to you and I sort of imaginated heaven where it's like if you could really sit down with the heart and mind of those two women, like what the hell they could really come up with. And I think because I was, I've always been so service based and then. And that speaks to Sarah, you know, because she's got a servant's heart. And I think going through my teacher training and just sort of the way that I speak and the way that she thinks and sort of what came together. Not that I created yoga ritual per se, but I think it was a lot of the spark that Sarah and I created together in using yoga for the greater good and putting something like this together. Now if it was me, I'd be like, Everybody needed a VFW at 4 o'. Clock. Yoga reaches out. It's gonna be amazing. But because it's Sarah, she's like, okay everybody, I'll meet you at Gillette Stadium, you know, which I hate red tape and I could never do all that. So I love her, you know, has really kind of hustled that end of it and gotten it to where it is. Yeah, but it's just an amazing event that when you walk into and you can genuinely just be a part of the human spirit for a day and it's for no better cause than for children. I mean, it's like if you walked through Children's Hospital right now, you know, I mean, you'd start going door to door asking people for money. It's insane. It's so sad. And at the same time it's really beautiful because there's so much grace and there's so much help. I mean I was in children's eight o' clock yesterday morning. I had to get up at 6 and I went in there to be with Annabelle. Annabelle was in the hospital for the past five days. She got out yesterday and she was confined to one room since this past Tuesday. So I went in to leave my brother because he had to work on Saturday. And you know, the whole family just pitches right in. As soon as she goes in, we just know we go right into like, you know, children's hospital mode. And you just start like, you know, doing what you got to do. And you know, I'm in there and I'm like, this child has been in the same friggin room since Tuesday. And then I'm looking at the nurse, you know, who's standing there and she said, you know, this child has really been an amazing child. And I looked at that nurse in the face. And she must have been like, whoa. But I was like, and so are you.

I love that.

So are you. Who are you? You know, and so I feel like, to pay homage to the people that are in there holding this kind of space, sitting there with parents who are losing children. I mean, could you imagine being the nurse that has to look at you and break the news to you? No. I mean, or the doctor, you know what I mean? It's like, oh, my God. So we got to give them. We have to give them support. We want to give the parent support. Some of them are in there for months and they came from, like, Arkansas. They don't even know Boston.

Yeah, I have a friend in from town right now from Cleveland. I mean, and then we met five years ago. Our daughters were born just about a week apart and both treated in the cicu, which is the cardiac intensive care unit. And, you know, they've been back and forth, you know, for five years now. So it's. There's no finish line to this work. And the motto of Boston Children's Hospitals, until every child as well. And we have a lot of work to do still, you know, and like you said, I love how you described it as grace in action and seeing humanity for a day. And for those of you who aren't totally sure what the event is, it's on this coming Sunday, which is April 28th, right? Yes, April 28th.

Yeah.

It's an all day event of a thousand yogis. So it's at the bubble at Gillette Stadium. You can sign up to be a part of a team. Jackie has a team. Probably get an in to get you on our team here or there are other teams or you can come as an individual. But either way, as Jackie said, it's just people showing up to do the work for children's. And if you haven't been to Boston Children's Hospital, if you just spend some time going through there, or trust us, you literally, like Jackie said, would go knocking door to door to support not only the patients and their families, but the staff. Because the reality is money is an energy source, just like our time, our love. And you identified one of the energy sources that comes out of it is all the compassion and the love and the support. And another one is the money, which is a reality that we need to be able to improve services and supports for, you know, these, these kids who are fighting like, who are really freaking fighting, like our Ladens and our Annabelle and so many others.

I mean, and not to even mention. I mean, Sarah. I mean, each year, she's so thoughtful about what she really tries to put together in order to be able to express back to all of these people who at this point have raised millions to say, I am so grateful. So she's bringing in Rod Stryker this year, which is really special. And they also have the fundraising that you don't have to have it. You wouldn't have to have it done by this Sunday. So you could technically come Sunday and have not even raised a dollar. They will charge your card at a certain day, like, down the road, but you have months, even after the event to still raise if it was something that you were interested in, but money was holding you back. So, you know, it's like they try to do things like that so more people feel welcome so that it's achievable, you know. And she puts together musicians. Donald DeLorey's coming, Alicia Mathewson. I mean, so many different people that. Who's the other guy? Kevin Barris, who is just a Dre. He's got such a great voice. And just so many people that she tries to line up to really give you the gift of a day so that she doesn't just say thank you. That you, like, feel. Thank you. Yep.

And I'll be. For those who don't know, I'll be the keynote speaker there this year, which is an absolute honor to really. My journey.

I get to go after you. I'm gonna be like, hello, everybody. Let's just sit here and think about what she said. That's what my segment's gonn.

No, it's amazing words and energies to offer everybody. And speaking of which, where can people find you if they want to learn more about yoga? Reaches out if they want to just kind of see what you're up to, where you're teaching, what's the best way for them to find you?

Definitely go to my website. I feel like I update that the most. I'm horrific with email. I'm horrific with the phone. You know, I think, you know, I feel like. Yeah, I feel like my website, I do try to keep as up to date as possible. And then I usually send out a little monthly newsletter. If you were to get on my email list, I'm kind of old school. It's a little monthly newsletter. I like to make it. It's like a special thing I like to put together from the people. And so I would say that that's probably the best way is to get on the newsletter and to check out the website. And I'm kind of a gypsy. I'm kind of all over. I really like trying to bring yoga into, you know, all different pockets of New England. And I love traveling, so I'm a big fan of going to new places, even if it's like new towns, you know, like, in yoga, people will say, hey, have you been to India? I'm like, no, but I've been to Stoughton. Like, it's a great little town.

What is your website, Jackie?

It's just my name, so it's Jackie Bonwell. It can either be jackiebonwell.com or jackiebonwell yoga.com. they both go to the same thing. So just my name.

So I'm sure people who have heard what you have to share, like, this is just such a tiny glimpse of the wisdom, the energy, the love, the compassion, and just the ways that you genuinely serve this world. And I'm so grateful that you took time to hop on. I'm so grateful that Laden's light led me to you and that we're now connecting. It's because of her that we've, you know, now made our connection, which to me is a little gift from her. And I'm excited for yoga reaches out and to see what else is in our future. Maybe some grief resources that we might be devising behind the scenes quietly, but we won't say too much.

Yeah, yeah. See, when we sit, like me and Sarah Gardner, you know, or like you, when we sit down, it's really cool to think what we can come up with. And I would just like to in return say to you, thank you very much for even giving me the opportunity to speak. I mean, I feel like, who's teaching who? You know, it's just an amazing thing that you've been able to show people how to be constructive with your blues. And I think that that's what a lot of people like. We go through stuff, and it just sort of knocks us out and blows the wind out of our sail. And. And I think you've really done a masterful job at showing your listeners, of showing your people and of living, you know, being just a living example that you can, you know, sort of like, in the wise words of Beyonce, take some lemons and make some lemonade. And it's really beautiful what you've done. So, yeah, I. I know. She's like, that's my other favorite animal. But, yeah. So thank you so much, hon. I really appreciate it. I feel really honored to speak. I feel really honored to present with you on Sunday and I'm super grateful to Sarah Gardner. They can check out all the details@yoga reaches out.org and it will kind of give your listeners, whoever can hear me now, just a little bit more information. But it's not to be missed. It feels like a hug of a day and really is just so powerful for you to be able to get the boost of sitting in that level of human spirit for a day.

I love that.

Well, thank you.

I will hug you on Sunday. The biggest hug.

Oh, my God. I know. I might. I don't know. I don't even know what's going to happen. I'm going to have to go slowly. I'm going to have to go easy. I might just crush you.

All right. Thank you, Jackie.

Okay.