#115 How To Turn Massive Income To Passive Income, ft. Brandon Turner

Welcome to the Passive Income MD Podcast, where we talk about creating your ideal life through multiple streams of income. I'm your host, Peter Kim. If you enjoy hearing about this stuff, make sure to hit subscribe so I can bring it to you every week. Now, let's get on with the show.

Hey, everyone.

I always say I'm excited by these talks and these, you know, episodes, but this one I'm extremely excited about. I mean, this is something that we've been working on for a while, and it's just excited to have Brandon Turner here in front of us. In case you don't know who he is, I'm going to go ahead and intro him. I'm going to read this off. He's the founder and managing partner of Open Door Capital. We're going to find out all about that. He's a bestselling real estate author. He's got over a million copies sold of his books, and he's the past host of the BiggerPockets podcast with over 100 million downloads. All right, so over the past decade, Brandon, uh, he's got this tremendous track record that he's built up in multifamily, including apartments and mobile home parks. We're going to be talking about all of these things today. And also just of note, he is the keynote speaker at PIMDCON Live 2022 this year. So if you're going to be there live, we're going to be hanging out with Brandon. I'm excited to have him. Brandon, how you doing?

Peter? Man, this is amazing. Thank you for having me on today. I'm psyched. This is going to be a good time.

Oh, no, I mean, it's pumped. I mean, usually you're the one talking. You're the one interviewing people that I know and you're. And everyone else is telling their story to you. So to today's episode, if it's okay with you, I want to find out a little bit more about your past and your history. Before we do that, can you just tell people a little bit about what Open Door Capital is right off the bat?

Yeah, man. So first thing I always tell people is it's not the same as that billion dollar like ibuyer Open Door. I had the name first. I always say that, but they'll yell at me someday. So we don't buy single family houses like they do. We are a, I guess a commercial real estate company. We buy mostly two things, apartments and mobile home parks. We started with the mobile home park space, which I love. I will talk about that. All day long. And then we added on apartment complexes as well. So we do both kind of like a B class value add type apartments, you know, maybe a minus, so like nicer places. And it's a, it's been a wild ride. Yeah. Went from zero to. I don't know. Well, I guess I had about 100 units three years ago and today I've got 5,000 units. So it's been a quick scale up of the last few years, but yeah, it's been fun. That's open door capital.

Yeah, it's been amazing to see that growth. And I mean, obviously a lot of people here know you from bigger pockets, but let me ask you just to go back a little bit further. Was real estate always part of, you know, your past history was this, like always your thing growing up and you're like, live, breathe, and we're going to do this. Especially coming out, like as a young kind of person in your career, just wondering if that was.

Yeah. I mean, my dad's a billionaire developer. I'm just kidding. No, he's not. My dad's a meat cutter. Uh, was a meat cutter his whole life. My mom did daycare. Uh, and so, no, I didn't know anything about real estate or finances or money. It was one of those, like, you do not talk about, you know, money at the kitchen table kind of like unwritten rule and. Yeah, I mean, like, I, I just, I got into college, decided to, like, I was a history major. Like, what do you do with a history degree other than maybe go to law school or be a historian? And I don't want to be a historian. So I started applying for law school. And that was, I quickly realized what I was headed toward was like this, like, all right, so in my soul, I could feel it. And I bet people listening right now will, will resonate with this. Like, there's like in your soul, you feel like something's wrong. It's like you're in the Matrix. You're like Neo in the Matrix. You're like, something in this world is wrong. This idea of like, wait, I'm going to spend the best hours of my day, the best days of my week, the best weeks of my month, and the best months of the year and the best years of my entire life, working the majority of the time or stuck in a commute for the majority of time, just to be in debt, to be able to pay all these bills and like, it just like, there's something not right in that equation. And I'm like, this sounds miserable. So in that process, I discovered like, entrepreneurship through real estate investing. In other words, like, like, how to make money not at a 9 to 5 job and just do it through real estate. And I just got obsessed. I mean, like obsessed. I was like 21 and I read like a hundred books on real estate and started buying little houses and learning how to do stuff. It was a. Yeah, it's just like my soul needed something else and real estate was the answer.

I mean, you'd be surprised how so many people listening to this. This is a podcast mostly for doctors, high income professionals. I think a lot of people resonate with what you just said. I mean, in terms of working, kind of expecting, this was the kind of life that they wanted. They put their time in. At this point, they're in mountains of debt and they're like, wow, I'm doing this every single day, in and out. That's kind of where I was a little bit. Like, again, not to go into my story, people have heard that, but again, it just didn't. It wasn't cracked up to be what it thought it would be, you know? And so I found real estate as well. Now for you, what was that first moment for you? Was it a book? Was it a person? Like, how'd you get introduced to it?

Yeah, man, I'll tell you. I got kind of two kind of different stories, but similar in the same way. First one is I bought a house. So it was like 2006 or seven, like late six, early seven. And I was like, working at, like, I think I was at the time working at Cold Stone Creamery, like, make, like making ice cream for people. Like, it was like, like terrible, right? And it was a cool job. I got to sing for tips. It was awesome. And. But I was making a whopping, like, you know, thousand dollars a month, maybe 1500 on a good month. I had no credit, I had no, like, real good income, no experience in any of that. And it was the glory days of crazy mortgages. So of course they just like approved me for a crazy mortgage. And I bought this single family house just because I thought it'd be cheaper than renting. And I rented the bedrooms out thinking, how do I live cheaper because I don't have much money, right? I'm broke. And I remember, like, renting the bedrooms out to some buddies. And this is. I'm still planning law school. This is like during, like, I'm studying for the lsat. I took the lsat. I'm headed down that path. And then I realized one day, actually Here's a. Here's a story. I don't tell this very often. So I'm sitting in a church, the church I'd never been to before. This, like, random church in Minnesota. I went with a friend. She's like, hey, let's go to this church. And so I go there, and I'm just, like, not paying attention, as is usually the case when I'm sitting in any kind of meeting. My. My mind's just wandering. And I thought it would be cool to backpack Europe. Like, I never had that thought in my life. I just, like, it would be cool to backpack Europe for, like, a year. And then I started thinking, well, how would I do that? And I was like, well, I mean, I got this house I bought. I wonder what that's worth. I bet it's worth more than I paid for it. And, like, that was the start of it. That was, like, the first aha. It's like, I could. And then, by the way, I did. I sold the house, actually. I made, like, 25 grand. I could go travel Europe now. Instead, I got married, which was a much better trade. But that was like, the aha moment of going, wait. I just bought something. And then it made a ton of money for very little work. In other words, for the first time in my life, I had separated the idea of hours worked and dollars produced, right? Most of us spend our entire lives, hours worked, dollars produced. And for the first time, I got outside of that. So that was aha moment number one. And again, I think I've made a good choice getting married instead of. Instead of Europe. I went to Europe a few years later, though, which was whole different story. Second story. I sold that house, and I'm now broke, right? I'm like, I mean, what am I? I paid for the wedding. I still have no good job. I don't know what I'm doing with my life. I like the idea of real estate. That's when I'm getting obsessed with it. And I bought a duplex. I lived in one unit, rented the other unit out. And I remember my tenant. The very first day I got a tenant in, he comes and pays me rent in cash. That's a terrible idea. But at the time, I didn't know that. But anyway, So I take $650 of cash in this, like, crappy alleyway in this terrible part of town, in this terrible part of Washington state, and I remember holding that $650 in my hand, going, my mortgage is only 620. Like, I'm living, and I'M living in one of the units, which means I'm living for free. And that was like the second aha moment is not so much my time is now displaced, but more of, you know, for my hours from the dollar per hour. But now I'm creating passive money. Like it just comes in every month. This guy just pays rent. And I get it. Now, of course, anybody who's been in been a landlord knows that it's only passive ish when you're managing tenants and there's a lot of headache there. But shoot, I remember thinking, okay, if I can do this with one, what if I did it with 20 or 30 and I wouldn't have to work ever again. And so that's what I did.

That's amazing. I mean, then how did it go from there where you started building up that portfolio? Do you actually putting it out there to the world? You ended up on this podcast, like, how did that come about? I'm just wondering how that connection happened.

Yeah, so what happened was I got. I spent the next like six years, give or take, building up my portfolio. So I bought some duplexes, some single family, some house. I did some flipping here and there to generate some cash so I could, you know, live and eat. And I ended up buying a 24 unit apartment building almost for no money down. And that was a project. I mean, I was there every day for two years working on it, fixing it up, every unit. I went in and remodeled it. I learned how to stretch carpet and how to do painting. Now, by the way, for those listening, no, you do not need to learn how to do all those things. I was stupid. I didn't realize there were other ways to do real estate. But at the time, that's all I had. I was like, I'll, I'll do all the work. So Here, finally, I'm 27 years old. I've got about three to four thousand dollars a month coming in in passive income. Like mostly passive at this point because everything's stable. I got somebody managing the properties at least somewhat kind of in house. And I found myself with more free time than I knew what to do with. So I was like, all right, I'm retired. I'm gonna sit on a couch and watch Judge Judy for a while, which I did for like a few months. Judge Judy, Law and Order, those were my jams. And after a few months I was like, this is not the life either. Like, I thought this elusive financial freedom, like, get out of your job, was like the goal of my life. And then all of a sudden, I realized that was pretty lame. So I was like, well, I guess I need something to do. So I started a blog. It was called Real estate in your 20s. And I just started teaching people in their 20s, like, how I was investing in real estate in my 20s. And it did all right. I started gaining some traction. And then at one point in that process, I met a guy named Josh Dorkin who ran another site called Biggerpockets. And he was just by himself, no employees, nothing. Just him in his basement working on this little site. And we became Facebook friends just because we were doing the same thing, basically. And one day he said, hey, I'm looking for someone to help me edit blog posts. And I was like, I got free time, and I could use some more cash. I'll do it. So Josh hired me just to write blog posts and edit blog posts. And a few months into that, I was like, hey, let's start a podcast. So we did, and 10 years later, it's got over 100 million downloads. And it was a wild, wild ride. And it was cool to see Biggerpockets become the behemoth that it is today.

I mean, that's crazy. I mean, how did it feel to be part of that in terms of building it, growing it?

Yeah. I mean, part of it was just, like, gracious. You know, I'm very gracious for the dumb luck that I got in being, like, early on. But here's a. Here's a powerful lesson, actually. I want to pull from that. So a lot of people hear the story of Biggerpockets, and kind of, like the founder's myth here. Like, you know, Josh was building it. I came in, the thing exploded. And I get a lot of people, like, you know, patting me on the back, saying, well, Brandon, look like you came in and the thing exploded. But the truth is, like, it had nothing to do with me at all. I would even argue it had nothing to do with Josh at all. See, what happened was there was a piece of luck, obviously, in any Anything. We hit it at the right time. We started a podcast when podcasts were just taken off. But the real magic here, and this is what I want to impress, is that what we did author Gino Wickman calls rocket fuel. In other words, we had a visionary. Josh had a vision for what Biggerpockets could be and where it was headed. But entrepreneurs are terrible at doing the things. What I mean by that is entrepreneurs like. Like, today, I'm, like, more the visionary. But back then, Josh was a visionary, and the things you do to grow a blog or what, like guest post and other people's websites, go to conferences and meet people. Like, there's things you do every single day, or at least like almost every day. There's things you do in rhythm that produce the result you want. This is true for everything in life, right? Like if you want a six pack, you go to the gym every day and work out and eat healthy, right? If you want to. If you want to be a good salesperson, you cold call 100 people a day. And if you did that every day for six, six months, you would be shocked not to get the results, right? You following me? So what Josh did is. And I don't even know if you knew this at the time, but what he was doing was he was hiring someone to do the boring, repetitive, imperative tasks, right? So, like the things that everyone knows we have to do, but entrepreneurs are terrible at doing them. And so he hired someone to do them and then they actually got done. He could have hired anybody to do that, and it probably would have been equally successful. But that's where Gino Wickman calls it rocket fuel. You add vision. Somebody who's, like, passionate about where we're going. The entrepreneur. Combine that with somebody who's great at getting stuff done on rhythm, on repeat, over and over and over, and the results just take care of themselves. It like blows up because of that. So I took that same concept, and that's exactly how I built Opendoor Capital. I don't work in opendoor Capital. A lot of people are surprised at that. I maybe put in four hours a week because from the beginning, I said, no, I'm not the guy doing the work. Cause it won't get done. I'm too lazy. I'm too lame. I. I just, I'm not good at that stuff. I'm going to hire people who are good at that stuff. And then it just took off. So the question I ask everybody all the time now, I pose this at. At you, at every listener, is this. What could you do every single day for the next six months? That if you did that, like your wildest dreams, your goals, whatever would get accomplished. What is that thing that you have to do repeatedly, one or two or three things, and then the second question is, who can you get to do that? Because if you're an entrepreneur like us, like, we're just not good at doing the things.

I mean, I think that comes into play a lot for these. A lot of doctors that are listening to this, they're busy professionals. Already in their daily lives, they love the idea of financial freedom. Who doesn't, right? And then a lot of them are trying to put that together with real estate and use that as a vehicle to get there. But a lot of them feel like again, they don't have the time, they don't have the connections, these kind of things. Like what have you seen out there as possible for doctors to. Then what is. Like what are the daily tasks that they can do to build and, and get where they want to be?

Yeah, that's such a good question. You know, I actually talk to wealthy people a lot, obviously being a capital raiser and all that. But just like in my day to day world, like a lot of my friends are lawyers, doctors, musicians, actors, whatever. Like in this world of like crazy successful, like they're making six figures, seven figures, some eight figure, whatever. It's crazy, right? And then they tell me, yeah, I want to get into real estate. I'm looking at houses to flip, or I'm looking at buying a duplex and renting them out. And I, and I'm like, you do realize you're making like really good money at your job? And they're like, yeah, I don't like my job. I'm like, that's fine, you don't like your job. But like you're making really good money at your career, your business. You're making massive income, right? This is, I think what I'm talking about at the conference is mass. How do you turn massive income? And anybody earning over six figures I'd call as massive income. How do you turn that into passive income without having to get in there and be a landlord because, or make an offer. I mean like we literally make.

What do we make?

Probably three to 400 offers every year. That's an average of one offer every single day that each offer takes about eight hours to underwrite and put together. So what we're talking about is like in for all of that, we buy enough deals to, you know, to go around, but it's a tremendous amount of work. So if you're, if you're working 40, 50, 60, 70 hours a week with a doctor or whatever that number is, right? I know there's a lot of hours put in there. And then you got family as well that you got to take care of, which is more important than your real estate or your, or your job. And then you're trying to add on that. You got to analyze deals every single day. It just doesn't get done. So what are the options? I Mean, obviously, if you can find, like, a partner who can do the work, that's a great way to go. Like, if you want to be active, but not that active. A partnership can be a great way to go. If you can invest in somebody's syndication, like yours, like mine, like the deals like that, or spread it out with a number of them, that can be one of the most passive ways to go. I love that concept because it doesn't require much work at all. In fact, I'll tell a true story. I'll probably tell this on stage at your event as well. But I remember, like, five years ago, maybe six years ago, I bought this house at auction. So first of all, I learned how to buy at auction. That took dozens of hours of learning and talking to people and whatever. So I learned how to buy at a county auction for a foreclosure. I show up. I'm the only one to bid on this house. So I get it for 50, $15,000. 1 5, right? I take this property, I go and hire a couple contractors to fix it up. It takes them a year, and it's like, complete hell. The whole time, I'm like, dealing with. Every day, I'm dealing with these contractors, I'm having to show up to the project. I'm dealing with all this stuff. It's just a mess, right? Finally get it done, and I put it on Airbnb for the while. That was a disaster. Like, just like. Like, I was so involved, and there were people like, I can't figure out how to use the remote. I can't figure out how to open the door and all this stuff, right? Then I'm like, okay, Airbnb. I'm not going to do that. Too active. I'm going to rent it out. Passively. I rented out for a year passively. That was a nightmare. People calling like, my neighbor's too loud or there's some weird car parked in front. All that stuff, right? All right, I'm getting somewhere. After a few years, like now, this is like two years later, I think finally, maybe two and a half years later, I finally, like throwing the towel. I'm just going to sell it. I sell it for, like, $75,000, which is way more than the 15,000 I paid. But I had to put repairs in. I had to do all that stuff, and I averaged my return. At the end, I went back and I looked. How much money did I actually make per year on this investment? And I made 15% per year on average. When you take in the cash flow, and the sale at the end and everything. I made 15% of my money. And that was the day it hit me. I was like, shoot, all these syndicators out there are offering 13, 14, 15% per year returns, or not offering, but projecting. And I was like, what the hell am I doing? It was so much work to make the same return as I'd probably make by just hiring, or not hiring, but investing with a smart team. And that was a day I was like, I'm done. So I just started investing in other people's deals because I'm like, this is stupid. You know, it's just dumb. So anyway, it's now I, now I invest in my own deals and I invest in other people's deals because it's so much easier.

We talk about the time value of money all the time. I mean, again, the returns are great, that number at the end of the day, but how much time, energy and effort did it take for you to get there? I think that's actually a factor that people need to put in there. And also, again, what do you want your life to look like, Right? I mean, yeah, I mean, the whole point of all this stuff is not to have another job. And so I see what you're saying and I see a lot of these things are great and it's amazing to see what you've built and grown. I mean, how did even open door capital come about? I mean, you were investing in your own things. You had this podcast, like, why even go in and build this whole other real estate venture?

Yeah, man, good question. So the answer is twofold. One, I was on stage at an event that was full of like real estate, like high end developers and syndicators and like private equity, like these really big players. And I was on stage presenting to them. This is three and a half years ago. And I, I remember being on stage, looking out to the audience and I realized that I was the least qualified person in that room to be talking to those people. Like the least qualified guy. Like, I had like 30 or 40 rental units or whatever. Like, I was like, just like, to me, I was doing really well. Because a lot of times I talked to people who have one property or two properties, right? I had like 30 or 40. I was doing great. But then I got into a bigger room and they like, they say if you're, if you're the smartest guy in the room, get into a bigger room or get into a different room. I got into a different room and I was humble that like, man, I, I don't deserve to be here. So I left there, and I swore that I was going to earn my way into that room, not get there just because I got, you know, a big mouth on a podcast. Like, I was going to earn my way in that room. So part of it was just this idea of, like, I can do more. I want to do something challenging and exciting and hard. So that was part number one. Part number two is just like, frankly, I'm just. I'm rich. Like, I make good money. Like, I sell a ton of books, and I have, like, all this stuff coming for me, and I make massive income, right? And I was like, I can just keep dumping this money into, like, all these flips I was doing or whatever. And I was like, I would rather just dump this into a syndication of some kind. Like, I'd rather make my money grow in real estate, but I don't want to be able to. I don't want to, like, be involved, right? So then I was like, all right, well, so I started doing that. I started dumping it into people's deals. But what I kept finding was that most of these syndicators were doing deals that didn't provide any cash flow. It was just, like, long term. I was like, yes, someday I'm gonna make money. Like, in fact, I don't know if I've really made out of all the syndications I've done. I don't know if I've really made cash flow from almost any of them. Most of them were down the road. They're gonna be really good, which is fine. But I was like, no, I want money monthly. So I looked around, I was like, how do I get money monthly? I'm like, mobile home parks. And there wasn't a lot of mobile home park funds available. So I was like, all right, well, what if I just built my own and I invested in my own deals instead of everybody else's deals? And that's what I did. I was like, I want cash flow from day one. And mobile home parks were the way to go. So that's kind of how that came about. I wanted to deserve it, and I wanted to grow my wealth.

So what's it look like today? I mean, in terms of. Is it. You said you have a team built out for that. And what are you looking at? I think mobile home parks. You guys are also looking at apartments as well.

Yeah, man. So what happened was, I mean, we got it, and we set a goal to hit $50 million of real estate owned. We wanted to buy $50 million of real estate years. And to do that, I had this piece of advice given to me from a really wise mentor. And I was telling him once when I was at Biggerpockets, I was saying, hey, we have this many developers and we can do this much whatever, and we have this many HR people and we can do this, and we have this many salespeople, we could do this. And he finally holds up his hand and he says, brandon, stop telling me what you have and what you can do with it. Instead, tell me what's possible, tell me what's possible and then what you need to get there. And blew my mind. I never thought that way before. I'm very much like, this is what I have. Here's what I can do with it. This is how much money I have, this is how much real estate I can buy. But when he said that, I went, how do I apply that to my real estate? And I said, well, $50 million of real estate is possible. This is the same time period as I went to that conference. I was like, well, shoot, we can do $50 million of real estate. That was a stretch goal. It was huge. And then what do I need to get there? I was like, well, I need a, you know, I need an acquisitions person, I need an underwriter to run the numbers, I need a finance person to handle all the money moving around. I need an assistant to help with that. I need investor relations, somebody to talk to all the investors because we gotta raise a lot of money for that. And then I would need maybe. And then this was the key, this was the game changing question was, who's gonna run those people? Because a lot of people will build companies, right? They'll build companies and they'll say, I'm hire all these people and I'm gonna be in charge. But I was like, I don't want to be in charge. I got a two year old at home. Like at the time, Rosie was two, I was like, I don't want to be in charge. That's another 50 hour a week job on top of my 40 hour week, bigger pocket stuff. I don't want that. So I immediately hired that integrator, that number two, that rocket fuel person, right? And they hired all the team and then they went on and did it. And we didn't buy $50 million of real estate. The goal was $50 million of real estate in three years. We bought $300 million of real estate in that time period. And it just shows that value of bringing the right people together who are the best at what they do. I mean, I'll give you an example. My investor relations guy, Mike. Mike Williams, he's like the greatest guy. Everyone who talks to him is like, mike is the greatest guy I've ever met. Everyone loves him. They want to talk to him. He wants to talk to them. He gets fired up on the phone. Like, he loves it. He loves the phone. The way that I love doing interviews like this on podcasts. It fires me up. It fires him up with me on the phone. Do you know what doesn't fire me up? Being on the phone with investors. I just. I just hate the phone in general. I don't answer it. You and I have never talked on the phone and never will because I don't answer. I don't answer my phone. But, like, you get me on a podcast, I'll talk all day long. So, again, you get people who are amazing at a certain skill, and that skill fires them up. You get those two things together, and you put them in that role, and you get a bunch of them, and you just watch Rocket Fuel just take. I mean, it just takes off. And so that's what happened. And it's been the most amazing journey I've ever been on. And this is why I preach it left and right every day. I'm like, tell me what's possible. Show me what team you need to get there and work on building that team. And you. It'll just blow you away, the success and the fun that you're going to have doing it.

I mean, that's so cool. I mean, one word that you use that I noticed you use the word rich. And I think a lot of doctors. Well, people think doctors are all rich, first of all. And I know that term gets thrown around. There's a lot of. It's pretty charged, actually. There's a lot of connotations around it. What do you mean by rich and wealthy? Is that real? I mean, I'm just wondering what that means to you.

Yeah, so when I say, like, rich, I mean, I'll be. I'll be open. So I make about. Give it, give or take, $700,000 a year from book sales. So that's from book sales. And that is almost entirely passive at this point. So I don't have to, like, work anymore at that. I wrote the books years ago. I built bigger pockets to the level. I could sell the books at that level. And now that money just comes in with a few hours a week of tweaking here and there. And I. You know, it's social Media and I go on podcasts and whatever. So for me it was like making that much. Now some people listening might think like, shoot, that's a lot of money. Other people listening might say, well, you call that rich? All I mean is like, I have excess money. I live on a couple hundred thousand a year and I make a lot more than that. Plus, when you invest in certain types of real estate deals like we do, and you do certain tax strategies like we do, I don't really pay taxes. This is kind of like the secret that I don't really want the whole world knowing. This is like the Donald Trump stuff, right? Why doesn't people like Donald Trump and me pay a lot of taxes? It's because there's some really cool strategies with real estate that you don't pay a lot of taxes. So I don't want to go depth in depth on that.

But hopefully people have been paying attention. They've heard a lot of those strategies on spot.

Yes, exactly. Yeah, they're out there. I'm just, I'm never gonna go on CNN and tell everyone how like, I don't pay taxes because, like, if we, they, they will stop that when enough people get angry at it. But right now, all Congress owns real estate, like everybody in Congress owns real estate. So they're not going to change that unless they have to. Another reason to own real estate because, yeah, the government's on our side for the most part anyway. So yeah, for me, like, it means I make a certain amount, I spend a lot less than that, so the extra gets dumped into my future. When I was a kid, I ate Lucky Charms for breakfast every day. All the doctors right now are like, oh geez. But yes, I didn't know any better. I was eating Lucky Charms every day for school, before school, and I was the kid. I would pour a bowl of Lucky Charms and I would eat all the, like the cereal part, not the marshmallows, just the cereal. Until all I had left with marshmallows. And then I would pour another bowl on top of that one and eat all that cereal. Don't touch the marshmallows. Another one. I'd have like five bowls of cereal until all I had left was this mound of marshmallows. I do a whole box for breakfast. There was a reason I was a 240 pound middle schooler and I would then just feast on marshmallows from Lucky Charms. And I love that picture because it's how I operate so much of my life. I'm always the guy Eating the cereal, even Opendoor Capital. I don't make money off Opendoor Capital as a company. All my marshmallows are at the end. If my team wins and my investors win, then I'm going to win, and it's going to make me a tremendous amount of money. But after all the cereal and after everyone else gets their marshmallows, and I like that. I think that's how it should be. That's what I mean by rich, is you make a lot more than you spend and you invest it.

All, right? Ultimately, now you're considered. You're successful. But I think all standard metrics, at least you feel successful. And you've done all these amazing things. What still drives you at this point?

Oh, man, I love this topic. So remember I mentioned earlier, entrepreneurs are not good at doing the things. If you want to invest in real estate on your own, you're going to have to analyze deals every day, make a bunch of offers, negotiate. You got to learn all that stuff, right? And I don't do that stuff. Why? Because I get bored with it very easy. And most entrepreneurs do. We're not wired to do the same thing every single day, especially when no one's paying us to do it. So what's the one thing that I never get bored of? And I would argue that almost nobody listening to the show gets bored of helping people. And I don't mean, like, in some, Like, I'm, like, going down to the soup kitchen necessarily, though I should be doing more of that. What I mean is, like, when my team comes. When Mike Williams, my investor relations guy, comes to me and says, man, I've been, you know, we're raising all this money, but we need to raise more. Do you have any ideas what can we do to raise more? Sitting with him over a beer, talking ideas on how to improve the investor relations funnel or team or conversations like, man, that never gets boring. Like, that never gets old. Helping your team, like, build a better life for themselves is, like, the best feeling. Which, again, why entrepreneurs are built that way. Our job is to be a coach to our teams who are the ones doing the work. And so coaching, like, people in that way, like, coaching my. I don't do, like, coaching, like, paid coaching or anything right now. I'm just way too busy for it. But, like, man, I love just, like, pouring into my team, helping them grow. That'll never get boring.

That's awesome. It's just been fun to hear your story. I know that some people are going to hear this. They're going to resonate with little parts of it here and there. We want to reach out to you, find out more about you. Where's the best place for people to do that?

Yeah, man. I am most active on Instagram. It's Beardy Brandon on Instagram. I'm also on Facebook @BardyBrandon. I'm also on TikTok if you want to see me dancing on Beardy Brandon. I don't dance actually, but I am on TikTok and I think I've got a LinkedIn out there somewhere, but I rarely use it. But it's there. But yeah, I'm around. And of course my website's open door. Well, ODC fund, ODC fund.com we've got a lot of info on there. But what we're doing real estate wise.

Well, it's been awesome talking to you. I just want to say obviously that so many people, at least in my world, started with real estate, you know, by hearing your voice. So I'm one of them. So I just want to say thanks for that. You're doing amazing work. Obviously, keep it up. Open door capital has been, I've seen it grow as well just from the side here. And it's been an amazing resource for a lot of people. So I recommend people check it out. Brandon, I just want to thank, thank you for all the time that you put in to really help people. And again, let's talk again soon.

All right, man. And looking forward to the event. It's going to be good.

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