Why Your Content Isn't Getting You Clients (It's Not the Algorithm)

So a few months ago I sat down with this guy, Cassidy, here in Las Vegas. He has a podcast studio here and he's actually an ex-engineer who walked away from a corporate job and now he buys short-term rentals. He teaches real estate and he has a podcast paid community and he's helping so many others do the same thing. So he asked me to be on the pod. We didn't plan anything. I literally just walked in the studio and then he hit record. We got into the specific mindset shift that everybody needs to in order to crush it this year and also how to create the kind of luck that not only changes your business but will change your life. If you've been waiting, if you've been thinking about starting something new and taking it to the next level, this combo is going to help you so much. Let's get into it.

Where are you at on YouTube as a platform? Yeah, like informational content, because I get stuck in this trap of, is this good content? Am I just going to become this whiteboard real estate guy, or what value am I actually adding to people's lives?

The content actually needs to help people. So they should be able to watch one of your videos, go implement something, go try it in their business, or try a strategy that you're teaching and actually see some improvement. So like your free content used to— needs to be what used to be courses and stuff that people would sell in a community and things like that. Now it's okay to have more deeper, like deep dive into it, but I think as far as giving people actual tactics and showing them, it's— that's what the YouTube video needs to do. But I think there's a, there's a nuance there. You don't want to get too deep into here's the exact software and here's the thing like that becomes more of a tutorial. And that's like super niche. But I think for broad appeal, you would just talk about the concepts and give them enough to get them excited about it.

Okay. So like we were talking about the short-term rental loophole, right? Yeah. I, I know about the taxes. I know how I can save everybody hundreds of thousands of dollars in their taxes. But I also just think like, oh, everybody already knows that. Or is that too technical? How do I, how do I get this message across for people to understand? And this is, this is meant to help people out there that are like wanting to create content. And have information, like how do I get my message across?

Yeah.

And help people in a more technical field like taxes and real estate.

Well, I'll give you an example. I was at a conference one time and there was this guy, Evan Carmichael, who's like a YouTube genius guy who talks about— he's helped all the big, these huge names, celebrities, influencers build their YouTube presence. And I just ran up on him in the hallway afterwards like, hey, Evan, how could I grow my YouTube channel? Like, what's the number one thing you would give to me? I gave him a little bit of background. He's like, well, Neel, if you and I just went and grabbed a beer right now, what could you talk about for an hour off the top of your head? No script, no notes. We could just talk because you're that interested in it and you have that much knowledge on it. And I was like, content marketing or building personal brand. He's like, okay, so that's what you need to talk about and go make an hour-long video on this. So I didn't know— this was years ago. I didn't know anything about packaging, YouTube, what works, tags, title, thumbnail. I didn't know any of that shit. So I literally just sat at my desk, turned the camera on and talked for an hour. And that one video for an hour did like 200,000 or 300,000 views. And I didn't even have any subscribers on YouTube at the time. So it just taught me like, okay, you, you need to know what you're talking about. People can tell. I think their like BS meter is really strong right now. So you need to be able to know what you're talking about. But then if you're coming from a good place, you're teaching people things and you're giving them true case studies. So the other thing I looked back because, uh, whenever something successful, Look back, success leaves clues, right? So why did that video do better and why did it blow up when I didn't even have it optimized? It's because I was talking about a real case study. So I think today, if you're talking about things in theory, pie in the sky, people are like, well, they don't really connect with it. But if you're like, I just used this thing to save this much in taxes, here's a client of mine, either your own case study, which is powerful, or one of your clients' case studies, and you walk them through the real math, the real numbers. That's going to connect with people. So I think a really powerful piece that everybody could make for this piece of content would be a case study. Like you walk them through a real example of how you use this, acquired this property. Here was the numbers on it. Here's how you saved on taxes.

And what about people that haven't done anything yet?

So then they could use somebody else's, like a client, you know, and that's the hard part. Like if you haven't done anything, the advice would be to go do something. You know, it's like, what's the strategy? For becoming an influencer is like, go do stuff and then talk about it and then do bigger stuff and then talk about that. And then it just, you know, but if you haven't done anything, I feel like it's going to be tougher to make the content. You can make the content about other people, so you could do a case study on somebody else. I've seen people blow up using that, but ultimately, like, if you want your brand to stand out and your personal brand to take off and you want to sell products and services and build a business off of that, I think you actually need to do it. Like you have to be in it, you know, product of your own advice.

And so who are the ideal people to start their personal brand right now?

So I would just say, like, if you have something to share, don't discount it. Like you just talked about this before we went on camera. You're like, bro, sometimes I scarcity mindset. I'm like, who would really want to learn this? Is there enough people who want to learn from me? So don't say that because you are the most qualified to teach the person who is just like 1 or 2 steps behind you. I think there's a misconception. People think I need to be like big-time influencer with subscribers and followers in order to teach. No, you just have to have done something, gone from A to B, so I can help you go from A to B now. So if you've gone from A to B in any area of life, you should have— you can build off of that and talk about your experience as a personal brand. Now, if you've done nothing and you want to build the brand, then your strategy should be to build in public. So that would be like, guys, here's what I'm working on and come with me on this journey, and then share your learnings and share the things along the way. I think people want to BS and say that they're already there when they haven't gotten there. Like, why don't you just be honest and say, hey, I'm building this thing, come along? Like, I think people really get connected and they'll, they'll follow along with that and support you.

I want you to name names who failed.

No, yeah, that's true. You see it all the time though. Like, I remember a kid came up to me at a conference, a real estate conference, and he's like, bro, I loved your talk, thank you so much, I'm really going to implement what you did, and what's like your best advice? So I told him this: build in public. Like, Talk about it. Be honest that you're new to the business, you're growing. And he's like, well, would you mind looking at my Instagram so we could like, like you could give me some feedback? So I pull up his Instagram and the first line says top producer. I'm like, didn't you just say you just started? So I'm like, okay, literally you're starting off by lying to the audience, saying you've already made it when you just started. Like, just be honest and be like, I left this industry to join here. I'm bringing a unique perspective. I'm a fresh young energy to, to an industry that I think is old. And I'm going to like, we're going to take off and follow along. Like, people would want to support you without the experience if you're just straight up about it.

And so what's stopping people from like, why do people feel the need to?

I think it's just insecurity. Like, people think that like, people don't want to drive this shitty Honda because they want to look to their friends like they already made it. The truth is nobody cares anymore. Like, if you pulled up, I pulled up in a Range Rover. If I pulled up in a freaking, uh, I don't know what, like, whatever, you know? Yeah, yeah. Would you think less of me? Would you guys think less of this content? No, honestly, nobody cares anymore. I think it used to be a flex years ago. So if you're buying things to impress other people, it's really not impressing anyone anymore. You should be buying it because it makes you feel good. You like those things. I wear a nice watch because I like it. I always wanted it, so I bought it. But I'm not worried. Like, yes, people notice it, but if nobody notices, I don't care, you know? So you have to just do it for yourself. But I think there's just this insecurity I see, especially men and entrepreneurs, like, guys are weird about it. They, they really want to act like they've already done it. Like, they want to be at a certain level. And if you would just humble yourself, the best part, like, you're skipping the growth part to look like you already made it. And that's the part that you learn everything. That's the part you make the valuable connections. That's the insights that you can share later. So I spent like 5 years in that muck. I'm still in it, honestly. And that's been the most valuable part for me, is I just share what I'm doing along the way. My best talks right now that I give publicly are simply me sharing an experience and what I learned from it and how you guys could apply it.

Can you give me an example?

So I'll give you example. Like, one of the— this is a weird example and I just did it for my private mastermind. I wanted to have Alex Hormozi speak at our annual event 2 years ago and our Forward event. We do this huge event every summer. Well, Alex doesn't speak at events, you know, and if anybody's ever tried this, like, it's impossible and it doesn't work anymore either. But I remember just going through years of trying to like reach out to him, how we structured it, how I got into his network and all these different things and failure after failure, like getting shut down. And then what? And then eventually it happened and how cool it was. But what did I learn from that whole experience? What I learned from him? And then also, how could you apply it? And the whole way it worked out was through a shared connection. And so the purpose of the talk was Everybody watching or listening right now is one connection away from changing your life. And you don't realize it. Like, you might meet someone through a video, through an event, through, through networking that can connect you to an opportunity that changes the game for you. But you just have to be in the room. You have to put yourself in a position to win. And so that's the best part about personal brand is like it creates those type of opportunities for you. So when someone's like, well, why should I start doing this? I don't know what it's going to be ROI-wise. That's the coolest part. If you know exactly what the ROI is, then it's boring, bro. Like, you do deals right now where you buy the property, you flip it, you're going to make this much money. It probably wasn't exciting for you in the beginning.

Yes.

It's not as exciting now.

No.

Because you know what's going to be like. That's the coolest part about these opportunities. And these are asymmetric opportunities. So symmetric opportunities, you put this much money in, you get this much return, you know it. Asymmetric is you put this much time or money or whatever it is in The upside is uncapped. You don't know. It could be $100 million. It could be worthless. And so that's the cool thing about putting yourself in the room and doing that. So I taught that and I remember teaching this and people like, I could see like a spark in their eye as you're teaching, like, oh shit, I didn't— there's a guy I want to connect with. How could I connect with— how could I reverse engineer getting this person to do a podcast with me? And you've gone through this too. How could you get someone to sit here with you? You have to find a shared person. You have to maybe see if they're launching a book. You have to figure out some angle to get in there, and then that person sits down with you for an hour. Now, if you do a great job, the content is good. Now you have a connection with that person. They might offer you an opportunity now, maybe down the road. So that's the whole point of doing this.

One of the reasons I started the podcast was because I was getting bored.

Yeah.

And so you talked about do cool shit and share it and talk about it. Yeah, that's part of the, like, thesis behind this podcast is like I came from corporate. I was an engineer. Like, how big and how expansive, how many cool people can I meet? Who can I go talk to? And can I be an inspiration to others to go do the same?

Yeah. And it's also like anybody can do it. So that's a big part of my personal brand as well is like, hey, I'm just a nerd from Reno, Nevada. Like, I'm doing that. My videos were terrible. I wasn't making any money from content. My business wasn't doing well. And then all of a sudden it started doing well because I stuck with it. And so there's, I think there's just something to be said for doing something without, uh, with just with the goal of getting better at it, not necessarily wanting a huge outcome. But then in— it's kind of weird, like the way the universe works, you get the outcome. You do by not trying, you know. It's just kind of like when you're trying to get the girl, you're trying too hard, and then she— it pushes her away, you know. That's, that's how it works with this stuff.

Yeah. And like, is my goal to be one of the top podcasts in the world? Yes. Am I there yet? No. Yeah, but look what I'm doing right now. I'm living in my dream right now. I'm living in the thing that I said that I wanted to do, and I'm keeping commitments to myself and I'm learning and I'm growing and I'm expanding. And these opportunities, you and I, you, you were here because I interviewed Omar. He invited me back to an event that he was doing, a live podcast, which is— I do live podcasts also. Yeah. And literally walked in the door and just ran into you and you're like, hey, let's do the podcast together.

Yeah.

Yes, please. Yeah. And you don't know those things that are going to happen. When you start to do the thing that you want to do. You just literally can't know. The universe hasn't given it to you yet. But that's what happens when you start doing the thing that you're meant to do.

Yeah. And that's luck sometimes. But you're in the room to get luck, you know? So I just think of— so Hill Bloom taught me this. He's like, increase the surface area of luck and then more luck happens. So someone might be like, dude, that guy gets this opportunity. How did he— he's lucky. I mean, he knows all the right people and I don't. Well, how did you know all the right people? You just start putting yourself in these rooms, start asking questions, just talk. The other part is don't be scared to ask, you know, like you get more courage, but the more you want to connect with people. I have found that the most successful entrepreneurs, they love teaching, they love helping people, like they love pulling people up and helping them along the way. That's why they're, they're so passionate about what they do. That's what made them successful and they love teaching other people. Now you have to do it with respect. Of course, you can't just email, DM people and say, hey, can I pick your brain? Which is a terrible way to do that. You want to add value, get in the room. Probably the easiest hack to connect with the high-level person is to simply support their business. Yep. Number one way. So before you can become a friend, become a customer. Mm-hmm. It's the easiest thing. So I remember doing this with like everybody who I wanted to connect with. Grant Cardone, Gary Vee. What are they doing right now? I remember Gary Vee I wanted to connect with and he was pushing his new shoe with K-Swiss at the time. This is like 5 years ago. And so he had this thing one day on Instagram where he wanted to be the number one shoe for K-Swiss that year and he wanted to blow up. So he wanted his audience to help him reach this goal. And so if you bought a bunch of the sneakers, you could come to this private thing in his office. I was like, dude, no brainer. So I bought like 5,000 pairs of K-Swiss and then I got to meet Gary Vee and hang out. And then that led to a podcast that led to a thing, led to another opportunity, led to some content. So it was a really cool opportunity. But, you know, It wasn't me cold DMing him like that could work too, but it was me buying something that supported his stuff. It's not about the money. It's about with these people, it's about supporting their products and services.

That's right. I've done it for almost every single guest that I've had. Books, books. I bought stuff from Omar. I've bought courses and like everything that I can think of. And I pay full price and I leave a good review, right? The best thing that you can do for anybody, whether you want to network with them or not, is pay full price for their product or service.

And dude, there was a guy who is a multi-multi-millionaire and he's in the financial space and he, he provides consulting advice to like athletes and entrepreneurs and celebrities. And I wanted to get him on a pod or do something with my mastermind. And so I could message him cold, like we knew each other, we'd run into each other in a hallway essentially, but we weren't really friends. And so I noticed he was putting on an event in Nashville So I just bought a VIP ticket to the event and like as soon as he announced it, paid full price. Don't ask for a discount, just pay full price, buy the ticket. It was like $5K or something like that. And he DM'd me and he was like, dude, thanks for support, really appreciate it. And I shared it, tagged him, you know. And so you would think, well, why does this person who's probably worth $50 million or I don't know, even more, who knows, care about a $5,000 purchase? Well, they do because it's their thing, you know. So it really connects with people. So I think it's not necessarily about the dollar amount. It's about just you supporting them and then what you can do with that. You can leverage it to meet, to talk more and get in their circle.

Exactly. Yeah. And people have this weird concept of like, oh, well, you're paying for friends, but you're not paying for friends. Yeah, you're paying to get in the room, you're paying for access. And nobody thinks about the cost of the ticket or the cost of the mastermind or whatever it is. Once you're in the room, everybody's there, everyone's good people, and you can just share ideas. I got a call from Rich Summers, my buddy Rich Summers. Yeah. He's like, hey, we're flying a private jet down to Mexico. Do you want on? It's $5,000. I'm like, yeah, easy. Of course. And then I got to meet Carlton. I already knew Mikey. There was a group of so much.

Yeah, so much networking.

And I was like, who am I to be in that jet with them? But I made the investment. And that to me actually is something that I had to deprogram for myself is seeing those things as an asymmetrical return.

Yes.

That I don't quite know yet versus my engineer brain that looks at the symmetrical return. And that's why I got into real estate, right? Is because it's symmetrical return. But you don't know the asymmetrical return. It's $5,000. Like, and if you're sitting out there thinking $5,000 is a lot of money, then you should keep listening to the podcast and you should listen to Neel Dhingra.

And like, yeah, it's not like I'm not telling anyone to waste money or go into debt, but I kind of am sometimes telling you to, you know, what do you have to do to get in the room? Like, And you should have a plan. You should have a business. You should have goals because you're not going in there with nothing. Like, you have a podcast, you have a way for connections to benefit you. Like, when I did that whole exercise with the group, they're like, who are you one connection away with? Well, one guy was like, hey, there's a developer in my market. If I could team up with him, he's in mortgage— I'm— or I'm in mortgage and he's in real estate. We could do some big things. Like, I just want to be in his network because it would benefit my business and it would be a cool connection that I could leverage to get the next one. Cool. There's a reason why to meet— you want to meet that person. So if you just want to meet them because you're a fan, like, that's not really going to benefit in it. So you can definitely connect some of these opportunities to business goals. So that way you feed the engineer part of your brain too, where you're like, hey, I'm going on this plane because I could get guests for the pod. I could, you know, do this. I could bring that person into my community. Like, whatever it is that your business is, it's going to help the business. Yeah.

And sometimes it's just a Hail Mary and it's an experience.

Yeah, there you go.

How do you feel about delayed gratification?

So this is what I would say separates successful people from broke people is their payoff window. So broke people have a very short payoff window. So I'm going to try this and if it doesn't work in 30 days, I'm done. Versus the most successful people I know, they have a long payoff window, delayed gratification. So they might say, I'm going to start doing content, I'm gonna start a podcast. I don't know where it's going to lead. I don't even know if it's going to make money. It's probably going to lose me money. If you think about the time you put in, right? But I know this cool thing could happen down the road, so I'm going to do it. 5 years in, it turns into like, oh my God, I'm so glad I did that because it's made me $10 million, $50 million, who knows, right? But it could have been zero. So like, that is a long payoff window. That's delayed gratification. So the longer you can stick with something without getting paid for it, as long as you're on the right track, you need to make sure you're running in the right direction. Those are typically the biggest payoffs.

And so how do you go from the broke mindset, short payoff window, to the successful mindset and a longer payoff window.

So you would just pick some project that's gonna take a long term and then not dedicate all your time. So somebody will misread this advice and they're in a W-2, so they'll quit the job and go start the business or go start being a content creator. That's not what I'm saying to do. I'm saying keep the 9 to 5, but what are you doing after work? So for me, my 9 to 5 in the beginning, 6 years ago, was in mortgage business. And I still have that business, but I would spend 9, 8 hours, 9 hours doing mortgage. Then I would come home, eat dinner, hang out with the kids. And then from when my kids would go to sleep from 9 PM till 12 or 1 AM, I would work on my personal brand, work on content strategy, research, do all this stuff. So I had like 2 jobs and I remember not getting a lot of sleep during that time, but I remember thinking, wow, this is really worth it years down the road. So I was really bought in. I knew that this was going to pay off in the long term. I didn't quite know how, but I was doing it on top of this. I'm not saying quit. But dedicate some of your time. And in the beginning, it could just be your free time. Like, that's the biggest excuse I hear from people is, I don't have time. But like, if you audited your time, you do have time. You need like 2, 3 hours a day, or in the beginning, 2, 3 hours a week to dedicate to something that would pay you off in the future. So majority of the time in the beginning, you have to pay the bills. Like, if you especially have a family, you got to do that. Cool. You can't like not pay the mortgage. But what could you dedicate a few hours to and then graduate, you know, from there to keep leveling up?

But then what's stopping people from auditing their time, shifting bad habits into good habits, and going after what they want?

It's indecision, right? So it's overthinking, the number one thing. So this is why people get stuck in learning. So we should definitely— you got to watch this podcast, you got to listen to what we're saying. But then what do you do afterwards? I think all this great content has tricked people into thinking that learning is doing. So you spend hours learning, you're doing all this stuff, you've got notes, you've got threads in GPT and Claude about all these projects, but you haven't done anything. There's no business, there's nothing happening. And so I think people are waiting for certainty or they're waiting for confidence. And the problem is it doesn't come unless you do things. So like you might think you need to gather more information and then you'll do the thing. The truth is you have to flip it. It's backwards. You have to do something and then you learn everything you need to know along the way. What's also interesting is when you decide to do something just by simply making a decision, the universe helps you. People help you. Just, just— it sounds kind of hokey, right? But all of a sudden you're like, this connection you need happens. Like, it's because you've signaled to everybody that you want to do this, that you're doing it. And people are afraid to take that jump because they're waiting for some confirmation that never comes. So I have this 70% rule, bro. It says if you are 70% sure, go for it.

Yeah.

You don't wait for 100%. You'll never get it.

Yeah. And even after taking the step and the universe is rewarding you, then you'll actually figure out what you need to go learn too.

Yes. Right.

You're going to learn along the way and you're like, oh, I actually need to go read this thing or now I need to go use ChatGPT or whatever.

Yeah.

Because you've now figured out the next step or the next blockage that you need to uncover and you can use more information before you get to that point, you don't even know the information that you need to solve the next problem.

Yeah. And that only comes through doing the thing.

It only comes from doing. Yeah, I, I think we've forgotten how to do.

Yeah. Like, unfortunately. Yeah.

And coming from 9 to 5 and, and just being around people like, I don't see a lot of people doing. And it's not just about grinding. It's about like making a decision and a commitment to yourself And then taking the steps that are required. But we've— and I've talked—

and I'll give you like some examples of how people can get out of that. I've had several people work with me and then go on to launch things. And so it doesn't necessarily mean that you have to do it. You could go work with somebody and learn and just be upfront like, hey, my goal is to eventually do— is to be a free— to do my own business or do this. But I know I'm not there yet. And then again, this goes back to humbling yourself. And putting in the work so that you can have the freedom in the future. People want to skip that step. That step for me was like, I'm going to pay to be in these rooms. I'm going to work for other people. I'm going to go shadow this person. I'm going to do this work. I'm going to work for free. Just put me in the room, bro. Put me to work. What do you need help with? I just want to be around you.

Cool. So how long was that kind of ramp-up period?

So for me, I've been in the business, in my first business, for like a decade plus, stuck in mid-six figures, wanted to break out. So that's what how got me to 7 figures in my first business, which was mortgage, was personal brand. I started putting out content and then what I started doing is serving people in the industry who needed help so that they would refer me more business. And so that's how that— and then it started to lead to recruiting, then it started to lead to like all kinds of different things through that. I ended up launching another business to help people in, in my industry and related industries. And then I launched an event and a community and all these other things. These kind of happened by accident. But it all came from just helping other people. So I think whatever it is you're doing, you have to add value to other people. And so in the beginning it was like, hey, I'm not good at teaching, but that was the thing that I needed to get good at. Because if you can teach other people, they'll want to work with you, they'll want to refer you, they'll respect you. But I wasn't a good teacher. So I hired a coach to help me put together a presentation because I sucked at public speaking. So I got that. Then the next part was just doing it. There's nothing to replace doing the reps. So how do you put on a good presentation or training or class? You have to do a couple of shitty ones first, right? So I did some really bad ones. Like if I watch the video, it's cringe, you know, but that's how I had to do that. So I had to go through those phases of like, okay, I'm just going to do it. I'm going to announce the date. And so this is the biggest thing that helped me is just setting the date. So I'm going to do my first training or my first class for people in my industry on this day. What am I going to teach? I don't know. Let's come up with the packaging, the title. What are you going to get by coming to this? What are you going to present? I'll figure it out. You know, like, you will figure it out, by the way. The PowerPoint will be timestamped the day before, the night before, but you'll figure it out, you know. So I just think set the date and then start putting it together, get people in the room. And so that's what I did. And then through that process, it just kept leveling up from there and it turned into all this content as well.

Yeah. And so how do you look at personal brand is leverage.

So if you think about— it's the ultimate leverage because it's your reputation online, right? So you think about what are people saying about you when you're not in the room? What opportunities are there? And then it's the coolest thing because, you know, Warren Buffett says if you don't find a way to make money while you sleep, you're going to work until you die. And so right now, I don't know if everybody realizes this, but we're going through a major shift in the economy. It's been happening and then people are starting to become aware of this. And it's also true for most industries. So it used to be a bell curve distribution curve of like, there's a lot of people who are doing okay. You can make a decent living, you can make good money. And then on the other side of the curve, there's people making crazy amounts of money, doing really big things, but there's a big amount of people in the middle. Well, what's shifted now is it's become inverted to a power curve. And so what this means is like, there's a bunch of people struggling. There's a bunch of people in this middle muck area. And then as you get up into the curve, there's people getting bigger benefits. And then as you get higher in the curve, there's people getting enormous benefits. And so it's kind of, it's kind of sad to say, but like, think about this stat that just came out this past summer. There was a record set for the number of Americans taking a trip overseas to Europe. Like, this is wealthy, affluent people flying, maybe even private, who knows. So record set the same year in the fall. There's a record set for the number of people at food banks.

Hmm.

It's, it's this power curve. There's so many people struggling and you could say, hey, this isn't fair. What's happening to the middle class? What's happening to average? Well, it's just the way it is. Like, I'm not waiting for politicians to do anything. They seem to be dumber, like dumber than ever, and they can't agree on anything. So who's going to help you? Nobody. You have to help yourself. And your goal should be to continue to move up that curve. And so the best way to do that is through personal brand. So the best way would be like, okay, what can you teach? Either you're building something or you have some expertise. You've gone from A to B. You don't need to be an expert yet to start this process. So what could you help people with? Uh, the best way to get rich is to help other people get rich. Like that— I don't know who said that shit, but it's so true, right? So what could you help people with, and how can you start that process? And then you start moving your way up, and you should be documenting along the way, and you should be honest and authentic along the way. Like, I would tell people, hey, I'm doing my first class, I'm doing my second class, I suck at this, anybody have any tips on public speaking, let me know. I'm not trying to act like I'm the big time guy, I'm just saying, hey dude, I'm just trying this stuff. And then years later, people will come to our events and be like, hey, I've been following along since the beginning, dude. I'm just inspired by the journey. I just want to come and support. Like, that's really cool. So you can talk about as you're building, and then you can launch things and do things. You'll get things along the way. I remember Jesse Itzler, who's like a billionaire, he spoke at one of our events a few years ago, and backstage he told me that the biggest wins for him were things that weren't on the roadmap.

Mm.

Like huge deals, big opportunities. Zico coconut water, this deal, that deal. Matt Damon story. Like all these crazy things that happened because he was just building in the back room. There's a conversation that leads to this meeting that leads to Coca-Cola. Like all these just crazy shit happened to him over the years because he was building his personal brand, you know, like he didn't plan on starting a private jet company or selling it to Warren Buffett. Or starting a coconut— like, all these cool stories happen because he just was in the mode of building his brand, sharing what he's doing, talking to more people, and then it just levels up from there.

I think the other piece of that, and it's tied into personal brand, is who you're being as a person. Yeah, right. And so, like, Jesse Itzler and, and some other folks that you've mentioned, like, the way that they're being and showing up is attractive to people. And so I, I think about who I was before and also my coworkers and people I was surrounded by at my job. And I'm like, I think people have a fear of who they are and putting themselves out there.

Yeah, they're not comfortable with themselves. And so it's okay to start. Like, I was there. Like you just said, you were there. And I think it's a matter of just getting over the hump through the reps. So you don't have to have it all figured out to get going. You don't need to know the whole roadmap in order to start the journey. So it's going to be like, okay, where am I at now? I need more confidence, like I need more stuff. And you get it through the actual process. And what happens is if you have a— if you're coming from a good place, like you're not trying to scam people, you're learning, you're good, you're a good person, it'll come through. Like I said earlier, people are really good at viewing somebody's authenticity right now. Their BS meter is like super high right now. So you can tell when people are BSing. You can tell when somebody's not doesn't know what they're talking about, but they're trying to pretend like they do. I think right now we're in a trust recession because everybody's questioning everything. So when you see an image, you're like, is this AI? When you see somebody teach, are they lying? When you see somebody tell you that they're an expert, who are you to tell me this? Like, everybody's just questioning everything. And you'll see it in the comments on anything that goes viral. You'll see a debate happening in the comments of people calling this a lie. This doesn't really work. And then so it's kind of like you find what you look for right now, right? So in that world, the only way to kind of get beyond that is to just be fully authentic and then to be consistent, like sharing it on a consistent basis. So I feel like a huge mistake— I don't know if you've seen this too— is like people will start, go really hard for 2 months, not see anything, and then stop. Yeah, they fall off for like 6 months. Then you run into them at an event, you're like, hey dude, what happened to your stuff? I don't see you on there. Oh dude, I got busy. I'm not posting anymore, you know. So you have to stick with it and not fall off because that's where you lose the whole progress.

So how do people Remain consistent.

What is your thing going to be? So for example, my— I'll just give you my experience was I'm going to teach. Here's the main topics I'm going to teach and find the pillars of content I'm going to be putting out. And then how often am I going to do it? And I think there's something to be said for not trying to do everything at once. If you dilute your efforts, you really get nowhere. So I would go into a focused thing of like which platforms I want to go on. Like somebody's telling me right now I need to do LinkedIn. Well, bro, I haven't logged into LinkedIn in a few years and I'm not going to right now, you know, because I'm focused on Instagram and which is connected to Facebook. And then I'm now focused on YouTube and then I focused on writing on X and Threads, right? So I started to do them. And then once you have some momentum and once it doesn't feel like a big lift, then you could add the next thing. Then you can add a team member. I think a huge thing that would help people is getting help, you know, like hiring someone to help you with this because there's only so many hours in a day. So I think I would ask you, would you be scared to hire someone at $70,000 a year right now to help you? Because I remember we walked in here with one of our content creators and like, and maybe that's a six-figure investment for somebody. Would you be scared to invest that?

Yeah, of course.

But I think you're scared because you think you have to write a check all at once.

That's right.

You don't. You just pay this month.

Yeah.

And then if it doesn't work, like, you know, for either party, It can end like— so I think you have to reduce the risk and just say, okay, I'm not committing to years of hundreds of thousands. I'm committing to one month or 90 days, see how this goes, and then continue from there. So that's how I started with hiring people because you need help. Nobody who's done anything major has done it on their own. There's some level of help. I know now there's AI and stuff to help you, but still there's not enough hours in a day.

No, there's not enough hours in a day. And that's how I hired my assistant.

It was probably scary at first.

Yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah. And it's funny that you say that. I probably— I think I have to pay the whole amount up front, right? You're not I don't like doing the math on my, you know, it's like, wait.

Well, also, if you just do the math and say it's like $7,000 this month because it's not just the pay, it's benefits, everything, tax, payroll taxes. There's a lot more cost. I get it. So that's the cost. Okay, well, is this person being in your business— can you add that much revenue this month? And if the answer is yes, like, it's a no-brainer.

That's right.

And if you're 70% sure, remember, if you're 70% sure, go for it because you'll never get the 100% certainty. So just if you're like, you know what, I think this works, Let's go then. Because what you'll find is, anytime you bring somebody on, increase your overhead, you work harder. You ever notice that? Like, you're like, I need to go make more content. I need to go get more deals because I need to cover this cost.

Yeah. And it's a level of accountability. They're, they're moving faster than I am, or they should be moving faster than I am, because they're off doing their stuff while I'm doing my stuff. And they're like, I need more, I need more, I need more. I'm like, okay, okay. Yeah, you know, and so then it and then that does open up the door like, oh, I do need someone. Everyone's looking at me, the shorts editor, the longs editor. They're like, hey, what do you want to do about all this content? I'm like, I don't know. I need someone that actually knows.

Yeah, it's about like I'm where I'm at right now because I've had the benefit of working with great people along the way. I have great people I work with right now. So it's just a lie for people to be like the solopreneur. I do it all. Like, yeah, you do a lot and you're the brains, you're the, you're the face and maybe the talent., but there's a lot of other people you need help from.

Yeah.

You can't do it alone.

No.

Even think about Dan Martell. I know both of us have had him on the podcast. Well, who's Dan's right-hand guy? This dude Sam. Sam. Sam's a genius, like in content, if you think about it. And he, he didn't start that way, but he got there because he's obsessed with content and he helped Dan. So Dan will tell you, hey, I wouldn't— my channels and my content wouldn't be where it's at without Sam.

Yeah. And it's true. Yeah, it's true. And I had Sam on too. It was a great episode. It was the first episode that actually performed really well., and Sam laid it all out there and he's still posting clips from that episode almost a year ago.

Yeah, because it's all still relevant and Sam's a genius and Sam knows his stuff. That's the whole point. Like he, he lives, breathes and eats content. And so when he talks about content, he knows the game.

I think, and I can say this because this is where I've been in the past, is people have a hard time with their own leadership.

Yeah.

And not getting frustrated and being able to lead people and stay consistent in the vision and hold people accountable and be loving and, you know, all the things that it takes to be a good leader.

Yeah.

And so then they go and they hire VAs.

Yeah.

And they—

it doesn't work.

It doesn't work.

Yeah.

No, you can do some stuff, but it's, it's just to say it's like kind of the same thing with AI is like it can really only take you so far. Yeah.

And I think some of the VA stuff is going to be removed through AI like it already is. If you have, for example, by the way, from just a quick— I know this isn't about AI, but anybody who's using AI right now, if you're still using ChatGPT, that's great. But like, you need to move on to other things like Gemini or Claude and other tools. So I still use ChatGPT for some stuff, but I've moved on and getting way more output out of Claude. And this past week, something that's gone super viral is this new tool called ClaudeBot. Claude, I think it's called ClaudeBot. Yeah.

ClaudeBot.

Yeah. People are installing it on their computer, on their phone, and it's basically your VA, but it's AI. Connects to all your systems and APIs and it can do everything that a VA can do, but it's AI. And so that replaces that $2,000, $3,000 VA. But then the, the person you can't replace is the boots on the ground person, the ear assistant, the person that you can talk to that's a real human that can get stuff done. And then that person can be using AI to increase their output. So I don't think like AI is going to replace anybody valuable. It just replaces the robots. Are the people who don't bring value.

That's right.

Yeah.

The people that are not— yeah. And they're not building their skills and they're not improving, they're not growing, they're not adding value. Right. They're not changing with the times.

Yeah. So that would be like one skill for— I'll give you an example of this for people looking to level up and they're like, well, what am I going to do? I just have a job. I'm kind of interested in the real estate thing. I kind of like what Neel Dhingra said about personal brand. I'm a content— I love content, but I don't know what I would make content about. So I'll give you a great use case. And I've seen so many people make an insane amount of money in the last 12 months, and this is going to continue. They go deep on an AI tool. They just start spending their free time becoming an expert at this. It could be ClaudeBot, it could be Claude, it could be the new tools. Then you start sharing what you're learning, not pretending like you're the expert, just sharing what you're learning. At a certain point, relatively quickly, if you're interested in this, you will be close to an expert level in that thing compared to the average person. That person will pay you a lot of money. Like, if somebody came to me right now and told me they were expert at automations, AI, they could do this and this in my business, I would pay them right now. They could write their ticket. Those people don't exist. Like, they're very rare, and people are searching for them. I'm on X every day, and founders, people, entrepreneurs, creators are looking for talent and they can't find it.

Yeah. Zuck paid what, like $14 billion for the best in the world?

Yeah, bro. It's the most insane opportunity of our life. So when I talked about earlier, it kind of sounded doom and gloom where I'm like, this power curve, people are struggling. Then it's also never been easier to get into the top of the curve, like, because of technology. So use— yeah, use tech to just shorten. Like, it's the ultimate accelerator. You can go from zero to hero quick.

Because what you're really saying is like, take a skill, take anything that you know, anything that you know, and if you don't know anything, go learn it, right? Spend less than a month. You could probably in less than a month become an expert at one tool in AI. Or whatever, whatever the thing is, and then just go start posting about it. And those two things combined will allow you to go create a business or something where you're correct.

You could work, you can work for somebody. I'll give you another use case. There was a guy who I saw speak at this school conference. So school is a learning platform, just like Circle or Kajabi or any of these platforms where you could sell, you know, your community, you can host your community, you can host courses and learnings. Well, school was blown up over the last couple of years because of Hormozyne and a couple of the things that that he did. But this guy started from scratch, from dirt, his content strategy around AI. Then he started an AI community. He is now the number one AI or the number one community overall on Skool platform, and he makes over $1 million a month from zero, bro. And he's start— he's making 7 figures a month. Like, he makes way more than— like, he's making double what I make annually. This is crazy. And I'm like, dude, this is wild. And I've been in business 20 years. And this dude looks like he could be my son, you know, like, bro, this is crazy. I'm 44 years old. He's in his 20s. And he's, he's outearning me. And he's probably on a trajectory, he's gonna make even more. Because he just got started.

The bar is so low. Yeah, right now, people don't realize how low the bar is.

But you just have to be obsessed. The reason why that guy makes $1 million a month is because he, he eats breathes and sleeps AI. He became an expert at it through his own curiosity. He's lucky because I'm like, he has all the free time in the world. He's probably a single guy. He doesn't have family or whatever, so he can just spend literally 18 hours a day if he wants on these things. And he did. And then he— that comes through in his teachings, that comes through in his content. He's obsessed with all of it.

Like, people think $100,000 is a lot of money right now. Yeah, even $150,000 as a salary is a lot of money. You could get to that level in a couple months with the right amount of dedication and leveraging the skill set that you have and sharing content online.

Yeah, you just have to be that type of person. And then also, you know, there's other things like he became good at speaking on camera, he became good at content.

Like, that's all part of the journey though. That's what it is.

And there's talent involved too. Like, I'm sure some people— for me, it took me 2 years to get good at public speaking. For somebody else that's more talented than me, it might take you 2 months. So everybody's learning curve is going to be different. It took me over a year just to get comfortable doing a selfie video, bro. Like, I would literally, like, do 20, 30 takes. Still to this day, I'll do like 10 takes sometimes, but I would be afraid of everybody. Is anybody seeing me? I would second-guess myself, lack of confidence, not want to hit post, all the shit, you know, the dumb stuff in our head that stops us from executing.

So what was it that kept you going, kept pushing and doing 20 takes?

Getting the feedback from a few people. So if you're on the right track, you'll get little hints of success. It won't be a lot, but someone will be like, hey dude, your video helped me. Or you go to an in— like a local industry thing and they're like, dude, I love your videos, man. Keep going. You're like, okay, I'm on to something now. You know, I remember teaching a shitty— what I thought was a shitty class to 6 people, bro. Only 6 people showed up. And one of the people in the class came up to me afterwards. He's like, hey bro, I learned more with you today than I've learned the whole month here at this company.. And I was like, oh shit, I'm on to something, you know? So those little hints give you— it's gold. Like, I still to this day screenshot every DM, every message. I'm sure you get messages like, hey dude, this podcast really helped me from a dark place. That is the most inspiring thing to me. I get so much fulfillment from the feedback and it's, it's not like they're paying you either. They just gave you their attention.

Yeah, it means a lot to me. It means the world to me when people reach out and message and tell me how it's helped.

Yeah. So that's what drives you to make the next 20 episodes. That dude's one DM, which is also why people should let creators know if your stuff is helping. Like, bro, you never know the impact of just letting someone know you appreciate what they did. Nobody does it anymore.

No. Yeah, I think it's less and less, but that was what kept me going for a long time in the beginning was the, the people, the core audience, the ones that were—

Yeah. And it's, and it's hard today for creators than it was a few years ago. It's also easier because of tech. And because of AI and, you know, all these things that can help you scale. But it is harder because you get less feedback. So less people hit the heart button on Instagram, the less people hit the follow button, less people hit the subscribe button on YouTube. There's less people in comments, but you can't get deterred. You just have to keep going and it starts to get going. Nothing attracts a crowd like a crowd. So I noticed I didn't get any comments for a while and then all of a sudden you got 2 comments. Well, that leads to 12, that leads to 24, right? So you just have to get get the, the ball rolling.

I did want to talk about the gap that you talked about, the power curve or the wealth curve, whatever it is, because I started noticing this the last decade really with the wage gap. Yeah, right.

And just by the way, before you get into the question, the same is true for podcasts. How many are in the middle muck? How many are winning? The same is true for people in real estate. How many people make ungodly amounts of money and how many are struggling? So just apply this same curve to anything and it's true.

So what do we do?

Well, what it— what, like, let's just look at your example right now. You're on your way up for sure. Um, what is your expertise right now is short-term rentals. We were just talking about this, right? So you want to teach more people, you want to make an impact there. You also are helping, I would say, a young audience level up, leave their W-2, exit the rat race. And so you kind of can have both of these things going. Your mechanism for getting out of the rat race could be buying properties, short-term rentals, tax advantage. It could also be other things like from guests that you bring on, right? You were just talking about— yeah, we're talking about other things that we could teach people, how we could help people. So I would just find out like, what is the thing that really lights you up? I don't know if you— you mentioned that getting feedback from people gave you a certain level of fulfillment. That's the same for me. That's why I love speaking. I used to hate it, but I love it now because people afterwards will tell you how much of an impact you made. And they'll literally change the course of— it sounds cheesy, but they'll change the course of their business or their life based on 30 minutes they spent with you in a live room. That's huge impact, and that becomes like a drug. So I'm like, I want to do more of that, even if it doesn't pay me as much as some of the other things. I spend more of my time doing that because I know it'll lead to something big in the long term. So I would just find out like, okay, 70/30 maybe for you, like 70% of the time is spent on doing things, you know, like you can move the needle. And then 30% is kind of a moonshot thing. It could be the podcast, could be something with huge ups, unlimited upside, jumping on the private jet with the rich, all those kinds of activities, whatever you want to do. But then like, what's the core thing going to be? And so how do you monetize your thing right now?

I have a community. It's called Escape Velocity. It's because you need the push to get out of your— get out of the trap.

Okay.

And, and so there's community to help people buy the right type of real real estate to quit their job.

Okay, cool. So exit your 9-to-5 or start this as a side hustle and then eventually exit through real estate.

Yes.

Okay, cool. And then so that would be— is your goal of yours to grow that to a bigger level?

Yes, 100%.

Okay. So then that should be the focus of, you know, a lot of the content. A lot of the time is like, I don't know if you're being intentional about adding people to that community. Do you run ads? Do you do webinars?

I don't do ads. I've done a webinar. I talk to people in the DMs and I'll have calls.

Okay, cool.

But it's, but it's been less intentional.

Yes. So I would like, you just would get serious. You'd be like, look, man, my goal is to double the size of this group or triple it or whatever it is. Cool. And big goals, but then small plans. So big goal is like you wanted to have this podcast reach this many millions of people. Big goals is like, I think you even said you want to be Joe Rogan.

Cool.

That's big. Small action. It's today's Wednesday. We're shooting this video. So big goal, we need to double the community, the paid community, and double the revenue. Small goal is what are the things we could do to do that? Well, if you've had success with the webinar, why don't we do another one? You know, I do this all the time where you have success with something and then you're like, move on to the next thing. Yeah, well, why don't you run that play again? And so I had this really crazy meeting with Daniel Priestley. He was just on Diary of a CEO. He's been on— he's been blowing up on YouTube. He's been an author, all these kind of cool things. And I had the privilege of just connecting with him through a mutual friend, Luck. And then he flew out to Vegas to hang out with us. And so I got to talk to him and I was asking him and he was doing the same thing with me. He's like, hey, how do your events and your systems grow? And I was like, if I had to look at it, it's events and webinars. He's like, well, what's the recurring thing that you're doing? Like, what's the repeatable process every week or every month? And I was like, well, I kind of just do it when I feel like it. And he's like, Neil, are you dumb? You know, you found success with this. Why don't you redo it? And I was like, well, when I get tired of doing the same webinar, he's like, do you think Coldplay gets tired of playing their set tonight? Like they're getting paid. It's a lot of energy. It's fun. Like just have some perspective. Somebody's outside right now digging a ditch and you have to host a webinar.

Oh yeah.

Let's just like get it, man. I can push buttons on a computer.

You know, I don't— the only way I take this seriously is that I love it. I'm having fun and I'm helping people. Otherwise it's like, I'm so grateful.

Yeah. So just getting that place, getting back to a place of gratitude for what we get, what we get to do for a living. And then let's just do more of the things that work, run the plays that work instead of just dabbling and experimenting and getting distracted. So I think Hormozy's been talking a lot about this lately. He's like, you know, your success in entrepreneur is going to be determined by what you say no to, because we've never been this distracted. People are vying for our attention, starting a new business, start this thing, do this thing. I get, I get a new idea in my head every day, every morning.

Yeah.

I do have the ability to shut that down and focus on my plan. So that's okay. Like you can spend some of your time, but there's got to be something repeatable that's growing the business. So that way when you get to the end of the year or the end of 2 years, you'll notice that the thing kept growing because of that repeatable thing. So for some people it's paid media, but what does the paid media send them to? You know, lead magnet, buy the offer directly. If you've noticed people don't buy directly, they need to come on a webinar, then that would be the process. It would be organic and paid that leads to a paid webinar that grows your email list. And then the webinar, uh, not a paid webinar, um, it would be a free webinar in your case. And then you would offer the community at the end of it and you would just continue to do that. You can automate webinars as well through like WebinarJam or WebinarFuel. So that way some of this can be on autopilot. I do think that some of these automation things are starting to fade. People are actually like less— they're reluctant to buy when it's a prerecorded thing. They want it to be live. So I've found success lately on webinars of just make sure people know that this is live. So did you guys see— what do you guys think about the Seahawks win last on Sunday? I had money on, on so-and-so to score, you know, like whatever it is, the weather, whatever, and talk about like this is live. Ask questions in the chat. I'm here to teach, like I'm here to, to, to give value. And I do have something special to offer you at the end of this. But so stick around for that. And then so it's not like coming from left field that you have a paid thing that you want to offer them. But the main goal of it is you're going to be better off by coming to this. You're going to learn it's actually valuable for you. And then that thing can scale. And then now the business is going, you're making more money doing all the things, you know, plus you have the content, plus you have all the things going. But there's got to be just some basics that are just happening on autopilot.

I got a message from an old friend this week saying that he's going to unfollow me because all my content is about money. And I actually looked through my content and I was like, well, there's only a couple of pieces that are like specifically about money. And one of them is about saving on taxes.

Yeah.

The other is being able to go to Japan and ski with my friends, you know, and have that flexibility. And I chatted with him a little bit and he, he said, yeah, well, it's an interpretation. And it reminded me of how I was when I was just chasing money and, yeah, and all this stuff. And, and what do you, what do you say to people that have a negative interpretation about making money?

Well, I noticed this, like, when you're leveling up, when I wanted to be a better speaker, a guy who's really good at it will like want to help you and pull you up. Uh, when you wanted to talk about making more money and like the things you talked about, the things you aspire to do, people are going to be inspired by that. Wealthy people, successful people will be like, man, that's a great goal. Anybody on the journey is going to be inspired, but a few people along the way will talk shit, but it's always people who are just mad at themselves. It's a mirror, you know. So like, the hate never comes from above. It's always somebody who's mad at themselves and just angry at the world. And so you just kind of have to ignore those people. And the other thing I realized is we are really good at changing what we're doing to accommodate these people who will never do business with you. They're just mad at the world. They're mad at themselves. So I remember hosting an event and I get all this, all these people buying tickets and, and, and having great feedback. And then we did an anonymous survey at the end and hundreds of people are like, this is the best thing. Here's some things I could improve on, but like, this was awesome. And then somebody wrote in there like, hey, This event's too loud. I heard cursing and I just feel like, you know, you just don't respect the audience. I'm like, what? You know, I put my heart, soul, and money. I put like over $500,000 into that event that year. And somebody is complaining about, you know, these little ticky-tacky things. And I was like, well, should I next year, should I make sure that we don't curse by accident? Should I make sure that we don't do this and be perfect? I'm like, well, hold on a second. That person isn't even coming back. They weren't even like, it's not even my people. So why would I cater to that person? So you have to think about like that guy, he's on his own journey. He's probably has some issues with money based on his upbringing and what he's been programmed. That's why I always say like, if you came from a low or middle class family, that's fine. I did too, like middle class all the way. The first thing you need to do before you learn how to make money, what business, content strategy, the first thing you need to do is deprogram your mind. Because you are programmed in a scarcity mindset. And when you see success, you actually are maybe even angry that you don't have that success, or they must have it easy and you must have it hard. You have to unwind that thinking, otherwise you'll never break out no matter what business you get into.

The words that he used actually were that I was putting my faith in money. Yeah. And I was like, I don't put my faith in money at all. And I told him what my purpose was, to help people live their true purpose. That's my purpose, is to help people live their true purpose. Right? My community. That's what it's about. The money is a tool so that you can go live your dream life. I don't care if you become a full-time real estate investor. That doesn't— screw real estate. Like, I don't even care. Yeah, I want you to have a platform and a foundation of assets that you can then leverage to go live your true purpose.

Yeah. And I think as you get older, you'll find this too, that the whole money game, it's just like a scoreboard. People want to make this much money, that much money. The true test of wealth is freedom. So like, money is not what you could buy all these things. It's whether you could leave at 2:00 today and do whatever you want to do. Whether I could just take the weekend to do this with the kids, or if I want to not work out in the morning because the gym is crowded, I could go do it after lunch. Like, you do what you want to do on your terms and then you're free.

You—

that's the true definition of exiting the rat race is you have freedom. Now you need money to do that. You need money to have health care. You need money to have, you know, to put my kids in the school I want them to go to. Like, there's money is a tool for so many of these things. When we travel, we want to stay in a nice place. You need money. Like you said, you want to go to Japan. That's not free. But like, it's about the freedom and the experience. And so when you make it about that, I think it changes the goal because I did this experience where like we were thinking about upgrading to some crazy house like that we always wanted in this area, but it was so expensive and we could afford it technically on paper. But I just knew the level of stress it would put me in in terms of like, I don't want to be house poor.

Yeah.

At the time, you know, so I'm like, well, what if we did this other house? It's still like kind of— it's almost what we wanted, but it's way more manageable even though we could afford both technically. So we did it the other way, but it just opened up like just this whole anxiety. It just left of like, I don't have to be house poor. I don't have to worry about that. So I think there's— and you could be rich. So the guy living in the other nicer house that's double the price, he could be richer than me on paper, but I'm richer in time, you know? So like, everybody has to define their own definition.

It's why we started renting our primary.

Yeah.

My amount, the amount of energy I think about my house now that I rent versus own is like zero compared to looking for everything that I need to update. And, you know, and yeah, and that, like you said, you have to reprogram. The first thing you should do if you want to start a business is work on reprogramming your mind. And 100% agree. And I just posted about that this morning on my stories.

Yeah.

Someone asked what books I read, and I was like, well, the last couple of years I needed to deprogram my mind from corporate and scarcity and lower middle class, middle class. And so I listed all the books that I read that helped me do that because that was the goal that I needed to be able to just start spending money. And now I see money as a tool to go create what I want to go create. I'm like, oh, I got big dreams, I got big goals. I want to go do things not for making more money, only or specifically, it's I want to go have fun, I want to go create things. And you need resources, and money is a resource to be able to go do that.

Yeah, you can, you can tell these people as well, like, one of the best ways to learn the Soul Process and reprogram your mind is to start an entrepreneur journey or start your business. And you may not have all the tools, and like, so you might be like, okay, I'm starting this deprogramming thing and now I'm going to put something out there. You'll learn from the potential customers, you'll learn from the audience how you don't want to be. So I remember like people reaching out with this broke mindset thing, and then you're like, well, you know what, I'm kind of like that. Now I see it from this side of the aisle. I'm like, man, that's not good. So now I'm learning I don't want to be like that person. I remember a guy recently bought into one of our programs online, and then he, he, uh, he bought into it, and then he's like, hey, by the way, um, you know, I can't afford this right now, but I'm really motivated to do this. And if there's anything you guys could do to help me, I know this is a program that only allows an annual commitment. And he's like, if there's anything you could do to get me in on a monthly, I would really appreciate it. Like, I think of the world of you guys' content, whatever. Like, okay, well, let me try and help you out. Like, so we put together something custom for me to happen. And then 30 days in, he's like, hey, is there a guarantee? Because I found out like it's not for me and I would like a refund. I'm like, what? You didn't even show up. You didn't even do anything. So this guy who I bent over backwards for was the wrong person, you know, like the guy who just signed up and put in the work is the customer, not this person who wants you to. So I thought I was being nice and honestly, like, it just ended up backfiring, you know? So I learned something from that interaction of like, I don't want to be like that person. Also, where you should focus your energy on, you know, like somebody like that, maybe there's signs like you try and help everybody, but sometimes people, they'll, they'll tell you things that would indicate to you that this isn't something that you want to do, you know? And so you start to see that only through doing it.

Yeah, there's been a lot of mirrors in the last couple of years since I started going out on my own, and it's great. I'm, I'm grateful for feedback as a gift, right? Feedback is a gift. And that is feedback when you're around certain people like, oh, I am like that. I still have that, whether it's as bad or as extreme. But there's things.

Yeah. And just on this thing of feedback, I think this is a great thing you should do. I think everybody could learn so much from this. Uh, the best way to have a better marriage is to ask your wife for feedback. Like, hey, what can I do to be a better husband, right? The best way to be a better boss is like ask the people, hey, what could I do as a leader to help you with your job? Anything I could do to help you out? Like, I know we're telling you things you need to do, but like, what could I do as a leader? How about the same is true with your community? What if you ask the people in the community, what do you guys like? What do you not like? I'm putting together how we could make this thing 10 times more valuable next year. What do you guys want? What do you like? And what's one thing I could do to improve? Because people are really, uh, they feel reluctant to give you negative feedback. They— it's just awkward. But if you give them permission, they will. So the way I do this is like, say I'm speaking at an event and you're there, and then I come off the stage, you're like, hey dude, great job, you dabbed me up, it's awesome, cool. I would ask you, bro, what is one thing I could do to improve that talk? And you'd be like, you know what, Neil, in the middle you lost me here. I'm like, so you weren't even going to tell me that shit? You were just going to let me continue the next 12 talks because you don't want to give negative feedback. So you have to give them permission, ask them for the feedback.

Yeah, I actually just learned this lesson of feedback being a gift and that true love between friends, between partners, whoever, if you love somebody or if you care about somebody, giving them that feedback is actually showing them love and being a good friend, being a good husband, being a good wife. Yeah, because, yeah, like you said, I was just going to let you go and you had this thing going on and then you get to decide whether you keep it or not, right? You don't have to take my opinion and do anything with it at all, but it's feedback for you.

Yeah. This guy in our community is like, my fiancée is such a B-word and like, she's treating me like this and I don't even know if this is the right thing anymore. I just want to like get out. And I'm like, well, hold on, hold on a second. Pump the brakes. Like, what about your stuff? What are you doing? And, you know, what feedback do you need? You know, because people are always quick to blame everybody else, but like, what about yourself? And that's a hard thing to do. But that's the thing that's led to the most growth for me in all areas of life. And so anybody watching, listening, like, ask people, your mentors, ask people you work with, hey, what I want— my goal is to make more money next year. What could I do? Like, what could I do to drive more revenue? What could I do to make money? So like, you know, a lot of people who are W-2 that want to get into exiting that and get freedom.

Cool.

There's some steps along the way, I'm sure. Like, you can't just quit and then start buying homes and then be rich, right? You probably have a process for this, right? Well, one of the things that I noticed people can't exit is they don't have enough of a cushion, like a liquid savings or investments or things. So one of the things you could do before you exit W-2 would be to start making more money so you can put some cash, like start investing and do a little thing on your own. Well, how could you make more money? What if you talk to the people you work with and ask them how you could add more value? I'm guaranteed they would be happy to pay you more money. Like they need more help. And if you're driving revenue, they'll pay you more money. So like, those are the things like nobody asks. They're just like, you know, so that's, that's the process of exiting W-2 eventually and actually serve like, hey, I'm going to lock in, I'm going to do this for the next couple of years. My goal is to do something bigger in the future, but for now I'm going to lock in and do this.

It's what I teach on how to quit your job is actually get better at your job. Yeah. And get a promotion and make more money.

So best way to quit your job is don't quit your job.

Yes. Like literally, like keep working your job, go go make more money and go use that money to go buy short-term rentals, save on taxes, and keep doing that as long as you can, can withstand it.

Yeah. And then you can— then now you get— because you paid that cost, you get to live freedom in your 40s, 50s, 60s. Like, you can do whatever you want. Like, Cardone always says that, pay the cost now so you can pay any cost in the future.

Yeah, delayed gratification. Doing, doing the long term— the long-term win is always better than the short-term win. And if you have a purpose behind it, So I teach people, use your job as your purpose to quitting your job and becoming free, right? When you change your mindset and reframe your current job that you can't stand.

Yeah.

Into, oh, this is actually the thing that's going to create my freedom. Then it changes everything. You just didn't have any focus. You were just buying shit and you were drinking and smoking and you're doing all this shit on, on the weekends that you shouldn't be. And now you have a purpose and you show up to work at 6 a.m. every day. You leave at 6 p.m., you get raises, you get promotions, and you're funneling all that money into real estate. You and your wife and your partner having better relationships because you have a purpose towards creating a better life for yourself. But now what I see in that gap is people are lost, they're confused, they don't know what to do. They were promised something that they don't have. They racked up the debt, they got the cars, they have all this stuff and they're completely unfulfilled and they don't have a purpose and they don't have a why behind why they're living, why they're breathing.

Yeah. Just imagine like when you go buy something super dope, and you spend a bunch of money, like for a car, for example, and you sign yourself up for some high payment, dude, the, the drop-off from how cool it is is so quick now. Like, it might happen the next day. Used to be like it would make me happy for weeks, maybe months. Now it's like, dude, the next day I'm like, you know what, I'm over. Like, that's how quick the whole gratification thing happens. So I think you're not going to get fulfillment. You're not going to be happy buying things. Now, if you want it and you can afford it, cool, go for it. Like, I have nice things. Awesome. But I don't think that that's the path. Like, the path would be to take that money and build. And then like, you like people, like, let them think you're broke while you're stacking. And then all of a sudden you come back surprising everybody. It's like, bro, how'd you do that? Well, I've been building for the last 2 years. You just didn't see it.

Yeah.

You know, that's the key. Like, and then they will ask you, how did you do it? That's another business. Now you can launch your community, you know, like help me and jump on a call with me. I remember my first offer was like, jump on a call with Neel, run anything by Neel, like let's do a coaching call. I wasn't a coach, but I was just getting too many free requests. So then we started charging $500, then it went to $1,000, then now it's like $2,500, whatever. But I remember in the beginning it was just like, that's a, that's a product, that's an offer. Your time's not free. You want to jump on an hour call? I'm happy to help.

And when I launched my community, guess who the majority of the people that launched with me were? They were the ones that I did the free one-on-one calls with. Yeah.

Yeah. You can plant those seeds and then now, you know, but it was fun.

It was fun though. It wasn't me trying to sell them anything.

It was learning.

Yeah. Learning.

So that's, that's another cool thing that, that we should make this point. I remember speaking at an event recently and I went out there I spoke for the— and we— so I got done, I spoke for 45 minutes, I did 15 minutes of like Q&A, and we took some pictures with people like that were from Instagram. Like there was cool vibes. And then I had to leave because we had to go catch a flight. So we did it. We left. My video guy who was with me at the time is like, hey, how much did they pay you for that? And I remember this company paid me $20,000. And he goes, Neel, bro, that was the easiest $20K you ever made. It was like an hour. We were in and out. That was so dope. And it was fun. And I was like, easy, bro. You weren't there when I was doing this for free. Not only free, I was paying my own way. Or how about this? You weren't there when I paid $8,000 to get a booth at an event so that they would give me 7 or 8 minutes on stage. So just so I could get the rep and the footage that I could leverage to get another speaking opportunity. Like, so you have to put in that work to get these things. But what it taught me is that the thing that you're doing for free today if you stick with it and get good at it, you'll be paid for it in the future. And not only paid, you'll be highly compensated for it. So like speaking is just a side thing for me because I enjoy it. But now I make a quarter million dollars a year just for doing that for fun. It also leads to content and so many other business opportunities that are six-figure, seven-figure opportunities for me. But that thing alone I get paid for now. In the big— for many years I didn't get paid for it. Like podcast is free right now for you, for me too, but there's opportunities coming for us if we stick with it. So think about like that whole long journey of whatever it is you're doing for free content, speaking, teaching, like you did the free calls that led to a paid community. So do it for free for first, at first, so you can get good at it before you charge for it is the whole premise there.

Yeah. And then charge more than you think.

Yes. Yes.

Yeah. And then you'll figure it out.

Yeah. I remember wanting to offer a workshop for people and my business coach at the time is like, hey, Neil, Here's what you're going to do. It's a day and a half workshop. You're going to do this, this, this for people. It's going to be awesome. And so I want you to price this at $5,000 per person. I was like, what? Are you kidding me, bro? I'm not charging— like, I was scared to put that out there. This was in 2021. And I was like, well, he's like, Neel, hold on a second. You're someone who's going to give them the blueprint. You're going to do it hands-on with them in person. You're going to take a full day and do this. Your team's going to be there. That you guys are going to do this, they're going to leave with this deliverable, they're going to leave with this, they're going to— and it's going to be amazing. If you were coming up, put yourself in their shoes, but you 3 years ago, and somebody would have sat down and spent the time that's already gone through all the mistakes so you don't have to. And they did this for you. How much would you pay for it? And I was like, probably like $10K plus. He's like, so $5K is a deal. And I was like, it just reprogrammed my mind. Like, okay, this is that valuable. I am confident in the offer being worth this or more. So for me now, whenever I sell something, it's worth multiples more, sometimes 5x, 10x more than what I'm selling it for. And then I have complete confidence to offer it to people because I'm like, bro, like, you're, you're getting the better end of the deal here. Trust me on this one.

You know, that's right.

Yeah.

I've got a buddy, Brian Lubin. He's got a similar— he calls it Action Academy, similar community as me.

Yeah.

He says you got to give them 1,000x on their, on their dollar. That's his goal, is to give them 1,000x. And he does the math between like cash flow and equity and like, yeah.

Or even think about this podcast, like this is This is free. They're paying with their attention. Yeah, their time. But you're getting a return on your time spent with, with you on the podcast.

Well, cool.

That's, that's a huge multiple. It could be 100x, like you said, 1,000x on just free time that turned into thousands of dollars, hundreds of thousands of dollars. Who knows? So that's the new bar is like, is the thing actually valuable for you to charge? And it should be worth way more than what you're charging. And then you'll have the easy success because now you have confidence. The other thing that it gives you is this thing called with or without you energy, right? The best people are the people who don't need the sale. They're the best salesmen because like, dude, I would love for you to join and it's going to be awesome and help you. But if not, no worries, man. Like, no pressure at all. And they're like, wait a second, you know, they're used to like being hard closed and it's like that has a new energy about it. So I remember doing this at an event and we just invited people. It wasn't even a sales pitch. And the program was full just off of the invitation. Because I think people are getting over the whole salesy, blowing up their phone, hard closing. I just think that that ship has sailed or sailing right now.

So how did you get to that point where it was the—

so first time I had to do it, be scared, put yourself like jump in the pool and you learn how to swim. You know, I just posted 2 days ago that the way I got rich was I bit off more than I could chew and then I figured out how to chew it. Yep. You know, that's literally what I did. I started doing bigger things. I was like doing a small event. I'm like, why don't we do a 1,000-person event? Like, who told you that you have to go in steps? 100, 200. I did a podcast with Grant Cardone. He's like, who told you, Neel, that you have to keep buying single-family? Then eventually you could buy duplex, and then eventually you could buy a fourplex, and then you can buy an apartment building. Did you know that you can skip straight to the apartment building?

That's right.

And I was like, oh yeah, who told us this shit that you have to go like step by step, baby step, baby step?

It's old corporate, right? Yeah. You start as a janitor and you work your way up to CEO over 40 years. That's—

Yeah, but think about everybody else. They just skipped a few steps.

That's it.

They took the freaking elevator, you know? And so where's the elevator for you? So I said, I'm going to go from 70 people to 700 to 1,000 at our event. It turns out I'm going to spend the next 6 months putting this thing together and promoting it. It's the same amount of time whether it's for 60 people or 600. Might as well take a swing. Now, if I come short on the $600, I'm still way ahead of the game.

Yeah.

So what's the thing for you that would make you uncomfortable, whether it's a new business venture, whatever? Like, raise the target, swing. Even if you miss, you're still way ahead.

Yeah. I went through an exercise recently. We had to like kind of make a declaration, right? We were, we were helping feed the homeless.

Yeah.

And we had to declare how many we were going to feed in a 3-hour window at night. It was a fun exercise, actually. And we started at like, oh, like 200, 250, you know, kind of low. And then we ended up at 1,500. We were like, we're going to do 1,500. And guess what? We did about 1,400 that night in 3 hours. Dang. Pizza, you know, all the things. I reflected on the exercise and I said, I think if we would have stuck to like the 300 target, I don't think we would have hit it.

Yeah.

Because it was too small and too, quote unquote, easy. But having that 1,500 target at the end made you push harder. Yes, 100%. We were all in. It was like this energy, right? And so having a moonshot vision is really important in your life, not just for the reason that you said of if you fall short, you're still going to be way past. It's for like the energy and actually getting people on board with your vision, right? Brian Lubin also told me— I buy properties in Tucson, Arizona, because my wife and I love it, and that's— we've had a lot of success there. But he gave me— he's like, if your vision is just to keep buying Airbnbs in Tucson, he's like, I'm not on board with that. Like, give me something bigger, give me something more exciting. And I'm like, yeah, that's really good feedback.

Maybe you start an Airbnb park. You ever see these things?

Yeah.

You know, piece of land, do like 12 on 1, you know, or a building or something like that.

Exactly. And like there's—

or the hotels like Rich does.

Yes.

How did Rich go from small-time real estate investor to buying actual hotels, boutique hotels?

He's got 6 now.

It's crazy.

In like 3 years, he bought 6 hotels, right? Because he set a vision and he— and he started the community and he has a big team.

Yes.

And what that does, that creates accountability and motivation and momentum. And he gets to hold the vision.

Yeah, right.

So creating the moonshot, I think, is really, really important for people.

Yeah. And I guess when he first wanted to do that, people probably were like, are you crazy, bro?

Yeah.

You know, like even his family or maybe somebody in his circle or that guy that DM'd you, like, you can't do that.

Yeah.

But look, like you said, look, fast forward, he's got 6 of these things now, which is wild.

If money is about freedom, what is the first freedom that people should be buying back.

This is from Dan Martell, but the first hire is an executive assistant or just an assistant. It could be a VA, but like I said, AI is becoming your VA, so it could be that assistant that can help you do things. Now I'll give people the hack: in the beginning, it could be you, like, in your free time, and you could set up another Gmail. You know, I remember getting inquiries and then I didn't want to respond, so I have Tanya respond. Well, Tanya was a fake, you know, it's just another email address, like you don't have to like so, but it does give you more credibility and more things. So like you can hire somebody and then start delegating. That is going to open, unlock so much more time. So if you're on the journey already, I think that's the first hire. If you haven't made it yet, that buys you back the task time that you're just thinking because a good assistant will not just take on tasks, they'll like take on a little bit of your mind space. They'll like take some stuff off your plate so you don't have to think about it anymore. Anymore. That frees you up to do things that are in your highest and best use of time, which is like creativity, new business, getting more clients. That's what you're uniquely qualified for, but you're spending your time doing some BS, you know. So that would be the first thing I would do. It also can create more time for you to do things you want to do in your life, like outside of work, which would be awesome because then you could be more fulfilled. People want to work with you because you have better energy, you're not always burnt out. There's so many other benefits, you Yeah.

And even let's say you don't have a business yet, but you're a W-2. Yeah. Get a housekeeper.

Oh yeah. Yeah. Assistant in your house.

Yeah. Yeah. House assistant essentially, because we have someone that does meal prep. They cook, they clean, they run errands, they return Amazon packages. I haven't had to do any of that stuff. I mean, I still cook, you know, and clean occasionally, but like, and it's not as expensive as you think it is. Right. But if you're trying to start something new or like create something like go get someone to help around the house. And give them everything you can. Right.

Yeah.

And you will get your time back. You will get your energy back.

Yeah. We had a gal in our community. I'm glad you brought this up. She was saying she didn't have time to dedicate the 3 hours for content. And so it's really hard for me to tell her because she's already running her business and she has kids and a family. So I'm like, okay, well, it's hard for me to tell her to add 3 hours that don't exist. Like there's only so many hours in a day. So I said, look at the time that you're doing at work and see if there's a way you can delegate something that you're doing that's robotic that you could give to somebody on the team. Well, she's like, well, you know, I'm a solopreneur, I can't give anything away. I'm like, well, look at the whole schedule, including personal. She found that she spends 3 hours doing laundry.

Yeah.

So there's literally a service in North Carolina, Charlotte, North Carolina, that is a bus that somebody converted into like a laundromat mobile. They come and park on a street, bro. They take all your clothes, they wash them, they dry them, they hang, and then they give it back to you and your laundry is done and it's affordable.

Yeah.

And I'm like, wow, like, what a great business idea for whoever started that bus. But on top of it, it freed up the 3 hours she needed to do this.

We were not created— we're not here on this earth to do chores and pay our bills and die.

Yeah, that's true.

We are here to go build and create and spend more time with our families, right? That's part of my purpose is like, If all you want to do is spend more time with your family, I want to help you do that. You should be able to spend more time with your kids, not doing laundry, not doing the dishes, not just cooking, not all this. And I know there's people out there that are hearing me say that. They're like, yeah, that'll never happen, as they're like washing the pan right now. Yeah, right. Or they're driving in their car to their job that's an hour away from where they work. Like, no, it is possible.

Well, the first one is the housekeeper. Just literally ask your friends and fam. Like, everybody's got a same one.

They just don't talk about it. Yeah, because they just might feel weird about it.

Yeah, say, who cleaned your house? I need someone to help clean. Like, that's the easy way right now. Number one thing you can do that frees up that time off your plate so you can start working and actually executing. Then the next thing could be the thing I want to do right now, and this is what I've heard from several wealthy people. They said their number one hire as they've gotten to more wealth— and they could have done it long time, their biggest regret is they should have done it earlier— is getting a chef. Yeah, someone to cook the food. Because right now, like, we cook, but it takes up a lot of time, and we got kids and we're running around all the time. And then once in a while we just eat out, and then you start eating out a little bit more. The food that we get from outside has never been worse these days. It's garbage, you know. Like, every day I would see a new Instagram reel about I'm being poisoned, you know, with these ingredients that— every day I find out what I'm eating and drinking is bad for me, by the way. So like, I'm gonna die soon, but from the— from our diet, basically, is what I'm being told on Instagram. So essentially what we would love to do is just cook, eat more at home, and use the right food and do that. We just don't have the time every single night. So what if somebody came and did that? So I'm literally gonna go this week, I have it on my list to like post and ask my friends, my entrepreneur friends in Vegas, or even online, like, who do you guys use? Because nobody, like you said, nobody talks about— because maybe it's like taboo, they don't want to say that they have a chef. But I know friends in Vegas that have someone come once or twice a week to cook their meals for the week.

Yeah, and we found ours not even as a chef, we, we found her as a meal prepper and does our laundry, cleans the house, helps with the kids, right? So like, you don't need a chef. Like, you go get a chef. But like, for most people, you don't need a chef.

Doesn't need to be like— chef makes it sound like we're going to get world-class meals.

Exactly.

You don't need—

no, you need a meal prepper and they can make good food. And then you just— and this goes to the other thing that you said about the first thing that people should be doing is reprogramming, is reprogramming their money mindset.

Yeah.

If you as a W-2 worker, you go to your job every day, you got kids, you want to start to create something for yourself, go hire this person, feel the effects of having all that time and energy back and what you get to do with that time and energy with your family or your hobbies. Or now if you want to go create something and it starts to reprogram your money mindset by hiring people.

Yes, 100%, man. Well, this is the way to go. But thanks for having me, bro.

This is— Neel Dhingra, appreciate you being here, man. Thank you so much.

Yeah. And one thing I just want to leave you with and anybody else, and you probably went through this. Did you ever have someone tell you that— what— or did you ever have the feeling that your stuff was cringe?

Oh my God, yeah. There's specific videos I'm like are rolling through my mind right now that I remember.

Okay, same with me. I have these— I wish they don't exist, but they like— are these classes I did. But, um, I just want to tell people like, man, it's all cringe until it works. Like, think about every single entrepreneur, creator, anybody you look up to, celebrity, whatever— they all gave a talk that sucked, they did a performance that bombed, they made videos that were totally cringe. Until it starts working. And so people like the guy will message you, he's probably a hater. Somebody's going to leave a nasty comment. But you, your ability to like push through that even when you're not certain is literally the thing that determines your success. So I would just tell people to keep pushing forward, man.

Yeah, that's right. You don't know what's going to work until you keep doing it and trying it. And the great thing is, if it didn't work, then nobody saw it. I'd like to simplify this down. Just start and don't stop. Yeah, just start and don't stop. Keep going.

So that's it, bro.

Yeah, I appreciate you, bro. Thank you for being here.

Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you.

Yeah. Can we do a quick rapid fire?

Yeah.

Cool. What's the fastest way to make money in real estate?

The fast money— make money in real estate is through sales.

Cash flow or appreciation?

I would say for my goals, appreciation. Like, I just— I built a portfolio and I just think about that total asset value of that entire portfolio over decades and the fact that it's not going anywhere. People always need a place to stay.. And so that can pay me. If the whole world goes to absolute shit and all my investments crash and burn and my business, like, I still have that portfolio.

What's the worst business decision you've ever made?

The worst decision I made is listening to my gut. You know, I always say trusting your gut. So I think there's two different things. There's trusting your gut, but there's also like your gut will mislead you.

Yeah.

So you have to know the difference. So like if I meet you and have a bad feeling about doing business with you, that's my gut. Like maybe I lean into that. But on the other hand, when I'm supposed to go somewhere and do something that I know is beneficial for me, my gut tells me to stay on the couch. It tells me to not put myself in an uncomfortable situation. So for me, trusting my gut all the time was leading to me staying broke. So I'm like, man, maybe I should start listening to something else, you know, besides my internal mechanism, which was telling me to stay small. Don't put yourself out there. Don't put yourself in uncomfortable situations. And that was what was keeping me below the ceiling.

Yeah, I love that. I've talked about that a lot, actually, or not enough, that you got to trust your gut. And then in those moments, if it's telling you to be afraid, you got to push past it. Yeah, exactly. What's the best business decision you've ever made?

Investing in myself, my brand, like my education. I talk about this like I put money in the S&P 500, I put money in homes and everything. But the number one investment by far that's paid me the most is investing in my knowledge, skill set. So I don't know who said it, but like I call it the S&M 500, right? Like that skill has paid me multiple 7 figures and it's going to continue to be the thing that brings me the most revenue. And then I could take that money and put it into things.

Is the American dream dead?

No, it's not dead. It's alive ever than before, more than ever. But I think it's just you just need to have skills and the right mindset and then push harder. So like 80% effort gets you 80% results. 100% effort gets you 1,000% results. And that last 20% nobody's doing. And so I believe right now the competition has never been weaker. So I think it's an incredibly easy time. It's hard, but it's also easy because you think about the— like you said, the bar is very low for people in business entrepreneurship. You just have to push harder than everybody else and be like almost legit obsessed with what you're doing. And you'll just notice that nobody's in that category. It gets really lonely there.

What do you say to people that blame the algorithm?

It's just your content. Like, you know, like the algorithm is not some mist— like some freaking guy that's trying to keep you down. It's literally the will of the people. Like, if people are watching that type of video, then they'll watch more of it. Like, yes, they make shifts and people get screwed up in like tweaks sometimes. But over the long run, I've noticed if your content is good, it'll get in front of more people. And if it's not, people don't watch it. Like, Literally, if somebody scrolls past your video, it's no one's fault. They just didn't want to watch it. So then like, that's your fault. It's not like the Instagram didn't do that shit to you. They scroll— the user scrolled past you. So what are we doing to make our content better is the better question.