Passion Is the Gateway Drug Playcast, Episode 2, "Altered States of Transformation"

Introduction and we'll jump in.

Great.

So, so welcome, welcome world. Welcome everyone out there to the MetaFuturist Playcast series. This is a special edition hosted by myself, Bret Minster and X Rasma. And we have a playcast called Altered States of Transformation, which is really about delving into the future now of mental health reformation and evolution and revolution. And we're excited to be here. And my only other housekeeping is, yes, if people would like to see our first Copilot episode and other Metafuturist episodes, they can check out metafuturist.live. And the reason it's called Metafuturist, M-E-T-T-A, is because this word meta comes from, well, the Sanskrit or Pali, and it has several different meanings, but one of them is really a prayer for unconditional love and loving kindness and benevolence. So as a group of people I've invited to be part of this play cast, is really that we're not just futurists looking at trends and patterns as if we were, you know, dry, neutral, let's say, just futurists working for some corporation or something. We're meta-futurists because we're really coming from this place of unconditional love and loving kindness. So that's the kind of futurists we are. Although we're all different, we have different missions here. I want us to all be at least have that alignment to be futurist from this perspective of love. And with that, I welcome my co-host for Altered States of Transformation, which I love this title coming from something you said in the pilot episode. And it's nice to see you, X. Why don't you— is there anything you'd like to introduce about yourself? I'm not going to read bios and all that, but if you'd like to, you can say hello and just tell Tell everyone something about yourself in relation to mental health reformation and transformation.

Yeah, I have a lot of information on my website, which is www.raz.ma, like my last name with a period between the Z and the M. So raz.ma. I think the simplest way to kind of summarize my direction in this lifetime with regards to mental wellness is as a guardian angel. I'm really interested in helping people in their process of transformation and to help carry a light to light some of the dark paths that I myself have have walked to hopefully with greater grace and speed aid others through walking similar paths. So I just really, I'm really hoping and working for a world that we all can process in play and pleasure, and I'm doing my best to bring that about as, as soon as possible.

Right on. I mean, it's— I mean, we have a lot of different things in common. X and I only met a few months ago as part of something called the Design Science Studio. And I guess I should say it's also called the Playcast rather than a podcast because it is about us being playful. It's about playification compared to gamification. It's about being players, you know, players on the stage of life. and bringing forth the performances and the reality and the experiences that we all want to have. So the Playcast is also very much about tuning in to what it means to be players, really, and to play and to have a good time. So we're definitely here to have a good time and to inquire and to laugh and to weave in our personal stories as well while we talk about different topics around mental wellness. There's a kind of a subcategory based on my experience of what I call transforming perceived mental illness into a blessing because I was diagnosed with bipolar disorder when I was 19. I'm 45 now. So it's a really big mission for me in my life to start finally turning the tables and inverting the systemic nature of how we work with and support people who are having altered states of experience, altered states of mind, who heretofore have been diagnosed with this insidious, for me, by the way, I'm speaking for myself, this insidious, destructive, and ultimately unbeneficial term called mental illness. So we'll talk a little bit about that over this playcast today. You know, why is it even called mental illness? Is that even serving everyone? Is it even accurate or true, which is a big thing for me? I'm not just saying that to be rebellious. So we'll talk a little bit about why I think it's actually quite stupid, for lack of a better word, to be calling these experiences illness and to be pathologizing. So X, I'm sure— so X also helps people, by the way, and I'll let you say this in your own words. But at festivals and events, she's someone who has been there to help people who may have taken psychedelics or otherwise having what are notoriously called bad trips, but I'll let you speak to that. So why don't you tune in a little bit to sharing a little bit about what you have done in the past and on this space and tie that in a little bit to this idea of how we pathologize ourselves in a way with this type of language.

Sure thing. Yeah, um, my academic background, it's, it's worthy to say that, um, I studied transpersonal thematic psychology at a graduate level. And concurrently, for about, uh, over 15 years now, actually, at this point, I have been an altered state angel. So what that means is I am a person who designs and staffs sanctuary spaces at a variety of gatherings, large and small. So at largest, I am a Burning Man Green Dot Ranger of a very long time, over a decade, and that means that I am You know, either— that means I have extra. So the Rangers are the community mediators and the sort of folks from within the community of the burn that emerge and say, I love this culture, I want to support the thriving of it, and I want to support the thriving of all the participants. And green— being a green dot means that you have additional kind of mental health training and specification. So you'll frequently find me in sanctuary, or alternatively walking around, and people end up coming up to me and finding me also. I'm kind of like a magnet for people that need support. There's like just a beacon that's like, this person is safe, you know, which is great. I'm glad it comes across without, without needing to put put a big banner on my chest. But so I'll be in sanctuary and there's roving rangers that will find people or people will approach them and they'll be having a hard time, whether that's from not sleeping for 3 days, having, you know, a breakup in their polypod or a fight with their campmate, or that they're just feeling lonely, and they didn't, they didn't know that they would be experiencing challenge, or, you know, maybe they're dehydrated. And all the— like, there's a variety of conditions that would bring someone to sanctuary. And another one of which is, you know, psychedelics or other kind of more expected sources of change in mindset that is maybe more extreme or feels overwhelming to that person. And those folks get brought to me and other people who are Green Dot Rangers, and we sit with them and we, you know, we hear them out and we, you know, provide an empathetic ear and, you know, provide the resources that we think would help them. But oftentimes it's just the act of really being listened to. And this idea that I put forth of feeling, feeling felt. So that sensation when you really within yourself feel that someone is resonating with you and is empathizing with you, that, that I think is actually at the heart of all rapport and therapy in general is that sensation of being, being in this experience with someone else as much as you can. So yeah, I mean, I've saved people's lives like very, very directly who, you know, had suicidal ideation or who were out of, you know, out of their consensus reality mindset and You know, taking off to the lake and gonna go about to drown themselves. I've been been there for people, and yeah, just provided yeah, provided presence, compassionate presence.

What that brings up to me, X, when I think of This idea of systemic mental health and mental wellness change on this planet is really extrapolating your experience. Don't we really need green dots around the whole planet? I mean, isn't the whole planet at a type of event and a festival right now, for lack of a better word? But the idea, I know for me, so I'll speak again for myself, one of my dreams is really to create these spaces and places, you know, I call them holistic healing and centers and creative, co-creative incubators. So I think we'll probably end up getting into that a little bit. But have you ever, let's start there as far as your imagination. Have you ever conceived of yourself that way or this green dot thing? Like what if the whole planet had green dots? I mean, you must have had that thought just in a creative sense. So share anything along that line. It doesn't have to be too long, but just, I mean, because we want to help, we want to serve the whole planet. And these types of experiences can be invoked and provoked in many different ways for many different reasons. And I will also acknowledge, you know, mental health is a big, mental health and mental wellness is becoming a very big topic in the mainstream and status quo in universities. I, of course, have to admit, I come at it still from this idea of transforming perceived mental illness. And I'm really personally concerned about all of the children and brothers and sisters out there who continue to have similar experiences that I did, which is not empathetic, which is getting locked away, getting overmedicated, getting treated poorly, and all these other things that are part of the mental health system. So I— I'm still on a bit of a crusade just for these people that are diagnosed with mental illness compared to the overall topic of mental health, which is much broader to me and bigger than the little, the angle that I normally come from. So what do you make of having green dots around the planet? And would you be interested in bringing something like that to life, like this reimagining of— this, the green dots, but somehow decentralized at scale, you know.

100%. And that's why I wrote and continue to add to my book called Guide for Guides. It's all about ethical spaceholding. And I was invited through the Design Science Studio and through our Regenera Launch Week to participate in envisioning what, what an ideal kind of mental wellness future looked like, and it looked exactly like that, that everyone, based on their capacity and proclivity, would be aware of the basics of how to hold space for someone and also how to hold space for themselves, which then kind of gets into this broader mode of like self-care or proactivity in terms of wellness and things like that, which can often prevent some of the more extreme parts of that experience from reaching such a boiling point. But I think that a world in which we were all well-resourced and well-trained in how to be empathetic, for lack of a better kind of concrete word for what's at the heart of this, would be really fun. I mean, I have had a lot of experiences where I did really deep processing, and I have a really heavy trauma load background that I'm happy to share about. But just to keep things short, I've done a lot of intergenerational trauma healing through play and movement and what I call Trauma drama. So this idea of taking these characters that are within me, such as my inner critic, which is intergenerational, based on trauma, etc., and turning turning that into its own like kooky character and making it such that I can have a relationship and some distance. From that part of myself so that I'm not beating myself up, but that, that voice is still kind of present in, in my awareness without me taking it so personally. So, I mean, I have this vision where we, we, we together, like, for example, in this space, you know, we would come together around someone's healing, for example, and it could like naturally emerge, you know, these sort of spiritual emergencies come as they do, and we would help support someone in metabolizing the knowledge of their experience. And in witnessing someone's transformation and viscerally being present for the insights they receive, not only could that group be a part of holding, holding that person to that realization and to that development of character, but We would then learn as a community the wisdom of the trauma in a way that we don't when things are so one-on-one, behind closed doors, like isolated shame. I'm, I'm working with several people in a trauma therapy context right now who, you know, have said that they don't have anyone else to share this with, that they wouldn't want to burden their friends. Or their family with, with these things. And I actually think that trauma is a collective experience. It's meant to be healed collectively as well. And I know that although I haven't experienced all of the different types of trauma that exist on this planet, I have certainly viscerally learned from helping others in, in their process. And I think that also ties back into This idea of our society right now has a pretty limited bandwidth of neurodiversity, and as we know from permaculture, the ecology of any environment is a lot stronger the more diversity that it can support. So we as a culture cognitively would be much more creative and there would be a lot of upside to having frameworks in place to support neurodiversity. And a commonly cited example is so much of the great art of this world has come from people who are neuroatypical, for example, who would have been diagnosed, likely diagnosed as bipolar in these times if they had gone to a psychologist and gone through that process. And so, so much of the vulnerability that makes us human and can connect us is, I think, being lost and locked away. And, you know, we're taught to toughen up or we're medicated to be numb. And again, we're losing so much of the emotionality and the insights and connection and the intimacy that can come from that transparency among people and among different types of people and learning from the wisdom of a diversity of ways of seeing the world.

Thank you for sharing that, X. I got the chills when you were Talking about the part of, see if you can rephrase this again, because I was so into listening, I feel like I can't reflect it clearly. But you said something about in that space holding, in the play of the drama of the trauma and being in community together, you said a specific phrase like we metabolize the experience. Was it metabolize? That's when I got the chills.

Yeah.

Like this idea of metabolizing was so vivid to me. So did you say we metabolize the experience together or they do? Can you just see if you can jump back into that space and just—

Sure. Yeah. I've been, I've been really, uh, for a long time now thinking about the idea of deep emotions as what are they feeding? You know, what are these, uh, experiences meant for? Like, why do we have these emotions? Why do we have the experience of trauma? And I believe that there is a metabolization process that can happen when these experiences are held in a compassionate way that allows their wisdom to unfold. And I personally believe that this happens to the most benefit of the most people when it is held in community. In this celebratory community catharsis, although you know, using the term celebratory, some might be like, "What do you mean by that?" I just mean welcomed. You know that this type of cathartic communication and expression is welcome because there there is a reason that it is coming forth. There's I I. This is my belief. You know, there's there's a reason that these things happen, and I think it is to to have us to have us learn more about this world and to do so in a way that hopefully brings us together and into greater harmony and wholeness and cohesiveness. I've also been playing with this idea too. In my own sort of experience of having an intense experience, I'll just speak more bluntly. I've had an experience of sexual assault, and there's this interesting thing where it was it was due to the other person not feeling me or not caring about my feelings or not. You know, asking for consent whatsoever, that this experience of me leaving my body and going through a process of dissociation, that then, you know, now I have to have these trauma healing processes. It's, you know, at the root of it, when you look at what occurred, it was that this person was unable to feel or uninterested in feeling someone else. And so now, within my own healing process, I'm needing to feel that and all of the compounded interest of the not feeling that that brought about. So there's, there's something at the heart of this for me that all these, these emotions arise to be metabolized. And I've You know, it's really in the psychological literature that if what you resist persists, and what you repress will come out, and it'll— it will come out in a way that is often more maladaptive. So let's say you have something that you're— you're— that is wanting, that is crying out to be addressed and held and brought up. If it's not addressed in a way with community, Or even something like— I love the technology, the ancient technology of song and dance for processing, especially group dance to move trauma through the body. If it's not processed in that kind of pro-social way, it will come out through numbing behavior such as addiction. Or, you know, we have all these modern addictions as well, or modern ways of numbing like Mainstream media or television. It'll it'll be things like you'll you know create conflict interpersonally because you're there's this part of you that wants this attention and it doesn't know how to ask for it. So a big thing in my life is giving doing my best to be have around me a space of welcoming expression. expression, that my, my container, my capacity is big to hold a variety of states of mind and being, and that the more that we can feel comfortable in expressing and the more transparent and vulnerable we can be, the more we will have access to deeper layers of relating, which to me is where, where that richness of life is.

Yeah, there's so many pieces there to relate to. I mean, going back to something you shared a couple minutes ago, I've noticed, number one, I'm sure most people like ourselves that have had some kinds of trauma or labels like mental illness, et cetera, et cetera, in our journeys to move through that or to recover from that. There's different ways of looking at it. But number one, I've certainly identified that everyone has a different path. It's not as easy as saying, here's some Seroquel or here's some cognitive behavioral therapy or here's some ayahuasca or here's some dancing. Every one of us, these experiences are not really about Going back to the opening of this session, are not really about mental illness. That's like the last layer of manifestation, like seeing things or hearing voices or feeling depressed or feeling manic or all the different obsessive-compulsive, all the different manifestations are really like the last expression compared to what is at the root. the root of these experiences. And I know for me, with what I call the bipolar experience, because I do honor that I have had this experience of mood swings and going up and down. So it's not really about denying that real experience. It's just reframing it to the bipolar experience for me compared to a bipolar disorder or bipolar illness or something like that. And The one piece of guidance I would give anybody who has the bipolar experience is to find some way to disidentify from the experience. Going back to what you were sharing, it's not about bypassing it or ignoring it, but the only way I was able to have some spaciousness was to disidentify to some degree with the character known as Bret. you know, that was having these, these experiences and these impulses and these sensations and all that until I learned that I could even have an idea like, I feel manic, but I'm not manic. Like, I feel suicidal, but I'm not. Because when you claim this, I am like, I am this or I am that, it's a real slippery slope to thinking you are that and identifying with that state of being rather than being able to see it as a temporary thing that's happening. And it's not really who you are. It's something you're experiencing. So I've always said, if there was a cure, quote unquote, for the bipolar experience, it has something to do with this ability to detach and disidentify with your experiences in order that you may find out who you are. Whereas these experiences are more like the character you play on TV. And then when you do that, you can start co-writing the screenplay, so to say, or you can change up your character. You have a lot more authority and a lot more creativity and a lot more, I don't like to use the word control, but it's some sense of control of your experience because you're not that experience. And for me, it was about the path of asking, who am I? Ramana Maharshi or the Eastern path. So for me, it wasn't necessarily yoga. or certain types of meditation because they didn't fit my personality. But I was such an obsessive, hyperactive mind, this monkey mind, that I ended up realizing I could use that to my advantage by at least temporarily being obsessed by asking, who am I? And being obsessed with the inquiry and using that as my springboard into a new space. So I thought that was Significant, a significant aspect of what you were talking about, this ability to disidentify. But you made the more important point, which I often will leave out or forget, which is it's not really about forgetting it or just ignoring that. But there is a power in disidentifying and detaching from your experience so that you can get a new perspective.

Yeah, there's a, there's a really powerful thread there that The field of psychology also addresses pretty strongly, which is this idea of when you label something, when you give something the name of disorder, when you give a person the label of a disorder, it often will remove agency. So there's, there's a— and this is like one area that I personally depart, or I I have a— I don't follow the party line of psychology insofar as I think that labels are useful in order that you don't feel alone, perhaps. But when your label becomes your identity and you lose agency, then you— it's almost as though you've been conscripted into this role that you can that lasts for your lifetime. You know, these labels, these disorder labels are meant frequently to just apply for the rest of your life, which I don't all— I don't agree with either, insofar as all of, all of these things that we call altered states of mind are so context-dependent, you know. And we're learning so much with regards to epigenetics and how For example, like, let's say you have a proclivity within your kind of bloodline for alcoholism. If you don't encounter a context of great stress or access to alcohol or, you know, poor modeling, you actually will never develop alcoholism. And I think that it's I think that it's similar in some ways with regards to, you know, these altered states of mind, insofar as I consider myself a corporeal consciousness canary in the coal mine because I'm super sensitive. And I think that— I think that everyone actually would feel similarly to me if they were as sensitive as I was. I just happen to be extra sensitive for, you know, a variety of reasons. And so in some ways, like, if we were to look at the idea of these altered states of mind, you know, which is defined as mental disorders, etc., as a cultural, a community, a cons— consciousness issue as though it's arising from the collective unconscious, I think that's actually a more accurate way to look at it. Like, there are some of us that have greater valence, which is kind of the, the likelihood to take something on or step into a particular role. And I think it is the sensitive ones among us that get these labels of disorders, when in fact it's actually a disorder of Yeah, I mean, when we talk, I feel a sense of relief.

I feel a sense of lightness. And I feel, I actually also feel emotional, almost as if I've been waiting 20 years to start having these conversations. And I want to thank you, first of all, just for being my friend on this part of the journey.

Thank you.

And bringing your wisdom and your sensitivity and your intelligence and your love to this conversation. Because this is even still part of my healing in a way. And I would say I have like a righteous chip on my shoulder because I don't want to be a pushover in a sense that I think some things need to change now. You know, like, I don't want to just be like, All like woo-woo, love and light. Not that you're saying that. I mean, in myself, like these topics are, I feel they're very important. A lot of what you're pointing to and what's coming up and what will come up in these conversations around. So I want to be clear. I think most people in the mental health industry and the health industry have good intentions. You know, I think they get into these fields because they care about people and because they're fascinated by psychology and the human experience and all those things. And yet simultaneously, like we're talking about, the brightest among them, among us, have fallen into this trap. And it's a bigger discussion, like you're saying. It's about, for me, material— the cult of materialism on the planet.

Yeah.

It's the cult of over-respecting authority because people went to Harvard or whatever it might be, and they've got a plaque on their wall. But there's some— there's a real blind spot for the beauty of naming something. Like you were saying, it is helpful. You know, if someone walks up to you, X, at a festival, it's helpful to say, I'm hearing voices. Compared to I'm feeling suicidal, compared to I can't leave my tent without locking the door 150 times. So in the literature and in the mainstream mental health, that's good. It's good to classify things and categorize things in order to better understand them. But somehow when it comes to groupthink and a system, the ability to name and categorize things has, as you alluded to, become this This life sentence and this label where we've confused the map with the territory, the famous saying. So instead of saying, well, it's clear, Bret, you have this bipolar experience and you seem to go up and down a lot. It's like, you are bipolar. You will have this the rest of your life. You should take medicine and call it a day. That's who you are. You know, that's the story I was given. For all intents and purposes, that's the story I was told. And it's still pretty much like that in in mainstream mental health. And I want to, as a last point, I want to point out to our audience the very fact that you also went to school for this, if they care about that. You know, if it's all about that whole thing, like you're all, you are experiment, you have personal experience and you actually have training. I actually went back to school when I was 30 for something called psychosocial rehabilitation. So I've, I've been on the other side and I've seen the bureaucracy and how people do. So we're not— I don't think it matters, but just to be clear to the audience, we're also not just talking as like, you know, what would be the word, like partial, you know, it's just like something we like to do in our pastime.

Hobbyists.

Yeah, hobbyists, right, right. It's not really— we're not just speaking from hobbyists or only like we have, and there's so many of us like this. Out in the world, and to finish my point of my the the the rebel in me or the revolutionary in me, it's like I'm not going to settle anymore for anything less than the the respect for lack of a better word that we all deserve in in that sense in bringing a change to the planet on this on this level. And the song that I like to play in before all the podcasts that. My friend Kevin says, nothing keeps the truth unexposed. And I was thinking about that coming into this playcast. And that's what it's all about for me. Nothing keeps the truth unexposed. And to be quite frank with the audience, the truth is the mental health system is broken. It's distorted. It's destructive. And yes, there's good, there's like highlights and good moments and there's good successes. I'm not really saying that. But systemically, fundamentally, in my opinion and in my experience, it must be changed. It must be discarded and obsoleted. And we actually have the ability to create new systems with decentralized technologies, with new thinking, and with the resources available to us. There is no reason why Bret and X even can't start a revolution. That leads to the obsolescence of hospitals and psychiatric wards. And it's not because of wishful thinking. It's because we actually have better solutions and better ideas and better innovations to take the place of those things. So again, I'm not talking about just sending everyone on their way to take some ayahuasca or something. I'm talking about getting to the point where we actually are building these structures physically, mentally, and everything to actually replace the system as we know it. And nothing keeps that truth unexposed. You know the truth by working with people of what is at the bottom of these altered states and what people really need. And what I needed when I first went into the hospital and had an episode, I needed someone to hold my hand, to be honest. I wrote an essay about it.

Yeah.

I needed someone to hold my hand and say, Bret, what's going on with you? And instead they locked me in a room with cameras. And then when I banged on the door and started screaming for my mom and dad outside, they shot me up. That was their affirmation that I was psychotic. And then they shot me up with their, whatever that thing is that they have to carry the antidote for because it creates convulsions. I went into convulsions and started screaming, mommy, I'm dying. Like you hear about like with like soldiers or something. And then my parents had to witness that. So the whole experience when I was 19 was founded and rooted in this experience of being locked in this room, given this shot, going into convulsions, and being told I'm sick because of the epigenetics in my family as well. So that bloodline had altered states of mind and trauma in it. And of course, the Western doctors say, if you have that, that's your fate. So yeah. So thanks for the extended listen there. I just thought it was important to share.

I just want to say I am so sorry you experienced that at the hands of what proclaims itself to be, you know, the mental health services. And it just— it's, it's an exposure of how it's still in this kind of capitalistic, colonial type of mindset where It's it's making making that experience wrong insofar as it's not you know productive or what have you. Like there's all these kind of ethical these unspoken sort of judgments, I should say more more broadly about certain states of mind, and that's the thing. Like what we call mental disorders really is just the psyche's cry for help. Like, nobody— it's not— no, it's, it's not as though you would choose to be in that position willingly. It's that your psyche has gone through experiences, or again, has the tendency to, to shape itself in a certain way, and it Needs people to again, like hold space, hold compassionate space for the processing of you know what what the baggage that we collect as a gosh as a very traumatizing society. I mean, living in society is actively traumatizing. It's actually kind of astonishing how. Decently, most people function when our society, and I think this is like capitalism again, where it's this idea that you have to struggle every day to make ends meet, to even feed yourself, to continue to exist. For example, like that is, I think that's a traumatizing state, you know, and it's new. That's not that wasn't the case for all of it wasn't the same. Way in terms of also this idea that like you're wrong if you're if you need a break sometimes or what have you. This we need to return to actually honoring rest, for example, as part of the cycle. And so what we're seeing is we're seeing you know the the falling of for lack of a better word like this capitalistic structure like in the burnout in The rising rates of you know what are mental disorders, what's called mental illness. I mean, this year with the pandemic has exposed it, has ripped it off like people. And okay, so here's another piece, and this is why I'm so passionate about entertainment and creating and sharing the tools that I learned in this ivory tower of graduate school, and that I continue to. as, you know, an obsessive researcher, like, read the latest about these things, you know, read the latest research, read the latest books, etc., is that we, we can actually teach coping skills. We can teach pro-social ways of processing. We can teach, you know, children and adults— honestly, we all need it— what it looks like to be approaching what we could call like a crisis. Like, there are, there are steps that lead up to it, and I think that we should take a more proactive stance toward mental wellness, and we should give, you know, kids and everyone the tools to regulate their nervous systems. And that's what I do with eco-regulation through, through this Design Science Studio and through my own need to find a way to regulate without other people. I mean, I'm up here alone right now on 188 acres at a retreat center that's closed because of COVID and my ways of, you know, finding wellness all came from, you know, touch and bodywork, contact improv. I created a bodywork style called Soma Sense that's really a lot of pressure. and contact, which is really regulating to my system. And I have had very, very shockingly little of that this year for how much I actually need to balance my neurochemistry. And so there's, there's ways that we can, if, if we educate ourselves, which is what I try to do with eco-regulation, we can, we can regulate our nervous system. you know, with, with the natural environment. Or again, we can teach each other how to regulate. So it's like, I have this dream of like every kid being taught eco-regulation. And also like, a great example is like, you know, bullies on the playground. Bullies on the playground are only bullies because they themselves have been harmed in some way. And so what if this beautiful thing could happen where like Let's say some— a kid is bullying another kid and other kids are seeing it, they can approach that bully and say, hey, like, you seem really upset, like, what's going on? And like, to have this enhanced sense of empathetic capacity for all people is the vision that I hold and I carry, and also why I am so dedicated to this work of what I call spaceholding, or being a guardian angel. Or being a sitter, or, you know, being a therapist, like all these names for kind of the same thing, which is holding an empathetic presence with someone where your, your attention and your prayer and being with them is for them to experience this force of unconditional love coming through you. That is at my best. That is what I try to hold, and that I think that if more, more people were able to hold that, it would be, you know, we'd be approaching that state of, you know, heaven on earth. That is what I'm striving for. And it not only feels good to give that experience of unconditional love to someone, it feels good to have it flow through you. So it's this beautiful win-win experience, and we can do it. It's just like gathering the resources and rising it as important in the collective consciousness.

Word. It is another favorite angle for me, or topic in this space, is really how Mental health or mental illness or the mental health system is such an amazing microcosm, macrocosm reflection of our greater state, you know, as a civilization. And I'm usually pretty practical about it in that if you get thrown into the mental health system, you're dealing with insurance companies, you're dealing usually with the police, you're dealing with doctors, you're dealing with the welfare system, you're dealing with money and getting state spot— like, there's so many intricate pieces that the mental health system is like tied into as an epicenter. So it's quite, it's quite an interesting topic, anthropologically speaking, which, which is what, you know, you were pointing at. And I mean, for someone like myself, and I guess like you, without putting words in your mouth, you know, as an evolutionary, as a meta-futurist, like, it couldn't be clearer, you know, that the zenith, the zenith of Western civilization, as we approach this zenith, as most things happen with humans and patterns and trends and cultures, like, it brought many amazing things, even like polio vaccines. and, you know, and sanitation, the classic arguments for capitalism, you know, it brought the free market and people's ability to have their needs met and all this stuff, which is true to a certain degree, you know, true enough until it's not true anymore, so to say, you know, until it reaches its kind of its benefit. And then there's the whole, you know, evolutionarily speaking, or the butterfly, like something, there's a breakdown point where we need to break through. And for me, like you're saying, the whole, rise in suicide and mental health because of COVID and everything. People are finally, I think, starting to get a glimpse that when we use— when we talk about capitalism, like, I'm not necessarily talking as a strict economist, you know, or a historian. I'm like, I'm using my own eyes and my own direct experience to see like the zenith of Western civilization and all the brilliance of it also, like anything else, has an underbelly. And it has that shadow to it. And for me, the biggest shadow is what you've spoken about. You know, Krishnamurti said, I can't, I never get his saying right, but, you know, trying to adjust to it, it's not a sign of a measure of health to try to adjust to a profoundly sick society. And we've done a really good job in Western civilization of brushing things under the rug or saying, but it's made us rich and it's alleviated poverty. But really, Yes, and yes, and there's always been this underneath. I mean, it came from the beats and the jazz throughout all the decades and stuff until we reach a new level of care in this civilization. We call it in our project with our platform a care-first world. And that is severely lacking in the capitalistic, material, external-oriented, obsessed culture that we've really birthed where we don't let people take a break, like you said, and have a rest. And that's one of the— I'll end it here, this piece here. That to me is one of the massive cracks in the traditional mental health system as it is, is that there's no environment and system that can help people in the way we're talking about. It's either take your medicines or be sick. And there's no insurance for these things. There's no free access accessible for all these things. So for me, without completely ditching capitalism in that sense, it's my— I feel like it's now my responsibility. And I like to break that word up, my ability to respond or my response ability to continue speaking about these matters with you and people like you and altogether.

Mm-hmm.

to figure out how, what would it look like to have some of these new solutions become more than just my talks here? And I have your 188 acres and some 100 acres somewhere else and 100 acres somewhere else. And how do I become my version of Patch Adams, someone who broke the system there and just started helping people without insurance and just help people? And in some senses, if I could even do half as much as what Patch Adams did for kind of healthcare, I would probably be job done. But yeah, those are just some thoughts. How do you relate to any of that?

I think that I have this idea of being a compassionate corporeal culture curator. What I mean by that is, how can we holistically weave a culture that is supportive of wellness all around? And I believe in it, and I try to live that as, as the way that I am. And right now it looks like being the evolutionary edge of empathetic embodiment, which Is right now it's fringe, but I, I mean, somatic psychology is really validating a lot of these, how shall we say, alternative pursuits. Like a great example is in ecstatic dance. So like freeform movement in a group is really regulating to the nervous system for a variety of reasons. reasons. You know, you're literally vibrating the body, which is regulating to the nervous system. Seeing other people in their freedom of expression and being invited into your own without judgment in this like neutral or supportive container is really cathartic. And it's a, it's a great processing and maintenance practice. And it's also physically good to move the body and like flush the lymphatic system, which doesn't have its own pump like the circulatory system does with the heart. And that helps all your hormones move, all, all the toxins kind of move through your fats and like go, go through your body. So there are accessible, affordable technologies that can help us in creating a compassionate corporeal culture, but it would be really helpful for there to be an understanding around how helpful these things are and to have institutional support for these things. And I'm trying to bring forth the research from transpersonal and somatic psychology that does support these things. Another great example is like group singing. Again, it's this idea of like expression together and vibrating together that activates, you know, the vagus nerve and calms humanimals, which is what I call us. We're human animals. And we— I think getting back to that, we've gotten so, so heady, and we've accomplished so much in the direction of the head that we have left behind caring for the body. And we are seeing that emerge, and it's calling for support. And I feel confident that I will continue to put this forth. But what I'm really excited about is creating content to share this with more people and to have more exposure. You know, like I grew up in a forest preserve southwest of Chicago. I wish I would have seen videos of healing practices that were happening in somatic psychology and transpersonal psychology like when I was growing up. That really would have influenced my path and, and inspired me. And so that's one big thing that I'm seeking to do is to, to show people's healing processes and the healing technologies that we're engaging in, kind of again on the evolutionary edge. But I feel pretty well aware of a lot of things that could be adopted quite affordably and would make a huge difference.

Right on. I love the idea of the— we talked about this on our first call. Like, not only, well, first of all, we need to, and I don't usually like to use the word need, but we need to just do our, continue to do our best to have more and more people have these types of experiences. And then the other half of it was what you mentioned last time is documenting it, which, I mean, to me relates to what you were just sharing, like content, content, content.

Yeah.

The more we can document these processes and the people's positive results from that, like the far better we are off as a global community and having people wake up one day and catch that one video on YouTube or Facebook or whatever that changes their lives because they, because we're not, and we just need to create that content. Like you're saying, like get it out there. So I was going to ask you, as far as linear time goes and all the different stuff we all love to do as Renaissance people, is that one of your kind of top 3 sort of intentions? Like, what might be next for you in a sense? Or is there anything you would be able to put out there into the noosphere here of what help you might like or what support you might like or the kind of contributors you'd like to find or resonant people. Like, share a little bit about the 1 to 2 or 3 things like that are all converging for you, like, yet, like, whatever that may be. And, and just let's put it out there. At least let's put it out there, like, what kind of, uh, contributions or, or resonant people you'd like to find to be part of that.

Thank you so much. I think I am most greatly seeking methods of distribution and ways to compensate media makers insofar as I am really honored to have a lot of people have really immense confidence in me and having had amazing experiences with me as their space holder. And I have one piece called Trip Report, which is the documentation of a transformative experience that I held space for. And that's meant as an integration artifact that wants to be viewed by more people in the world, and I think wants to become some type of series, insofar as I would like to put forth this idea of creating these healing media pieces as not only beneficial for people to encounter new, new forms of healing, but also to act as a transmedia talisman towards transformation for, for everyone viewing it. So not only, you know, the people who are a part of it upon repeated viewing can Much like they're hearing the retelling of a story deep into the insights, but that it's this way that, again, that we can turn what we, what we perceive as this individual trauma healing and make the wisdom of it available to the collective. So, I mean, I, again, I'm also a media maker and I'm privileged to know amazing media makers, and I want to create series of ways that we can heal. I mean, I steward this beautiful space, you know, we could film right here, and I am seeking pretty reasonable support to just compensate them for their time and skills. And, you know, I am again fortunate to have people who are willing to be documented in their processes and I'm also open to being, being an example insofar as I have intersectional intergenerational trauma in my lineage, and I have a very good sense of how to continue to process that within my system and just seeking, seeking, you know, compensation for people's time and helping me do that. You know, and I will, of course, you know, even if I don't receive that, I will continue to produce content, albeit at a much slower pace. But really, I mean, I, I'm really excited to share things like eco-regulation with everyone, and I'd, I'd love to not put it behind a paywall. You know, I'd love it to just be accessible to everyone. I'd love for these integration artifacts to be to be made, you know, from people's transformational experiences. And so, yeah, I, I am also, you know, I'm a healer. So the business or what have you, the financial side of things is not where my, my soul is drawn. Like, I'm like, I'm gonna keep doing this, you know, regardless of the circumstances. So I guess support in Structuring that in a way that is resilient and that is, you know, most beneficial to the most people would would be helpful. But I mean, I I'm ready to travel and document and hold space for different people, and I have a crew that can help me with the actual, you know, behind the behind the camera with the audio that I. love to work with. So yeah, I'm ready. I want to hold space for you, and if you're open to being documented, or if not, I'd love to continue to do that for as many people as possible and to share, to share the weavings. And that leads me to one last thing, which is this idea of, you know, I studied transpersonal psychology as well, and I, again, I think that These things that we think of as individual are actually just parts of the collective that are emerging through us because we have a particular sensitivity towards it. And so I think the more that we take that view, the more we can gain compassion for any one individual's experience as a gift to the collective. And that We would do well to support that because it is for our benefit that that trauma gets metabolized by someone, or else it's going to come up again within war. It's going to come up in a huge way if we don't address it at a smaller scale. Great.

Thank you so much for sharing that. Thanks for letting our viewers know. I'm in a similar boat, I guess, when it comes down to it. I'm going to keep on keeping on. I mean, ironically, one of my missions on Earth is to help catalyze a rebirth and renaissance for philanthropy. So it's not really the same philanthropy that we're all familiar with as far as NGOs and recircling money and tax breaks and all that. The etymology of philanthropy is nice. It's a love of humanity. So, um, no, I'm not also— well, I kind of just stand for it. I mean, at the end of the line is like, I'm not really interested in monetizing my passions, as, as the famous quote goes. Like, it's— if it happens easily, you know, like, I don't know if my— here, if, right, if the Playcast ended up finding a production team and Like, whatever. And it was on Patreon and people started donating. Like, I'm not anti-money. I'm happy to receive money. I like spending money. I like having the money to support, like you're saying, to support the vision and support the team. But I'm not really into like monetizing it as far as like turning it into a business because that's not why I'm, why I'm here, so to say. So, um, so I'm kind of excited to see how we all How it all reveals itself, you know, like next month, next year, 10 years, because I think we're going to show reality and show the world a different way when it comes to even the money and the funding and the business and all that. I think we're going to find those other parts of ourselves, like you say, to put it that way. I've often had an A resistance, which I'm going to say is a good resistance, to people telling me to pick up that American dream and become an entrepreneur to create funding for myself. Because my question was, why don't we all do what we're here to do? Why don't we all bring our gifts? And some of you are really good at making money. Like, you've learned how to win that game. You're like, making money has actually become a specialism. And I'm like, why should I go back to school and monetize my passion when you are worth $20 million and you're part of the community? We show up all the time. We provide other goods and services, so to say, as a community. But that's really, to me, the shift that you're talking— that's happening. The shift on the planet is, I wouldn't even say the I and the we, it's just a shift to understanding we all share the same being. And we all are kind of a unique expression of that same being. So we can uplift each other from that perspective. We don't all have to be breadwinners, quote unquote, or moms or dads. Like, we've got a village to raise the child of a new Earth. And I'm just continually anticipating and feeling the excitement of people continuing to show up and say, oh, well, I just became a millionaire from crypto or whatever, like, and start turning that wealth into assets like land and solar panels and housing and all this kind of stuff. So I'm kind of excited about that. And I'm excited to continue our playcasts together. And my friend Hillary, who I'm working on a call to the mothers with our Project for Mental Health Reimagining, often talks about intergenerational trauma. being a key part of what she's seeing. So I'm going to look forward to bringing her on sometime with us so we can go a lot deeper on that piece of the puzzle and this call to the mothers we have. So by the way, call to the mothers is not just women. It's more of a metaphor of people that want to nourish and unconditionally love. This new form of mental health and addiction, you know, reformation into being. So by that token, I'm starting to think I want to create the 100th Mother Effect, you know, and, and find 100 mothers that maybe all put in like $1,000 or $10,000 so we can actually get together and start creating some of that content, have a nice website, a nice podcast, like all that stuff that, like, like you said, I could learn to do it for the next 3 years. If I spend all of my time becoming a podcast expert, But yeah, like you, I'm going to stick to doing what I love to do. And like you said, we just carry on. There's no pressure really. I don't know how you feel about it, but I don't feel an external pressure to succeed or save the world or anything. Like, to me, the biggest success is us being our best selves and following our bliss and following our highest excitement to be in the world the way we want to see. So So with that, I'm going to give you the final word of celebration or summation or conclusion or anything you want to share as we're going to head off.

Oh, well, thank you so much for this opportunity. If possible, I would invite everyone to view Trip Report as an integration artifact, and maybe we can put the link in the description. As an experience of prayer for that culture that we want to emerge. And please reach out if any of what we've spoken about resonates with you. I'm also providing a lot of support for people in this time. So if you're looking for support, I'm happy to either provide it or direct you toward resources to help you find what you need in this time.

Thank you.

Time of Transformation. And you can email me. My email is the letter X at symbol raz.ma, just like you see on the bottom of this. I don't know if you can see that.

There you go. You got it.

It's just like that. If you— so it's easy. And I am hoping that you feel supported in in your evolution and in our collective evolution. And anything that I can do to help with that, I'm interested in doing.

Awesome. Thank you for, for being here. Thank you for being my friend. I love you and take care of yourself until the, until the next time.

I love you too. And I love all of our audience. And I want you to have access to greater capacity for love. So may, may that be an easeful way for you.

Yes, beautiful way to exit the Meta— the Metafuturist Playcast. It's all about love. Thank you.

Yeah, be well.

Okay, take care.

Yeah.

Bye.

Bye.