Episode 162: The 5 Psychological Barriers to Profitability with Dan Nichols

So seriously, I'm at the doctor's office again. This is. Yeah, this is now a week ago. And I was just frustrated. Right. The waiting part is what got to me. Just sitting there waiting, waiting. And yeah, the texting and emailing, that didn't help. But the. The waiting got to me. On the way out, I'm like, at least it's over. And I walk out. In the waiting room is this woman, elderly woman, who has the hurricane. Do you know what the hurricane is? Like, the four little.

I've never heard of it that way.

Yeah.

But yeah, I do know what the four prongs.

Yeah, the four prongs. It grips people. It's in itself is menacing. And she's just sitting there talking. She goes and she knocks it over. And then she's like struggling to get. No one helps her. They shouldn't have because they were the smart people.

She was crying on the floor and nobody was helping her.

No one's helping her. And I go over, I'm like, ma' am, I will get that for you. I pick it up and give it to her. And as I give it to her, she looks away and starts talking to someone else like it was my obligation. So I looked right in the face. I'm like, you're welcome. I don't know, am I in a bad mood or what? Have you ever seen me?

This is the best of us, you.

Know, everybody gets a little sassy. It's okay.

Yeah, I'm a little sassy.

I'm curious. I'm curious. If she had fallen and needed help up, why didn't she have the pendant thing too? If she had the hurricane.

Good point. She didn't fall. She was just sitting in their chair, sitting there. She was just. I don't know. I don't know. She's just waiting for someone to take care of her.

Maybe people have to do it all the time. And then she feels guilty that people are always having to do things for her. So it's like kind of a reverse psychology thing.

Oh, that's true. So everyone's always helping her. Don't pity me.

How dare you.

I always knock off Kane over kids.

I can get it myself.

Exactly. She should have said that.

That's true. Yeah, that's true. So you're listening to the Profit first podcast.

This is the one you've been waiting for, episode 162.

Oh, that's right.

Gag back.

Okay, welcome. Welcome, everyone, to the Profit first podcast. I'm Christina Bulduk, your co host, and.

I'm Mike Malowitz, the author of Profit First.

That's right.

Joined in studio by Kelsey Ayers.

Hey, everybody. Ayers with a Z, like.

Yeah, it's a long. Whatever. I can go down a tangential path. How you doing? You doing right?

Yeah, I'm doing excellent.

All right. And you, my friends, you are listening to the Profit first podcast. Are you doing all right? Well, if you're not profitable, I understand why you're here then. Because you want to get profitable. That's what we're going to do in this episode, just like we do on every episode. And if you are profitable, we're going to make mo money for you. So I'm happy you're here.

And luckily, you can find us everywhere on itunes. Stitcher, Google Play, Profit first podcast dot com. Am I forgetting any? I don't think so.

Tune In Radio, and of course, our own website. I think you said private first. Podcast.com has the list of things. Oh, and by the time this one goes live, I think Fat Daddy Fat Back will finally be its own website.

Oh, gosh.

The design just got completed.

Are you bringing that back?

I'm bringing Fat Daddy Fat back. It is so funny. Do you remember the. The things are called GIFs, the animated. So remember the animated graphics from, like, 10 years ago? You go to the website, it's like. It's like they'd have four flames coming up, and the flames all do the same. So I have four dancers dancing next to me like gifts. They all move in the exact same.

I can't wait to see that.

You're going to love it. You're going to love it. It's so cheesy. It's so cheesy. Well, you, my friend, you listen to Prop First Podcast. Yeah. We have a lot of fun and we discuss profitability. That's the goal here. We're going to drive profitably in your business, and we're going to do a very special guest today, Dan Nichols. Now, before we get kicked off into that, I do want to know how my friends are doing. I do have an icebreaker for you.

Do you?

What is your. We were kind of on the pet peeve thing last week, so I was thinking about that. What is the feature, or I guess, yeah, a feature of someone else that's a pet peeve. Like, when you see this on someone else, for example, I'll give you mine, because I don't really know if it's a feature. A nose. A dangling nose hair.

Yeah.

It's distracting. It's so distracting for me I cannot have a lucid conversation with someone with a nose hair hanging out.

That's my happen often.

No, no, no, no. It's not like every day with my father. Every single day.

Yeah.

I don't know. I don't want to, like, pick anybody.

I'm not picking on anyone. I'm just saying a situation. There's gotta be something that distracts you.

I got one.

I know what is.

Go on.

What is it?

A guy over 20 with his hat on backwards.

Oh, are his pants too low? Like, off of his.

Yeah, yeah.

You don't like. You don't like that?

Yeah.

You lose like 10 IQ when you got your hand on backwards and you're over 20. Unless you're a catcher on a baseball team.

Okay. Yeah, yeah.

And of course, I don't even notice that.

Yeah, I wear my hat backwards sometimes. Like when I'm running. And I left on recently. I just forgot. I came in, my wife's like, why are you wearing a beanie like that? I'm like, it's my baseball cap. She's like, no, it looks like this big old beanie. So not there's anything wrong with a beanie, but when it's a baseball cap, it's kind of weird. What's your thing, Kelsey?

I think I used to work at a farm stand, and there was this fella who used to come and smell the corn, and he had like, a really, like, bulbous nose.

Bulbous nose? Sniffers.

Nose always grows. Yeah, it's like, kind of like it was just a very large.

Does nose always grow? On men? I know, but on women too.

Yeah.

Oh, I didn't know.

That's very specific.

No, but it's just funny. Why the nose?

I don't know.

I know other things that could grow.

Maybe because it's like, central to your face, so you're eyes gravitate to it. I don't know.

I think there's some psychology stuff there, right? The face and how it looks. And a bulbous nose can indicate issues or things with somebody's physical health. I just think that's that sort of subconscious stuff that triggers someone.

Like biology takes over.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Yep. Huh.

Huh.

Cool segue.

Yeah. I think we should talk about noses today. Who knew we'd talk about noses?

What else do you have to say about noses? What about the bumps? Do you like when people have bumps?

No, I don't have nothing wrong.

There's nothing about features yet.

No, actually, I think I like my wife's nose in particular. She has a cool Nose for a woman's nose. A woman's nose? Yeah.

My sister has a cool nose. It kind of like has a square at the end. A little bit.

No. Yeah, My wife too. A little bit. Like, a little. Yeah, squarey her nostril. I'm like, that's a nice nose.

Yeah.

For a woman.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I don't know who has a good man nose now. I'm thinking, I don't know, I think of an actor or something. I don't hate my nose, but I'm like, oh, my God. Like that nose, right? Someone nailed it there.

I don't think I hate so much.

God. Really, really picked out that one. I feel. I don't. Honestly, my nose was from the junk pile, but it was definitely in the surplus parts. You know what I'm saying? It's just. It's a little bit long, but. All right, let's get to the point at hand.

Anyway, our sponsors, yes, of course, that.

You know, are awesome. So they are in no particular order fund, Dara, Fundbox, Nextiva and Receipt bank. Which ironically isn't a particular order because that's how it's written here. So I guess that is a particular order. Do we have any shout outs or anything else?

I have two shout outs, actually. So first I'd like to shout out our. One of our recent new members, Ronalee Williams. She's over in Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania. It's close to us. Yeah, I actually went to Ronalee Drive on over. Come on over. But yeah, no, so her and her husband, they own tax services. They do tax bookkeeping, accounting and other consulting. And they focus in small business and nonprofits in Strasburg. So I just wanted to shout them out. Welcome to the family.

Yeah, welcome. We're excited to have you.

And I want to start doing this more. Is welcoming our new members.

I think that's wonderful. Yeah. We had on the call yesterday there was the. We call it the. The kickoff call just to meet the people that joined in the last few weeks, I think we had 15 people on that call. It was. It was packed. She was on that call and she's now Profit First Professional. She's going through the training Stroudsburg. You got a Profit First Professional out there.

Yeah.

Work with her.

Yeah.

What else did you want to do?

We got a community shout out, which, by the way, I want to bring recognition to our shout out hotline, the 844-876-7221. I love those little recordings. It's like 20 seconds. It tells you exactly what to do. But I love hearing your voices. I love hearing how enthusiastic you are about changing your lives around. So if you have a story, I want to hear it. But we got an email in from Priya. This is about actually the Profit first book, Mike.

Oh.

She writes that your book has been foundational for their small business. Despite being in the finance industry for over a decade, they were clueless when it came to the numbers beginning behind running a business. Once they read Profit first, they implemented it immediately and it became a part of the process that they now teach all of their entrepreneurs.

Go, Priya, Priya, you could be a Profit first professional right there. It's cool. It's cool. When I hear an accountant, a financial advisor like Priya is a bookkeeper embracing profit first and saying, we didn't even get it for ourselves.

Yeah.

Because the people who didn't get for themselves and now see the light, so to speak, are very capable of understanding the initial resistance entrepreneurs are going to have saying, I don't know, it's never worked. I've never been profitable. How can I all of a sudden become profitable? So it's kind of cool. Like, she understands her story. So, Priya, you. You kind of rock.

Yeah, that's awesome.

You more than kind of rock.

You too.

Let's get to our guest. His name is Dan Nichols.

Yes, it is.

Not pennies, not dimes, but Nichols. Dan. Does T. Dan Nichols does T stand for the.

It does now.

All right, so T. Dan Nichols or the Dan Nichols is the author of Get Unstuck and the Lemonade Stand. The Lemonade Stand simple program. So go on Amazon right now while you're doing this and get those. Uh, he is the company spokesperson for his company. Thrive Orchard is out of sequence here and has owned and operated his business since the age of 18. Dan, having a loving. A love for all things in business, has been in multiple industries since graduating from high school and college. Yeah, having a loving. You know, you guys don't you slip up in this. You slip up here in the studio at all. And Kelsey and Chris, you guys are on me.

He has a very loving relationship with businesses.

He's very loving.

Yeah.

Thrive Orchard helps people overcome their fears of starting a business and then develop their strategic plan. And a couple things you may not know about Dan. He's been employed his entire adult life. I guess you figured it out when I said he started at 18. He's only lost money in a few businesses over a 30 year period and started over a dozen. So I wish, I wish I could claim that same thing. And he shared the speaking stage with names like this. Colin Powell. Ever hear of him? Anyone? Anyone?

Never.

Steve Forbes. Anyone? Steve Forbes? Anyone? Brian Tracy? Anyone? Laura Bush. But he has her own TV show now. Lou Holt. Probably the funniest speaker I've ever seen in my life. And the most unique thing about him, he's a historian about Boonton, New Jersey. Yeah, he was telling us about the predominant.

It's impressive.

Yeah.

Oh, no, it's impressible. That's awesome.

Yeah, it is very impressible. Dan, welcome to the show.

Oh, man, you got me freaking out now on my New Jersey. My Boonton, New Jersey trivia.

No, you nailed that fact.

You know way more than any of us. So you're okay.

Yeah. But probably one of the most impressible facts that you have is that you say there's five major psychological issues holding people back from launching a profitable business. I wanna dig right into this. What are the factors holding people back?

Right now I'm trying to find out if impressible's a word.

Oh, yeah, it is. It's in the Christina dictionary.

Okay. Hey. So the way this works is I've been self employed my whole life, and then over that time, just like any entrepreneur over a period of decades, sometimes it might take a whole lifetime. And that's kind of a bummer. I'm hoping that's not me. But you start to see, you see these pieces that you're like, oh, wow. Wow. I was holding back because of this. I was holding back because of this. So I call what I call the five core psychological issues that hold people back. The first one being. And I'll touch on them, we can go deeper into them, but I'll just touch on the main names of them. Right now. I like it. One I call the FULBS syndrome. Why? I had to try to make an acronym out of it, I guess F, O, L, B. The fear of looking bad. Nobody wants to look bad. You know, we all want to try to present our best self. We don't want a bulbous nose or what was the other thing?

We don't want to say the word impressible in front of an audience.

It's a real word.

Yeah, yeah.

Is it really?

Yeah, no way. It is.

I just looked it up.

Okay, so the fear of looking bad.

Yeah, yeah. So the fear of looking bad is one. And these are things, by the way, you know, that I discovered myself. That's why I know them so damn well. So the ADA syndromes, allowance, deservance and approval people are Looking for these things in their life. I'll keep on going down the line here. The OMT paradox, the belief that if I just get one more thing, then I'll have everything I need. That's a line of crap. We know that. Right then. 4. One that's probably more common as far as, like, out there in the world where people are aware of the term is the imposter syndrome. That we don't believe, we don't believe we are, so we don't think we can. We feel like we're faking the current moment. That's kind of that light, just giving you that lightly. And then another one I have under the umbrella I call social constraints. And that is. That encompasses a number of different psychological issues that. And by the way, I took a lot of psych in college. None of these were specifically addressed except for the imposter syndrome. It doesn't mean that I'm the new Freud or I invent anything. I just think that they offer an interesting slant to people in their endeavoring to be successful entrepreneurs when they observe these things and they're aware of these things, because only when you become aware of them, you know, you put them on your radar. Only then can you say, aha, you're not going to get me this time.

Okay, so now we know they are. I want to go through each one. I do want to dive deep. So you said the first psychological principle that holds us back from launching a profitable business is the fear of looking bad. Explain further. What does that mean exactly? And then how would that hold us back from being profitable?

Well, you know, I remember reading this and I thought it was just so. It just really impacted me when I read this, read this little story about this guy. He's sitting in a restaurant, gets up, walks calmly into the bathroom, and he's found dead an hour later. Cause of death, asphyxiation. Let me ask you, did he choke on the chicken bone or did he choke because he didn't want to make a ruckus in a scene?

Oh, gee, that's a good point. Yeah, I suspect last week he was probably with Moshe. He was so embarrassed in the whole bathroom scene we had here, like you couldn't even go in there. So I suspect. I suspect the guy got up, he was embarrassed of choking in front of the people and tries to dislodge himself.

Yeah, exactly. He go. He tries to get out of the public eye. And I'm just saying what I mean by this is that that is such an intense thing. It's actually Tied to the deepest fear of all, which is the fear of death, by the way. The fear of looking bad is tied to the fear of loss of control. Fear of loss of control is tied to the even deeper than that, which is just fear of death, but just sort of the one that everybody can kind of recognize is like public speaking, the number one fear. Right. Why? Because nobody wants to feel like, you know, everybody's watching them and they're gonna screw up, you know, or I'm not good enough for. And this kind of leads and segues into other issues around, you know, you don't think you deserve to be up there, you don't allow yourself to succeed, you know, things like that. So here's the big question that I would ask all the entrepreneurs listening is if we're afraid to dance in the dark or even sing in the shower, a lot of people won't sing in their own shower, in their own home. I ask you now, what else are you afraid of? What else are you afraid of? What are you not doing to be your best in life?

So that's a good point. So when it comes to profitability, are you saying, Dan, that some people are fearful of their idea of falling flat and that's why they don't even start it?

Absolutely. I mean, because we're conditioned from the time we're little kids and you know, don't do that, don't do that, don't do that. Don't. You move into an adult and you think you shed that stuff. The reality is, no, at 49 years of age, I've got a one year old in me, a two year old in me, a three year old. I won't bore you, but I'll go all the way up to 49, right? I mean, they're all in me. They didn't die, they didn't go away. They're still there. The experiences are still there. So those things are deep seated. And those people that are extroverted or more comfortable being in front of people, that's something that they have. And that's why people are fascinated by them a lot of times is they wish they had that little piece, that little piece that would step up on a stage and share their information. That little piece that would start a podcast, that would open a business, that would share their inner guru. Right? They don't do it because they don't own it, because they have all these fears around it.

Okay? So they're stopping the tracks before they begin. So my question is, how do you a, you realize you have this and then b. How do you get over it?

Well, I think one way might be just to think to yourself, like, you know, because you got to go inward for this stuff, right? I mean, this is just the evolution of self. You've got to go inward. And so when you're. And only when you're aware of it can you, you can say, oh, I got it, I see it. And then you need to manage that. And the reality is, Mike Kelly or Kelsey, Christina, sorry, all three, all four of you. Now we got a Kelly in there. All of you. Like, the reality is if you aren't aware of it and it's not on your radar, it'll continue to undermine your capacity, your ability for your potential. That's just the way it is, period. It's only when you're aware of it, you say, aha, I see that. Or that inner voice that we sometimes catch and we say, no, no, no, not today. I'm gonna make that phone call. I'm gonna take that awkward sales call. I'm gonna, you know, you're gonna do the thing that's a little awkward and uncomfortable, and only then I'll tell you. I started. I remember when I started my lawn business out of high school and then I went into the disc jockey business, then I went into game show entertainment. I've done them all over the country. Family feud, Jeopardy style, gaming. Why am I sharing that? Because I remember the first time I got on that microphone, I couldn't speak. It was a little birthday party. I took a really simple gig, something really easy. I couldn't speak, I choked up. And I remember it was because all of a sudden it was me I was on. And interestingly, I started that because what I really wanted was to share the stage with some of the people that you were just talking about. I shared the stage with. I wanted to be up on a big stage someday. Zig Ziglar was the guy. He was like my man. And I always wanted to be that guy. And I thought, you know what? I'll get comfortable in front of crowds. And this is the easiest way for me for a young kid to start. As far as I saw it was, I'll go be a dj.

So, okay, so you gotta get past it. But I still wanna dig a little deeper. How do I know that I'm having the fear of something? A fear of looking bad? I mean, I think I would come up with excuses, here's why I can't do it. And I would try to use logic to overcome that emotional fear. I wanna know, how do I identify? This is truly just a phobia, almost.

Well, you know, the one thing I think is important too is, as my psychologist friends tell me, goes, you got the 90 and the dime. The 90 runs the show. The 10% gets punched, hit punch like, shut up, kid, go away. And that dime is that 10%. That's the logic. The logic doesn't rule or drive the bus. The emotions drive the bus. And we all like to try to get beyond that and say, well, you know, let's have a more logical approach. Look it. Since that's never a good litmus test for reality. What drives the bus is how we feel. That's what drives us. So you've got to stop and pause and say, why? Why am I hesitating? I mean, if you were to diagram this, you'd have to say, okay, I need to stop and I have to figure out what is it? And then what's even more interesting than that is you look at some people and they'll play within their comfort zone. Because first and foremost, that's what we are. We're comfort addicts. You don't become an alcoholic, you don't get addicted to cigarettes, you don't get addicted to food. What you get addicted to is the confidence and how they make you feel. That cigarette makes you feel good. So good luck trying to quit cigarettes by saying, well, gee, you know, it causes cancer. Who cares? It feels good.

Okay, you see? Yeah. So, I mean, I got you now. I got you. Why we stick in a bad habit because of the fear, because it feels good not to do something. Once we realize, once we see that emotion, that our emotions holding us back. What step do I take to overcome that?

I'm going to tell you right now, it's that dive in thing, right? Feel the fear and do it anyway. What choice do you have? I don't see. I don't. You don't get on the phone and call somebody and say, hey, can I do this right? You just got to do it. The polar opposite to the fear of looking bad. The polar opposite is admiration. That's the ego's most valuable commodity. We want to be admired, we want to be loved, and we want to be cherished. So the polar opposite to the fear of looking bad is admiration. You know, it's completely on the other end of the spectrum. But the only way you're going to get there is by. Is by kind of reaching down and doing that thing anyway. You know, you've got to do that.

So do you hold that carrot out there in front of you, Dan, do you say, you know, what? If I do this, here's where I can end up. I mean, I think the fear of looking bad, we look at the worst potential outcome like this. May I fall flat on my face. I'll embarrass myself in front of everyone. Do you put that carrot out there and saying, you know what? But what if I succeed? This is where it can take me.

Yeah. You know, for me, Mike, I. I like to do stuff for the challenge of doing it sometimes because I need to prove to me and my evolution of self that I can freaking do this, that I'm as good as the next guy, and damn it, I can do this. I'll give you a perfect example. I remember years ago, a good psychologist friend of mine, he had called me up on the phone. He said, hey, Dan. Because he knows I'm in the entertainment industry. He said, I got a. I got a gig, man. He goes, I. I can't get anybody to cover it. I need you to go hypnotize a group of high school kids. I said, what? He's like, look, Dan, I can make a great entertainer, a really good hypnotist, but I can't make a good hypnotist a great entertainer. And he said, and I know you're a great entertainer. And I said, you know what, brother? I've been. I've been reading these books on hypnosis. And I went and did it. And I'll tell you what, it was probably one of the scariest entrepreneurial things I've ever done. And it was funny because it was. For me, it was a bucket list. I'd always wanted to do the hypnosis thing live and actually work a group. And there I was in front of about 150 kids, their parents, you know, kind of all looking on, and I. And I did something that, like, is really king in the hypnosis world. If you're gonna be up on stage doing it is. I went for the alpha male, okay? I looked for the biggest jock with his hat on backwards.

Oh, I knew that was coming out. There it is. Okay.

And I looked for him. I knew he was the one that everybody loved. The girls loved him, the guys wanted to be him, et cetera, et cetera. And I went over and I saw. I could see his eyes. I could see the state that he was in. They called a fugue state. Anyway, this isn't about hypnosis, but the long story short.

Play this out.

Yeah. So I went over to the kid, I put my arms on his back, kind of on his back. I touched his forehead, I ran my hands down his face. I said, sleep. The kid went out like a light bulb.

Really?

Oh, wow.

Like a light bulb. Now you gotta understand, I went through a series of exercises, a series of protocol to get myself to get the kids in that room. And by the way, high school kids are a good group. Athletes are pretty good group. Cops are great groups. People that are used to taking direction are good groups. That's the other thing too is a lot of people like, oh, you couldn't hypnotize me. And the issue really becomes all hypnosis is self hypnosis. I can't do it unless you want me to do it to you. So if you want to fight it, go ahead and fight it. But do you want to feel it? Because it's pretty cool. Let me go ahead and take control, you know. So part of this though goes back to this other piece around the psychology and entrepreneurship and doing stuff is there's order and process in everything. There's not one successful entrepreneur in the world that ever made any money doing in business that didn't follow an order. In the same way I have to do a certain order to hypnotize a group of people, I have to also perform an order in order to succeed in the business of my own. And if you don't, if you don't have passion behind what it is you're doing, if you don't persist, and if you don't have vision, Those are the, those are the three requirements of order in business. Passion, persistence, and vision. You got to have all three. If the thing isn't working for you, you need to do a gut check and say, what am I not passionate about? How is it I'm not persisting? Or what is it I'm not clear on? Where is my vision weak? And you will see that there's a disconnect in there. And what it usually is, Mike, it's usually tied to a lack of passion. They're doing it because for a perfect example, multi level marketing, I absolutely have no problem with it. I think it's a great place for people to start and even finish. If they love it, good for them. But you better be passionate about selling X, Y or Z. Whether it's vitamins or furniture or, you know, makeup. I don't care what it is. You better be passionate about it because if you lack that, you won't make any money at it. Because somebody else out there, they have It. And they're going to, they're going to. They're going to rule the roost because they've got the passion.

Gotcha. So fear of looking bad. Passion is the way past it. That will bring you to profitability. The next thing you said that's preventing profitability, at least from the psychological standpoint, is ada. Was that allowance deservance and approval.

Yeah. So one time I remember really being really bummed out about some entrepreneurship stuff. Yeah, allowance deservance and approval is. A lot of us are waiting for a smack on the butt from the eighth grade coach game. Go get them, kid. But yet we're 25 years old or we're 30. There's no coach around to smack us on the butt. You know, that's that allowing yourself to do it. Or the approval piece, by the way, they get a little conflated. That's really the approval piece. I'll go back to allowance for a second though. Under the ADA syndrome, allowances. I remember one time literally crying my eyes out and my wife's like, look, Dan. She goes, it's like, you don't allow yourself to succeed. And that was an aha moment for me because I thought, she's right. I got this piece of self sabotage in me. I got this piece of self sabotage in me that just doesn't allow it. And then the deservance piece. One time we had gone to Napa and gotten a couple of massages. One time we went out for like a wine tour thing years ago. And I remember one time.

And your coach showed up, slapped you in the ass.

You crack him up.

Oh, see, I don't have a fear of looking back.

It only gets more weird when I tell you that my main coach in high school was her dad. But anyways, yeah, so, but no, no, so. So I remember she went to go give me a foot massage. She we bought this peppermint oil and I was just like, no, no, no, you don't. And I caught myself. I'm like, I didn't think I deserved a foot massage. Well, who the hell? Wait a second. I'm her husband. I'm married. I caught this piece of me. I listened to that inner voice and. And then I thought to myself, holy crap, if I don't think I deserve a foot massage for my wife, what else don't I deserve? A million dollar. A million dollar business. A $5 million. What else don't I deserve? If I don't deserve a freaking foot massage, what else don't I deserve? So I challenge all the entrepreneurs that listen to this to think look themselves in the mirror and say, what is it they don't think they deserve? Where are you playing? Are you playing at 50 grand a year? 100 grand a year? Why you deserve 500? Why not a million? Why not a $20 million buyout? Why not you? If not you, who?

Let me ask you this. Is it possible that this is an ego game? That I say I don't deserve it because I don't want to look better than others, or, you know, I, I, it's just for my own ego, I'm going to buy stuff with it. For me to overcome that deservence challenge, do I have to see the, the goodness that comes out of having that $20 million or whatever you, you pointed at.

Are you allowed to say, you can you say what kind of words? It's like PG 13.

Oh, no, you can swear, you can swear. Okay, just don't say abs, that's all.

No, no, no, no. Yeah, so what it is though is it's a line of bullshit, right? You got to realize, you got to look yourself in the mirror and say, look, I'm not even being honest with myself here. And again, I go back to the whole thing, the whole thing around deserve. Really? Why not you? Why not you? You know, and we look at these entrepreneurs that go off and they just do these amazing things and we look at them like, yeah, well, you know what? He just was more deservant of it, you know, of that, what he got or she got, than I was, you know.

Watch that show American Greed. No, have you seen that, Dan? American Greed.

Yeah. Yep.

So you know, those are people, these are criminally minded people.

Yeah.

And they feel they deserve it and they make ridiculous amounts of money. It's weird. I wonder if the, it's, it's really the dilemma of the good guy and good gal that out there saying, I really don't deserve this. I wonder if it's a, I still wonder if it's an ego issue, Dan.

Yeah, but, yeah, but here's the other thing too though. Here's the other thing. You gotta look at 10% of the population are sociopaths, right? And I'm not. And this isn't like a ha ha, this is like, it's for real. When you look at leaders, when you look at leaders in general, whether it be business leaders or, you know, politically, you know, leaders, they've got this piece in them and I remember one time talking to my brother in law, we were talking actually about Colin Powell and I had Said something to him about, yeah, you know what? I heard he was a narcissist or something like that. And my brother in law looked at me and he said, he goes, who else do you want running the army?

Yeah, that's a good point.

And I thought, geez, yeah, what do you want? Some guy that's hiding behind the foxhole saying, oh, we're not going up there.

We don't deserve to win. Right?

Yeah, exactly. Think about it, you almost need a touch of that. You need a piece of that ego that lifts you up and says, no, brother, you are good enough. Because we play small too often.

You know, my turning point was this. I say regularly, I say it actually every day, that I am the most prolific small business author of the century. And that's a, it's a bold, outrageous, I'm doing air quotes statement, especially when said in the present tense. But I'm in a group that said, you gotta see who you are. And once you see the positive impact, like I'm not doing it for my ego, albeit I know that's threaded in, I can't prevent that, but I am really doing it to have a positive impact on other people. And he said, this is a mission, a cause, you have to do it and you have to step up that big. So I get that.

Now let's talk about my quick challenge on that. Take away the word. And I've noticed this in the texting world, we've removed I from a lot of stuff. Now love ya. We don't say I love you, we even say ya. We've taken away the I. We've taken away the you with just called it ya. We. We've descended, we've taken out the part that really touches the heart, the deeper stuff. Now I would ask you then to also get comfortable saying you're the most prolific business author in the world. Why do you have to say small?

Yeah, good question, good question. You know, and I'm not saying I have my reasons behind that, but. But your point is taken.

I get it. Yeah, yeah, I get it. Right, right.

I'm just saying, you slapping the ass coach.

I'm just saying try that on. Just try it on and see how it feels. I'm with you on the small thing. Right. Because what small business is actually big business. It's 99% of all the businesses out there, blah, blah, blah. But still, with that being said, take away the word small and see how that feels. Next time you send a text to somebody, forget the love. You say I love you.

And See how that feels.

Are you able to move to the heart? You got to move from the heart because what we want is heart. We want heart centered leaders. That's what we want and that's what we're attracted to from the heart.

Tell me about omt, the one more thing. What's this? Disbelief, preventing profitability.

The belief that if I just have one more thing, then I'll be good enough. I'll give you an example. I got my college degree for one reason. I always felt like a loser because I didn't have it. That's it. Period. Did I really? I mean is all the stuff that I later learned in life, did it really come from college or. No, I mean it came from my experiences in life. Right. I got it because I felt like I had a chip on my shoulder and I needed to be done with that chip. And I. And I never once used my college. Well that's not true. Even all my small business in my bios, I'll put University of Michigan, that's the greatest college in the world. But I'm too. I'm kidding. No, but so like it's a marketing piece at some level. But the reality is like I did that for me because I just needed to get over that piece. It was a hurdle stuck in my way and I knew I'd never get that chip off my shoulder. I have friends of mine that to this day successful entrepreneurs that to this day they didn't have their degree and they still kind of have this attitude about it and I think like eh, you still a little bit raw about that, aren't you?

And I think it lands in the now what Syndrome. Right. So you say, oh, if I just get that college degree. But then it happens and you're like now what? And I see it in profitability with clients, meaning a business will say if I can just get one more client, finally I'll be profitable. And they get that one client. It doesn't happen. And they're like, well now what? And they go back into the well, maybe it's just one more client. And they seem to be trapped there and never turn a profit.

Yeah. And then I was teaching a class at my public library and I had this lady in my class who'd been selling these real densely packed high nutrition bars. Nutrition bars. And she sells them at the local farmer's market in the city I live in here in Royal Oak, Michigan. And she sells them there and has been selling them there for about eight years. This woman is an absolute encyclopedia of nutrition. She Looks amazing. Just everything about her. And she's in the class, and she shared with the class that what she really wanted to do, though, was move beyond that. She sells these once a month, and they line up out the door. She sells all of them. And she said she dreads cooking these things, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But she said it's just part of it. This is this business she created. And she said what she really wants to do, though, is be a nutrition coach. And she said, but I need to go and I need to get my certification. And I said, stop. And we had about 15 people in the class, and I said, stop. I said, which one of you in here, if anybody in here right now, did any of you doubt even for a moment that she didn't absolutely, positively own it? Would you not think of her as the fitness coach with this certification piece? And everybody looked at her and said, yeah, you're nuts. You so own it. Don't even. What is this thing around having to get your nutrition certification or something? You know, you own it. You own it. You know? And so for her, it was a one more thing. And she sent me an email back after talking to her therapist, and she said, dan, you touched my life. You moved me, you know, because that's what that did for her, that set her free around this belief that she needed the certification.

So what about all the folks listening in right now that are thinking, I need one more client to be profitable? What do you tell them to get past that psychological barrier?

Well, you know, I guess I look at that as more like the mechanics of the business. I mean, I need one more client to be profitable. I guess I would probably want to pour into their book a little bit and wonder why they weren't profitable with the 99 and why do they really need the 100?

Yeah, why aren't you profitable already? Right?

Yeah. Why aren't you profitable already? What is this one more thing that'd be hard for me to buy?

Okay, I love that imposter syndrome. Tell me more about that.

Yeah, it's just very simple. You don't believe you are.

So.

You don't think you can. You get up in front of. I mean, Mike, even to this day. How long have you been doing your public speaking?

10 years.

How long did it take you? How long did it take you? Or have. Or are. Are you there yet?

Where.

When you walk up there, you 100% know that this is your throne. You own it. This is your thing.

Yeah, it's taken me a long. I am there it's taken me a long time to get there. I actually wouldn't even admit I was an author for about five years after I became an author because I didn't think that was right.

Yeah, you didn't think that was for real. Even when I would tell people I'm an author, or I wrote this book or I did this, or, you know, I never feel like it in my head. What am I saying? You're a liar.

Yeah.

You're not. Shit. You know, that's what's going on in my head. But the reality is now, though, I'm aware of the little kid saying that. I'm aware of the kid that got cut from the baseball team. I'm aware of all those little, you know, those voices of doubt. And instead I arrest them and say, hey, but here's the other thing. I don't believe in the whole good, bad thing, because then what I am is just a battleground. I don't believe that. What I think is those voices, they're my teachers. They're here to say, no, Dan, Step up to the plate, brother. Don't let me bring you down. Don't let me bring you down. So they're teachers because I don't want a war within. I want peace within. And I just refuse to believe that what I am is a battleground. Because a lot of people say, oh, that's the eagle, or that's the ego, or that's Satan, or what? No, what are you? A battleground.

Let's see, could that be Satan? That's a 70s reference also for you guys. So, okay, so the imposter syndrome. And you're overcoming it by. You're just that. In that case, it sounds like you're confronting it, Dan.

Absolutely. You got to be aware of it, because the stuff doesn't die. The inner child, you don't get to lay that to rest. That's always going to be there, and that's that thing. I want to go back to the omt, Right. The one more thing. Oh, when all that stuff subsides, then I'll be ready to hit the big stage. Are you kidding me? It's never going to subside, brother. The people, they're either A, maybe they are narcissists, and in that case, they figured it out. Or B. Or B. And I was kind of tongue in cheek on that one. Or B, they're aware of the voice, but they do it anyhow.

The whole.

What is it, Susan Jeffers. The fear. The fear. Feel the fear and do it anyway. You Know, I mean, that's it, you know, I'll tell you what, I'll give you guys. When I spoke on that tour with all those big names, I would be slipped in between as a commercial, you know, and I would sell product from the stage. And I'm not going to tell you what I was selling, but, well, I can tell you it was a very high end finance product.

Okay?

Okay. And the thing is, I came to them because I wanted to sell my lemonade stand, simple process from the stage. And they flipped the script on me and says, we don't want to sell that. We want you to sell our. Sell our stock trading program. So I sold that from the stage. And you want to talk about feeling funny?

Yeah.

I wasn't a stock trader, but I'm in front of thousands of people now pitching this product. That was kind of bizarre. But you know what? I believed in it. And it took me. At first I told the guy no, and then I studied the stuff and the program and how it worked and how it operated, and then I did it because I believed in it. Why? Because I cannot sell crap if I'm not passionate about it. When I get multi level marketers saying, you got to sell this for me, blah, blah, I go, forget it, brother. I'm not passionate about. What do you mean you can make a lot of money? If money was the only thing I was passionate about, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

Oh, yeah, I hate that. Oh, I'm doing. My passion is money, making money. So it's funny, we, Mike Scalise, also known as the Hawaiian lumberjack, here, he's now helping on with member recruitment, basically. So when a member calls, he'll explain what we do and if it's a fit or not. He believes in profit first professionals so much, he's so successful with this. And his quote unquote sales pitch is basically saying, I don't know if it's a fit for you or you know what, from what we said, it's definitely a fit for you. Like that's his whole sales process. And what I'm hearing is Michael Scalise is not an imposter. He feels it. And Dan, what I'm hearing to get past this imposter syndrome is you have to be passionate about what you do and believe it fully.

Yeah, well, you certainly have to have that. And then you have to realize and recognize fully that you're going to experience that resistance. Life is resistance. Right. There's. We're always, every day we wait to walk we need. We have to resist the ground below us. I mean, everything. So you're just going to have to face that stuff. You're going to have to face it. I mean, it goes. It's all these things. The answer is pretty simple. You got to be aware of them, spot it because you got it. And then you need to. And then you need to manage that by saying, no, you're not going to take me today. Right now. I'm going to make that phone call right now. I'm going to make that sale.

No, I was just going to say, how do you. But how do you beat it? Like, how do you beat all the questions? If you finally. Like, for me, as an example, I, you know, I'm. I'm a professional. Well, I won't even. I don't like to call myself a professional singer because I'm not on a professional stage, but I, I study opera and I would. I have this vision of opening, you know, a recording or not a recording studio, a learning studio for kids. But I'm like, well, I've never been on a professional stage, so I don't have the professional experience. I can only play chords on a piano. So how do. Once I get myself into that thing of, no, I know what I'm doing, I know that I have it in me. I can teach it to you. How do I get past that criticism of, well, where are your credentials? Why should I? You know what I mean? How do you, how do you explain yourself? Or do you have to.

All right, well, so I think that what resonates always with us as human beings is if you don't believe it, I'm not going to believe it. That's number one. Number two, remember the lady that was in my class with the nutrition thing? Not one person in that class raised their hand or said they disagreed. And it was a very open forum. I can assure you, when I teach my classes, we're all very comfortable kind of talking and just hanging out and having a good time discussing business ideas and stuff. So everybody in that room believed this lady. They never for a moment doubted her. And had they needed a fitness guru, you know, a nutrition guru, excuse me, she would have been a top choice. I mean, she sounded like an encyclopedia every time. She knew all the chemical components of this, that the lady was just brilliant around it, yet she had no certification or quote, unquote, formal education.

You know, to me, I think just to add to that, too, it's the intangible you have. You care about the client, the customer more than anyone else. And if that's true, that's the major qualification.

You know that's true.

Dan, last one, because we're running out of time here. We actually started touching on. Is the social media, the social influence. Tell us about that psychological barrier.

Hey, so since we have two females here, this one here, I was what I call the reverse imposter. And why am I bringing that up? Because it falls under this umbrella of social constraints. And that's a lot of times it's very gender strong. Females feel, excuse me, feel it a lot. And that is that they don't feel like they're faking the current moment. They totally know they could rock the current moment, but they don't do it because it doesn't seem socially acceptable or doesn't feel right to them. They actually fake the current moment by not stepping up. Okay, another one that falls under this is what I call the Petri prophecy. What goes in is what comes out. So what goes into that dish? Only the little pieces that go into that dish. And I'll give you a great example. I think this is it. And there's a few others that fall under here. But we're running out of time. But I remember one time there was a four wheeler commercial that came on the television. My daughter's 11 now and I think she was like five or six at the time. And I remember the four wheeler commercial came on and it was like, you know, get yourself a new ATV and blah, blah, blah. And I remember thinking like, God, if I'd only had a boy.

Right?

That was it. And you know what, what a load of crap that was. All of a sudden, as her dad, my daughter can't get on.

Really?

How does that even work? But see, those are the things you got to be aware of because they limit you. But how many of us live our lives with that stuff under the radar? You got to get this stuff out. You need to excavate this. If you want to make money in a business of your own, you need to excavate these limiting pieces of you. And there's a lot of them. And I address them all in my. I have an online course, Get Unstuck. I got my online school, the Thrive Orchard school and that's. I address all that. I have a psychology one, the get unstuck course. It's a real easy course. And you know what's most amazing though, guys, and I'm sure you've experienced, all of you, when you know, if you've done any online courses or teaching is I'LL get. People enroll, they spend the money and they. And then I look at how many minutes they spend in the course.

One.

Yeah. Wow.

Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah, I see it over and over again. I, I just. Funny story. Then we gotta get your info. I was at a, an event and someone came up and said, I love your books. I love your books. Like, oh, thanks. Which one you love the most? And this was a few years back, like Toy Paper Entrepreneur. Like, it's such a powerful book. I'm like, thanks. Just tell me what's the most. Your most favorite part? Like, oh, I haven't read it yet. I just like, I love the idea. Like, and I have it. And it's true. Like, a lot of people consume books, they never read it. A lot of people take that one step and never follow through. And I think these five psychological barriers speak to why we're not following through on things. Dan, we gotta wrap things up. Where can people get your stuff and learn more about you? Exactly.

I think the, probably the quickest, easiest place to land would be Facebook. Just, you know, go to Facebook, search for thrive orchard. It's facebook.com, you know, forward slash Thrive Orchard. I also have my online school. But again, if you just kind of want. I recognize it's a dating game, right? Like, you know, people kind of got to get to know me. So I think the Facebook piece is probably one of the easiest. And then I do also, if they wanted to go right to the course online, it's thrive orchard.teachable.com.

Fantastic. And we'll have it all in the show notes. Dan.

Cool.

Thanks so much for joining us today.

Thank you, Dan. That was awesome.

Glad to be here, guys.

You know how what we do next, we're going to share what we learned, we're going to share some other details and first we're going to talk about our corporate partners.

Yes.

Yeah. Right? Did I do that right? Language guard. Okay, so do you guys want to talk about them? I'll let you two handle it. How's that sound?

Sure.

Cool.

All right. Yeah. So next, Diva voice over ip. The best phone system in businesses ever.

You guys are crushing. You guys are crushing it. Best phones in the universe ever. Okay.

And your turn count.

Okay.

Fundera is a one stop shop for all your loan needs. They will shop for all the loans for you, for all your business purposes and get you something within 24 hours.

And they're the best ever. Who else?

Receipt Bank. No more. Do you need to keep those stupid little receipts in your wallet? Just take out your Phone, scan them into the app, they will load. And I believe it actually links to your accounting system as well. So it loops right in there.

It does.

Big time saver.

There was some research done about Receipt bank versus all the competitors. Receipt bank, one Best ever award. Yeah. Yeah.

And finally.

And the judges were the three of us.

Exactly. Well, that's a good point. Who's the last one?

The last one is Funbox. They solve all of your cash flow needs. If you have any problems with your accounts receivable, they will spot you the money and then you can pay it back.

Yeah. Actually, we have some checks to be deposited today. I put into Asana for you.

Yeah. Thank you for the reminder. Yes.

Oh, my God. That was just right before we started this. You're impressive. You know who you are? You are the best ever. All right. Right. I think that's.

We have talk.

What did we learn today?

Oh, for God's sake. No, I use that turn. Yeah. What did we learn? Thank God you guys are here. I got. So did you learn. Let me start with I learned. Yeah, he didn't talk about it, but it applies this. I met a guy named Todd Herman, and he's writing a new book that's coming out called the Alter Ego. And Dan accidentally called you Kelly, and we joked about a little bit, but it also speaks to an alter ego because you kind of said, oh, Kelly's their good one.

Yeah.

This guy who wrote this book, Todd Herman, about the alter ego, says he coaches some of the most elite professional athletes. And he says the biggest step for them getting past all these roadblocks is to come up with a different ego, an alter ego that when they step on the field or they step in that moment that they take on that new name. Oh, this is Kelly showing up to the podcast.

Yeah.

And now they can live out that alter ego and don't have to confine with their past of their childhood and so forth.

Oh, yeah.

So that was kind of my takeaway.

Yeah. What.

What's your other name for when you got to perform, Kelly?

Sparkles.

Sparkle. No, no, this isn't a strip joint.

Marshmallow.

Okay.

Marshmallow. That would be the worst stripper name. There's Marshmallow. Everyone's like, okay, get out of here. Quickly, quickly. All right, what'd you learn? Marshmallow Chocolate. What'd you learn today?

Okay. I think I just learned that I'm not alone. I think the kind of human psychology aspect is actually really reassuring. And I also, like, kind of juxtaposed to last week's episode with Moshe where his was very much plan and prepare before you start your business. And this is more, you know, take a leap of faith. And all of those voices in your head, you have to let go and go for it. And I feel like I'm really good at jumping off. And then like, once I get there, I get really scared.

Yeah.

And then I can't, you know, I just sort of like plateau.

Okay, good one. Good one, Kevi.

To stop letting fear be a cripple. I know I'm guilty of that too. And I think for. For me especially, I. I always confuse selfishness with self worth.

Oh, good.

Where I'm. I talk myself out of so many things because I feel like I don't deserve it or that. Or that I feel like I'm being selfish when I know that I, in fact do deserve it. And I think a lot of people can relate to that as well.

Classic, classic, classic, classic. Oh, you know, we're gonna do. So I'm talking about Profit First Professionals. You guys share where people can go. We're also going to do what your stripper name is. We'll do the very, very end. I got it. So what can people do right now?

Please go to Profit first professionals dot com. Why, Mike?

Because if you go to Profit first professionals dot com you can find a Profit First Professional, someone who drive profit in your business. So it's real quick, really. To go to profit first professionals.com then click on the find button, fill out the form. There you put the information about your business. If you want to improve your profitability, the more details you put in there, the better because we'll match you up then with one of our certified Profit First Professionals. People have been trained by myself and our team here. They will deliver profit to your business. It's that simple. And you can do it right now. Go to profitfirstprofessionals.com, click on the find button, fill out the form. We're off to the races. Oh, and our podcatchers. Where can they go? And leave us a comment.

Oh, of course, itunes, Stitcher, Tune in, radio, Google Play, and of course, Profit first podcast dot com.

Okay, your stripper name. Here's how we do it, how you do it. It's your. Any of your pets, the first pet that comes to mind. You've had an entire life, your pet's name and the street you grew up on. For example, our cat was named Patch. I grew up on Glenbourne Drive, so my stripper name is Patch Glenborn.

It doesn't work.

That works.

That's not bad.

You're like, I'm going to that strip toy in a heartbeat. Now introducing himself as Patch Glenbor. What about you? What's your stripper name?

Annie Willow.

That's perfect. That totally works. Better than marshmallow. All right, what's yours?

Emmy Lana Konig. The winner.

The winner. All right, we're out of here, everyone.

Sam.