Dame Lillard on Blazers future, CJ McCollum trade & fight for respect | The Draymond Green Show

What's up everybody? It's Draymond Green. Make sure you subscribe to the Volumes YouTube channel below so you don't miss any more of this great content going forward. Man, I'm honored to have this next guest on, a guy who I've now had the opportunity to play with, win a gold medal with, but someone who I have the utmost respect for, that I've kind of built a— that I have built a bond with. And it's funny 'cause it just kind of happened like right after at the combine when we was in the draft together. 6th overall pick of our draft, but just kind of had that same underdog coming up and just clicked right off the bat. You know, has become a brother of mine, built a lifelong relationship that'll go far beyond our basketball years. And I think that grew even stronger in getting some hardware together and a gold medal. But I'm honored to have you on, Dame. Welcome to the Draymond Green Show, my brother. Thank you.

Appreciate it, bro.

6-time All-Star. First off, man, how you feeling? Obviously we know you're coming off the injury. Well, you had surgery. You're trying to rehab back from the injury. How you feeling first off?

I should have listened to y'all, bro. Y'all told me to do it. I should have just got it done. But I mean, shit, I had to do what I had to do. I ended up getting that surgery. Where our team was at, it just made sense. You know what I mean? Just go ahead and correct it and move forward. But I mean, it ain't a bad surgery. You know what I mean? It was like, you know, it's an aggressive recovery. So I had surgery on January 13th at like 6:00 AM.

Mm-hmm.

And then on the 14th at 6:00 AM, I had therapy, yoga. It was like right away, just like get back moving, start attacking it and building that strength back up. And since then, it's just been every day, bro. Just rehab, all that. So I mean, I'm back on the move now. Just cutting, sprinting, jumping, and stuff like that. Now it's just a matter of strengthening my adductors in that groin area, my hips, and getting my core back strong. But I'm getting there quick, bro. Like, I'm moving. I'm just not in a rush.

Nah, that's beautiful seeing I was, as you saw, I said on, I think Instagram, like, "This dude finally going to get the surgery." It made me happy. And I don't think—

To my defense, bruh, I didn't realize how hurt I was until now when I'm walking around and I'm doing stuff. I didn't realize how hurt I was, bruh. Like, I knew I was hurt, but I ain't know I was hurt like that. Feel me?

It's funny because the reality is, We're all, like you just said, we're all telling you like, "Damn, get the surgery. Damn, get the surgery." And the reality is you're stubborn as hell and you don't listen. But what most people don't understand is that's actually what makes you great.

Yeah.

Is that you are stubborn, that you do carry that chip on your shoulder. And so it wasn't ironic to me that you wouldn't listen to none of us tell you get surgery.

I almost did, bro, but I was like, I think I'm cool. Until my ass couldn't move, I was like, man, I should've just got that damn suit. But it's all good.

I don't think people really understand, there was a lot of talk after the Olympics, you know, Dame don't look healthy, this. And then, you know, you rehab, you come, or you took a break, you rehab, then you come in for training camp.

Yeah.

And you having those days still, but people don't understand when we were over in Tokyo and seeing you not be able to practice and seeing you like, "Hey man, I'm hurting today, but tomorrow it'll loosen up again." It's good. Like, "It'll loosen up again and I'll be able to play." Like, I don't think people really understand what you were going through over there. So like, walk them through And I can help with that, but walk them through what you were going through in the Olympics and still continue to fight through, continue to help us win that gold medal.

I mean, I think the number one thing for me, bro, is I ain't even comfortable with excuses. You feel me? So my main thing was like, shit, I just gotta find a way to get through it. But I think what it came down to is it had been getting worse every season. You know what I'm saying? Like, at first it was like, all right, I gotta get treatment and then it feel better for the next couple games. And then it'll be like bothering me. I get in the cold tub, get a massage, and I'll be good for a month. Then the next year it was like every week I gotta be on the table before and after practice. And then the next year it was like, I do the same stuff, it ain't really helping. And then last season, it was bothering me the whole season. Like the whole year I'm like struggling. Like in between games, I'm trying to walk up my stairs and like my shit is completely locked up. So I'm like, I start realizing like I'm really hurt. Then I stopped being able to explode like vertical when I was running full speed. When usually I can just pop up there. I'm like, damn, I can't run fast and jump or run fast, change direction and go off one foot. So we get to the playoffs and during the playoffs, like I was getting so much treatment and, you know, doing medication and stuff like that to where I was able to have a good playoff. We lost.

Mm-hmm.—

and I started getting ready for the Olympics. So after a long season, and then I kept training, then went to Vegas, and then was there for 3 weeks, and then went to the Olympics, and shit, it pretty much just gave out on me. Like, it was done, bruh. And the whole time we was there, I was like, bruh, this ain't the experience I planned to have on the court.

Yeah.

It was already like half the experience just being there 'cause we couldn't do nothing, so. But on the court, I'm like, "Shit, I'm finna play with Draymond Green, I'm playing with KD, I'm playing with all these people. I'm finna hit 8 threes a game. I'm finna get some dunks. We finna have some fun." And then it's like, you get there, I can't really move, my shit hurting. I couldn't even walk normal. So I'm like, "As long as we don't leave here without winning this gold medal, like, I'm cool. Like, we just gotta win a gold medal." Yeah. KD just telling me, you know, in between timeouts, like, "Bro, just, we just gonna need you to hit a big shot. We just gonna need you to do this, do that." I'm like, "If I can do anything, I can do that, bro." Like, I can't, I mean, I ain't gonna be out there playing all these minutes, which I didn't need to, but, you know, I can have some moments. And, you know, we accomplished what we went over there to accomplish. And, you know, I'm just happy I was able to get through it, but— Hey, After that, it was all downhill. You know what I'm saying? That's why I said I should have just had the surgery. 'Cause after the Olympics, I took a bunch of time off. But then when I came back to training camp, it was like the first day we started like moving around. We got to the end of the day and I was just like, you know when you know something, but you don't wanna tell nobody 'cause you like, "Man, I'm fucked." You know? Absolutely. It's past the point. Like I got to camp and I was just like, after the first day, I knew, I knew at training camp, like, it ain't never been this bad. You know what I'm saying? Like, I could at least practice a little bit. I got up the next day and like, it was done, bro. Like, it was done. So that was it. But I mean, it is what it is. I never really had, I never really thought a whole lot about, you know, what other people were saying because you gotta ask the people who've experienced the injury to really know. 'Cause it's hard to explain. So you don't wanna be explaining this shit and then sounding like you just making a bunch of shit up. So, you know, I just didn't say nothing and I'm still not gonna say nothing. I just handled it so I can get healthy. And then when I'm healthy and then they see me, they gonna be like, "Something's wrong." You know what I mean?

Yeah.

When they see how I return, they gonna be like, Damn, you know, like something was really wrong. And that's all I really care about. You know what I'm saying? Is being healthy when I know I wasn't healthy.

No doubt. And I think for me who already had a bunch of respect for you, I gained even more respect, you know, in going through those times of me having to go to Coach Pop like, yo, take Dame outta practice. Like he not gonna come out. Like he hurting, you know, like he can barely move. Like just let's get him outta practice. At least we can get him for the game tomorrow. So I gained a bunch of respect for that or for you and just watching you handle that, you know, but, and moving forward, obviously, can we expect you back this year or should we expect you back this year?

I mean, right now, I don't, when I first had the surgery, I was, you know, more optimistic, like, you know, we gonna see. But I think where we are right now and, what we need to happen for us to be able to take full advantage of, you know, the opportunity we've created with all the moves we made. I don't even think that's the play to make. You know what I'm saying? I ain't 1,000% sure, but I mean, at this point, I'm not sure how much sense it made. Yeah.

No, and that makes sense. And obviously you had the opportunity to use all this time to get healthy. I think people don't realize you, like how much you've been in the playoffs and how the toll that that takes on your body. So I think it's great for you to get this rest. And speaking of the moves that y'all made and trading away Norman Powell and Robert Covington, and then of course, obviously trading CJ away. And I know I've spoke to you about this before, just you and CJ. And I remember you telling me like, nah, me and CJ talk all the time. We know at some point this is gonna happen. It's kind of just a matter of when it does happen. Obviously it's happened now. How did you feel about the move? How you feel about what it was for CJ and him going to New Orleans and the type of situation it is for him, but then also what y'all got back and where that leaves y'all going forward?

I mean, conversation going back, you know, 3, 4 years where it's like, I remember when we lost to New Orleans in the playoffs, it was like, man, we don't know what's gonna happen at this point. We just got swept as a 3 seed. Like, we don't know what's gonna happen, but we knew it was a possibility. And, you know, I think at that point we started to line our contracts up to where we was basically on the same time, you know, where like, all right, if something gonna happen, you know what I mean? Like, we was already, aware of what the possibilities could be. And I think that's what being solid and, you know, really being partners is about. Whereas like, we know that this is a possibility. Like, I'm never gonna be like, I'm never gonna hang him out there and I'm never gonna know something and not go to him like, "Look, bro, I think something might go down," or whatever, you know? Like, 2 days before it happened, we talked on the phone for an hour, you know? Like—

Yeah.

Just talking about it. So you never would, like, if it was gonna be something where I was gonna be moved and CJ knew about it, I would never want him to be like, I would never want him to tell them like, "No, don't do this." I would wanna be there on the strength of them wanting me to be there as opposed to me being there on the strength of somebody making them make me be there. So, and I know he feel the same way, so.

Yeah.

You know, you get to a point where, you know, maybe something run its course, you know? You gotta reroute yourself and try to figure out what's the best thing, what's the best angle to take at this point. And that's where that reached. And, you know, he went into a great basketball situation, you know, with—

Yeah.

BI and Zion and Valanciunas. And also people don't realize how good CJ really is. I think that's another thing is like, they don't realize that how nice he really is. So that shit was tough to deal with, bro. I ain't gonna lie. Like I was, you know, when you know something could be coming and you know that it's a possibility, but when it happened, it's different.

Like, damn.

Absolutely. And I kind of been stuck in that space the whole time. Like I've been watching every game in New Orleans, like, damn, like he really ain't coming back. You know, it was over.

So.

That's kind of where I've been at. I still kind of haven't even really moved past it 'cause I ain't had to play. So—

Yeah, yeah.

Like when I ain't had to get on the court and he ain't on the team no more, it's like, it probably take a little bit longer to be like, man, this shit really over, you know? So, you know, the end of an era, bro.

Absolutely. And I think obviously y'all had a great run. We met y'all in the Western Conference Finals and in other playoff series as well. But in looking back on these years, I think it's 9 years y'all played together or 8 years. I mean, 9 years as teammates, 8 years because of the injuries. But what was your favorite moment in playing with CJ that you can go back to and be like, that was the moment that we'll hold on to forever? Or is it just the relationship overall?

I'll say the relationship overall, 'cause there was a lot of moments where I was just like, you know, that I think about and I'm like, "Damn." But I think the moment that I think back to is, and just because, like, even when CJ wasn't playing all the way up until last season, when COVID hit, me and CJ sat next to each other on the plane for the first 8 years we played together. We was, like, sitting right next to each other on the plane. So we used to watch film together. We used to listen to music right there. We used to be watching TV shows, like, everything. Like, we used to sit right there next to each other.

And—

When we made the first move, when, you know, LA left and Batum and Wes and Rolo and all them, when that team first broke up, CJ came in and he was like, "Bro, I got you. Like, we ain't about to just be trash." You know what I mean? Like, "We probably ain't, it's gonna take time, but like, I'mma, I got you." And I remember we like squeaked our way into the playoffs that year and we ended up being like a 5 seed. Or something like that, a 5 seed in 2016. It was my 4th year. And we played the Clippers in the first round. And in game, I think game 4, CP and Blake got hurt. And then we tied the series up 2-2. And then we went to LA game 5, won that one, was up 3-2. And then we closed them out in game 6 at home. And I just remember like walking off the court and I turned around and he was behind me and—

Yeah.

And he just hugged me and I was like, "Bro, we just won a playoff series, bro, the first year. Like, we gonna be all right." And I just remember, like, I just remember we embraced each other and I was like, "Bro, we finna, like, we about to get some shit done." You know what I mean? Like, I'll never forget that. 'Cause I was like, "All right, you know, it's real. We really, as long as we can put it together, like, we got a chance." So. Yeah.

That's it. And so in making those moves, I think y'all will have somewhere around $60 million or something like that in cap space. Like you're turning 32 as I am turning 32 next month as well. The one thing you don't have on your side is time. And so you don't have like, oh man, I can watch this play out for 4 years or 5 and, grow with this. Like y'all have to go for it now. Do you feel confident in the team's plans and what they want to do moving forward that's going to help you get what I ultimately know you want to get to, which is winning the championship in Portland?

Right. No, I think what we've done, bruh, is put ourselves in a position we have not been in. I don't think the year when we signed ET, we signed ET, we signed Mo, we signed Chief. You know, we just signed a Buck Myers. We signed a bunch of people. And we haven't been in this position, you know, with talent on the roster already since I've been here. You know, you look at what Ant is doing and then you look at what Nas was doing before he got hurt. And then you add Nurk, like Josh Hart, Joe Ingles. Like we got some pieces to the puzzle now that we just gotta use what we have available. To add to that. And it's just a matter of us being able to execute that, bro. We in play to get something done. And I trust the fact that we gonna be able to execute it, you know? And we just gotta, you know, we just gotta see where that land. That's where we at now. We just gotta see where we land at the end of it, bro.

Absolutely. And I wanna talk to you about a young point guard that I have that has earned a lot of, or gained a lot of respect from me. And I know how you are. Like a lot of guys in this league, you really ain't rocking with, you kind of stay to yourself. But I also know you do respect guys who get it out the mud. And another mid-level guy like yourself who play, I mean mid-major guy like yourself played at the mid-major level. Ja Morant. What do you make of what he's doing with his team, especially at this stage in his career? 'Cause not many people can really relate to what he's going through. Like, I can't, as much success as I had early on in my career, I can't tell you what Ja Morant is doing.

No.

And there's other guys in this league who's big time that can't either, that did it at the level that y'all, that you've done it at as early in your career as you did. And now what he's doing, what do you think about what Ja doing and where he's falling in that pecking order of great point guards in the league?

Nah, I think he's rising quick, you know? And I think a few things, bruh, when, from experience as a mid-major point guard that ends up being a top pick in the draft and being a good NBA player, is that as a mid-major player, bruh, you're playing with less talent than what everybody else played with. And you're learning early how to get the most out of that and how to make a team win without everybody just being nice. Having the same ability that you have. So you gotta learn how to lead. And that ain't always scoring all the points or getting a bunch of assists. You gotta learn how to make people go. You gotta learn how to make people, like, come along with you, like, and do everything they can to have a part in winning. And I think you saw that, like, CJ did that. Kawhi did that. Steph did that. You know, it was like all of us that come from— Draymond Green. Small schools, it's like we have that responsibility in college with lesser, like less talented players. So when you come to the NBA and you playing with more talent and you got the ability yourself, like you know how to make it happen. You know, it's one thing I know how to do and that's make it happen. And I think a big factor in the level that you do that at is what are you surrounded with? Sometimes they get it right. Sometimes they don't. You know, like, I feel like if I had the team that I came into the league with for 2 more years, I would be a champion already. If I still— if I played my 5th, 6th year with LaMarcus, Robin Lopez, Wes Matthews, Nick Batum, Mo Williams, like, if I still had all these dudes on my team as a 6-year player, I would have won one. But, you know, that didn't happen for a long enough period of time for me to come into, you know what I mean, what I was coming into. Mm-hmm. So for him, I think they've got it. You got Jaren Jackson.

Mm-hmm.

You got Steven Adams, an experienced center that's gonna set screens, he gonna rebound, he gonna talk, he gonna be the enforcer. And then you got Dylan Brooks. Then you got Desmond Bane. Then you got Ja. And then you got Jones coming off the bench. And then you got, DeAnthony Melton. DeAnthony Melton, like what's the athletic, they be throwing it a lot to—

Brandon Clark.

Brandon Clark, like they got it right. You know what I'm saying? So like they got him, but they got everything else right. So now it's like, he got, like he got a shot. They just gotta keep the team there. You know what I mean? So I mean, he, I got a lot of love and respect for Jock. Like the thing, the number one thing that I love is, when I came in the league, like, and you was the same way. Like, people might not have liked you like that. Like, I don't think people dislike me, but when I came in the league, bro, I didn't have just no above and beyond respect for dudes like that. Like, I knew who was who, but I wasn't coming in bowing down. Like, my mentality was like, I can fuck with everybody.

Absolutely.

Like, you might be, more highly regarded or got a better body of work, but like, I'm not doing no bowing down to nobody. Like, and I feel that way to this day. And he has that about him, you know?

Absolutely.

He has that about him, like ain't no bowing down. And I think that's my number one favorite thing about him.

Man, I absolutely love that because the reality is you come in and you bow down to these guys who, You know, we've put ourselves in a position to now be those guys, right?

Yeah.

But you come in and you bow down to those guys, everyone's gonna continue to follow that. Or if you give people something else to follow, they're gonna follow that. And it's funny because I be talking to my, I talk to my fiancée all the time, just sitting in the crib and I'll just be watching the game and start talking to her about like, the games within the game, you know, and, or talking to my mom. And I remember I was telling my fiancée the other day about the Bengals. I said, baby, the thing about this team is they're young and they're unfazed. When you young and you're unfazed, a team go up 10, you just standing there like, you know, or—

They won 3 to the Chiefs, bruh.

Absolutely.

And they don't care, bruh.

Like they're not even really, they haven't been around long enough to even process how big that moment is. And so for them, it's just like, oh, we down 21-3. What people don't understand is when the Chiefs are up 21-3, the Chiefs supposed to win that game.

Right.

So once they go up 21-3, they get tighter than the opposing team.

Exactly.

And this situation was the Bengals. They get tighter.. And they like loose, like, nah, we good. Like we just gonna keep playing. And so that's a good trait for a young team to have. And you only get that by having, in a lot of cases, actually a young leader because he doesn't process what the moment is. And because he don't process what that moment is, everybody who follow him, they don't process what that moment is. And I was telling her the other day, I said, that was us. My first year we won a championship. In my third year, Klay in his fourth year. Steph's in his sixth year. But for Steph, his sixth year, he, the first three years of his career, he missed half of each one of the seasons.

First four years didn't count.

Yeah.

Like, he didn't know what was going on either until y'all, until the year, who did they lose? Who did y'all lose to the Spurs or did y'all lose to Denver?

Yeah, we lost to the Spurs in the second round after beating Denver.

Yeah.

And then that's when it was like, oh man, you know what I'm saying? But even then it's like, dang, we actually just did that. All right, let's see what we can do again. You know? And then we losing 7 to the Clippers and you like, wait a minute, but then Mark Jackson get fired. And so you kind of go through that whole thing. But even then we get to my third year and that's when we like, we come into the season, we playing well, Steve Kerr first year, we playing well. Be like, oh, okay.

All right.

And then you kind of win a couple games. And I remember the one game where we knew like, ah, okay. That's when we was playing at the Clippers and Steph dropped CP with the double behind the back on the baseline. They were up 20 points that game. We came back and we won that game. And after that game, that was when like, oh no, like we really supposed to be this good.

Exactly.

But you go through that whole year and you're not really processing how big those moments are. So we go up in the NBA Finals against Cleveland Cavaliers and LeBron James. LeBron know how big that moment is. Like LeBron has to win that championship because he's LeBron James. We going in there like, man, what? Y'all see all these people around the court? This the NBA Finals.

Right.

And you just, you're almost dumb to what's going on. And I think that's where the Grizzlies are right now. And in large part due to all of those guys just followed Ja. And Ja out there like, "I don't see none of y'all in front of me. I'm him. I'm that guy." And I just remember seeing a lot of that in yourself because you, I think what, LaMarcus left after your second year?

After your second or third year? After my third.

And you took on that team. Like you had really already taken over the team, which is part of the reason I felt like he left because he felt that switch in the organization. But you had already taken on that and then now taken on the team by yourself. You know what he's going through. And so I think that's a dope thing to watch.

Yes, it is, bruh. Because you know, like, when it's infectious, like, even when it's not on purpose, people have, like, they start to just follow that energy, bruh. Like, I came to Portland, bruh. I came in here walking in the building, rapping on my phone with an instrumental playing. And dancing and you know what I'm saying? I brought something that felt like confidence and belief. You know what I mean?

Absolutely.

Whereas opposed to before that, it was kind of just quiet and almost a little bit like on eggshells. And I had that, like, I ain't give a fuck. I was just like, I work hard. I do what everybody asks me to do. I don't be walking around like I run the place. I just do what I do. And it was a belief. People had belief in that. You know what I'm saying? They definitely got that going on, bro. I can see it. You know what I mean?

Absolutely. No, and so, and just speaking of mid-major guys who at some point obviously were overlooked, I thought, I think everybody thought, and you were outspoken about it in 2016, 2017 when you were snubbed for the All-Star Game both of those years.

Yeah.

And obviously you made All-Star every year since except this year due to the injury. But, and being snubbed that way, I also thought last season you should have been higher up. Like with the year that you had, you averaged 30 and 8, you shot 40% from 3. I thought you should have been higher up in the MVP conversation just based on what you were doing. And you know, when guys, when other guys get those numbers, you're talking MVP, runner-up MVP right away. Didn't quite seem like the same to you. Do you feel like you still don't get the respect that I personally think you should get or that you think you deserve in this league? And as far as what you've accomplished and how you go about your business and what you bring to the table every night?

I think I get the respect. I think people respect it. I think is, I just think that because what I do is not loud. My game is loud. Like I'll have 60 and 10 and 7 and we'll win a bunch of games.

Yeah.

Like I have loud performances, but I'm not loud. I don't get on social media, say crazy shit. When stuff is happening, I don't respond crazy. Like every once in a while, if I feel challenged or, Somebody like pushing the line on me, like they think something sweet, then I come back and I say something real aggressive and then it'll be like a headline. You know what I mean?

Absolutely.

But like, 'cause I'm not outspoken about everything and I'm not loud, you know, I don't think that's really attractive. Like I don't give 'em enough of a topic, you know, for them to be like, 'cause in reality it's like, For example, last season when y'all, who y'all lost to, the Lakers in the playing game?

We lost to the Lakers, then the Grizzlies.

Then the Grizzlies. So last year, like Steph going on this crazy run, right?

Steph is going on a crazy run.

Absolutely. Like he's going crazy. Y'all lose to the Lakers, y'all lose to Memphis, but there is, a significant amount of people out there saying, "He should be MVP." You know what I'm saying? Like, and in my eyes, I'm like, "He probably should be MVP." Like, he probably should be, 'cause what he's doing is that crazy with what he's playing with.

Mm-hmm.

But for me, I'm averaging 30 points, 8 assists, Damn near 5 rebounds, 46% from the field, 40% from 3, 90% from the line. CJ missed 2 months, Nurk missed 2 months. Everybody done been hurt. We get to the playoffs and it's like, yeah, Dame's having a great season, but they the 7th seed, they the 8th seed. So like, I say that to say, bruh, that like— Yeah. I get my respect, but people are gonna respect what I've done and how consistent I've done it when I'm done playing more than they would now.

Absolutely.

And, you know, it's a thing where like, if I, when you say the truth sometimes people say you crying.

Like, you know what I'm saying?

When you say the truth, it don't line up with what they want it to be, you crying. Or, "Oh, he's saying this," or, "He's saying that." But like, That's just the truth, bro. Like, I've— I definitely should have been up there in that MVP, bro. Like, when you weigh in, when you weigh into, like, everybody's situation and what you able to make happen, like, for us to get into the playoffs, bro, we had to really come from behind. And I'm coming out here, I had 60 against y'all, I had 60 against Brooklyn. 60 against Dallas, 50 against Philly, 50 against Denver, 50 against the Lakers. Like, bruh, this is the season where I'm like—

Yeah.

Player of the Week, 52. I literally was averaging 52 points, 10 assists, and 8 rebounds for Player of the Week. Then the following week I averaged 47 points with 10 assists and 9 rebounds. And it's like, had that been anybody else, they would've been ready to hand him the MVP, bruh.

Absolutely.

I'm just saying, like, this shit is like— So for me, bruh, I've accepted my place. You know what I'm saying? Like, when you ask, like, a lot of college players and, like, young players, like, who you fuck with? Like, they fuck with me, bruh, because—

Absolutely.

Because they know I'm solid. I say what I mean. I mean what I say. I ain't no hater. I don't be jealous, but I just do what I do. But I do feel like what I do is not, is respected, is not appreciated and valued as it should be. Like, that's just what it is. That's what I see.

Do you think, and I actually agree with that 100%. I think in Steph's case, it could be a little different, but I'll ask you this question 'cause I would love to hear your opinion. Do you think for Steph it's viewed a little differently because he already has rings as opposed to not? Because however, I think even in what you're saying, there are still other guys in this league that don't have rings, but they'll still get that nod. But I think in Steph's case, it could be a little different because he already had the rings. Do you feel that? Do you think that? Or am I a little off with that?

I mean, I mean, I don't think into it that deeply. You know what I'm saying? For me to weigh all of those things. Like, I always tell people, you know, like, people ask me like, you know, what about this? Like, kind of like along the lines of what you saying. What about Steph? What about this person? And I'll be like, at my position, Steph is the one person that I'm like, You can say what you want. Like, if you say, who's the best at this? Who's first like this? Steph is the one person that like, I can accept coming behind. Because Steph came from a mid-major. Like Steph went through injuries. Steph's team struggled. Like Steph is a 2-time MVP, 3-time champion. Like I respect Steph. You know what I'm saying?

Absolutely.

Like I have no, I take nothing away from Steph. I respect it 1,000%. But like, after that, like, I ain't put— you know what I'm saying? Like, I can't take a back seat after that. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

Like, in our time. And I'm not talking about numbers or none of that. I'm just talking about lining it up. You know what I'm saying? And Kyrie too. Like people don't give Kyrie enough credit because they be worried about the wrong shit. You know what I'm saying?

Absolutely.

They them the ones. So like, I don't really like, I think it is, you know, certain people gonna have certain things based off of what they've done, you know, what they've accomplished. But I think you gotta, anytime you start to have these conversations, you gotta weigh in the positions that everybody's been put in. Like, look at who, look at everybody who, the teammates that everybody at the top have had.

Yeah, okay.

Who has Steph played with? Who has Bron played with? Who have you played with? Who has AD played with? Who has Russ played with? Who has James played with? Who has CP played with? Like, if you look at everybody that all these guys have played with, everybody has played with these— with— everybody has played with everybody.

Mm-hmm.

And had a chance, and they didn't have to leave their teams for that to happen.

Yeah.

So some cases might be like, well, you could go and do this and go do that. But like, in many cases, nobody has had to do anything. They've been afforded these opportunities to play with The best. I have not.

Do you think, well, first off, how many All-Stars have you played with?

One?

Lamarcus.

Two.

Lamarcus, that's it?

That's it.

That's interesting.

Lamarcus was an All-Star. Me and Lamarcus was, he was an All-Star my rookie year. And then my second and third year, we were All-Stars together. My second and third year. After that, I've not played with an All-Star. Rookie of the Year, like none of that.

That's interesting. But do you think some of that has to do with where you play and getting guys to come to Portland?

I think part of it. I think part of it is that, but I mean, bro, people going to Oklahoma City, bro. Like, no offense, but like people going to Oklahoma City and people going to Milwaukee and you know what I mean?

Like— Absolutely. Portland is a better city than both.

People are going places and Portland ain't what people think it is. Otherwise I wouldn't have been living here this long. You know what I'm saying? Absolutely. If you just couldn't live here, like, I wouldn't be living here this long, bro. So like, I think that's part of it. You know what I mean? But at the end of the day, people are going places that's like, "You went there?" You know what I mean? Like, Melo went to OKC.

Yeah.

When we was trying to get Melo to come here, ask Melo where he would go. Ask him where he would go first.

Me knowing Melo, I know what that answer would be.

Exactly, bruh. Like, and not just, and I'll say this, bruh, not just because of the living situation, but like, bruh, people that play with me, bruh, I don't play the game selfishly. I don't operate selfishly. Like, I wanna see everybody getting, having their way. I wanna see everybody getting to be happy, do their thing, bruh. And even on the court, I don't get in the way of that. I know how to do me while not getting in the way of everybody else having an opportunity. I'm not holding onto the ball until I can get an assist or a shot or all that, bro. I'm passing it in. I'm hockey assist, boom, boom. I'm making the right play. I ain't fucking walking around the facility and everywhere trying to run everything and have everything my way, bro. I play fair. So like, when you consider all those things, Like, come on, man, that can't be the reason. It's like, sometimes honestly it looked like which route is the easiest.

Mm-hmm.

Like, oh, over here they got this dude and that dude. So if I go over there and then when they get there, it's like, I ain't getting my shots, I ain't getting my numbers, I can't do me. And then you see him going somewhere else again, like, bro, you could have just came and got with somebody that's gonna, somebody that can meet you there. Like, I ain't trying to compete with you. You know what I'm saying? Like, I know how to win, bro. And I know how to get along with people and make shit work. You know what I'm saying? So I don't know, bro.

Like— Do you think—

I feel like my bread is going everywhere, bro. Like, they going all kinds of places. So that can't be the reason.

Yeah. Yeah, that's true. That's true. But tell me this, do you think, like, —what's made you greater and who you are is I think you have the toughness that you have, like, but you're very silent. So, you know, if you don't know, you can mistake you for not being the alpha that you are. You know, if you don't know, because you don't say much, like you said.

Yeah.

Do you think in your career that that's maybe hindered you a little bit from the standpoint of, Like most guys in your position are constantly telling a GM what they should do, you know, or, "Hey, you gotta give me this, or you gotta do that, or you need to move this guy." Like that's, I don't think that's no secret. Everybody always talk about LeBron and like, "Hey, Bron, I'm about to trade you." Yeah. But the reality is guys who are in that position and you are the face of franchises, you do have that power to go to a GM and say, "Hey, I need you to move this guy. I need you to go after that guy." You're not quite like that just because you gonna take whatever situation you've given and treat it like, "I'm still growing up in Brookfield." Yeah. "And if I can make it outta that, I can push through this." Do you think that's hindered you in a sense of like, yeah, you're always gonna get your team there. You haven't been able to get over the hump. And I think that's for way more reasons than people are going to attribute it to. But do you think that's played a part in it?

I think that's definitely played a part in it. 'Cause, you know, I think the solid parts of me are like, I can't go in there and say, do this and do that, do that, and be, you know, putting other people's lives and their families and they situation just out like it ain't nothing. You know what I'm saying? Like I've never, felt comfortable operating like that. But, you know, before now, I reached a point where I knew that I can't ask the team to say, you know, give me an opportunity to win and then not be willing to deal with the, you know, the hurt that comes with that. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

And that don't mean I'm going in there telling them, do this or do that. But I'm telling them like, man, if y'all, I'm not gonna tell y'all what to do, but I'm also not gonna tell y'all, stop y'all from doing y'all job. I want y'all to give us a chance to win. So that's kinda, that's my stance, is like, give us a chance to win. Don't feel like, oh, we gonna, Dame is gonna be mad or anything like that. 'Cause there's been plenty of times throughout my time in the league where I was like, man, Mo Williams is my guy.

Mm-hmm.

Like, to this day, we didn't bring him back.

Mm-hmm.

D-Rob was my guy. Like, these, none of this stuff goes over easy. So it's just like, they know where I stand. Like, give us a chance to really win. So I do think that has played a part, you know, probably in it because you just, but another thing is I don't think, being an alpha to me don't mean to be like the, the person, the loudest one, telling everybody everything. Like, to me, being an alpha, like, is the presence. You know, the presence of an alpha is more known than anything. And that's— I don't think anybody that's been around, like, anybody that's been around, they'll know, like, you know, this is— I ain't know he was— I ain't know that was there. You know what I'm saying?

Absolutely.

Until they know it's— until they see it's there, and then they be like, "It may all make sense now." So like, that's been my stance. But I do think, you know, for a long time in my career, I took too much of a stance of like, you know, I can't, you know what I mean? I don't wanna see that happen type thing when it's like, man, you know, you can't wanna win and then also want everything to be all peachy. You know what I mean? It don't work like that.

No, absolutely. 'Cause ultimately it's a business and—

Sure.

You have to make those decisions best for the business. Like I know for instance, right? Like I, to this day, Harrison Barnes, I've actually never spoke on this before, but Harrison Barnes, I think to this day still don't like me for KD coming here. And the reality is, bro, it's like, I didn't tell him to trade you to bring KD in. Now the reality is if KD did come in and you was still here, You would've, you maybe had to come off the, you would've had to come off the bench. It's fucking Kevin Durant. And like, it just is what it is. If you were still here, I didn't tell them to trade you, but he took it very personally because of the story that came out that I cried to KD in the car or whatever.

Right.

Like he took it very personal at me. And so for instance, this dude invite Steph and him to his wedding, Steph, Klay, everybody at his wedding except me. Like, bro.

Bruh.

You ain't get invited to the wedding, bruh? All these dudes was at the same meeting that I was at with KD. They was all there too. You know what I'm saying? However, I didn't take it personally because it is what it is. Like, I wasn't invited to your wedding. Now it is what it is. I thought it was funny. I thought it was funnier than anything.

Yeah, you must be right there, bruh.

I thought it was funnier than anything. But in that same light, it's like, "It sucks that you got traded, but you went and made your money. You know, you went and got a great deal. You still making money." But I did get 2 championships. And again, I did that. I didn't go in there and ask them to trade Harrison Barnes. I didn't do that. But I did have a conversation with him about how much Kevin Durant could help us.

Right.

What move happened after that ain't my job. Like, that ain't really— what I do, that's not my job. But I do think Kevin Durant can make us better. And so it seems like now—

Everybody.

With y'all, absolutely. With y'all current GM and the route y'all going now that you're taking more of an approach to like, hey man, I'm trying to win.

Yeah.

As opposed, and you've always had that approach on the court, but now in those, in the decision-making around the team.

Yeah, it's just, you know, the, It's like what is, it's kind of like what you were saying, where it's like, man, you gotta, to actually win is like, you gotta, you can't just go on the court and think, all right, I'm just gonna play great and it's gonna happen. 'Cause some people just built better than you're built. You know what I'm saying? Like I never went on the court one game where I was like, we about to lose, literally. Like, we played the Lakers New Year's Eve and, you know, we had 8 players out with COVID and they had Bron on the run, Russ, they out there, you know, they was flowing. And we went out there, I'm like, "We about to win tonight." I really thought that in my head. We about to win tonight. We get blew out. I re-aggravate my abdominal and I'm like walking off the court like— [SPEAKING SPANISH] The way they walked on the court when we was about to do the tip, like, they walked out there like the champs. And we walked out there and I'm like, you know, the underdogs. It felt like and looked like the underdogs. And at that moment, I was just kind of like, man, I wanna, like, it's time for me to, you know, have that feeling of walking out there and feeling like the champ. Like, we got, we really got it. You know what I mean?

Mm-hmm.

Like, that's what, And I remember looking at them walk on the court and they was walking out there like, and they didn't even have AD, but it was like, they walked out there like that. And it was, to me, it was just like, man, I gotta be in a position to win it. You know what I'm saying? So that don't mean I'm gonna go in there and say, you know, trade everybody. Like I didn't even, when we made the move to the Clippers, I didn't, you know, I knew after, you know. Like I knew after, but like I said, it was the thing of like, I'm not gonna stop y'all from doing what y'all think is gonna make our team better. So, you know, that's where it's at, bro. Just, and now we in position to do that. So, you know, we just gotta execute that plan to make some shit happen.

I think you just said something that really sticks out to me because, and being in the position I've been in, my first couple years, obviously we made the playoffs. And then the 5 years after that, we went to the finals. You tend to take that for granted, you know? And I think for me, in all of those years of knowing, like you just said, and walking in and saying, yo, like we gonna win today. Like there were times, there were times during our season where we would say, "Hey yo, let's approach these next 3 weeks like the playoffs. Let's lock in. Let's, we need, we setting these, we need to hit these things and work on these things to get great." And like in those 3 weeks, we'll go 11-1, like 12-2, like.

Yeah.

And that's like good enough for regular season games. But you know, you get the old cliché saying like, you can't flip it on or flip it off. Like that shit is, that saying is cliché, but the reality is for our teams, it was true. Like we could click it on and off. Like, hey yo, stop playing. Let's go. Like, let's go beat them. Or walk into a—

Hey bro.

Yeah. Or like walking into arena like, hey yo, we need to send a message to them and we win by 20. You know, it's like, and then 2 seasons, last year was rough. I mean, it was better, but 2 seasons ago, And walking in every arena and knowing like, yo, we don't have a chance to win. Like it was the most unnatural mind-boggling thing to me. I lost love for basketball. So people like, yo, he washed up, he this. I'm like, you want me to get excited to go play in this game? We like, we 7-39, bro. Like how am I supposed to get excited and— And to go play in this game. Like, I can't begin to even think about getting excited. If we win, we are moving to a whopping 8-39. Like, you can't possibly think I care about this game. And so that really stuck, just stuck out to me when you said like, you never felt like you were gonna lose until you was like, damn, like we can't win.

Like it's— I mean, we in the middle of COVID I'm looking, I'm like, I think we was probably 6 games under .500. And I'm just like, I ain't healthy. No, I'm just like, I'm putting it all together. Like, bro, I'm really like in pain. I just, you know, I done did these cortisone shots and I felt good for about 10 games. It's wearing off. Like, I just was sitting there. I'm like, man, I'm trying to, I wanna walk on the court and look like, the team looking at us like, "Oh, we gotta be, it's gotta be our night tonight to beat them." You know what I'm saying? Like, so yeah, bro, hopefully we can make this happen, bro.

Absolutely. And I've held you long enough. I could sit here and talk to you all day 'cause it's just me talking, talking to the homie. But moving off the court, obviously you said your rehab is going well. We all know what you doing in your spare time. Dame Dolla, you been in the studio a lot. You got some new music coming. Like, what's the deal on that side?

Yeah, bro, I got some— I didn't— I got a lot of new shit. Just stuff that I did. It's some stuff that people haven't heard. Some of the stuff I sent you during like, during the Olympics and stuff that I still ain't put out. And I even did more since then, but I got a lot of stuff. All the stuff that I'm trying to— put together for like, you know, post-career, end of career, just stuff that I wanna, you know, do the groundwork for so it's already done. So I ain't, you know, sitting here trying to put it together at the end. Now that I got this time, I just been, you know, planting those seeds, getting all that stuff ready that I wanna do. And I'm also about to get back to, I'm about to restart. I did this series on YouTube during the draft, bruh, called License to Lillard.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. And that shit was, it was big during that time. Like, it was getting, a lot of people was following it. The whole 10 years we've been in the league, I be getting like tweets all the time. Like, "When you gonna start back License to Lillard?" So like, I'm about to pick that shit back up. Start putting those back out. I think that's gonna be cool. So that's probably like the main thing I've been getting ready for.

And what will License to Lillard look like now? Will it include your family? Is it just like hoop? Is rap?

This gonna be everything.

This gonna be what I look like now.

Gonna be everything, bro. Like, it was a lot of stuff that coming from Weber State, all that, basically making myself known. And I think now we'll probably start just kind of reflecting, you know, just all the way up to this point, just all this shit that then took place that I never kind of, you know, when you in the middle of something, you don't really realize how big it is or like—

Absolutely.

So like, it'll be just reflecting on that stuff. 'Cause now that I'm sitting still, I'm just looking at stuff like, damn, like, I still got, like, I still have, I still feel like my absolute best are coming in the next 3 years, bro. Like, I really, I really feel that in my heart and in my body. Like, I didn't know how hurt I was, bro. It's crazy. But just being able to reflect on all that stuff to this point and just going through the process, just keeping, you know what I mean? Just keeping people in the loop, tapping in. It's gonna be smooth.

And you spoke on what you're setting up post-career. What does that look like for you? Is it trying to make your label one of the top labels? Is it trying to— be a number one charting artist? What is that? Is there some mixture of both? What does that look like for you post-career, post-basketball career?

On the music side, it ain't really so much my music. I'ma still be recording, but it's more creating opportunities for other aspiring artists. Like, that's what I'ma do. I ain't really tripping on my own stuff when I'm done playing. It'll be just lining other artists up, but— The main thing, bruh, is just putting together these, it's just empowering the youth. Like, I got a couple situations that I ain't, that I haven't finished setting stone. So I don't wanna put nothing out there like that. But I got some stuff that I'm gonna be doing, bruh, that's gonna be different. It's gonna be different.

Okay.

It ain't gonna be the typical, money grab, for show, like, "Oh, this is what this is." It ain't gonna be none of the fake shit. It's gonna be authentic. It's gonna be something that, you know, it's gonna be something for real. You know what I mean? It's gonna be truth-telling, like character-building type stuff where it's like, I don't need nobody's money, bro. Like, I don't need nobody's approval or nobody's validation. I'm telling you the truth. I'm telling you the real from what I know and what I experienced. People that also come from that same angle is gonna be a part of it. It's gonna be a real thing, bro.

Man, I'm looking forward to that. I think speaking on things that you've done, one thing I appreciated that you used to do, and I think you should bring it back. If you do bring it back, obviously, you know, I would always attend, but if I can help with any way, I would love to. But I definitely think you should bring back the block party you used to do. I thought that was super dope. And I think for even speaking for myself, we get so busy, you know, and so into our own lives, you know, that things like that, like the block party you used to do, or like for instance, for myself, like I used to do this camp in my hometown. I haven't done it in years now because you get busy, right? You start having kids, you got a wife. Like I got a wife, I got kids. You get these 2 to 3 months off and I don't think people really understand how special and precious a day or 2 is. You know, when you have 67 days off, like that 1 or 2 day and then for the next 280 or 278, whatever.

288.

288, actually something like that. My math's a little off right now, but That's not the point. The point is that day becomes so much more precious because now it's the travel. And so it's not just that 4 hours that the block party could be going on. It's everything you're doing to set it up. It's getting there the day before. You're probably there a day after. Now that's 3 days of 67 gone.

Yeah.

And so I do understand. And I think for myself too, like I've been exploring things of, What can I start back doing back for my hometown? The reality is it probably won't be the camp because I don't have the time to necessarily go do a camp. Like I didn't stop doing that because I was just like, "Oh, I'm over it." Yeah. No, you just kind of run out of time. And so if that's something that I think that you should do again, and I would love to be involved, 'cause even like in moving over to San Francisco, Like I always tell people, Oakland is home for me, man. Like that's my second home. I really grew into manhood in Oakland. You know what I'm saying? And so I have a soft spot for there. But as you know, I mean, I don't care what no one say, Oakland and San Francisco are two totally different places.

Different world, bro.

And when you live in San Francisco, you're not in Oakland much. Just like when I lived in Oakland, I was hardly ever in San Francisco, you know? And so, I've kind of lost touch over there too. And I want to put my hands back on that community because I know how special and important that community was to me and who I am, as I want to do that again in my hometown as well. So just something I would love to see you do, my brother. I thought it was amazing.

I'm gonna definitely bring it back. I think we didn't do— I think the last 2 years we haven't done it 'cause of COVID but— Like I'm definitely gonna bring that back for sure. 'Cause I brought it back from when I was a kid when they used to have it, bruh. Like they used to have that when I was a kid. That's what made me do it anyway. 'Cause they hadn't had it since I was like 9 or 10. So—

Wow.

They stopped letting us have it 'cause people start— the last time they had it, it was like they start shooting and all type of shit, bruh. It's crazy.

No, no doubt. But I think that's what the power of your name, you know, And then you bring in some of your teammates, you brought me. That's a different thing. You know what I'm saying? That's like one of your own bringing something back. People don't come on that same thing. You know what I'm saying?

Right.

So nah, it's a beautiful thing, bro. But I truly appreciate you coming on the show, man. Obviously always wishing you a speedy recovery. I can't wait to see you get back. I was dying this year watching you come out and score 14, And everybody like, "Oh, Dame ain't got it here." And I'm just sitting there like, "Hey man, hey, get this surgery, bro." Like these people pissing me off talking now.

Hey bro, but look though, like they gonna always talk. Like this, there's some people that know the truth and some people that don't, bro. I don't really care. I mean, obviously we all care what people have to say, but you gotta take it with a grain of salt. Like if you know their understanding of what's actually happening is so little, then what they're saying and their lens on what's happening is understood. Like, I understand. They're used to me scoring 30 points every game. And they're used to me blowing by people and dunking and step back left, step back right, and all that stuff. And when you don't see it happening, they like, "Oh, he washed." And he can't— they ain't miss this, that. And I'm like, "Bro, I'm a healthy 31." I ain't no beat up 31. I'm a healthy 31 years old.

Absolutely.

I've never missed— games like that. Like, you know what I'm saying? So like—

Mm-hmm.

I don't live a hard life, bro. I don't be out partying all the time and getting high and drinking and all that, bro. I be chilling. I take care of myself. So like, it only gives— they're only giving me more power at the end of the day because now that I am fully healthy and I have not given them a single excuse, Like, I have not given them a single excuse. So now that I'm fully healthy, they're going to see. And when they see, they gonna be like, they just gonna look stupid. You know what I'm saying? Like, they gonna look stupid and it'll be like, damn, like, and ain't nobody gonna tell 'em take nothing back. You said this, well, what about? They just gonna act like that never happened. Like, they gonna act like they never said a thing.

Absolutely.

That's the funniest shit in the world to me. They gonna act like nobody said a thing and it's like, all right, we gonna see.

Nah, man, I definitely appreciate it. I've never seen a job that people could just make bold-ass statements and not be held accountable for it.

Just say stuff, man, like, and look, let me say this before we go. They had so much to say all year. I had 24 points, 24.5 points and 7 assists, bro. Y'all hear people in the All-Star Game and giving praise to all these people that are not even doing that. How great do I have to be?

Fact.

How great am I if that's really what y'all, you know what I'm saying?

Absolutely.

I hope it's great facilities and all that, but like, bro, what do you, you know what I mean?

Absolutely.

People not doing that. So it is what it is, bro. Like, we'll see.

Nah, that's facts, man. Many people has done it. Not many has done it the way you have, bruh. Like from coming from where you come from, the way you go about your business. I think people can say what they want and people on the outside always gonna have something to say. I always say the ultimate respect for me and the ultimate acceptance that I look for and I appreciate is the acceptance of my peers.

Yeah.

And I don't think there's a guy in this league that will have anything to say about you, how you go about your business, how you handle yourself, would be any different than what people see and how you carry yourself. It's the same across the board. And I got nothing but respect and love for that, bro. I appreciate you coming on the show. Like I said, we looking forward to you getting back healthy, my dog.

Appreciate it, bro. You get healthy too, bro. Yes, sir.

Soon come.