In this interview segment, Robert Greene argues that manipulation is a deep‑rooted aspect of human (and even primate) nature, not a new product of social media. He explains that while people have always been manipulative, social platforms simply provide a convenient veil—anonymity and distance—that lets individuals act on their darker impulses without immediate accountability. Greene references his concept of the "shadow" from his recent book, describing online trolls who hide behind screens to deliver nasty comments and avoid consequences. He also notes that primates, dubbed "Machiavellian animals," exhibit manipulative behavior, underscoring the evolutionary basis of these traits. The conversation contrasts the idea that social media compounds manipulation with Greene’s view that it merely makes existing manipulative tendencies easier to conceal.
Robert Greene taught me that social media doesn't make us more manipulative, it just makes it easier to hide.
You often write that you write, your writing process comes from a place of anger. And so you've talked about the fact that The 48 Laws of Power was based on the fact that people weren't being honest about how manipulative they are. And so relating that to today, here we are 22 years later, do you think that social media has compounded that problem that we're hiding behind manipulation more than we ever have? Or do you think that it's sort of opening that up and we're being more vulnerable and transparent about it?
Well, people have always been manipulative. I talk about it, why they are, in all of my books. I think it goes back to childhood. There's something wired in our nature. And also, if you study primates, you study chimpanzees, for instance, you know that they're nicknamed the Machiavellian animal. They can be incredibly manipulative. It's something wired into our nature. It would take hours to discuss why that is so. Social media, it doesn't necessarily make us more manipulative than we already are. It just makes It easier to disguise. So for instance, you know, I talk a lot in my last book about the dark side of human nature, what I call the shadow. And so you get a lot of people who have kind of trollish behavior on the internet. We've all dealt with them. And they kind of come in with these sort of nasty comments designed to get under your skin. But because they're not there, because they're not in front of your face, they can kind of get away with it. They can pretend that they're a tough guy or a tough woman and they don't have to take any consequences for it. So you're able to kind of discuss behind the screen, behind the anonymity of the internet, you're able to get away with more of the kind of nasty behavior that a lot of humans are prone to.
If you don't see the shadow side of human behavior online, you're just being naive.