Episode 302: Unleash Your Team’s Secret Weapon to Scale Your Business with Ashley Harwood

Welcome to the Unstoppable Profit podcast. This podcast will give independent insurance agents all of the tools to grow your business and live life on your terms. Wherever you are today, if you're starting with nothing or well on your way to the success you desire, with the right people, processes and promotions in place, you will be unstoppable. And now I'd like to introduce your host, Mike Stromso.

Greetings, everybody. Welcome to the next episode of the Unstoppable Prophet podcast. And I intentionally brought my tone down just a tad entering this episode because I am privileged, grateful and thankful to have Ashley Harwood on the podcast today. And I'll go into the story in just a minute, but Ashley, welcome.

Thank you. I'm happy to be here.

I'm happy that you're here. And Ashley and I recently got to know each other at a training event and I learned more about her. And she has.

A talent, a gift, an attribute, all of the above. That really, if I look back over my 40 year journey as a licensed independent insurance agent and my entire business career journey, it's something that I would love to know more about. And so as I got to know Ashley, learned about she's an incredible entrepreneur. So I thought, let's get her on the podcast to help more people in her expertise, which is what Ashley, which.

Is working with introverts.

Introverts. So if you know your personality style and you may or may not know what extrovert versus introvert is, I mean, it's an all transparency. I'm an extrovert, that's all. So we are who we are, right? I mean, the gifts that we were dealt when we were conceived is who we are. And who we, who we've become is molded by how we were raised and our belief and everything else. But you know, we are operating within seven generations of people, everybody, as I've mentioned multiple times, and there's, you know, four quadrants of personalities out there. So when you blend that all together and it makes what, 28 different things going on out there and people and, and we're trying to build relationships. So anything that we can do to help people build deeper, more significant relationships is always a win. So I'm excited to dig into extrovert or, excuse me, introverts today. Ashley also wrote a book on the subject, and I would highly recommend that you get a hold of the book Move Over Extroverts by Ashley Harwood. It's on Amazon. That's where I got mine. She started in the real estate industry, but she's moving into other industries because introverts operate within any industry out there. So Ashley Harwood began her career in 2013 and built a six figure business before launching Move Over Extroverts in 2018. Since then, she's built programs and courses to help her fellow introverts. So you're a self proclaimed introvert.

Yes, I am proud of that.

Okay. And getting to know her, she's an awesome person. So to help them thrive in sales roles without feeling like they need to change who they are. She's a sought after national speaker, trainer, author of the book that I just showed you and contributing writer for Housing Wire. She was also named one of the top coaches Buy the clothes and Inman. Her coaching and training programs are available for entrepreneurs throughout a variety of industries. And now you have a little inside peek on why we connected so well so quickly. We just love to help people, right?

Yeah. That's what it's all about.

That's what it is all about. So anyway, thank you for joining us on the podcast, Ashley. Let's dive in, shall we?

Yeah, let's do it.

And let's just set the table here for a second. Many agency owners and leaders think that sales and leadership are all about being the loudest voice in the room. Ashley is here to help us flip that script. And if you've ever been in a room full of insurance agents, you know exactly what I'm talking about, right, Ashley?

Yeah, I bet you just have fun standing there observing.

I usually find my way to a corner.

Until you kind of figure out who these people are, right?

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. So fantastic. So what inspired you to write Move Over Extroverts?

I was inspired by not only my own journey and entrepreneurship, but what I saw from those around me. There are so many people who have such an amazing skill set and gift for relationship building, which is a core of any sales industry, but didn't have the tools they needed or the confidence to really embrace those strengths. So that was the core of why I felt the need to start all of these programs. And the book is sort of a culmination of all of my classes I've been teaching for years. And to have everything in one spot, it's really the best value for the biggest bang for your buck.

Yeah. And to give everybody a reason or a reminder why this is important. Because as I've talked about before, I had an insurance agency client who grew a $1.4 billion revenue company. And when I asked him.

Halfway into his journey about what the key to growing a Great team was one of the three core pie of the answer was it's the balance within a team. That's what Ashley is sharing today. We got extroverts and introverts and different personalities. It's that whole balance. So fantastic stuff. When did you first realize, Ashley, that introverts bring a different kind of power to business?

It was about three or four years into my own career and I was struggling as a fledgling real estate agent trying to which, similar to insurance agents, we have to be hustling, we have to go find the business. It's not just going to come to us. So I was struggling with managing my time and my energy and really figuring out what activities would be the best suited for me. And essentially I was burning myself out all the time. So that's when I did some research and found a book on introversion. It's called Quiet. I highly recommend it. The author is Susan Cain. I read that book and it just really shifted everything. I realized I'm not alone, I'm not broken, I'm not crazy. What I'm feeling is there's a reason for it and there's a solution for it. So that led me to make some changes in my business and my business got much, much better and easier and less time consuming. So, yeah, it just, it's been a really cool journey, but it took time to get there.

Yeah, I think most cool and significant journeys do.

Yeah.

So was that of sorts an aha moment or turning point for you?

It absolutely was. Probably one of the biggest in my life so far.

Yeah. Fantastic. Well, congratulations to getting to the first one. And I know there's a lot more in front of you, so keep doing the great things that you're doing out there in the world and I know you're constantly honing and refining that skill. So what do you think the business world or why do you think the business world might be so, in some cases biased towards extroverts?

I think it's a lack of understanding and, and I'd like to just give a quick definition of introvert versus extrovert because a lot of people that I encounter don't realize that they're more introverted than they might think. So the, the common misconception is that all introverts are very shy and withdrawn and quiet and we're not good with people, we don't like people. None of those things equate to introversion. They're just personality traits that one may or may not have. So that's where this bias comes from. Like, oh, we want to only hire extroverts because they're going to go out and network and meet people and be bubbly and outgoing. That's not necessarily the case. There are a lot of highly social introverts that you wouldn't know are introverts, but that social output is very draining for them, for us, people like me. So the important thing for us to be aware of is simply we need a break after.

That's really the key. So it doesn't mean that we're not well suited to be salespeople or industry leaders. We just need a rest.

Let's dig into that a minute. What do you need? What do you mean you need a break or rest?

So for introverts, we expend energy when we're around other people. Other people are draining, even if we enjoy it.

Yeah.

And in order to recharge our batteries, that really only happens when we're alone. So we need to kind of disconnect for a while and be alone to recharge.

Aha. So when they kind of remove themselves, maybe in a social situation for a few minutes, that's just a recharge moment.

Yes.

Good stuff. That's great to know. So you had a definition. Do you have definitions?

I do. So the definition of an introvert is somebody who not only recharges their energy by being alone, we're also internal processors. So we need that quiet alone time to think through things versus extroverts who tend to need to talk through things to process them. And I say that with love because that's a lot of people in my life. That's my boyfriend who wrote the foreword to the book. He's an extrovert and he processes by talking. And that takes energy from me. So I know that and he knows that. And it's not a bad thing. It just is.

Yeah. So he totally understands when you say, I need 15.

Yeah, absolutely. And, well, at this point, he knows me so well that he will call me out and say, I think you need a little alone time because you seem tired and just go take a break.

Well, you probably go hang out with Marty, the big orange cat. And Marty, does it drain your energy?

He doesn't. He is. He is a good boy.

Yeah. That's awesome. That's awesome. Yeah. This is important to know. It's just that realization of, you know, how people operate and, you know, what makes them tick. So this is great information. So what are some other versus extrovert? Do you have a definition of extroverts? There as well.

Yeah, it's basically the opposite. Extroverts get really energized and recharged around other people. If we think back to earlier in 2020, 2021, that was really, really hard on the extroverts because all of their social interactions, at least in person, were stripped away. And that was really difficult because that's never happened for them before.

Right.

So that. That's a big part of it, as well as needing to kind of talk out, processing information.

Yeah. So let's get to know extroverts a little bit better. What are some of the biggest misconceptions about. Excuse me, Introverts. What are some of the biggest misconceptions about introverts in leadership, sales and entrepreneurship and maybe teamwork?

Simply that we're not equipped for it, that we don't have what it takes, that we don't have the skill set or the energy for it. And none of that's true across the board. In fact, the opposite tends to be true. A lot of CEOs and leaders in many industries are introverts.

Right. And since I got to know you and maybe understood, you know, what an introvert is versus an extrovert, more on a deeper level, I've kind of been watching what's going on in my world and I see them. In fact, I'll be completely transparent here. I just got done with a conversation with my wife this morning and I said, knowing that I had this coming up with you, and I said.

She'S an introvert.

Was that Naha for you?

It was even. We've been together 35 years. I mean, I kind of knew it, but now I have a greater understanding. So, I mean, we've been through a lot together. So back to helping people in business, industry. So, yeah, it's just identification. Right. And don't assume anything. Right.

Yeah. It's really hard to tell externally from somebody you're not super close to. Your spouse, your kids, you probably have a better idea of if they're more introverted or extroverted. Your clients. This is important for. For everyone in the insurance world. Don't worry too much about whether your clients or prospects are introverts or extroverts. Frankly, it doesn't matter because their energetic needs are not super important to working with you in terms of insurance or even in terms of real estate. That doesn't. That doesn't matter. Like, stick to your knowing yourself first. That's the most important. And then your partner, your kids, business partners, that comes next. Everyone else don't worry about how their energy manifests.

That's good to know. Yeah, we just need to understand ourselves first. And more importantly then. So me the extrovert and you the introvert. What a perfect conversation. So what are some things that I need to be thinking about as an extrovert? On how to better serve and interact with you. So I build relationship and not push it away.

I think the easiest way to describe it is. I'm sure you've heard the term mirroring and matching.

Yes, I have.

Yeah, it's a little bit of that. It's just kind of meeting somebody where they're at. If there's a huge disparity between energy levels, which can happen amongst any combination of introvert extroverts, just who somebody is in that given moment. But if somebody is just really excited, really loud, talking really fast, and the other person's so chill and so slow and it's good to try to meet somewhere in the middle while not being inauthentic, but just making the other person feel more comfortable.

Got it. Yeah. Because you want to continue to build, not push away.

Right, right.

So how do you see introverts changing the game in business industries, specifically insurance or any others?

Yeah, we, we are the, the ones who get in there. And I see introverts as building bigger businesses more slowly but more intentionally because not, not, not overall. These are very general statements I'm gonna make, but yeah, we, we do. Introverts do like to go deeper with fewer people. So it becomes a very deep relationship business, a referral based business versus someone who's going to be really good at cold calling on the telephone.

That's important and.

Fantastic. I mean, there's opportunity out there everywhere and we want to continue to grow that. So what are some of the superpowers that introverts bring to the table?

We in general tend to be great listeners and ask great questions and the.

Question is the answer, right?

Yes. And that's one of my favorite things to do. I was at a conference earlier in this week and I love asking different types of questions that are unexpected. For instance, what's your favorite piece of your business right now? Or what's something you're looking forward to in the next few months instead of just how are you? How it's go deep, go deeper. Everyone can do this. Go deeper with people, they'll remember you for it.

Conversation starters.

Yeah.

Yeah. I've got a list of 10 right over here that I learned years ago. So that particular aspect hasn't changed. Kind of a Pattern interrupt. Right?

Absolutely.

Yeah, yeah. So how can introverts leverage that superpower of listening and preparation and depth to possibly outperform say, the extroverts or other people in business and in relationships, having.

The knowledge about it first is the key to stepping into your confidence. One of the challenges I see with the introverts that I coach is a lack of confidence. It's being told either implicitly or explicitly, you can't do this, you can't be successful. And so if you, if you're already feeling that, that's going to erode your confidence a little bit. So first step is just know that you have a superpower, own it, step into it and build that confidence and go out into the world without trying to change who you are. But just saying, no, I'm here, I'm not going to be the right fit for every single person, which is true of everybody, by the way. But I'm going to attract the clients who are the best fit for me, the people who like me, the people I like and just go out and quietly and surreptitiously go find your people and build these huge businesses and they won't see it coming.

Yeah. There is a whole list of iconic business entrepreneurs over time. One of them comes to mind is Jim Collins from, you know, good to great and great by choice series and all that. I will suggest he was pretty introverted in his own right. So fantastic stuff. So you mentioned, you know, helping people and coaching people. Can you think of any specific stories of people that you've worked with where, you know, unpacking this and getting, you know, identifying themselves and how to better thrive, where they actually took that and thrived in unexpected ways.

Yes. I'll share my favorite story and it's, it's in the book as well, but awesome. It's, it's a story about somebody who came to one of my in person training classes. It was a full day class and throughout the, the course of the day we came to find out that he was sabotaging all of his appointments with potential clients. And the way he was doing this is on the drive over because most of our, the appointments in real estate are in person in somebody's. He was driving over, he was making a phone call to his family member and it was just totally zapping his energy. So he'd show up to the meeting with the prospective client, not in the best headspace, not in the best mood. And the aha for him was I said, why don't you just call this person afterwards after the important meeting. So, so you're showing up with your best self. And he was like, oh my God. Mind blowing. You know, sometimes it takes somebody outside of yourself to tell you something. That's a small shift, but it makes a huge difference. And from that point forward, his conversion rate went through the roof because he was being very intentional with the activities leading up to that important meeting.

That's the second or third time you said that. I, and I agree with you. Intentionality and anything we do is huge. And so to your point, I learned something this morning, and I may have heard this years ago, but it was reminded this morning. If you take your pen, everybody, and you put it on your nose, you can't see it, right? Because you're too close. And that's the power of having somebody from the outside, such as Ashley or myself or anybody, to see things that you can't see. That's great, great stuff. And so I'm sure that agent now thrives at a much higher level because of that self identification with intentionality.

Yes.

Awesome, awesome stuff. So are there any other practical tools or habits, you know, preparation techniques or anything for introverts specifically that they can use to, you know, you talked about intentionality. What else to prepare for? Business situations.

Personal situations in life?

Yeah, any. Any situation. And it's.

It seems very obvious, but I'm going to say it anyway because people don't think about it. It's looking at the calendar for the past week or two and putting either a plus or a minus next to every activity. Did it drain your energy? Did it use your energy or did it give you energy? Start to do this and you'll see patterns. And then going forward, you can make really intentional decisions and be strategic around how you're setting up your day and where you're spending your best energy. And if you know that you're going to have an important meeting you in the evening, what do you need to do beforehand to either recharge your energy batteries or protect the energy you have from the rest of the day? Maybe that's rescheduling other appointments or maybe that's scheduling a nap for yourself or something.

That's awesome. I have a silly question, but I find the only silly question is one that doesn't get asked. So extroverts, Introverts. I mean, everybody has their specific time of day when they seem to thrive the most, right? It's no different for introverts than it is with extroverts, right?

No, it's not. It's just a Matter of what it is for you as an individual.

Yeah, yeah. So like I'm an early morning guy, especially after my about an hour and a half of mental preparation, reading and exercise. Like right then baby, that's when I'm at my best. And some people are like that better in the evening. Right. And so it's no different. Introvert, extrovert.

Right. It's just knowing yourself. So I would encourage everyone listening to spend some time really reflecting on this and figure out where your best moments are.

Yeah, fantastic. So how can business leaders, and it is my 100% humble opinion that leadership in business and training in business need consistent work and improvement. Ladies and gentlemen, how can business leaders better support introverts on their teams so that everybody wins the balance within a team. Thoughts?

Well, my first thought is many of the leaders out there are probably introverts themselves.

And the ones who are not.

Know that the introverts on your team are going to just process information differently. They're going to have different energetic needs. And so I would open up a dialogue and ask them what they need, how they're doing, you know, make sure people aren't burning out. That's the bottom line. If you're an extrovert, you have introverts on your team. You guys are spending all day together. The extroverts are going to be all amped up and charged from that. The introverts are going to be slowly draining minute by minute. So being aware of that and making sure your folks aren't burning out and that they're getting that alone time, maybe it's even encouraging. Hey, why don't you go take a half hour walk if you want or something. So it's not everybody together all the time.

Yeah, yeah, I get it. I've got an out of left field question for you. So my extrovert self is a partner with an introvert and we have been together for 16 years and I'm grateful for her. But the more I get into understanding people. Thank you, Ashley for helping me understand this part about people. I can see that I drain her.

I'm sure you do. And that's okay.

I'm sure I do too. And she tells me so. She doesn't use those words, but I can see in her eyes. So help me work through this. Because impatience, I mean self admitting my impatience with everything.

How do I deal with that? If you're just an extrovert out there who's a leader who, you know, says, hey, it's been five minutes, that's about Four minutes too long. How do we deal with that? Especially if we're dealing with an introvert who might need to process it or exact their energy.

I think it's all about communication.

And asking the other person what they need and saying, I understand that we process things differently. Do you want to take some time and think through this and get back to me and then you as the extrovert being okay with that?

What if we're not?

I mean, if it comes down to it, it might not be the best partnership, not for you and your partner because you've been making work for over a decade. But if it's a new partnership and two people are just so different and they can't come to an a mutually agreeable way to work together, that's what it is. It's just finding a system that works for all parties. Even if somebody give and somebody's take and maybe it's okay, you can't have a week to think about this, but you can have a day more than five minutes.

I guess it just depends what the decision is. So that's great information. I've become a lot more patient, I mean, to be honest with you, and transparent here. But you know, still there's times where, you know, I'd like to get to decision pretty quickly and some people need to think about it and especially in sales, right?

Yeah.

Especially if it's a big financial decision and they're going to enter into a coaching relationship.

They want to sleep on it or think about it, of course. And we just need to understand that this is great stuff. Ashley. Thank you.

You're welcome.

So for an introvert running a business, an independent insurance agency or anything similar, what's the first step, in your opinion, to thrive in business today?

The first step is to find ways of growing the business that don't burn you out. Find ways that are the best return on not only your time and money, but also your energy.

Ah, identification. Intentionality.

Yes.

Getting clear.

So for extra extroverts leading introverts, again, just to reiterate because we believe people need to hear things seven times in our circles. What's the best way to unlock the potential for extroverts leading introverts in addition to everything else we said, any other thoughts on that?

One other thought? Encourage them to be 100% who they are. Ah, sometimes I see, I see in leadership, often the leader will think they're doing the right thing by encouraging the people they're leading to be more like them and operate like them. I was successful doing this. So you should be too understanding. That's not always the case, and sometimes it can backfire. So I would lead through making your people feel encouraged and safe to be their best selves, even if it looks different than what you're used to or what you expect.

Yeah, that's. That's great stuff. That's great stuff. And, you know, I've learned through my hundreds, if not thousands of interviews over the years of people to come onto our businesses that it's really all about them and never about you. And so I've learned to ask the question, you know, paint a picture for me how we can support you and help you thrive as part of our agency. And you just have to listen to what they say.

Yeah, absolutely. And encourage it.

And encourage it.

Exactly. Yeah.

We want to help you be the best version of yourself. Right.

You're going to end up with a lot more happy people that way, too.

Yeah, exactly. We like to inspire happiness, so I love to wrap it up with takeaways, action items. So what's one thing everybody listening or watching this podcast can do this week to harness their introvert strengths in business? Because I'm going to suggest. There's a lot more introverts out there that I'm aware of, and I want to help them.

Yeah, they're usually people who come to my classes and listen to me speak, who don't realize that they're introverts. And then afterwards they're like, huh, I think maybe I am. So the one tangible thing you can do is look. Look ahead at your calendar. Look ahead for the next week or so, and find a spot where you can really be purposeful in recharging your energy batteries. Look for a place where you can schedule some sort of break. A walk, a nap, drive in the car by yourself in the silence, whatever you're going to need. And if there's a way to do that before something important, even better. But start practicing that because it doesn't come naturally.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Back to intentionality.

So I love that. And that's kind of one of the highlights of today, getting to know you and learning more from you. Thank you for that. Speaking of learning more, let's just remind everybody Ashley Harwood's book, Move Over Extroverts. It applies to any business. Again, where can they find this book, Ashley?

Amazon or the Barnes and Noble website if you don't want to be on Amazon?

Okay. Move Over Extroverts by Ashley Harwood. You can find it on Amazon. Barnes and Noble. I can't wait to dig into it even deeper as I've learned more about this critically, critically important space. I mean, let's face it, ladies and gentlemen, people are silently waiting to be led. We, as leaders, it is our position to learn how to lead them from the highest level. We've got to get better at leading people and tie back to what all we talk about here on every podcast. You don't have to be the loudest to be the most profitable. You just have to be the most intentional. And that was the wrap up thought that I had. And it is no accident because there are no accidents. That's kind of what we've been talking about today.

That's perfect.

So, Ashley, thank you. Any last thoughts, comments, suggestions for the introverts out there or an extrovert who's dealing with introverts?

Know yourself first and then get to know the people around you in your close circles. And if you're not sure about your spouse, have a conversation. Say, I just listened to the podcast. What do you think? What do you think? I am? What do you think?

Yeah. Yeah. So great stuff. Thank you. I appreciate that. So.

Another one last question I just came up with. Does it take longer to get to know an introvert than it does an extrovert?

Usually, yeah. We do tend to be a little guarded.

Yeah. Cool. How much longer does it vary?

It does vary. It varies on how comfortable we feel with the other person and the situation.

Oh. So it's back to me. I see it in the mirror.

It's partially that. It's also like, is this interaction going to be worth my energy? Highest level of intentionality. And it's. Are these words I'm saying going to be worth my time and energy?

Aha. So when we got together and then we had dinner with the group afterwards, you were probably, because I remember you're sitting right across the table from me and you're probably looking at me going, is he going to be worth my time and energy?

I was, and you were. That's why I followed up.

Well, thank you. I appreciate that. I'm glad you did too. I mean, we're helping thousands of people here and that's absolutely fantastic. So thank you for that.

You're welcome. Thank you.

You're my pleasure. My honor. Ashley Harwood. Keep doing amazing things out there in business and let's keep in touch on, you know, how we can further help independent insurance agency entrepreneurs, leaders and owners in that space, nationwide and worldwide. For that fact, being a better leader.

For their people, that would be great. I'D love to.

All right, fantastic. All right, fantastic everybody. Thank you. Thank you for joining this episode of the Unstoppable Profit podcast. And if this is your first time on the podcast, welcome. My name is Mike Stromso. I'm widely recognized as a leading author, speaker and coach for the independent insurance agency industry. You can learn more about what we do@upplife.com that's uppl life.com if you're interested in attending one of our virtual or live events, you can go to upplife.com or we have a live event coming up. It's upp mastermind.com it's our annual event. It's going to be awesome, full of extroverts and introverts so you can meet all kinds of different agency leaders and people at that event. UPP Mastermind, everything that we do is designed to share our over 36 years of insurance agency ownership and leadership. And we share with you everything that we've learned to help you grow your business, create wealth so you too can have more freedom to live life on your own terms. And if you got great value out of this podcast or you know, an introvert or an extrovert who needs to hear this message, please share our link with them. It's Unstoppable Profit Podcast. That's Unstoppable Profit podcast dot com. Just share that with them and most importantly, have them go up to the top and have them click subscribe so they don't miss one valuable episode of the podcast. And of course our podcast is out there on all the channels. Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, our YouTube channel and more. Unstoppable Profit Podcast. So Ashley Harwood, thank you again for joining us.

Thank you.

Appreciate all that you do for business, entrepreneurs and leaders out there. Keep doing awesome stuff. And to everybody here, thank you for joining us. Investing time to learn more, to become more because we attract exactly what we are and who we have become. So the goal this week, keep becoming more every day. Be intentional. Be intentional in your growth, learning and development and we will see you on the next podcast. Take care.

Do you love the podcast but don't know where or how to get started? Visit www.upplife.com that's up l I f e.com to learn more about our coaching and Mastermind programs and how you can join our community of growth oriented agency owners today.