EP#75 - Think About Your Thinking to Achieve Financial Freedom with Charlie Epstein

This is Mike Koenigs and welcome to another episode of Capability Amplifier. I'm here with a very good friend, also a client. His name is Charlie Epstein. Also happens to be a longtime member of Strategic Coach. How many years?

26 and.

Yeah, 26.

Amazing. Now I want to frame this and set it up because you know what.

I am, don't you? I am the ultimate slow learner with deep pockets.

I love that. That's one of Dan's very finest.

It's not. It's not the Deepak. It's not Deepak pockets.

It's not Deepak pockets. That's right. Yes, that is right. Right? Oh yeah. Oh yeah, that's. That's right. That is not right. Oh, okay. So I want to say something really cool about Charlie Epstein.

Charlie knows how to make paste interesting. And what do I mean by that? Well, he's in a highly commoditized, very, very challenging market that is also governed by all sorts of rules and regulations, financial advisory, and he happens to be the only financial advisor in the world with a one man show which is called Yield of Dreams. Paychecks for life. He's been a busker in New York City subways, had a show. What's that?

London Subways.

London Subway. That even makes it more interesting. Mind your head. And an off Broadway show. He grew up with aspirations to be an actor and became an actor. He's done television. And I think what I love most about Charlie is he has the ability to get outside his container, his Charlie character and human and wonder in a really fascinating way and try on all sorts of ideas. And he's open and creative and, and expansive and it's a beautiful combination that's very unusual, not to mention rolled up in a charismatic personality. So, Charlie Epstein, thank you for being here, my friend.

Good to be here in the field of dreams. Literally. I am sitting at home plate, folks, in Dyersville, Iowa, at the official Field of Dreams field from the movie Field of Dreams. And I think we're going to get into that as we talk about.

Whatever it is you want to talk about.

We'Re talking about today.

I wanted to ask you some questions because, you know, the podcast is Capability Amplifier. Dan and I and I have been doing this for a couple of years and my objective, my goal with every episode is for the viewer, the listener, to expand and increase and grow a capability, have a functional tactical takeaway by understanding someone else's brain and being able to try on a new operating system. And I think that's a, a very, very important.

Thinking, exercise and, and one thing we know about Dan Sullivan is he creates tools that change your thinking and you walk out with a profound new understanding.

And.

Like I said, an upgraded operating system with every quarterly episode or event that we go to, whether it's virtual or in. In. In the meat world. So I wanted to begin. We'll do your background, but I really want to talk to you, Charlie, about your creativity. You have a very interesting, unusual way of being able to make the profoundly, seemingly commoditized world, heavily regulated world of financial advice interesting. And I want you to talk a little bit about where you had your breakthrough moment and started to crush it as a sales guy. And then I'll get into more about you. But I think that's a good place to start because it will naturally lead into all about you.

Well, you made me think of a dear friend of mine, John Scott, who was in the 401k business. And back in 1992, we launched something called the 401k coach program. So up until that time, Mike, I was a financial advisor. Like other financial advisors. We have a very diverse business. We have our own investment advisory firm. I started 1979 right out of college selling life insurance for the Mass Mutual life insurance company right out of my car. Didn't know anybody failed their aptitude test, was going to be a failure, and was very, very successful. But I can remember in 1992, John, very successful advisor, walking up to my Booth in Phoenix, Arizona, 401k coach. He said, you know, I think I could use a coach. We became very, very, very good friends. But John has always said something that I find flattering and humorous. He said, charlie is the only guy I know that can monetize air.

I think you're one of those people too. And I've always been fascinated with the entertainment world. My mother was an opera singer. Her father, my grandfather was a starving artist. But then my father was an entrepreneur, and his father, my grandfather, Max Epstein, was an accountant. So I've always been torn between these two worlds. Entrepreneur, entertainer, entertainer, entrepreneur. And we'll get into that. And I think, though it was the convergence of those two right brain, left brain, that I always questioned everything. I questioned everything growing up as a kid, I questioned authority figures. I, you know, if I didn't think somebody knew what they were doing the right way, I questioned it. I got in trouble for it. I got thrown out of school for it. But I was also an ab student, so it wasn't like I was stupid. So when I started in business, I Didn't know any better. And I thought it was up to me to find creative ways to sell commoditized products. Like you talk about paste. I love that. I never heard that until today. So I've always been enamored with how to create an experience for people so they felt special and unique and they felt heard. Now today I tell people my ministry in life is to ease people's pain and suffering about their money because so many people are suffering about their money, whether they have none or they're multi millionaires. And we all know the stories. Both those kind of people are suffering with their money. And you bring up the compliance world.

So I have my own investment advisory firm, so I have my own compliance officer, but we have to be regulated by each state. I operate in the FINRA world, which is the broker dealer world, which means I get regulated by my broker dealer.

I'm in the insurance business, so I'm regulated there. I mean, everything I do is regulated.

But I've always looked for what Dan called an industry bypass. Is there a way to get around this regulation that is the biggest waste of money on the planet, bar none.

It cost the consumer billions of dollars, all in the guise that it's protecting the consumer. Now I'm going to get in trouble for saying that, right? Watch the compliance people come down on me. This isn't to say that there aren't good people in government and compliance doing a good job, but you could probably do away with two thirds of all that. So I've just always focused on how do you.

Allow people to have a different experience about their financial life. And you know, what it comes down to.

Comes down to what did you want to be when you grew up, what are you now, what happened? And are you going to live your dreams? So Dan Sullivan talks about having an industry bypass. I don't care what industry you're in. But what does that mean? It's how do you get around the obstacles that are in your business life now? Those could be compliance obstacles. Every industry has compliance. And you know, the government puts those obstacles in the way because they say they're protecting the consumer. But then that government goes beyond protecting the consumer and now they're protecting their survival and their paycheck and their life. So there's this, there's this balancing act, but then life puts obstacles in your way and how are you going to get around them? So I've just always been interested in creativity.

I was an economics major who lived in the theater. I mean, who does that?

So I'VE always looked at the entertainment, the marketing and the advertising world, that creative world and how to combine it with the financial world in spite of its compliance and look for industry bypasses. One of the industry bypasses I created in 1992 was something called the 401k coach program, which came out of working with Dan Sullivan and thinking about my thinking about the industry. So what was that? That's basically.

I said, oh, if I could teach financial advisors how to be better at what they're doing in the 401k retirement industry.

Maybe that would be a value. And the way I say it is, I was Betty Crocker selling my recipes to Duncan Hines. And people used to say to me, why would you teach your competitors how to get better? That means they're going to be better than you and you'll be out of business. Au contraire.

So that's why John Scott made that comment that Charlie's the only guy I know knows how to monetize air. Because I got, you know, the nationwide and the fidelities and whatnot of the world to write me checks, million dollar checks. And we've coached over 10,000 advisors around the country. But by creating that business, I created a bypass where I could not only coach advisors, but I could coach you, Mike the consumer.

And that was an awakening where I could live in these two worlds sympathically.

And I eventually, not only did I do that, but I got like massmutual, fantastic company. And I went to their compliance department and said, hey, I got this idea. I want to make Mike the advisor an author of my second book, Save America Save. Well, in order to do that, we had to get a letter from finra, which is the compliance government, that said you could do that. And you can't get that letter without having a broker dealer to help you. And they did. That produced a whole nother business where we were getting paid to help advisors become authors. Our book, we have over 12 different broker dealers that approved this process over three years. I mean, unheard of. Now I share that because it wasn't just about making the money on the sale of those books. It was, I was empowering the advisors to be the expert in their field. You and I know we can talk about the power of a book, but it's what I learned in that process.

Of. Most people would say, I can't do that because of X, I can't do this because of why. You know, there's already something. There's a law that says you can't do that. There's an institution that says you can't do that. There's a fill in the blank that says you can't do that.

Got it.

Well, I want to go back to something you said that really grabbed me, and it was.

Experiences that make them feel special. I needed to find creative ways to sell commoditized products. And that really resonated with me. And I'd like you to talk a little bit more about that because that is.

To me. And again, I'll give you my take on things. This is.

You know, one of the greatest talents in the world is being able to craft a stump speech and.

Do improv. You know, you are very, very good at improv, but to someone who doesn't have that unbelievably challenging skill, which I think is an. It's like an alien brain that can do that.

What do you mean by experiences that make people feel special? Because I'd love you to give some hard examples of those, if you would.

So you, you have a financial advisor. You've told me you've worked with them for years. Okay.

Something just happened to our screen. Okay, so you've had a financial advisor. You work for me years. They manage your money.

But.

You know, having coached over 10,000 advisors and asking them about their process, how do they engage people.

It'S pretty dry stuff. And it's typically about, let me tell you about what we've done, how much money we manage, who we've managed it for, what a great job we do, what our performance.

Process sale. It's process sale. It's. Yeah, totally.

Let me just share with your listeners, because if there's anybody out there, and this is applicable to any business. So.

A long, long, long, long time ago, I just threw all that out the window. So I start every meeting. I don't care who you are, with a very simple question. And I owe Don Barden of the Perfect Plan.

Immense thanks for this. And I would say to you, Mike, put your picture back up. You're next to me. So let us be side by side, Mike.

Yes.

Before I talk about who I am and what we do, you know, maybe you referred in or you heard about me. Can I ask you a question? Sure. How can I be of service to you today?

Good. So you put it back on them and why? Before I answer that question, why? You ask.

You don't have to ask the question.

Okay, but I want to know why. You say, how can I be of service today? I'm going to tell you what I ask.

Okay.

At the beginning, don't derail it.

Don't yet.

Okay. I want to know your psychology.

That's why be all those people that are going to a financial advisor for the first, the third or the fifteenth time. What is your expectation of me as a financial advisor?

And now you're asking me the question. Okay, My expectation is.

First of all, I want to know if I like you and I trust you and I want to get past that gap. But more importantly, what I know, I want to know is will I have enough money and can you find.

Some unfair advantages for investing? Tax advantages, things that I don't know about, things I don't have access to. I'm looking for shortcuts because I want financial freedom.

I want to maintain my current quality of life. And I'd also like to know that you'll be able to predict some of the crazy things that may happen because, you know, I've been through cancer. I know what that's like. If one or both of us get sick, are we going to be okay?

Okay.

And of course, ideally, if there's something left over, you know, for legacy or whatever.

Let's go. Before all of that.

Okay.

What your real thinking is when you walk into that office is what's he going to sell me?

What's he up to?

Right.

Yeah. It's the trust.

Yeah.

All of that.

Yeah. Trust and likability for sure. What I, what I'm thinking internally, not what I'm going to tell you is first of all, I don't trust you. I don't know what kind of a financial advisor you are if you're just going to sell me some crap that and then go away.

That the last guy or gal sold me that totally. I got traumas, money that I don't understand that never worked, never fulfilled my promise. Fill in the blank.

Right on.

Or. Or I'm working with the best people right now, but you're sitting in front of me, so that's interesting. So it took me years to get to this place of realizing.

Look, all I have is my wisdom, my intellectual property, my ideas, my approach to something. But before I can even get to whether or not that's of any value to you, it's a simple question. How can I be of service to you today? And what that question does, and it works in any industry, is it disarms you because you're walked in on guard, your guard is up, and all of a sudden you go, what?

So that energetically shifts the, the trust.

And it's not a manipulative question. I'M going to be really clear for people because I have discovered it's really aha for people. I mean, it's really, it's like, for me, it's enchanting. It's like you just walked into the emerald forest and you're like looking around and going, I wow. I never. Wow. And then you start talking about you. Now, you and I know the Dan Sullivan question, which is if it was three years from today and you were look back on the three years, what would had to have happened? And what are your greatest dangers, opportunities and strengths? The DAs and we incorporate that. But for the most part, how can I be of service? Just completely shifts the conversation for most people don't feel like they're being served by anybody in most of their life.

Look at the airlines. They don't serve anybody. As Dan said. You know, the airline's motto is, we're not happy until you're unhappy.

Yeah, yeah, there's, there's that. And how about your cable company, your.

Phone service, your Internet company, everybody, right, you're not being served. And then you got to talk to a computer voice. I, Charlie, I am specially modified to be of service to you today, even though the words that are coming out of my mouth are not coming.

Frank zap at Joe's Garage comes to mind when you were doing that. But yes.

So, and then that starts this, this journey that is really about what are you looking for now? Maybe I have it to offer, maybe I don't. Now after that, I let people know right up front that you shouldn't work with me.

So my next silo is. And they'll go, wait a minute. You were just highly referred. I said, we're completely different from any other financial organization you've ever worked for. And of course, now it's like, well, why? How. What's different about you? This is only one thing. Everybody else is in the business of getting you to save in your investor money after 41 years of doing this, Mike, my only job is to get you to spend your money right now because this is the healthiest you're ever going to be. Right? And right. Okay. Right now is this. Okay, this moment? Remember this right now? This is the okay. Okay. Right now. Okay. This. Okay. Okay. Okay. Right. Okay. This moment. Right now. Okay. Oh, wow, you look great right now.

And I was having a conversation at Abundance360 with one of the doctors from Fountain life who lives in Naples. And he said, charlie, oh my God, I can't believe you're saying that. Nobody's gonna Nobody's spending their money down there. They're all hanging out on their money because they're all afraid that they're gonna have Alzheimer's and they're not gonna have enough money. So they're waiting to spend their money when they don't even know who they are.

How freaking crazy. I had a. I had somebody in my office. We run a lot of 401k plans. So folks, if you're looking for a really unique person to run your 401k plan all over the country, but we run their 401k plan. The guy's brother started the company and 15 years ago died of a heart attack. So we managed the family's money, but not the brother. He's always kept it separate. And he finally came in to see me because he's getting ready to retire in June.

And he's a really hard worker. I mean, they're in the heavy equipment repair business. Ah, dirty, dirty business. And he's just a hard working guy who doesn't feel like he's ever, you know, been acknowledged. But, but he always kept it separate. And he came in to say, look, I'm going to retire and I'm going around talking to everybody to make sure I have the right person handling my finances.

So I told him what I said to you about I don't think you want to work with me. And I asked him, I said, what's the one thing you don't have that you would love to have that would just razzle dazzle you? This is a tough guy. And he immediately gets this little grin on his face. And I said that.

What is that? He said, I've always wanted a Corvette. What year? 1965. What color? Red. Convertible. Oh yeah, convertible. I want to be driving down the street. I said, good, why don't you buy one? He said, well, the people currently doing my finances told me I can't even retire. I don't have enough money. We're going to run out of money. I mean, he's just freaked out. And I said, based on all the numbers that we've done, you're going to be fine. He said, but I don't.

So we reorganized his thinking about his thinking and you know, you've heard me talk about pulling the debt equity out of your house. Now, he didn't want to have a mortgage payment when he retired, so he wouldn't have a payment. I said, so what if we refinance, pull the money out of your house. Oh, by the way, do that driveway barn thing that you want to do so you can work on cars. And. And by the Corvette. He goes, my wife will kill me. I said, no, you'll kill yourself in the Corvette. Don't worry about it. And he could afford it all.

We unlock dead assets to pay for joy, happiness, wonderment. Play.

Guess who he moved all his money over to manage.

Check, please.

Right on.

Now, that's because the other 52 financial advisors he talked to just ran millions of numbers, told him how much money they're going to make, and blah, blah, blah, blah. And that had nothing to do with being of service to what's in here.

But that all comes down to those power questions, right? And you can't.

It's improv. It's listening, right? Asking and listening. Listening.

It's. Yes and.

But. It's. But here's the thing. 99% of all advisors. I'm sorry, you're all good people. You've been taught well. You're like a surgeon with no personality. You're like a great surgeon that's operating on a corpse rather than a human being. When are you going to talk to the human being and find out how they're feeling?

That is so. So I really got two big things here. Oh, yeah. Is it okay if we talk about yielded dreams for a moment?

No, I'm not putting this up to talk about the show. I'm putting this up to say to people. It's about what you're yielding from in life, right? You yield and what you are yielding for.

You can go wherever you want. It's your podcast.

All right. Well, I think one of the things that I really learned in working with you is, you know, you're a dream maker. That's it. And that really, that last example you gave is an example of that. You know, I remember one of the things he said that takes people or sets people off is, no, I'm going to show you how to spend your money. How do you know and have fun? So that'll be. And that's basically what your story is, which is, what's the one thing you don't have that you'd love to have that would just razzle dazzle you? That's a great question. I like the razzle dazzle. And then how can I be of service? You know, what makes you unique is going back to experiences that make you feel special. Your questions make them feel special. So what other questions do you ask that you find unlock either the imagination, the wonderment, the what's possible in these people, and the question actually activates an experience in their mind.

So there's the what did you want to be when you grew up?

What are you now and what happened? Conversation. And that's. That can be all day.

You know, when you go to a financial advisor, they send you all these questions to answer and fill out. And we used to do that, and nobody takes the time to answer the goddamn questions. So, you know, we created this deck of cards. It's called the yield of dreams cards. It's got 52 cards in it. We send you two decks. You and your spouse or your partner, significant other. And we say do this separately. There's three separate decks in that. So there's 20 cards that we call your priority now goals. You know, what are your priorities right now? You know, pay off the mortgage, take a vacation, whatever it is. Pick three. What are your top priorities right now? What are your desirement dreams? What's a desirement dream, Charlie? Well, Webster's definition of retirement means to put out of use. And folks, I don't know anybody working their ass off to someday one day be put out of use. So what we say is, Mike, you're working to someday one day have enough money to create a paycheck for life. The title of my first book, to do everything you desire to do. So we registered trademark, a process we call desirement planning. So what are your desirements? So you got 20 cards. Pick those desirements. There they are. You can go to epsteinfinancial.com or charlie epstein.com and get your deck. Thank you. And then there's 14 cards that are 14 myths that we've identified that people have about their money that they don't even know they have. So, like that guy I just talked about, his myth was, my house has to be paid off in order for me to be happy when I retire. It was my father's myth. Like, where'd that come from? Well, what if I can't make the payment? Well, what if we make sure you've got a paycheck for life to make the payment, but that $300,000 of equity that's sitting in your house earning absolutely nothing is now paying for all those remarkable things that you thought you could never do? We just took a dead asset.

And had it. Fulfill your priority goals and your dreams, because we eliminated this myth that you have about money. Now you do the card separately. Then you get together with your spouse, come into the office, and it's amazing to watch people as they lay out their priority goals, and they realize, oh, my God, I have so Much in common with my spouse or I have nothing in common. My desirement goals and then your myths. Most powerful thing I've ever created. Now we have greater clarity, and people are more confident about what they want. And now it's, how are we going to get there? And that's what we do, is provide the capabilities to get you your priority goals and your desirement dreams now rather than later.

That's it, folks.

Okay. And I'm going to just deconstruct a little bit. So your most powerful tool are the myths. You'd say overcoming the myths.

Well, it's. First, it's not overcoming myths. It's what we do is I'm going to hold up in the light people's myths about their money to illuminate they.

Don'T even know they have, which could be old traumas that aren't true, inflicted by their parents or something.

Right. The biggest myth, if I just had enough money, I'd be happy and all my problems would be gone. Yeah. How's that working out for those lottery winners? So I want to hold them up in the light. Now, I'm not here to change your myth, so let me say this. If you have to have your house paid off when you retire, because psychologically that's so important to you, then pay your house off. I'm talking economics, you're talking politics. Right. My house has to be paid off because that I'll be happy. Fine, pay it off. But let's. Let's dissect the myth, and then if you want to keep it, you can.

The freedom that comes from liberating yourself from old myths and old beliefs is. That's why I'm sitting in the field of dreams field today, folks. Kevin Costner's character, Ray Kinsella, was just out taking care of his corn crop when a voice said, ease his pain, go the distance. And he suddenly decided, I'm going to mow down my cornfield, my only source of income, my livelihood, to build a baseball field so that Shoeless Joe, a dead person, will come and play baseball. And what he thought he was doing wasn't even what it was about. What you think you're doing with your finances and your life isn't even what it's about. I'm just going to be the shaman that.

Provides you with a whole new way of looking at and thinking about your. Thinking about your money, your finances, and what you really want in life.

Would that be interesting?

It's what Mike Koenigs did for me in my business. By the Way, you know, he parted the sea.

The Romans were coming, they were going to take me down. And he parted the sea and provided me a pathway to the other side, to the promised land that I didn't know existed. We can talk about what that promised land is when you want.

Okay. All right. Um, well, I, I want to just repeat some of what I heard because.

I, I love the way you think. And arriving at the place where you can think about your thinking like you do required, first of all, you had to get in front of an enormous number of people and you also had to train a lot of financial advisors and see the, the distinction, like how they were doing things that weren't effective and how you were.

Yeah, so I was lucky. I got Mike. You know, we run hundreds of 401k plans. So I've got thousands and thousands of 401k participants. So I just started sharing these stories and watching if they worked. Well, I knew they worked because I could see the results. People were saving more, they were being more effective. They were meeting with us, they became our clients. Then we wrote the book Paychecks for life. Here's my nine basic principles. Then I coached 10,000 advisors. I learned what they were doing. I said, well, what about this? I got this idea and they're like, oh, my God, that's unbelievable. So this has been 40 years. It's an overnight success. You know, 40 years of testing these concepts and these principles and you know.

Well, there's nothing better. This is another Dan Sullivanism, which is to have a paying audience that allows you to prototype, invent and test out your ideas and get real time feedback. And getting the momentum in place takes, first of all, a certain amount of cluelessness and courage simultaneously, which is, what is it? If I knew how hard it was going to be to build and grow and eventually sell my business, I never would have done it in the first place.

I never would have started. And it's a willingness to put a team of people around you that are smarter in other areas where you're not that go that. I mean, yesterday we did our planning meeting. I've got 12 people working or 10 or 12 people working at our cork business Epstein Financial. And we spent the day of everybody looking at, you know, what they want to accomplish in the next one to three, you know, but at the end of the day, everybody was basically saying the same thing. We want to make Charlie's vision come true.

That's the right team. That's amazing. But you gotta.

Greg is working in the studio right now. You know, we created this studio and I mean I priceless. This young man means more to me than he knows. He's hearing me say this right now to thousands and thousands of people. But there's no way I could do what I am up to without him willing to help me create this vision. But I've also created a playground for him. You know, I bought all the toys. You know, it's his studio, it's his equipment. I don't stand over him, say no, no, push the button this way and make the camera go that way. I said to him a long, long time ago, can I say the F word on your show?

Why not?

I said a long time ago, because he came from the auto industry and he was handling this guy that I know was a micromanager. You know, everything's got to be perfect. And one day early on I said to him, you know, you need to up big really fast so we can get rid of that in you. And I think that liberated him.

That is really, really, that, that takes a lot of balls as a, as a business owner. Because I know what are we terrified of? It's is loss of our, you know, having our brand messed up and you know, you inflict so much.

Greg is pure genius. I had no fear about him. The only one who's going to fuck up my brand is me. But what he was going to fuck up is growing.

And having freedom for wonderment, joy, laughter and play rather than, I hope I don't up and the boss yells at me, which is where he came from, that myth, you know. Now the only thing I say is, you know, can we do it faster, bigger? Can we try this? Can we, you know, experiment more? Can we? Woo hoo hoo.

But what did you say? Courage and what?

Courage and well, the courage and confidence and yeah, to first of all have a dream, declare it and be able to select and find and pick the right people who say I'd love to make that dream come true. And there has to be the self interest part of it as well. In Greg's case, you know, he's got access to these amazing toys and if you're in the production world, none of it's any good unless they've got someone with the charisma and the ability to perform to make all that matter. You know, there's nothing more boring than boring people when you've got all the toys in the world.

Right? And it's stretching his capabilities because this is beyond his, where he came from, you know, I just, I threw him into toyland. But, you know, surrounded him with other talented people that know the technical side. And he's a sponge and learns really fast and is incredibly talented that way. And so, you know, the one thing I would say to anybody in business is just surround yourself with what you want to surround yourself is incredibly committed people that want to make your vision real.

And maybe they don't have the experience that you thought, but they're committed, they're confident, they're willing to learn and they're willing to grow with you and expand and they're into their wonderment, joy, laughter and play and discovery for discovery's sake. That's DNA. There's no, we're not punching a clock here.

Yes. And I'd like you to talk briefly about in this world right now. So we're just hopefully on the tail end of the pandemic. Crusting is what I visualize. At least the hopium I choose to smoke is that we're cresting and we're.

In the final stages and six to eight months, Mike.

Yeah, that's exactly right. So for you, one of the things that happened when we started working together is, is.

I told you and we talked a lot about the value of a studio and you just talked about that right now. But I'd like you to tell other business owners what's the value of a studio? What does that mean for them? Even someone who might be afraid to get in front of the camera or they're like, I don't have anything to talk about. I'm just curious what you would say to someone about having that creative workspace if you're just going to give your 1 minute pitch for it.

Yeah, well, the first thing is, is I was thinking about it for years.

But, but the first thing that I did was, you know, hired, hired somebody to run my social media. So I had somebody before Greg.

And that's the most critical thing. You know, if you're, if you're an entrepreneur, you're a creative person and the more you can get your creativity out in multiple mediums, it gets your brain thinking in a way that you've never thought and allows you to experiment what the studio does. I mean, Covid just accelerated this. I mean, look at how awful everybody looks on Zoom, right sitting in front of that camera. So first of all, I needed a studio because you helped me create a one man show called Yielded Dreams. And then Covid hit and I can't. I'm an actor. I was going to go to a theater and rehearse.

Damn it what the hell, huh? I said, damn it, what the hell? I know.

I thought I had this theater where I did a one man show years ago in town here I'm in, you know, East Law Meadow, Springfield, Mass. And they're like, no, you can't even go into the space and be alone and rehearse. So, you know, what is it? Mother is the something of invention, whatever that expression is.

Yeah, it's.

Well, Covid is the mother of invention, you know. So I said, all right, I need the studio so I can get up and move around and I can rehearse. Well, flash forward. I've got three cameras, I got two monitors, I got the green screen behind me. I got 30 to 40 thousand dollars of equipment, toys that Greg is playing with. And we are discovering. I hired a director, woman who directed me in summer theater at Mount Holyoke. I hired a stage manager to work with Greg. Greg's never done a show, so this is all new for him. And we're rehearsing two days a week now. We've got a goal of starting mid March. We decided we're going to do a show within the show. We're going to pull back the curtain for what it is to rehearse a show and just put it out on social media. Invite the world in to see. How do you create a one man show during COVID when there's no audience? And then April 16th is our goal. We're going to launch the show on YouTube and Zoom and we're going to test out everything that I'm doing. And I have to tell you.

I am, I'm a great performer with a live audience like you because I'm just kinetically. I need that spark. That's why.

Yeah. You know the demands. You have esp, you have the, you know, how to read and feel and flow and get into. It's like ocean waves.

Audience. Well, guess what? Now I just have this camera that I have to perform to and I'm getting no feedback other than if my directors laughing or my stage manager smiles behind her mask. Right. It is really fucking hard.

I mean, it's really hard. Yeah. I was on the Guiding Light and that's different. You're not waiting for a laugh. You're doing a, you know, you're doing performance.

Yeah.

Tells you whatever. And I've, you know, done commercials and you know, they write, you check. So this is, this is work, but it's also play.

Yeah.

And we're going to get feedback. And I get feedback every day. So having this playground to test things out is just.

The space of grace. It's amazing. And I owe it to you because when I sat in your studio at your home there in San Diego and I went, well, this is kind of good. Of course, what I did is I made it three times the size of yours, so I had all this room to play it.

Yeah, yeah, I gotta move. I gotta get into a bigger place. And that's been like.

I just, you know, we took a space. Right. But you gotta be willing to play. You gotta be willing to spend money. You gotta be willing to discover. You gotta be willing to iterate. What all. You know, what does Google say? Fail fast, fail forward, fail off and fail off fast, fail off and fail for it. Whatever you're gonna get there, wherever there there is.

Well, that's again, I just think, well, let's, let's do this. I'm gonna just show one other dealio here for, for everyone, because I want to show everyone where. Where to go. And that is there's Epstein Financial. And you've got the playing cards here. Right on. Get your deck. But also they can learn more about the business itself and what you have. There's some deck examples, your personal website. Got some television appearances, but that's Charlie Epstein dot com. How can our audience.

Yep. Oh, we got the podcast. We got to send people there.

And how, like.

How can I serve you? How can our audience serve you, Charlie, besides following the podcast? Get on your mailing list, check out what you do.

We have. We have clients all over the country. And, you know, with Zoom and technology now, I can be in your home instantaneously. Right? Zoom's the greatest airline on the planet. But if you're listening to this and you're thinking to yourself, God, my advisory firm doesn't sound like this, doesn't act like this, isn't asking these questions. I don't really have that relationship. I'm looking for something different. Then reach out. I'm going to send you the deck of cards. And that's where we start with a conversation for possibility. That's it, you know, it's the introductory to the desirement planning process. And then let's dream together and find your yield of dreams. Where are you holding back? And what are you really yielding for in life? And I will tell you something about money management. The art of managing money is chiropractic, folks. You're not paying me for that. Do we manage? Yeah, we manage over a billion of assets under advisement. That's chiropractic. What do I mean by that, you go to your chiropractor, they go click, click and you know, you come back again. Okay. And I don't discount money management, but as Mike says, that's the pace, that's the commodity. You know, our job is to find you the right people to manage those billions. Now our job is to figure out what's holding you back, what are your myths about your money, what do you desire most and how do we unwind what your thinking and then project you into a whole new reality and stratosphere? You know, we got to kill the Borg. We got to kill the Borg. You are financially Borg.

Yeah. I think as I listen to you and after going through the experience and the process of creating yielded dreams with you, first of all, yes, you've got this incredible depth, 40 years of experience behind you. But your gift and the DNA of your organization is about all of us don't know what we don't know about what's holding us back with our financial dreams, our financial future, our inability or in our unwillingness to let go of old traumas that are holding us back. I mean that, that is the formula. Whether you're a athlete, a professional athlete, you want to become one, or whatever your profession is, you've got to have an outsider with a lot of experience asking you the right questions to remove those blocks and allow you just to see through that massive limestone wall that you don't even see yourself. And that's really what your gift is, is to help someone imagine a different future without those things standing in your way that you can't see and have been holding you back. And there were like you said you were in, you inherited them most likely, or they may have been some trauma that occurred. And it's like that isn't your future reality. It's.

And then it's connecting you with the people that are going to remember what I said. How can I be of service to you? It may be that our relationship is I'm of service to you by connecting you with the people that you need right now to make something shift in your life. And it doesn't have anything to do with money management, investments, insurance or anything like that. It's like what Mike did for me when I said to him, I want to go back and do stand up and I want to write a one man show. And what I didn't have was the capabilities. He said, well, you know what you should do is be like Ellen and Letterman and just hire some comedians to help you write it. And I went, that's great. I've been out of that industry for 19 years. And Mike said, you hire me, I'll get the team.

Boom, done. And then.

And then, yeah.

And then not questioning, what the shit did I just get myself involved in? And who is this guy and how is this going to work? And what if it doesn't work now? I'm lucky because I'm a high quick start and I'm a five fact finder, Colby, for those of you who don't know what I'm talking about, that I don't need a lot of facts to make a decision, and then I don't need any facts to go into anything, because once I'm in, it's all about wonderment, joy, laughter and play and discovery for discovery's sake, which Mike will tell you makes me a great person to work with because I can then allow myself to be contributed to by the people that he put together. So here's my question. If you're listening and you're thinking, are you willing to be contributed to?

Would you suspend your disbelief and you're thinking about your thinking and say, God, I really want somebody contribute to me in a different way that I'm being contributed to right now, and I really want to engage in a conversation for possibility beyond anything I've ever had. And I'm going to give up my thinking about. My thinking about how things have to work.

Then you know what? I'd be interested in working with you because I don't have to. That's the other luxury it is. Mike doesn't have to work with me. I don't have to work with you. We get to pick and choose. And I'll tell you right now, if it isn't fascinating and motivating working with you, I'm not in. I don't care how big the check is. 25, 100, 250 grand. If it ain't going to be fascinating and motivating, bye. Bye.

Nothing better than having that freedom. It's freedom of mind and the financial freedom to choose life on your own terms. It really is. That's. So we're gonna wrap up. Charlie Epstein, I tell you this all the time. I just love who you are. I love working with you. I adore your wife. I love the life you've created for yourself. And madly, deeply, every day, I fall.

Madly, deeply, passionately in love. The day my wife hit me, me physically backed into me walking behind her car and knocked me over. God put a slow hit on me. Took about six or seven years for it to sink in. But every day. We just got done working out this morning. I looked at her, we're sweating to death. And I go, I just fell more deeply, madly.

I bet you're gonna get kissed tonight, brother. All right, so let's do this. First of all, I am so inspired and fired up and I want to do this again. So we just did back to back interviews and we've got to find more ways to create together.

And I'll fill you in and update you on this really cool show that we just literally got yesterday that's super exciting. And I want to make you part of it because I think you're going to be a great contributor and you'll like who's in it. You'll, you'll, you'll freak out when I tell you some of the names. So that's for another show coming up, but here's what I'll say. This is Capability Amplifier. If you've enjoyed the show, make sure you like it. You comment also go to charlieupstein.com there or Epstein Financial. Get your. But let's start engaging with this guy. There they are, creating paychecks for life, ladies and gentlemen. But if you haven't figured it already, you're dealing with a character who knows this stuff, who can change your life for the better and change the way you think, more importantly, and be your friend while he's at it. And he's going to tell you exactly what he thinks because he has that freedom and that's the kind of person you want to spend your time with. So, Charlie, thank you. Appreciate you so much. Let's do it again.

Love you. Bye. Bye.