85: The Power of Saying Yes - an interview with Dawn Canada

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Welcome to Grief and Guts. I'm your host, Melissa Dugulecki. It is my honor and privilege to serve you by sharing stories, tools, interviews and strategies that will help you transition from what do I do now? How do I get through this? Those feelings of overwhelm and uncertainty to truly standing in your power. From my grief journey in losing my daughter laden in 2014 that I learned, practiced, was exposed to all these tools, but they are not grief specific. In fact, they apply universally to all of our unique situations. You've already done the hard part by showing up, by opening up to something new. So without any further ado, let's get to the good stuff that's going to help you in your journey. Let's dive in. What up, friends and community? I am so fired up to share today's podcast episode with you. We are going behind the scenes of behind the Scenes. We are interviewing a staff team member who actually started as a 90 day CEO client, but before that I was working with her one on one life coaching and mindset. And she is going to share how she had transformed, transformed her pain and her trauma into something on her own. Right. Doing the work. We talk about this all the time. Right. Doing the work for herself to heal, to then feel more empowered to step into. Like, how do I want to impact now? What do I want to do? She knew she wanted to do something. She just wasn't sure what she wanted to do. And I know so many of you resonate with that because I've talked to you and you said I feel a calling. I feel something like there's this pull. I just don't know what I want to do. And so dawn is sharing how she responded to that and how it has completely changed her life. So much good stuff. Cannot wait to share. Tune in, dive in. Let's do it. Please join me in welcoming Dawn Canada onto the show. My very first former client to join here. So thank you.

Thank you. I'm so excited to be here.

Yeah. And why don't you let everyone know where you know where you live, what your family, what your situation is.

Yeah. So I live in the Atlanta area. Atlanta, Georgia. I am married to my husband who amazing. We have two amazing little boys. They are five and six years old. They keep life interesting. That is my family life. And then I have, I am a life coach as well. And I work for Mel and Mel and Mooch and 90 day CEO and move.

So great. So before we dive into going deeper into you, your transformation, the work you've done, I gotta Ask. I ask everyone really self serving because I'm just making a massive inventory list, but favorite taco.

Fish taco. I love a good fish taco with good pico on it. I don't have, like a specific place because I feel like each place has their own fish taco that's unique to them.

But that's my go to fried or grilled.

I have to know if it's grilled. It has to be seasoned and prepared. Right? I prefer grilled, but there's nothing like a good fried fish taco, so I could do either.

All right. I love that. So great. So, dawn, one of the things I think is so powerful, you know, anyone listening in would have heard that, you know, you're in the Atlanta area. So we're not. We've actually never met in person, which is still weird to me. This is weird to me, but we've never met in person. I talk a lot about the power of connection, the power of putting yourself out there, the power of joining groups and masterminds and putting yourself in communities where you're going to level up. The power of listening to podcasts, right? Like, turn off the tv, like turn off the Netflix binges, like, stop surrounding yourself with people who are draining you or thoughts and sounds that are draining you, and really start connecting to places that just feel right. But we have to do that without knowing what it's going to look like, because we don't know what it's going to turn out to be. And so a lot of people want to know what they're going to quote, unquote, get. And I think it's safe to say that you never would have imagined getting to where you are now when you kind of made the decision to connect and to expand. So can you talk a little bit about how you connected to me and what that was like for you?

Yeah. So backstory, I think it was two years ago you and Mooch joined. I guess it was a mastermind or like a mastermind group that my husband was a part of. And he just started following you guys. And two years later he was like, hey, I really think you should follow these girls. Like, they're. They have this company called Move. I really think you'd like them. They seem like your style, your vibe. You should check them out. Okay, cool. Get on Instagram, start following Move, start reading more. And then I realize there's Mooch and Mel who are in Move. And so I go in both of your accounts and start just reading posts. And instantly, well, I got in your Handle. And I was like, oh, she has a podcast. Yes. Like, I'm. I love listening to podcasts. That's, like, my jam. So I just started listening to your podcast, and I was instantly attracted to your vulnerability. Like, I really. That's something that is. It's one of my core values is being authentic, vulnerable, like, having that trust. And trust, it's sharing what's truly going on, like, who you are. And so just listening to your podcast, I was like, wow, this girl, like, she is sharing, like, some raw, intimate pieces of her story that I've never experienced, and not in a way that was victimy. Like, it wasn't woe is me. You know, this happened. It was. This happened to me. And I get to inspire others. Like, I get to use my story to give back. And I was just completely drawn to that. That started it. And then once I heard you were a life coach, I had gone to the place that, like, I really wanted to go deeper and my own personal journey. And I told my husband, I was like, I want to hire her. I don't know how. I don't know how we can make it happen, but I know I want to hire her. And then I reached out to you, and that's where this started. And then here we are almost a year later.

Yeah. I'm telling you, I'm going to have goosebumps this whole episode. But so many layers of stories in this. So one is like, dawn, you were making a decision to kind of learn and to connect and to just see what resonated. And I remember our first phone call. I remember exactly where I was. I remember, you know, talking with you and being like, wow, this woman's got a fire. Like, you were like, I'm ready to learn. I'm ready to grow. I don't want to live like this anymore. And you were like, I don't know how I can make this work or if I can make this work. Right. And so gave you some time to kind of think about it, and we revisited it. But, you know, I think on the even deeper level, beyond that, I just want to remind everybody, I almost didn't start a podcast. Right. And I think that's important to note. Like, everyone sees this side of me where, you know, I share so openly, and it was really hard. I was afraid. I was afraid of going to those depths of my loss. I was afraid of saying difficult truths. I was afraid of offending people at Children's Hospital by saying, like, her case was a fucking catastrophe. Yeah, right. I was afraid of how it would impact my family, because to be honest, even my mom, you know, I love her, but she says, like, Melissa, I don't read a lot of your stuff. I can't. Like, it's really hard for her. Like, it's inspiring to people who didn't know Layden, of course, people who loved and held Laden. It's painful, right? And so I almost enjoy the podcast because of all these things. And I was afraid of what other people would think, and I was afraid no one listen or. Or what am I even going to talk about? And so if you are listening and you feel this calling to start something, but you have all these doubts, like, please just do it or reach out. Because from me doing that, then, dawn, we connected. Then we began working together. And now we'll talk more about your whole story. But for me, it's just your story reminds me.

Take the leap.

Do it. And you inspire me, dawn, to keep leaping. Because that leap that I almost didn't take arguably helped change your life. Right?

Yeah. Yeah. No, exactly. I think one of the things you said to me. I don't remember what it was in reference to, but you. In one of our calls, I was kind of. I was afraid, and I was like, what if I get hurt? Like, what if someone. What if someone abandons me? What if I lose trust again? And you're like, yeah, but what's possible? Like, what. What if they don't? Like, what if you make connections? Like, and I'll never forget, like, switching that language of what's possible. Like, why don't we look at this as what can be possible? And I think I've learned since working with you to live my life in that state of what's possible? Like talking to someone, reaching out to someone. What's possible? What's possible? In this conversation, it may not be a new client for me, but I may inspire someone in a way that I didn't know was possible. So I 100% agree. Like, take that leap because you don't know whose life you're going to change. And I think that's what I saw with Layden is it was like, I've experienced other people that have lost children, and I've seen it a detriment to their life. Like, they just shut down and no judging. Like, I can't even fathom it, but I saw something in you where it was like, I'm going to use this to inspire others. And I think that's powerful. I think it's powerful. We can use our stories, use the Things that we've gone through use the adversities to inspire others to change. I think that's the beauty and what the work we're doing and the online space, like, that's it. It's, you know, a challenge because that was one of the things is I didn't want to write and put myself out there online. And you were just like, well, what's possible if you do, like, what could happen? And so I think that's where, in this online space, like, sharing our stories is so powerful. Like, it really is.

You know, I'm glad you bring that up, because so many people who are critical of social media and comparison and trolls and all this, like, yes, that exists. But if that's what you're seeing, that's what you're choosing to see, right? And there is that look at me culture, There is that competitive culture, There is that shaming culture that's in our world, guys. Right. That's not unique to social media. So if you're choosing, if that's what you see, that's what you're choosing to see. Because what I see in social media are, you know, everyday people sharing their stories, changing lives, people getting voices that didn't have a voice before. Right. Access to connection of people all around the world that we might not normally connect with. Yeah, right. You know, I mean, we wouldn't have connected with that social media.

No, exactly. Yep.

So I think social media, in a way, is bringing us closer to source, bringing us closer to our true beings and our true selves. And I'm really glad that you brought that up, Don.

Yeah, no, exactly. And that's how I feel like I've 100% lived that. Like, I now feel that you and Mooch and other, like, women on our team, like, are now like my closest friends. Like, I hang out with you guys all week, even though it's all in zoom. But who would have thought, like, through this platform that I would now have, like, some of my deepest connections?

So 100%.

Yeah.

Yeah. And so, you know, Don, we're talking a lot about. And I also want to say the other added layer, you didn't think it was possible, one, to do what you're doing now to. To actually figure out how to work with me. But you reached out anyways and you had the conversation and you showed up, and there were times you didn't want to show up. There was even a couple times you didn't show up. Right. But it was like you kept on going. Right? You kept on going. And this Is, you know, and you just, you have done that over and over and you've overcome a lot of adversity and, you know, you have this amazing marriage and partnership, and you guys have your own amazing podcast, and you have these two fun, funky, like, fiery boys, right, that I just get to see in the background of zoom boxes who are so sweet, but I can't wait to meet them and, like, and play with them in real life. But, you know, you've been through a lot. You've been through a lot. And, you know, I would love for you to kind of share what it was like for you to go through the, you know, I think the sexual abuse that you went through at a young age for a prolonged period of time to experience what it was like to kind of bury that down based on society's standards and. And just kind of what that was for you, that feeling of how to. Will I ever shake this? Because a lot of people listening probably are wondering if they're ever going to shake what it is that they're carrying right now.

Yeah, no, I think it's so. It's so true. I. So just the backstory. I was, you know, sexually abused as a child, and then it happened in my adolescence and teenage years. And when I became a teenager at that point, like, I didn't know. I didn't have the tools that I have now. So, like, now it makes sense. Like, I was just broken and hurting. So I reached out drugs and alcohol and I started using heavily in high school. And then when I went to college, it was. I mean, it was full blown. I was just chasing one high to the next in order to survive. And so for me, like, I now see that because of the trauma that happened to me as a child, and it was never spoken about, I never spoke about it until I was 21 years old. I held on to that. Like, I held onto it. And. And even once I spoke about it when I was 21, like, it was still kind of just brushed under the rug. Like, okay, yeah, that happened. All right, let's put that away.

So, yeah, this is uncomfortable.

Exactly. And so. And the culture that I was raised in, it was a religious culture. So there's a piece of it that you shut up, like, you hide. You don't say what's really on your mind. And so I went through addiction, and then the only place I knew to turn was back to religion, because that's just what I was raised in. So I went back to religion and it served a piece for sure. Like, it's it served and helping me grow a little bit more and, like, taking it to another level. And while I was in. In that institution, like, I went to aa, like, I started doing recovery and started, like. I feel like it's like a hole. Like, you just start digging. Like, I started digging and started doing the work and started to kind of uncover these layers that were within me. And so, you know, then you get married. I got married, had kids, and. And there were still these things. Like, I just felt like I kept hitting, like, roadblock after roadblock. And. And so I say all that because. Which is why I reached out, wanted to work with you, because there were things, like, I couldn't. I couldn't push through. Like, I could. There's only so much we talk about in our. In our writing right now that there's only so much that positive poly could help me through. And so it's like, yeah, I could listen to all the podcasts and read all the books, and I had, like, the intellectual knowledge of how to work through this stuff. But reaching out to you and really, like, digging deeper within and realizing, like, oh, because of this original trauma, I created patterns around it. Like, it just became a bunch of patterns that kept me stuck. And so once I was able to, like, notice, like, oh, this is just a pattern because of the lack of trust that I experienced as a child. And, like, so then because of this lack of trust, I was perpetuating that into my adult life. And so, like, it was like, working with you and kind of understanding. Like, I get a choice to break these patterns. Like, once I could connect it all, then I could see it pop up in my life. And it was like, oh, hey, that awareness. Like, growing that awareness of, hey, this is what's going on here. This is where it stemmed from. Okay, cool. Now I get to choose something different. So that's where, like, I do believe that anyone that's, like, going has. That has gone through something traumatic in their childhood. And now trauma is definitely a word that's thrown around, but I think trauma, grief, like, it. There's an umbrella. And I think people think that trauma is just, like, a catastrophic event, but it can be different layers to what your trauma is. But I think so much of it is, like, being able to recognize it and understanding the patterns that you created because of that.

100%. 100%. And, you know, dawn, thank you for your courage and your vulnerability. I mean, you're so used to your story, but I guarantee you, somebody listening to that was like, wait, what? You went through years of abuse. I mean, how long span of time do you think it existed?

So there were two instances. It only happened twice in my life, but there was started when I was four. It happened again when I was in middle school and then from middle, like high school, then it became. It happened more, more often in high school. So it was like the original time that it happened. And then from middle school on it continued. Which even that in of itself was like a hard pill to swallow because at that age, like, I had a choice. But now, knowing what I know, I didn't understand how to say no, I didn't get it. And so I didn't have those tools. So, yeah, so it continued and I just allowed it to happen because just was where I was at at that time.

Well, I certainly wouldn't say you allowed. Right, but you certainly didn't allow. I mean, it's, it's victimology, right? It's paralysis. And so, you know, I just want to offer that. But yeah, you know, you know, but what you went through is years, you know, years. And there was a major component of grief to that in addition to trauma, because you're essentially grieving that middle school, high school experience of safety. You're grieving teenage years of safety and of trust. And I just, you know, one of my missions is to expand the way that people define grief, you know, And I actually think I'm in a position to do it because if you are looking at, quote unquote, a hierarchy of grief, people will put the loss of a child up top, right? And I, someone who lost their child, I want to expand it not to be a hierarchy, but to just be this wide cast net of all these different types of grief, because that's what really is going to serve and honor people. Right, but that's, that's a major aspect of grief, you know.

No, exactly. And I think that was one of the things that we, that really helped me, that you and I worked on was this trust. And like, I remember you had me write a letter to trust and like, what does that look like? And I think like identifying that and realizing, oh, like this is where it comes from. But yet once I could write, like, I wrote through it and really like had this emotional experience of what was lost because essentially, like, there was a grief that I needed to feel and experience because I had lost this trust at an early age. And I never saw it in that way. And so I think once I was able to see it as like, oh, I lost, like, I need to grieve for this loss. There's something powerful in that of like feeling it and experiencing it and mourning. Like, I remember you telling me to mourn for the loss of that trust. And I never, I'd never heard it in that way or done anything like that. So I think that was so powerful in order to like move through it. I had to feel it, like, I had to see, sit with it and I had to really mourn for this loss. And I agree, like, grief is wide. It's not a hierarchy. Like, it 100% has a wide scope. And if I want to help in changing that perspective, like for sure, right?

No, absolutely. And you are doing that. You're absolutely doing that.

Yeah.

Now something I think is important to talk about is I didn't know when we first talked, right? We do a consult call and we talk a little bit. You know, I didn't know the history of sexual abuse and then I didn't know the challenges you faced around alcohol. Right. And drug abuse. And so I think that's important that like when we first started working together, that's not something, I mean, to me, to be honest, like, that's very common. It's not necessarily relevant. When I'm, when I first start working with people, I. I get more an idea of their energy, their vibe, where they want to go. And, and then we start digging, right? And then we start digging. And so what I experienced with you was, you know, we would kind of, we make progress. But then like, it was like, it felt like, you know, I go digging. I always say what I like to do and which knows is I like to go deep under the fucking surface level, dig to those places like no one wants to touch, right? And. And that's where we find the freedom. Yeah, in my experience, right, that's this, this depth. And so we're digging, we're digging. And I felt like we kind of kept hitting like, almost like this like crater, right? This like rock. And it was like, what is this? What is this? And I can't force it out of you, but I think, and I'd love to hear your perspective, I believe us going through that process allowed you to see that, you know, so I've created a four step method, right? Step one, we build awareness, which you have. Step two, we really, we let go. But to let go, we got to go all the way down. Step three, we put in new power steps, new habits, new relationships. And then step four, sustain and maintain. A lot of people want to skip two. They want to go right from how they're feeling to what's the power steps? What are the new things I need to do? But we can't do the new things until we purge the old things. We can't. There's no room. And so I think through the process, you kind of realized, shit, I'm going to have to talk about this or I'm not going to get what I want. The results I'm looking for.

Yeah. And I think some of it was too, with, like, I had never worked with a coach before, and I think there was a piece of it that I was skeptical. It's like, is this person really who she says she is? Like, can I. Can I trust her? Like, can I share the depths of my soul and trust that it's not going to be used against me or whatever? Like, there's all these stories that we can make up. So I think for sure, like, I had my wall up, I had my guard up. Like, let's just fix all these outside things and not talk about what's really going on. And I think we see that so much in the work that we do is people. And I did this. Like, we come with, oh, I like, for me, it was like, I want to build a business. Like, I want to work on all the outside things. Like, I don't want to be jealous of my husband. Like, I had all these outside things that I wanted to work on with you. But what. What we realized in this type of work is that, no, it's all centered from within. Like, you have to fix the inside before you can even start to touch on the outside. So I think there's so much truth in that. And I think, for me personally, like, it. Absolutely. And that's the thing, too, is, like, I had worked with the therapist. Like, I had. I've gone to therapy and. And I did. I did work through it, but I think I needed to take it even deeper. And so, like, I had done all this work, and so I thought that, like, no, I was. I'm done with this. Like, I've gone through it. Like, I don't want to touch it again. Let's just keep it over there. Like, we don't have to talk about it. Let's just talk about all these outside things. But I think I needed to talk about it and I needed to feel it and go through it. Because, I mean, the growth, like you said, the growth that I've experienced in the past year is fucking amazing. Like, I'm so proud of, like, all that I've accomplished and who I am and what I'm doing. But I see that key piece, like, I had to feel it and really, like, really feel it and work through it in order to like, come out on the other side.

Yes. I love that you brought that up because I almost forget that. Right. I remember you wanted to work on, like, your fitness and you wanted to work on your health and you wanted to work on, you know, maybe some sleep patterns. And there was definitely that imposter syndrome with your husband. Like, oh, he's so great. He does this, he does that. He's amazing. I can never contribute the way he's contributing. And like, you are. He is amazing.

He is great.

He is all these things. Right. Those are all true. And so are you.

Right, Exactly.

But you. That was not accessible for you at one point.

No, I really didn't. Like, I thought it was this like, innate thing that he had. Like, it was this. He was just born like this. So therefore, like, that's him. And I'm always going to be in the shadows. Like, that's kind of how I viewed it. Like, I'm always just going to be behind the scenes. And I think some of it was just that culture I was raised in. Like, women, women do kind of hide behind the scenes. Like, you support your husband, you there. I mean, even in our culture, it's like, women stay home, have kids, like, do all the housework. And, and, and don't get me wrong, like, I like it. I wouldn't say I love it, but I enjoy it and I want to have my own thing. Like, and I want to shine and lead and have a company and work with amazing human. Like, all these things. It's an and, like, it's not an either or. And I think that's, that's what I've realized is like, I, I can do all of this.

Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, kudos to you though, for doing that digging, because I will be honest, you know, I've worked with hundreds. Honestly, I'm probably approaching like, thousand now, but like hundreds of people, either in the group or the one on one setting. And you know, a lot of times what people do is they get slightly uncomfortable, they get a little bit of change, and they're like, okay, I'm good. This worked. Right. Because it's really hard. Or they're like, I got, I made progress. Like, I'm communicating better with my partner. I'm not as annoyed at work. Basically, they've learned how to manage their triggers better, but they haven't actually done the deep stuff. That's Going to allow them to think of it like, anyone listening think of it like you've got this clog and you want to refill that spot with self worth, with confidence, with clarity, with excitement, with joy, with love, with worthiness. We've got to unclog. And a lot of times people learn how to manage the symptoms of the clog or they maybe unclog it a little bit, right? It'll somewhat flush, but, you know, they. They don't fully do it. Cause it's really fucking hard, right? You scream and you want to run away. There's this portrayal on social media, which, you know, we love, but there is also this portrayal that doing the work and doing the shadow work. It's like we sit there with crystals and we meditate. Like, that's not what I'm doing the work. That's what I'm maintaining. That's like, that's not what I'm, like, deep, you know, digging deep. So can you talk a little bit as a time where, like, you didn't want to show up or you wanted to quit or you wanted to run? Because I will say majority of people do that, and that's okay because it's human. But I want that person to hear this and be inspired to get back to it in whatever capacity that is for them.

Yeah, I mean, I think now running and wanting to hide looks very different. Like, I think now I have the tools to recognize, like, oh, here's this. Like, I call it a survival pattern. Like, a way to keep me safe is hiding. And I think for me, that stemmed from my trauma at a young age. Like, I learned to just hide and not be seen. And so now when I'm triggered in that way or things get hard, I see the desire to hide and like, oh, there it is. Like, and maybe I will for a little bit. Like, maybe I go cry in the shower and, like, take some time to feel and hide for a little bit, but I don't stay there. I think that's the key is, like, not to stay there. Like, allow yourself to feel it. Like, shit is hard. Like, this past year has been the fucking hardest year ever in terms of, like, society, like, every, like, Covid like, my kids being home. I mean, if I didn't have the tools that I have, like, I would have 100% thrown in the towel and said, like, fuck this. Like, I'm over it. This is too hard. But I think having those tools of knowing, like, okay, I can feel this and. And I can choose differently now rewind back Two years ago. Like, no, there were times that I did just give up. Like, I did reach and drink again. Like, I did reach for things to numb out because it just. The pain can feel too much to bear. And I think it's the same concept. Like, just don't stay there. I think we're all gonna. Even in, like, two or three years ago, five years ago, like, yeah, I would fall and I'd stay there for maybe a couple months, but I would come out. And for me, like, luckily, like, my husband is in this space as well. So, like, we really are a team and, like, we support each other. But I do think that people need support and you need someone. Like, you gotta have someone in your corner. Because these times do come. Like, these. These moments do come when you don't wanna get out of bed. And if you can have someone that's cheering you on, that's there to call. Like, you can call that. You can say, hey, I'm having a really hard day. Like, can you just hold space for me? Can you just listen to me? Cause I mean, there are times that it's hard.

Like, well, I wanna go more in that middle space. So you talked about, like, a few years ago when, like, you know, you were before we started working together, and then you talked about after. Right. But I want to talk about those times when we were working together when you actually didn't want to show up, when I wasn't your favorite person. Because then that's okay. But my job, right. I've made the decision to not be someone's favorite person, to do what's going to best serve them. But that's what I want to talk about. Because I see a lot of people start the work and they do that, but then it becomes hard. And, you know, they're like, okay, I think I got enough out of here. Like I said, like, I can manage these triggers. I can flush it a little bit better. Not all the way. Right. But, you know, I think I'm good. And they say, you know, I'm too busy. I got this or that, and I can't do it now. And that's where I see so many people where I'm like, ah, you're right there. Right? You're right there. And there were times where I. I remember, like, you didn't want to show up.

Yeah. One of the things, you can repeat the quote, but you say, be your biggest observer and your least critic.

Yeah. Your best observer and quietest critic.

Yes. I think that that is so powerful in those times. Like, in those times, just observe. Like, I think that's what I did is, like, no, I wouldn't want to show up on a call or I didn't want to have that tough conversation, but I just learned to observe myself. Even now. Like, I'm working with another coach now, and last week, I had, like, a really tough conversation with her, and I hung up the phone and was just crying and took a shower and cried. But I think what it's, you know, having a coach is like holding a mirror up to yourself. Like, that's. That's our job, is to hold that mirror up. And I think when you can observe yourself and see, okay, what's going on here, like, that's how the chain. Like, that's what keeps me going is, like, what you were saying to me was. Was true. Like, I needed that push. And I think. And not criticizing myself or judging myself or, like, shaming, that's. That's a lot of what I, like, had to work through was feeling that judgment and shame and guilt. Like, it's like, when you can remove that and just observe. Like, just kind of zoom up above yourself and, like, watch what's going on. Like, then it took the E, like, Or took the blunt of it off. Like, took the pain out of it, where it's just like, oh, yeah, okay, what she's saying. Like, there's some truth there. There's a reason why I don't want to show up, because it's fucking hard. Like, and I think when I could see that and observe that, it's like, oh, yeah, and take encouragement that. Like, when. When you're banging up against the wall, like, that's where the magic happens. That's where the growth gets to come, and it's so powerful. If you can keep going, like, if you can just push through that uncomfortable moment and just observe yourself. Like, don't. Don't shame yourself. Don't hate on yourself. Like, just observe. Just observe and notice, and then you can kind of, like, ease into the work.

Yeah, so that's something we did a lot around, you know, the alcohol and drug abuse. And I want to talk about that because I've worked with a lot of women who have wondered if they were an alcoholic. And I think, you know, this is probably a whole other podcast, Don. I'll have to have you back on. But, you know, understanding your relationship with anything that is treating an emotional issue versus an addiction issue, now, they can be very intertwined, and addiction is a real thing. But I think a lot of times people are Very quick to judge or shame or label and guilt. And what I try to do is like alleviate all of that because, you know, it's in my grief too. Like, you know, how much shame and guilt I felt from like creating a child who was sick and wondering what I could have done differently. In her case being termed a catastrophe. Like, the only way we can grow, guys, the only way we can grow is lifting this heaviness of shame, of guilt, of regret, of blame and learning. It's not like we're just like polypositive, right? And saying like, oh, it's great, that's fine. No, we're learning, we're observing, we're growing, we're choosing differently, we're looking and saying, oh, look at that was a way of coping and escaping with trauma that you had, right? So we're going to learn new ways. We have to dig, right? Step two, we got to dig and we're going to. And you had been doing this work before, but whatever for anyone listening, like, you know, now we're going to learn new ways to relate, to cope, to manage. And this isn't just alcohol, right? This honestly could be something that appears healthy, such as over exercising. This could be something like shopping that appears like a fun hobby, right? These are all different ways where we tend to our emotional needs in a way that actually drains us energetically. And then we're like, why am I so drained? Well, one, because we're depleted. We've got this major fucking clog, right? So we're not filling up the way we need to. And then we feel that emptiness. And instead of dealing with what we need to deal, we're shopping, we're traveling, we're over busying, we're eating, we're drinking, we're, you know, addicted to pornography, whatever it is. These are all these ways that people cope and then they just treat those things and instead of going in and I just think that's really important to point out. And thank you for bringing that up.

Yep, 100%. And that's, you know, the work that I do now, like I help women through. We label it as addiction, but I really think it's uncovering, like, what are we using to cope? Like. And I think society has labeled as addiction. And again, I think some instances, people truly are addicted, but I think we're more addicted to not coping and not dealing. That's where I really, I help women to identify that. It's funny, I do what you do now. Like, I help women to dig deep and to figure out like, what's really going on, because what they're focused on is the outside stuff. I'm shopping all the time or I'm exercising all the time. Like, I'm doing all these things to fill me up. And it's like, no, you have to fill yourself up from within, not from.

And honestly, we might have to do a part two, but I do want to kind of get to the where we're at now. I think we can go deeper in a lot of these things. And anyone listening, let us know what you want to hear more about, because I think we could definitely jam on this stuff a lot.

Yeah.

But you know me, and I'm glad that you said, like, this is the work that you do, because for me and my one on one coaching, I only work with a couple people now. That's a decision I've made because I don't want to totally let go because I actually love it. It's this beautiful space and energy where I love that depth. You know that Don, Right?

Yep.

Right. But being able to have someone that I've seen grow, that I've seen do the work that I talk to every single day. And you just completed coaching certification that I've created. Right. This program now, it's like kind of cool. Like, now I have someone I can refer people to, you know, if I'm not, you know, if I don't have any openings or I'm not the right alignment or the right fit and vice versa. Right. And to think that we got to this place from where you started. And I do think it's a funny story that, you know, you kind of fired me and then I kind of hired you.

Yeah, no, it's so true. I did fire you. And then it was like a week later, you're like, actually, would you like to come intern with us?

I want to talk about that for just a second. So, you know, dawn was in a place where you had done so much growing, so much growing. And, you know, you and your family were looking at, you know, priorities, where you were putting time, where you were putting finances, all these things that families look at. And it was like, you know what, Melissa? Like, this just can't be it right now. We've done so much work, and I just saw so much more in you. And I saw that fire, that same fire that I heard on that very first phone call. I'm like, this woman has so much more to do, and I want to be around her fire. And this is where I think, you know, it's even with Mooch, like, when Mooch and I met, it was like, oh, no, something. There's some energy synchronicity there, right? And so I talked to Mooch. Mooch didn't know you yet. And I was like, mooch, like, you know, someone I've worked with, we're looking for, you know, to bring somebody on. And so we basically created an agreement done, where, like, you know, you would have access to the program and you were going to begin working for us. But I wanted to continue to kind of mentor and support you, and this was going to be a way that worked. And so what was that like for you?

Like, I don't even know if I have words. Like, I just feel like it was. It was. It was divine. Like, it was this divine energy, this divine timing that I can't even. I can't even put words on. Like, for me, I was like, there was a sense of, like, pride, because for coaching, like, with working with you one on one, I truly showed up authentically. I didn't hold back. I wasn't trying to please you or be something that I wasn't. And I think for me, for the first time in my life, I fully showed up authentically. Me. And because of that, you were connected to me and you wanted me on your team. Like, you wanted to keep supporting me. And so I think for me, there was a sense of pride in it. Of, like, wow, like, when I just show up as me and I don't try to do all the things or try to, like, please people or say the right thing or do the right thing. Like, then, like, I'm actually like, I love who. Like, I love who I am. Like, okay, like, it kind of. It just fueled this fire in me of, like, just keep showing up. Like, just keep being you. And that's what attracts people. And I think for me, too, it was like the first time that, like, I achieved something without the help of my husband. Like, I always would hide behind him or ride on his coattails. And this was like the first time in my life. Life. Well, not my life, but in our relationship that I. Like, it was kind of like my little prized thing. Like, I did this. Like, I did this. It was all me. And so. And then as we've continued, like, now I'm on staff, and now, like, I'm your right hand person. Like, I've done all of this. Like, it's all me. And even, I think, was it last week. I think it was last week where at the end of our coaching certification, like, you and I Got on one on one. And just the things that you said, I was like, yeah, like, I did this. Like, I. So there's this. Yeah, it's amazing. But then it's also, like, I have this huge sense of pride. And, like, I'm so proud of myself. And I think to encourage others, like, just show up as yourself. Like, don't hide who you are, because you're gonna attract your people. Like, you're gonna attract the people you want to surround yourself with. If you can just show up authentically and vulnerably and be real and you're going to attract whoever is attracted to you. And so, yeah, and you're going to.

Find that synchronicity where you can grow. And, you know, Don started as, you know, an unpaid intern. It was an exchange, right, for support and mentoring and access to the program. But you built your business through that, and now you're an assistant coach for us. In fact, you're going to go shortly because you got an onboarding call for a new member of 90 Days CEO. You're onboarding them. You also oversee our operations, which means you have access to everything. You know, like, if Mooch and I disappear, dawn, you're running the show and you do our messaging, which that's like, my baby, right? So you and I will get on another call in like, an hour or so, right? Where we'll go through and we'll talk about our messaging. And so, again, like, you have done all that, you know, and when you first started, you were scared, you were afraid, you were doubtful, you didn't think you could ever measure up to your husband. And that's not a competition at all. You guys face for both of you to kick ass. And you're both kicking ass, but you've stepped into your power. But I just want to point out it's not been some fairy tale. You had trauma, you had to work through it, and you kept on showing up.

Exactly. And that's where, if we can encourage others, just keep showing up. And you don't know what's possible. You really don't. But if you keep showing up and keep doing the work, like, I promise something amazing will come. Like, it does. I truly believe in that. That divine energy and that possibility, the woo woo stuff. Like, I love all of that. Like, I'm all about it. And so I think this experience has just solidified that, like, that divine energy is always working. And, you know, even my husband being in that group too, two years ago. And, like, connecting with you guys, like, it has been that energy, divine energy, has been working all this time. And so for those out there, like, keep going, keep showing up, keep being authentically you because you don't know what's possible.

I love that. I have one last question, maybe two, but I think just one. I know we got to be quick, but how was it? So, dawn, you just completed the 12 week coaching certification, so we are super excited. We can now finally announce that we're doing an online teaching and coaching certification program that combines nlp, combines life coaching and education practices. Right. My background is in language based learning and social emotional learning. So I've created this entire training for people because I see a lot of really good coaches, a lot of people with good niches, but maybe they don't have those skills. And what's interesting is a lot of people think I show up on one on one coaching calls and I'm just chatting like we're having a cup of coffee, like, I'm working, my mind is going, I've got strategies. How was it to be on the flip side and to have me kind of teaching you how I showed up for you? Like, what was that like?

I mean, it was kind of cool. Like I shared a couple times in the training, like, oh, you did that to me. So in some ways it was cool to like kind of see a higher level view of like, oh, this is what's going on. Like, this is the why behind it. Like, I know for us, like there were, you kind of had shifted and you wouldn't come on the call with like an agenda or anything and you would leave it up to me and I would get, I'd be annoyed, like, what the fuck, Mel? Like I'm paying you and you don't have any. Like you're not setting up the call for us, like, what's going on? But I now I know it was because you were trying to teach me to have that voice to empower me to decide what we were going to talk about. Because it was a skill that I needed to learn. And so that was one of the things that we learned in the coaching certification was that exact concept. So I was like, oh, that makes sense. So I will say, like being on the other side of like learning all these things, it was, it's like all these tools and resources that I'd experience, experienced. But now I have, like, I have a knowledge behind it. I have a why behind it. And I see like the bigger picture of, of why it works. Like why and not works. But it helps people transform. Like, I'm an example. Like, it helped me transform. So it was. It is. It was really cool to, like, go through it and see, like, ah, like, I get it now.

And anyone who I worked with, who's listening, who's like, wait a minute, Melissa, you couldn't let me bring an agenda that was also by design, because your agenda was probably the things we didn't need to talk about that you wanted to try and maintain control of the conversation, so.

Exactly.

And that's where. And we'll talk about this, but that's where one of the characters we've created, Samezi Sam, is someone who thinks you have to treat everybody the exact same. And that's one of the things we really broke down certification. It's not, you know, equal and fair. Doesn't always look like the same. And that's something really important when you're doing this work. So, John, thank you so much for coming on. In three to five words, for the person who's listening, who's afraid to take the leap in doing the work, what would you say to them?

I would just do it. I don't want to say, but I mean, just reach out. Like, if. If it's something. If something we said, like, inspired something within you, like, you know where to find us. Like, we're both on Instagram. Like, anyone that's closely connected to me, like, you have my number. Like, reach out. Like, just. Just send a message saying that really resonated with me. So you got to say, just open the door for conversation. Like, I think so many times, like, we're afraid to say, like, yeah, me too. Or, yes, I feel that. But when you do, it opens the door for possibility. And so stay. Hang in there. Like, know, it just takes one. One message, one reach out. And you and I, like, we're on a mission to support people in this.

So, yeah, we are. Let's fucking go.

Yeah, exactly.

All right, dawn, thank you so much.

You're welcome.

All right, guys. I don't know about you, but I am full out goosebumps from hearing Dawn's story, her transformation, and I hope, if I haven't convinced you that it's possible yet, that dawn just convinced you that it's possible because to see her transformation from no tricks, frills, just doing the work day after day, right? And sometimes two steps forward, a step back, she has completely emerged and stepped into her power. She will tell you that she is more confident not only in herself, but in her marriage, as a mother, and in her professional work. So keep on doing it. You Guys, if you want to hear more, anything else, let me know. About time it's on. We can get her back on here. We can talk more about any of these things. You know, she's willing to go deep. And if you are listening and you are somebody who's thinking, I'm like Dawn was a couple of years ago, I'm nervous. I want to make the leap. Like she said, reach out. Reach out to me. Shoot me a dm. Even if I am not in a position to support you one on one, I will work with you to help pair you with the place that you can find your support and growth. My point is that there's never a finish line to growth. I am so grateful that you guys are here to continue to show up to allow my daughter Layden's light to shine and for you guys to shine your absolute brightest. I am cheering you on and we will talk soon. Thank you all so much for being here at Grief and Guts as Layden's mom. Being able to spread the stories, the strategies, the lessons I have learned through Layden and from Layden is the thing that means the most to me in this world and allowing my daughter's short life to have long and lasting impact by shining her light. Truly, nothing means more if you align with and believe in the work that we're doing here in these messages. The best way to give back and to spread this out into the world is to rate and review on Spotify and on itunes. Thank you for taking just a moment to do that. Feel free to shoot me a message. Let me know what you want to hear more of, what you want want to see more of. I am here to serve. I'm grateful to do so and I'm cheering you on in your journeys. Always.