Top 5 Ways to Grow Your Podcast Followers 2021

Hey, hey, hey. Welcome to another episode. This is Paul Colligan. My name is Mike Koenigs, and we are here to talk about Paul Colligan.

Did you just say this is Paul Colligan and I'm Mike.

Paul again is here, and I'm Mike Koenigs.

There we go. Much better.

Well, you can. Yeah, I'll be both. I'll be both of us today. And then you can be emptiness, like God. God's spirit. Is it okay if I call you God's spirit for the rest of the episode?

Why not, man?

All right.

Nobody's watching this yet, so once they jump on, we might jump away from the heresy, but, you know, there we go.

A little bit of heresy never hurt anyone, but. Well, there we go. We got one. And we're talking about the five ways to grow your podcast followers. And the reason why Paul Colligan is qualified to talk about growing your podcast followers is because he is a podcast master. Paul.

Thank you, man. We just did a whole thing about monetizing a podcast, and we challenge some of the norms of some of the ways that people think podcast monetization should go, maybe even some of the podcast strategy should go. And we will continue to challenge the norms here. However, once you've identified who your audience is, once you've identified the market, the message, the money, the media, the forums that Mike and I both subscribe to very, very strongly, once you've done that, you can build your audience to find more. The last episode we did, I chat about a guy with less than 500 downloads per weekly episode making over a million dollars from his podcast. But if less than 500 downloads per episode is making a million, can we find another 500 of that right. Category to make them to 2 million? So let's chat about that today. We're going to start with the low. We're going to get to high. And then I've got a. I've got a bonus full screen moment that's. That's. That's kind of fun that we'll play with.

So the first question, Paul.

There we go. The number one question I get at the podcast partnership is how do I get more followers, period? They want.

I've got clients who have said, if there comes a moment where you can buy some, and you know they're coming. Credit cards open. Invoice me. Use the miles to send your family to Hawaii. You know, not a problem. Very, very good to go right now as of the recording. And it's funny because this is changing on a regular basis. We're recording this Tuesday, March 16, 2021. Right now, there is only one place to buy an audience. Certified set place to buy an audience. And I want to speak to them for a second. The volume isn't huge, but there's a side benefit that we'll chat about. It's Overcast fm. Overcast FM is run by a guy named Marco Armit. Marco brought Instapaper to the world and, and he brought, oh, gosh, that microblogging platform that Yahoo bought. Oh, well, it'll come to me in a second. But the fact of the matter is he's built stuff before. He built Overcast, which is the power user podcast app. And inside of this power user podcast app is show me the health podcast, show me the business podcast, show me the comedy podcast. And you can buy an ad in there. And what's interesting, Marco is such a numbers guy that he'll tell you on the average how many clicks you're going to get, how many listens you're going to get, how many subscribes you're going to get. And I'll tell you, we've run thousands of dollars through him on a regular basis and the numbers he gets are low. I think possibly it's because our podcast, the podcast that we market in his thing, are a little bit stronger than some of the others, but it is a way to buy a podcast audience. Now, the sub benefit of it, that's really, really interesting. Two things. Number one, these are power users. These are people who love podcasts. But number two, this is a really great chance to check a podcast concept. If you're building out a business podcast, you could spend 500, 800,000 bucks, find out those clicks, see if they stay, track that over time. It's a really interesting marketing option as well. If you want to buy an audience and you want to be absolutely secure, your numbers, Overcast is the way to do it. But the numbers aren't that bad. Big. So we'll chat about others. And I don't go full screen on me yet, man. That's the surprise. That's the one at the end. But that's the buy, that's the credit card spend. Let's talk the true strategy. Mike. The only, the, the best way with a bullet to get the word of.

Your podcast is it's getting on other shows, man. And I'll talk a little bit about that because I'm sure you can do outreach. But one of the ways that I, one of the things that I ignore in general, not always is I get a lot of requests to be in my podcasts. Part of it's just because one of them's Dan Sullivan, the other one is with Gay Hendricks. And.

So, realistically, Maybe I've got 10 slots a year for outside people to bring on. And I'm going to say no to practically anyone unless, first of all, they are extraordinary talent, meaning super entertaining with proven high value, or they come with a big platform. So just to go back to answering this question, you want to get on other shows? So what I do right now, I don't know about you, Paul, but I actually pay an agency to get me on other shows, and I've done it with a couple. And in general, you can expect to pay around 250 to $400 to get on someone else's podcast. And if someone goes, well, that's a lot of money. If that's your reaction, if you get on the right podcast in front of the right people, you can increase the number of subscribers you have on yours by hundreds, potentially thousands. But I think in general, most podcasters, even if you're on a podcast that supposedly has 10,000 or 200,000 downloads, that doesn't mean that's how many listens they're getting. And I know for a fact, and I've checked this before, Paul, is there is an individual that I've been on on their podcast a couple times, and, you know, the bragging rights has been downloaded hundreds of millions of times. The number of true listens is actually pretty low. And. And I was able to verify and do some tests because I gave away some really good stuff that had high value on the podcast, and I didn't see a lot of action, like under a hundred.

Yeah.

So, you know, having an engaged podcast with right fit people is more than a podcast that supposedly has, you know, millions of downloads. And, you know, they might brag about a million downloads a month or something. I say horse hockey to that. Yeah. I think it's all about right people, not the volume and the quantity, even though we live in a volume quantity world. Go ahead.

Well, and you want to do the math on getting on other shows. You know, getting on a stage means you got to get on a plane, you got to get your jacket pressed, you got to have the presentation, you got to deal with all the nonsense, the hotel, food, all that crap. You know, getting on a podcast is, you know, turning on the microphone and getting to work. So first of all, you can do five, 10 podcasts in a day. And so whereas one of them might not Necessarily be the thing, you know, the travel potential. Your co host Dan Sullivan says Zoom doesn't replace the phone Zoom replaces. And this is, this is absolutely huge. So you want to do that number and you want to realize what's there. And even if the podcast gets no downloads, links, Google, Juice association, all these things. The Internet Movie Database. By the way, Mike, did you know this IMDb Internet movie database got bought by Amazon? Okay. Amazon is now doing podcasts. And Amazon has promised they're going to put podcasts on the IMDb. Which would that be? The Internet media.

Well, Amazon bought IMDb though.

Yes. And Amazon has promised they're going to put podcasts on IMDb.

That's great.

I was literally looking at my IMDb listing today and there isn't a place to put podcast.

It's coming. So if Mike is on 500 podcasts and Linda is on three podcasts, Mike's going to get more exposure. So you don't necessarily always have to play the big game. Now, flip side, there is an entire industry of shysters, there's an entire industry of ripoff and scam artists, you know, who have built a whole, you know, get on the show kind of thing. And basically, you know, they take $200 to get you on a show and then they give the show $100 to put you on that show. Don't play that game. Find real success. Ask them for a past client. That type of thing. Mileage may vary. Be strategic, be intelligent. And then finally, just being on the show isn't enough. Mike, you spoke to this. You were on a big show with a lot of downloads, but you gave an amazing offer and you gave people a reason to jump over to your podcast. This is about that. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, the net net is.

It.

Really. What it comes down to is, I believe what you've got to do is get on as many podcasts as you can that are high value. It doesn't mean getting junk ones. My, my general rule of thumb is, first of all, I don't, unless I know you, we have a long term relationship and you're a known quantity and I know you're someone who's, who's going to put in the effort and the work. I'm not going to be your first person on a podcast. I'm going to wait until you've got at least probably 50 under your belt and I want you to have, you know, at least 50 comments and ratings on itunes. Okay? That just tells me that you've been asking for them. You've got Some momentum and then from there that you're actually putting forth the effort. So one of the things that I make a point of doing is.

I invest in. When I do YouTube podcasts, for example, we turn our podcasts into YouTube shows. I will invest and promote them. Okay? So I'm going to get some guaranteed views. And.

That is something that you want to work with people who are just as invested as you are in their own shows and have put in the effort because anyone can start a podcast. But I think it's fair to say that until you put 18 months into it, you can't expect it to be profitable or make you money. And.

It just takes some good old fashioned hard work. Now, of course, you might be lucky. You might get discovered, the right person might feature you for whatever the reason is. Maybe you met someone at a party and they introduced you to a high value individual with a great show and you guys just clicked. But that's pretty rare. And the people I know who built big followings, like a guy like Lewis Howes, for example, he was part of a group of young millennials who co promoted each other and over a period of time and they pounded the ground and worked their butts off co promoting each other. And so, you know, it doesn't come easy to build a, to build a lot of followers.

So you get on other shows, but you do it strategically. You, you do it with people who are obviously there. Now we know.

Did I bore you, Paul? Sorry.

No, no, no. You can buy reviews, you can buy ratings, you can buy downloads, you can buy all these things. But let's be honest, 45 seconds that they're listing at Apple and you can tell if they've bought all these things, you know. Yeah, no, Reviews come from XR 51279. You know, just not a big podcast reviewer. Not that complicated. Do your homework and let's chat about Houzz and his group, because that's actually number three, getting on other shows with dynamic insertion slots. Okay, the tech and podcasting has changed. A lot of people think podcast is you make a video, you make a recording, it's there forever. For those of you who are watching this on YouTube, it is there forever. Mike and I are stuck with that. For those of you who watch this on Facebook, although you might not be able to find it, it is there forever. But a podcast you can change and a podcast you can change dynamically. So what's interesting here is let's say I get 100,000 downloads per episode. Let's say Mike gets A million downloads per episode. If I go to Mike and I say, mike, you know, let's each do a swap for each other, Mike's gonna go, no way. I get 10 times as much as you do. But with dynamic slots, I can go, look, I will run ads until I get the million. You know, might take me 10 episodes, might take me 20 episodes. You can do that. And after a million, you can cut it off and you can go from there. Mike might even at a million a day, he might only give me a half a million and then give a half a million to Lewis Howes, you know, or something like that. But the tech is there to insert the slots. And you've heard this, the podcast, they go, we'll be right back after this message. That kind of thing. If it's done intelligently, it's done with dynamic insertion slots. And what's cool here is if you're smart about this, and please be smart about this, that's hopefully why you're watching this, is if you're smart about this, realize that the same ad over and over and over again, it's going to get boring. So run an ad for what you're doing for a day or two, then run an ad swap with a complimentary podcast, and then run something else and then run back. The tech is there to do this on a regular basis. We set up entire months of regular changes in a couple of hours, the beginning of the month, and then it just runs itself through. So get on other podcasts, buy recommended, but do it with dynamic insertion slots. Remnant inventory. If you're an old podcast, you know, an old marketer is a way to describe that.

And where do you buy these, These dynamic insertion slots? Who's a reputable place, and what do you typically pay?

Well, usually it's. Usually it's a swap. Usually it's a swap, you know, so what I'll do is I'll say, mike, I'll give you 100,000 on my show if you give me 100,000 on your show. That's the way it works. And the problem is, is so many shows aren't created equally. See, most people think it's, well, I'll put you on an episode if you put me on an episode. But those episodes aren't even. It doesn't work. You go to slots, and then it gets even. Anybody with the navic insertion capability can do this. And so it might take someone a whole year. But you know what? If there's a category of one with a small audience, who's Going to take them a whole year to promote you. But you want that person and you can promote them in a day. Great. But let the computers do the hard work. Let the math do the hard work. If you're buying slots on anything right now, it's unreputable and it's across all the shows. Buy them on very specific shows, trade them on very specific shows. That's what Hal and the others have done.

Got it.

Cool.

All right, let's talk about the next one. Number four.

Number four.

Yeah.

Subscribe and follow contests now. It is March 16, 2021. Let me tell you something. In a couple of days, your Apple podcast app is going to stop saying subscribe. I'll say that again. In a couple of days, your Apple podcast app is going to stop saying subscribe. Get ready for that. Of course, people have been saying, you know, review me on itunes, even though that's been dead for about three or four years as well. But the fact of the matter is, we're going to want to follow. And because that's on social and the problem is if I pull up my iPhone, you know, it's very easy for me to click play.

Now, we see this all the time in YouTube. You know, they always say, click the subscribe button, ring that bell, that type of thing. We're not doing it enough in podcasts. And what you want to do, it's really simple, is you want to reward. And I'll say that again, you want to reward good behavior. Have them send you proof that they've subscribed to your show. Have a contest about subscribing to your show. Have a contest about following your show. Once you do that, then you reward the good behavior. And that happens. We have a right to a friend, okay? We have a friend who did a big launch who gave away iPads for people who left reviews on Apple. And here's the problem. He got 10 times as many reviews on Apple as he got downloads from Apple. Oops. Apple knew that and had to deal with that particular issue. So the fact of the matter is, though, subscribes follows, whatever you want to call it, that's what you want from your audience. Because then it pops up every week. It pops up every day. It's a five day a week show that subscribe you want. Build a contest around that. I'm going to give at the end of this, we've got our, our extra bonus episode or our extra bonus technique. That particular client, the day they launched, we had over 500 reviews. At the end of launch, day without asking for them. But we did ask for the subscribe. We did ask for the subscribe. So ask for the subscribe, ask for the follow. Put a contest around it, reward good behavior and you'll do really, really well. Because remember, if they listen once, they listen once. If you have a weekly show now, you got 52 in a year, you got a bi weekly show, you got over a hundred every year. Get them to subscribe or follow, make it a contest, reward that good behavior and you're at a good place. Mike.

Well, here's what I, I'm curious about is the people that you've seen do this successfully. So let's just say the instruction is I want you to go and so make sure you subscribe to the podcast. I still say rate and review it. And the reason being is I determine whether or not I'm going to even listen to a podcast. If there aren't a lot of ratings and I don't see a lot of reviews, I'm like, eh, fine, if you.

Don'T have a lot of rating, that's just common sense. Nobody wants to be the first person to hit, you know, you know, YouTube video views. Zero. Like you didn't even check it out yourself. I mean, come on, let's be, let's be serious here, right? The thing is reviews and ratings, social proof. Absolutely, absolutely. But they don't make any money. They don't affect the downloads at all. They don't affect your rankings, they don't affect where you come up in SEO. They do affect what people think. So you definitely have to do that. But here's the thing. We have seen over and over and over again, when we took Brendan Burchard to number one, he didn't have a single review that day. Okay? You can get people to number one without number one of all of Apple.

He's way an anomaly. I'm going to call you on that one because Brendan knows how to grind them out.

Reviews have nothing to do. Let's pull up, you know, pull up the top podcasts and let's see how many reviews they have.

Here's what I'm talking about. Brendan doesn't count. He just, you got to take him out of there.

He.

There's nothing.

It's an extreme example. It's just, it's an extreme example. But the fact of the matter is you can go to number one without reviews, you cannot go to number one without subscribes.

I'm not saying that. Here's the thing, going to number one is one thing. Going to number one isn't. Isn't what I'm talking about. I'm talking about getting legitimate people who are browsing and finding your stuff. And if someone, if you see there's a bunch of positively reviews and a lot of good copy and someone's specific about it so you can tell they're not fake.

Right.

That's going to give you massive social proof and credibility.

Absolutely. And you do that first. Yeah, and you do that first.

And I don't really give a rat's ass about number one, anything, because you and I know you can game the system and there's always going to be a way to game the system. But someone can buy their way to the top.

Search, though, if you want to come up in search, play the game. And the game is Apple wants subs today, followers tomorrow. But that's what they want and that's what they're looking for. And if you reward that, it's going to happen. The problem is if you reward the review, they're going to walk away, they're never going to get the ding again, the phone's never going to beep again. Nothing's ever going to happen again. And you got, you know, somebody else writing your copy for you. And in our next episode, we'll have a computer right copy for us, and it won't be that big of a deal.

So I want to ask you an extension of this question, which is.

Let'S say I'm doing a subscribe and follow contest and I'm doing my podcast. And I'll say something like, hey, look, we've got something really special for you. For everyone who goes to the Capability Amplifier subscribes and leaves a review and takes a snapshot. Go over to Instagram right now, send me a picture of that, and I'm going to send you a free copy of one of Dan's new books.

Okay, so here's what would happen. We've tried this. Here's what, here's what happened. You give somebody two commands. You know what they do? The second command, Second command, you tell them to subscribe and review, they'll review and they'll send you a screenshot, period. It's been proven. We've done it too many times. You tell them to subscribe, they've only got one choice. Subscribe. You tell them to review, they got one choice, review. You tell them to do both, they'll do the second one.

Yep. And then I just saying, if you're too damn dumb to know the difference between those two commands, you disqualify yourself.

Nice.

Come down and eat you.

I'm going to go against you on this one. You give them one command, click the buy.

I understand.

Yep.

I understand. That's why.

Yeah. You know, one. One task, one event. Yep.

It's too bad. It's. I'm sorry. Too damn dumb to do it. Right. We can't be friends. But let's go on to. Here's. Here's what I do want to know is, have you done this in the past using Instagram? What has been your vehicle of choice for collecting the. The pictures or the proof?

Instagram. Instagram with enough followers to get.

Swipe up.

And so then they swipe up to. To follow or subscribe to the show. But.

But which I believe is 10. 10,000 to swipe up, right?

Yep.

I believe that's what it is.

Yep.

So just go and buy your followers, ladies and gentlemen. Okay, let's move on to the next.

10,000 to get that. That. That is definitely a technique. Just realize, you know, that. That the first 10,000 aren't real. But let's talk about the. The fifth one of following the followers.

Number five. Oh, yeah. And we've got some good love here from Lisa. Reels just showed up. Hi, Lisa. How you doing? Here we go. Look at this.

Hey, Liz. The golden ticket technique. Okay. This is.

Fun. Okay. We've tried it once. And the person.

Yes.

Oh, absolutely. The person we did this with was able to beat Oprah the day we did this. Okay. And then the next person we're gonna do this with, unfortunately, there was this virus thing that canceled the event with 10, 000 people in San Diego, and we weren't able to pull this off. But the golden ticket technique is this. Okay. Use dynamic ad insertion, which we chatted about. Number three, run a golden ticket in the show. For a certain amount of people, run an ad that's a golden ticket with the password they have to download. They only get that by subscribing. They get the password, they know where to go. Only run that 10 times, 100 times. They don't know when it's going to run. They don't know what's going to happen. But the only way you're going to get it is if they subscribe. They're not going to get it if they click follow or I'm sorry, they're not going to get it if they click play. It's only going to happen if it goes with subscribe. It's the same thing Willy Wonka did. The Chocolate Factory it worked for him. You know, it works in podcasting. Anything you can do to get.

So give me, give me this. In practical tactical, I'm not sure.

You're at an event, there are 10,000 people in the room. Okay.

Yeah.

All right. You want them to subscribe to the show? Okay, you tell them to subscribe. A good chunk Will if you're a. If you're a. If you're a Mike Koenigs, type a large chunk Will if you say click subscribe and then listen. The first episode, 100 of you are going to get an exclusive meet and greet with the governor of California.

Wow.

Hey, ladies and gentlemen.

Yeah, the governor, you know, then they click and they download and they go from there. A hundred of you are going to get $1,000 cash. 100 of you are going to get, you know, whatever it is.

And then they take. They click play, they listen for the golden ticket, and they go from there. Just like, you know, rating and reviewing Willy Wonka chocolate bars. That isn't what he wanted. He wanted people buying chocolate bars. The only way you could take the wrapper off of it is by buying the thing and taking out of the store. The thing about the golden ticket technique is the only way they're going to get it is if they click play. And there's this delta from Apple. You just released your podcast on the last thing that we did. It won't be an Apple for another four or five hours. The only, you know, the people are going to get it because they subscribed. Those are the golden ticket users. And tell them that you're good to go. We did that with a mutual friend of ours. The day we did that, he beat Oprah, you know, on Apple just by doing that. So the golden ticket technique, it's not for everyone. You know, you got to have a large audience to announce to at one point. But it's an interesting one. It builds an audience very, very quickly.

Yeah, I would say anytime you've got a captive audience.

I mean, if you go back the. One of the ways we did this, I see Tamara Patzer is watching us right now. Hi, Tamara. You know, like, what we do at our events is when we were promoting books, for example, we'd walk in and I would bribe people and I'd say, hey, look, go buy the book for a buck. I'm going to. I have a physical copy of the book. I'm going to give you. Every one of them at least has a dollar in it. Some have a five dollar bill. Some of them have a $20 bill. One of them's got a hundred dollar bill. And if you get a bill bigger than five bucks, come up to stage, we're going to take a photo together. And of course, there was that. But it was a great way to generate 100 sales, which is enough to make for a bestseller. I think anytime, a launch event.

Yeah, yeah. You rewarded behavior. And there are some who got large enough clubhouse groups where they could do that. There are people get large enough, you know, Facebook and YouTube feeds where they could do that. But you got. The thing is, Mike, you didn't just say at that event, we were there for a bunch of them. You didn't say, hey, do this and then come back and get your free book. You said, hey, do this thing that we need. Show us that you did it. That's what the golden ticket.

That's right. Yeah. We had everyone hold their phone up after they had purchased their book or looked at their screen. So, you know, there's always going to be a cheater or whatever, but whatever. Good. So the bottom line, do the act, take a picture, take a screenshot.

Send it to me with Instagram along with your address so I can send you something. You had bonus pillows in here. We got just a couple minutes left. I've been looking in the background at logo pillows, but why don't you talk about pillows?

So how do we switch over to my pick here? You did that.

We have to click on your solo layout. So the one on the bottom, go ahead.

Now, if you notice here behind me, you know, right there is the podcast report, but right there, oh, boy, it's backwards. Is Comeback Stories. Comeback Stories was our most recent podcast launch, and one of them is Vegas Raiders tight end Darren Waller.

And ladies and gentlemen, when you are.

A hot shot in the NFL, you know what happens a lot the week before the Super Bowl? They ask you to come on board.

And do tv, do Zoom, do that kind of stuff. You could do it from home because, you know, nobody's going to fly them anywhere right now with COVID and that type of thing. But the problem is, you ask somebody to hawk your podcast, they're not gonna. You ask somebody to promote your stuff, they're not gonna. But they're gonna ask you what that pillow is. They're gonna ask you what that sign is. Darren, actually, we had a hat made. Subscribe to Comeback.com subscribe to Comeback.com we were number one in the category that day, you know, from all the TV and whatnot. Done. So, Mike, go back to my. Go Back to the screen of me, man. But so now what we do is whenever I do my live events, we take different clients and we just have that subtle pillow on the back end. And I'll tell you this, I have yet to have a call where somebody hasn't said, hey, what is that pillow? And I got a whole stack of them. And you know, they're 20 bucks and they're two sided at Vistaprint. And the buzz that that gets is fun. Now you notice I didn't say go to Apple and go to Comeback Stories, you know, show. I said go to subscribe to comeback.com which sends people to that. And by the way, if they're on an iPhone, it sends them to Apple. If they're on an Android, it sends them to that device, that kind of thing. But subscribe to comeback.com. tamara likes the pillow, so at least we'll go from there. But it's just a little, little bonus, small things. But as of now, Overcast FM proven you know what you're getting. It absolutely works. You get on other shows, you be smart about it, and it's not that hard. Dynamic Insertion Swaps is a way that you can deal with people who don't have the same size. Just use the tech subscribe and follow contests where you rate them on what to do. And then the golden ticket technique is kind of an extra way to do that. If you want to get smart and do pillows, you can, but there we go. Mike.

You know what, Paul? You had me at tight end. I don't know why they have a, a position in the game. I, I remember, I misunderstood that the first time I'm like, that seems a little too forward for a professional sports activity. But that has nothing to do with podcasting. Paul Colligan.

It would be a mic show if you didn't make some inappropriate comment, right?

I tell you, I'll tell you what. I'm just noticing things. I didn't even make an inappropriate comment. I'm just.

You're the sign of new media, that's what you are. What is it with airplane food, Mike? What?

What is it? I'll tell you what. It's a quick run to the back room. So here's what we're gonna do. This is officially.

The end of this episode, which is five ways to grow your podcast followers. All of the tips are in the links that you'll see in the comments. And what we also like to do here, just because we're gonna do it, is we're gonna ask you to follow our Podcast. So Paul Colligan, he's got one right here. Heads up. Tuesday.com every Tuesday.

That's actually the email newsletter. Yeah, there we go.

Subscribe to the podcast Calm. All right, I've got two myself. I've got the Big Leap with Gay Hendricks, and that's@mrbz.com bl and then I have another one, which is Capability Amplifier with Dan Sullivan from Strategic Coach. You can just search for capabilityamplifier.com too. That's just a little shortcut link. But what I can tell you is it's always a pleasure to spend some time with you. We are about to do one more episode. This one I'm super excited about, Paul. We're going to talk about our top 10 AI powered marketing tools. So if you've ever wondered where is the state of actually using practical tactical tools that can do a whole bunch of your marketing for you? Well, we're going to unlock and talk about those and we're going to demonstrate them too. So, Paul, anything else you want to add to finish this baby up and push the boat back out into the harbor?

Well, Mike, you taught me a number of things, but one of the things you taught me was the magic trick. And for our AI demo, you know, now you've had some tech issues, so. So come to see if it works, which is always one of the benefits of a Mike and Paul show. But we have got the magic trick of, I think, all magic tricks.

In the AI world. I think we're going to have some fun with that. So if you're watching this on our feeds or on YouTube, on Facebook, it's the, it's the one below. If you're in the podcast, it's, you know, coming to you in the next episode. And if you are on this live, hit refresh. We will come up in a few minutes and we'll go from there. Right on.

Ladies and gentlemen, this has been Mike Koenigs, Paul Colligan. We'll see you in the next episodes. Refresh. See in just a couple moments. So long.