Turn internal conflict into harmony by learning to appreciate every "part" of you with IFS therapy

Welcome back to the show, and I'm so excited for our next guest. We have a real angel in the house today. Um, we've got Tricia Kelly. She's amazing. I met her because I went to an IFS workshop that she was hosting, and it was incredible. And I knew immediately I wanted all of you to meet her because she is just full of so much light and love. And I feel like her, her ability to connect with people on a real deep soul level, if I can use that word. Because I think spiritual, for some people doesn't go quite deep enough. But if I say soul, I think you understand how deep I'm talking. I'm talking about the core, the center of who you really are. And she has this amazing innate ability to help you, you connect with your soul and who you truly are. That's what IFS is really all about. Hi, welcome back to the Chemoff Conqueror Show. It's been a minute, I know. Thank you for enduring that little pause with me as I got my life back together. Things were a little chaotic after I had the passing of my grandfather. For those of you that don't know, he moved in with us. And anyway, it was rough watching him decline and pass away, but it ended up being a beautiful experience. And I appreciate all of the well wishes and the love that you all have sent to me and, and helping me take that much needed grieving time. So please go ahead and click the like, the share, do all that stuff so that we can get this video out to everybody who needs to hear it, because she is incredible. Thank you so much for helping us spread these words of wisdom and everything. So let's welcome our beautiful Patricia Ogden. She is a small-town girl. She grew up in South Jordan. I love that she put in here, uh, back when there was just one stoplight and lots of farms. She's been living in Payson, Utah for over 20 years, and she has 6 kids, most of whom are all grown now, and 5 girls, 1 boy, and who just got married, which congratulations.

Thank you.

She loves being a grandma to her beautiful granddaughter. She loves going on walks and taking in the beautiful sunshine, watching cheesy Hallmark movies. I'm right there with you. And cuddling up to a good book. When she can say she loves to get away to her family's cabin up in Logan Canyon. I, I, this part is why she got into IFS or part of it anyway. She was tired of being pathologized for her own long struggles with mental health. And she found IFS and has not looked back. IFS stands for Internal Family Systems. And in a minute, she'll explain what that is, but her experiences in life and healing herself have perfectly positioned her to hold a compassionate and loving space for clients to safely explore their inner worlds and heal with the power of their true self. She believes we have the resources we need to heal right inside ourselves. And I couldn't agree more, which is why she is here today. And I cannot wait for you guys to understand IFS. She's done a couple sessions with me now and already just in one main one, I've had life-changing, um, experiences, and I've already felt burdens lifted. And she's just amazing. So Patricia, will you explain to us what IFS is, what Internal Family Systems is? Because that is probably a foreign term to most people.

It is, it really is, because it sounds like it's something to do with families, but actually It has to do more with your internal world, and we find that as we go in and explore what's inside here, it is kind of like a family and its own little system, and it's right there inside of us. So that's why they call it Internal Family Systems, is you're dealing with this internal world inside. Um, and so yeah, that's what, um, that is about. And, um, so What we, we believe that each of us are, um, born with subpersonalities, and, um, we believe that it is the nature of the mind to be subdivided, um, and we're born with multiple personalities, which sounds kind of strange because out in the psychology world that's not a good thing. It's a disorder, right? And we don't believe in pathologizing people. So what we say about someone with that disorder is that their personalities were just really traumatized and just— it happened really early. And so it's just more shattered, I would say, with someone with multiple personality disorder. But we— yeah, we believe that we're all born with these multiple personalities. Just some people, we say like a different aspect of me, or If you've ever heard of like ego states, um, that's kind of another term for, you know, parts. Um, it's also called parts work. Um, so like, have you ever heard someone or heard yourself talking about something and you're saying, well, a part of me wants to do this, but then part of me feels like really conflicted about making this choice? That would be like, that's why he decided, or Richard Schwartz, the developer, decided parts is just a really common word that people use to describe what's going on inside of them. And so, yeah.

And he, uh, Richard Schwartz, he, Dr. Schwartz, he, um, came up with this a couple decades ago. Was that right?

Like, it's been around for a long time. Decades ago. Yep.

Okay. And I believe I was looking on the website, he has several books out and a recent one, um, No Bad Parts, or is that, is that the last, the most recent one that he just came out with?

I don't, I think it might be the most recent one. I think that one came out in 2021. It's phenomenal to help just everyday people understand what IFS is all about.

Okay. It's on my wishlist on Audible.

Yes. We haven't gotten there yet, but it has great exercises. That people can do to get to know their inner world. So, okay, cool.

Well, I remember when I did a session with you, I did feel a little schizophrenic. It was a, um, an interesting experience to see myself as different personalities or different people, but it made sense because like you said, there are times when if you're faced with a decision, like right now I have a big decision I'm trying to make, and part of me feels this way, and a part of me feels this way, and a part of me feels this way, and I'm weighing all the pros and cons. So can you explain to everybody how, um, having these different parts isn't bad, but it can be used for, um, once you get to know them, you can love them and appreciate them, and they become in harmony with each other, and it Um, can you explain that a little bit more?

Yes, yes. So one of the things I want to say is that, so we're all born with these, that these sub-personalities, these different parts inside of us. And what happens when we're young, um, is we might experience a really difficult or awful trauma or experience. And what happens when we experience that is these parts shift from their naturally beneficial states when they haven't been traumatized, they're naturally beneficial. And so they shift into these— even sometimes can be quite destructive, like an addictive part or an anger raging part of us. Um, they switch into this very protective role to keep us safe because oftentimes they still think, even though we're, you know, 30 years away from that trauma that happened when we were 3, that is still happening. So they're kind of frozen in time. And what, what is really great about IFS is we go inside and we get to know that part. I, when I am working with a client, I don't see their anxiety or depression or their trauma. I see a whole person. I see their, their true self full of light and love and everything that they need. And I see that there's these different pieces of them that have, they're hurting. Or they're wounded and they just need us to get to know them so that they can get the help that they're looking for. And quite often that's what they're do— they're looking for, for us to heal them and redeem them. And that's how we do that. We get to know them, we befriend them, and then they, as they feel safe, they let down their walls and they tell us their secrets. And then that's how we find ways to understand and heal the trauma that happens. So many years ago.

Okay, so what I'm hearing you say, and I think you said this in the workshop, is that the part of somebody who might be addicted or feeling suicidal or depressed, these are the parts of them that are hurt. And I don't want to say broken, but they've become a guardian maybe and a protector to protect the true self from getting further hurt. Exactly.

And they think it's still young and vulnerable.

Okay, so if you get to know and you can pinpoint that part of you and hear what it's been through, um, and show it compassion and grace and thank it for being a part of you and thank it for protecting you and being there, but then showing that compassion is the next step. What happens after you, you meet it and you greet it? What do you do?

So it all depends on which part you're talking to. So there's two different kinds of parts. There's protectors, and then there's the vulnerable parts.

Okay.

Protectors protect those vulnerable parts.

Okay.

Now, you know you're experiencing a vulnerable emotion when it's something like shame, loneliness, worthlessness, emptiness, just like that hollow, empty feeling, or you just feel completely alone and abandoned. That's definitely a very vulnerable feeling, and those are quite frequently from these younger experiences. And these older, these protective parts, not necessarily a lot older, but they come and they protect that shame from coming out. So like, if you— a part that would protect shame maybe in a parenting relationship would look like pleasing the parent so that you never get in trouble again.

Hmm.

That would be a part of you that would develop to do whatever it has to do to keep you out of trouble and from feeling shame again. So it might look like pleasing others, placating others, Overachieving. Overachieving is definitely a coping skill, but also it could be becoming combative and doing the other end and just fighting and resisting. That's a protective part too. Does that make sense?

So that makes a lot of sense. So how did you find IFS? Now I know a part of your story is that you found IFS because you were going through some hard things and that's part of your story. So can you tell everybody, um, why IFS really is, um, I mean, we now know what it is and why it's so powerful, but how it was so powerful for you personally.

So for me, I, I had got married the second time, um, and thought this is it. And 2 months in, I knew I was gonna need help. It was really hard. It was just so hard, unbelievably hard. And so I tried marriage counseling with a marriage counselor that just blew up. I felt even worse after that. And I was trying an individual counselor, but it just didn't feel like I was getting better. And I was in the middle of something really hard and I needed some hard, fast answers. I didn't wanna wait around for 3 or 4 years like they see in traditional therapy. You're going to need at least 2 years to start feeling better. And I want to feel better now because it was, it was raw. All my feelings were often very raw. And so I, God said, look for a therapist in my town that charges $80. And so I was led to a therapist in Payson that only charged $80.

And that's a really specific answer. Look for a therapist that charges only $80.

$80. It was phenomenal. And I found him and I was like, I know I'm supposed to be with this therapist because he was the next step in my healing journey. And he introduced me to Internal Family Systems therapy. And right away, within 2 weeks, I was like, I feel like myself for a little bit. And I just, I was like, this feels so good. I got to keep going back and go. And I kept going back and I was feeling good. And I haven't looked back from since that time. It was just like, this is— I have— he's not giving me homework. You know, the only hard part is showing up and that's not very hard.

So tell me more about what that, um, what the sessions looked like. You don't have to go into like what you said or experienced or whatever, but I want to give people an idea of how IFS works in terms of what you experience as a, as a client.

A client. Yes.

I know for a lot of us hearing we're going to go internally and discover our parts, that's kind of scary. It's kind of scary to think I'm going to go deep into my subconscious and get to know myself. I'm not sure I want to know myself. Like, I don't know, there's, there's a lot of fear and anxiety when it comes to deep subconscious work. And I hear a lot of people are very resistant to, to doing that. But like you said, I personally believe that this deep subconscious work is what's fastest. It gets to the root of the problem. It gets you to know the problem. Quickly, and you get quick results. I did talk therapy for a number of years, guys, and while it was wonderful, I didn't really start getting major healing done until I started hypnotherapy, EDMR, and now I was drawn to IFS because I no longer felt comfortable with the hypnotherapist I was seeing, to be perfectly flint. We— I feel like he was— he served a purpose, and it was what I needed at the time. But he helped me with that trauma, and then the trauma I really needed to deal with, I wasn't comfortable dealing with him. And so anyway, long story short, I knew I needed something that was deep subconscious work because I, I had seen how quickly it works. And how effective it is, but I couldn't find where I was supposed to be until I met you. And I was like, this is it, this is what I need to do. So I want you guys to understand how this works and what a session looks like. And, um, and then I'll tell you a, uh, I'll just tell you now, um, we're going to do a, um, so she's going to explain how this works and then we're going to, in our next video, We're going to do a workshop and show you a demonstration of an IFS session. So if you would like to be a part of that workshop, obviously let me know, um, in the comments or whatever, message me, do whatever you want to do so you can be a part of that workshop and we'll figure out how we're going to do that so that you guys can be a part of that and see it live. Um, So will you explain to them what this looks like and what they can expect at the workshop?

Yes. Okay. So in a typical session, I always tell my clients, I want you to know that I see us as a team. I am not the expert. I feel like you know yourself better than me. And so I defer to my clients always. I say, you're the boss. If something feels uncomfortable to you, please let me know. That is my client's job to, to say, that feels uncomfortable, oh, that feels good, yeah, that's right, or to correct me if I say something wrong and that doesn't fit for them. I want my clients to, to say, please, that doesn't feel good. So just knowing that, like, I'm trying to create this really safe space. Now, for some people, they may not know even what safety means. But for me, like, it's such a tender thing to go inside someone's soul and walk in there, walk around in there with them. And for me, when I do that, I take off my shoes and I only go where I have permission to go. And those parts inside of you They know whether or not they're okay with you going inside. And if they say no, I totally respect that. If there's a part of you that's not comfortable going somewhere, I— we would not go there. We would only go places where that client feels comfortable and safe, because the biggest thing that I want my clients to know is that they are important and they are the experts. Experts of what happens here. They are in total control.

And I want you to know, Patricia does a really good job. Every, um, you can just tell from her countenance when you meet her that she's a safe person. And I'm naturally skeptical of people because I've been where I thought I was safe and I turned out not to be safe. And she is very respectful. We had a few moments in my last session where one part wasn't ready to talk yet, right? It was shy. It didn't want to be known. And she was so sweet. She was just like, it's okay, you don't have to be known, you can sit down, or whatever it was that you said. I don't remember exactly, but it made me feel like I wasn't going to be pushed. I never ever felt pushed. I was vulnerable, but I felt safe to be vulnerable, if that makes sense. Like, I felt like it was okay to be vulnerable and to be as vulnerable as my subconscious would allow me to be. You need to go at the pace that your subconscious is willing to go at, and as soon as I was willing to, um, go with the flow, so to be, that's when things started to open up for me.

Yeah.

And I had an amazing experience.

Yeah. And if there's someone, if someone feels resistant or hesitant to trust, that's okay with me. I don't need people to, um, let me in. That's totally— and I get that if someone's experienced severe trauma, they're not gonna want, and I have clients like that. It has taken months with one of my clients that has serious complex trauma issues from her childhood. And she's had a really— she doesn't have anyone in her life except for her husband that is safe. And we have been able to build a network right inside of herself with her parts and her true self. She's not fighting with her husband anymore. She's got autism. She's got— she's on the spectrum. She's been diagnosed with bipolar. She is doing so well, and someone like her would have been in therapy for years before she ever got to that point, and we did that much in 6 months.

That's awesome. So when you sit down with somebody and you create a safe place and you allow them to feel, um, safe— I love that you have no agenda, right?

You have no agenda.

This is, um, and I remember you saying in the workshop that you check in with yourself to make sure you have no agenda frequently during the sessions. Um, what, let's describe for them what happens after we kind of set the stage for, um, for people. Okay, like during a session, um, you ask questions to kind of help guide them to get to know their parts? How do you do that? How do you ask, like, what sort of questions do you ask and how do you help them facilitate that?

Yeah, so some of my favorite questions are, what would you like to get curious about today? What have you seen in your behavior or your actions this week that you want to get curious about? And I, I say curious because curiosity is one of the qualities of your true self. Curiosity is open, it's judgment-free, it's teachable and humble. It's like this open feeling, and I know when my clients are experiencing curiosity because I can hear it in their voice. When I'm really curious, I want to get to know this part of me that came out over the weekend.

So can you give me an example of, um, We can even use mine as an example. Um, we— I think I told you I was struggling with, um, being the executor of my grandmother's will, right? And I was feeling very conflicted on what to do there and how to, um, manage everyone's emotions.

Yes.

And, um, I wasn't going to use me as an example, but I feel like I should, so I guess we're going to. Um, and you, um, then helped me, um, you asked some more probing questions about what that looks like, and you invited me— I can't remember exactly how this went, but I remember being invited to, um, kind of quiet my mind and see in my mind's eye a peaceful setting, correct?

Yes, yes, yeah. And then we invite these, we invite these different parts of you to come in and sit down, kind of like at a table or maybe at a campfire, somewhere that feels right in ways that feel good for all of you, what feels right for you.

And for me, it was, we were in a meadow I was sitting at the base of a tree.

Yeah.

And we were all sitting in like a semicircle with, um, like just on the ground. Yeah. Okay. So if you can picture that scene of me with all the different me's. So I say I felt schizophrenic because it was like, you know, a lot of—

yep.

And then you asked me who was in attendance, correct?

Yeah. Yeah.

And that's when the revelation started happening, you guys. Like, this is when you start to get to know your subconscious and who you really are.

Yeah.

And is it fair to say that my true self was the person, um, I kind of imagined my true self as the one at the head of the semicircle, if that makes sense?

Yes, the leader.

Looking at everybody.

Yes. Yeah.

And, um, it was really interesting because there were a few people who were in attendance that didn't want to be seen. They didn't want to come out and play. There were other people who were in attendance that were like totally obstinate and like, shh, dumb, I can't believe we're doing this right now. Yeah, we had really interesting personalities going on.

They're all so cute.

It made me laugh. I was like, what is happening right now? Um, but then, um, we, we were able to pinpoint who, who needed to be addressed.

Yeah, right. I asked you, Bonnie, as you feel into this moment, who do you feel like needs your attention right now?

That's right, that was the question. And And asking that helped me know what part of this issue am I having that needs to be addressed. And we ended up uncovering some interesting things that I've been hanging on to since I was a little, little girl, and, um, some things that happened when I was a teenager, and, um, that have— that are all influencing my thoughts and my feelings and my behaviors and I have to tell you guys that I had one of the most sacred experiences of my life during that experience. And then this week, I was challenged because I learned something about myself that I'll share. I learned that it is not my job to be the rescuer. It's not my job to rescue you. Um, it's not my job to rescue my family. It's not my job to do that. It's the Savior's. And this week I was challenged with that knowledge because my, uh, natural tendency is to be that rescuer. And I remembered what I had learned during that session and what the Spirit had taught me. And my internal cells were talking again inside and being like, okay, rescuer, like, you don't need to do this. You need to do this instead. And I was able to kind of talk myself out of this, um, experience. Does that make sense?

It made you more able to consciously decide, right?

Yes.

Yeah. That's what IFS does. You don't have to, like, as you, as people keep working on things, they, they find themselves just changing. And, and you don't have to fight against yourself. You don't have to fight against that addicted part or that part that's angry or the part that's depressed or anxious. It, it naturally comes. And it's like sometimes you can hear the conversation, like with your parts, you can notice it. And other times it's just this quiet shift where just like, oh wait, I usually get mad, but I don't even feel a vestige of anchor here.

That's amazing. Okay, so we— I think in our workshop this will be really cool to help this. Um, I'm really excited to show you guys how it works, because now that we've kind of described it to you, hopefully it makes a little more sense, and you'll want to be a part of, of this workshop and be a part of the demo. And, um, If it's already happened, if you're watching this video later, we'll, we'll update the links and we'll put it down below so you can see it and you can see how it works and, um, then be able to contact Patricia Ogden and, um, work with her personally and do one of these sessions yourself, um, or find an IFS, uh, counselor closer to you. But she does Zoom. So, you know, it's, you can do this work over the computer, you can be in person to do it. So, um, not that I ever try to push anybody's business or anything on anyone. But if you are drawn to this, and you do feel like it's something that would work for you, and you're ready to meet yourself, my beautiful friend, you have an incredible person inside of you who wants to shine. And they want you to get to know them. And every single part of you is beautiful, and every single part of you serves a purpose. Even those parts of you that you hate, and that you're scared of, and that you wish weren't there. Those parts are amazing. They are serving you in some way. And you being able to get to know them, you'll be able to see how they're serving you and be able to help them heal so that they can go from a place of pain and suffering to a place of love and light and blessings. I feel like IFS for me takes away the pain and the suffering that, that little 3-year-old self felt. And now that 3-year-old self can be a 3-year-old, right? And can— and I no longer resent that experience. And I feel like that is a— you shared an experience once, Patricia, about somebody with suicide. Suicidal tendencies and how that tendency was actually protector, right? Like they were trying to— I'm going to butcher this, so maybe you should tell about how— why does suicide work and how can you turn that into a good thing?

Yeah, yeah. So I've even dealt with suicidal part and it was the only option for this part at that time. It felt like the only option was to just end it all because it just felt so overwhelming for this part. And it was doing it out of love. And obviously we don't want to encourage anyone to follow a feeling like that. Um, but what happened is when I got to know that suicidal part, it taught me what I needed to know, and then it didn't have to work so hard.

And I think I remember you saying it changed from being suicidal to being a protector, and it became your, your role in that it would alert you if you were overwhelmed or alert you if there was danger. And it became— it shifted from being a negative force to being a force for good in your life.

Absolutely. That's my part that says, you need a nap now. You need to have— go have some fun, watch a movie. When it shifted into its natural beneficial state, which is my self-care piece, which is beautiful.

And I, and I want that for everybody in our group. I want that for everyone who watches this video. I want you to have what Tricia has. This light. And the light comes from being unburdened. And I know that you have the ability within you to fix that and to become unburdened. And maybe you need someone like Patricia who can help facilitate that, but you're going to do the work, not Patricia.

Absolutely. Thank you.

Well, I mean it with every fiber of my being. I am so excited. Thank you, everybody, for watching it and sharing it. And I hope that you will want to to be a part of our workshop. So just to explain, the workshop's not going to be everybody doing a session, okay? We're going to pick one person. There will be one volunteer who's willing to be the guinea pig and to do a session with her. And the rest of us will watch and be supportive and be there cheering on that person and watching this unfold. And if you feel like you want to be that person already, maybe the spirit has pricked you, um, let me know. Um, it's, uh, it's beautiful and it's amazing thing. So I can't wait till we do round 2 of that video. So stay tuned, everybody. Thank you.

Thank you.