Raising Children on the Spectrum with Harry Psaros

You need to take that same approach first. Is you and your spouse have to accept the diagnosis. But what I would tell any belligerent father out there, it's not a stigma. It's not a scarlet letter. It's a pathway to improvement. Who cares what it's called? You could call it whatever you want. But when you receive the diagnosis, you can start that delineating that child, pushing that child forward, and helping them in their life to improve on a daily basis. And I talk about. the concept of the mind of a black belt in the book, and I call it the 2% rule. Objectively helping that child every day, 2% with something, but improving their life. If you don't and you remain belligerent, that child will drift into the abyss where you think by not accepting the diagnosis you're helping them, you're actually significantly hurting them. And that's the point and the message I'm trying to push across in the book.

Terry, welcome to the Book Thinkers Life-Changing Books Podcast. How are you feeling today?

Awesome. How are you, man? Thank you for having me on today.

Yeah, I'm really excited for this conversation. You are somebody who is always of service to other people. You're always positive, and I see so much alignment between the message you're putting out there in the world and the message I'm putting out there in the world. So before we get rolling, why don't you tell everybody a little bit about your story so they can kind of catch up? And then we'll dive into some more specific questions.

Yeah, absolutely. Um, so I am involved heavily here in the Pittsburgh area in a multitude of different places. Um, but again, my name is Harry Paceras. I'm a new author. Um, I am on the board of directors for the Autism Caring Center. Uh, I founded— helped one of the founding families of an organization in the area called PALS, uh, which is an organization for special needs children. Um, I have 100 titles. I'm also a social media influencer. For the University of Pittsburgh and all their sports activities. But in 2014, so 17 years ago, my son was diagnosed on the spectrum. And that's why I've been heavily involved with a lot of these organizations. But in 2014, Kelly Kane, who in the area here is the founder of the Autism Caring Center and a beacon of light in the area, was running what was called the Autism Notebook. And they had a conference here in the Greentree area. And I was supposed to speak and another speaker was supposed to speak. And in fact, I was speaking from the perspective of a father, but their main speaker, quite frankly, just fell short. He ran about 10 minutes and that was it. They had about 20 minutes to go and they said, can you fill it? I speak on a regular basis. So I said, I have this. So I got up and just start riffing. And as I was speaking, I noticed a lot of mothers start lining up, 1, 2, 3. By the time I was done, there had to have been 10 to 12. And I have to tell you, my first thought was, my God, what the heck did I say? Did I say something offensive? You know, I thought maybe an obscenity, something. But I noticed they were emotional. And when I finished, they all came to me and said, we need your help. Our husbands aren't on board with the diagnosis. We are on our own. It's overwhelming. And our kids are just drifting away. So I am not shy whatsoever. I said, I want their numbers. I'll contact them. And I did. It led to one dinner. It led to several cups of coffee, a few good conversations on the phone, and a few hung up on me. But what I was able to do was start that conversation. And what was interesting to me is in several cases, the father's stoicism meant that— it didn't mean they weren't on board. Men want to fix things. And they were just really transfixed as to how to handle this monumental issue that just fell into their lap. So I was able to help there. And I thought about it at that time, you know, maybe a book needs to be written, but I held off. Let's go back now about a year and a half ago. I delivered a larger speech, first father to ever speak for the Autism Caring Center's Mother's Day conference here locally, probably about 350 to 400 mothers. And as I was writing it, it was 50% my son's story, and 50% my points of quantification, which really is all about mindset, hope, positivity, grit, and resilience— what it takes to properly raise a child on the spectrum. Well, I'm writing it out and I realized, you know what, I think I have a book. And shortly after, I was approached by a multitude of people that said, your, your voice and a father's voice needs heard. And, and I will tell you, I did my research in, um, 17 years into this, so I Googled, and there's very, very little from a father's perspective out there. There's some great podcasts. There's a few books, but nothing overwhelming compared to the warrior moms that are out there. So therefore, struggle to strength, and the message is resonating. It's taken off like a rocket ship. Happy to say it's it's number one in the U.S. and U.K. in its specific category. And hearing from the people that I was just hearing last night from people that have read it, and I'm. very touched by the response.

Yeah, it's amazing. And I remember during our first phone call, I told you, Harry, I'm not sure if this book is a great fit for my audience because it seems kind of niche. And you said, no, no, no, no, no, no. According to the CDC, 1 in 36 children are now diagnosed with autism, and just a few years ago it was 1 in 44. So it's becoming more prominent. And then you said to me, I bet you know somebody with a child on the spectrum or somebody on the spectrum. And I thought, you know what, you're right, everybody does. And so it is very relevant. I think it's a relevant discussion and I'm happy that we're having it. Why do you think that number is continuing? Well, I suppose to decrease 1 in 44 to 1 in 36, 1 in something will happen soon. That's even a lower number, I'd imagine. I'm sitting here today with Ken Rusk, who has done hundreds of millions of dollars in business. He's also sold tens of thousands of books and changed countless lives. We're sitting here today because he is sponsoring today's episode. So Ken, tell everybody about your course.

Well, thank you. I built a course called The Path to a Successful Life. It's designed around trying to get somebody unstuck. You know, sometimes you're feeling like you're kind of stuck in where you are and you're not really sure what you want your life to look like or how to go about getting it. Well, for the cost of about dinner and a movie and maybe the time you'd spend on a weekend, you can know exactly what you want your future to look like and how to go about getting it.

You know the power of vision. That's why you watch podcasts like this. So Click the link below, get signed up, and let me know what your experience is like.

People— I think it's a good question. I think people are now more aware of it. The testing is far better, so they're picking up on it. That's great. That, that's why you're seeing more, unfortunately, but you're still seeing it. My concern are for those young families, those young parents that are receiving the diagnosis And in particular, the fathers that may not be acting on it. Because what's very important, you need to be in unison with your spouse and attack this. And for anyone wondering why they see the gold boxing gloves, I boxed. I have a martial arts background. I have multiple black belts in Tang Soo Do. I took Aikido, Muay Thai. So I wanted to bring that fighting mentality into this. And not that you're going to attack anyone, but in terms of the fighting spirit, thus the gloves. But my goal with this book was to get to those young families that are receiving the diagnosis and understanding that there is light in the darkness. But the first thing you have to do is have everything in life is perspective and mindset. It is perspective and mindset. So what this book tries to do is give you both. And I hope it just kind of lights a flame for those families that are receiving a diagnosis. As you and I are talking right now, There's thousands of kids getting diagnosed. So this book, as far as I could see, is good in perpetuity.

Yeah, I mean, you mentioned this a little bit already, but we'll, we'll go a step deeper, that men oftentimes, they try to fix things. They have this stoic mindset. They're logical, not emotional. They just want to fix things. But you say in the book very clearly that autism is not a problem to be fixed. You can manage it and improve symptoms and help your child along the way, but you're not going to fix the problem. There's no Limitless pill, Bradley Cooper, right?

Exactly.

What are some of the initial perspective shifts that a father needs to have?

Well, I give the analogy. My wife and I love to kayak, and we're very, very good. We're very proficient in a single kayak. And I talk about this summer, we were at Bethany Beach, Delaware, like second home, and we attempted a tandem kayak. And what we found, it was absolute hell. I was going one way, she was going the other. We couldn't straighten the kayak. Lots of obscenities getting thrown out. We got— we were way behind some of the people we were with. Finally, at the end, we start rowing in unison, and it just propelled forward. You need to take that same approach first, is you and your spouse have to accept the diagnosis. But what I would tell any belligerent father out there It's not a stigma. It's not a scarlet letter. It's a pathway to improvement. Who cares what it's called? You could call it whatever you want, but when you receive the diagnosis, you can start that delineating that child, pushing that child forward, and helping them in their life to improve on a daily basis. And I talk about the concept, the mind of a black belt in the book, and I call it the 2% rule. Objectively helping that child every day, 2% with something, but improving their life. If you don't and you remain belligerent, that child will drift into the abyss where you think by not accepting the diagnosis you're helping them, you're actually significantly hurting them. And that's the point in the message I'm trying to push across in the book.

Now, did you originally have this mindset? And I know the answer here, but did you originally have this perspective, or was it something that you had to learn over time?

So, if you can't tell by now, I'm a lunatic Type A. And, and I, as I mentioned in the book, I could have fun at an insurance seminar or a monastery. I mean, if you put me in. So, my thought was, how's this Type A, overcaffeinated, positive guy that can light a room up have a child that's going to be struggling socially? So, it was our first child. I had no perspective. And I thought, my God, why label the kid? He's probably an introvert. He's a little bit more quiet. Accept it for what it is. And then we had some incidences occur, and I discuss them in the book, where it really did come to a head. And acceptance was a big key. So I was that belligerent husband. I made sure in the book I put a big public apology out there. And my wife is a badass. My wife was a true warrior mom that cut through all the fog and said, we have an issue here. And I talk about in the book, we went to the Cleveland Clinic. Um, we were on the way home. I live in Pittsburgh, it's a 2-hour drive. And halfway through, I went from despair to just Mike Tyson. I said, you know what, not my child. I said, I'm gonna do what it takes ever in it to this day, every single day to lead the path and really help improve him. And I, I hope everybody takes that same perspective.

Yeah, I think so too. I think we should apply that perspective to every area of our lives, not just an autism diagnosis. Or receiving what some might perceive to be bad news or troubling news. But I mean, every area of your life, and that you mentioned the word stoic earlier. You know, one of the big things, one of the core tenets of stoicism as a philosophy is differentiating between things that are in your control and things that are not in your control. And when something is not in your control, there's a concept amor fati. It's Latin for a love of one's fate, and it's this idea that you should view everything in life as. neutral or maybe even positive. And so I'm curious, like, what lessons have you learned having a child with autism on the spectrum? What positive lessons have you learned throughout your life now?

Oh, that's a, you know, it's— and not just me, let me apply this, I think, in general to my family. Um, and, you know, my youngest son Max is going to go to play football next year at Allegheny College here in Meadville, Pennsylvania. He's a tough guy, you know, but What it's taught us, and even someone like my son, who's a pretty tough kid, is greater patience, greater compassion, greater ability to listen and empathize and to never judge. I don't— I have to know the human being. If I'm out and I see someone having a meltdown with their kid, instead of going, oh, that's a bad parent, because I've had that happen with me, I never try to judge. And I try to think, wonder what that person's situation is. I think it's a better perspective in that way, where you're not judging people. It's taught me a lot. He has taught me a lot. I talk about it a lot in the book. What I didn't want was— I am an avid reader. If I turn my iPad around right now, you'd be staring upwards of 300 books, possibly, like you have behind you. I go back to the Ted Lasso effect in my book. I don't have— I'm not a psychologist. But what the show Ted Lasso proved was that you set the tone of optimism and positivity and humanity, humanity, really understanding someone from an emotional level. And if you do that, positivity just plumes. And in the case of the Ted Lasso effect, he improved the team, he improved really not that, but the entire town around him, you know, that was rooting for the team. I, I try to explain to fathers, you need to do that in your own household. If you start the day with a positive, uplifting approach, it's easier for that child who's already struggling— and they go through quite a bit— um, to be able to go about, improve 2%, and deal with all the difficulties they have to deal with on a daily basis.

Yeah, I think you could probably write a follow-up book called The Ted Lasso Effect. Uh, what a wonderful TV show, makes you feel amazing, and it's great to see that You're right. He represents somebody in that show who's non-judgmental and just puts positivity into every single situation. And it is scientifically proven that positivity is contagious. You can lift the people up around you. And I know that you're doing that with your energy already. I mean, everybody that you interact with on this podcast, I'm sure everybody's in the car like, yeah, I get it, I get it, I get it. Or at home doing the chores, they're like, I feel the energy of this guy. And It goes back to a saying that you put in the book, and I'm going to read it off my screen here. It's, if you are breathing air, you should be helping others. By being positive, you are naturally, through the laws of contagion, helping other people. But what other ways are you helping other people, and why do you think it's important to be of service?

I'm glad you asked this, and this is a very big portion at the end of the book, but I try to talk about this. I am Greek, and we have an interesting concept. It's called the Greek secret. It's called philotimo. Philotimo is good for this— my definition— good for the sake of doing good, knowing that there's going to be a ripple effect in the universe, and you ask nothing in return from anyone. So, you know, it could be feeding a homeless man you happen to see in front of you or doing some act of kindness, but You know, I tell my sons on a daily basis, in life, you either play in the game or you sit on the bench. And I want my kids to be an MVP making an impact in life. And what I mean, what I mean by that, not just going out and functioning in society, actually helping others, being a benefit, going out and making a positive impact. If everybody did that, we'd have a better society. So what I ask in this book, you're, you're gonna learn a lot, I hope. When you read it, but when you're done, there's thousands of young children right now getting diagnosed. Even if you can go out with some of the knowledge you pick up in this book and help one family do it, there has to be a ripple effect from this, or I haven't done my job. So that's a big part, a big ask that I have in this is pay it forward, an act of philotimo, an act of love. And I really hope it happens. And I, I'm already starting to get the vibe that it is, and it really, uh, really makes me happy.

Yeah, I, I'll say it right now. If you're listening or watching to this podcast and you have a friend or a family member or some type of acquaintance that has a child who's been diagnosed with autism, buy a copy of this book. I mean, one of the great things about buying books for other people, by the way, is that they attribute the value to the person who gifted it to them, not the author sometimes. And so, like, you can be of service and looked at as a positive influence on the people that you gift this book to. On the Greek terminology, real quick, I have a tattoo across my shoulder that says eudaimonia, which means well-being and flourishing. And a big piece of that equation for me to genuinely enjoy the passage of time and flourish is to be of service to the people around me. And so I am totally in alignment with you. Quick question on the Greek origins. How often do you get to go back to Greece?

You know, it's funny. So my family has gone a considerable amount, and I'm Chiotico. I'm from Chios. So we have not— my family personally has not had an opportunity, and a lot of it was because we were kind of like held down with a lot of what's going on. So next year, my son will be playing football, believe it or not, in Rome. There's a game scheduled, and we'd like to get both Greece and Italy in at the same time. And my brother has talked to me about flying to Mount Athos, which is considered one of the holiest places on the planet. And we've also discussed that. So that is actually in the works. But, you know, I'm fortunate to have grown up in the Greek Orthodox community. Strong, strong emphasis on, on faith and family. And, and I, I will tell you, those roots and having that background really assists you in something like raising a special needs child. So I'm very fortunate in my background. But no, I plan— trust me when I plan— I want to go to Mykonos and some other areas. We have it planned out. And, uh, my wife and I will be empty nesters here very soon. So we're going to make up for lost time soon and head over there.

Yeah, I've been a couple of times and I love it. And I have a question about it in a second. But first, you mentioned 2 words that are important to me. On this bicep, I have a Family First tattoo, and on this one, I have a Faith in Action tattoo. So I'm also involved, you know, with my church. I'm not Greek Orthodox, I'm Catholic. But having faith and a focus on family, those are very important to me as well. Now, to piggyback this thing real quick, the reason I brought it up, other than the eudaimonia tattoo, is that diet and health, those are big pieces of your book. You talk a lot about the importance of maintaining your body, that your body is a machine and what you put into it matters. And I found going to Greece actually a few years ago that I love the Mediterranean diet. And so, every single day for the last 2 years or so when I'm at home, I have the same lunch and it's a Greek salad and I love it. So I'm curious, like, do you want to give everybody in our audience a little taste as to what your thoughts are on health and how it relates to this subject?

I, I could go off on a 2-hour-long dissertation. So if you're wondering where my second book is leading, you're, you're leading me into it. Um, I am absolutely adamant on clean eating, on exercising. Your body is a machine. What we do as a Western society, especially here in the United States, is absolutely reprehensible when it comes to processed foods, fast foods. Um, you won't find an Oreo in this house. Um, so the point being, there's high rates of obesity with autistic children. Therefore too, because a lot of parents, um, shut down mentally, so they just stay home and they, they grab quick fast food. So there's high rates of obesity with parents as well. And what I try to preach is the cleaner you were eating the cleaner the child would eat. You're setting the example, and neurologically, they will flourish, or at least be a better version of themselves. Think about it. If they're inhaling sugar, food dyes, which are a neurotoxin— I can go on and on— high carb, high sugar, they're not— especially gluten and casein, which are sensitivities to the brain. You have casomorphin, glutamorphin going into an opioid receptor.

Yeah.

If you clean the child's diet, you're going to optimize their health. Neurologically, they're going to be better. And the same goes for you. The other thing I will tell you, I come from David Goggins' book, No Excuses. So, when I hear people go, well, how do you find time? You make time. I mean, right now, my goal, I will get up in the morning, it's 100 kettlebell swings in the morning. It sounds long, but it's not. Anybody knows kettlebell, you could do it and go from there. Movement is imperative. Health is imperative, and you pass that to your children. So I— that's probably going to be my second book. There are a multitude of activities, even if they're more moderate to severe, that they can take place in. They can walk, they can run. You can work with them on movement instead of placing them in front of a television and clicking on a machine all day long. So I am— I come from that Bruce Lee mentality of really optimizing and taking care of your body, and it'll take care of you.

Yeah, I do too. As we're recording this, I'm about 60 hours into a fast and I'm breaking it tomorrow, 72 hours. And that's because I just got back from an international trip and I was feeling a little inflamed and I thought, you know what, I need to clean myself out a little bit. So, I am totally with you.

That's impressive. Yeah.

Thank you. Thank you. And you know what? I'm actually very sharp right now. I feel pretty good even though I haven't had a calorie in 60 hours or so. The movement piece is important, and I don't have any children yet, like we talked about. I do have my first on the way.

Yay!

I've read a lot that— yes, yay! I've read that behaviors are caught, not taught. And so you as a father are representing what a man should be in your household. And if you are eating Doritos and Cheetos and Fritos on the couch watching TV, telling your kid to go exercise, they're just going to follow your behavior. They're not going to hear what you say. They're going to mimic what you do, right? And so I think it's wonderful that you set an example like that. And I would imagine that as a parent with an autistic child, yeah, it would be a little bit harder to involve them in athletics. And so people probably underestimate the power of simply walking or stretching or swinging a kettlebell, right? So I think it's so cool that you're going to write your next book maybe on that subject.

Absolutely. And like my son, so my son, um, who really is the focus of the book, is up at Kent State right now as a sophomore. Um, you know, here at home he has an incredible— Bill, his trainer, is an incredible human being. They're very close. Bill works him out. He went there, we got a trainer there, and it just keeps him accountable. And I tell you what, Gus likes it, you know what I mean? He says to me, Dad, I feel better, my weight's down, clothes fit better, and he has more energy. So You know, it just kind of now my youngest son is an animal. I mean, you have to worry about that. He's in the gym nightly and eating every piece of protein in the house. But um, but you know, it it just set the tone. You you have to set that example. And um, I look, I'm fifty years old. I could still. I've got marathons that I've ran. Um, you know, I love that I could still go in the boxing ring with my kids. I could go lift weights. It it is incredible to me when I see a a. Fathers that are probably 20 years younger than me, they can't get off a couch or walk a block. I, I think it's inexcusable. That's just my mentality.

Me too. Um, me too. I'm training for my first sprint triathlon right now as well, and I'm really excited to get into that sport. When I was younger, I wrestled, I played football. I've played basketball twice a week for the last 10 years or so. I'm obsessed, and I want to stay that way for the rest of my life. And like I was sharing, my wife and I were just traveling internationally at a location where Most of the Americans there were quite a bit older, you know, they're retirees. And we were walking around the beach and I just said to her, I kind of nudged her and I said, I can't believe what the average 60, 65, 70-year-old looks like these days. I mean, I just, I can't imagine it, having a hard time getting out of your beach chair. So it's super important to stay fit as you age.

Right. And I'm not trying to belittle anyone out there. I would just say if you're looking at yourself right now thinking, man, I need to get in better shape, start today. Just start slow.

Exactly.

Yes. Even if it's 15 minutes of movement, if you just go out for a walk, that's better than nothing. So, I'm not trying to belittle anyone, but I am trying to instill that mindset that you need to move, you need to eat right.

That's exactly my mindset as well. And I also love sort of the Goggins mentality of no excuses. So, before we wrap up, I've got a couple more questions. You mentioned Bruce Lee and your martial arts background. You mentioned David Goggins. I know you're a fan of like, uh, the Rocky series, for instance, Sylvester Stallone. Who are some of your other influences? What books are on the bookshelf that we can't see? Who are some of your favorite authors? Just kind of give us a little, a little taste.

So Tim Ferriss is amazing. Um, Mindset from Carol Dweck, um, is awesome. Awesome. Um, I mentioned Goggins, uh, David, um, excuse me, Robert Greene's 48 Laws of Power. Um, yeah. Oh, he's incredible. Um, Sun Tzu, um, Discipline Equals Freedom, Jocko Willink. Um, I could go on and on. From a health standpoint, um, I love like Aubrey Marcus, who owns Onnit. Yeah. Um, own the day, own your life. I love Dave Asprey. Um, you know, I could go on and on. I, I, you know, I, I love— I, there's a good mix. The new James Quick book, uh, Limitless. Incredible.

He's awesome.

Oh my God, you got some, some rock stars then. So yeah, I could go on and on. I mean, I am, um, I, I love to challenge myself with a different type of book each time, you know, but those are probably some of my favorites. But, uh, Ferriss's book, like Tools for Titans, um, I'll kind of rattle through a quick chapter and go off in the morning, you know. I— it's things like that inspire me, really do. I, I love, um, Eric Thomas, the motivational speaker, has written a few. Um, you know, like I said, I could go on and on, but these guys fuel my fire. You know, I, I really— I, I have a multitude of books, and a lot are health and more motivational, but I'm starting to get more into the— I do a lot of, uh, reading on neuroplasticity as well. Um, Dr., uh, uh, David Molello that wrote, uh, uh, Reconnected Kids and Disconnected Kids, um, and his whole book's on, on re— Programming the Brain. Those books, along with the Brain Balance Institute, probably helped turn my son around and got him into college. So, I'm obsessively reading about neuroplasticity all the time as well.

Now, would you read with him or read to him or just sort of read and then share what you're learning?

I think he sees me as Yoda. I do a lot of reading and then try to— what I try to explain to him And he's having to read in college, don't get me wrong. But I think he's starting to understand the value of things like audible.com. You know, it's okay, you can ingest more books. He learns at a different level. I'm trying to get my youngest to start and love reading, you know, and he's about to start college next year, you know, and I told him, I said, it's going to be force-fed initially. But I tell them, you're as good as the last 5 books you've read. You know, I try to stress that all the time. They'll both pick up on it eventually. But Um, I, I love it. To me, it's an outlet. If I'm not reading, I'm listening to Audible and I go through like 2 Audible books a week.

Oh, I love it. I'm a big fan of Audible. In fact, they've sponsored this podcast for years and years. So shout out Audible. And, uh, yeah, for your youngest son, I think listening to Can't Hurt Me just in the unique way that that book is presented, especially as he goes into college football, like that'll get him running through people even more.

Absolutely. And I, I tell you, the, uh, Discipline Equals Free. I'm huge, if you can't tell, on discipline. And, uh, I had him read Jocko's book and it was just straightforward. I, I, in fact, if I like the local kid, I'll buy it for them. I bought like a dozen copies by now. I think it's that important. So, um, you know, I think you got to spread your knowledge and I think I try to help as many of these young people as I can.

Yeah, I love it. All right, 2 final questions. Um, the first, where can people go to learn more about you and to get a copy of this book for either themselves or somebody in their network?

Sure. In terms of the book, Amazon has the book right now. Again, look for the gold boxing gloves. It's a father's journey with autism and the power of hope and positivity. There's also a Kindle version. I'm recording Audible probably within the next few weeks. I want to get that up and running. If you go to HarryPisaros.com, so it's HarryPisaros.com. Everything there is you need to take you where you can buy the book and get a little bio on me and kind of go from there. But like I said, I'm really hoping if you like the book, reach out to me. I'm easy to find. I'd love to hear from everybody.

Amazing. All right, here's my last question. And now normally I have a co-host on the podcast, although he's traveling today. His name is Luke, and he asks some variation of this. Imagine that Harry gets deleted. The book is gone. All the talks you've given are gone. The Pittsburgh sports stuff—it's gone. But you can leave the world with one message. It's got to fit on a billboard, Tim Ferriss style. What is that message?

What do you want to leave the world with? Oh boy! You know, oh man, that's a phenomenal question. Um, you know what? I'm gonna—I—I tell you what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna go with the tattoo that I would get if I could get it, and it's about the spirit of the word. Uh, the Greek—the Greek term molon labe. And the reason I'm throwing this out, when King Leonidas was at Thermopylae at the hot gates, and we just talked about philotimo, he knew, by the way, that he was going to die. I have no doubt. And when you think about what they were up against, but he was doing it for the greater good of Greece. Ultimate, ultimate act of philotimo, giving back. And when King Xerxes and his army said, put down your weapons, what did he say? Molon labe, come get them. That attitude, that spirit is what I apply to life. So it's you, you attack life. And I mean that in a positive way. We just talked about it. You give back, you help others, you shed positivity. I mean, so if I had to go with one, one statement, it would be Molon labe. In fact, my son and I were talking about a tattoo the other day. And we said, if we ever get them, we're gonna get them together. And I'm getting that with a couple of Spartan spears in the back on my shoulders. So that's what I'm gonna go with.

That's so cool, man. I will share the information, uh, from my Greek tattoo artist because I also got tattooed in Athens and he was amazing. And, um, super cool. Listen, amazing conversation. I had a really fun time chatting with you and getting to know you and reading your book, and I will be buying some copies for people in my network. I've already been able to share it a couple of times on social. So if anybody listening wants to go see some of those reviews, they can go check that out. But Harry, amazing work. I'm happy that you wrote the book. Thank you so much for coming on today.

Thanks for having me. I really, really had a great time. Thank you.