Draymond Green 4x NBA Champ breaks silence on regrets, Steph, LeBron & truth behind the perception

It feels so much better when you're not sitting on your wallet.

I don't have as much money as you.

Nah, I seen your wallet. Your wallet thicker than mine. That shit just smush in.

You got a smushy booty.

Channing definitely got a smushy booty for sure.

I like to keep my items in my wallet. See, y'all don't got all y'all items.

Glute holes.

Nah, nah. I like to just pile into it.

Bro, I take my wallet and throw it in my backpack so quick. I will not sit on my wallet exactly.

Lon Hughes is coming to hell.

What up, G?

How you doing, baby?

What up, man?

Appreciate you. What's up?

What's up? Rich back.

Right here.

Hey, you talking about big man?

Yeah, big man was uncomfortable dappin'.

That's how you know Draymond start trouble. He got security. 'Cause you wear 6 rings.

Man, the 6 rings be sweet. You ever wore 6 rings? Oh, thank you.

Yeah.

The shoes.

6 rings?

6 rings. The Jordan 6 rings.

You be wearing 6 rings?

Man, I got about 12 pairs. Get the fuck outta here. —out of here. Them shits fire.

Hey, what the fuck you say?

That's like wearing Jordan Fusions. You remember them Jordan Fusions? With the Air Force One bottom?

Yeah.

I got my 10 pair now.

Oh, you country. You from the country.

The Transformers. Woods of Georgia.

Niggas still be camping in it. I fought to hear to witness it. Get my people feeling militant.

Draymond Green, man. Welcome to The Pivot.

I appreciate y'all.

Congratulations with this 9-time All-NBA Defensive Team, 4-time All-Star, but more importantly, 4-time NBA champion, future Hall of Famer. This is Channing Crowder. This is Fred T. I'm Ryan Clark. Pivot fam, thank you for pivoting with us. I went down a Draymond Green dark hole. On the interweb. I found some urban legends of a young Draymond Green.

Ooh.

I just wanna know if this is true. Your mother and your aunt tell a story about you on a bicycle going to a grocery store, taking chips, putting 'em on the counter with no money and telling the people, "I'm Draymond Green." You went deep.

It's crazy. Neighborhood I grew up in,— is, you know, I'm from a small city. Everybody know everybody. So the neighborhood I grew up in, at 3 years old, that's when I took that bike and went to the store. I told them, you know who I am. I'm Draymond Green. And then they was hot about it. So I went and told my granddad. And he always had my back. My granddad was like— he was a man of few words. Like, he don't say much. But when he say something, you know, like— Mm-hmm. And so I went and told my granddad, I walked out of there with what I was trying to get. My granddad went back and paid for me.

Yeah.

But yeah, man, I don't know why I did that. But when I go back to these stories with my mom, different things as a kid, I kind of always had that confidence, but my mom pushed that. We were not really allowed to be fans in a sense. You could like who you like. But she always pushed, like, you gotta be so confident in yourself. And the way she go about it is, you don't bow down to man. Like, you just don't do it. And so, that's kind of the foundation of who I am.

Yeah.

You know, I came into the league, that's essentially what made me, is you don't bow down to anybody. So when I came in, it was like, I don't respect none of y'all because what you've done, you ain't do it to me. You did that to somebody else. And that's because of the foundation, that kid, that 3-year-old kid.

That's awesome.

Going to the store saying, "You know who I am." Okay. I'mma take this.

Great story. You just stole a bag of chips pretty much is what you did.

Hey, like the same way he tried to act like Freddie T made it clean.

You made that shit sound real good. You just stole a bag of chips 'cause your granddaddy had bread.

That's a fact.

But to that point, now as a 4-time champion, all defensive everything, all-star and all, Draymond Green and that personality means something now. It didn't mean nothing your whole life. What was the struggles of feeling like, the feeling that way that you feel inside, how your mom raised you when you wasn't a champion, wasn't an all-star?

You know what? When I look back on it, number one, I've been a champion my whole life. I won middle school, I won in high school, I won in elementary. So I felt that way. And growing up in a city like that, like, those things matter. You know what I'm saying? It's a small city. You turn the corner, you see him. You turn that corner, I turn that corner, you see you. So I always felt that way. But I will tell you, her, Building that foundation like that definitely got me in trouble at times. Because the bravado didn't always add, to your point, the bravado didn't always add up to the guy.

Yeah.

But you couldn't necessarily tell me that. Like, to me it made complete sense. And when I, I ultimately appreciate her pushing me to be that way because to this day it is still one of the main reasons that I was able to become who I've— because I was able to always see it. Like, for some reason, little kid from Saginaw with no clue how to make it always knew, like, "No, I'mma do that thing. I'mma go and play there. I'mma be in the NBA." And it oftentimes don't make sense to me how this all panned out. Mm-hmm. But then I take the step back and I'm like, I did. It actually does make sense. But I don't know, man. It's a crazy journey. 'Cause at times, although I thought that way, I felt that way at times, I still can't fucking believe it really happened. Like, it's like, yeah, you always said that. You always thought that. You know, 5, 6 years old doing Dr. King's "I Have a Dream" speech on the stage. Everybody listened to me. I have a dream that one day my four little children, like, everybody lock in. Here I am right here. I always felt that way. But it got me in a lot of trouble growing up though, man. I ain't gonna lie to you.

Do you think it was just, well, mostly circumstance? Because we all come from different backgrounds, you know, much like a lot of other athletes, right? And people don't always take that deep dive to see how we came up and what we've really been through. But you're Saginaw, not too far from Flint. Yeah. I know a lot of dudes from Flint. I know Cleese, Mopee, Big Shug, Bear, Draymond Green, who was edgy, you know what I'm saying? K-Mark, Jay Rich. So it's a lot of guys in that area, which isn't separated by much. And a lot of 'em right on the edge, kind of like how your personality comes across, right?

Mm-hmm.

When you take that deep dive, do you think it's just the circumstance of, you know, the demographics in which you were brought up?

Yes, because you have to be that way. Like, in that area, to your point, we all are kind of the same.

Oh, right.

Like, because that's the only way you can make it through those places. Like, you can't make it through Saginaw quiet.

Mm-hmm.

Like, you go to the park, if you don't talk, you don't get on— you can't get on the court. You go to the rec center, you not talking, you can't get on the court. So it's almost like a— It's like a law. Like, you learn to be that way growing up there. Because again, we growing up in this little city. I may not like you. You right around the corner, bruh.

Right.

And so on and so forth. And so in these small cities, Splint, Saginaw, you kinda gotta face the issue. Like, I ain't going a week without seeing somebody.

Yeah.

You seeing people immediately in this place, like, and so growing up in these couple places, like, it does build a certain type of person because that's the way you have to be. And if you not, like, you kinda just, you just, like, you gone with the wind if you not gonna be that person.

You know, you've always known who you are, Saginaw seems much like New Orleans, right? Where it's like, you knew the person around the corner. He could be your best friend, but there could be a day that y'all ain't getting along, y'all gonna throw hands, you gonna dap up afterwards, we gonna move on.

Absolutely.

Right? That's part of the culture. That's why it's part of how we find solutions. We get things through and then we're done. You get to college, you know, you get into it with Derrick Nix, I think it is, like early on. You know, you and Keith Appling have a little thing at practice too, but y'all found a way to move on. They understood we need Draymond Green. You understood you needed them. But then when the Jordan Poole situation happens, you're in a different world.

Mm-hmm.

And so now everything I've always been, everything I've always known is different today. What is it when you have that realization And now the world is sort of judging who you are at your core about something like that.

It took me, still at age 33, 34, 35, I still learn those lessons. 'Cause I'm in tour with Keith Appling and Derrick Nix come outta nowhere. I could take a punch. I ain't even see it. And Izz go crazy, "Get him up, get the fuck outta here. How dare you? You fucking soft as fuck." You come from the side, put him out. And I'm at practice like, "Damn, he caught me from the side, put him out." Yo, you not putting him outta practice. Let me go in this locker room again. We gonna come back out here. We gotta practice. And we move on. It just happened. We not about to, like, what we doing? It's my teammate, fine. Like, yeah, you got me. We move on. And I've had a bunch of situations like that growing up. Sometimes I was the guy that would get, sometimes I wasn't. Regardless, we move on. And so that's how I've always approached it. You know, and in college, freshman year, I'm talking to one of the OGs, Goran Suton. Goran. I'm in my chair, sitting back like this. Locker room, we'd have been going at it on the court, locker room. And he could feel it, like his locker right next to mine, he could feel it, I'm getting there. I'm like, "All right, I'm about to get up, I'm about to get bruh." As I'm thinking that, as I try to get up, and I'm a freshman again, so this is a 5th year senior, good luck.

Right.

As I'm trying to get up, he caught me in that chair, had me pinned down. Like, "What you gonna do?" And he on top of me. All right, we move on.

Mm-hmm.

So when that situation happened, I'm like, "All right, cool, we move on." And then when we couldn't, I was like, "Huh?" And for a while it made me think like, "Man, this dude nothing like me." Like, 'cause when those things happen, you just move on. But it taught me so much because it taught me You right, he may not be like you. He ain't from where you from. The things you went through, the way you had to come up, he may not have came up like that. So for that 5 seconds, I forgot where I was at because I immediately went to what I know. But what you know don't really work here.

Yeah.

And everybody say, "Oh man, but you was 10 years in, you should know better." Still learning, 9 years in. But it's them lessons like that that ultimately make me who I am to this day because, man, I fucked that up.

Bruh, I know you hate the angry Black man title because it means so much more than just the adjectives and the nouns. 'Cause that's how they try to title people, you know, the rebellious and all that stuff. So I say you are an African American male that might have anger problems.

So you just gonna use the technical term.

That's what he said because I heard you say you don't like angry Black men, but. Well, you just, it's crazy to look online and it's like Draymond Green's 32 fights. Like, motherfucker done fought 32 times while playing basketball. So like to this conversation where it's like, and I'm like that too. Man, we can lock up, go have a beer afterwards. I told stories about NFL, we'll wrestle in the locker room, get my lip bust, oh, we'll slide to the strip club in a little bit, have a good time.

Absolutely.

But it seems as if you might have a little something else inside of you. Like, I don't know what makes it, but you almost can't control yourself at times. I've seen that.

You know what?

And I'm not afraid to admit that to you.

Mm.

When I'm on that court, it's a different person. The guy who's sitting here with you right now, it's not the same person. And it took me a long time to accept that. When I say a long time, maybe like the last year. Because, but I had to go through it to realize that and be comfortable with accepting that. So on the court, I'm in a different space. What it requires me to be great, I gotta take it there. I don't jump like these dudes. I'm not as fast as these dudes. My edge is I can get you here though.

Wow.

But I'm also not fake. So if I can get you here, I still gotta be willing to go there. Or how do I really get you here? If I ain't really willing to, you see through it. And so the problem I have with the angry Black man is in accepting what it is, which is I know the guy who on the court is a different dude. It's also what make me be, have the opportunity to be a catalyst of 4 championships.

Mm-hmm.

It's what makes the 9 defensive teams at, with the limitations that I have. And so the problem I have with that is Maybe on the court. That's possibly true. But people take the court and then apply it to the man that comes sit here. Mm. And that's not the case.

As the father, as the husband, as the businessman, as all that.

That's not the case. You know what I'm saying? Like, I play basketball. A, it's entertainment. B, we're competing. Something that I'll do on the court You couldn't get me to do sitting right here. You couldn't even get me off my square like that.

Yeah.

I saw Fred VanVleet last night. Me and Fred, we got a relationship. Got a lot of respect for him. Young fella. Like, his journey. Beat me in the championship. And we're playing Houston, and I kinda got this thing where if I'm playing against you and I rock with you because I know I could go there, if I'm playing with you and I rock with you, you get into some— I ain't getting in that because Bro, I don't fuck with many people. So me and Fred got into it Game 3. I said some choice words that as soon as I said 'em, I was like, "Ah." I knew it right away. That series went 7. I never said the words again in the rest of the series. We dapped it up. We hugged up. I saw Fred last night. He was with Rich. I pull up. He like, "Yo, I need to talk to you." Soon as I got to the table, I said what's up to everybody. Draymond Green back around, pull his chair up over here. "What's up? Talk to me." What you said, the words you said, like, we— I was— And as soon as he starts, I said, "I'm sorry. I was wrong." And I knew it right away. But when we on the court, I'm into it. I'm mixing it up with your teammates. And he did what he had to do.

Mm-hmm.

I'm mixing it up with your teammates, and you coming to the rescue. But the way these little niggas talking, and you come to their rescue.

You part of them now.

You with them now.

Agreed.

The gloves are off. I'm willing to go there now. And to your point, right there I'm like, it's over. We in it. I actually wanted to see you because I felt as soon as I did, ah. And so that's the problem I have with it is don't try to take what I'm doing, what I do in my job, what I do to make a living, what I do to compete in, and try to dumb me down to just that. Because I'm way smarter than that. I am so far from that in the man that's standing here. When I do my job, I am. But they try to put the angry black man tag on you like you walk out in the world, you ain't got good sense. I'm far from him.

I think a lot of it is, There's so much PTSD in our community. And when you look at patterns, that's for anyone. It becomes a part of our personality a lot of times. And, you know, it's really hard to differentiate between the two. So that's probably why, you know, someone might look at you and say, "Oh, there go that crazy-ass Draymond. Boy, you better watch out. You never know what he's thinking or what he's gonna do." Because it's psychologically, that's how it's labeled. Or even sociology, that's how it's labeled. But every time I see you, I believe that the Nas "Ether" song just gonna start playing. You know, the one with Deon got the voiceover?

Mm-hmm.

What about you, or what about me, think you worry about your opinion of me, right? I believe that you just have that mindset. Am I far off? Like, do you worry about any of the stuff that you hear on the outside?

For a long time I didn't, until it really started to affect me.

Mm-hmm.

Started to affect people around me. I never cared. And then it's like, wait a minute, they're saying I'm this. They're almost portraying me as if I'm a dummy. As if I can't control myself. Before that, I'd say over the last 2, 3 years of where it start, like, "Oh no, like, this guy can't control himself." But don't say that to me because we ain't doing that well, because when we was doing great, I was the same person.

Mm-hmm.

And it was like, "Oh, that's how they win." But because we ain't doing well, now I'm crazy? Nah, like, that's my edge. Like, they like, "Yo, he can't control himself on the court." No, you did some bullshit and I'm just gonna get you back. I'm not fake, so I'm not hiding it. I'm not gonna act like I ain't try to do it. No, you shouldn't have did that shit.

Right.

And if I let you get away with that, then I don't have the edge on you. So I can't let you get away with that. So I'm gonna get you back. And I'm not hiding getting you back. So you will see me get you back. The way I kind of view it is, for me, it's conscious over consequence.

Mm, okay.

I gotta deal with my own conscience when I walk outta here. I can sleep better at night dealing with the consequence than I can my conscience. So I'm going to fucking get you back.

Shannon, who he sound like?

Huh?

Who does he sound like?

So, let me tell you, bro.

Yo, crazy.

He can't let things go.

But Draymond, here's the thing, man. Like, we have had— select basketball players have been on our show. And Fred VanVleet was one of them, Chris Paul, you. There are certain ones that sit down, and right away when they sit down, I go, that's my type of guy, right? We had Dejounte Murray on recently, and I was like— It's my type of guy. I think what sort of locked me into what you were saying about Fred is that you did something to him that he couldn't let go either, right? But instead of making it a big deal and tweeting or having— he pulled you aside like a man in a quiet moment and said, "Hey, I look— I don't need to talk to you." And I respect that so much that you were willing to sit down but also on his side of it, being built in a way where you have conversations with men when you disagree with them. And so I just wanted to say, man, like, I just really respect the fact that he could pull you aside and you could say, "Nah, man, in that case, I was wrong. I knew it right away. I was looking for you too." I respect that, man.

No doubt. And those guys you just named— CP, I hated, man. And I got the opportunity to play with one of my favorite teammates of all time. He probably gets tired of me sometimes. I just randomly out the blue call him. He don't answer, I call right back. He hit me back like, "Si, what you doing?" We get an hour and a half conversation out the blue. Dejounte, since he came into the NBA, I first met him, I just pour love into him. Like, bro, play against him. Just try to give him tips. He had his first camp in Seattle last year. I went. I love Dejounte. Fred, just spoke about him. So the guys you naming, them also, them are my type of guys. Like, though I don't have a relationship with many guys in the NBA, but the ones that I have is strong. And those guys, they are the type of guys. I've had a mix-up with all of them.

CP?

CP, we mixed it up for years. But I can move past those things when you talk as men.

Mm-hmm.

What I don't respect is, I told Fred, I said, "Man," the rest of the night I kept going back like, "Bro, I'm so happy you talked to me." Because you don't know how many times I go through this and like you think you got a relationship with somebody and something happened in the game and they fold. Then you see 'em, they weird, uh, like, "Bro, just talk to me." Right. If I was wrong, I'll tell you I was wrong. If I— or I'll give you my sack. Or I'll tell you I was wrong and, "Fred, this where it came from." You know what I'm saying? Like— But don't get weird. These dudes, they be getting weird. And I don't understand that. Like, bro, we— we can have a conversation.

Right.

And so, again, with all of those guys that you just named, Fred, we had our moment. CP, we had moments. Me and DeJounte actually got into it once in Carbone in Vegas. We standing there with Farrah from Clutch. DeJounte come downstairs. He wasn't even down there with us. He come downstairs to talk. And I had said something to him that he didn't like. When I played it back, young fella taught me something 'cause I was dead ass wrong. And I would never share what it was, but— What was it? He taught me something in that moment. And we mixed it up. We was about to fight. And I told my boy Trav, I'm like, "Man." I was telling my boys, like, "Man, me and DeJounte, they know how hard I rock with him." And I waited to see him. And my first time seeing him was we played him. And we were standing at the free-throw line. And boom, we had the conversation.

Damn.

'Cause I hit him up, and he was hot. And I— he actually had to— He was 1,000% right to be hot like that. But I'm not going to let this go on without having a conversation. So if we gotta have this conversation right here on this court, if that's where I'm gonna get the conversation at, that's where I'm gonna get the conversation. I love that, bro. Farrah was so goddamn happy. She like, "I'm so happy y'all talked. I'm so happy." But like, when I have these situations with people, from that point on, I know you my type of person. So the relationship just gets so much stronger.

Yeah.

Like, all those guys, because the relation, like I told Trav last night, I'm like, Trav, no, I actually just told him walking over here, I said, Trav, my relationship with Fred about to get so much stronger. And it's already strong. It's about to get so much stronger because, man, you so much like me. Like you wanna have that conversation. I wanna have that conversation. I don't wanna be weird, bro. We come in the spot, you acting weird. Now I feel like, you know, dudes start acting weird, I feel a little like a bully because you won't talk. Like, man, just talk. Like, you know what I'm saying? Now I gotta kind of tiptoe because I know you acting weird and I don't want you to think I'm bullying you because if I was trying to bully you, I'd just bully you. Like, just talk to me, man. And so all of those guys, there was a conversation and the relationship just go, but that's my type of guy, man.

Well, I just want you to know what Channing calls it is, assholes love assholes. And so he says that he's—

Oh, he's an asshole.

Yeah.

I don't know if you knew that. Did anybody ever tell you that? You talking about Draymond Green telling you stuff. You know you an asshole?

I'm a very, very nice person.

To who?

He said he's an asshole on the court.

He's been great to me. On the court. Oh, okay. Yeah.

Yeah, he's been, since the moment I met him, he's been awesome.

I don't think, I think I'm actually too nice.

Listen, you just stuttered and you don't stutter. I watch you on TV. You see how you—

Hey, so articulate, right?

See how you bringing it back in your mind? Because that's you running from it. Don't run from it. Embrace your asshole-ism.

No, on the court, I'm a complete asshole though.

To that, I've actually, 'cause you talking about people, you'll beat the hell out of them Europeans. You choked the hell out of Gobert. Nerkiss, you slapped the shit outta him. Zabonis, you yoked him on his head. And what's the boy this year, Houston? Oh, Shingun. Boy, you were giving— why you kept pushing the man, grabbing his arm, elbowing him in the ribs? But I did notice when Big Steve Adams came out there, you kind of calmed down a little bit.

You know what? With Shingun, number one, this your first time in the playoffs. I gotta test that.

Yeah, you gotta test that.

He 23 years old. He only getting better in this league. I gotta test that. I need to try to have something mentally on you as I age into this career and you getting better in yours.

Yeah.

I gotta test that.

Mm-hmm.

I gained so much respect for that young fella in that series because— I told Fred this last night— in the beginning, he was folding. He was folding in the beginning. And he caught up and he was— and he stood up. And once you stand up, We gonna go at it, but I ain't like, "All right, I like that." Like, "Yeah, all right, cool." Gained respect. And I gained respect from him. Steven Adams, that respect is already there. I got you. Like, we've been through the—

You kicked him in the dick.

I ain't try to, but—

What is wrong with you?

I mean, I watch this man in the playoffs every year.

But check this out though. You know what? Right after that game and after the series, I waited for him in the hallway.

Really?

Chopped it up. And you know what he said? "Bro, we out there playing basketball." Mm-hmm. To the point of this being the guy I don't need to mix it up with like that because there is that mutual respect. A reporter asked him during the series, trying to— some question trying to, like, make me look crazy. And he said, "Man, we out there battling for something. We both trying to get the same thing. He ain't crazy." That's what happened. In so many words, that's what happened between the lines. And he just out there doing that. In the middle of the series, he says this to a reporter. That's why you don't see that.

Mm-hmm.

Because what we gonna get into about, I'mma boom! Man, Steven Adams strong as hell. But as the series went on, if you go watch the film, bro, on the box, I just start grabbing his arms. Like, bro, I'mma just grab you. Because I'm ending up on the floor too much. Like, I can't keep ending up on the floor, getting up. Like, after every— I'm getting up to take the ball out. Like, I'm ending up on this floor too much. Yeah, right. I gotta hold this defense down. I'm 6'5", bro. I gotta hold this— I gotta anchor this defense. I can't keep ending up on the floor. He might look at me a certain type. So I just start grabbing, bro. And I come outta nowhere, boom! He come outta nowhere, just like throw me down like a rag doll. And I'm like, I don't get up and say nothing to him. I come outta nowhere, bow. He don't say nothing to me. It's a respect there. I got you. It's a respect for the competition. So it's no need, like we mixed it up before. The respect level is already there.

Yeah, Channing had a similar moment, but when he went to meet the guy, not in the hallway, he went to the bus and it was a different, type of situation. Your mat light story.

Yeah, yeah, we got into it. I talked a lot of trash and I asked you this, 'cause you talk trash, I see. I don't know what you're saying. Why y'all be all cute with y'all little mouths covering your mouth up like that?

Because, man, you had the helmet on. You could say anything.

Yeah.

This camera catch everything we say.

Everything, bro.

Everything.

Have you ever talked trash and hit too close to home where you done really upset some dude? 'Cause they, you can call them all the names, soft and all that stuff. It's just sports. I used to do research on guys. Well, like dudes would play with guys in college and now we on different teams and they knew I talked and they'd be like, "Hey, well he did this in college," or his old lady who's now his wife did this in college. And I would say that during the game and then I'd see a dude look like, and I'd be like, "Oh, I got him now." Have you ever got too close to home with trash talk?

Bro, I didn't. I done went so close to home, bruh. I don't do the woman thing. Like, I ain't gonna talk about your lady. That's where I draw the line.

Yeah.

It's about the only line I draw, 'cause your mom, I'm crushing her. And everybody else, I ain't gonna talk about, I ain't gonna talk about your lady, I ain't gonna talk about your kids. Those two to me, they off limits. If you start talking about somebody lady, I don't respect that. Wow. So if I even hear something like that, it ain't even gotta involve me. I'm coming to the defense of the guy. Whoever getting it then. Draymond Green. Everybody had their opinions on him. It's one of the things that really pissed me off in this series and why I went at bruh so crazy. Everybody talking shit about him and his woman. That ain't none of y'all business. Get out that man business. I'm publicly defending him. Like, y'all stop. That's whack to me. I don't rock with that. So that's where I draw the line. But I have said some stuff that I wasn't too proud of that hit way too close to home, bro. I've talked— I won't put specific people's names out there, but I've said stuff to people about dead siblings, all type of stuff. And it's like, it was very low. But he was kind of attacking me, so I, you know, I'm— I get it. Then I don't know how to stop. But I can draw the line with those two.

Yeah.

But yeah, bro, I've had too many that went way too close to home. But that's where it is. Like, that's what we do. That's, again, growing up in Saginaw, there is no line. You gotta find the angle and you gotta use it. And I do my research, so I already know stuff. So if you, I ain't gonna lead out though. I don't lead out with like stuff like that. I'm gonna lead out talking shit. Maybe, if I need to get under your skin. You gotta be really good for me to be trying to do that though. But I don't lead out with that stuff, but where people get fucked up is once you go there with me, the glove's off. I'm gonna say whatever I have to say, whatever I think. I don't really think the two things about the kids and the lady, 'cause those just off-limit things, but anything else, I don't give a fuck how deep it is. Yeah. And I've had some ones, bro, that my boys think I'm crazy. Like, "Day, you crazy. You can't say that to him." Like, but I had to say that. Like, and so— Yes, I agree with you, but you wild for like going to the ladies and stuff. We would've had to fight.

Yeah, they did the cheap shot, hitting in the back and all kind of stuff. And then okay, well, we got— Anybody ever got you?

Yeah. Yeah. Well, as far as my lady?

No, no, no, no, just— Cheap shots. No, got you verbally, where you done turn, like they, you, the Draymond, they Draymond Green, Draymond Green.

No. From a, nah, man. Hell no. 'Cause you gotta be willing to go so far. And guys really ain't willing to go that far.

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Mm-hmm.

Right? And I kind of talked about it being an undrafted guy and saying, yeah, like, there are those doubts that creep in from time to time because you remember the adversities, you remember the struggles. You know, you, a second-round guy that goes on to be a Hall of Famer and an NBA champion. In playing with Steph and even through your career, How have doubts crept in to what you guys were trying to accomplish together based on the fact that both of you were not expected to be what you've become?

You know, when I saw Steph say that, I was like, damn. I know Steph really well. We spent 13 years together. I've probably spent more time with Steph over the last 13 years than anybody in my life. 'Cause you at home, you together. Practice, gym, game, that thing, this thing. On the road, you together. At home, I'm with my family. On the road, I ain't. I'm always with, for the last 13 years. So I know him really well. I didn't really know that. But when he said it, I was like, "Ah, makes sense." Mm-hmm. Because I too feel like that. Times. But I'm also not Steph Curry, so I'm like, "Oh, dang, him too?" Mm-hmm. The doubt for both of us, it's what our journey is built on. Klay too. Like, wasn't highly ranked coming outta high school, you know. He went to Washington State. Klay love— he love Washington State. But come on, bro, you went to Washington State for basketball. What are you talking about? Like— We all were in a sense overlooked. And so the doubt is actually what did this for us. You didn't see it coming. You doubted all of us. He too small, not strong enough. He can't dribble well enough, blah, blah, blah. He can't play. He's, he don't shoot it. About all of us.— and our foundation is actually built on— I'm covering his weakness here, he covering my weakness there, he gonna cover his weakness there. It's all because of the doubt. We bonded around that and used everything we had together to lift this thing up. And so, the doubt— when I go back and I look back on the journey, it all started at the same place for all of us, although different. Very different, right? Like, they sons of NBA players. I'm the Saginaw with shit. Like, but yet all doubted. And that's what brought us together and lifted us up and created this thing that I still can't believe. Like, damn, we won 4 championships.

Yeah.

Like, what? But it is built on the doubt. It's like we banded around each other on the doubt. And I think that's one of the most beautiful parts about our journey. But yet it's also what makes it what it is because it's the reason we have such a fondness of each other. It's a reason that we'll go to hell and back. People be like, "Yo, I don't know how Steph deal with him. I don't know why Steph still want him on his team." You'll never understand why. You'll never know everything we went through, the conversations we have, the things we go through. You'll never know. But again, we're bonded by the doubt. Mm-hmm. That's what ultimately brought us together. So it's probably the key ingredient to everything you've seen us do. It's the doubt. And so we put those things together. We relied on each other. There is no one of us without the other one. You can say, "Oh, man, there's no Draymond without Steph." There's no Steph without Draymond. There's no Klay without Steph. There is not one of us without each other. Could we all have reached our own individual greatness somewhere else? When you got it, you got it. It come out somehow.

Yeah.

But through the doubt, on top, standing on top of the doubt, nah, we built this thing that you can never speak about me without them two and vice versa. And I love that Steph is so great that people think they don't need to. I love that. That's my brother. I want everybody in the world to think he's great as I think he is. 'Cause I think he the greatest in the world. You can't tell me nothing. So I love that, you know? But on the flip side, amongst that group, we feel that way. So I really don't give a shit what anybody else think.

I love that.

That's what I felt too. That Ether song just started. But we all have been through moments of doubt as we tend to age in our sports, right? We start like kind of looking out like, man, I don't know, 'cause you're not able to reach that, you know, that highest of highs, you know, in your ability. RC's been through it, Channing's been through it, 13-year career, 13-year career. He's the only one in here that's won football, a Super Bowl, right? You've won 4 championships in the NBA, like the pinnacle 4 times. Steph, Klay, the whole crew. Do you think that doubt creeps in more As you guys start to, you know, get older and your abilities start to come down a little bit, you can kind of see on the horizon— you've even mentioned about retirement, right? Mm-hmm. You're doing— you're an active player doing Inside the NBA. So it's not too far. You're getting ready for your post-career life. Do you think any of that has anything to do with you guys being able to recognize that imposter syndrome?

1000%. I think, but as, but it's also our respect for the craft.

Mm-hmm.

You know, it's, it's the respect for the greatness. So sometimes, like some of these things that's happened to me, I love Steve Kerr, man. We've had our battles, man. But he know me like a book now. And I know him like a book. Some of the things that's happened with me over the last couple years is due to the doubt.

Right.

Self-doubt. Because I'm like, man, like, I ain't able to get to that level sometimes that I thought I—

It's frustrating.

And it's frustrating. And I'm like, fuck. Like, I'm willing to do anything to get to that level. And so that crazy anger you talking about, sometimes that come out because I'm like, I'm struggling. And I need to put— I'm trying so hard to push through it that I'm willing to do anything, but this league ain't really cut for that.

Right.

You know what I'm saying? So that doubt that you speak on is also what's still pushing us, especially me, but that doubt is also some of it that has led me to some of these things over the last couple years. Because when I knocked Nurkic out, I really couldn't find it that game. And they was like, "All right, knock him out." I was, you know, like pow, he went down. He laid down, so it probably is a knockout 'cause you a big man, you can't lay down like that. So, but that game, I had nothing.

Right.

I was terrible. Whole first half. We start the third quarter, I'm trying to find it. Bruh grabbing my side, wah! Like, you look at some of these situations and it's like, you start looking at that and you become self-conscious about it. And so when I'm feeling within myself that, and then it's like fight or flight mode, you know what I'm saying? Like, and I go into that and it lead to some of these moments. I feel that as I get older in this league, and that's what I've been trying to channel because, so this year I was able to get back to like, a high, high level of playing. And I think one of the things that pissed me off was like the angry Black man is like, "Now I'm getting penalized and I'm actually chilling." Right. Like, I'm actually chilling because I ain't feeling that doubt of like, "Ah, fight or flight." Like, no, it's all working for me. And now I'm being penalized for— I'm actually out here chilling now. That thing ain't sparking me the way it was because I'm actually playing at a great level that I think I need to be playing at. And so the doubt ain't triggering something. But that doubt triggers something for me, man, because I wanna be at that elite level still. And if I'm not, then I gotta do whatever I need to do to get to that level. But again, it's like, it's something that I told you, bro, therapy, all that.

Therapy helping.

That's what I'm saying. It's something that I talk about with my therapist because it's a real thing for me, bro. I've been a basketball player my whole life. When you start to see a little bit of a decline, it's like, whoa, damn, I ain't, whoa. But I'm still at that level, I can still get there, so I'mma do whatever. But the therapy has helped me a lot, bruh. It's helped me a lot.

If a dude calls you, I'm trying to cuss less, I'm trying to better myself. If a dude calls you a female dog, you could walk away?

The last time I was called that, I punched somebody. I'm still learning.

Tomorrow if it happens.

If we was just walking down the street?

Just going to grab, going to the bodega.

I might stop. Eh, but I'm gonna keep it pushing.

So it's working. 'Cause you can realize those people aren't worth it.

Yeah.

That's the conversation you always have. Like, why am I gonna lose, or why would Draymond Green from Saginaw, Michigan, who had nothing, lose that? Over this person. And I think, you know, like, that is part of the growth.

Can I say something? One second.

Absolutely.

Before you go. But that's not my struggle. Your struggle's on the court. The struggle is if you call me that on the court, where do I go? Because if you call me that in life—

You good.

Bro, you not getting me off my square like that.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. In my mind, I probably think I can whoop you, but you ain't getting me off my square like that. The problem I have is on the court. And that's why when I was— the suspension with Nurkic, and I'm talking to Adam Silver, I'm like, "Adam, I'm done. I don't wanna play anymore." Dang. Because the problem for me is on the court, and I felt like, "Damn, I got a bright future after this, and this court is about to cost me that." And so, If I'm walking to the bodega, no problem. But that ain't my issue. My issue is on the court. You call me that and I'm in a different head space, how do I handle that? And that's also like, that's where the therapy is like, that's where I, because that's the guy that really needed the help. And so if it was happening on the court today, I still can't 100% say to you that I won't do anything.

You're two different people is what you're saying.

For sure.

Like the Hulk. Banner's a scientist, smart as hell, sensible.

For sure.

Mm-hmm.

But then he gets mad and becomes this irrational monster.

Absolutely. It took me a while to accept that. But that's just on the basketball court. Off the court, the likelihood that you'll see me how I am on a basketball court is so slick. Off the court, unless I'm comfortable, I won't even say much. If you talk to my family, by the way, they be like, "Oh." My mom, they trip my mom out. She come to the house, she come in town, and people say all these things. She be like, "If they only know you don't even talk." I don't say much. I gotta be really comfortable in the situation to talk. And so that's why I was like, "Yo, it's really confu—" It's really— Confused. Like this is bleeding over here. And I take so much pride in the man that I am, how I stand, that I was gonna be done. I'm like, "No, I'm done." Like, because it's costing me. So that, yeah, just, yeah, I mean, I am. But it took me some, it took me a lot of inner work. And I'm also, I don't even know if I'm supposed to say this, but I'm writing a book. Oh. And that process was so therapeutic for me because it's actually where I worked my way through. I was writing. It's actually where I worked my way through, like, oh, shit. It is two different people. I'm like, they probably think I'm crazy as hell. But it is two different people. On the court, like, I am a menace. You think? But off the court, I think I'm arguably one of the nicest people you'll meet. But on the court, I am a menace. I will say this, I—

It's two completely different people.

I have told people about meeting you. And you know, I am one of those people that like, once I know you, you don't get to say bad things about people I like, right? And I have to, I also feel responsible to go, Okay, I know him. If they say your name, "Hey, I met him." Now you can say whatever you want, but I need you to know that this is a person I know personally. So you gotta be very careful about what you say 'cause I feel like I can say whatever to you in their defense. Another thing that you remind me of, if I was having this conversation last night about being able to process my feelings, I don't feel that people get to affect me and live their lives like they haven't. Right? You don't get to have— or I don't have to process something without you having to process that I've been impacted. Mm-hmm. And so a lot of times, you talked about, like, your conscience and— Conscience of—

oh, my conscience.

Of a consequence.

Of a consequence.

Right. My thing is always, if I get it out, no matter what happens afterwards, I'm comfortable with that, 'cause now I don't have to— I can look myself in the eye and say, "Okay, I respect the way I handled this situation." And I think that's a process to learn how to deal with those things. I'm about to do something that I do very often on this show, Draymond. Um, and I haven't done it in a while. I'mma cut the room.

All right.

And so when I cut the room, this is when only conversations people with championships can have. Professional championships. So right now it's just, you know, us talking, 'cause these two has never been one.

Eighth grade South Georgia Gatorade champion.

But I say that, I say that though, man. Once you win a ring and a championship, everything else feels like a failure. Playing Toronto and getting there and not winning it, that's a failure. Playing the Cleveland Cavaliers and being up 3-1 and losing, that's a failure. To many other people, that's a great success, but when you feel what it feels like to have the trophy, everything else is just a part of the journey on the way to a destination that's ultimately important. Recently, LeBron James spoke about ring culture.

Mm-hmm.

And— how, in summarizing, like, it doesn't define, like, the individual's greatness. I disagree with that. I think part of being great is being great in the most important moments that allow your individual talents to elevate a team.

Mm-hmm.

How do you see LeBron's comments, but also, how do you feel about ring culture and the value that we put on that as it pertains to individual teams and players.

So I understood what Bron was trying to say. I think, I do think, and I get the point. I don't think he did a good job of explaining it. And so when you are a champion, easy for you to say, "Yo, it don't matter because I'm a champion." Like, but, What, what Bron was trying to say, at least what I think he was trying to say, you got people that haven't done this and they use that to dumb down the greatness of other guys that haven't necessarily done it. Chris Paul is a winner. I tell people all the time, Chris Paul ain't never won a championship. Chris Paul is a winner. Never fortunate enough to get quite, quite get over the hump for whatever reason. Whether that was his individual ability, but that don't mean he ain't great. And so I understand what Bron was saying because it's like, well, if you didn't— in this media culture that we live in today, it's like, well, he ain't got a ring, so I could just blah, blah, blah. I could just crush this guy. And that's what Bron was getting at. It's like, don't— Yeah. Don't take away these guys' greatness because they didn't get a ring, and then you just start speaking on the ring, but you've never, like, for a lot of people, they've never even played at this level. And so, and they use that to tag these guys, but you don't know how hard it is to win a championship. And so you start talking about these guys that didn't win, but you don't know how hard it is to win a championship. So when they say ring culture and kinda use it as this negative connotation, what Bron is sayin', I'm watchin' these people say this guy ain't great, that guy ain't great, this guy ain't great because they didn't win a ring. They still great. And so what it boils down to for me is I get what he was sayin' because —those guys he named, he named a few names. To me, they are still great. Yes, they didn't win a ring. But I know it's so much more that has to go right to win that ring. And you don't have a clue. And you gonna crush this guy, and you don't know what it takes. You don't know all the things that need to go right. To win a ring, that shit is hard. It's very, very, very hard. Yeah. You speak on ring culture. It's worked against Kevin Durant in the opposite way. It's so hard to win a ring. Our team's made it look so easy that people say, Kevin Durant just went over there and walked to a ring. Man, without Kevin Durant, I don't know if we was gonna win another championship. We didn't walk, he didn't come and walk to a ring. We just got that good and made it look that easy. And so then you— this dude got the 2 rings and they still use it against him. That's the problem with ring culture. That's what LeBron was getting at.

But what happens when you have somebody who is as great as Chuck that has bought into, right, I have no rings, I'm a Hall of Famer, but I can only sit at this table and not over there with the likes of—

That's the truth.

The Byrds, the Magics, the Jordans. Like when those comments come out where he totally disagrees with LeBron's sentiment, and this is what he's bought into after all these years. Even Shaq teases him all the time, man, you ain't got no ring, you shouldn't even be in this conversation. Kinda like cutting off the room when we all have gone through the gauntlet to try and get there. And as great as I was in Jacksonville, and I'm just throwing it—

Hell yeah.

Hey, I'm ringless, but I don't feel that way. Like, I wouldn't have that same mindset as Chuck personally. But how do you feel about when those type of comments are kind of—

Me and Shaq got our little 4-ring handshake at the desk. It's fun picking on Chuck at the desk. I'm so honored I get the opportunity to work with those guys, man.

The best. —on TV.

Uh, it's— it's like— it's one of the honors of my life that I get to sit up there with those guys, man. But I think Chuck's able to accept it and embrace it like that because he became so great at something else.

Mm-hmm.

So he didn't win a championship. He's arguably the greatest sports voice we've ever seen. With what he can do with a microphone, and move a world. Pow! And it come like that. He, like, I've been honored to be able to work with him and watch him work. And it's just like boom, boom, boom. He's arguably one of the greatest sports voices we've ever seen. Key cog in one of the greatest, probably the greatest sports show we have ever seen.

Yep.

And so I think due to that, Emmy after Emmy after Emmy, I think due to that, he's able to say, "Fuck it. Yep, I ain't winnin' and look at me now. And..." So I think it's different for Chuck because of that.

What about just his greatness? 'Cause Chuck, like, you can't argue, you know, what he did on that court. What about that part of it? Because he was better than a lot of these guys that kind of move around. Like, all right, let's say Robert Horry, for example. And I don't want Robert to hear this. Catch Straymond, but he got 6 of them.

Also too, though, Freddie T, I think, and this is just my opinion, obviously you know better than me, like when we talk about football, this conversation, it's in my opinion, the ring conversation only comes into play once you are considered an all-time great.

Facts.

Right? We don't talk about players who are unimportant important and the amount of rings they have. Most of the times when we're speaking on ringless people, it's because they're Hall of Famers.

Yeah.

And a lot of 'em first ballot Hall of Famer. And what happens is when we are starting to tier the greatest of the greats, the thing we think about is what moment do I remember that he was a part of or that he orchestrated that got himself and his team a ring.

Mm-hmm.

I think that's where it comes into play is when we're saying, "Hey, Stephen Curry is beyond a shadow of a doubt the greatest shooter that has ever lived. And on top of that, look what that got him." Mm-hmm. How do you quantify that? Or how do you feel about that statement that, "Yeah, we've acknowledged that you're great," because we're talking about how many rings you have?

It's definitely validate, like, it's definitely a validation. Like when I walk in the room, I walk to the table, like don't get it twisted. Me being a 4-time champ, you gonna feel that.

Yeah.

Like, and I feel like some validation from that when it comes to basketball, when it comes to, when I walk in the room, like let's face it, some rooms I walk into, I am just always gonna be Draymond the basketball player. When I walk in that room and I know I'm walking in as Draymond, a basketball player, the confidence that I have is as if I'm walking through there like this. [LAUGHTER] Like, that's the validation that I feel walking into that room as a basketball player. So it is a validation. And as your greatness grows, more happens. So for instance, Steph, like, we all can agree that he been doing it at an elite level for a while now. But we all can also agree 2022 put him in a different stratosphere.

MVP.

When it was like, "Oh, he put them on his back," and he had that moment that uplifted and put him in a different stratosphere. So it's a double-edged sword, man. Like, it's unfortunate for some guys that it didn't quite work out and whatever could have went wrong. Like, sometimes you only get one chance. If OKC— we're obviously filming this before Game 7— if OKC don't win this championship, I don't think they'll ever win one. Because you only get— you have an opportunity. And this is what, back to Bron's point, people don't understand when you ain't been through it. You have an opportunity. If you don't kick the door in, kick the window in when you got the opportunity, You may never get the opportunity again. Team ain't gonna look the same next year. Salary cap stuff start happening, extensions start happening. You gotta get rid of this guy, you gotta get rid of that guy. And so when you talk, it's a double-edged sword because— Yes, you start talking about people's greatness, lessening their greatness due to not having a ring. But on the flip side, yes, it does validate. And the thing that we all don't like is people take it and they try to stab this guy that didn't get it. And I know, yes, you could have, you played 13 years. You played 13 years, right?

No, I played 6.

Okay, you played 6.

Too much to cook. I got up outta there.

6, 13, 13, right? Champion. But what I know as someone who's won it 4 times is I know I could see where it could've went wrong because it only take— So much gotta go right. Just one time. Like, your chance may have been that one time. And I see people with this hamstring.

Yeah, yeah.

You didn't kick the door down when you had to kick it. And it's just way harder. And so I know that in winning it. And that's the problem that I be having when people get up there and they start throwing the ring around and stabbing because I know that they may have— they had that one opportunity and they didn't kick the door down. That's why they weren't able to get one. And so that's where I struggle with it a bit. And I'm able to dish out the respect to the guys who didn't necessarily win. I can still respect you for what you are. Yeah, for sure. But on the flip side, I think it also took me to go through it over and over again and learn and understand more and more about it and know what goes into it. And a lot— and most people just don't know what go into it.

Do you know your mother tweeted me before?

Really?

Yes. I can't remember what playoff series it was, but you were actually playing really well. And you missed a dunk, and I think, like, you got your shot blocked or something. And I just tweeted. I was like— honestly, I was like, Those plays to me are the fascinating thing about Draymond Green. I was like, he is not the most athletic. I was like, but look at all the stuff he's done. And I think all she read was like the fact that I mentioned that you got a shot blocked or missed a dunk. And she was like, well, what about the ones that can do all that? I was like, ma'am, because the one thing I was like, I am not finna be— I was like, I need to be very clear. This was a compliment.

Yeah.

I was like, I am not— trying to beef, but I just, I looked at that and I thought, no matter how famous, how successful, that's still her baby.

Absolutely.

Right? And it made me think about it when you were talking about the ring culture and how people use these things to criticize and to stab. You mentioned something that touched me earlier. I say a lot of stuff, right? I get a lot of criticism, backlash, and I'm built for it.

Absolutely.

Right? I recently went through something where it affected my entire family. I got cousins defending me. I got people calling me. It was bad in my house. And it was the first time I looked at myself and I said, "Wait, when I speak or when I have my actions affect everyone else." You said, it started to affect your home and the people around you. As somebody who's always been comfortable in being Draymond Green, how difficult was it to handle your actions affecting all of the people you love?

Man, yeah, my mom, she's— I had to help her out with Twitter. She go crazy. And by the way, I am actually her baby. Like, I'm the youngest.

Right.

So it's a different thing there. And she, my mama ride to, to Land's End for me, you know? And, and I love her and I appreciate her.

Right.

It start affecting, my mom don't watch games anymore. She check the box score. It, it, it, it brings her anxiety at this point in my career because she like, yo, just be done. Like, "It's cool, you did it. You passed it. Like, just be done. Move on." And I'm like, "No, Mom, I got more to give." So she can't watch no more. People attacking my wife because I got into it with somebody on the court. She gotta cut her comments off. People telling her, "I know you getting beat at home." All this stuff. And it's just like, and I saw the weight that it was putting on her. Like, I could see it, her carrying it. And she gonna ride, so she riding, but I am someone who in my life, like, if I'm in your life, I take on your shit. I'mma be right there, I'mma help you through the shit. I take on a bunch of shit for a lot of people. Yeah. People. My shoulder's big enough for that. I'm cut for that. That's who I am. Very rarely am I going to let you take on my shit. I am the guy who take on the shit. I take on the shit for people, people around me, people close to me. I take on the shit. When I realized that, damn, I'm causing them shit and I ain't able to take it on because I caused it, it was crushing me because I don't put my shit on nobody. Mm-hmm. I take my shit on the chin and I take your shit, your shit, and your shit on too. I'mma be there for you like that. So that was another reason I wanted to be done because now, you know, my kids going to school, my kids coming home like, "Daddy, they said you did this," or, "Eh," and I'm like, "Damn." And I worked my whole life so that these kids kids can have the best so that they don't have to experience what I experienced. Like, I go to work, I work my ass off so that I can provide something for them that was never provided for me. And I'm affecting them negatively. It's killing me because I am that guy, like, I'm the guy to make it better for you. I'm the guy to take on the shit. Like, man, you move over, I got this shit. Yeah. Move out the way. All right, now it's done. Go ahead. Like, I took on that shit for you. And so going through that with them and knowing my actions caused it, it was crushing me because I can't— I almost need to save them from me now.

Mm.

And that's a totally different space than I ever been in. I'll come save you from anybody.

How can I save you from myself?

Now I gotta save you from me. And I tried to run, like I'm done with it. 'Cause that's the only thing I can think of of how I could save it. How I could save them from me. So I'm like, oh, I need to be done. I'm retired. Because I can't, I can't. I gotta be there to like get you through the shit. And if I'm causing the shit, How do I get you through it?

Yeah, that was, my wife was attacked because of me and the way it affected my kids, the way it affected her, and honestly, the pressure it puts on you to fix it when you are the problem and when it's you and, you know, we always say, "I'll do anything for family." Mm-hmm. "I'll die for my family. I'll kill for my family." What happens when you're the opp? You know, and dealing with that, man.

That's a tough space to go through, man.

Bro, you could retire. Like you just said it, your mama asked, I'm sure your wife asked, what's, why don't retire? You've done everything. Why not retire, bro? You got more to give. That ain't no real answer. That's a bullshit answer.

Why not retire? Because I still love to compete. I wanna compete, and where else can I find that level of competition?

Go fishing.

But I can't—

Play golf.

I suck at that, so I don't do it because I can't compete at the level I wanna compete at in golf.

Good for you, T.

Right? And in basketball, I can compete at the highest level, and that's what drive me. Is like I still love to compete. I love walking in that arena, shutting you up, saying everything I gotta say to y'all crowd, and walking out of Houston like, "Ha! Told y'all we was gonna beat y'all again." Y'all are that team, right? Like, I still get such a drive, like such a rush out of that. Like, I love, I absolutely love— Draymond Green. The competition, and it's the only reason why I still do it.

And that's the only reason you need, and that's the first reason we did it in the first place. But from stealing a bag of chips at the age of 3—

Taken.

Yeah, taken. To leading Saginaw High to back-to-back state champs, what, 53-2. Big Ten Player of the Year, having your jersey retired by Michigan State. 4 championships later, 4-time NBA All-Star, a Defensive Player of the Year, led the league in steals, to about to be a hell of a broadcaster at some point soon. Great husband, friend. In between all of that, what would you consider to be your biggest pivot in life? That's that one moment you can look back on and say, without this happening to me or for me, I wouldn't be who I am today.

I think in life we're always reinventing ourself. That's actually why I love y'all's show and the name, how y'all leaned into it, is because I think in life you always reinvent yourself.

Mm-hmm.

And so there are multiple pivots. And I can point to several of them at different times in my life. That if I didn't make that pivot, it could've all ended there, or blah, zay, blah. In high school, I got caught cheating on a test. I had an exam. I was a very good student. My mom ain't play no dumb, like, you ain't gonna live in this house and be dumb. Mm-hmm. And I was just being lazy. Our teacher had gave us this study guide, and the study guide had had a lot of the same questions on the test. So I took the study guide into the exam, put it under my paper, and I just was fucking cheating. Like, cheating. I got to, like, the last 2 questions of the exam. I'm sure I would have had— and I'm also not dumb, so I wouldn't have got 100%, but I think I got, like, 47 out of the 50 questions right. Yeah. I ain't gonna make it too obvious. And I got to like 2 more questions left on the exam and the teacher just came and took the papers. And I got a D- in the class because the way our grading system work, you got 3 marking periods and a final exam and they're all 25%. So on 25% of the grade, I got zero.

Wow.

Yeah. So which means without the 25%, just basic math, I had like 64%. So if you add my other 25%, I'm at an A. Yeah, you're right. My mom, Michigan State was my dream school. Tom Izzo had an Izzo Shootout at Michigan State team camp. And then we was playing AAU, going to big tournaments. I was on the Draymond Green team by this point. And she stopped me from playing that summer. I couldn't go to team camp. And people from my city was like coming to the door. Marshall Thomas, the Godfather, even talked to my mom. And she was like, That's cool. He ain't going. Y'all can send whoever y'all want over here. Because if he end up dumb and failing, y'all gonna move on to the next kid He just gonna be back in this house, so he ain't going. It taught me accountability. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, "Ah, you gotta put the work in. You gotta be accountable." And so when I go back to that moment in life, that was 9th grade. That's what got me to Michigan State. You know what I'm saying? It's that moment right there that got me to Michigan State, which is one of the best things that ever happened to me. Mm-hmm. So if I point to anything and I go, now, the reinvention of me, the man, there's different pivots. But that one is what got me outta Saginaw, Michigan, which laid the stage for everything else and everything I've become is making it outta that city. I love that city, so don't get me wrong, like, but—

Right.

I couldn't stay there and be great. You know what I'm sayin'? And so that set the table for me to make it outta that city and ultimately allowed me to change my family life for generations. You know what I'm sayin'? Like, show us a life that we could've never imagined. It was that one moment that if I gotta go to one, 'cause that set the stage for everything else.

Yeah.

Well, I'mma say this, man. I've been, yo, I've been tryin' to get this done forever. You know that. I know how valuable your time is, Draymond, so appreciate you, dog. And this— you have expectations, right? 'Cause we're human. And I had an expectation that this show was gonna be really amazing. You 100% exceeded that, bro.

Thank you.

Just very grateful for you, man. It's been amazing to watch you grow as a man. You accomplished things as a player, and, you know, I was on TV while I played as well. Man, you're better than that, bro. I can't wait to see what you do going forward, but— Unlike Channing, man, I believe you should keep playing for a little bit longer.

Hang that shit up, man. Go enjoy your baby.

I appreciate it, fellas. Appreciate it. I'm pinning it. I fought to hear, to witness it. Get my people feeling militant. Way I'm feeling, get me up. On a mission, get me up.