An Awakening: From Atheism to Spiritual Teacher

And tried to see how close I could get to, you know, being killed or, you know, killing myself. Guess what? If you can change your mind, you can change your life. If you're feeling anxiety, you're starting to get aggravated, you can utilize this and I call it.

Our guest today is Ray Catania. Ray is an award winning author and metaphysical teacher. He is also a survivor of a near death experience which led him to explore aspects of the physical, metaphysical and physiological, bringing together an understanding of both science and spirituality. With the tremendous knowledge Ray has gained through his research and mentorship, Ray empowers individuals through incredible life transformations by helping them to reshape their reality. He is known for his expertise in the mind, body, soul connection. You can find his website@raycatania.com, as well as his two books, the Atheist and the Afterlife. And you'd are still alive now act like it. We want to welcome you to the show, Ray. Thank you so much for being with us.

Thank you guys. I appreciate you having me. It's an honor and a privilege. Thank you so much.

Ray. I want to start with your book. The title is very interesting, the Atheist and the Afterlife. I think that probably grabs a lot of people's attention right, right away. So did you grow up with a religious background? When did you consider yourself an atheist?

Yeah, so I did. I grew up Catholic, Roman Catholic, and that was the only thing accepted in the home. No deviation would be accepted. And you know, I had a tumultuous childhood with a lot of arguing, fighting and, you know, just domestic nonsense. And it wasn't pleasant. And so one of the things that I did, I think, to rebel against that was specifically against the religion. You know, also I looked at it even as a young person, like I thought about, well, if there's this loving God, how is it possible that these things are happening right in front of me? You know, I'm young. What did I do to deserve anything? So I kind of adopted that attitude and chose to rebel by going as far as I could go to the other side, which was atheism. It wouldn't have mattered really what my parents believed in. I just still would have rebelled against whatever it was. So it was more about the rebellion. So that lasted for quite a while, many years. In fact. What would happen in my home is, let's say, you know, when the arguing and fighting was going on as a little kid, I would hide so that I wouldn't be, you know, involved and I might hide in a closet or lock myself in the bedroom or maybe out in the yard. And, you know, I think I tell a story of. I used to. I had a little radio and I would listen to the Yankees, which is true, and that's really all I had. But if I didn't have the radio, I had nothing. So it was just me and me waiting until like one o' clock in the morning to be able to go to sleep, you know. And I forgive them for that now because I understand a lot of things a lot better. People in general at that time, it was very traumatizing. So when you're isolated and staring at something, perhaps a wall, let's say after a while, the wall became something more than just the wall. It wasn't a blue wall or a white wall. No color anymore. It wasn't made of wood or whatever it's made out of. It became energy. And I could start to see the lines in it. And I didn't think anything of this. I just thought if you stared at it long enough, everybody could see it, right? So I didn't think anything of it. But that was my first interaction with energy. And much later, it was when I was about 20 years old. And this is when I have my ND. And this opens up a whole new portal. At the age of 20, there was a fire in my home. And it was in the kitchen. And the fire was caused by a gas leak. The gas was rising all night long. So my bedroom was directly above the kitchen. My bed was directly above the stove. And although there was no fire yet, the gas had been leaking, it was natural gas, so it would just rise. And I was breathing it in all night, we don't know for how many hours. And in the morning, my mother got up and she turned on the stove to cook, make breakfast, what have you, I don't know. And a big ball of flames just came out of the stove. And there's a safety valve on those things, so it kind of puts itself out. But by that time the wall had caught fire. There was some smoke, but it wasn't the smoke or the flame. Fire. My father was there with a fire extinguishers. The way I understand the story, obviously it was upstairs. They put it out before the fire trucks came. But I heard the fire trucks and I heard the police cars. And I'm hearing all this and I'm in my bed and. And so I want to get up to see what's going on, what's all this ruckus downstairs in my home. And I try to get up and the first thing that I notice is certain parts of my body I can't communicate with. They just won't move. Such as my legs. Both of them. That was really scary. My head, I couldn't get it off the pillow. And the strangest thing was I couldn't yell. Like I was like. It was almost like a. You know, I just couldn't get anything out. And so my arms worked. Or at least, you know, yeah, kind of. One definitely worked. The other one was so. So. And I'm trying to pull myself to the edge of the bed because I figure I'm. I gotta get out of this bed or I'm dead. I kind of just know that based upon the way I'm feeling. And I pull myself to the best of my ability and I go a couple of inches, I pass out, I wake up again, I pull myself a couple inches, and finally I get to the edge of the bed and I tumble out and I land face first and I hit myself right on the chin. And here's the strange thing, you know, I landed on my face. I know I landed on my face. And I'm waiting for the pain to kick in, but it doesn't. And the reason it doesn't is because it's like a millisecond before that pain comes in. I'm out of the body. I'm not in that body anymore. That body is now lifeless. And my consciousness, spirit, soul, whatever term you wish to use is above it. And I'm looking down on my lifeless body and I'm not scared in this moment. It's not a scary thing. And I don't know why. I should have been really frightened, I think. But I've spoken to other nders and they weren't afraid either. For some reason. There's this comfort and this feeling that comes with it that just lets you know that you're okay. And there was adjacent to me and the room was a perfect square. I was in this upper hand corner and my body was down there. And then that the light is coming from the adjacent corner. Corner. The cone shaped white light. It's like spotlight. It's only on me. But this is not just a light. This is like. This light is love and euphoria and painlessness and every positive emotion wrapped into a light. And now my being, which is energetic and is commingled with the light. I'm one with the light, literally. And this is the greatest feeling I've ever felt in my entire life. I start to go into the light and there's a being at the end of the Light. Who says, ray, it's okay. You can come into the light. I was like, wow, it knows my name. And I don't know if it was a male or female. It had no human form whatsoever. It was lines. They were just lines. And they were communicating. Weren't even talking. I wasn't hearing it. I'm just receiving it. So I proceed to go into the light. And as I go in further into the tunnel, the euphoria intensifies. So now I really want to get to the other side. This is great. And at that moment is when my father kicks in the door, and he sees me on the floor, and he scoops me up, and he's holding me and he's hugging me, and he's almost. He is in tears. He was completely distraught. And he was yelling for the paramedics, help. Help my son. Help my son. And, you know, I didn't really have a good relationship with him. You know, in fact, I can't remember the last time he hugged me before I died. You know, it's like. So it was a. A moment for me that was very emotional, and I. I wanted that. Like, I kind of longed for that relationship with my dad, and I never had it. So when I saw that, I asked the being at the end of the light if I could go back. And I don't know if that's the reason I came back or not, because, you know, at that point, I had just woken up, and I'm no longer in that room. When I woke up and I came to, I was on the living room floor, and the paramedics were resuscitating me. And I'm like, guys, guys, I'm. I'm fine. What are you doing? Like, I was, like, startled. Like, why are these people on top of me? You know? And they're. They're like, just stay put, kid. You're. You're not fine. You don't understand. And I was like, no, no, I feel great because the euphoria is still there. Like, it doesn't, like, wear off right away. So I'm still feeling this throughout. And I said, well, you know, didn't you see the light? Didn't you hear the voice? I mean, you guys were here, right? And then they start looking at each other like, you know, we better run a tox screen on this guy and see what he's smoking. And, you know, and so I. I just shut up because I was like, okay. You know, they obviously. They think I'm crazy. Not gonna say anymore. Take me to the hospital. Do what they had to do. The whole time I'm there, I just can't stop thinking, what was that? Came home and everything went back to the way it was. So it was like, you know, my father went back to the way he was, or it was like business as usual, right back in the same place. And I was like, I can't believe I came back here for this. I made such a mistake. Such a mistake. I want to do over. I want to go back to the light. I really did. I was very depressed. So when I tried to explain this to my mother, she told me I was crazy. You know, that didn't happen. Never tell anybody that. Absolutely never tell anybody that. And so I was, you know, just like with the energy when I was really young. Now I'm crazy again. So I just start to accept that maybe there's something wrong with me and I'll just go back to atheism, because that was simpler. I don't have to figure anything out. It's very simple. I fell in front of a window on a sunny day. There's my white light, and I inhaled so much gas. I was hallucinating. And I saw a being and I heard a voice, and that's. That's it. I just kind of washed my hands of it, put it in a box, and then address it. Now, you also have to remember this is a time period where there's no computers yet. There's no Internet. I can't just go and look this up. I have to speak to someone. And whenever I tried that, I was crazy. So I'm not going to do that anymore. So I shut it down and I completely forgot about it. But it was about a year later or so that I moved out of that home, got my first bachelor, and I'm all excited. Yeah, we're going to have parties all the time. This is going to be great. And as soon as I move into this place, none of that happens because I move in, and I feel like the party's already going on without me. It's like the place is full. I'm being looked at, I'm being watched, and there's nothing there. I remember my first night, like, I was just moving stuff in and moving stuff in. I tried to sleep. I just threw a mattress on the floor. I could not sleep. It just felt like there were these things, like, around me, and it was energy. I know it's energy now, and it's pushing up against me, and it's making the strange things happen with any electrical appliance. After I got established and I put everything in there, nothing worked, right? The tv, the phone, the alarm, everything was off. So I would always call the maintenance man and he would come up and he said, listen, kid, I'm going to tell you this the last time. Don't call me again. There's nothing wrong with anything in your apartment. You're crazy. Here I am crazy again. So I'm starting to believe this is the fact I might be crazy. And I continue to live there. And they know I can see them and I don't see anything as a human right now. This is all just energy. But they are not leaving me alone. They cannot sleep. Anything I try to do, if I put the TV on, I try to just get involved in a TV show, they would turn it off. I used to play a lot of video games to take my mind off what was going on. And I would just play video games all night long because I could not sleep. And after a while of having this intense insomnia, I turned to drugs and alcohol to go to sleep. And a lot of drugs and a lot of alcohol because it would knock me out. It was the only thing that would knock me out and make this go away. Even if it was just for a couple of hours, you know, I got that break. So I lived there for a year. I wound up with a dependency on drugs and alcohol. And by the 10th month of a 12 month lease, I said I had it. I packed my stuff and I left and I moved into a new apartment. Didn't care about anything. I was just like, I'm out of here, I can't take it anymore. Moved into the new place and I'm like, well, you know, fresh start. Here's the parties. This is where it's going to be. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Moved in, Same thing, same thing. So the apartments are not haunted. Raised haunted, we're going to use that term. And wherever I go, they're coming with me. So I'm a kid who could see energy. I was in tune with energy because I was forced to be. Then I had an nd I cross over, I come back. I'm like a portal for them to come through. And they're not going to take no for an answer. They want to be acknowledged. Now. I don't know how to deal with this or address this in this moment because I know nothing. I'm an atheist, right? So I don't, I don't even believe that they're. I try to yell at them. I'm like, I don't think you're real, you know, get the hell out of my house. I don't believe in you. And you know, here I am just, you know, really starting to lose it. So time goes by, more drugs, more alcohol, and I start putting myself in some really, really bad places. Because I'm at a point where in my life where I just don't care if I live or die. Really don't. In the back of my mind, I know the white light was the real deal. I have no kids at this time, no dependence, nobody, you know, really cares. I think it's not a fact, but that's the way I feel. I make decisions in that part of my life that are detrimental and many are self sabotage. I took jobs working for shady people. You know, there was one time we were in a bar, it was after hours and I worked there and I was just putting stuff behind the bar. And then I bent down under the bar to get a bottle of something or other. I hear pop, pop, pop, pop, pop. And I know that these are gunshots and I gotta get the hell out of there. I don't even know who shot who's not who's shooting. I don't know anything because I'm like, I just know that I have to get the hell out of there. And that being that I told you was at the end of the tunnel is now with me. I cannot, I don't see. I just feel, and this is hard to explain, there's no hearing, there's no seeing. It's just like a download. Side door, side door, side door. And I'm like, I can't get to the side door, thinking, because if I get up, the shooter is going to see me. The side door is all the way over there. But eventually I have nothing to lose and I have no other way to get out. So I go for it and I get out that door. But that's not the end because then I have to go down this long corridor, it's like 40ft long, to get to the next door, which is a side door, a fire exit out to the parking lot. And when I get out there, the strangest thing, my car's right there. I parked it there, I never parked there. I had my own personal parking spot on the other side of the building. But I never would have made it to that side of the building. There's no way. So I go out the side door, I get into my car and I managed to get away. So that being has shown up for me many times, many times. Because now I continue to put myself in these bad situations. I would even say I upped the ante and tried to see how close I could get to, you know, being killed. There's just so many things that I did to myself that I should technically not be here. Go back to my 20s and the apartments, and when I'm about 30, I decide to settle down and get married and have two kids. Now those kids just gave me a reason for living. I can't be carefree. I can't work for crazy people. I can't drink and do drugs anymore. I have kids. This is it. And I am not going to do well. I'm not going to give them the life I have. I'm going to give them a better life. I was determined to do that. So I checked myself into rehab, I went back to college, I got a great job, followed by another great job and then another great job. And I just moved my way up and I did very well. And my kids had everything that they wanted and I probably overcompensated. I was in a good place, I guess, is what I'm saying. And I get to a point where I want to start dating again. I went online because I guess that's where we go. And I started looking at these different websites and I was looking for a match, if you will. Then I remember I came across one particular site and there was the third person, the woman down on the right side. And I looked at her and I just said, oh my God, that's my wife. It was like I knew her for 10 lifetimes. I knew it was her. I remembered her never seeing her before. And as crazy as this sounds, So I joined the site and I send one email and it's to her and that's it. And I told her it was. I can't believe she responded. But it was kind of funny. I put it into this email, like, hi, I'm Ray. Very nice to meet you. You don't know this yet, but you're my wife and if you want to have dinner, I can explain the whole thing. And she's like, lol, you are completely crazy. And I said, I know, I know. So we did have that dinner and we are still married and we live in this house. And this is exactly, you know, what I thought would be the case. But when we start dating early on, things start to get a little crazy again when I meet her. And by crazy, I mean now. Up until now, I've seen energy, I feel energy. I can sort of communicate a little bit, but this is the first time I see energy in a human form. And it's like a movie screen opened up in my mind for the first time. And it's a black screen. And it's like you're sitting in a theater. And I'm watching this man, and he's speaking to me, and he says, I effed up. I made a mistake. You can help her. I cannot. I have no idea what that means. I have no idea who this man is. I don't know where he's coming from. I don't know where that came from. It really startled me, like. Like to the core. I kind of just shook it off like it was a daydream or something. But then it happens again, and it's exactly the same. Nothing changes. It replays itself. Effed up, made a mistake. You cannot break it up. He's a big guy, beard, mustache, thick black hair. His demeanor, everything about him is imprinted in my mind. And this started on a Friday, and it was the weekend, and I had the weekend off. So I left work on Friday early. So I go home and I figure I'm just gonna, you know, rest. Maybe I'm getting sick. I don't know what's happening. But it continues that night. And then in the morning, first thing Saturday morning, I wake up. Boom, there he is again. I'm like, something's wrong here. I don't know what. I don't know what this is, but I know that this is not right. It does not feel right. I see him more and more on that Saturday. Saturday turns to Sunday. By Sunday, he is there every five minutes, and I mean every five minutes. He is so persistent. He will not stop. And I don't know how to make him stop. I don't even think it's a hint because I'm still trying to cling to, if not atheism, some sort of agnostic belief or whatever, what have you. Anything that doesn't involve an afterlife and God, etc. Etc. And he's just so persistent every couple of minutes. And I remember the breaking point for me was I was in a store and I'm paying for my stuff. I was online. I get to the counter, I don't know what I did or said. The lady says, are you okay, sir? I said, no, no, no. I'm really not. And I took my card back and went back to my car, and I just sat there. I don't even think I bought anything. And I just sat there and put my head down. I started sitting and, like, crying because I worked so Hard. Like, I changed every single thing about my life. I wasn't an addict anymore. I wasn't working for bad people, doing bad things. I mean, I completely flipped the script on my life. I went back to college, got great job, busted my butt, and I did everything right. And I'm like, see, that's why you don't exist. And I was so depressed, and now I have to tell the woman I just fell in love with. And this is going to break my heart, because I know her and we're only dating a couple months, but I just. I know who she is to me. I get my courage up, and I finally try to tell her, and I said, you know, I got. I have to tell you something. She's like, what? And I said, well, sometimes I kind of, like, see certain things. It's kind of like it's on a movie screen and I get these vibrations and see lines shooting about the room, and I feel like there's a presence. And then this movie screen opens up and there's a man there. The man says, I effed up. I made a mistake. You can help her. I cannot. And it's like a movie that's playing in my mind, but it's also blocking me from being cognizant of other things. And it's taking over, and I don't know what to do with that. She's. What do you look like? And I suppose, stocky guy, beard, mustache, thick black hair. Why? She goes, oh, my God, that sounds like my dad. Now, mind you, my girlfriend at the time is a doctor of psychology and a doctor of neuropsychology. So I'm telling a doctor of psychology, I see people that aren't there. This is not going to go well for the relationship. And I'm expecting her to just run away, maybe give me a referral here, call this guy, never call me again. I'm out of here. Instead, she comes back with, I think it's my dad. What do you mean, how could it be your dad? You told me your dad died, like, 10 years ago. She's like, yeah, he did. Now I'm thinking she's crazy and I'm getting hell out of here because you think I see dead people. I mean, that's just the craziest, most bizarre thing I've ever heard in my life. And she goes, well, maybe you're a medium, a psychic medium, and you don't know it. And I said, what the hell is that? And she goes, relax. I have seen many mediums, and my dad always comes through. And he's very powerful. And they all say the same thing. They can bring a medium to their knees. And I've seen some of the best in the world. And I'm like, okay, so what is this medium thing again? And she explains it. And I said, here's the. Here's the thing. I said, this man doesn't look like you're okay. I saw the pictures. It does not look like him. You have that picture that's over the fireplace. It's not him. That guy is thinner, and he has no facial hair. He doesn't have the thick bucket. She's like, listen, that's a very old picture of my dad. And she goes through her phone, and she says, let me show you what he looked like before he died and shows me a photo of the man that was on the screen. Holy. You know what? You know that guy? She goes, that's my dad, silly. And I didn't know what to do in that moment. It was like my jaw hit. Hit the table. And I was stunned. Here is the guy that's been talking to me all weekend, running, making me crazy. And she's showing him to me in a picture, and he's dead. This is not, you know, coming together for me. So she goes on to explain what mediums do. And she says, listen, I've been to a lot of mediums. He comes through. There's a medium that I was going to book a session with because she's coming to our area. And I'll book two sessions, one for you, one for me. And then you can talk to her and just kind of go tell her what you see, and you guys can talk shop, and. And you'll get your answers as to whether or not this is real. I said, okay, what have I got to lose, right? So we do just that. And she makes the appointments. And I am nervous, to say the least. I mean, we get there, and my knees are shaking, you know, and here's the things that I've been through in my life. I'm afraid of a little woman that night. I don't mean little. You know, like a little. She's a tiny little thing, and she's a medium, and she's scaring the hell out of me. I go in and I'm like, hi, I'm right. And she's like, oh, that. Like, oh. And then she says, please, have a seat. Tell me what's going on. I said, well, I see people that aren't there. And she goes, me, too. Like, okay, this is going to Be interesting. And she goes, why don't you just explain it to me? How does it happen? When does it happen? I go through the motions and I explain everything that I saw, how it happens, the vibrations, then the room changes, this changes, and here comes the movie screen. And she goes, stop. And I was like, what do you mean? What I say? And she goes, that's exactly the way I see it. And that's exactly the way we all see it. And I was like, we all was. We all. And she goes, you're a medium. And then I go into telling her about other premonitions and visions and things, and she goes, you're psychic, too. She goes, that's very rare, man. You have this and this and this capability. And I was like, okay. So I was so relieved, right? However, there's this new thing now that I don't understand. It's still an unknown, so it's fearful. I'm fearful because I don't know what it is, at least insanity. I know what insanity is, and I understand it. As much as I hate it, I understand it. But I don't understand what this mediumship thing is. And luckily, she takes me under her wing and teaches me for the first year as she becomes my mentor and saves my life and confides in me that she was put away because her parents thought she was crazy, but she was not. She was medium. And it made me think, like, how many other people are put away that might be mediums and they're put away from being. I was told I was crazy my whole life, and I was ready to check myself then. So it's. It's pretty scary, you know, how close it can come to something of that nature. But I was grateful for her. I was thankful for her. So happy that she helped me and she saved my life.

That is just such an incredible story. And I feel like every ND has an incredible story, but the. Yours just is like the gift that keeps on giving, just keeps going and going. But I have about a thousand questions for you. I want to ask you, though, jumping back to the actual ND experience itself, because I think a lot of people are fascinated by this topic because there's a lot of fear around death and what that's going to feel like, what that is for us, right? And I've heard other end years talk about the moment of the transition as well. And I know you just told us in your story you didn't have a feeling of your face hitting the ground. So do you feel that the spirit exits the body prior to the trauma that's taking place. So you don't actually feel that moment of impact or whatever it may be?

I. I think so. I think so. Now, there's going to be exceptions to that where, you know, I hit the floor poor and. And died right there. But, I mean, obviously what we're all most afraid of is the fact of being, like, tortured or something like that, or dying slowly in pain. But, yeah, I think that you are spared that pain if it's possible. And. And yeah, I think I was pulled right before it said in. Because let me tell you something. When I came back and the euphoria wore off, oh, my God, it was like a bomb went off in my body. Everything hurt. My whole body hurt. You know how you have all these, like, little aches and pains from sports throughout the years, or you tripped and fell when you were 10 and you didn't quite fix this or that? Okay, everything hurts when that euphoria wears off because you were free of it, Even if it's just for a short time, you were free of it and you were painless. And then you come back to the body and you notice all these little aches and pains that you didn't notice because your brain says, okay, we can't fix that. We're just going to leave that be. So coming back was the most painful thing ever.

And considering that, because I know again, a lot of people will say that when they were in the light, because it's pure love and they don't actually want to leave. Did you feel that way? Did you feel like you wanted to see, stay on the other side?

Oh, yeah. I wanted to get to the end of that tunnel so bad. As I went further and further into it, the euphoria increased and I just. My only thought was getting to the other side. But that's when my father came in. And once I saw that, it hit, you know, hit me emotionally so hard that I thought if I went back and I would have that relationship with them, even though that didn't happen. That was my thought. And I don't really, you know, I asked to go back, but I don't know that I was granted it or maybe for whatever reason, I came back, but I don't know. It's because I asked.

You mentioned that you came back from your NDE and you had extra sensory abilities. Now, you also mentioned that you were seeing energies before that. Do you think that the NDE exasperated those gifts?

Oh, my God, yes. Oh, yes. Crossing over and coming back. I believe it opened A portal, and made direct communication very, very easy. Easier for them than me because they would just, you know, come through. They'd be around me, and they're trying to get my attention. Now, what I later learned is if an entity or an energy being is from the other side, they're trying to communicate with you. All they want to do is get a message to someone, you know. And remember when I told my wife what her dad said, he was gone. After that, like, the feeling was lifted off my shoulders. I did what I had to do. That was what I had to do, was deliver that message. So once I delivered it, it was. It was gone. So. But once they understood that I can't help them, no matter how persistent they are, I don't have the ability, that's when it started to subside a little bit. But that was years later.

Understandings. Did you come back from your NDE with that you didn't have previously, the.

Ability to speak to the dead? I could then see them and I could interact that. I never had that ability before. Everything was always very mysterious, and it was in a way that really didn't make any sense. But now I understand that they're doing things to make me acknowledge them so that I see them or hear them or feel them, what have you. And at the time, I just. I didn't understand any of that. But it all came to fruition years later when I met my wife, because her dad has this ability, I think that when we pass over and we go to the other side, we don't necessarily have the ability to speak to people in this realm. Some do, some don't. Some better than others, and some are just simply incredibly powerful. And he was that, because when I met my second mentor, he was actually the person that my wife saw, which is another ironic story for the first time when her dad came through. And there's so many similarities between the way he saw him and the way I saw him, because he's a spirit artist, and he actually drew him, and we still have the portrait, and we were on vacation, and my wife took it out and showed it to me. And I was like, oh, my God, that's your dad. And she's like, yeah, I know. I said, yeah. But what you don't know is that's how I see him. He's got that shirt on, and that's the hair, the way it is, and the beard and everything. And she's like, wow. I said, who drew that? She goes a medium. And I said, who? And right away we looked him up on the Internet and it said, now taking applications for a two year mentorship program. You must submit your application before the deadline of February 15th is my birthday. It's always been on my birthday that something like this. So she's like, are you gonna, are you gonna submit your application? I said, pope ship in the woods. Sorry, I'm from Jersey. I'm gonna, I'm gonna fill it. Yes, I'm filling it out. Are you kidding me? That's like divine intervention. So now here I am looking for signs, symbols and synchronicities, you know, after just one year. And he is the most amazing man I ever met, and I think I may ever meet. And it was a two year program and that was back about, I don't know, six years or so ago. So I'm like, I'm the kid that's never going to graduate, that sits in the back of the class no matter. The new classes come and I see them come and go and I'm still there. I don't want to graduate because I'm not leaving him ever. You cannot get rid of me. And he goes, that's fine. Hope you're okay with that.

Well, that actually answers my next question, which was going to be exactly that. How did you determine who to work with as a mentor? Because there are a lot of people out there that claim to have these abilities and can teach, as you said earlier, some better than others. So obviously you just explained how you arrived at that. But the synchronicity is just amazing. How the information finds its way way.

To you, that is the most interesting. Right. These two particular people were the ones that guided me. And I don't think that's an accident at all. You know, the first one, if you remember, she was able to really identify with what I went through because she was called crazy, crazy, crazy. And that's what I needed, was somebody who got me to the first time in 40 something years I'm sitting with somebody who doesn't think I'm crazy when I tell them the things I can see. And that is what I needed in that moment. And then a year later, I work with my next mentor who can see the man that I saw the very first time. And he said the same thing was so powerful, he drove him to tears. He was crying during the reading. You know, he's a powerful guy. He was powerful when he was here and he's powerful over there. So, you know, he's just that type of presence and still is.

Yeah. And I also know I've Heard you talk before that you became very well read on metaphysics and physics and you were following all the great philosophers, Deepak Chopra, Eckhart Tolle, Joe Dispenza. And then you were also following Tesla and Einstein as well. Did you have any interest in any of these topics prior to your nde?

Well, science was always like something that I enjoyed, especially astronomy in particular. And one of the very first things an energy healer said to me is, you need to get back to astronomy. And I was like, get back? I'm thinking, and you mean in the sixth grade when I did that report and I built the solar system. And so I did get back and what it led me to was books about physics. And that led me to being more interested in quantum physics. And then I started to study just about anything I'd get my hands on. Einstein, Tesla, Bohr, you name them. And I went back to college for metaphysics and I did my bachelor's, I got ordained through the school and then I did my master's and now I'm doing my doctorate and it's only taken me about 10 years. So you know, I'm right on, right on track with the way I go to school. So I combined that with physics, so metaphysics and physics. And yes, like you said, I studied everybody on the other side of the spectrum too. Eckhart Tolle. Right now I'm in a four month program with Eckart Tall. I am so grateful because he's an amazing individual and him, Deepak Joe Dispenza, who actually already is taking science and spirituality, putting them together. He put his back together after being run over by a truck. I mean, that is amazing. Absolutely stunning. I, I hope to be able to meet him one day. So, yeah, I started to study all these different individuals, plus the college I was going to. And I started to see that I could line up a physical, an actual physical proven formula with a spiritual technique. So I'm the biggest skeptic of all time. I don't, didn't believe the things I could see, the things I could feel. I denied them 100%. So, you know, the first time I was taught how to manifest something like the law of Attraction, I was like, are you kidding me? Come on, how's this gonna work, right? And it was my second mentor that taught us this. He taught us a lot, not just mediumship. I mean, he really covered a lot of ground. So he taught us, you know, how, how the law of attraction works from the spiritual side. This is what you do. And I'm like, that sounds absolutely crazy, but here's what happens. At that time, my youngest son was going away to college. And the college. The college called me and said, and not so many words, hey, ray, you're short 10 grand. And I was like, what do you mean? I paid this in full. And they're like, no, you still owe $10,000. And I was like, oh, my God, this can't be happening. Evening. And I'm so embarrassed. I can't tell my kid. I don't want him to feel bad or anything. And he's going in 48 hours, like, you know, two and a half days, he's going to be there, and they're not going to let him in. They're not going to let him move into his dorm room if I don't come up with the money. Yeah, I was stunned, too, that they had no leeway there. But anyway, so where am I getting 10,000 right now? I don't have it, like, liquid. I got no time to get it. So I remembered what I was taught, and I said, what the hell? I got nothing to lose. And I went into the meditation, and I did it step by step by step and went into my manifestation. I need $10,000. I need $10,000 over and over and over. You're supposed to do it twice a day, in the morning and at night, which I understand why now. Sustain flow all day. But I was doing it six times a day because I really needed this. 10,000 now. And so after the first day and I do it six times, my other son enters the room and hands me the mail. And I was like, thanks, you know, And I'm going through the mail, and it's bill, bill, bill, bill, Bill. Tax, tax, Bill. This is gonna be terrible. And I'm just going through. And I'm like, did. Did. Am I saying this wrong? Are you getting this right? So I'm. I'm.

I'm.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong here. I don't know. And so the second day, I do it again, and it's. It's six times again. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Maybe more. And by the end of the second day, nothing happens. And I'm just so frustrated. I'm starting to think, okay, I was right. This doesn't work. Work. I need to start looking into my different accounts and seeing if I could take a couple thousand here, a couple thousand there and put it all together. So as I'm working on that, I figure, let me just open them and see what the damage is. I always have to pay my taxes. I'm a 1099 employee, so I always have to pay. And I start opening it up and my accountant does it the same way every year. So you take out the first letter and it says, you know, more or less. Dear Ray, thank you for your business. You owe us X amount of dollars, you know, for doing your returns. Okay, great. Next one says, dear Ray, you've overpaid the federal government $8,216 and something something.

Yes.

Wow.

I gotta read that again. Over payment. That's refund, right? Like it's, it's, That's a refund. $8,200. I was like, that's incredible. So then I put that letter down, I take out the next one. It says, dear Ray, you've overpaid the state of New Jersey. $1,800. 42 and something something cents. It's 10,000, like $1.

Wow.

Yeah, I just got goosebumps.

Money. And I said, I am so sorry. I will never doubt you again. My bad. And you know, it was, it was there on the first day. I said how amazing it was, and I said, it's for my kid. It's not even about me. I, I. And there it was. So I spent a lot of time trying to figure out how this works. And I figured out how we put out how we extend vibrations, how we turn vibration visualizations into a vibration, send it out, finds a match, brings it back. And I, I started to piece together what Tesla was telling us. Energy, frequency, vibration of the secrets of the universe. And I was like, wow. People would probably really like to know not only does it work, but how it works. I know I did. So that's the second book. The whole second book is, you know, there's still the stories and stuff that, that are in there, like in the first one. So if you don't read the first one, you'll get a gist of it. But it's more focused on things like that and breaking it down from a scientific point of view so that you can read it as a skeptic and say, wow, you know, there's something to this. This looks pretty cool.

You talk in your books about the conscious mind and the subconscious mind and how they work, work together. Can you elaborate more on that a little bit for us?

Yeah, sure. So the first thing, like when I'm, when I'm coaching somebody, the first thing I explain is how the mind works. Because how the mind works is going to be the foundation of everything else that we're going to do. So if you understand the mind, you know that you can change your mind. Guess what? If you can change your mind, you can change your life. You can change everything. But first you have to understand how it works. So we have the unconscious mind, the subconscious mind, the egoic mind, the conscious mind. And then at the very top of the heat, if you, you're like Eckhart Tolle, you have an awareness, oversees everything. Okay, let's go through it. So the unconscious, that's your emotional core. That's your, your core emotions, core beliefs, bodily functions. You don't have to tell yourself to breathe, you just do. So that's where that lies, right? However, subconscious. Now we go up a notch. Subconscious is actually the largest part of your mind. Now, this is not your brain. This is your mind. Brain creates the mind. Mind controls the brain and everything else. So the energy that's created by the brain is the mind. So the subconscious, that's where you store everything. Like a hard drive in a computer. It's stored there. It never goes away. You can't delete a hard drive as we know. You overwrite it with other stuff. So everything from the day you were born is stored in here. And here's the kicker. Between the ages of 2 and 7, as a child, we're in what's called a theta brainwave state most of the day. This is a hypnotic type state. If you go to a hypnotist and you say, I want to quit smoking, he's going to put you into a theta state so he can speak directly to your subconscious. And I don't know what they say, never smoke again, blah, blah, and then you come out of it and your subconscious like, oh, we don't smoke, right? So that's how that works. Now imagine I'm too between the ages of 2 and 7, and I'm absorbing everything around me. And in one case, my parents had a bunch of people over the house, and they were all talking about fears and phobias at the table. And I'm a little kid, you know, maybe seven years old, I'm under the table, I'm playing with my trucks, and I'm just hearing the conversation. And when it gets to my mother, my mother says, oh, I'm definitely afraid of heights. Okay? So I take this in. I don't even hear it really, but it's there, and it goes right into my subconscious, who says, well, if it's bad for your mom, it's bad for you. And that goes through the egoic mind because the ego is there to Protect me and says, you're deathly afraid of heights. So my whole life I'm going through life saying I'm deathly afraid of heights. I even said it the way she said it. I wouldn't just say I'm afraid of heights, I would say I'm deathly afraid of heights. Right? So literally, it's like brainwashing and it goes right in. Now, at the age of 50, I went to Peru and I climbed Machu Picchu because we were going to have a big celebration up there with the elders of the, of the tribe, the Carol tribe. And it was a big deal and I really wanted to get up there. I did not even think about heights. I didn't think about anything. I went up that mountain, we did the ceremony and then I came down. On the way down back to the hotel, I said to my wife, I said, I'm not afraid of heights. My mom is. And it was like, click. We do what we hear. That's her problem. But I adopted it, made it my own because it made sense. If it hurts my mom, it hurts me, not some. And we adopt their beliefs and we adopt everything. And it's not just our parents, but it's our extended family. It's things we see on tv. It's everything. Because we literally take in everything. Don't quote me on the numbers, but if I'm not mistaken, the subconscious mind takes in something like 40 billion bits of data per second or something, whereas the conscious mind can process 40. I mean it's like not even close. So, but the good news and the bad news is this. Your subconscious doesn't know what's real and what's fake. So keep that in mind as we go forward. Let's go to the egoic mind. The egoic mind is put there to protect us, but it's also the over protector of everything. And it can prevent you from doing anything that might hurt you in the littlest way. Don't get up on that stage and say that speech. You're going to look absolutely ridiculous. You're going to wear that. You can't wear that. Do you remember what you said to so and so last night? You okay? Protection, protection, protection. Stay at home. Don't do anything, be nothing. So we have to break away from the ego and recognize that your ego is not you. It's all these other people. You just absorbed it and made it yours. I submit to you. Not even 1% of your ego is you. It's all made up of your environment and it's not Just two to seven. But that's the time that it really hits because you're just walking around like you're hypnotic. But if you, if you have kids, I have my two kids, my sons, when they were five, I would say, stop doing that, stop doing that. Stop doing that, Stop doing that. They don't even look. They can't hear me. They're hypnotized. But later on they'll go, did you tell me to stop doing it? Yes. So they, they don't. They don't get it in the moment, but they get it and it never goes away. So it takes the conscious mind we have to use, utilize the conscious mind, which understands what's real and what's fake, to go back and tell our subconscious, this is not real. This is not who you are. This is who you were given. And my number one client is a person who has it all. They've got the, you know, the house and the burbs, the spouse, 2.2, two kids, three cars in a vacation home, and they go, I'm miserable. I said, that's because you're living someone else's reality. This is what you were told happiness looks like. And you went for it and you achieved it. Now you're there and you'd rather be a goat herder because that's who you really are. Yeah, I'm just in chest, right? But there may be something that you wanted to do that you never got to do because your parents are going to tell you were idiots. And your ego said your parents are going to be you, tell you you're an idiot. Everybody's going to tell you're an idiot. Everybody's going to say you're crazy if you do that. And we buy into that. We listen to this voice. It's not real. It's not us. I should say it's real. It's just not us. And then at the very top is our awareness. And this is where you connect to your higher self or the universal collective or God, with any term you wish to use. That's your direct connection. And it's called the awareness. Because we are one of the few creatures living that are aware that we're having a feeling or having a thought. And if you're aware that you're having a feeling or a thought, guess what? You can change it. Tell yourself not to have it. And I understand there's some overwhelming, traumatic things, okay, like grief. That's obviously going to take time to get. But I'm talking about the little things that we get aggravated about when a car cuts you off and you get angry for the next two hours, and then you go to work and you say, this ash won't cut me off, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then you go home and you tell. I tell him what? This guy cut me off. And then I. I go out with my friends and I'm saying, this person cut me off. It just goes on and on and on. Stop the suffering. I don't care about that guy and I don't care that he cut me off. I'm looking at it from, we didn't hit, not he cut me off, we didn't collide. And that's the change in perception. And that's what I teach. Change your mind, change your life.

I know the subconscious mind is extremely powerful. I know that. We just have to basically train it, right? We have to train it in a certain way. And I know you just mentioned that you do teach these techniques. Is there something that you could offer as a little hint or tip to anyone listening that they could put in place immediately to help them, you know, get a little more control over their subconscious mind that will help increase the quality of their life?

Yes, absolutely. There is a really, really short, quick technique that will get you back into a flow state. And if you. Even if you don't know what that is, that it'll still get you. If you're feeling anxiety, you can utilize this. And I call it the attitude of gratitude. And what it is, is nothing more than a minute or two where you by yourself and you just basically state to the universe. You go into a light meditative state. Close your eyes. I like palms up. I don't know that it really matters, but I go like this and I say, I am grateful for. I am thankful for blank. I'm grateful thankful for blank. And I go through all the things roof over my head, my children, my wife, you know, the important stuff. And I remind myself, anybody that does that attitude of gratitude, you can't come out of that and be in a bad mood. So if you feel anxiety is starting to take over and you're gonna like, snap, take five, go into a bathroom and just say, I am grateful for this. I'm grateful for that. I used to have a job where people would come into my office asking for help all the time. And I had, I don't know, 100 employees or something. And they would come in one after another after another. And, you know, that's my job. That's what I was supposed to do. But sometimes it would, like, maybe Rub you the wrong way or they would say something and, you know, whatever. So I would go into the bathroom. Very simply, I am thankful for this job. I am thankful for the money it pays. I am thankful to be able to put my kids through college, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Then I go back and my whole vibrational state is completely different. And I sit down and now I'm in a good mood. The next person comes in, they get a completely different person. They got a completely different. Ray. Hi. Yes, come right in. Tell me what's going on.

Well, Ray, as we wrap up, do you have any final positive messages of hope about the afterlife for anyone listening?

Oh, yes. The. When you. I've been granted the opportunity to change my relationship with death, and I tried to pass that forward to others who haven't had an nde. And it's because when you change your relationship with death and you don't fear it so much, you understand it's not the end, but it's a transition and it's actually a beautiful one. And it feels phenomenal, and it is phenomenal. Phenomenal. And, you know, there were so many studies done about people that were on hospice or not on hospice, but they were told they were given their, you know, you have six months, you have a year, blah, blah, blah. And they were asked, you know, what changed in your final six months? And they're like, well, I did everything I ever wanted to do on my bucket list. I told every single person in my life that I love them if I do. And then I, you know, I travel and I did this and I did this and I did that. I'm like, shouldn't we all live like that every day? Do we have to hear that? We. How many days we have left? So when you change your relationship with death, you change your life, as amazing as that is, you have that just freedom about you and you don't need an NDE to change that relationship and be less fearful. And when people. People leave you and you're grieving, know that they're really not gone. They're like, right here. Literally right here, whether you like it or not. Death is not the end. Certainly not.

Well, Ray, we want to thank you for sharing your story. We hope the messages that you share will bring comfort and inspiration to anyone listening. And for anyone who would like to learn more about Ray and the coaching that he offers or to get his books, the Atheist and the Afterlife, and you'd are still alive now, act like it. You can find them on his website. Raycatania.com Ray thank you so much again for your time. We sincerely appreciate the wisdom that you shared with us, so thank you so much.

Thank you. Tara. It's been a pleasure. Thank you. Tracy.