In this episode of the Draymond Green Show, host Draymond Green interviews former NBA player Shane Battier about the pivotal decision that led Battier to choose Duke over Michigan State. Battier explains that while he was being recruited by many programs, he trusted Michigan State coach Tom Izzo initially, but Izzo’s promise to bulk him up as a traditional power forward conflicted with advice from Dean Smith and Coach K, who saw Battier as a small‑forward who should develop a three‑point shot. This positional preference drove him to Duke. The conversation then shifts to both guests reflecting on their own college experiences, noting how they each started at power forward before moving to small forward or guard roles, and how the modern game’s shift to "small‑ball four" and positionless basketball emerged from such transitions. Battier emphasizes that the true "skeleton key" to longevity in the NBA is mastering post defense—using leverage, angles, and body positioning rather than sheer strength—and being adept at defending the pick‑and‑roll. Both guests stress that current young players often neglect these fundamentals, as the game moved away from post play, but a resurgence in post usage makes these skills increasingly valuable. They also credit legendary coaches (Izzo, Coach K, Dean Smith) for shaping their defensive mindsets. The episode concludes with practical advice for aspiring players: prioritize learning to guard the post and pick‑and‑roll to remain versatile and valuable in today’s evolving, positionless NBA.
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True. No, true story. And I love Izz, and I tell Izz this, I tell him, I tell him to his face, he messed up. You know, I'm being recruited by everybody and Izz had just gotten the job at Michigan State and I liked Izz, you know, I'm like, man, this guy is, he's legit. He's got it. But Izz messed up. One day he came to me and said, Shane, and you know this, he said, we had the best weight staff in the Big 10. Okay, we're, we're, we're gonna put 40 pounds of muscle on you and you're gonna be the baddest power forward in the Big Ten. And then I got Dean Smith and Coach K say, no man, like you're a small forward, man. You gotta shoot threes. I'm like, I'm with those guys. So that was the reason why that was like the main, I didn't wanna be a power forward. I didn't wanna, I didn't wanna, you know, put 40 pounds and, and bang guys. I wanted to be a small forward and shoot threes. So that's, that's, that's why I went South.
That's true story.
True story.
That is so interesting to me because I came into college as a power forward, right? And now I'm looking at all of these things like, wait, this guy's too small to be a power forward. He needs to be a small forward. So ironically, I start at the small forward position and where do we play? We're playing at Cameron Indoor. We're playing against Kyrie Irving. That's one of the 6 games Kyrie ever had and he had 31 points. And I caught myself going out there playing the 3 that year. My junior year. And I told Coach Izzo after that game, I said, "Hey coach, you know, I think I'm gonna just move back to the 4, man. This 3 spot ain't working for me. You gotta chase these little guards off screens, off pin-downs. Like, I'm not, I'm gonna just go back to the 4." So I was actually the total opposite, but I thought I wanted to be a 3.
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That's funny. Well, it's funny. I mean, obviously, like, I think you and I are two of the originators of small ball four.
I mean—
Absolutely. I mean, it's—
Absolutely.
Whether you came first or I came second, well, whatever. We were the first, like, small forwards became power forwards. And now the game is obviously so changed and it's positionless. But like the ability to guard a 4, and no matter how small you are, that, that, that's the skeleton key, man. I mean, you're obviously you're one of the greatest defenders of, in NBA history. And, and you could guard, you guarded 1 through 5. Literally they say like 1 through 5, but you could guard 1 through 5. But like what your special skill was, was you're able to get up and use leverage, you know, against 7-footers who are outweighing you by 40 pounds. Absolutely. You know, it's not about strength, it's just about like knowing how to use your body, knowing about angles, knowing leverage and like, and so like, you know, I don't, I look back at my high school days, I was a back to the basket 5, but I learned how to do that. And so when I transitioned to be a small forward in the league and a 2 guard for majority of my career, I never lost that. And like that was, that's the skill that unlocks everything. So for these like young guys, you know, they wanna step out and shoot 3s and, and turn a face. But it's like, yo, if you wanna play and like be super valuable to your team, like learn to guard the post. Learn to guard pick and roll. Yes. 'Cause like you'll always play, you'll always play. And that's like, no one ever talks about that. And so I'm glad I'm here talking to you. You're like the one guy in the entire history of the NBA who gets what I'm saying. Am I right?
At 1,000%. It's crazy because I, you'll see young guys now, and to your point, they don't have a clue of how to guard the post. And here's, to take it even a step further, people stopped teaching post defense because guys stopped posting up. Well, now the game is changing back and you're starting to get guys posting up again. And no one knows how to play post defense anymore. And especially when you get guys coming from college, you know the first thing these guys come from college, they do, they put their chest out. And I'm like, yo, you cannot guard the post with your chest in the NBA.
That's a move.
Guys hitting your chest, they're spinning off you. You just can't guard that way. And so it's interesting that you say that because I think the key actually to my career and to your point, the key to my career was that my whole life, I was the biggest guy in Saginaw. So my uncle had me dribbling the basketball. Coach Speedy told me like, "Man, you can't just be a 5." But my whole life I would play the 5. Now I played a point guard offensively and post up some and bring the ball up the court, make plays. But I played the 5. And so you, once the NBA turned to small ball, you'd see teams like, "Oh, that guy is 6'6", "6'7" too. We'll put him at the 5. But my whole life I learned how to anchor a defense. Because I played the 5, you know? And so to your point, I think that's a great thing for young guys to learn. How to guard the post and how to guard pick and rolls.
Yeah. I mean, we played for two of the best, you know, college coaches of all time and Coach Izzo and Coach K too. That didn't hurt. But you know, the ability to guard, you know, pick and roll, be able to switch off on pick and roll, you know, to do every single coverage, you know, like you just don't see guys who are that defensively just, you know, versatile and have the IQ to be able to do all that thing in every situation. It's a huge, huge, huge advantage for these young guys if they get that teaching and that coaching.
