John Wall REVEALS NBA Secrets: D-Rose battles, Wizards mistakes & All-Star drama | Baron & Draymond

We got an incredible guest today. The number 1 pick in the 2010 NBA draft from the University of Kentucky, All-NBA, All-Defensive Team member, 5-time NBA All-Star, NBA Slam Dunk Champion, none other than the one and only J-Wall. What's up, my brother?

What's up, what's up? Ain't much, chilling. How you, bro?

I can't complain, dog. I can't complain at all, man. We appreciate you coming on, bro.

John Wall, my dog. What's up? What's up? Happy to have you on the show, bro. Happy to have you on the show. You know, you know how I feel about you. You know, you one of the greats. You one of the greats of your time. You're a game changer. You came in, And I say, you know, you have the same kind of effect from the media side, like an Allen Iverson. When you think about social media, when you think about, you know, becoming an icon early, right? And being able to hold that, carry that torch, right? And lead this new generation. I always look at you as, you know, a legend in your own right and a pioneer as far as being able to, shepherding this new energy of point guards, right? The dudes is dunking, guys with personality, speed, and quickness. You know, how do you guard somebody like that? Just wanted to just shout you out, man. Just give you your flowers on the show, you know, before we get going.

Appreciate that, appreciate that.

Yeah, that's fire. That's well said, brother. I tell you what. Hey BD, that was incredible. You had no choice but to get that brother his flowers.

After he dunked over my birthday.

I'm watching this video.

Hey Dray, you know what? Hey Dray, I'm telling you, it's gonna be a moment you're gonna be like, okay, I'm on my way out. Damn, that was that moment.

That's when you knew the end was there, right there?

I jumped for the lob and I don't know why I jumped for the lob. Like I wasn't gonna get the ball, but I didn't wasn't thinking nobody was, I didn't, I wasn't thinking like a guard, man. This man jumped all over me, dog. And bang! I looked at Mike Bibby, he was like, happy birthday. I was like, this shit over, bro, this shit over. You thought that shit was funny, huh, bro? You thought that shit was funny.

Oh man, so, so question: how much money did you proceed to steal after that? If you knew, if you knew right in that moment it was over, how much money did you proceed to steal after that?

Nah, I was done. I was done. That was just the year I got hurt.

Yeah.

That's, yeah. Hey bro, I had just came back too. I was like, damn, I'm feeling good. I'm getting some minutes. And after that dunk, I was like, okay, I ain't got too much longer. It's over. And it was over at the end of that year in the playoffs. It's fucked up.

Wow.

Yeah, man.

When you know, you know. When you know, you know. Yeah.

And that, and J-Wall, that's your rookie year. My rookie year?

Nah, hell nah.

Nah, second year, that's my second year.

Yeah, that's the second, yeah.

That's my second year.

Nah, that's probably like your third year, bro.

Nah, you trying to, don't try to advance him along just because you—

Nah, it was his start, man, it had to be his start year. 'Cause I remember, I think it was his rookie year or second year when we—

Nah, rookie, I had them Z-Techs on them hot tops, so I know it wasn't that, I ain't had them on in that second year.

Give me one sec.

No, but I played against—

What you say? —They may say the year on this clip. Give me one second. Yeah. The rookie.

Nah, it was another person that was a rookie.

So what year? How far apart?

And then it's like a huge alley.

Chris Singleton is a rookie on this clip.

Yeah, it's like a huge—

That's my second year, I think then. Second year. Yeah, I think it's my second year. 'Cause I remember when— Is Melo on the Knicks right now, right?

I see, I see Shump. I see Shump. I see—

That's 2012. So that's my third year.

Yeah, no, I see Melo.

Man.

That's the year Melo came to the, y'all came to DC. And Melo had like 20 straight with like 5 minutes to go in the second quarter before half. And Chris like, don't send no help. I don't need no help. I say, listen, we need to send double team. This ain't no fucking college. This ain't Florida State where you got boxes and elbows. And we just sat there and literally watched this man get abused in the mid post for 4 minutes straight, Draymond Green.

Who was the coach?

He had 4 fouls going into the halftime.

Was Flip still the coach?

I think Flip Saunders was still the coach. If not, I think that's when Randy Whitman took over.

That's old school NBA though, bro. If you—

That's what I'm saying. When I came in there, it was like, listen, we told coach, listen, we ain't helping. If he get 5, he said he don't need no help. We gonna leave him on his island.

That's awesome.

That's what you don't do. I'm telling you, man, we keep talking about what these guys don't go through now in the NBA.

Yeah.

And that's another one of those things, bro. Like rookies don't get thrown in the fire and be like, yo, you go stop that guy there. Like if a rookie can't guard, they gonna try to hide the rookie. Like it's crazy.

They do for sure hide him.

You know what I'm saying? Or like, yo, they'll try to go zone. And as opposed to like Chris Singleton, a guy who actually was a good defender his years in the league. Right here as a rookie getting cooked.

Yeah, for sure.

Right? And y'all just like, nope, that is what it is. That's old NBA, bro.

It ain't like that no more.

He asked for that.

Yeah, now they running zone. They showing those screens. Yeah.

Yeah, it's way different. But I do remember, I think I was in Golden State. It was your rookie year. And we was beating the crap outta y'all, man. And I don't know what you did, but you just kept getting the ball out of bounds. Remember that? You was going one on five, fast break. Yeah, I was just going whatever I had to do. Nobody could stay in front of him. Coach called 3 timeouts. It was like nobody could stop him. So he would shoot, boom. Say we score, he get the ball, boom, right down the court. And he was trying to bring him back. I damn near dove in front of you, bro, just to try and slow you down. There was no way. I was like, damn, dude, I ain't never seen nobody This was crazy. I ain't never seen nobody that fast in my life. The Warriors.

In the end speed.

Hey bro, he was pew, pew, pew, pew. Everybody on the team, nobody could stop him. That shit was wild.

J-Wall, have you seen anybody in the NBA from baseline to baseline as fast as you? Either after you, before you?

Only one I could compare, you know how this shit go, Draymond. Everybody try to compare somebody to somebody. Only guy I seen that's like close to me, I would say De'Aaron Fox. He just left. Yeah.

He crazy.

Like I remember, I forgot what year it was. We was in Houston about to play. We had a day off before the game. I went, I drove like an hour, 2 hours to go watch him play.

Wow.

And I was like, you know what? This is the one kid I can say is close to what I could see in myself. 'Cause I was basically supposed to be left-handed, but he was really left-handed. And I'm like, this is the only guy I seen that was close to me with that type of speed. Like, don't get me wrong, you know, like, D-Rose is quick. Like his quick is on a whole nother level. You know what I mean? I feel like Ja got different type of quick, but they don't have that speed to go baseline to baseline.

Facts. That's a different speed.

Yeah. So I say, only one I can say is De'Aaron Fox.

Speaking of D-Rose, it's funny. I was just about to ask you a question about D-Rose, just in, you know, in light of him just retiring. You coming into the league where like prime D-Rose, not even prime D-Rose. 'Cause I would say like he never got the opportunity to really reach his prime. But what we know in his career is prime D. Rose. You coming into the league, what was those matchups like? You with the, 'cause the thing about your speed was it was speed, but your speed was powerful. You know what I'm saying? Like you played with so much force to where it just wasn't like, like De'Aaron Fox speed was like, and he still got it, but he played with way more pace now. But—

Yeah.

Like his speed was just like fast speed. I feel like yours was like, fast, but it was also like powerful. And coming into the league with a guy like D-Rose that, like you said, quick but also powerful. What was those matchups like early on in your career against D-Rose?

Well, I tell you this, my rookie year was MVP year for him. Wow. So that was hell for me. Just to be honest. But I mean, we played him in preseason. I was just like, damn, this might be like the first guy I say that's like quicker, faster than me. I mean, just because, he's already been in the league, he already had his twitch, he already had know what he wanted to do. 'Cause me, like when I watched him play in college, I forget, it was playing Tennessee, I'm Oklahoma in the Garden.

Mm-hmm.

And I was like, this is where I'm going to school. Like when I seen that game and I seen him play Tennessee in Memphis, I already knew in my mind I'm going to play for Coach Cal, just because the way he allowed D-Rose to play, I knew I played a similar way. But when I was in the league, like I always tell you people, it's 3 people that was hard, like 3 people, 3 to 4 people hard as me. Kyrie, 'cause he could do everything, scoring every level. But the hardest person I had problems with was D-Rose.

Yeah, he was a problem.

'Cause you gotta think with Tim's system, everybody around him was located to play defense.

And he was the guy to get the ball.

Go get the ball and you couldn't stop him. It's unlimited pick and rolls. He's scoring at will. And you look at any other guards that played for Tim, they all got that freedom. But you know, D-Rose just on a different level. And like I always say, like, you know, injuries are part of the game, but I feel like if he ain't never had no injuries, bro, we wouldn't even be talking about. A lot of these other guards the way we do.

That's interesting. That's interesting. I was gonna ask you that.

Because a lot of guys was acting like they was sick when he came in town.

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

I got an ankle injury or I got the flu. Like he was scaring people.

He was that dude.

Yeah, he was definitely. And I look at it like my third year, I kind of realized that to build my confidence to another level where like I really can go at this guy toe to toe. But at first, then my rookie year, I was like, man, this shit ain't right.

That's crazy.

This guy's different.

It's always interesting to think like, what does the guard race, if you will, or the guard outlook, like the outlook on the position look like if a D-Rose never got hurt? You know, if a Penny never got hurt, right? John, if you never got hurt, like you got, I don't think people realize you got hurt right in the middle of your prime.

Yeah, facts.

And then it's like, And we'll get into the injuries a little later, but I always wonder like, what does the guard position look like if that never— what does the rap game look like if Biggie or Pac never get killed, right? Like you always had those what-ifs of like, you see how it played out, right? Like Steph's, Steph's goated. Like Russ, like yourself, like the work everybody put in. But you just always wonder if it looks different at all. If D-Rose never gets hurt? Like how does that pan out? It's interesting.

To be honest, I feel like, man, I don't know. Like you said, like they were so close to getting close to the championship in the East. Like if he don't get hurt, like how they was giving Miami a run every— I mean, when they started to get to that point, he was right there on their toes. So, and then you had Indiana, you know, like with Paul George there. So like, it's just like you said, you just never really know what could have happened or what would've went on.

For sure.

But you know what I mean? Like you say, you definitely gotta give D-Rose his flowers, bro. Draymond Green being the youngest MVP, having the battles against him, man, it was super exciting to see him go through the journey he did and fighting back. You know what I mean? I watched the game and he had his first 50-point game and breaking down in tears. And I've been watching a lot, you know, he never really talked. So I watched a lot of his podcasts he'd be having, you know what I mean? And he was talking about like when he realized he was injured with his torn ACL, he had to come back. Like people don't realize that shit—

It's the hardest thing in the world.

Injuries, bro. Like you be on top of the world And then you just feel like you hit rock bottom and you just gotta get through that. And everybody thinks everything's fine because we make the money and we living this lavish life. But the game we love is taken away from us for the time being. So you gotta fight your ass off to get back to even feel like you 100% healthy.

Yeah, that happened to me. You know, but I was—

I know, I watched you since college.

But in college, right? And it's a lonely island, especially as a point guard. When you're an explosive point guard, because now you have to figure out a different way to jump, a different way to land, you know, how to, you gotta change your game. And I was gonna ask you that, you know, as you came into the league, you know, as fast, explosive, one-man fast break, talk about, you know, the steps of how you evolve, right? From a point guard perspective, from like, year 1, 'cause you made the leap from year 1 to year 3 to being dominant, right? Talk about that process.

I think like really just, man, like having Sam Cassell around, you know what I mean? Him being my coach, like he was the master of the mid-range. So he was like, yo, you can't outrun everybody. 'Cause I'll be pushing the break. I'm like, damn, where everybody at? They not even past half court yet. So he was like, you gotta slow down. Like you gotta figure it out. So just watching film with him and understand like you had to master the mid-range, but Like I always told people my whole life, I never had to shoot. Like I always got wherever I wanted. You know what I mean? No matter if I played up or played, I never tried to play my age. I played up. I always got wherever I want, even in college. Like they'd go zone or box. I'll find ways to get there because we were just so talented. But in the league we had real powerful, real centers. So nobody's, you might would probably shoot 10 threes, 11 threes the whole game. Right.

Yeah.

So your most mid-rangers was your foreman. So the paint is packed. And then you come across the lane, they hitting you. Just working with Sam a lot, working with Rob McClanahan at the time. That was D-Rose, you know, Kevin Love, Russ, Kevin Durant, all those guys' trainer. Just teaching me the basics like, yo, you just gotta slow down. You gotta be able to knock down the mid-range. 'Cause no, you was going on these screens, it's a race to the basket. I feel like I can get there every time, but I might have a 7-footer there. So just learning that, like learning how to change my pace and learn how to knock down the mid-range a lot more with confidence. I think that made my game evolve. Like I was always good at passing, always trying to get my teammates involved in finding those guys because I knew in the fourth quarter, if I passed the ball early on in the fourth quarter, you can't double team me as much because my teammates have the confidence to make these open shots instead of them only getting the ball in the fourth quarter. And they like, damn bro, I ain't got no rhythm. So that's kind of how I took my development, just working with Sam a lot, working on my mid-range, working on change of pace and just watching film, bro. And just watching how teams was guarding.

Yeah. On a side note, I wanted to, You know, like what was your favorite memory? You know, you talked about Derrick Rose. What was your favorite memory about playing against Draymond? Besides his glasses.

I know every time you played against Draymond, he was always gonna be somewhere fucking helping. I was getting tired of Draymond. Then if he switched on me, he gonna talk a little shit while he guarded me. We had a funny brawl. Remember that brawl we had, Draymond Green, and you go to state?

Man, listen, I got bullied by Brad. Brad bullied me. Brad wanted to be a bully that night. I got bullied. I tried not to let myself get slammed. I don't let myself get slammed. And I still got fined $35,000.

And then on top of that, I run over there to see what's going on and I get punched by Kelluza. I got punched by my teammate. I look back like, damn, who installed me? It's my own teammate. I said, I ain't going no fight with him.

Damn, y'all was getting down like that?

That was crazy. Nah, but I just think, just, I mean, I think Draymond just get credited, discredited for a lot of stuff he do, but he plays with that old school mentality. You know what I mean? Like he comes with that grit and grind. Like he's probably been a 20-point scorer in high school. You know what I mean? Go to college, things change, get to league, he not playing early on. He find his role, he find his niche, and that's been his, been a dog for it, been a junkyard dog for his team. But on the also, on the other end, on the offensive, he's a point forward. Can run his offense, run his team. So I think every night going against Draymond, we couldn't really put our 5 men on him, which most teams try to do. Because if you try to pick and roll with Steph, he's good at passing, throwing lobs and finding shooters. So you gotta try to go small, but that shit don't work because he's still gonna post up and find ways to do it. So I think just going against Draymond, we knew what he was gonna bring defensively, his intensity. And if you try to get him in foul trouble, that's the only way you can kind of beat the Warriors because when he in, he makes their whole show go.

Yeah.

Like we know Steph is this great and that goat, we know what Klay was. And, but he was just the glue guy for me too. When we played them, we had to key in on him because he makes they whole shit go.

Yeah. I was gonna say, I know what—

Yeah, I always tell you that.

I know what Draymond favorite moment was playing against you.

What's this?

Do you remember when Draymond Green dunked on you?

Hell no, I gotta see this, show me the highlight. Bring in the clip.

Show me the highlight.

Oh, hey, hey, hey. Ooh, no foul. Oh, look at that. And the in-the-air speed, we talking about John Wall speed. Did you just see where I started from?

Okay, he took off. He took off. Look at him. Draymond got me.

Yeah, Dray got me. Dray got some sneaky bounce though. He'll dunk something.

Thank you, Draymond.

'Cause he got me.

I got, see, see, hey, y'all showing that, y'all gotta show BD that.

Oh man, show him that. I was on the rim.

Oh, that was crazy.

I was on the rim.

That was nice.

It was like, oh shit. It was like, oh shit. You gotta show him that, Charles.

BD, you had no business jumping.

I ain't think he was gonna jump, man. I didn't know he was gonna jump.

I don't know what the fuck I was thinking.

You know what that's called?

It was my birthday too, bro.

That's called getting old.

But I didn't think he was gonna jump. I just told Draymond Green like, throw that lob, throw that lob. I'm in the Garden, I needed some highlight. We getting spanked anyway.

Man, I was gonna knock the ball. I thought I timed it. Oh! Mike Bibby over there crying, dude.

That is hilarious, man.

That's the only time I got dunked on like that. All right, Charles, that's enough, dog. Okay. I never forget that, man. I never forget that. I never show my son either. Well, you know YouTube, he can't hide nothing.

Bron might be the only one get stuff deleted off YouTube.

—What Bron get deleted off YouTube? —Draymond probably up on him when he was at David's camp. Yeah, yeah, they can't take that down!

It gotta go! Cut! Where is it? That video got to be somewhere in the world now.

Somebody only why I brought up because somebody just posted not too long ago. They found it there. Bron ain't getting this one to go away but I'm like I ain't seen it in years.

And it's super janky the way they filmed it. Like, yeah.

They edited the film, it's like behind the basket.

Like, you don't even know what's going on.

Yeah, I feel Bron probably put that out himself. Like, this is the blurry edited version. Let me go on and drop this. Draymond know, he know. That's just dumb.

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We mentioned you as a slam dunk champion, and I'll be one of the judges this year for the slam dunk contest. Why do you think superstar players haven't, haven't recently wanted to participate in the dunk contest?

I don't know. I think they should though. You know what I mean? Like, I think like the old day they did like, I ain't really wanna do it, but I told him, I said, if I make the All-Star game, I get in the dunk contest. You know what I mean? And it was different. Don't get me wrong. I'm gonna take my win, but it was a different setup the year I did it. They want the regular way, but I never did that dunk before neither. But one time, like the day before I tried and I was like, man, shit, I don't got nothing else to do. Either this gonna win or we gonna be losing. But I think all the stars should get into it. Like, I think that's what make All-Star Weekend fun. You know what I mean? You seeing all the greats that was going in the All-Star Game to be in the dunk contest. That's what people wanna see. You know what I mean? Like, you got so many, Ja Morant, you had LeBron, you got Zion, you got all these great stars that be in the All-Star Game that they usually be in the dunk contest. And I think, I mean, you gotta kind of try to get back to it. 'Cause a lot of the guys that get in it, they're in the league, we know who they are, but they not like the name that everybody wanna go see and be excited. I think probably, you know, me and Draymond, we was there, I think the best one we had in a while was when Aaron Gordon and Zach Lavine went back to back. Like, that was the best one.

That was sick.

You gotta have those type of guys that's doing shit we ain't never seen if you ain't gonna have the stars in it. But it's kind of like you run out of options. Like, what more tricks can we really come up with?

Yeah, I was gonna ask you, what would you do to get them to, what would you say, like, what would you do to get them to compete?

I don't think you could do anything 'cause they weren't doing it before.

Yeah, they damn sure.

For sure not doing it now.

But you know, if when you look back in the league, The reason why the dunk contest, to your point, the superstars, even if they got in the dunk contest and didn't wanna do it, like they still gave the fans something. And then that name, that next name became a name, right? Like a Spud Webb, right?

Yeah.

Like Spud Webb became a thing and became a name because all the top dogs still got in the dunk contest, even if they wasn't tripping. And so I think, you know, it's an entertainment cadence too that go along with this, kind of like a passing of the torch or all these dudes around, you know, a young dude like, what's his name for the Clippers who won the dunk contest? Yeah, Derek Jones. Derek Jones, like that type of energy, right, around these young dudes, even this year, like finding a way to get this, you know, to get them some more exposure. I like it be like, "Oh, who is that?" Like, we know who these dudes are, but who is that? And you know, that's the person who wind up winning and getting the name. That's how Dee Brown got on, right? It wasn't 'cause he was, you know, killer, like, or just killing. He got on 'cause, you know, the dunk contest and got his name.

Yeah, I think like if Giannis Kaminga won't hurt, like, you know what I mean, Dray, you see him probably do some, I feel like he'd be one of those guys that like people, like to see him because the dunks he do during the season, if he was healthy, if he got in there, because I seen him in my tournament, in my high school tournament and stuff, I seen him do, I'm like, he'd be somebody that's a name that's right there that people are starting to hear about that can take that next jump to put him in that spotlight.

Well, I think, I think like for young guys like JK, I think the thing that, and just isn't just him, I just think as a whole, like the thing that those guys don't understand is if they do like the dunk contest, what it can do for their personal brands. You know what I'm saying? So everybody, we live in this day and age where all of these young guys wanna kind of push their own personal brands, right? But you have these rare instances like an NBA All-Star, I mean like a dunk contest that you can do to— Yeah. Like Mack McClung became somebody doing a dunk contest. He not even in the NBA. You know what I'm saying? So that just for what it could do for guys' personal brands, you would think that more young guys would do it for that reason. You know, before Zach Lavine ever became an All-Star, he was at the dunk contest and made a name for himself, you know? Yeah. And so I think young guys miss out on that side of it when they decide not to do it. I think they're leaving a massive opportunity. On the table.

I agree.

Speaking of All-Star Weekend in general, I feel like your All-Star appearances, the game was still better. Like it wasn't the best, but it was still—

Competitive.

Competitive, like—

Entertaining, I would say.

What would you say has to happen today to get the game back good? Like the game, Last year the game was pathetic. Like what do you think has to happen to get the game back good?

I don't know. I think like they, what they try to do like a total score every quarter, like every half or something. Like I think they just gotta go back East versus West. You know what I mean? To me, I feel like you should go East versus West, but it's hard to see, man. Like I don't know how can you raise the stakes to get everybody to wanna compete? You know what I mean?

Yeah.

Because if your star stars, like the guys that we want to go see ain't competing at a high level, It's kind of like—

Everybody too friendly.

I guess like everybody just cool.

Everybody too cool.

It's like, all right, well I'm gonna let you shoot 23s or I'm gonna let you get 90 dunks and go get 50 points. Like, it's like, it's no pride into it. You know what I mean? Like, you know what I mean? Early on you might get a little bit of showcase here and there, but like you still want to keep the game close. And then, you know, we knew going into the fourth quarter, it's go time. Lace them up, we trying to win. But like now it's just like, you might be down 50 by the third quarter. I don't know, it's kind of hard to say 'cause I like, you probably wonder too, like how can you get the game back? And I'm like, I think it's just slipping away. Like I think they got like a new format this year, right?

Yeah, it's a new format. It's like—

Like if the rookie sophomore game, whoever win that one play, ain't nobody trying to see that shit.

At all. Yeah, it's too much. It's a lot of gimmicks. Instead of watching dudes play—

But you giving the rookies and sophomores the opportunity to feel like, oh well, I'm an all-star. Like for them, if they get the opportunity to play against the real all-star, they gonna feel like, They All-Stars at the time being, you know what I mean? So they gotta find a way to—

Wait, what is happening?

They gonna keep losing the fans. I think like the rookie, sophomore play each other, right?

So the way it is, so, you know, it's 24 All-Stars, 12 from the East, 12 from the West. There will be 3 teams of 8 and they all make up 3 teams. And then the rookie All-Star game is doing the same thing. It's like 3 teams of 8 or something like that. And the winner of their little bracket is going to be the 4th team versus the 3 teams of 8 All-Star.

Oh wow.

And they'll play like some game.

But don't they like one team play a game, they go to the locker, come back.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's gonna be hard to get All-Stars to one play 8 minutes, then go in the locker, chill.— and wait for another guy.

Yeah, they gonna check out.

Yeah. I mean—

They gonna be checked out.

But what's missing, I think, is the old school way, and nobody had no beef with each other. Nobody really like, "Oh, I get double-teamed, so you can't double-team me now." Kinda like that mano a mano, right? It's none of that. There's no beef. There's no, you know, nobody like, there's nobody antagonizing. The opportunity to get people riled up to go at each other. Nobody goes at each other. And so at the end of the day, if everybody to John point, if you cool, then everything cool. And what we're watching is a lot of threes, dunks, and you know, kids are like, "Man, I can go do that outside with 3 people." Mm-hmm. Right? It always look like 3 people on the court. And never like a full court game. So they gotta make it a full court, 5 on 5, the best players playing against the best players, just for reasons, for names alone. And I wanna make sure that people know I'm the best shooting guard, I'm the best point guard. I think that was your, that was the last era of like your time, John. You feel what I'm saying?

Yeah, you went at each other like, oh, I don't like you throughout the season. And then I think like with these teams, like I might have beef with you, I might, Don't wanna play against you, I'm gonna just put you on my team. You know what I mean? But I feel like the one person that can't, not one person can change the whole All-Star format, how they do it. But I feel like the one kid I know that got it is Ant-Man.

Yes.

Like, I feel like he gonna find somebody, if he starting, or I'm gonna find somebody I don't like and I'm going at him. You know what I mean? Like, you need that type of competitiveness. Like, I mean, just what you need. I mean, I feel like if he go against KD or if he go against D-Book or he go against Donovan Mitchell or whoever the next 2 guard is, he's trying to let them know like, I'm the best 2 guard in the league. And I feel like, He can bring that to the All-Star Game, but I don't feel like he's at the level now where everybody will follow along. You know what I mean? But I feel like he can get there at some point, but you hope he is soon so that the All-Star Game don't kind of go away with people just like, you know what, I don't even care about it on the weekends.

Yeah.

'Cause we used to wait, we used to couldn't wait till Sunday and be like, man, I'm ready for this game. Now it's like Sunday, people wanna leave. They don't even care about going to the game.

I think one of the things, you know, that the NBA has to realize is also like, when the games were good and the games were competitive. You also have to remember, like, BD, back in y'all time, the prep that y'all had for to get ready for a game and the prep that guys have today are totally different.

Yeah, way different.

You know, there's, there's osteos, you know, that you got PTs, like, you have a whole different type of prep now for games than when than back in the day. And so I think that's a huge part of it. Like, I think the NBA need to prioritize, yo, for every one of these guys who gets them ready for games during the season. Okay, I know that person's supposed to be on All-Star. I'm gonna pay them $5,000 extra, $10,000 extra to be at All-Star weekend to prep Steph Curry, to be at All-Star weekend to prep You know, and to make sure every single guy has their prep. Now, with that being said, no other requirements. From All-Stars, there's no other requirements. If you do some personal require— you know, some personal things that you wanna do, then do that. But there's zero other requirements from All-Star. The only thing you are here at All-Star Weekend to do is to be ready to compete in this game. Get your body ready to play at a high level. And I think that's what the NBA needs to do. They need to make, because to, to John's point, by the time you get to the game Sunday night, you've done so much, you've had so many obligations that it's like, oh, now we got the game. Like, man, get me outta here. But as opposed to if, if you don't have anything on the weekend, like nothing, no requirements, you got this game. In the NBA, but you can't make it so corporate though. So you gotta pick what you want, right? Do you want a great game? Or do you want this corporate thing where, oh, the All-Stars are here? And I think they need to make that decision because right now the game is suffering and guys live like, it's just different now.

Dills used to look forward.

I can pick and choose one. Dills used to look forward to the game. Just on that vibe.

Yep. It used to be a thing you look forward to the game. Right, you gonna get some dudes gonna get, the big dogs gonna get they rest. The new guys gonna be out trying to get they name up, but you knew you had to show up to practice, media day, and probably one or two appearances, that's it. But now you look at, you know, the game is so global, the responsibility on these dudes, the attention on these dudes, that they kind of just wanna, not be seen and chill. Like, All-Star Weekend was like, it used to be rest, but you treated it like it was another game.

Facts.

Like, this is the game I'm playing with all the juggernauts. Like, let me show who I am. And I don't think people get, we not setting our guys up for that or setting them up to fight. That should be the best fight, the most entertaining fight.

Moving on, we had, you spoke about Sam Cassell and the impact, you know, that he had on your game. We had him on the pod. He shared this story about you getting emotional after losing 25 games when it wasn't even December yet. Tell your story.

John Wall, his rookie year, he lost 8 games from high school to college, 2 years. Knocked on my door, I said, "Oh, what's going on?" John Wall in tears, in tears crying. He lost 25 games, it ain't December yet.

He asked me, say, "OG, is it gonna get any better?" You ask any guys I ever coached, I'm not gonna lie to you.

I ain't gonna lie to you. I ain't gonna lie to you. I said, I looked him in the face, I said, "Come on." I broke him in the room and said, "No." And guess what, J Dub? I throw him a towel, man.

I say, "It's gonna be bad next year too, but we gotta grow." Absolutely.

"You gotta keep working." Can you walk us through that moment during your rookie year?

I ain't gonna lie, man. We went on the road, we probably lost like 24 straight road games. I'm like, "What the hell is this?" My, you know, like my whole life, I probably never lost that many games like in one year. I just left college, lost 3 games, and they called it the doodoo bowl, bro. We playing Cleveland, like they lost 24 straight games complete, and we lost 24 straight on the road. So we just like, man, we gotta win this game. We finally get a win. I was like, Sam, if this how it go, I'm like, yo, we gonna lose like this. Can y'all just pay me and I go back to college and play? Like, can we make this work some way, somehow? And I'm like, how long is it gonna last? He like, probably about 2 more years. You gotta draft some more guys. We gotta hopefully trade for some people. And I'm like, bro, the league is not like this. I'm like, there's no way people don't care about— 'Cause you know, you first come in, you just looking like, I know people care about the game.

Yeah.

It's like, we losing, we just outside. We grown, like we outside. I'm like, bro, I don't wanna be seen. We just lost by 30.

Definitely.

Like I wanna just order room service. I don't wanna be seen in the bar, nowhere downstairs. But like, it just taught me a lot though. 'Cause I had a lot of good vets though throughout the years. You know what I mean? Like Drew Gooden, Draymond Green, Trevor Ariza, Al Harrington, Andre Miller, Paul Pierce, just always talking to me. This before they was my teammates, like after game, they come whisper to me in my ear, like, just stay the course, just continue to work. Like, it'll get better at some point.

Yeah.

And I think that kind of helped me a lot because I wasn't used to losing that much and I wasn't used to like being in that type of environment. But I think just having great vets around, understand that I was willing to work, I was willing to listen, I wasn't scared to ask questions. And that kind of helped me pave my way to figure it out throughout the league.—

Did you ever get used to the losing? Like, do you feel like at some point you ever like, just like, you know what it is, what it— or did you ever not really?

No, I kinda knew going like, you know, you go high pick, you're not gonna really go to a good team.

I wouldn't know.

I appreciate that. I wouldn't know. It ain't my experience.

So I was like, I knew it was like going through a rebuild process. You know what I mean? So I'm just like, all right. You know what I mean? Gil was there, so they was getting ready to trade Gil. You know what I mean? Then I had like Andre Blatche, Nick Young, JaVale and those guys was young, 'cause they didn't play as much when you had Draymond Green, Antoine Jameson, those guys there, they huge. So just learning from those guys and just trying to build like who we drafted, who we drafted. And I remember like what, 2, 3 years in a row, we had like a top 7 pick, you know what I mean? We had number 6 pick, then we had, I remember we had like 2 first round picks, like back to back, 2 years in a row. Yeah. So I'm like, all right, hopefully we drafting the right guys to fit with our team. And I think, you know, that's the key to like, all these GMs, they like a lot of GMs, they don't, I think a lot more players should be GMs. You know what I mean? 'Cause we know the game very well. Just because you nice and I'm nice don't mean we mesh together. You know what I mean? You gotta figure out, do they, is they gonna, is they gonna balance it out right? So I think that's more thing we gotta figure out with more GMs and things like that. But I think like down the road, it's about the work you put in as a player. You don't get used to the losing. So I never got used to it. I just like, okay, we gotta find a way to get outta this. Like, what can I do to get better myself? I never try to blame the team. I'm like, well, John, can you come back better? And hopefully my other teammates are coming back better. And then we finally figured out like my third, fourth year of figuring out, getting over the hump.

And looking back on it, do you think the GM that you had that was doing the drafting, do you think he ultimately did a great, a good job?

I think we missed out on some pieces. I think we missed out on a couple of pieces. You know what I mean? Like we could have drafted Klay. I mean, we took, we took Jan Bueschel. We thought he was the overseas Blake Griffin at the time. No, we did. That's what it is.

When they drafted him, they thought he was the overseas Blake Griffin.

That was it. Yeah, no, for sure. 'Cause he was athletic, but I'm like, we need a 2 guard. This is before we drafted Brad. So I'm like, we need a 2 guard. You know what I mean? With me, I'm like, I need a 2 guard knockdown shooter. The way I get into the paint, find shooters that would have been perfect for us. You know what I mean? I think, I mean, we got Brad right for sure. You know what I mean? I think Otto Porter was the best situation at that time coming out, being a great 3 man for us and a slasher. We had got Trevor Booker that was at that time for the 4 man. He was a hard worker, play hard, do all the dirty work. Those guys we drafted, you know what I mean? You try to hit on the right ones, but same time it's hit or miss. But I feel like we missed out on a couple of pieces that could have helped us. Could you imagine we draft, we draft Clay, next year you get Brad? Yep. All right, we cool then. I'm straight. I got a 2 and a 3 that's shooting the piss out the ball. I'm okay with that.

Absolutely.

You know what I mean? But it goes like that. But I also think so, like when we got to that point, you also gotta try to make some trades. I think we did some great trades of getting Gortat, you know what I mean? To help me, a lot of my pick and roll having Nene. I mean, then we got Trevor Ariza to help us at the 3 position, you know, going against Bron in the East and those guys. So he was a great mentor for us just 'cause he had a championship pedigree to knowing what's going on and things like that. So he kind of helped me mold and understand like, okay, bro, you the best player out here every night. You gotta think that, like, you can't think nothing otherwise.

No doubt. I think we all have a moment in our careers, like, where there's a matchup that you take personally. You just mentioned mine. Like for years in my career, I'd say maybe my first 7 years, like until I really felt like, all right, I've done enough in this personal matchup and in my resume to where like, all right, I feel like I'm good with that now. Like I've done that.

Mm-hmm.

And we all had that matchup of guys in our career. For me, it was Blake Griffin. Like when I came in, everybody like, yo, this the next young dude up, right? Like Blake was in it, all NBAs, and he was in the West. And so for me, I'm like, all right, if I'm trying to become an all-star, that's the guy I need to go at and I need to take down. Who was that guy for both of y'all?

I would say for me, mine was gonna be D-Rose, you know what I mean? Then he got hurt. Other than that, it would be Russ 'cause Russ was on the West. But for me, I'll say Kyrie. I mean, he was on the East.

Okay.

You know what I mean? Every time he played Cleveland, I know that game was on TNT. I know it was on ESPN. I'm like, these shoes gotta be laced super tight. 'Cause you know what Ky bring it like, you know what I mean? You've been against Ky in the finals and he just, for me, I feel like he's the most skilled basketball player. There's nothing he cannot do on the basketball court. Catch and shoot off the dribble, post-ups, left-hand floater. So for me, I knew I had to lace these boots up. Like forget what happened the night before, forget going to dinner late. I'm no. I'm in his bed getting some rest and I'm going at it. So I feel like Kyrie would be my guy. Like that's who I would say I would always look forward for that matchup.

Yeah, I'd say for me it was always like Iverson or Kobe. Kobe, 'cause that was the only time I got a chance for people to see me on TV at home when they— it was different back then, bro, with no League Pass. You know, they come back, they come to Charlotte, Kobe come to Charlotte, I had to put on a show. Or, you know, Allen Iverson, 'cause growing up everybody wanted to be like AI, had that crossover like AI. And I knew I need to put myself in a certain category. But in our era, it was like night after night, you had like, you had nightmares. Sam Cassell, you got nightmares, you better get some sleep. Nick Van Exel, you gonna have nightmares, you better get some sleep. Tim Hardaway, like all these dudes was like, you know, where I was when you dunked on me, John, right? And so it was like one by one trying to take them out. And I think as I got older, you look at like Chauncey Billups, Steve Nash, and Tony Parker, which a lot of people don't give a lot of credit to. Those were the dudes that, you know, I wanted to take out or had a certain chip on my shoulder when I saw them.

Yeah, I had to stretch my rookie year. I was like, nah, the league set me up. I had D-Rose, Rondo, then I go out west, I got Deron Williams.

Yep, Utah.

Russ and Steve Nash. I said, this some bullshit. Steve Nash went in there like 10 for 10 for me, against me. And like, you know, there's nothing you can do. He run around the basket, he don't stop his dribble. I'm like, bro, this dude is cold. Like, so I had like, I was just like, I had that, you know what I mean? I can't forget CP, you know what I mean? I had CP at the time. You still had Tony Parker. I mean, people forget about Goran Dragic. He was hooping at that time. Like it was, I was like, yeah, the league is some guards in this shit.

That's where every night at the point guard position was head.

Oh yeah, for sure.

And then, and also I couldn't go guard no 3 man or a small 4 man that might can't shoot in the corner. You know what I mean?

Like I have to guard the point guard every night.

It was no ducking, no matchup. And I'm like, bro, I gotta do this on the offense and do this on the other end. So it was great. It was a time, like I came in a great time where I had to play against a lot of great guards and it kind of like molded me to put my competitiveness level to another level.

Yeah, I was gonna say that as a guard, you come in and you shaped by like your rookie year, you played against Rondo. He played way different than Steve Nash. Who play different than Deron Williams, who play different than Chris Paul, who play different than Derrick Rose. And if you get caught up in trying to figure them out, right? Then you'll never figure out who you are and make them, you gotta make them scared of you. That's what happened my rookie year.

Oh no, that's how, yeah, that's how I looked at it. I had to make people like, okay, like, and I try to make it to where it's not a matchup. You know what I mean? Like I'm trying to go every possession back at them. 'Cause if you like D-Rose at that time, you try to, oh, he score, I gotta go score. You know what I mean? And then we can't forget like when Steph started to figure out doing him, I'm like, oh, this is BS. Like I gotta run around 90 screens. Like, you know what I mean? 'Cause he don't stop moving. So I feel like that's the, like, so when people say guarding Steph, I like, it's a whole nother level because y'all set so many screens. Like he might have a shot, throw it and they holding, he going off 2 more screens. I'm like, fuck, I ain't guarding nobody like this. So I'm preparing myself for this one game of how he's going. You know what I mean? Like you said, it's always different ways you gotta guard certain people. And it just make it difficult.

Yeah, one of my favorite memories of your career was your game-winning shot against the Celtics in 2017. Yeah, I was there. Yeah, it was ironic. What do you remember about the shot? And what was that play? Was the play designed for you?

No, I was in the corner. Dray know the play 'cause Dray, I know Dray watch film. It's the same play we run all the time. Decoy to the corner, the 4-man dive, Brad gets the pin down from Gortai, he's supposed to catch the ball at the top of the key. Marcus Smart was on top of the play, so I just legally run out the corner and like, just gimme the ball. Then they got a 5-second violation and stepped out of bounds. And I'm going against a great defender, which I don't understand how he never was All-NBA First Team. If I'm wrong, please correct me, but I don't think Avery Bradley ever made All-NBA First Team, which he should have. I might be wrong.

I'll check that.

But he was a hell of a defender. I played against him since my 11th grade year in high school. He played with Dule Gaddy. On the Seattle AAU team. So I take one dribble and I'm like, bro, I can't get to the basket. I know they're not calling no foul. So I'm like, my only shot is to shoot the 3. Like we either win or go home. And you know what I mean? The bitch went in and it was up after that.

One time, 2016, one time.

One time that year. Oh, fuck it. I'm wrong. He made it that one year. I was about to say, but I knew like trying to get by him with a certain time on the clock, I was like, it ain't gonna work. So I just pulled up and Iconic. But then IT almost hit a damn bank shot over Gortat. My heart was like, please go.

I need my game winner. This my—

Man, I need this.

This my one.

That maybe, that helped me get my all NBA right here. 13.

Okay.

And that, in that same vein with the Celtics, that series, they came in in all black saying game 6 was a funeral. I remember you mentioned in the postgame. Was that a discussion for y'all going into that game? Like, yo, like talking about that? Because at that time, like the fashion wasn't as in your face like it is now.

Nah, like for me, it's like, you know how you sit back in the locker room, they got a little TV on and they show the teams walking in. I'm like, damn, this nigga wear all black.

Yeah.

It's a funeral. I was like, nah, hell nah. Yeah, that used to be the thing. You just can't wear no, I mean, you can't wear no fin, like all black and some, Told me I said funeral. So I kind of took it personal. You know how you warming up for the game. I told the guys like, yo, we can't lose. Like they treating it like we done with, like they already put us in the casket, we over with. I'm like, we just gotta, we gotta figure a way out. So I mean, luckily we came back and got the win and then, you know, we lost in game 7. But I feel like ironic, that's probably one of the best series in a long time. Like was going toe to toe and we really had real beef throughout the regular season.

Yeah.

Like we had real smoke throughout the regular season. To get to them was very like, we needed that. Like I wanted that smoke.

Them the fun times, man. When you got a little chippiness back and forth with a team and then you get matched up with that team in the playoffs. Like we had, we've had those times with like the Memphis Grizzlies. We've had those times with Houston where it's like this chippiness amongst you. Every game you got that same chippiness and then you meet in the playoffs and it's like, all right, here we go. I got you.

And you know, every game is different, bro. Every game gonna be different. You like, even you go down 2-0, you up 2-0, you like, man, shit, it ain't over.

It don't matter. It don't matter.

And like, that's how I felt when we played Atlanta. We got to play Atlanta early that series. And I was mad because 2015, we had Paul Pierce, I fractured my hand and I finished the whole game 1. I didn't know I had 5 fractures in my hand. So I go to the back, take a shower, my hand like a little white muffin hand. I'm like, yo, I can't wash my back. I'm like, shit, I'm out. I got, I missed like 3 games. So I let 'em numb my hand up and finally came back and play. And I'll never forget, I blocked Schroeder shot game 5 and Horford get the rebound and score a layup, man. They go up 3-2. I'll never forget Dennis Schroeder and Kent Bazemore like did a, like looking at me and posted a picture. I'm like, oh, I gotta get these motherfuckers. I gotta get them. I gotta get them. So when we went back and we got to play 'em that year, I had like 24 in the fourth. Like I ended up with 42. I was like, "I told y'all I was coming back. I told y'all I was coming back." So, you know, like you said, you have those beef and those personal battles, that shit means something.

Yeah, that all black to the funeral, that's kind of like a whole little mantra, you know? But at the time, y'all in the playoffs, y'all making waves. Was there ever a Big Three era moment for Washington where, you and Brad were potentially gonna get somebody, or who was that player you were trying to add that you guys thought could help you get to the finals?

I really tried to get Paul George. You know what I mean? Like that year we were trying to get KD. I was like, bro, we gotta get Paul George. Like we needed, this is a perfect 3-man force. No matter, I feel like we had the 4 and the 5 that was solid for us. Me and Brad in the backcourt, we just, I just think Paul George could have helped us. 'Cause I feel like that time in East, it's LeBron. I mean, everybody knows Bron. You gotta have a 3. That can guard, not saying you gonna be able to stop him 'cause we know how dominant Draymond Green is, but can go back at him too that he has to respect. And I feel like Paul George would've been that guy. And we was trying to go get KD and I was just like, we're not getting Kevin Durant. Like he's not coming to DC. Like it's too much family stuff. It's too much. He, nah, he ain't trying to do it. And we ended up having Paul, which Paul ended up being great for us. You know what I'm saying? Like great vet for me. Taught me a lot, his routine, the way he worked. It was amazing. And— Yeah. We kind of got Paul 'cause he thought Sam was staying. He thought Sam Cassell was gonna stay as our coach. And that's the year Sam went and went to the Clippers. So Paul stayed for that one year. And then after that we just had to try to figure it out. Yeah. But for that one year, I feel like we could have got to the East Coast and find it if I didn't break my hand. But that's the guy I was going for, for sure. Paul George.

I remember y'all being on the list for KD.

'Cause I think he went, is that same year or the year after he went to OKC, right?

He went to OKC. Yeah. He got—

Yeah. So I was like, man, we gotta get him. 'Cause come on, right here.

Like what are we doing? Yeah.

That would've been nice.

Kevin Durant's not cut.

Hey, but if y'all could've got KD, ooh, if y'all could've got KD.

Nah, it would've been written. Like we know what the hell that would've been. But in my mind, I'm just saying we're not getting Kevin Durant right now. Like where we are, we're not at the level where we feel like we are a championship team. That's what Kevin was going for. We need a person that's gonna help us get there, which Kevin would've got us there. But I just felt Paul George would've been the best fit for us at the time.

I knew when I was looking at KD list of like teams that he was looking at, we was in there running and trying to get, I knew the one team we didn't have to worry about was y'all. 'Cause I knew he wasn't going home. I'm like, there's no chance.

Yeah, I told everybody we not going home.

We not going home.

Yeah, you know. So I just knew like, just for that reason alone, like I knew, I'm like, bro not going to the crib. Like, so I just, I knew that.

I was telling this the whole time, like, well, we gotta go get PG. Like put all our focus on PG, like, I mean, K ain't coming home, man.

Yeah, that makes sense. And speaking of that Big Three and just you and Brad, like playing together for 8 years, what's your thoughts kind of on what's happening with him in Phoenix right now? Where it's kind of like, he's kind of like the, almost in some instances it comes off as like scapegoat-ish, but I don't know they locker room, so I can't necessarily say that, but like, he obviously not starting, you know, like, so just kind of what his whole situation and what he going through there.

Oh, I think it's tough. I mean, 'cause like, I thought it was a tough move anyway going there early on, you know what I mean? 3 guys that could score the ball at a high level and they all 3 need the basketball, you know what I mean? But we know K's the one guy outta those 3 guys that you just say, you know what, just gimme the ball in the mid post in the 4th quarter, I'm gonna do my thing. I'm very efficient. So I think it was kind of tough because he didn't know where his shots was coming. And then all of his shots turned into being just catch and shoot shots for real. You know what I mean? I think that kind of like wasn't his role and kind of listened to K, had a postgame interview and he was like, I know he probably don't wanna come off the bench and he's still playing starting minutes like 35 minutes a night. But I think now he knows where his shots is coming from. Like he's able to get into his rhythm. He's able to have more scoring games, but it's like, damn, I'm making 50-something million. Like I'm coming off the bench. This shit don't add up. Don't add up. It don't add up. You're not really getting a guy paying $50 million to come off the bench. So I think in their mindset, they're kind of looking for a guy that's more like a slash or like glue guy for them. And it probably fit better for them. You know what I mean? 'Cause I feel like Brad, feel like at the same time right now, he still can go get 20, 25 in any given night. And he's had proven that coming off the bench. So I think he want to kind of roll where he's gonna have the ball more. And I think in Phoenix, he's just not gonna work with D-Book and K there with it.

Yeah. And I think it'll always be, And it's just, it's tough in general. Like, because whether you're playing starter minutes or not, if you're coming off the bench, it essentially slots you into a role. And just as a role player, I don't think people understand, you are not going to get the same shots every night. I don't care how many minutes you play.

Right.

Yes. As a role player, you just not gonna get the same shots every night because the offense isn't built for you to get those shots. Like the same stuff.

It's always a different game plan on how they guard you.

Absolutely. And so as a role player, the game plan may delete you right outta the offense because the offense ain't built for you anyway. So the way they're guarding something, you may get 2 shots that night. I saw the other night where I think Draymond Green had like 5 points. He had like 4 or 5 shots, right? Like there's gonna be some nights like that when it's not designed for you. And I just think, you know, if, if, to have those nights like that.

Too much talent, bro.

Like, it's not, you're not getting the best out of Bradley Beal.

It's the coaching too. And it's like, if you come off, yeah. And I feel like if you like a guy that's been starting and been in that role, and I get it sometimes at some point in your career, you have to take the backseat and come off the bench. But if you feel like you still in that moment, you feel assured that you can still be in that moment, it kind of fuck with your mind, your mentality coming into the game. You know what I mean? Like it kind of puts you in a position like, man, I know I can be out there.

Like I know I can help better.

But like you said, you come off the bench like, well, you might get 15 minutes now, you might get 20 minutes now, or you might get 2 shots, or your leash is a lot shorter than it is when you're the number 1, number 2 option, or you that franchise guy. So kind of accepting that role is a little bit difficult than a lot of people think. You know what I mean?

Yeah, no doubt.

They think it's so much easier, but if you used to being that guy and being that movement, it hurts, yeah.

Like the worst thing to do is somebody with that much amount of talent, and that much amount of game to know every game how much time they gonna play. If you're a superstar, you know, okay, I'm finishing out the game, I'm closing out the game. If you somebody like Brad and you looking like, oh man, I'm playing 25, 30 minutes, I don't know how this is going. Once you start, once you got that mentality, it's frustrating. It hurts because you can't think past like, The confidence of, I'm the closer, or I'm on the closing team, is unpredictable. So you ready, you unready, you getting shots, you not getting shots. So it really just play with your confidence and your psyche, and more so your mentality going to the game. 'Cause if you know, like, all right, some dudes who come off the bench and play 20 minutes a game, they know they playing 20 minutes a game. That's their role.

Yeah.

Somebody who is nice like Bradley Beal that should be over capacity and can affect the game, that could potentially, you know, hurt his psyche or just hurt his rhythm and hurt the opportunities for the team to have a better rhythm in knowing how to win. But that's ultimately a coaching thing. You know, if you got 3 higher guns on your team, and you're not putting them in position to all be in rhythm, then you gotta start looking at, man, who's mixing and matching these lineups where these dudes can't all get their game off.

You went to a Wizards game earlier this month. How was it for you going back there to receive the reception that you did in your return to a game?

Oh, it was dope, man. I was in town 'cause one of my close friends had a baby shower and I was like, man, the game on Sunday, like, I'll just stay and go to the game. You know what I mean? Like, just to be back around that love, you know what I mean? See a lot of people from the facility, you know, that I haven't seen in a while. So it was dope, man. Like, I appreciate the tribute. The fans still show me the love that I feel like I deserve. And it was dope to be back in that environment. I mean, you kind of get the chills and try not to like break down. 'Cause you know what I mean? That was home for me. That was a place I never wanted to leave. I wanted to kind of, play my whole career there until it got to a point where, you know, my, the front office might be like, you know what, we just trying to completely rebuild and we feel like you should go somewhere else. You know what I mean? That's kind of the role I wanted to be is play for one team, my whole organization. But I mean, it's a business, shit happens. You move on from it. Right. But I still got a lot of love for the city. That's my second home. The city still show me love and I always try to do as much as I can when I go back there and try to visit as much as possible. So to get that type of love still and know like how much I meant to the community outside of just basketball, That's what I really prided myself off of.

You haven't officially retired though, so they can't tell you yet when your jersey getting retired.

Nah, that bitch better get retired for sure. It gotta happen. Absolutely. Absolutely.

It gotta happen.

With your love of basketball and you watch a lot of games, what do you think of the current Wizards squads and how would you improve the team?

For me, I feel like they gotta find that number one guy. You know what I mean? The franchise guy. You know what I mean? I think the young guys they drafted is pretty, they gonna be good. I think they gonna be some great role players to kind of go into what they system needs. But I think they like, you know what I mean? Like they vets now don't want to, they kind of see like they want to be out, you know what I mean? Yeah. So I think they gotta find, and Dray probably contributed to this. A lot of these teams don't really have vets that's mentoring these guys that want to be there. Like, you know what I mean? Like, all right, you know, you signing me as a vet, I'm not gonna play as much. I might not play, but I'm gonna help the young guys know what the league is about. I think that's what some of these teams are missing. So I think if they can get a couple of those guys to help out, but yeah, I mean, they probably gonna be in the draft with the next 2, 3 years, probably trying to get that one guy that's that guy. And I think, I mean, once you find out who your guy is, I think all those young guys can learn from, you know what I mean? I kind of look at the Rockets, you know what I mean? They found out who they guy, they, I feel like it's Draymond Green right now, or Sagoon, and they put a lot of vets around him. They got a new coach, a new coach. And so he don't fuck around. He's like, this is what we doing, this is how we going. And they drafted a lot of young, great talent. I think they drafted too much great young talent that they might have to get rid of some of those guys 'cause they don't get to get on the floor. Yeah, I mean, but I feel like the Wizards are going in the right direction. They just gotta, they got a new front office and things like that. So it takes some time. I mean, but you know, a lot of teams, a lot of fans don't wanna waste no time waiting.

And the worst thing you can have in player development when you have rookies and a young team is you can have, the worst thing to have is vets that don't wanna be there because that means that they don't really wanna play or show the young, or groom the young guys.

To show the young guys what's going on.

There's no culture being built. So I agree, that gotta be blown up fast. Also, one of the biggest trades being discussed obviously is Jimmy Butler. You went through a tough trade. You were traded from the Wizards, right? The city you love. He arrived in Houston when Harden was trying to be traded. You know, we thought, hey man, I thought, okay, we cracking. You know, I thought it was gonna be cracking. Man, that was— Yeah, I thought it was gonna be too.

Shit, I got there and it was—

You know, you went to the charity event. Giving the blueprint. He was picking up full, locking up. It seemed like it was gonna be something. Social media is tricky, bro.

Yeah, like we was going at it at the charity game.

Yeah.

I thought it was gonna kind of work out, you know what I mean? Like try to figure out like which way they was going. And I feel like that just was a tough spot for me, you know what I mean? Getting traded there, which I love. Like didn't have no problem with the city of Houston. I mean, they showed me a lot of love. It was during COVID it was a tough time, but it was just tough because I had just came back and I'm like, okay, I'm getting back to myself. I'm healthy again. And I'm like, okay, I'm ready to hoop. Like I ain't trying to sit down. I'm not trying to miss no time. I missed 2 years, you know what I mean? From my Achilles injury and then dealing with COVID and all the other personal problems I went through. And then after the first year, they just wanted to go to a rebuild. So I kind of got stuck in a position where it's like, I want to be playing. Like I know I can still start and play at a high level for a team. And it's like, kind of like we were just saying, like, I don't want to come off the bench. You know what I mean? Like, 'cause now if I do, this is gonna be my trademark to—

Everybody else.

Every other team in the league is, John Wall is a bench player. Unless I'm going to back up like a John Moran or Steph Curry, the one of those guys is that guy, then I could be okay with that. But I didn't feel like I was in that right situation at the right time. And they even told me that, I don't feel like you should. But what they did, how they built their team out and made the changes, they're in a great position. So I can see what they future and what they plan was. It was just a bad spot for me.

And then what was the atmosphere like, you know, having a teammate trying to be traded, you know, similar to what Miami going through with Jimmy Butler.

Well, to be honest, for me it wasn't bad. Like James showed up every day, did his work. He was professional. He came, did his work. He didn't kind of act like he had any problems with us. Like whatever problems he had with the front office or whatever anybody else was doing was trading him, didn't affect our team. You know what I mean? He came in, he did his job, he did his work, and he got up outta there. So I can't say nothing bad about a guy that's still been professional, come in doing his work. And going about his way. That's the way I would look at it. I mean, I feel like you just gotta continue to do what you gotta do and eventually it happens the way you want it to happen. Like, I know they probably like, damn, Jimmy, you just still missing planes? They like, they ain't messing with that. You know what I mean?

That's crazy.

And I had to explain to my homeboy, 'cause he was like—

I've been on that though. I was on that.

But he was like, don't y'all just get the flight private whenever y'all want? I'm like, no, bro. Like, unless you got a family matter or something going on, You supposed to be on a team flight.

Yeah, you gotta be on a plane. Yeah, I went through some shit like that when I was having beef with the organization. I wasn't flying my own plane, but I was, when you got to the airport, having my driver come get me and dunking out.

Oh, when y'all landed in the city?

That's funny.

Well, you know, that happens sometimes. You know what I mean? You might get in late, you might wanna go do your thing, but missing the team flight completely and they waiting for you. It's like we waiting an hour for him.

It's like, man, I'll meet y'all there, I'm on my own plane.

Also.

Or he pull up beside you in his jet, like his jet waiting right there.

Also.

Ew.

I'm sorry, but put me on the team plane, man. Them private planes expensive, man.

Oh my God, tell me about it.

I did my share of that. I did my fair share of that, and I was like, this is nice.

This ain't it.

And you don't get the food you get on the team plane.

Team playing football. Well, you know, for us, I was telling them we had to order stuff before we got there. Like, we order, go get the catering food, we out. But yeah, I think like, you know what I mean? Like in that position, it could be like kind of a distraction. You know what I mean? Like, you know what I mean? 'Cause like, I never been played for the Heat, but I like understand what the Heat culture is and what they believe in. I think like me, I look at if I'm ever going through something like that, if I'm between these four lines, I'm giving everything I got because this could fuck around and be your last game. You know what I mean? So as long as you just being professional, I think that's the key. You gotta look at it into it and hopefully they do the right thing by you, by you being professional and doing the right thing by them. But like, we don't know, like I don't, I can't really say too much 'cause I'm not in the locker room. I don't know what those conversations are like. They're just like, if it was a different scenario than what I knew what it was.

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Tune in each week. Check the link in the bio for where to watch Vice TV. You've always been passionate about the younger guys coming after you. And having a high school tournament, you know, and being involved in the AAU scene, just always been seen giving back. Are there any young guys that you are mentoring in the league coming up right now?

Oh yeah. Like, you know, I mean, I still try to talk to Draymond Green as much as possible. You know, I was there when he was a rookie. He's blossomed into what everybody thought he could be. And I think he just found his niche. I still talk to KJ, Kenyon Martin Jr., you know what I mean? Helping him out a lot. And then Rob, you know, Rob Dillingham, I known him since 7th grade when he played for Combine, Jeff McGinnis' old high school team. So just try to talk to those guys. And like, I always tell all the young guys, like, I'm a phone call away. Like, I'm not one of those guys that's bitter that you getting to this level or doing that. Like, it's my job to pass along what I learned and the mistakes I made to help you out. So I even talk to all these high school kids. Like, I got the old Glaxo tournament, which is mine. We just had it and I got like a lot of top kids in it. So it was dope. We had Westchester come out there, Trevor Reeses' son. So they played pretty cool. But yeah, I just got a lot of guys I just talked to, you know what I mean? I try to go to games whenever I'm in certain cities and they see me and I say, what's up? So.

College career. So Troop 41, due to John Wall.

Yeah, due to John Wall. Troop 41. I don't know where they got this from.

That was out of nowhere.

Where were you when you heard the track for the first time? I mean, you had a, come on, man. You got a song in college about you.

I wish they had NIL now.

Man, what?

It would've been crazy, huh? But nah, it's crazy 'cause I didn't even know they, like, I knew them, they younger than me and they kind of went to school like with my sister and a couple of my homeboys. And I forgot, I forgot where it was. I think I was still in college when they made this song, like in a regular season or in a tournament. And they was like, "Yo, you got a song." I'm like, "What the hell I got a song for?" And it was just lit, I mean, I went up there and danced when I was up there, so it kind of blossomed.

You had the John Wall, you had to dance. You know, like, think about it, you would've got bread. What are your thoughts about NIL and how it's changing?

Legally, he got the bread, 'cause they was getting the bread at Kentucky.

Oh man, at least—

Legally, he would've been able to get more bread.

No, no, no. Legally, it would've been posted.

And listen, I don't care. Listen, legally, not legally, I didn't get a dime for me.

Like this is—

Of course you didn't. Of course.

No, I'm done. I don't care. Listen, if NCAA's listening, not listening, this is the honest truth. Like on everything I love, I not got nothing.

Of course. John Calipari. No, BDL, we can have this conversation off camera.

Coach Cal. Coach Cal. What I did do is went to summer school, had a job and got paid $20 an hour, but only signed in for 1 hour. But like the money they getting, like, $50,000. But I couldn't wait for that Pell Grant.

Man, that Pell Grant was everything.

Like I was wearing Polo Assassin, US Polo, I was getting Levi jeans, like yeah, this is what was going on in college. But I feel like, like $1,000 going to my mom from Pell Grant, like it was nothing else. I couldn't take the whole, you know what I mean? But I think NIL is dope to a certain extent because it's supposed to be name and liking, you know what I mean? And what you selling, jerseys. Now it's to like a full bidding war. It's like every year, let's say like Draymond Green, like, okay, look at the kid from Ohio State, Jeremiah Smith, right? Somebody offered him 4.5 to hit the portal.

Yeah.

Like, why am I leaving the Ohio State? Like, I just won that championship. Probably can go back the next 2 more years if I really want to, you know what I mean? So I get it for some kids that's probably not gonna make it to the league and it's probably the most money they might see. But I don't, I think they gotta take the portal out though. Because like everybody just going to the portal every year just to see who gonna offer me the most money. Like I know one kid that was at this school last year was making $20,000, right? He hit the portal and made $1.5 million. He only played 2 minutes a game.

Jesus Christ.

Happy for him though, don't get me wrong. He's making the most money he probably will unless he do something outside of basketball or go overseas. You know what I mean? 'Cause he probably not gonna be a pro. But now it was like every year, okay, who's gonna offer me the most? I'm gone. Like imagine Draymond Green's in high school, they making $6 million.

$6 million.

So you're pulling up to your school with the best car. Yeah. You think you really listen to your college coach unless you got a great foundation of like a, assistant or mom or brother that's keeping everything in control. A lot of these kids lose they passion and the love for the game because they're already reaching what we try to get to the league for.

Mm-hmm.

Is to take care of our families, take care of ourselves. They're getting this in high school.

Yeah. A lot of these kids gonna be short-sighted and think they doing it. "Man, you gonna miss out on the $500 million that's coming up in the NBA." Man, again, say it twice.

Hey, I'm in my tournament, right? I'm in my tournament, I'm seeing kids iced out, like walking in iced out, Gucci shoes, Gucci shoes. I'm talking about mirrored pants. I'm like, all I had was a Nike sweatsuit. This is all I cared for.

Like, you know what I mean?

Going to a high school game. Like even if you go to the summer, like if you go like to AU tournament they got in the summer, I didn't even think about walking into the Louis store. Yeah.

Yeah.

We didn't even know what it was.

I didn't know what Louis was.

You couldn't walk in there.

I knew the flea market one where they put the Louis on the force and then hope those work. But I hope they figure it out and do it better. I mean, I feel like it's great for kids to get paid for what, like, I feel like we all should have been paid for what we brought to the game, like likeness and selling our jerseys. But I think some of it is going a little too far in my opinion.

For sure. I was thankful. I was thankful to get a little Nike, like nice little Nike package from uncle. Michael West or Vince Baldwin.

He was cool.

Look out, they send you a Nike package every now and then. I get a couple sweatsuits out of there, a couple kicks. That's all I get.

I do got one more. And this is for you too, Draymond Green. I just thought of this. John, give me your top 10 all-time Kentucky team. And then do you think, that Kentucky, with all his great blue Kentucky blue spirit and heritage, could they beat Michigan State? Hell.

All-time team?

No chance.

What?

Draymond Green, believe that. Are you crazy? Hell no.

All-time?

No chance.

All-time? All-time?

No chance.

Like you saying college, like playing in college?

I said, must we do this?

Yes.

Yes, please.

What?

Are you crazy?

Yes. Are you crazy? Come on, what?

Yeah, who's the number 1 pick?

Yeah, who's the starting 5? Who's the second 5? And can that team beat Michigan State all-time team?

I got DeMarcus at my 5.

All right, so you taking DeMarcus, number 1 pick. I'm gonna take the Earvin Magic Man Johnson himself.

Okay, I got AD at my 4.

AD at the 4. At the 4 for us, I am going to go the all-time starting 5.

Ooh, let's do this. A.C. Green.

Hmm. Boy, you about to make me look stupid.

Did A.C. Green go to Michigan State?

No chance.

Real talk.

No chance. I think at the 4, I'm gonna go with myself, of course.

Okay. Of course.

At the 3, I'm going Jamal Mashburn.

Jamal Mashburn at the 3. I am going Steve Smith, Motor City Smith.

Oh shit, it's getting real. At the 2, I'm going Tayshaun Prince.

Tayshaun Prince at the 2. At the 2, I am going— it's getting real.

Damn.

Do I want Scott Skiles at the 1 or 2?

Magic at the 1. Well, he gotta match up with me if he at the 1.

Magic at the 1, so Scott Skiles.

Oh. I'm at the 1.

Scott Skiles. I'm at the 1.

And then at center, you gotta go with that jumping dude, that Z-Bo.

Jumping Johnny Green, you know Jumping Johnny Green. Jumping Johnny Green.

You got Z-Bo too.

Z-Bo animal. But Z-Bo, Z-Bo don't play one.

I give y'all 6 men, so. Z-Bo for sure. 6 and 7 men.

It's too much. I don't even know. I got too many people. I just put anybody there. I got too many people.

Y'all gonna lose for sure.

You crazy as hell.

There's no better coach than Cal, so we gonna outcoach y'all for sure. It's happening.

That's cool. Y'all, you can outcoach us, but whatever.

We gonna outplay y'all. So we gonna beat y'all.

We gonna be way tougher. We gonna be up and down that court. We up and down that court.

Oh yeah, we—

Scott Skiles ain't tough as shit.

Scott Skiles is tough.

Don't worry about Scott.

Scott Skiles is tough.

I know I'm just talking shit. I know Scott Skiles, I'm just talking shit. I wanna see what Draymond about to say. You see his whole face expression? He like, Scott Skiles?

Hey dude, the Jamal Mashburn, Tayshaun Prince, A.B. Cousins.

Listen, nobody, Magic, Magic, Magic and Magic, but I'm putting Tayshaun on Magic.

Tayshaun gonna get bodied, put in that post.

I'm saying I just gotta put him on him though.

Bodied in the post.

Who your 5 man? 'Cause Boogie is bullying whoever your 5 man is.

Who?

Then AD, you not finishing over AD, Draymond.

I would've gave AD hell. Cal was— we almost played AD and them and we lost to Louisville.

I know, but AD back there having bad practice.

AD was about to catch all type of hell.

He was about to give him all type of elbows.

One elbow, shot fake, get outta here, young dude. —all type of hell on that block.

Hey, AD was smacking shit, pushing the break. Nah, for sure.

Who your 5 though? Your 5 gotta match your Book. 'Cause Book on the bully shit too.

I'm trying to think of that one.

Y'all two should've matched that. Y'all would've got ejected first quarter. First, like first 2 minutes of the game, Dre.

Oh yeah, it wouldn't be Draymond Green and DeMarcus Cousins are out.

They out. Yeah, I would've been out.

They out. They out. They ain't gonna play no 2 minutes of the game. Hey, Draymond, y'all would've been like, when Bud dropped the elbow on Swash right when we played Louisville. He was supposed to be ejected the first 2 minutes. We had 8 texts in the first minute of the game.

That's crazy. That's crazy.

Hey, this is a funny story, right? Tony Dutt was on our staff, right? It's his cousin or nephew was on the Louisville team starting. We could not get E-Blade to calm down. He told Tony Dutt, "I'm gonna whoop his ass. Which side you picking, his or mine?" I'm like, "Bro, you can't tell the man to pick his cousin or nephew, bro." Like, what you supposed to do?

I forgot E. Bland was there too. That was my rook.

Yeah, that was a pit bull.

That was my rook. I think, I don't know, we might, we, Bud gonna have an advantage for sure. He'll have an advantage for sure.

That's all we need.

But we gonna get him in foul trouble, all that. Like, there's ways around just his talent advantage against us. Like, I still think we win it. It just won't be talent for talent there. Like he gonna have that advantage for sure. 100%. No matter who I choose, he'll have an advantage at the 5. But everywhere else.

What?

Everywhere else is good. I'm gonna catch hell.

Where? Don't act like Jamal Maguire and Steve Smith ain't a great matchup.

That's a great matchup. But Smitty and, oh man, Smitty.

But Smitty was a point guard in college.

He was, that's true.

So you got Magic and Smitty at the guard.

But you figure that out. Like that's fine. Like we'll be all right. You putting both of them on the court together.

I have to say Draymond Green.

That's a lot of 5s.

Draymond, I feel like John Wall really know Kentucky basketball history. I feel right now, Draymond, you kind of stuck.

You kind of stuck.

No, I'm not stuck.

I'm stuck on a 5.

Because—

I'm stuck on a lot of positions, bro, because I forgot like Derrick Anderson.

No, for sure. Like I can go way deeper into the vault.

Yeah, I know what I'm saying. I got like 15 teams.

I can go way deeper into the vault. The vault, but I've been stuck at a 5, man. I think like that's where—

Yeah.

That's why I said we gonna struggle at the 5 for sure. But everywhere else I can go deep into the vault now.

I built an AI called Kobe. Let me ask Kobe. You got Greg Kessler.

Greg Kessler.

You got, yeah, Greg Kessler.

Gregory Kessler. But that's what I'm saying. Kessler was like a 4. You got Paul Davis. Paul Davis. But that's what I can't be like, I'm a big Paul Davis fan. I can't be like Paul Davis against, Andre Hudson. DeMarcus Cousins. Now Paul Davis in real life would've gave him some hell.

Kevin Willis. Kevin Willis.

Kevin Willis for sure. But Kevin Willis, he would've— Kevin Willis, no way. Cousins would've gave him some hell.

Yeah, but he wouldn't have bullied him.

No, not bullied him, but he would've gave him hell. He wouldn't bully, no chance. Ain't nobody from Michigan State getting bullied.

Adrian Payne, that's who I was thinking of.

AP. Adrian Payne, he was too little, but he was a good college player. I like Adrian Payne.

For sure, AP. No, that's what I'm saying. I was going—

But if I was doing Michigan State, I would say Mateen Cleaves.

Of course.

Magic Johnson.

But I can't start— I can't start over Magic.

No, you start Magic played a 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

For sure.

Steve Smith played a 1, 2, 3.

For sure.

I'mma put Mateen Cleaves, Steve Smith, Magic.

I pick Smitty.

Smitty? Yeah, Steve Smith. Yeah. I pick Smitty.

I pick Magic.

Yep.

I picked myself.

Oh, you put Scott Skiles though. Yeah.

I picked Scott Skiles.

Scott Skiles is a good one too. You need a center though.

I got Rondo. I got like—

He got more. He got—

Ron Mercer, Antoine Walker.

Uh-oh, here you go with the revolt. Okay. Oh, there we go. Okay.

I was winning when you was gonna say that. Okay, okay. I go De'Aaron Fox, I go Bam, I go Malik Monk.

Okay. Go foul on him, Draymond Green.

I go Maxey. Sam Vincent, Maxey.

Yeah, we keep going.

Okay, okay.

It ain't sweet now.

Yeah.

No, I know what y'all got.

I don't know, you know, I'll put it into my AI algorithm and I'll see. I say y'all team.

What your AI algorithm say?

Yeah, who got the best, who got the better team? We know UCLA is incomparable, so we won't even go there. Y'all can't compete with us.

Who can't?

Not Kentucky.

You crazy as hell. Come on, don't do that. Y'all got some shit. Lou Alcindor. We can compete with any school.

Lou Alcindor.

Lou Alcindor, that's all. That's all you need to know. Stop being, yeah, yeah. Stop at Kareem.

Stop.

Bill Walton.

Oh, Kareem and Magic. Like, come on now, we ain't gonna do that.

No, we gonna do that. Lou Alcindor in college, bro. Lou Alcindor in college is a phenomenon. We're not even, we're not gonna even—

So was Magic, come on.

No, no, no, no, no. We're not gonna even discuss that.

Don't do that. We're not gonna even— Magic, we brought D-Book off the bench on our team. Like, that's how loaded he was.

He wasn't good enough yet, it's cool.

Nah, he was cool. He just wasn't no starter yet. He wasn't no starter yet for sure.

Hey, Book about to break the all-time leading scorer record in Phoenix history. So before he do it, I'm gonna just say it right here. Congrats to D Book.

That's fire, dog. Congrats, congrats.

That's fire for sure.

Hey, but BD, hold on.

Magic and— Listen, come on. 3 national championships. Magic won one and got outta there.

He won one sophomore year and got outta there.

Hey, hold on, Draymond Green. Who was he playing against? People, I hate me or her. He beat Larry Bird.

Larry Bird in the national championship.

No, I know, I know, I know who Magic beat. I know who Magic beat. I'm talking about Kareem.

Kareem was playing against BD.

Yeah, that's what I said. I know who Magic beat. Come on. He started at center.

Elvin Hayes, he was playing against, come on, man. He was playing against all kind of—

They had one person on their team.

Come on, dude.

No, they are greats. I'm not— Come on, man. Elvin Hayes, you know, I know him. I couldn't wear number 11 in DC 'cause of him.

See, exactly.

I know how great he was, but the teams we name, it's like 3 or 4 guys that's like that.

Come on, man.

No, no.

You name a team, they got one guy.

Who's gonna stop it? Who's gonna stop Kareem?

I cried, I couldn't wear no motherfucking—

Who's gonna stop Kareem Abdul-Jabbar?

Nobody's stopping him, but I'm putting AD on him, but nobody's stopping him.

Kareem is a GOAT, but I'm just saying, you're not gonna act like—

I am gonna act like that.

Y'all got Magic, y'all got Kareem. We make it up the same. Like, we could sit right in that conversation and have a—

We cannot at all. When it comes to in college, no.

Right there.

In college, are you the—

what? Magic? Are you kidding me? Are you kidding? What? Are you kidding me?

Magic could have did it again. It was just like, no, Draymond Green won in Los Angeles.

Put your glasses back on, bro. Put your glasses back on.

Now who's the other?

Man, Charles, what you writing in the chat, man? Charles, you—

Yeah, we want to hear them other UCLA players.

Bill Walton, Ed O'Bannon.

Nope. Nope. Marcus Johnson. We only know, nope, nope. It's only 'cause of the—

Marcus Johnson.

Nope, he can't stand in this conversation.

Man, they all won.

So yeah, that's fine.

They all won.

So did Matt Ishbia.

Oh my God.

So I'm saying Ishbia won a national championship too.

I know, yeah, yeah, I know. But we talking—

So he should be in it.

So Matt Ishbia should be in his starting 5.

Imagine the Johnsons. Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey. Like you not about to mention your own banner. Man, you better stop it.

And your uncle rounding out the 5, I'm gonna take myself off the 5, I'm gonna put Draymond's god uncle in the 5, the creator of the Warriors run, Bob Myers. Talk about impact, now say something.

I got nothing but love for Bob.

That was a good one right there. You can't do nothing but show love there, JJ.

I got nothing but love for Bob.

Come on, man. Who gonna stop Bob Myers? When he doubled down on Draymond, when he tripled down on Draymond, come on, dude.

I got nothing but love for Bob. We gonna move on, on that note. J Wall, for you, what are you doing to continue to stay ready? Optimistic about returning to the NBA? Are you kind of moving on from that? Are you optimistic? You still wanna return and kind of where, where you stand with that?

I still got like a year, I think like a year or two. I'm gonna give it, you know what I mean? But I'm still working out every day, you know what I mean? But doing broadcasting, getting into that field, you know what I mean? Trying to do some games. I went to the G League Showcase, speak on that. I mean, I think that's something like I still wanna be involved in basketball, you know what I mean? Like broadcasting, try to be a GM one day. But also, you know me, just doing business stuff, networking. I mean, investing in certain things. But most important thing I'm doing now is being a father. You know what I mean? Being hands-on, being able to be around my kids all day, every day. I mean, they get into all the sports. You know what I mean? My oldest son just asked me 2 weeks ago to play basketball.

That's killer.

I mean, that kind of brought some, brought some tear and joy to my eyes. 'Cause I didn't wanna force him. You know what I mean? A lot of parents force their kids. I want him to fall in love with what he wanna fall in love with. He loves soccer right now. Oh, he's a soccer star. So he just got into basketball, baseball. My youngest one, that's the football guy. You know what I mean? He playing flag football. They telling him to put a flag. He hit a kid so hard. I'm like, I got one of those bruisers. You know what I mean? So I'm enjoying that though. You know what I mean? I'm still like staying ready, putting the work in, you know what I mean? Enjoying the game, watching it. But you know what I mean? You never know what happens, but I got like a, I give it like another year, like next season, see what happens if it don't happen. Then I'm cool with like, you know what I mean? Giving it up. I mean, I feel like I had a great run. I wasn't mad about it.

Incredible.

I mean, injuries are part of the game like we talked about, but you know what I mean? Basketball don't bounce forever. You know what I mean? I always wanna be known as something more important than just a basketball player. That was a great thing and a great run in my career. That's how it ends. But you know what I mean? I got a lot more life to live. So I mean, I can't trip off that.

Yeah. You got a lot more to give to the game. I know when I was, I call it basketball purgatory when you want, You know, it's like, I got 1 or 2 more years. I just wanna walk off the court on my own terms and feel that one more time and find a young dude that— the last young dude I can mentor, I think, you know, all of that kind of like just tug at your soul. So I just wanted to know, you know, from you, like going back to the league, kind of what would your role, like what is your mentality, you know, going back into the league? You know, in these, and I would say not the last few, I would say last few years, not two, right? 'Cause having someone like you would be valuable to teams.

Oh, for me, like, just be real. Like, you know what I mean? Me, I'mma just always wanna be an honest person. So for me, if I go to a team that need help and I feel like I can fill that void, cool. But if I go to a team where they like, you know what, we don't even really, we just need you to be a great vet presence, I'm fine with that. You know what I mean? Because upfront they're being honest with me. You know what I mean? It's kind of like, you don't never want to be blindsided, you know, but it's all part of a business. But just let me know what it is when I sign up for it. And if I sign those papers, I know what it is. You know what I mean? And I feel like I can help a lot of young guys out. I think a lot of teams need a vet to mentor these young guys. And that's even show 'em how to watch film, show 'em how to work, show 'em how to be a point guard. All those things I think I can help with. And I'm cool with every role I get opportunity to be in. Like you say, you just want to go out the way you want to go out in. Any on the cruise, Salem.

That's a fact. Do you see teams right now that you like, that team for sure I could be a vet and help these guys out to help culture all of those things?

Yeah, I see a few teams. I mean, you got DC, especially a team I've been there before. I feel like you got Charlotte, they can help the young guys out in LaMelo and Brandon Miller and those guys. I think Utah, Utah can use some vets to help those guys out. You know what I mean? But I think a lot of these teams are doing a better job of adding the vets that they know that they need nowadays. Yeah. 'Cause a lot of times, you know, they was booting the vets out. And I think because they was giving the vets kind of mixed signals, like we might want you to play a lot of minutes, then we might not. I think if you just tell 'em like, you know what I mean? Like kind of like a Taj Gibson role, like he's doing, you know what I mean? Out there in Charlotte, you look like a Tristan Thompson role. He's helping those guys out in Cleveland, you know what I mean? Like if I get in, I get in, if I don't, I'm here to help, help to mentor and try to keep those guys on the right path. And I think our league needs to continue to have vets, even if it's me or not me down the road. I think all teams need vets to help these young guys, to keep 'em in that platform, to keep 'em to understand. And like you said, we kind of gotta get that old culture back to them to understanding it's not just sweet. Like these rookies get to walk in there on this, no rookie duties, it's cakewalk, it's handed to 'em. Like we all had to earn it. No matter if you was a top 5 pick, second round pick undrafted, we had to earn.

What we had. Atlanta and New York too. I would add those two teams, Atlanta and New York.

New York, hey, New York, you might not be a vet just on the sideline. Tizz might have you doing suicide. Those guys got what, like 4 guys in the top 5?

But that's what I'm saying. New York, they gonna phase out or they gonna tire out.

Yeah, they gonna burn out. They gonna burn out.

Jalen Brunson being a small guard that score a lot. I just see you being, you know, you could be a key component defensively, you know, and to help stabilize, especially in the playoffs, right? 'Cause you are born, you know, veterans are born for the playoffs. And I think that's where, you know, you really start seeing the true value of an experienced guard or experienced vet. 'Cause when you put them in, in the playoffs, they've been there, they know, and they know how valuable possessions are, so. Yeah. I say the Knicks and—

Draymond Green had one, S-Dot.

Absolutely.

Y'all had S-Dot. I had S-Dot for like a year in DC, man. He was special. And that's another guy we forgot, like didn't have an injury.

Yeah, he would've been crazy.

Yeah.

He'd have been crazy.

Bad boy.

That's a fact.

But he mastered that mid-range though. I don't give a damn what nobody say.

He could not block it. You try to block it, you fouling him every time.

You gonna foul him every time. Like go and give him 2 free throws. He all right.

Forget about it. Deadliest mid-range in the game. Crazy. Before we get outta here, always love a good list. Who's your top 5 number 1 picks?

Since when?

Since, go back to, yeah, 2000.

2000?

2000, that's my era.

That's 2 decades.

I can name every number 1 pick from 2000 to now. And you, the number 1 pick you should be.

He looking at his computer right now, John. I'm telling you, don't let him fool you.

I'm looking at the, uh, Draymond Green.

He got the Wikipedia on full blast.

He got the big screen behind him. Yeah, he ain't 3,000 and 10.

I go 2010 to now.

2010.

I go me, Ky, AD, Anthony Edwards, and Wimby.

And Wimby.

I really wanted to put Paulo up there, but I go Wimby, Ant-Man. I gotta put Ant-Man up there though.

For sure.

Not Ben Simmons. All right, Draymond Green.

But if you take me off, if I take myself off, I'll put Paulo in there. You know what I mean? But are you taking yourself off?

No, absolutely not.

So you got—

No, I'm not. Me, Kyrie, I'm the one, Kyrie the two, Ant-Man three. AD is my 4 and let Wimby play the 5.

It's a great top 5. No Zion, no Aiden.

No Zion, no Ben Simmons.

Don't start your shenanigans.

Karl-Anthony Towns.

See, KAT is up there, but like, I just like AD. I mean, you got AD and then the shit Wimby doing is—

Markelle Fultz, you got Markelle Fultz.

I think he would've been special if he didn't have that show then.

Anthony Bennett. Anthony Bennett.

Hey, he might be close to—

Man, he could've been a Draymond Green type of, you know—

Man, like, didn't he start his career where he missed like his first, what, like 20-some shots?

Yeah. Oh yeah, that hurt.

First 3 games he didn't score. That set you back.

I think that's what kills a guy. That's a good set you back point.

Your first 3 games you don't score at all. Like, you couldn't get a free throw. Kinda killed this confidence.

Yeah, no, that'll set you back, especially as a number 1 pick.

What? You supposed to score at least 10 on the first game.

Yeah, that's tough.

Like, you might have a bad game. Like, my first game we played Dwight, I'm like, shit, I can't shoot no layups on this mug. This is what Dwight was doing. I was like, damn. I remember I spit on the court, he blocked the shot. I said, fuck.

Bro, that's probably 3 games in your rookie year that you showed up like, oh, that's the number 1 pick. You got a donut. Goddamn. Hey, dude, you out here. You out here showing up serving donuts. Ouch.

That's gotta kill— You know what, but you know they saying, this nigga ain't no more. I ain't hitting on no more big body ass. You know that start fucking with your mind and then—

He was like, am I?

Like, I ain't scored shit. Am I ass? I ain't scored. I ain't scored anything.

I think if he wasn't the number 1 pick, he would've had a possible chance to have a decent career.

But like, who went 2 that year?

Shit, you know, Hashim Thabeet.

Nah, hell no. Thabeet was in the league way before him.

Victor Oladipo? Is that Vic?

Did he go 3 or 4? Did Vic go 2 that year?

Let's see.

To the Magic?

Yeah, I think Vic, maybe.

Is that Wade's draft?

Yeah, 4.

That is. He was 4.

Wade is 4. So Otto was 3?

Yeah.

Yeah. And Vic was 2.

Yeah. Yeah.

Man, damn. I don't think they knew what to do.

It was tough.

You know, you look at like, who's supposed to be 1 out of these 5? I mean, I think I would've took—

Alex Lin. Alex Lin. You had Anthony Bennett, Victor Oladipo, Otto Porter, Cody Zeller, Alex Lin, Nerland— Nerland Noel. Ben McLemore.

He was supposed to be the number 1 pick, but he had tore his knee up.

ACL that year. Ben McLemore, 7. Kentavious Pope, 8.

It was cold at Georgia.

Jay Burke, 9. CJ McCullough, 10.

He was cold at Michigan.

Michael Carter-Williams was the Rookie of the Year at 11. Giannis was 15. Steven Adams, 12.

Ole Miss. Yeah, nobody would've did that, but that bitch should've been number 4. You know, you go back sometime, they look like, how was he drafted? Well, listen.

47. He was it. Who?

They got Rudy Gobert.

He was 27. I ain't doing it today. I ain't doing it.

Keep my mouth closed today.

I see.

You be out there getting barbecue.

John Wall said it. It's unanimous.

I'm just saying, they're like— Listen, this is my point. I do, like I said, then we could go wherever y'all wanna go. You defensive player here, bro. You gotta be able to guard people. You can't just get put on the bench in fourth quarter.

It's hard out here.

If I gotta take you out 'cause you getting cooked.

How are you the defensive player here?

That's all I have this conversation with my friends all the time.

Like, bro, no. That don't make no sense at all.

Nope, no brainer.

Yeah, it's tough. You mentioned a little bit that you went back to the G League Winter Showcase. Start doing some analyst work. You know, talk about that. How is that feeling for you? You know, what you like about that?

It was dope, man. It was something new. I mean, try to branch out and try something else. But I mean, I see Dray do it, you know what I mean? I see Jamal Crawford, one of my good friends in the league doing it. And I just get to talk about the game of basketball, you know what I mean? Something that I love to do. And everybody always say, you always talking about it 24/7. Like when I'm watching the games, I'm always acting like I'm, coaching or playing still. So just to be in that environment where I get to talk about the game and be around the game I love, I'm willing to try to do possibly anything except for coaching. I just can't do no coaching. These young guys be making you wanna— Get over here.

With they man purse.

Nah, Dray, no, Dray, you coaching. Hey, you ask somebody to pull Nelson over there.

You gonna be like Charles Oakley in the court, like, "Get up, get your ass up here." I can't.

You owe me that $10 for lunch.

I can't do a dude walking in the gym with a man purse, not working hard. I'll be fired, I'll be fired.

Come on, BD, you can't do that today.

Then I go in there, have one of the ball boys cut all your fucking Louis Vuitton luggage. Cut his purse up. I bet you we get a reaction.

Oh, you for sure you get a reaction.

Steal his purse. Oh, my purse. My purse.

J-Wall, we appreciate you coming on the show, brother. Good luck whenever you do decide that you done with it. Congratulations on your Jersey retirement, bro. 'Cause it's happening for sure. But man, just, it's been an incredible journey. And regardless of what happened with it, like what you did in the league, what you did coming from Raleigh and just continued, like you look at the young guards that come outta Carolina, like CP a little removed from them. You know what I'm saying? And like you kind of filled that gap. You know what I'm saying? Like with Steph.

Yeah.

Steph is, is from Charlotte, but it wasn't like that, right? Like Steph, like he was the kid of an NBA player. And so his upbringing was just different. It wasn't like he was the guy that was giving a young kid from North Carolina hope. You know what I'm saying? Like, because his upbringing was different and you were that guy who was like giving these young guys hope. And now you look at the Rob Dillinghams, you know, you look at the, the Aiden Holloways, you know, and all these young guys coming outta Carolina. Like that come off the heels of what you did and what you brought and the swag that Rob Dillingham walk around with. Like that come off the heels of what you brought to the game. And, and we honor that, bro. Like a lot of people try to make it, you know, try not to respect what's been done, brother. Your career stellar, lived up to the hype, a number one pick and live up to it. We, we, we just talked about it. How many guys don't live up to it, bro? So I just wanna tip my hat to you, bro. And thank you. We thank you for coming on the show. Thank you.

Appreciate that, appreciate it. Thanks for having me, for sure.

I wanna just echo that, like your character, man, just keep walking in your light, you know, keep basketball around you. You are basketball and like everything you gave to the game and given to the game, you know, it's more to come. And you know who you are as a person and your game, you like the pride of every kid growing up that was a have-not, you know, or a kid that wanna have. And so you are, you, your story and every, every day you walk, you know, just know that you giving that to people and, and your character is, is what's gonna continue to, to make you blossom for your second best at, you know, in basketball.

Appreciate that. Appreciate every show.

Absolutely. That's a wrap from this episode of Draymond Green Show with my dog BD. Special guest J-Wall, we appreciate you, brother.

Peace.

Peace.