S4E7: ATHEIST DIES and returns A BELIEVER

You don't feel pain and you don't know why, but I was. My body was dead at that point. My energy or my soul or whatever you wish to call it was above it in a corner, like a neutral corner. And I'm looking down at my lifeless body. And this does not scare me at all in the moment because it actually feels wonderful, like it feels more alive than I've ever felt actually being alive.

Ray Catania is an acclaimed author, metaphysical teacher, theorist and coach. He is a survivor of a near death experience and has dedicated his life to helping others achieve their full potential. Ray's unique approach combines scientific theories with his own life experiences to reveal how anyone can harness the power of the mind, create their own reality and be limitless. Catania has written two captivating books in his awakening series, the Atheist and the Afterlife and you'd are still alive now act like it. His profound insights and intuitive abilities have made him a sought after practitioner in scientific space, spiritualism and the practical applications of metaphysics. With a thriving private practice, he guides individuals on their transformative journeys. Ray's work has helped tons of people to achieve the spiritual awakening that they have been seeking. It's so wonderful to have you. Thank you for being here, Ray.

Kristin, thank you so much for having me as your guest. It's an honor and a privilege.

So wonderful and I'm excited for you to be able to share your experience and your wisdom for others to benefit from as they move through their journey of knowing why they're here and how to connect with their soul and just learn the lessons we're here to learn. Ideally, as a starting place, please share a bit about who you were in life before your nde, and then we'll lead up to your nde.

So back to the beginning, I would say I came from kind of a troubled home. You know, it wasn't particularly pleasant environment and it was kind of chaotic with a lot of fighting, arguing, drama and trauma. So coming from that environment, I learned chaos. And chaos was kind of my comfort zone. And when that happens and you know, when you're very, very young, I took that with me, you know, throughout my teen years and, and into my 20s. And if things around me weren't chaotic, I make them so, or I would find an environment that was chaotic because you feel like, because I'm comfortable there, I know how to navigate that. Right. But when things were normal as, as I guess we say, I didn't know how to handle that, I didn't know how to deal with that. So I Felt uncomfortable with normalc, you know, felt better around chaos. So I. I would place myself in situations that were pretty dangerous that most people would, you know, run the other way from. But I chose jobs where, you know, I could lose my life or, you know, I was just. I was a troubled kid. And growing up in. In an environment where, you know, I would kind of up the stakes as I went along. And I was also rebellious against my. My family and their Christianity. I didn't really think that there could be this loving God that would just allow many of the things that I saw transpire actually happen. But I didn't understand things yet. And so. But there was always, you know, there was always this being. There was always something or someone that was on the other side that was kind of like, had my back in the strangest, most dangerous moments, if you will. You know, one of them, when I was a child, I had swum out too far in the ocean. My parents took me down the shore and we were. I'm swimming out and the undertow is taking me away. And I'm going farther and farther from shore, and I'm trying to wait for the lifeguard, but he's looking the other way because there's about, you know, 15 kids on that side that he's pulling out. And it was only me on the other side. No one's really looking at me. And I'm beginning to go under and I start to panic, you know, and so. And I'm waving to my father, who's unsure. I don't know what the heck he's looking at, but I'm going, hey, I'm going down over here. But so as I felt like I was, you know, about to die, here's this feeling. First of all, it was like a feeling of warmth and calmness. It was just from head to toe. I went from panicking to complete calmness. And the being or the voice or whatever you want, I don't hear it, but I know it's just a knowing. And it said, swim sideways, take all the time you need. Swim sideways, take all the time you need. And, and, and, and calm down. And so that's what I did. I just. I felt this feeling of calmness. I started to swim sideways, and it took me a long time, but I got to shore. And I remember getting there and just collapsing. And then all these people came around me. But the thing was, is that that's not the only time that this presence made its presence known. There were other times where I worked for some shady characters and after hours in a bar, there was a shootout. Being is there, I'm hiding under the bar. I'm not a part of this. I'm hiding and I'm trying to figure out how I'm going to get out of here. And the being says, side door, side door, side door. And I'm thinking, well, I can't go out the side door without the shooter seeing me. But there was no other option, there was no other way out. So I went for it and I went out the side door and then there's another corridor about 40ft that I ran down and I went out that side door. And don't, you know, for some strange reason, I parked my car right there that night. I never parked my car there. And I got right into my car. I remember I was trying to put the keys in, I dropped them, I picked them up, I dropped them. And it was just amazing that time and time again there's always been something there that's helped me in the worst times of my life. And yet I rejected it as not real. Like, who would want to help me? You know, like I had no self worth. I didn't feel like certainly, you know, I'm not, I'm not particularly intelligent or, you know, did anything deserving of having this being, you know, I'm not chosen or smart or anything like that. It's just, I don't know, I don't have the answer as to why my life was spared. And then I was around 20 years old when I actually did die. And that was a fire in my home. And I was still living at home with my parents. And the kitchen was on the first floor and my bedroom was just above the kitchen. And there was a gas leak that was from the stove and it was natural gas. So it rose, and it rose right into my room and I was breathing it all night long. And I guess in the morning my mom came down, turned the stove on to make breakfast or what have you, and it went just like up in flames and the whole wall right behind the stove caught fire. And the way I understand the story, the fire wasn't really very big and my father put it out quickly, but the gas was, was what was. You know, I was inhaling all night and so I hear the fire trucks, I hear the police coming and I don't know what's going on yet because I'm just asleep and I try to get up and all of a sudden it was like half of my body was just paralyzed. I could not move my legs, I couldn't move my head off the pillow. It felt like my head weighed like a ton. And I couldn't yell. I couldn't yell for help. Not that anybody would hear me anyway because there was so much ruckus and everything going on downstairs. But I try to get out of the bed and I'm pulling myself, you know, with my two arms that are kind of working. And I'm pulling myself to the edge of the bed. And I remember passing out a couple of times as I got close to the edge. And I knew if I didn't get out that I was. I was gonna die. I knew that. So I pulled with everything I had and I tumbled out of the bed and I came down face first. And I hit the floor. And I knew I hit the floor. But here's the strange thing. I didn't feel any pain from hitting the floor. And. And later I learned that this is actually something that other people have experienced right at their death. You don't feel pain and you don't know why, but I was. My body was dead at that point. My energy, or my soul, or whatever you wish to call it, was above it in a. In a corner, like a neutral corner. And I'm looking down at my lifeless body. And this does not scare me at all in the moment because it actually feels wonderful. Like it feels more alive than I've ever felt actually being alive. And the light was adjacent to me. And this, it's exactly as you've heard, a huge cone shaped white light like a tunnel. And it's just shining on me, my energetic self, not my dead self, my energy. And I'm more or less commingled with this light. I'm one with the light. And the feeling is euphoric. It's love, it's painlessness. It's every positive adjective I could possibly give you. It was amazing. I wanted to go further into the light. I wanted to keep going into the light. And. And I did. And then here's the being again at the end of the light. And he or she, I don't know which is saying, it's okay, Ray, you can come into the light. And so I proceed to go in. And then the euphoria increases the more I go in. And I thought that this was the most amazing thing. It was. It was beautiful. And then my father comes into the room and he scoops me up and he starts yelling for the paramedics. And I'm. I can see this and I can hear this and. And I see him break down and cry, which Is not something I've ever seen my father do, nor has he ever put his arms around me, with the exception of when I'm dead. So I wanted that love and that affection that I was witnessing. So I thought that if I went back and I was allowed to go back, that I would have that maybe. And so I kind of like started to, well, negotiate, if you will, to go back. And I said, you know, I can't leave him like that. Can I go back? And the next thing I know, I. I wake up. I'm not in that room anymore. I'm not in his arms anymore. I'm on the floor of the living room, which is downstairs, of course, and the paramedics are on top of me, and they. They have all their tools and stuff and they're working on me, and. And I. I'm kind of a little bit out of it, but I'm like, guys, I feel. I feel great. Like, this is the best I've ever felt. In fact, you know, like, I'm good, I'm good. They're like, you're not good. You have no idea, but you're not good. And they, they, they. They're like, bring up the truck. Bring up the truck. They're like, in a hurry. And I'm like, wait, wait, we gotta find the. Did you see the. Did you see the light? Did you hear the voice? You guys, you guys watch this stuff. And, you know, of course they're now like, okay, what's this guy on? Right? And I didn't want to wind up going to the wrong hospital, so I just shut my mouth and I let them take me away. Because even before that, like, when I was a child and there was all the turmoil in my household, I kind of hid from that by, you know, try to get away from it by hiding, I should say. And I would hide for hours and hours and hours. And it was almost like self. A meditative state that I would put myself in for hours every day. And in that, doing that day after day, month after month, you start to see and experience another part of the world or our universe that we all just take for granted. And that's the energy that makes up everything. And if you just. I would. I would be staring at a wall for hours. Eventually, I can see the energy in the wall, and I can just. I can see the lines in the wall. It's not a wall at all. And this was kind of normal to me because I just thought everybody could see this. You know, I didn't think anything of it. And so I had this kind of, like, bond with energy that I wasn't really aware it was anything abnormal. And then when I cross over at the age of 20 and I come back, well, now what happens is the energies that are of the deceased come back with me, and they have this direct portal to me, right? So this gets where. This is where things get really confusing. The next year or so, or a year after I move out, I get my own place and I'm. I got my bachelor pad. I'm 21, 2, something like that. And I'm like, yeah, this is gonna be great. We're gonna parties all the time. And none of that ever happens because this, from the moment I get inside the apartment, it feels filled with people. And I don't see them. I just see lines, like, going back and forth against the white walls. And I feel energy, like, pushed up against me. Like, there's a person pushed up against me. It's almost like, try to get out of your way, but there's nobody there to get out of the way. And this would go on night after night after night. And they were very persistent. Later I learned they're just trying to get my attention, to get a message across to somebody. But I don't know this at the time. I just think I'm losing my mind. So I turned to drugs and alcohol. You know, I'm 20 something, so.

And did you tell anyone?

Not. No, not at that point. No. No, no, no.

Did you tell anyone? And I know as you're coming to, like, I'm doing great. You guys see the light? Did you tell anyone after that that you had, may I ask, like, is this in the late 80s, early 90s? Like, what time period is this?

So if I'm 20, it's. It's 80. It's got to be 8990. I think it's. I think it's 1990. Yeah. And my mother would have been the first one that I told, and she, you know, shot it down. I know that she went through a stage of denial because she felt like, well, I left my kid upstairs and he died right on my watch. That's got to be very traumatic for her. She didn't actually admit that the whole thing took place until the book came out. And she called me up and, you know, we told me details I wasn't even aware of. Apparently I died four more times in the hospital on. I mean, in the ambulance on the way to the hospital, but I didn't know that she did. So, I mean, it was it was, anytime I mentioned anything like that to anyone, it would always be, you know, shot down. So there really weren't many times that I mentioned it at all. And you know, my mother's outright telling me it didn't even happen. I'm really. Yeah. More crazy, right? You know, like, okay, you know, I didn't even. So that's why I guess I gravitated to atheism, is just because, like, you know, okay, screw all these people and their religions and their stuff and you know, I'm just going to shut down and I'm going to be nothing or agnostic and I'm just going to go through my life that way and. But then things increase in craziness and when I'm in the apartment, I'm calling the maintenance guy and having them come up and check all the electrical appliances because they, they turn on, they turn off. I, they change the channel when I'm trying to watch tv. I remember I played video games and drank until I passed out. I mean, that's what I would do. And I finally. We got close to the end of the lease and So I left two months early. I had a 12 month lease and I left in 10. Went into a new place, thinking I'm going to have a fresh start. No such luck. They all come with me. Here I am again. Same situation, different town.

Were you living alone in that apartment? So it's like this is a haunted apartment. It's not. Go ahead.

Well, I had a roommate. Here's the, here's the funny part. So I moved in. I was supposed to have a roommate. And it turned out that just as we had signed the lease and moving in, he never moved in because he had a girlfriend in Brooklyn and I never saw him, so he was never there. So I was alone. And that magnified it for sure. The second place, I do have a roommate, right? And so we're just doing massive amounts of drugs together, right? He's. I'm not gonna tell him what I can see or feel because he's going to just think I'm nuts, you know, so there's. And I knew he was not the kind of person that I would ever bring this up, even today, I probably would not tell him.

Yeah.

So I mean, and then after that, it wasn't until 30 or 30 early 30s when I marry and I have two kids that, you know, I now have a reason for living and it's these two children that I brought into this world, you know, So I have to change everything about my, my life in this moment. And I know this because, you know, I probably would have, I don't know, overdosed or did something stupid like that. Who knows? But the bottom line is, is that I knew that these kids needed their father just like I needed a father. And I was going to be the opposite of everything that they were and do everything correctly the way I thought it should have been done. And so I checked myself into rehab, I went back to college, I got my degree, and our marriage fell apart very quickly. But I still had the kids, and I'm raising them as a single dad. And so I'm focused and I'm. And I'm fighting and fighting and fighting to, you know, make a good living. So they have everything they need. Probably overcompensated because, you know, I felt guilty about the divorce and whatnot. So I made a very good living and I. And I. And I think gave them a good life. They're in their 20s now and doing well, so. But they were the reason that I changed. I began that change. I began that process of change for them. And it wasn't many, many until many years later that I decided that I'm going to try to date again and maybe settle down. And now probably in my mid-40s, at the height of my career, and I say, well, you know, you know, my k getting older. And I go online to meet somebody because that's what we do nowadays. And they give you examples of ladies that are in your area to entice you to join their website. And a picture popped up, and I was like, oh, my God, that's her. That. That's my wife right there. That's my wife.

Wow.

And I just knew that. Don't know how I knew that. Just knew it. And I joined the site and I sent one email to her and that was it. And I told her, I said, this is the only email I'm sending. I joined the site to send you this one email because you don't know it yet, but you're my wife and.

Took a lot of people out.

I didn't say it like that, though, actually. I put the exact email. It's in the book. It's in the first book. It's pretty funny. And her response is pretty funny also. So she found it amusing, got back to me, and of course, you know, we did get married. We still live together. We're still married. Everything is great. And so after the crazy part wore off, she accepted me for who I was. And it even gets better because, I mean, it's amazing. Talk about acceptance. After I met her, she asked when we started getting serious. She popped this question, right? She says, so, what religion are you? Or what? What's your spiritual beliefs? And I'm like, I don't know. What. What are yours? You go first. And then I was just gonna say, yeah, yeah, that's my two, sure. But she kind of held back and didn't give me much information, and I was confused. And. And it was about a month later or so she says. It was my birthday and she says, I'm gonna get you a spiritual clearing for your birthday. And I said, wow, that's just great. What is that? Yeah, I had no idea what it was, Right. So I'm being sarcastic and I'm like, is it like a massage? Nah. Okay, whatever it is, that's great. We'll have cake, right? Cake afterwards? Yes, we'll definitely have cake. All right, great. So it's a distant clearing. Like, I don't even have to be there. I don't. I don't have to be present at all. And the woman calls me on the phone, and I was at work, it was like 10 o' clock in the morning.

And.

And she says, okay, I'm going to begin the process now. And I said, okay, great. And when I'm done, I'll call you. I'll let you know. And you might feel strange for a couple of days. I'm like, whatever. Okay, thank you. I was polite. Just.

You didn't do any research, especially with your background.

Oh, God, no.

This is ridiculous. Do what you're going to do. Thank you, honey. We'll move on. That was great. Where's the cake?

Nothing. Nothing. I'm still holding on to these atheistic beliefs. Why? Because it's simple, it's safe.

You have a lot of trauma around this.

That's exactly right. It's comfortable, it's safe. It's what I know and it makes sense to me. And so I'm clinging to it, of course. And even the nde, I remember, you know, justifying it to myself as the. The white light was the sun coming in through the window, and I was hallucinating because I inhaled gas fumes. And so I chalked it all up to just that. And it was. I changed it from an NDE to that.

Sure.

So. But now we're getting to a point where it's getting more and more difficult for me to deny these. These truths. And after I meet her and she gives me this spiritual clearing is when things get really weird, as if they're not weird already. The. Up until that point, the energy that I've seen or felt or however you want to say experienced was never taken a human form before. But I felt really strange afterwards. And I remember I said I had a really bad headache and I'm just. I'm gonna go home. It was a Friday. I did not feel well at all after the clearing. And I went home. I laid down and then I started to see. Not with my eyes, but in this. What I call the movie screen in my mind, my third eye. And it's a. Like a. A man's on the screen. And he says the same thing to me over and over. He says, I effed up, I made a mistake. You can help her. I cannot. I have no idea what it means. I don't know who the guy is. And he says it, and it's like a video loop that just keeps playing again and again and again. And I, I. Whenever my mind went idle, like whenever I was doing something like, you know, brushing my teeth or driving or anything. Here he comes again. So I really think I'm starting to lose it. And that was Friday. Saturday, he's coming more frequently. And I'm seeing it again and again and again. By Sunday, it seems like it's every five minutes.

Are you telling your wife or anything? Or you're just like, oh, here we go. I'm losing it again. Be quiet.

Well, I. Here we go. I'm losing it again. I don't want to tell her because I don't want to lose her.

You poor thing.

But I don't want to tell anybody because I'm going to. I'm going to alienate anybody from me, right?

Yes. You work so hard to get this stability and normaly.

And here it is again, all like. I'm back in the apartment all over again.

Oh, God.

And so by Sunday, I couldn't function. It got so severe that I couldn't really carry a conversation. And the breaking point, I was in a store paying for my. My stuff. And I don't know what I did, if I said something or froze, but the lady behind the counter says, sir, are you okay? And I said, no, no, truthfully, I'm not okay. And I took my card back and I went to the car and I just sat there with my head down and I said, this is, you know, this is the end of my life. And I have to start making arrangements so that my kids are taken care of. Make sure my. My brother has my will and my dnr, because I'm going into the light. Nobody stopped me from going into the light, you know, and I really believe this. And. And I had to tell her, you know, because, well, we have to break up. I'm. I don't know what's going to happen to me. I'm. I gotta check myself in. I don't know what. So I tell her and I expect. And I started to think, now, my. My wife, or my future wife at that time, she's a doctor of psychology and neuropsychology. Right? Yeah. Oh, yeah. You can't make this stuff up.

She's the one that bought you that kind of gift. So I'm suing.

That's right.

Into this stuff.

Exactly, exactly. But I don't see that coming yet. And I tell her what I see and what I hear and what happens. And the reaction I thought I was going to get was that she was going to run for the hills and just, you know, give me a phone number, call this doctor and never call me again. But instead I got something I never saw coming. She said, oh, my God, I think you can talk to my dad. And I said, your dad's dead. She goes, I know. And like, well, this doesn't make any sense to me. What are you talking about? She goes, maybe you're a psychic medium and you don't know it. And I was like, what the hell's a psychic medium?

Wow.

And in that moment, I'm like, she's crazy. Check, please. I'm out of here. I'm going, you need help, honey. And, you know, I mean, I make jokes about it, but thank God she was like that, you know, and. And she proceeded to tell me that she saw mediums in the past seeking her father. And. And he always shows up. And she said, there's a particular medium that's coming around, and she's going to be at so and so's house. She'll be staying there for a week. We can book appointments. You can meet with her. She's really good. And tell her what you see and. And how it happens and compare notes and get all your answers.

Are you feeling relief? Like, oh, thank God, finally I can talk to someone, or are you still dubious and thinking this is just.

I'm still what to think until I meet her, but I've got nothing to lose.

Well, it's either that or death in your mind. You're checking out. Yeah.

So I may as well meet with her. And I. I do, but I don't really. I don't know what to expect. I did not look this up because I didn't want to go in with preconceived notions. If I did, I could taint the information, right? And then I would not know if it was real. Again, even the NDE I couldn't research because we didn't have a personal computer in 1990. There was nothing I could. There was nothing. And if you ask somebody, they'd be like, what are you talking about? You know, so. Especially in my neighborhood. And so now I'm at a. I'm at this point where I'm meeting this woman, and I'm petrified of what the results are going to be, because really, now that I understand what a medium does, I don't know that I like that either. So I sit with her and I say, hi, I'm Ray. And she goes, oh, you're that Ray. And I was like, what does that mean? She goes, nothing, nothing. Just have a seat. Tell me. Tell me what's happening. And I said, well, I'm. I'm insane. And she says, but tell me more about it. And she proceeded to tell me very seriously how her parents thought that she was insane, and they actually had her evaluated and put away for schizophrenia. And she was not. She was a medium. So, you know, we. We chatted for an hour, and I told her how I see things and. And the vibrations that I get and the. The change in the room and then how the lines. And then the movie screen opens. And she says, that's it. That's exactly the way I see it. That's exactly the way we all see it. And I'm like, we all. There's more of you. So in that moment, I did feel relief, but I also felt, well, what am I. What are my obligations? What do I have to do with this? Like, why is it there? And why would you give it to me of all people? So it was. I'm back to, why do you save my life? And why do I. Why can I do this? And none of this makes any sense, but I'm mature enough that I know I've got to figure this out, because I can't handle it the way I did in the past and just go to alcohol and drugs as much as I wanted to. I never did that again, and thank God. So with her guidance, she actually mentored me for the first year and taught me how to turn it on, how to turn it off, you know, how to control it. Not really turn it off, but how to. Like, it's almost like a cell phone call. You can. Now I can reject the Call. Or I can answer the call. You know? Whereas before, it was just Zoom owned me, not the other way around. And after a year of being with her, it was the next birthday. Now, mind you, every birthday, something, like, amazing takes place. I don't know why we always go away from my birthday and something crazy happens. So here's the second birthday. Here's what happens. She says, where do you want to go? You know, we can go anywhere you want. You want to go to, like, a beach or this or that? And I said, no, I want to go to the middle of nowhere where there's a bunch of trees. I don't care if I have an outhouse. I don't need any amenities. I just need trees. That's all I need. I don't know why, but now I'm a tree hugger. I used to make fun of tree huggers. Now I am one. Don't cut this tree down. Not on my watch. So we're there and we meditate pretty much the whole time that we're there. And she takes out a portrait that was drawn and she shows it to me. And I'm like, that's him. She's like. And she's like, smiling. I'm like, that. That's your dad, right? That's him. She's like, I know. I know this. One of the mediums was a spirit artist, and he drew what he saw. And I said, yes, but you don't understand. That's exactly the way I see him too. Even the shirt. That's the shirt.

Wow.

And she's. They joked about that shirt. It was his Christmas shirt because he was. He was a builder for a living, a very successful one. But he had the one nice shirt that he would break out once a year. Otherwise he was in work boots, right? So it was a very notable shirt. And as soon as I saw this shirt, I was like, that's him. That's just. That's crazy. I gotta meet this guy. Not the guy in the picture, but the guy who drew the picture. So we search for him online and it comes up and it says, now accepting students for a two year mentorship program with Medium Joe. The deadline to apply is February 15th.

No one can script this. What is the date of your birthday? What's your birthday?

February 15th. Yeah.

Oh, my gosh.

Yeah. So she says, are you going to apply? And I said, are you kidding? This is universal or divine intervention. Now I'm talking this way.

I'm one of them.

I'm one of them. Now I'm Hugging trees and I'm talking about divinity. So I submit my application and then there's another application and then there's an interview and then there's another application and then there's something else and it just continues and goes on and on and on and on. And I thought I didn't get it because I never heard anything from him. And to speak to his integrity, he is so amazing. I called his assistant and I said, so I didn't get it right? And she's like, oh, no, no, no, we didn't make any decisions yet. And she's like, there were hundreds of applications and this program was multi years and cost thousands of dollars and hundreds of people times thousands of dollars. But he was only going to accept the person, the people that could, he could prove were real. He could have just taken everybody and said, yeah, you're all mediums, come on in and filled up his bank account.

Had a windfall and then gone.

I'm not even sure I could have done what he did. But when I got, I did get accepted. Obviously I was number 11 of 11 and then eventually there was like 14, but that was a couple of weeks in. A few more people trickled in, but that's it. That's it.

Super selective. And so he, and I was like.

You'Re my guy, man. You're, you're, you're the dad I didn't have. I'm staying with you forever.

You're the dad I didn't have.

I told him that too.

Yeah.

And it's been like four years at least. No, it's been longer. I'm, I'm losing track of the years. But I've been, I'm like, I'm never, I don't care if it's a two year program because I'm with you for the rest of my life or you know, whatever, whatever happens. And he's like, that's fine. But I don't practice mediumship because I really respect those that do. It's really, really taxing on the emotional self. You have to allow the energy of others to enter you. And it's that quantum entanglement that stays with you well after the reading is over. And it could take hours before that presence leaves my body and I'm feeling all of their emotions during that time. Even my mentor, I think he's, I think he caps at three a day is the most he can do if. And he doesn't do it every day because he teaches. And then, you know, so I chose a different path because I was just starting to find happiness. Now I'm writing the second book and, and as I'm writing the second book, I'm writing more about science and how physics plays a role in spirituality. And I'm bringing those two together so that I can prove to myself really that this stuff is real. And I can talk about it in a way that I'm educated and I can explain how something like the Law of Attraction works from a physical perspective of scientific data that's been proven by people like Tesla and Einstein and Niels Board, so so on and so forth, all the grandfathers of quantum physics. And the more I understood that, the more I could see the relationship between metaphysics and physics. And bringing those two together made the light bulb go off for me. And then I just completely consumed every piece of information I could find on both of those topics. I went back to college again for metaphysics, working towards my PhD. Hopefully it'll be in 2024. It's like six years. Took me 10 years to graduate regular college. So six years to, you know, a post grad. I'm all right on track.

Maybe you're doing what you need to do. What comes up for me. Tell me if I'm tracking with you or for if I'm not. But yeah, I absolutely understand that it is that quantum entanglement and how draining that is. But also I'm hearing the weight and the tax of feeling like such an outsider and such a crazy person and that there was this collective, especially in, in the circles that you were gravitating towards, like only insane people are going to have that experience. If you can be a part of that. Proving at a quantum mechanical physics level that this is not woo woo, this is actually empirical evidence. It helps other people recognize it as something we need to embrace rather than just those people do it. And that other people won't have to go through your feeling of feeling crazy to the point where you wanted to die.

That's why I released the first book and the second book. And as much as I did not want to say all the things that are in there, in order for me to have my own integrity and be honest with myself, I had to put it all in there. The good, the bad, the ugly, everything. And yes, that was the point. So that somebody else who's experiencing what I was experiencing, having self doubt, having other people tell you crazy, potentially being locked up literally for something that's magical and not insanity like my first mentor was. And that's the reason I put it.

Out there like you're the conduit. You're the holding both worlds and saying you can come this direction.

Yeah, yeah. If you, if you're feeling this, if you're seeing this and there's things that everyone can do, you don't have to be a medium. I mean, we're all, I hate the word psychic. We're all intuitive, you know, and we all have the ability to tap into what we call our God minds, or that's what they called it in college. It's the right above your awareness, which is your highest level of consciousness. According to Eckhart Tolle, he refers to it as awareness that is a direct connection to God, to the universe, to the collective. Call it what you will, but that's where you should go when you're trying to make a decision about your life or you want to manifest something, or you want to make huge changes. Instead of the egoic mind, which you know, we know is directly attached to the subconscious mind and that lives in the past, that lives in yesterday, that's where the world of chaos resides for me. So I have to stay out of there. I can't go back there, do the same thing and expect a different result tomorrow. So I had to find this new place. I had to find this new me.

Well, it's really interesting that you say I had to find this new place, this new me, because there was a wisdom that you had as a child, as you're trying to survive chaos, as you called it, that you became quiet and you went into that realm quite naturally as a way of self soothing and not feeling alone. So it's almost like you're returning to you. But now you have the adult mind to have the parameters and the understanding and the teachings and the language.

That's well said because you're exactly right. I wanted to escape the reality I was in so badly that I did, but I didn't know I was doing it because I was a child.

Yes.

And it's something that happens to a lot of people during traumatic events. Your mind is actually detachable from your body. You, it can come off and go someplace else. And it happens when you're being beaten, let's say to within inches of your death. And you do not want to experience this. You can have your mind leave so that it doesn't experience it and your mind goes directly to the other side. Your body is going to be gone and.

Right.

And it's, it is a protection that's I think is built into us.

It is, I mean, they call it dissociative you know, and they can talk about it in a way that is pathologizing. Right. But it's also when people talk about remote viewing or a way of moving out of, like, you're saying, traumatic situations. Can I. Can we get back to your NDE for a moment?

Yeah, yeah, of course.

So I've actually two questions. One before we get to the nde, is how young were you when you felt that presence of a being and that relationship felt not real, but present.

The. You mean the energy that was like, in the closet when I was hiding? Okay, so I'm in single digits for sure. I don't. I don't know that I can recall the very first. But, you know, we're definitely talking about between the ages of 5 and 7. 7. Or something along those lines. Too small to, you know, defend myself or do anything. So hiding was the answer and being hidden. The. The only thing we had was a radio. I remember I would have a radio sometimes, and I would listen to the Yankees, and they were like my. They were on ever. They play hundreds of games in baseball, 100 games, something in baseball. So I had a lot of games that I could listen to, but other than that, there was really not much else that I could do. So I was just trying to escape my world, and I didn't have anything to escape with.

Yes.

And in a way, it was kind of a blessing because I learned how to do that naturally, even though later I turned to drugs and alcohol and other things to do it. I actually learned how to do it and that it could be done and. And you don't have to go through that kind of trauma to do it.

That's right. That's right. You went into an altered state. But when that became too threatening, because everyone's telling you if you actually say that either, it didn't happen. Which. The only alternative is that you are insane. So a more accessible and actually socially acceptable route is getting high. Right, Right. So both are altered states.

That's right.

So then when you have your NDE and you're reacquainted with this being, and I know what I'm hearing you say is like. It was like a Claire Cognizance. It was just a knowing. It wasn't necessarily a scene until when you came back and then you started seeing. Oh, gosh, When you felt him. I don't really have the language. It. Was it just a feeling? Or did you see or how did you experience so her. It.

It's so hard to answer that question with the Regular words that we have.

Yeah.

The interpretation or perception was I felt that I could see something did not look human, just looked like lines at the very end of the light. There was no hearing. It was just a transmittal transmission of information from being to being that came right into my head. And yet somebody says, can you describe the voice? And the first thing that came to my mind was blue. I don't know. It's not. It doesn't make sense. I can't put a human design on it. I can't put something that you like, we can really talk about. I just. I felt blue. And I don't mean like I was sad. No, no, no.

That's okay. That's okay. And I know because they're. And again, language is so very, very limited. But there's just a different experience that goes outside of. In our sentient bodies we can experience. Okay, so then fast forwarding. You have this mentor. You're going through this intensive and you're starting to recognize this is a gift. Not sure why it was given to me, but what do I feel called to do with it? Tell me. And I'm hearing the books. Tell me how you coach people and what your message is that feels so connected to your mission with these gifts.

Sure. So it was during the writing of the second book that I had my awakening, my biggest spiritual awakening. I believe we have many en route to enlightenment. And I'm not enlightened by any means, but, you know, I hope to get there one day, but I'm not. I've got plenty to learn, but I'm a student and a teacher at the same time, and I'm able to help people with the things that I've already experienced. And one of the greatest gifts that I think I have is that the last spiritual awakening I had was a clear egoic fracture where I lost negative emotions that were my regular go to emotions for just about everything if it wasn't happiness. So sadness would bring me to anger, and confusion would bring me to anger, and sadness would bring me to anger. And now anger is kind of off the table. I experience it, but maybe for a second or two, it's not. It doesn't take me over. It doesn't drive me to do stupid things. It's not. It may come up and then it goes down. And it's just that feeling, you know, I believe that enlightenment is not a state of bliss. It's a state of not having the negative emotions. It's not having super happiness. That's right. That's a Fallacy. It's being content, being okay with not being okay. Because you're never going to be perfect, you're never going to be okay. You're always going to want something that's. So be content with who you are and what you are. That's enlightenment. No matter what your situation, in a cardboard box, in a beautiful house, in a bicycle or in a car, whatever your it is, is beautiful. And when you feel that way and you live that way, you are a different being. And that is what I teach. But people will come to me and say, well, I experience anxiety or experience this or experience that, but the underlyingness, but under all of that is the same thing for all of us. We extract from our past experiences, we bring them to our present and we expect to be a different person, to have a different result and feel different. And it doesn't work. So when we cut the egoic mind that, that thing that attaches and tells us what to do and tells us we're not good enough says, you know, don't, don't do that, you'll look stupid. You can't accomplish that. You can't be wealthy, you can't, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah. Cut that and learn. Your awareness is right there and it's connected to your God mind. And go that way every time and not go this way. And you can teach yourself how to do that and receive information downloads, we call them, that are going to blow your mind. You'll be like, why didn't I think of that sooner? Why didn't I do that sooner? So instead of getting frustrated or angry, now I get information and, and it, and I, and I write it down because it's, it's, you know, it's the transmission of it. We're not used to it, so we can forget it. So I make sure I record it, write it down, and go back to it and utilize it. So that's what I'm teaching is how to have your spiritual awakening. How to get to that place where, you know, not everything is perfect, but all the bad things are not so bad anymore. They're really not.

Yeah, gosh, it's just day before yesterday I was interviewing someone else and she said very much the same thing, really emphasizing the word contentment and saying, you know, there are the ups and downs, but it's that sense of peace and freedom in the midst of it that you're not just this ping pong ball that's going from anger to despair to moments of happiness that you're trying to chase.

Yeah, Like a ping pong ball. And you're just like all over the place. And no matter what happens, good or bad, you're always going to come back to this place of contentment and love that place. Because wherever you are, you know you can. I. When people say I need a vacation, I'm like, a vacation from. What do you need a vacation from? Because you're going to uplift yourself from here and you're going to go there and then there you are.

That's right. That's right.

So you don't really need a vacation. You just need to be happy with where you are, regardless of where you are.

The equanimity.

Yeah, that's what I try to teach.

So time is coming to an end here. And I know there are, I assume there are lots of textured, layered, important series of lessons that you teach. But if you could give advice to someone to say, listen, if you want to move more in this direction, if you just start with this small practice. Do you have. And everyone is different? You know, for some people it might be automatic reading. For some people it might be mindfulness just on a walk in nature. Some people might be meditation. But is there something that for you feels important to communicate?

Oh, yeah, there's a practice that I call the attitude of gratitude. And it's a part of the meditation that for manifestation. But you can take that one simple part out and do it anytime. It takes less than a minute to do it. And here's what it is. You just, you can close your eyes or leave them open. Doesn't really matter. Just relax yourself and put yourself into as close to a relaxed state as possible and recite all the things that you're thankful for that you're grateful for. That's the attitude of gratitude. What that does is you're changing your frequency as you're saying the things that you're thankful for. I don't care how bad your life is, you have good stuff. You have it. You just, you need to say it and you need to be grateful for it so that it comes to the surface and you're reminded. So, yeah, this terrible event may have happened, but turn around and do your attitude of gratitude and say all the things that you're thankful for and all the things that you have to be grateful for. And it's going to diminish this hard, terrible experience that you're in right now or this frustrating thing that you're. You're dealing with. And it's going to raise your frequency and bring you to a different place. And I yet, I've yet to see anyone do the attitude of gratitude and be in a bad mood afterwards, regardless of what it is you're dealing with, because it's, it's just too uplifting of a process to, to allow you to stay down.

So good. So good. What we are believing, what we are thinking has such a profound impact on how we move through our lives and what we attract. I love it. I love it. So how can people find you, learn about you, work with you?

Rekatana.com is my website and from there you can contact me through the contact page. And if you're interested in coaching, you can let me know. If you're interested in the books, the website will show you where to get them. They're pretty much everywhere. The first one is the atheist in the afterlife and the second one is you're still alive now act like it. And thank you. Thank you so much for allowing me to say that. I really appreciate that. Thank you very much.

Thank you so much for sharing all that you have. It means so much to me and I'm sure for countless others. So I really, really appreciate you. Thank you.

Thank you, Kristen. Thank you.

How I Made it through is produced, produced and distributed by EIQ Media, llc. Elevate your emotional IQ with podcasts and content focused on overcoming adversity, leadership, mental health, entrepreneurship, spiritually transformative experiences, and more.

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