Creating Innovative Activewear Built for Maximum Performance With Wesley Horbatuck & Greg Orfe of Driftline

Startups get the party. Startups get the party started. Startups get the party. Startups get the party started. You want tech and tacos, tacos and tech you know we got tacos and tech is on smash border green guacamole keeper captains counting beans Contador quentan frijoles Founders trying to raise some queso la vida San Diego school of rappy rapping fire tortillas round jalapenos in these modern times a crappy my coding yoga posse fold the body origami we be surfing coronado eating tacos el gordo, the taco stand in puesto lucha libre and sombrero got a shout out to cost angels by the ocean watch the sunset la Jolla shores Entrepreneurs trying to get funded when San Diego Startup week is popping in the summer Oceanside, the Tijuana esti be full of hustlers from couch surfing to penthouses right on the beach Tech leaders believe stars are within reach we interview and founders who be shooting for the moon SD Tecos with your host, Neil Bloom. Startups get the party. Startups get the party started. Startups get the party. Startups get the party started.

Welcome to the Tacos and Tech podcast. I'm your host, Neil Bloom and I'm thrilled to have you here. On the Tacos and tech podcast we interview builders of technologies, of companies, of communities and we do it weekly. So thanks for tuning in. Every Tuesday a new interview and on Fridays we talk about what's new in the San Diego tech ecosystem from a news perspective. So make sure you join us there as well too. We also have a tech newsletter that comes out every other week@freshbroodtech.com you can subscribe to listen to it without further ado. Enjoy this episode. I am thrilled to have on the founder and co founder of Driftline, Greg and Wes. Hey guys, thanks for being on the pod.

Thanks for having us.

Appreciate it. Neil.

Yeah, no, excited to learn what you guys have been building. I know you recently were on Shark Tank, so we're all kind of excited to hear the behind the scenes story a little bit about that compared to what's out there. But Wes, you want to take us through a little bit what Driftline is?

Absolutely. So Driftline is a company that Greg and I started focused around water sports apparel. So we actually created the first ever and our patent pending drifties, which are wetsuit lined board shorts, so they're specifically designed for water sport performance. Utilizing neoprene has so many benefits behind, you know, beyond those thin compression liners. So Greg and I really married this idea of having a wetsuit liner with a stylish outer shell without showing the liner. So it's literally a pair of board shorts that has a wetsuit liner stitched in to keep you warm, comfortable and chafe free.

Super important in San Diego, where, you know, it's not just surf culture. Like it is part of just everyday life culture. So gotta imagine that came from a personal need, I would imagine. So we're gonna hear a little bit about the founding story, but I'm curious to kind of hear each of your backgrounds. Like, you know, it's. Anyone can have an idea. It takes complimentary skill sets, the right partners to actually make an idea into a business. And that just doesn't happen overnight. You want to give us each of your background, maybe, Greg, you go first.

Yeah, I think it's actually our backgrounds that. That really were the perfect marriage to get us to how Driftline was founded. For me, I was. I grew up in Philadelphia. I grew up skateboarding and snowboarding and just obsessed with that culture back in the 90s, I think a lot of people were. But it carried with me all the way through college where I went to Elon University. It's in North Carolina. And coincidentally, Wes also went there and we happened to live in the same dorm room, the fre our freshman year. And we became super, super close right off the bat and ended up living together all four years throughout college. Yeah, so we can get into that shortly after Wes's story. But, you know, after college, I went to. Moved to D.C. and actually had a sales job. I was in tech sales and enjoyed that for quite some time. But while I was in dc, the whole remote culture was starting to become a thing and I was able to move to San Diego. At the time, I'd always wanted to live in California. Moved there with a close buddy of mine that I worked with. And we were in a house. Wes joined us as well. And we had our desk in the garage. We popped it open 95 with a ping pong table in there and just slinging calls and just totally enjoying life. But it was during that time I actually knew that my time in sales was winding down. And I'd always wanted to be an artist like my mom's super artistic. I grew up artistic and I just never kind of pursued that part of my life. So I started taking some night classes in San Diego, downtown at San Diego City College, and ended up getting my degree. And during that time, Wes and I, you know, kind of had this light bulb Moment.

Oh, that's cool. Wow. So, like, college roommates all the way through living together and building a company together. I have actually had a similar experience with my first started a company. I started my co founder. We were roommates as well. And I have some stories about that as well too. But. And we're gonna. I'm gonna specifically ask some questions. Once you started a company, if you stayed roommates. Cause that is a different thing as well too. But mixing work and home life, you know, who did the dishes actually really saying, like, did you pay the bills, you know, or did you do that thing? But. All right, we'll get into that. But Wes, take us through. Obviously, similar background, but how'd you end up back here in San Diego with Greg?

Yeah, it's funny. My background is similar to Greg's, but a little different. I'm from Connecticut, so while Greg grew up in, like, the skating, a little bit more grunge culture, I was definitely a little preppy Connecticut kid. I grew up, like, surfing, but I also was huge into sailing and just like, overall waterman style. So I grew up in Connecticut and then obviously went to school for finance and accounting with Greg. Did all four years at Elon Down North Carolina. But then instead of going to D.C. like Greg did, I actually went to New York City and I cut my teeth there. I got my MBA at NYU while working in the finance world. And the left brain had kind of overworked itself, so I actually got pretty into photography and writing and started getting to, like, the more marketing side of my brain, which had always been there but just never really flexed. I actually started a, like, small company there that was like, we wrote blog articles and reviewed a lot of musicians and artists and actually this, like, subculture of surfing in New York City. It's pretty rad and not many people, like, know about it, but that actually got me very much wanting this west coast lifestyle. And, you know, growing up, I was always that beach kid. Anyways, so one thing led to another, and Greg and I literally moved to San Diego without really telling each other in 2015. Like, at the same time, we're like, we called each other one day. I'm like, dude, I'm moving. He's like, dude, I'm moving too. And it was just like, we'd been best buds at college and always kept in touch and seen each other those years in New York City and D.C. but this was kind of like a weird culmination. And then we just, you know, went to San Diego and I was able to do the same thing as Greg. I was still working remotely and really in like this finance world, but I was in San Diego now, so it was perfect mix for me.

Wow, that's so random that you. It doesn't sound like either of you had ties to San Diego, but you both move across the country.

Yeah, I'd actually never been to San Diego before I moved here.

Oh, yeah, I'd been one time and I thought I went to SeaWorld when I was there, of all things, and for some reason I was hooked.

Yeah, and you probably Never went to SeaWorld again once you lived here.

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Man, I can totally picture that. Like PB garage, like east coast boiler room meets PB lifestyle of just like, you know, hitting in the garage, hitting some waves. What was that like initially? Was it three of you or how many of you were all in a house together?

Yeah, it was so Greg and his. Greg and our buddy Joe, we all lived together just for a little bit or they lived together by themselves. And I moved in at a certain point and one of the things that we needed was having a big garage. And we had this idea that we would all work out of there. It'd be really cool. I got kicked out within the first week because I talk super loudly on the phone. So it was actually worked out for our benefit because it weirdly gets cold in San Diego at certain times and people don't really know that. So the garage was either freezing or hot. But I definitely made it down there for ping pong breaks. That was a necessity for sure.

Super cool. So and you each interestingly, like, kind of pursued more, I don't know, like technical or finance, and then found your way to the other side of the brain, whether it's some kind of creativity, which is interesting as well, too, of scratching a different itch when the actual idea of Driftline come up. Like, how long ago was the idea coming to fruition?

It was almost like the idea came about and then it got boosted because of something Greg did. But the idea came about. We were kind of just like surfing in pb. We did a lot of those just afternoon sessions down like Tourmaline. And it was that kind of transitional period, which is almost like right now a little bit, you know, probably a month or two ago, where it was like too warm for a wetsuit, but too cold for board shorts. And I'm, you know, six, five, I'm tall, lanky, and I hate putting on wetsuits. So it was like that aha moment where I was like, why isn't there a pair of board shorts that has a wetsuit liner. And you know, it was. Right. It was probably around the time that we moved out here and we gave it a couple of years. So it's probably around 20, 18, 19. And this whole concept was born because there was just nothing in the market. And it was really cool because that was kind of the time when compression line shorts or 2 in 1 shorts are becoming a thing. And people were starting to be able to wrap their brains around that idea, especially men. And then obviously from idea to product conception took a long, long time, but the idea happened. And what was really cool is Greg and I were driving up to a wedding in San Luis Bispo, and Greg was in art school at the time, but the idea on an eight hour drive went from like an idea to like. And it blew up. And I'll let Greg tell why.

Yeah, I mean, I think we, we really saw the vision and, and what helped spawn that, you know, conversation was I was in design school at the time and one of my projects in the fall was to brand a business from the ground up. Just totally hypothetical. A lot of my, you know, peers did like a coffee shop or a brewery stuff that made sense for San Diego. And we had just had this idea on the beach like a week or so before. And I like, well, let's just let me run with this as a project. Like, it's a great idea. I love this stuff. I've always wanted to kind of flex this part of my brain in terms of the surfskate lifestyle. And once we were driving and we kind of got some more ideas on the table about the branding and, you know, what the logo could look like and what our motto and tagline was. I kind of took that to work at school and by the end of that semester, we legitimately had at least a full blown branded business. I had business cards, we had the logo, and everything was kind of built out. We had letterheads, even stuff that wasn't really necessary to get us off the ground, but it made us feel more legit. So, yeah, I think that was really pivotal moment for us so that we kind of had the confidence to say, okay, well, let's actually talk about next steps now.

Yeah, and keep in mind we only had product idea and like this cool graphic design stuff around it. We had no pitchbook, we had no, like actual product. So, like, it was definitely rough, but it was like very clean from the outside.

Blind confidence for sure.

Did you, did you know anyone who had started a similar business or did you, how did you start surrounding yourselves with people to kind of fill in the gaps where you hadn't? Because there's a lot, right. You hadn't done a product, obviously a physical product. I don't think it sounds like either of you nor sold a product, either online or in a store. Where'd you start doing to fill in those gaps?

I think what's funny is there's, in my opinion, there's a difference between product and apparel. Apparel is just like a whole different beast. And Greg and I have become, like, fairly decent experts, and we're still so far away from knowing everything. And so I was still doing that entrepreneurial blog world that I just had started in New York, and it kind of transitioned out here. And I was actually doing something with Sector 9 and Arbor, the skateboard company. And through just connections, you know, one of my positives and positive attributes is I'm just able to surround myself with really good people in the connection world. And we met a guy, his name is Paul Wood, who was the apparel designer for Sector 9 in Arbor. And I just kind of pitched my idea to him one day when I was doing the article on them, and one thing led to another, and he was like, helping us do freelance work. In terms of this, you need a tech pack, you need a technical. You know, I'm a technical designer. So we kind of just worked, workshopped this idea, and it really just helped to have someone in your corner like that, because it would have taken Greg and I years to be able to do any of that.

Got it. Okay, so what. And how do you actually go from designing to manufacturing? Because that's a whole other leap. Right? And is it something where you find someone local to do a test run, or do you have to find something overseas? Like, how did you even know where to start on the. Actually, the physical pieces of it?

Well, I'll go first, Greg, and I'll let you jump in. We didn't really know. And that's the crazy part is, like, Greg and I were talking with Paul, and after you have the design aspect, we had some samples in terms of what we wanted and the quality we wanted, but we were fresh out of not knowing anything. And Paul really was our connection to a lot of the manufacturers. We went through about 15 manufacturers before one even gave us the remote, like, time of day. And it just so happened that he, the head guy of this manufacturer in China, was actually in LA at the time. And we, Greg and I, like, popped in our car and drove as fast as we can to LA met Paul and this guy in like a hotel lobby pitched our idea. Greg had this dope branded, like, pitch book and we just kind of laid it all out. And because of the relationship that Paul had, we were able to get a first step. It's literally like if you're going blind, if you don't have a relationship into that world.

Interesting. Take us through that.

Yeah, just to. No, just to jump on that. I think. Yeah, it was just a lot of little wins along the way too. I mean, again, credit to Paul. He had the connections and new people and linked us up. And even that first tech pack, like, I had such a crude drawing of.

What our board shorts would look like.

And, you know, he was able to provide like a much more dialed in asset that we were able to take. And I was able to colorize and kind of stylize so that when they received that, it actually spoke to their language and they understood, you know, how this was supposed to look. But yeah, it was just such a new world for us, like the measurements and trying to figure out how this should fit for, you know, multiple body types and different sizes of waist and whatnot. So I think there's been a big learning curve there. And ever since we took over all of that, a hundred percent, I'd say in the last two years. Yeah, there's still, like Wes said, plenty to learn on that front.

It's cool to come get on this, you know, this world because people are just like, oh, you're a board short company. And it's like, yeah, but we are like a technical board short. And when you say that, it's not just because we're technical in terms of we have two different kinds of materials that we stitch together. But really, like, the barrier to entry to create a T shirt these days is super low. You can get in screen, print, whatever, but to create something of this caliber, people don't know that. Greg literally has like every centimeter like dialed out on these designs to make sure that every inch in your half hip and your inseam is just perfectly proportional for like the male and his waist and his thighs. And it's really complicated to get something at the end of the day. Fairly simple.

Super interesting. So how long did it take from your first sample, like your first product? You, like, see it now you can, like, feel it to actually getting your first sale. Do you remember that, Greg?

Gosh. I think, you know, the cool thing was we were Wes again, he's so good at that marketing and the creative approach to how to reach People and audiences that he was just quietly building a ton of hype around it while we were both mutually just grinding, trying to get some product in hand. And we were dealing with delays even before, you know, Covid supply chain issues and just. Yeah, we were like chickens running around with their heads cut off. But we planned a pretty big launch party in San Diego. What was it? North park west.

Yeah, the June shine in north park.

Yeah, it was June shine. And I mean, that was just such a cool moment for us because not only did we have, like, our friends and family come in to support us and obviously have people buy product, but the best part was actually seeing, you know, passerbys who were coming through juneshine or seeing in the window that we were having this party and seeing the look on their face as they would touch the board short, like, hang up in front of their face and be like, oh my God, I need a pair of these right now. And there was a lot of those people too. Just way beyond our friends. So I think that was another one of those. I'll call this more big win though, where it totally instilled us with more confidence of like, oh, yeah, this is.

The right path right now.

That's pretty cool. So take us through today. Like, where are you selling it? Where can people find it? And yeah, just take us where the product is now. Go for it, Wes.

Okay, cool. Yeah. So Greg and I have always positioned ourselves to be flexible and scalable. Like, that was our goal in the beginning. This is 100% self funded. So we really wanted to make sure that when we grew and as we grew, it was going to be something we could contain until obviously we needed to let it explode. But the way we did it was we wanted to build something all e commerce based. And the reason being is plain and simple. Some margins are so clean and it's just apparel. The hardest thing to do right now is. And as you've seen in the past couple of years with the fall of malls and you have people who are in stores and stores had to close during COVID Like going an e commerce route was just our bread and butter. Greg and I were in tech. It was just kind of the way we needed to go. So right now we're 100% or 99% on online direct to consumer. But then, you know, specialty stores were in a couple of them, west coast paddle and Alila marea hotel up here. So we're just testing out a couple of cool things. But honestly, we're selling out of most of our Orders. So it's just unless until the time is to grow, we're pretty much all direct to consumer on our website.

And just to emphasize on that too, most of our business, even prior to Shark, well, especially prior to Shark Tank, was honestly just word of mouth and organic. You know, we realized that again, like Wes said at the beginning, there are people who are looking for line board shorts in some capacity for the comfort component. But I think a lot of people initially thought that compression liner is just like underwear in your board shorts and they just didn't put two and two together. But when they realized that we had created an actual specialized product for it, there the amount of searches for line board shorts is just dramatic increase. And I think we did a pretty good job initially of like our SEO and keywords to get some more traffic. That really launched us because it was kind of coming from nowhere. Like not people that we knew per se, but one thing that we've done a really good job of and something that we really always want to do from some advice from another San Diego company was to own our backyard in San Diego and really just make sure that because this was a product for San Diegans, honestly, that's always kind of what our intention was. And you know, we loved that time period so much when we lived together and our lifestyle was just basically the beach and just jumping in the water for any and all reasons. And I think that's really helped build some hype in the local community for sure.

That's awesome. Yeah, we love, we love hearing that local. Not just local product, but building it for the local scene too. And that kind of has had a comeback during COVID as well. Just like support local businesses. Businesses again and not just restaurants, but all of the people who've kind of missed out on having things in stores and other things like that. So that's pretty cool. But then to take it to this national level on Shark Tank, like take us through why? I mean, the obvious mentality we all understand of like getting a national model, but you'd bootstrap to date. And now you were deciding to take investment. Why there versus something else? And how long did the process take to actually get on the show? How many tries?

Yeah. Finance aspect of it is kind of fun because my brain constantly fights each other itself. I act like they're two different people. But the main thing is because there's one aspect which is like marketing sales, like exposure, get your name out there all the time, always be branding. The other side of it is like be fiscally Responsible. You have a vision in terms of how you want to scale and raise capital and like go that route. Now if you can marry those two in a beautiful deal, then why would you not? So you have couple sharks, two in mind. You know, they have this world where they've invested in not only San Diego products before, but also in the water sports world. Robert was Sand Cloud and he does hand planes. And then you have Mark who is tower paddle boards. And it's like we've not only done collabs with both of those companies, but also, you know, they speak highly of the experience. So when went in with a pretty reasonable offer for them. And if you watch the episode, you can kind of see without spoiling it, like they all were in agreeance of our valuation and how much we were looking to raise, but they all wanted to be bigger parts of the company because they saw the vision. So that was pretty much the main reason why we wanted to get on. And it ended up being like a great exposure opportunity for us.

Okay, so then we'll link the, the episode so that people can watch it. Yeah. What has come from it since like sales, new investors. What's it been like since the, since it went live?

I would say a lot of sales and learning. And a lot of learning. The reason is so like obviously when people get see the Shark Tank episode and it ends very positively, people are excited. I gotta check this out, gotta check this out. So the sales have kind of gone through the roof and we didn't even know we were going to get on. So like the fact that we did and this, it's just blown up beyond our wildest dreams. Which is really cool because it was right, you know, right around this time where summer's happening and like it's just our perfect season now with that and with success, like any entrepreneur will tell you, always comes like exposing the gaps in your plans and the gaps in your business. And what Greg and I have really had to learn is this idea of exchanges and mass like packaging and shipping and just always making sure consumers are happy. And I think one thing that people don't realize is we're still a two person company and Greg is literally handling hundreds of customer emails and chats while I'm just like packaging like crazy. I had some of my friends here, bought them pizza and was just trying to walk them through our operations back end because all of our product is still in my house. So we're all just like, it's just chaos.

And they packed up 700 packages in that night.

Yeah.

By the way, that's a lot of pizza.

Yeah, we got some really good friends, so it's just been crazy.

Wow, that's awesome. What has that done, like, in terms of like, Greg, for you, because it was brand led. It was brand before the product even existed. Now to see it come to fruition and being talked about and being bought, where does that go for your mind in terms of like brand and design? Does it just explode in 100 new ideas?

Yeah, I mean, it's super exciting and I think even more than the brand because like I said, we thought we did everything. We thought we were very prepared for this moment at least. The air, the airing of it all and the customer response. We redid the entire website like a sprint in like one week to rebrand it and make sure everything was dialed. All our backend apps were fluid, make sure like our Instagram was cleaned up and all the login to our Facebook, everything. We really tried to maybe like double and triple check everything, but again, there were gaps. And I think really what that has taught us and what has my mind running specifically as like kind of the operations lead of the team is just how to expand our supply chain and get new product lines in the works. I mean, some of the number one responses and feedback we got were for a women's line, which has always been in our plans, as well as a youth line which has also been in our plans. But you know, we always wanted to take this time to just super dial in Drifties, which is obviously our primary product. So I definitely see the future as not only continue to improve Drifties, but hopefully getting to, you know, I think opening up a huge section of the population with women and children.

That's awesome. Super cool to see just where it's going from here. Sounds like we may need to intro you to a local 3PL, just so that it's, you know, don't have to have friends over every time. So I can make a. I can connect you to Shipcom if you don't know them yet, but also local North County Group with warehouses in Carlsbad and then across the country, if that's of help, help in that regard. Where? So obviously you mentioned some products that are happening from here. Where else? What should we be looking for like a year from now?

I think one thing that Greg and I have always kind of worked off of is if you've waited, something is perfect, you've waited too long. And I think Greg and I are very. We've always been, we're going to iterate on Drifty's until we're really happy with it. And that's why also, you know, not only from the money aspect, but that's also why we've done such, you know, specialized smaller orders is because we want to make sure the product stays better and that the consumers are getting the best product out there. So we're actually upcoming on our fourth version of them and this one will have an eco friendly option which is super essential these days. But a year from now it'll probably look like expanding the product line like Greg was talking about, but also expanding the use cases of our current product. So not only growing the company Driftline, but growing the product Drifties. You know, working with the local lifeguard associations, we actually made a pretty big impact not only because Greg's fiance is in the military, but because there's a huge military in our, you know, presence in our backyard here in San Diego. So working with, I think a step above just surfers because our product is born from surfing. But we've been shown time and time again in the past, you know, two years alone that Drifties are meant for watermen, paddling, swimming, fishing. It's like people just keep showing us new options and I think really growing the specific uses of the product for specific sports and people is something that we definitely want to do.

That's awesome. What's your take on San Diego having density for sports apparel? Is it a hub? Would you, I mean we know we've got Yori, we've got Prana and a lot of golf tech. Would you consider this an area where a lot of entrepreneurs are and starting kind of sports tech related apparel?

Dude, it's crazy. Like you start getting a little bit successful and start honestly putting out feelers, you can make a network that is massive here. San Diego has become not only a tech hub, but a product tech hub. I mean I've been able to talk to the blenders, the Pura vidas, the fee. Like all these people are here and everyone is just came out here for a specific reason and it's all open source, everyone is willing to share their expertise and obviously you have to take it with a grain of salt because not everyone's product are the same. But San Diego is the perfect environment because people are happier, products are being able to be utilized all year round and it's just become like a welcomed open source tech hub. It's really cool.

That's awesome. I feel that for sure it's a very give first mentality amongst the tech scene and it's cool to hear that around the product scene as well too. I have seen there's two new groups that have popped up. There's startup cpg, which is kind of a national group, but they've got a local presence and I think there's a, there's like a local meetup that happens now around it. And then also naturally San Diego, which is all about helping natural products, not just natural foods. Natural product entrepreneurs find each other and find connections too. So always curious to hear if there are other groups we can promote to make sure that it's helpful for entrepreneurs like you and others. Please share them and we want to make sure that the community continues to be supportive of building a company like yours. But that's great to hear that you guys especially you mentioned two like Pura Vita and Blenders, two companies who grew, I think from like student projects when they're at SDSU and sold. So they have had seen the full life cycle and continue to expand and they're giving back. That's also something you really want to see with entrepreneurs because it's easy to kind of check out and be like, I just spent 10 years of my life building something, I'd like my life back. But to hear that they give back is a really, really cool thing that I think is unique into our DNA here. So glad to hear that. Last question. You've built a business about San Diego in San Diego for San Diego. Nothing else goes alongside that like San Diego tacos. We gotta know, Greg, you have a favorite spot or favorite spot based on the hour of the day?

I do. And there might be some additional debate as to whether one considers it a burrito versus taco spot. But one of my personal favorites, having lived in PB for about five and a half years, is La Perla number one or number two? You name it. I freaking love that spot. I think it's so, so good right off of just the main strip.

It's incredible. It's a burrito spot. It's not a taco spot, but that's fine.

Unbelievable.

I knew it was going to call me out.

I mean post surf sesh. It's burrito for sure. It's a California burrito. After you've come out of the water and you are cold and exhausted for.

Sure and hungry and starving.

Yes.

How about you, Wes?

I so when I lived in pb it was definitely, you know, Oscars for fish. But up here in Encinitas, Lucada area, I've just become to love like Love City Tacos and I Know, it's around a couple different spots, but they deliver every time. And I have my burrito spots. Like Greg and I talk, you know, we talk about that all the time, actually. But the city tacos just delivers a huge menu of solid tacos and I'm always there.

Yeah, wide ranging too, like, and vegan and vegetarian options. It's really cool to see them there, especially in Encinitas. It's always like a. People have their. It's like city tacos or taco shop for that level of taco. Depends if you want to wait in line or not, I guess is what it's about. And both have multiple locations around town too. Greg, you've recently moved and hit up a few other cities. I know. You know, Texas has got its own, like, Tex Mex scene. Anything notable from there or it's. Or nothing compares to San Diego.

It's different, you know, Tex Mex. I think the comparison between like coastal Mexican versus Tex Mex, it's so much earthier. It's still very good. Very lively, but definitely a lot heavier. It made any time I had good Tex Mex there. I still, like, there was always something back my mind. Like, I wish this was San Diego Mexican, though. But I will say the. The barbecue there, it legitimately can't be matched. It's so good in Texas, it's unreal.

That's true. We do lack that here, except for Cardiff crack, but I still don't. I don't think that meets Texas barbecue. Like, Texas would laugh at us a little bit, but we do what we got. The one thing I do love about Texas is they. They know queso as well. Like, they can really dress up some cheese. Not just cheese sauce, but like the meats and everything else. And the salsas inside, like a queso.

Dip, well, the barbecue spots, they would add in like chop brisket inside the queso and then, you know, it just blows your socks off.

Well, we are now very all hung, very much all hungry here.

Yeah.

So I think it's a good time to wrap up before we go get some food. Guys, congrats on building this, bootstrapping it, the two of you putting out a product. It's got to feel so good to have taken this idea and making it come to fruition. And like you said, there's still so much more to learn as well too. So we're excited to continue to watch your journey. So keep it up and congrats.

Thank you so much.

Thanks so much. Sunil.

Yeah, thanks for having us.

Of course. Appreciate it. Cheers guys. Thanks thanks for tuning in to the Tacos and Tech podcast. You can find all of our episodes on freshbroodtech.com as well as on Twitter @tos and TechPod. Also follow Freshfood Tech on all of our social platforms and make sure to share and give a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or Google Play. Thanks again.

Startups get the party Startups get the party started. Startups get the party Startups get the party started. You want tech and tacos, tacos in tech, you know we got it hey. Startups get the party Startups get the party started. Startups get the party Startups get the party started. Startups get the party Startups get the party started. You want tech and tacos, tacos in tech, you know we got it.