The ONE Truth that will Change Your Life | with Jon Gordon

But your vision and mission must be greater than all the challenges you face. Your positive energy must be greater than all the negativity. And so, yes, I still have some negative thoughts that come in, but I know they're not coming from me. So then what I do is I speak truth to the lies. I speak words of encouragement. I talk to myself instead of listening to myself. And the more you do that, that gives you courage. It gives you power. Because the words we think, the words we say becomes the life that we live. As a man thinks, he becomes. As a woman thinks, she becomes. The words you say, the words you think become the reality that you're experiencing. The journey of life is the separation and the wound we experience and the healing as we go through life to heal the wound that we have. You can live from your wounds or from your healing.

John Gordon, welcome to the Book Thinkers Life-Changing Books Podcast. We are so grateful to have you on today and can't wait to get to know you a little bit more. And more about your newest book, The One Truth. You've accomplished so much. I was doing a lot of research on you, and though I've read some of your books, I was like, I got to do a deeper dive. And I just like saw all these things that you accomplished and was blown away. I mean, from, you know, 28 books, 15 bestsellers, you've worked with top NFL and NBA athletes and worked with CEOs, and I was blown away. So, what I came across was In your journey, you had a— used to have a lot of self-doubt. And I'm curious, what is the difference? And you've said that now you're speaking from a place of knowing. So I'm curious, what is the difference between John that had the self-doubt and was insecure compared to the John that is knowing now?

Well, I would often say that I wrote what I thought I knew, and now I'm writing what I really know to be true. Because I've experienced it, I've lived it, I've seen the impact of it. And so, like, going to an NFL team, going to speak to the team, and, and one of the players comes up to me and said, hey, can I get a picture with you? My mom's a big fan of your work and used it in her offices. But also now he's using it on the team and in his professional sports career. So I think I believed it to be true, but now I know it to be true. But do I still have doubt? Of course. I mean, I have doubts. All the time. We all do. Every time I get on stage, I have doubt. Like, maybe this is gonna be the day I don't have it today. Maybe I don't have my best today. And I think that's the actual fear of every great high performer is they always wonder if they have what it takes. So it makes them prepare more. It gives them the edge. Every time I write a new book, I'm a little concerned that it's gonna be a piece of junk. Like, maybe people are gonna say this is my, my, my worst work and my best work was behind me. So, that's something I always have to encounter. I think we all do as human beings. I know LeBron James still has moments of fear and doubt. The greatest of the greats all have that. So, to me though, I know the principles I'm sharing and I know they work because when you get feedback from now thousands and thousands of people and from all these companies I've gotten to work with, all these sports teams, when you see them elevate and have success, You go, okay, there's something here. When I work with the Dodgers and the Rams and the Miami Heat and the various programs in Texas and Clemson, and you see like why they have success and why they don't, why they have great years, why don't they— don't have great years. And you know, it's the principles, you know, it's the team, it's the culture, it's the values, it's the mindset, it's the beliefs, it's the leadership. You see all those things come to fruition and you know it works and you know it doesn't.

Powerful stuff right there. Do you feel like you still struggle with the negative voice? Because I know you've talked about there was time in your marriage that your wife said, listen, I'm going to leave you, Jon, if you don't fix something. So, do you feel like you still struggle with that or do you feel like you've overcome that at this point in a big way?

I've overcome that in a big way because now I know those negative thoughts are not necessarily coming from me, not the initial thought. Like, when we have negative thoughts, We often think they're from us, so we believe them. Then we reinforce them. Then we speak them out loud, and then we feel guilt and shame and beat ourselves up for the thoughts that we had in our head. We actually feel broken. We think something's wrong with us. We think something needs to be fixed. But I often ask, do your negative thoughts come from you? And if you, if you say yes, who would ever choose to have a negative thought? Would you ever choose a negative thought? No, you wouldn't. And I wouldn't choose it. They always come in and they're lies that will tell you things about yourself and your future that just aren't true. That's what negative thoughts are. And in The One Truth, I talk about this a lot. This is why this book is so important. That's why I'm passionate about it. I feel like I'm just beginning as an author and speaker with this new book. I literally feel like I've come full circle. 28 books, my first book, Energy Bus, and this one being my 28th. And the wild thing is they both hit the Wall Street Journal bestseller list the same week when One Truth came out. Energy Boost hit it as well. Years apart, I think like 18, 19 years apart, and they both hit because I think they're both essential in terms of positivity, overcoming those negative thoughts, and then the One Truth explaining how thoughts work. And so, yes, I still have some negative thoughts that come in, but I know they're not coming from me. So then what I do is I speak truth to the lies. I speak words of encouragement. I talk to myself Instead of listening to myself. And the more you do that, that gives you courage. It gives you power because the words we think, the words we say becomes the life that we live. As a man thinks, he becomes. As a woman thinks, she becomes. The words you say, the words you think become the reality that you're experiencing. And so, our thoughts really are so important. So, I've spent my life now since my wife almost left me. Really tuning into the positive day in and day out. And the more I do that, the more I tune into the positive, over time, that's become more of my natural state. Whereas I used to tune into this lower frequency all the time, I've tuned that dial, and now I get into the car and that positive PlayStation is already on rather than the negative station.

One of the things that I love to do on this podcast, Jon, is give everybody an actionable insight into the book, right? So, everybody here, they're listening to you speak. They're like, oh, The One Truth sounds pretty cool. I don't know if I should buy the book. So, can you share with us what does it actually look like when you're speaking truth to yourself? What do you actually teach the reader to do? Is it sitting in the mirror and saying affirmations? Is it prayer? What does that look like for you and what do you recommend?

All right. Here's very practical. On the left side of a piece of paper, you write down your most common negative thoughts. Nick, you have yours. Luke, you have yours. Jon, you have yours. We all have our negative thoughts and we have our patterns. So, you write them down on the left side. On the right side, you write down the words of encouragement. that you will speak when those negative thoughts come in. And anytime it does, for instance, you go in and play pickleball with your friends and those negative thoughts are coming in, then you speak truth to those lies. For me, it looks like love the battle. Don't worry about losing. Just love the battle. Love the moment. Because I know love casts out fear. So the minute I focus on love, fear will dissipate. So I'm reminding myself to love playing, love the battle, love the competition, and just love competing. And don't worry about the outcome. When I'm writing a book, just love the reader. Negative thoughts come in. No, I'm not going to worry about that. I don't care if it doesn't sell well. I mean, I care, but I'm just going to focus in this moment on loving the reader, loving the writing process. So, it looks like that. So, the negative thoughts come in and you're speaking truth and words of life. I'm not really standing in front of a mirror, but it also looks like when I'm walking every day, it looks like me practicing gratitude. Because the research shows you can't be stressed and thankful at the same time. So this isn't the one truth. So when you appreciate, you elevate. You elevate your mood, your performance, and the people around you. So every day, I'm taking this walk of gratitude to start my day, and I'm practicing gratitude. And by the time I get back to my office, I'm ready for a great day. I've created a fertile mind that is ready for great things to happen. I have an acronym in the book, T-U-N-E. This is very practical. Trust. is T. U, unite with love because it overcomes fear. N, neutralize the negativity. Whenever those negative thoughts come in, you neutralize it by speaking truth. And E, you elevate your thinking. You can meditate. You can practice mindfulness. You can pray, or you can actually speak like these words of I am. Like, my wife was being really negative about 9 months ago. She's complaining a lot. Like, this is really practical. She's complaining, complaining, complaining. I'm getting old. My body's breaking down. I'm sore all the time. She goes, I'm not going to be like I I was when I was younger. Like, I should just give up. I'm like, honey, what are you talking about? Like, why are you thinking this way? I go away to a speaking engagement. I come back after 2 days and she's like a different person. She's all positive. She's all energized. She's light and free. I'm like, all right, did you find a boyfriend or something? Like, what's going on here? She goes, no, no. I had that call with the health coaching company where we were doing a Zoom and they did my test and they look at your blood. They test your genes and your DNA. And they said, this is really rare. We don't see this often. They said, they said, this is unique. You have the genes of an Olympic athlete, is what they told her. So now she's walking around the house going, I am an Olympic athlete. I am an Olympic athlete. I'm telling you, the soreness goes away. The pain goes away. She stops complaining. She starts working out, right? Because she's an Olympic athlete. She starts, she starts lifting and training. She's now losing a lot of weight. She looks amazing now, 9 months later. Thoughts completely different. What changed? Her words. I am. I'm an Olympic athlete. So I did this with the University of Texas football team. I had them stand up after I told them this story, and they stood up. Each guy went around and said, I am. One guy said, I am strong. Another guy said, I am a warrior. Another guy said, I am a great teammate. One guy said that I am enough, which is really powerful, with, with tears in his eyes. So powerful. An hour later though, I'm in the weight room. The strength coach is in the middle of the room. The team is encircled around the strength coach and he yells, I am. And then they yelled, my brother's keeper. He yelled, I am. And they yelled, my brother's keeper. Meaning like, I know who I am and who we are together and who I am in relation to you. That's connection right there. That's oneness. I said, this team is going to beat Alabama. I know it. And they did, right? They beat Alabama. This was a more powerful story, you know, before they lost to OU, but they came back after that and then had a lot of success after that. So, so it's just a great example that I've seen in so many teams and salespeople and high performers and leaders, like optimism and leadership, like their competitive advantages. Like, positive leadership is essential and positivity is the ultimate competitive advantage. Leadership is a transfer of belief. So you believe, can you get others to believe?

I love that story. I think, see, I thought you were gonna come back with, you know, you got back from the speaking engagement, she said, John, I finally read your book and it worked.

But no, but it was a good one. I like that though. I like, John, I need to say that in the future.

That'll be a good one. Yes. There you go. Yeah. So you, it's, it's free. So look, so this all kind of has a through line of, of doubt. And I know early on I've read that you had a hard time getting your first book like published and in stores and all that. So kind of a 2-point question. A, how did you— so it's one thing to navigate negative self-talk just in a— not in a vacuum, but just in the day-to-day life. It's a next level sort of thing when you are being presented with the negativity in your face, i.e., in this case, you know, you're not getting your book on the shelf. So how did you navigate that, especially early on? And then as a second, How did you decide it was worth doing a tour to self-promote and to do all of these things? I guess at what point do you say this isn't working, maybe I need to pivot, or no, this is just a challenge and I overcome it and I overcome the doubt and the self-talk and all that? Because that, I mean, that must have been incredibly difficult in that moment for sure.

Yeah, that's a great, great example and a great question because here I am, I'm 36 years old, I write The Energy Bus. I had given up my career in terms of owning restaurants, sold them, now focusing 100% on writing and speaking. The money is dwindling out of my account. I'm paying the bills, supporting the family, paying the mortgage. And I have this dream. And I told my wife I wanted to sell the restaurants and I want to write and speak full-time. And she said, what happens if it doesn't work? I said, there are no other options. And so, being told no and facing all the rejections initially before The Energy Bus, you know, even was published, it was rejected over and over again. And that was hard. And there were many moments of doubt. But I've learned that I cannot allow anyone else's opinion of me to define me. I've learned that I'm not going to allow someone's rejection to affect my dream and my goals. I've been told my whole life that. I'm not good enough. Being an athlete and a college athlete, no one thought I would go play Division 1, but I believed I could and I did, right? I played lacrosse at Cornell University. So, going through those moments of doubt and overcoming and rising above and hearing the naysayers and then overcoming the naysayers, it prepares you for the future. So, I think being an athlete helped me a lot. So, when I was being told no by the publishers, I'm like, they just don't see my value or the book's value. They just don't get it. Because I've had some friends read it. I had my brother read it, my wife read it. The funny thing is my brother and my wife both thought, yeah, it was good. It's a good book. It's okay. You know, like, it wasn't like they said, oh my God, this book is so great. Like, this book is going to sell millions of copies like it did. No one could have foresaw that. And now I look back and I actually read it sometimes and I'll look at it and go, wow, like, I can't believe I wrote this. Like, I was the guy who wrote this because some of it is just so profound, so simple, but so so meaningful. And I know that I wrote it in a really flow state, no doubt. Like, I was just downloading, like, down— I wrote it in 3 and a half weeks. So, I was definitely just downloading this book as I wrote The Energy Bus. So, what made me say it was worth it? Well, one, I feel like I was worth it. Again, you have to have an identity where you feel like you're worth it. Now, when I started speaking, I didn't feel worthy to speak. I got to say that. So, you have this feeling I'm worth it, but then I didn't feel worthy. Who am I to speak? Who am I to make a difference? When I started speaking, I basically said, no, I'm worthy in that I'm here to make a difference in someone else's life. It's not about me. It's about making an impact. So, that drove me to make a difference while I was a speaker. But as an author getting rejected, I'm like, no, my identity has to be greater than what other people are saying about me. So, that was important. And then I felt like I had something that can make a difference. Your vision and mission. must be greater than all the challenges you face. Your positive energy must be greater than all the negativity. That's important as a writer, as someone who's a creator, you gotta believe in it. And so I truly believe that I had this vision and mission, and it was this, to encourage and inspire as many people as possible, one person at a time. And so through all the rejections, I'm like, no, I gotta be more positive than negativity. And my mission is to impact all these people one person at a time. So, that's what kept me going through all the rejections. And then when the book comes out and no bookstores would carry it, like, well, someone thought it should be published. It's now coming out. I got to get out there and share this message. Did I know that it would take off? Did I know that it would do well? I had 5 people in one city, 10 people in another, you know, 20 in another. Like, literally, the most people we had were 100 people in Des Moines, Iowa. They thought Jeff Gordon was coming, the race car driver, right? So, when I showed up, like, that's not a joke, by the way. It's a true story. That's so cool. You know, I wasn't sure how it was going to go. I go back home and it didn't look good. Like, the future didn't look good. But I just told myself, show up every day, make a difference one person at a time, and just share the message every day. And that's what I've been doing all these years. That's what I'm still doing. Nothing's changed. I still feel like I'm just beginning. I don't feel like I've accomplished anything yet. I feel like I gotta keep going, keep driving, keep making an impact. And that's what continues to drive me. So I think that's a big part of my journey. I forget a lot that I've accomplished. Like, I sometimes forget even as a speaker that I've given thousands of talks. When I get up there, it's like, no, no, you've done this before. Like, you should feel very confident right now. But, but I think that humility also keeps you Humble. It keeps you working to get better and continue striving for more.

So much I want to unpack there. I know we're a little bit time-crunched today. I'd love to, if you could talk about this concept of separateness and oneness that you talk about in your book, because when I was reading about it, it just like blew my mind. So, if you could maybe unpack that a little bit, that would be great.

Do we feel more connected right now in talking to each other? What do you think?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. 100%.

So here we are in 3 or 4, 4 different places. You guys have different tiles that I'm looking at right here of, of Zoom tiles. We're in different places and we are in some ways separate, but here we are now connected, you know, as one having a common experience and we feel more bonded and connected as a result of that. That's oneness. The more one you feel, the more joy, The more power, the more healthy you feel. When you feel separate, you feel divided, you feel weak. The root for the Greek word of anxious means to separate and divide. So when you're anxious, you feel divided, you feel separate. All mental health disorders report feelings of being alone and isolated, disconnected and separate. So when you move from oneness to separateness, you move from positive to negative. And so, so many of our mental health issues is the result of feeling disconnected and separate, being isolated, maybe physically, emotionally, relationally, or individually, where you just don't feel connected to yourself, to others, or spiritually to the creator of the universe. And for those who may be against religion, this is not about religion. Like, there's, there's a health to people when they have a connection to their creator that you can't deny. And most of this research shows that when people pray, there's a health to that. People who meditate, there's an enhanced health to that. So the more connected we feel to something greater— even addiction programs know this— the more you feel connected to something greater beyond yourself, connected, that leads to wholeness and healing. The more you feel disconnected and separate, it leads to feeling powerless, division, and all these negative thoughts that just flood in through that separation. It's almost like when you're one, the negativity can't get in. The minute there's separation there, the negativity just pours in. And what is a wound that someone has in their journey of life? A wound from their past. It's a separation, something that made them feel separate and disconnected along the journey. And then the key is to find wholeness and healing throughout your life to find oneness. So everything can be explained in terms of oneness and separateness. Hopefully I made sense of this.

Yeah, absolutely. I love it.

This book, The One Truth, feels like a step in a different direction in terms of writing style and maybe some of the themes. You've covered some of these themes before, but this just feels like a rebranded John Gordon. So does this represent a step in a different direction for you? And where did the idea from this book come from? Like, where did the inbound demand come from for you to write this?

Yeah, you know, you write because there's something that needs to be said. I had my publisher a few years ago say, you need to come out with a book. We need a book right now. I'm like, I'm not writing a book just to write a book. I'm gonna write a book because there's something that needs to be said. And like anything, this book just came to me, like, in a download. I'm walking, I'm getting these thoughts. The brain is an antenna. What? The brain's an antenna? Oh, yeah. 86 billion neurons in your brain. Every neuron has a transmitter and receiver on them. The 2 main frequencies are positive and negative. It all made sense. Oneness and separateness. Once I viewed the lens through oneness and separateness, and then ran things through the lens, like a positive team, a united team, a connected team is a powerful team. A team that is divided and separate is a very weak team. It just all starts to make sense. We talk about broken marriages and broken families and broken relationships. What are they? Separation. So it made sense that there's a power always trying to unite and connect, and it seems like there's a force always trying to divide and separate. So, these thoughts were coming to me and then I started to teach on these thoughts, high state of mind, low state of mind that a good friend of mine, Garrett Kramer, taught me high state of mind, low state of mind. Got to give him credit. Once I recognized that high state of mind, low state of mind, all tied to oneness and separateness, boom, that was it. And then I started teaching it to pro athletes, college athletes, got on a call with most of the NFL coaches that I know, like Like 7 of them, NBA coaches, Doc Rivers, met with him. I was meeting with all these different coaches and teaching them this teaching and teaching a lot of star athletes this teaching. And then friends started calling whose son was suicidal and really depressed, whose daughter was an athlete, you know, in college and struggling because it was her first year and she had this fear and anxiety and helping her. And then I started teaching it to all these different kids as well. And when they started to like, like change after one session of teaching them this, I'm like, all right, I gotta write this book. That was it. Like, I was like, I gotta write this book. I've gotta share this so more people can benefit from it. And that's what drove me to write this book. I don't think it means that I'm gonna go in this direction. Like, I don't wanna be known as the neuroscientist guy. I don't wanna be known as, you know, the oneness separateness guy. I wanna teach oneness and separateness cuz it really does, as you said, it, it fits with the positive message. Like, it, like, I realize in writing this book, All my messages over the years of positivity and negativity fits perfectly into the one truth, and it explains why positivity works. Once you understand the brain's an antenna, you tune into a higher frequency instead of a lower frequency. Love casts out fear. I'm going to perform at a higher level when I'm focusing on love instead of fear. It's why the companies I've worked with, why they rise to a higher level, because they're loving instead of fearing. They're staying positive instead of negative. And then you see how the impact comes from that. So, it's not a new direction. This book is definitely nothing like I've ever written before. As you said, completely different style, which I think is cool to show that I have range, right? That I'm not just a one-hit wonder that can write fables so that I can, you know, again, I didn't know I could. I'm just going to write what I know. And I just wrote it in the way that I thought I could present this and teach this to the reader because I've been teaching it verbally. It was hard to go, okay, now I got to teach it through writing and then through images. And I think the pictures are really cool where you put the graphics in there and it shows the cluttered mind versus the clear mind. And I just knew as people would, would learn this, they would benefit from it. And man, it's been awesome because all the people that are— have read it, I'm getting things like, man, I've never read anything like this. This is next level thought. This is profound. Because I think people were saying, oh, John's about just positivity. They don't, you know, they just positive or negative. They didn't understand that I have a lot of deep thoughts about a lot of things. And this allowed me to share it. But I'm gonna go back to writing a few more fables that I have in my mind already that I know I wanna write. So I got a couple cool ones I'm gonna share and can't wait to get back to them. And I have one fable that's gonna be based on the one truth where the main character goes from separateness to oneness towards the end and take him on a journey as you'll experience that. A lot less teaching in it like I've done, like The Seed, even though it's a fable and a story, there's still a lot of like the why process and other things. I don't want to get into that. I want to write a book more like where there's just this fable with cool kind of conversation and teachings along the way.

I think so many people can use that message. You know, we just live in a world that is constantly trying to divide everywhere and everything. It's like you get on social media, that's all it is. It's just that there's just constant negativity we're bombarded with. We already have enough that goes on in here in our own minds. And then as you get online, it's, it's everywhere. What are some, just like some maybe 1 or 2 practical tips that you have for people to get more into that oneness and less out of the, you know, out of the separation and into the oneness?

Yeah, well, one is to recognize that you are one and you're not separate, and it's an illusion. And the illusion is trying to divide you and separate you. And that's what the media does. That's what life does. But think about it. If you want to post something that gets a lot of comments, you have to say something that's divisive that you know is going to get people on both sides to agree or disagree. Everyone knows this in social media now. You've got to say something. So now we're actually looking to create content that creates division rather than focus on what we agree on, rather than looking at the similarities, rather than looking at the oneness that we are. Even when I talked about in the book about diversity training, I think diversity training is fine. Show uniqueness, celebrate different cultures, understand all of that is helpful. But I think the most powerful thing of all will be oneness training. When we realize that we are one and that we're connected and we're not meant to be separate, that's gonna lead to true power and healing as we move forward. And so how do we do this at a practical level? Oneness and separateness. It's reminding ourselves that we are one. And I talked about TUNE, the acronym of TUNE. That is key. Prayer for me is, is how I connect back to oneness, where you just pray, and as you pray, you're connecting to the creator of the universe. And what are we like when we die? We turn to dust. Our skin is just energy. Everything is energy. But within that energy field is a, is a soul and a spirit, I believe. And I believe, like, just like there's H2O, you know, water is oxygen and hydrogen. Well, who we are is spirit and soul. So that spirit and soul is, is ultimately like the eternal soul is, is who you are. So it's remembering that and that eternal soul and spirit is meant to be connected to others and everybody. So practically, reach out to a friend, share love and support, laugh together, spend time together, encourage and nourish each other. It's that practical. Relationships are important to create that connection.

I love that answer. I think more people need to focus on alignment and oneness as opposed to separating out a group of people, targeting them, and saying they're one of us. It's like, why are you separating everybody? So that makes a lot of sense to me. As we get close to wrapping this up, John, I just wanted to see if you had maybe one last quick question before Luke wraps things up here.

Well, I'll try to make it quick. So it feels like a lot of what, even in your own life and as we read your books and books like it, a lot of it is undoing the wiring that was done even through childhood. So as a parent myself with young kids, I know you're a father, what are some things we can do on the front end of the curve? So that they're, they're not at 20 and 30 having to undo the same things and this perpetuation and all that? Because I feel like relating, and I know you did with the coffee bean in the book, and that we— it's a whole nother topic. But yeah, what's some stuff we can do early on so that we can set them up for the next level that we had to undo to get to?

Well, the cool thing is the coffee bean message is all about inside out instead of outside in. So we become more one when we realize that we create from the inside out. The world will get you to focus on the outside, the appearance, the division, the separation. The more we look inside, we realize, no, we are one with myself, one with others, one spiritually. And then that oneness gives you power. And so, the coffee bean, when it's put into hot water, it transforms the water into coffee. The carrot and the egg, the egg gets hardened by the environment and the carrot gets softened and weakened by the environment. And that could be us in pressure, in different situations and challenges. So, What will we be? But going back to kids, like, we've got to teach kids that they have the power to overcome their circumstance. They are not a victim of their circumstance. The world teaches you that you're a victim, that the circumstance is why you are the way you are. But it's never the circumstance. It's always our state of mind. One day you're in traffic and it bothers you. The next day you're in the same traffic and it doesn't. Is it the traffic? The pandemic happened. Some people thrived. Other people struggled big time. Was it the pandemic? No, it was our state of mind. And when our state of mind is high, the circumstance has no power over us, and we know it. When our state of mind is low, we feel like the circumstance does have power over us. So, it does, but it's owning our power and recognizing that. But here's the deal, Jon. I've been telling parents, you know how they say you should save money for your kids' college and start now, right after they're born? Start saving for their therapy as well. Because no matter what you do, no matter what you do, you're going to create some wound. There's gonna be some wound that comes with your child. It is the human nature to have a wound. The, the journey of life is the separation and the wound we experience and the healing as we go through life to heal the wound that we have. You can live from your wound or from your healing. And in The One Truth, I explain ultimately how the healing is about oneness and the wound is about separation. We just did a talk with leaders, Patrick Lencioni and I, 75 top leaders. It was in Dallas. It was an incredible event. It was a high-ticket event. All these top leaders who run all these companies were there. You know what we talked about most? Wounds and healing. That's what we wanted. That's what they want to talk about. It was incredible. Kept on asking questions about that. And that's really become a big expertise of mine because I've lived it. I recognize it. I see it. And I see how living from the wound leads to dysfunction and leading from and living from your healing leads to your growth. So, for your kids, just love them unconditionally. Don't put pressure on them. Help them become who they're meant to be, not who you want them to be. And then along the way, just constantly reaffirm and love them. Make it hard on them in terms of self-reliance and having to work hard and having to have grit in life and overcome their own challenges. Don't make it too easy. I have 2 kids and I've not made it too easy for them. But early on, I was not that positive father. Later on, I was more positive and reaffirming. And we sat around the table like a year or 2 ago, and they were both in their early 20s. And I said, what'd I do wrong, guys? What could I have done better? Like, tell me, what could I have done better? And they told me, you know, it was a long— it was about 3 hours of telling me what I did wrong. No, I'm just kidding. But it was, it was definitely some time of what I did wrong. And you know what? You could have done this, you could have done that. Like, you know what? You're right. I apologize. I wish I could have done it better. But you know what? I was growing up too, and I wasn't perfect, and I was a young dad, and I made mistakes. But I'm trying to work on getting better now, you know. And it's never a dead end. It's an ongoing journey as a parent, and you're still actually raising your kids and living with them and, well, not living with them, but encouraging them and helping them along the way. Like, my kids call me more now than when we were teenagers. So, like, John, I'm trying to live my life and have some fun, and they're always calling me, Dad, I need your help with this. I need your help with this. I'm like, listen, I raised you. I just want to enjoy my life now. But I'm still having to play that parental role. And I do. So unconditional love, unconditional support, encouragement, and then helping them recognize on their journey the wounds they have and help them through the healing process.

And save for therapy.

And save for therapy because they will need it no matter what.

Oh, that's fantastic. I love it. So good.

All right. Well, John, we have really appreciated your time, your knowledge, sharing your wisdom. I have one more question that I will wrap this up with. And then we can let people know where they can go to find out more about you. But my last question is this, which is you pass away and all the stuff that you put out, the books, the courses, the speaking, it all goes away, but you can leave the world with a single piece of advice. What would it be?

Oh, wow.

All my books are gone. That's it.

That's it.

You know, it's funny, my plane was going to crash, at least we thought it was, and we were terrified as we're going down. And my first thought was, not about dying, but wait, I have more books to write. Like, that's what I was thinking. Like, I won't even write the books that I know I'm supposed to write. Like, like, there's no separation between what I do and the books and everything. It's my life. Like, I don't write for money. I write because this is who I am and this is what I do. And so that was my thought. But what was the one piece of advice that I could leave? It's this. Gotta say it. Been saying a lot recently. Romans 8:5-6. A mind governed by the flesh leads to death. A mind governed by the Spirit leads to life and peace. And so you can live of things of this world and focus on that and dysfunction, the greed, the power, the division, and it's going to lead to death and a feeling of death. Or you can connect to that oneness and that Spirit, and that's going to lead to life and peace. So I try to spend more time in prayer and less time arguing on social media. Those are the 2 differences. How do you feel? When you're around someone who loves you and supports you versus someone who hates you. One is flesh, one is spirit and life. So tune into the spirit and the life and the peace that you'll experience is incredible. That's what I would give in terms of advice because everything ultimately comes down to that. I believe that teaching.

It's beautiful, beautiful advice and a mic drop moment for sure. I appreciate it.

Well, first time I shared it. First time I shared it like this publicly on a podcast.

That is beautiful. I got goosebumps while you were talking. That's Amazing stuff. Well, where should people go to connect with you further?

Go to jongordon.com. J-O-N-G-O-R-D-O-N.com is my website. We got a free 7-step plan that people could actually utilize to increase their positivity, or Instagram, Twitter @jongordon11, and you'll find me on Facebook and LinkedIn and all that other stuff as well.

Oh, perfect. Well, we'll also have it linked in the show notes. So appreciate you again. Thank you so much for coming on our podcast.

Hey, thanks guys. I appreciate what you're doing. I love, I love a group of people talking about like book thinkers who love books. And so what a, what a cool thing you're doing. So thanks for having me. Thanks, Nick. Thanks, Luke. Thanks, John. Appreciate you guys.

Appreciate you too.