Ozempic Face Is Real: MCAS & GLP-1 Truth with Dr. Meg Mill

It literally is the most powerful tool I've ever seen introduced into medicine.

We're still in that quick fix mindset. I'm always reaching for the supplement or the drug or the thing.

I was like, what instructions did they give you? They said, you know, it's injectable and this is how you do it. And I was like, that's the instruction. People are so willing to inject themselves with that they have no idea about.

Because they want the quick, they want the fix.

You're gonna age faster and look wor if you don't disclose what you're doing, you're going to really cause problems. Welcome to the show. Today we have Meg Mill. She's a leading women's health expert, doctor of clinical pharmacy, and certified functional medicine practitioner with over two decades of clinical experience. She helps women around the world resolve chronic symptoms like fatigue, digestive issues, migraines, hormonal imbalances and histamine related conditions, especially when conventional medicine has failed to connect the dots. She is the creator of the cascade method, a proprietary reconst framework that empowers women to resume, rebalance their bodies, regulate their nervous system and reclaim their energy, clarity and confidence. Through her virtual functional medicine practice, Dr. Meg has guided hundreds of women to lasting relief and transformation worldwide. A bestselling author and host of the top rated podcast A little bit healthier, she's also a sought after speaker and summit host. Her work has been featured on Fox news, cnn, abc, NBC, cbs, and in the forms health, Reader's digest, Health magazine and Mind Body Green. Welcome to the show, Meg. All right, welcome back, Meg. I have you here and we were talking offlines for everybody. We're going to talk about pots, master activation, hormonal problems, autonomic dysregulation, all the things that I get asked about as a plastic surgeon who does explant surgery and detoxification for my patients that are really, really sticking points. I am fortunate to have Dr. Meg Mill back on the show to discuss all these things with me and save me from myself.

Thank you for having me.

So we need an update on mastle activation, I guess. First, Meg, we did this show almost a year ago now and we had I think over 6 million views of the, of the show, which was great, but kind of I was having a number of patients with muscle activation at that point and it was very, very top of mind. So let's revisit that for the audience and may just break it down simply so they understand what muscle activation is and where we are now.

Absolutely. So I think in order to understand this, we just need a little bit of, like, immune system 101. So I'm going to make it simple, not technical here, but we have two different parts of our immune system. And we have your, you know, your first line, which is just really looking for threats. And then we have like the second. So it's innate immune system and adaptive. So your mast cells are part of your innate immune system. So your mast cells are playing a critical role immune system, and they're looking for any danger. And so they are actually giving signals to other parts of the immune system to, hey, come in. And we have alert, we have danger. And but what starts to happen is when we get some of these things. So I want you to think of it like building blocks. So we have all of these things, and we'll talk about what they are. They're building blocks that come that maybe you have a virus, maybe you have exposure to mold, maybe you have underlying gut infections, and you have all of these things that start building up and it starts to tell your immune system, okay, we're in danger. This is happening, this is happening. And then you get to a point all of a sudden where your mast cells become overwhelmed and they start, let's say, misfiring. And it starts to say, okay, we're in danger all the time. We have all of these things that are in our body that our body's having to deal with, and we start to just kind of get dysregulated where they start to what we call degranulate and release all of these different, like, hormones and mediators. We have everything from histamine to heparin to Tryptase, and all of these mediators are released in your body, and you start getting all of these symptoms where we're actually reacting to things that are safe. So that's why people with mass activation syndrome can react to anything from water. You know, you have some people who are even reacting to water touching them or drinking water, to different types of food, to different environments. And so we need to build. We need to bring your body back into this regulated place that we're not really overreacting to everything that we come in contact with. And it can vary. Some people are really severe, and other people, you know, are having symptoms just because you don't react to everything. If your body's starting to be overreactive, that's an idea that you could start to have some dysregulation in the mast cells.

Can you say something about. Because I've heard The, the, you know, I drink water and I don't feel well or maybe I get bloated. And that just seems so counterintuitive to me because it doesn't make any sense. And I'm not trying to be, you know, flippant or rude about it, but water is relatively, basically it's not inert, but filtered water, you know, we'll just say still filtered water. Shouldn't, you know, in general. Why, why would that do anything?

Yeah, and some of it comes into like nervous system dysregulation, which we can talk about. So one of the things that I like to use as an example is if you, if I handed you a rose and I said, smell this rose and it was really like, you know, nice. It smelled good. You're feeling like this is pleasant. And then every time I told you to smell that rose, I actually also told you to touch the stove. So you're touching a hot stove and you're smelling the rose and it's like, ow, that hurt. You know, that hurts. That's uncomfortable. And then, okay, now take the stove away and just smell the rose. And you smell the rose. You're going to feel this negative feeling. You're going to have that reaction because your body is now trained to feel that reaction. So what starts to happen is like you're saying water in itself, like, is inert. It's not dangerous, but your body's just reacting to it's, it's basically misfiring. It's just reacting to everything. So while that rose isn't dangerous to you in any way, in fact it probably is pleasant. You're, because you had to be touching that stove because you have this dysregulation and your body's kind of misfiring. Even in nervous system wise, we're still getting reactions to things that are safe.

So that's more of a loop in the brain in the singular cortex, where it's just like you said, like now it's a conditioned response almost. You do this, you see this, you smell this, you drink that, whatever it is, and now you get a reaction.

Yes. And that's why we do need to do the nervous system work while we're doing the other work. So we need to look at, okay, what is triggering your mast cells to go haywire. And we can see so many different things like we talked about. So we can see there are actually specific mast cell activating and histamine producing bacteria in your gut. So sometimes even is it you or is it your bacteria? You know, there's that's where it gets so interesting. So, you know, we see everything from that to mold's a huge one. So if you're living in a moldy environment, you know, think about that. If you're doing all the other things to get your immune system back in balance and you're being. You're living in mold all the time, and your body's just in this constant fight or flight and reacting to that, that's a hard one to, you know, really get cleared.

I mean, it sounds like something that if you had your. It would be difficult to design a very specific study. But if, and I don't know if FMRI would see that activation, but that would be typically how I would think about looking at it. That particular part of the brain would light up, or you see that in the submittal cortex. And that's interesting because when people say that to me, I'm like, oh, my gosh. I do not understand why that's happening because I try to get it very, very basic. Big. And I just say, okay, filtered still water. Like, yes, clean. You know, when we say clean, I hate. You know, that term has a lot of. I don't know how to take the word clean anymore because, like, everything says they eat clean and they do all these clean things. And like, I don't know what that means now, but I, I feel like I almost have to break it down in terms of things that are ingredients because people ask me just probably like the issue, like, what about this protein powder and what about this vendor? And I'm like, I don't have any experience with vendor. Like, if you flip it around and it's got 19 ingredients, then I wouldn't use it.

Yeah, I know. I like to say that too. You know, the less ingredients, we need to look at things that have real, whole, natural ingredients.

Right. So I'm. I'm more to the point of like, simplify it rather than over complicate. Like, I don't know how to say this other than cleaner air, fluid and higher quality food. And I, you know, this whole ultra process versus process, I'm good. God, there's all this, you know, banter about all of that. And I feel like these, these patients, to your point, have been told so many things that by the time they get to me, and I'm trying to get them set up for an operation and then recovery and the amount of information that they'd be given, they've been given, and I guess the quality of that information, just like we're talking about the quality of the air, the fluid and the food is somewhat suspect at this point.

And there's a lot of influencers out there saying a lot of things. Oh, my God, yes, in a very strong way. That's like, this is it, this is the thing. And then people get confused and it's like, okay, that's the thing. And I'm trying to search for answers and I'm in all these groups that are saying this or people out there saying it, and it's, it just, it sometimes makes things worse because then, you know, when we're talking about that dysregulated nervous system, you're more and more anxious and then you actually become afraid to eat. So there can be food fear. So think of, you have food fear, you're afraid to eat everything. Then every time you're eating, you're in a, a sympathetic nervous system state. So when you're in a sympathetic nervous system, you're not prioritizing digestion. Your blood's going to your limbs. It's basically saying like, shut down digestion here because we're, you know, have to run from a lion. And then, okay, that's not great to, you know, that can create more dysbiosis and overgrowth of bacteria in your gut, which can lead to, you know, more reactions. So I think some. Yeah. One time I had to tell someone just for a week, go eat anything you want to. Like, just literally. And this person was so dysregulated that they actually felt, they're like, oh, wait, I feel better now. If you really, truly have mast cell activation syndrome, that's. You're not necessarily going to feel like, okay, I can eat free eat. But I could just tell it was almost like this food fear was driving all of the symptoms because she was just getting so overwhelmed. And so sometimes it's just like letting some of that go.

Yeah, I mean, that's the, that's the thing. Like, everybody's an influencer. And now we have maybe the, the influencer for all time Chat GPT, which I had. Somebody told me they did their research and on Chat dbt it said xyz. And I was like, for everybody listening, Chat GPT does not have access to medical journals. Journals are actually behind paywalls. So although a search could synthesize a response, which is what it does every time you do that, it says, basically you have to check this. Right. If you don't check that and you come into my office and say you did some research with Chat GPT, like, okay, so one number One that's really not research. You know, they're surveying quickly the literature. There's no way to read that literature because as you know, Meg, if you clicked on a link in PubMed and it's behind a paywall, so if it's not open access, you can't even get to it. Which. All the plastic surgery journals, Meg, except for a couple, are closed.

Yes.

Because that's how they make money. So let's just always remember everybody, the journals are not in the business of not making money.

That's a good point.

And so chat GPT can't actually read the literature. It can read abstracts because those abstracts are actually what's available, something that's on Google. So let's, let's just calm down about research and then flooding me or telling Meg or whomever you're talking to about the research you did because you haven't done any. That's not how research gets done. For somebody who's had to file institutional review board, you know, protocols and get approvals to do research and then publish research, I've often heard people say like, oh, anybody could publish.

I'm like, no, no.

There'S a lot I hear that. I just. You sound stupid when you say that. And I've, I've seen, you know, people say those things and I'm like, really? You think anybody can publish something? Okay, so there's a process called peer review, right? That's where you submit something. It gets reviewed, obviously, but it's a lot more complicated. And just typing into a generative search, oh, you know, give me the symptoms of muscle activation syndrome or give me the symptoms of XYZ or tell me what you know is causing facial fat loss. Hence ozympic face, which has become like my nemesis now. Because just for all you folks listening, just be very careful GLP1s because they work and you will cause your face to age much more quickly as a woman if you're doing GLP1s and not eating and you know, having what Meg's describing in terms of maybe some dysregulated eating or really it seems like that's going to get so much worse to me because now instead of it a anxiety driven thing, Meg, or a perception like that drug changes your behavior. So you're going to. Now you're not even going to have that, that stimulus for that behavior, I guess, because it's going to take it away at a certain dose. You don't even think about eating. Like I've had people tell me, like, yeah, I don't really, I don't really get hungry.

Yeah. So they have to force themselves to eat something. But yeah, And I, you, I agree with you. I mean, it is when people get excited about the weight loss and then you start to see their face change and then you're like, that's not what you want.

Yeah. So you never want to burn fat in your face. I can tell you 100, if you look young face, a young face is fuller and if you will, rounder because it's got that. And as we age and we become lax or we lose weight or you didn't pick your parents. Right. Or you got too much sun damage or, you know, people who are really facial animators, like super animators, they get more lines because of lines of animation. Like there's reasons, you know, for that. But if you accelerate that process by burning the fat in your face with a drug like cozepatide, Manjaro or Ozempic semiglutide, oh boy, you are going to look so much older, so much faster than you want to. And it's all going to happen without you knowing what's going on. The lines that you had are going to be accentuated. And then I had this happen every year. Somebody came in is like, I didn't have these lines before and I'm like, okay. You know, and we were, they hadn't disclosed because they weren't doing it with us. Because I have a very strict policy about GLP1s and surgery. Six months off of them before I ever operate on anybody. Because you have to be able to eat and drink normally from a behavioral standpoint. But, you know, so many people are doing it now. And this microdosing thing, so everybody listening. Microdosing is not an FDA approved dosing. Like, there is no study to show that microdosing to my knowledge is effective at, you know, whatever the parameter is. Right. Because these are just now being everybody's their own end of one. Right?

Yeah.

Meg needs a different dose than Rob needs because they want something different. I don't want to lose my facial fat. So I would never macro, dose or dose as an adult would with a GLP1 one. I don't need to lose a bunch of weight then. I don't have diabetes. But I don't want to burn my facial fat because that's going to be a problem now if, if a gal wants to lose five or ten pounds or they're having muscle activation and they're like, I've been told this will help me, like, you have to Be careful because all those, these drugs all work and they do have this kind of anti inflammatory component, but they also drive this like change in behavior of like bingeing and, and addictive. I don't say addictive, that's not right. But you just don't have the same desire, if that's a fair thing to say. Because it modifies your behavior to go like to that shelf or to the fridge or you know, through the drive through at 12pm or to the bag of chip. And those things ultimately will definitely tamp down activation of something like Mast cell or something that's degranulatory because you're not actually exhibiting the behavior then.

And so what, what do you do? This is, I know, a little bit off topic, but I'm curious now. What do you do? Do you do a fat transfer? Like what would you do for someone that.

Right. So the, my comment to this person specifically was you've burned the fat layer. So the ways to correct that are put fat back or use a product that's off the shelf. So you have hyaluronic acid fillers, you have things like Sculptra. There are other, other products. I think you have to be very careful with what you're doing. And in this country we're super sophisticated at assigning blame to people and not being.

Yes, I agree.

You start injecting something, you have to be accountable. And if you're buying stuff off the Internet.

Yeah.

I mean there is no chance in hell, Dr. Mill, that you know what is in that product. Mm. That product, if it's compounded, zero idea of the concentration in that product. You know this as well as I do. And when somebody tries to, you know, throw shade on me, I'm gonna be like, did you have that third party tested before you injected it into your body? Because I'm just a little curious. It may say one thing, but you can't prove that.

Yeah, and that's, that's a great point because there, there's just so much out there. Like again we're talking about everyone is becoming what we want people to become, more health advocates of themselves. So I think that like taking your power back and taking your health into your. But not just. But I think we're still in that quick fix mindset. So it's like I'm always reaching for the supplement or the drug or the thing and a lot of these things are complicated and there's, there's not, there really isn't a silver bullet. So, so I think we're trying to get those silver bullets. Now maybe if you're trying to lose weight, we, we found, you found Ozempic and that's your silver bullet. But as we're saying, even that has consequences. So we need to look at everything.

Burns fat. That drug was when I, when I looked at it and what it was doing and how it changed behavior, to me, that's probably the most powerful tool I've ever seen brought to market.

Yeah, I agree. I said to my husband years ago, I was like, if they find a weight loss drug that really works, it's a bill, it's a billion dollar business. And, and it is, it is.

But it's also called a trillion dollar change in everything else.

Yep.

Fast food, Starbucks, for that matter, dialysis. Because you're not going to see as many dialysis patients. They're not going to get there.

Yeah.

Have as many problems with people who have diabetes getting to end stage renal disease. Because now it's going to be, it's not that it's going to go away. I'm just saying it's going to diminish because now you have a way to combat the inflammation that really led to chronic end stage kidney disease. Same thing with maybe liver, maybe lung, maybe the brain. Like anything. If you just think of all the things that kill us, they're all products of inflammation. So now you have a drug that changes behavior mostly by what you put in your mouth, if that lets anybody know what we're talking about. So it's changing. All of the things that we've been talking about is like, if you can just how many times, you know, probably in my life did I tell people, hey, you're probably 5 or 10 pounds above the weight you want to be is. They'll say, I want to get my face done. And I'll say, are you going to lose weight? They're like, yes, I'm going to lose weight. I'm like, well, you have to be at that weight.

Okay.

Prior to anything it has to do with the face. Because the fluctuation of five pounds, which obviously, I mean, five pounds could be just literally water weight. But now we have a drug that targets fat and it doesn't discriminate from the face. There's no way that you know what it targets.

Yes.

Some people, it may be more the gut and some people who are lean, maybe their face. And that is like the coup de grace. You don't want that. And I've seen that happen. That's why there is a ozempic face discussion. Because I Have young people who are lean taking a drug they shouldn't be on.

Yeah. Wow. And when is enough enough? That's what I think what I hear you saying too, like, they shouldn't be on. Be on it. It's, it's.

Nobody's eating it, Meg, because they're getting off the Internet.

They don't know when an oven is.

I had a skinny gal tell me. I was like, what instructions did they give you? Well, they said, you know, it's injectable and this is how you do it. And I was like, that's the instructions. And I'm like, so you got online. Did they ask you your bmi, your body weight, your. Your, your body composition? Nope.

It is. Yeah.

110 pound woman.

Wow. Oh, wow. Yeah. Who. That's not a candidate. No. And, and I've seen in my Instagram feed because I like curious their. They'll say, you know, all these things which they drive me crazy when I see in four weeks you're going, you know, here's, here's me when I was this age. And here's me, you know, now in a bikini that's, you know, like suit, like maybe even too thin or, you know, either way. And in four weeks you can be this too. And it's like, oh, it's so not the message that we want to bring our bodies back into balance. So, so then some of these, when I've looked at them, like, again, they're, they're putting these products in and it's just, it's just upsetting, I would say, because it's like an unrealistic expectation. And maybe when you're saying the behavior. What can we do to get ourselves not to go through that drive through to get us not to stop at Starbucks with like, without any of it.

Well, right. I mean, and that's, I think, going back to a point you made about working on your nervous system and we talked a little offline. I always have gone back to this kind of self work concept and maybe that's not the correct term. And there are lots of. There's disorder of eating, there's body dysmorphia, there's a lot of anxiety. And, and then we couple all these things. We've been talking about mast cell activation syndrome, problems with migraines, problems with, you know, how you, you experience things, you, you know, drink or eat. Because, I mean, you have this negative feedback loop. I mean, it's definitely a lot more complicated. And that I don't really feel like that's discussed very Much?

No, Yeah, I don't think it is. And I think you really have to some ways reprogram. So one of the things that I do, even with people beyond, you know, we all know the, the breath. I mean maybe people don't, but simple things are like take microhabits of breath, work, do grounding, do things that just bring your body back into that parasympathetic nervous system. You know, we're hearing a lot more about some vagal toning exercises that you can do. But another thing that I work on with people is reprogramming thoughts. Because if you're having these negative like thought patterns all the time, unless you actually work on catching them and changing those thoughts, you're just sort of really kind of going in this loop. And so I think we need to think about how we actually think and realize like what your thoughts are affecting you and how to change that. And that's kind of bringing in some of that neuroplasticity where we're really kind of rewiring those thought patterns to get you out of some of these things that are these. Either it's patterns, it's negative thoughts because with those you're going to keep making the same decisions a lot of times.

And those drugs don't do that. They do not correct a nervous system problem. And if you're the woman who is like I said, 110 or 15 pounds, that puts you at a BMI of like in the 19s and 20s, you do not need to be on that drug. If, if you're experiencing problems, we'll say with inflammation and you think this is the cure all of inflammation, I would, I would caution you that that's not the route because that's going to burn your fat. And to remain youthful, we'll just say for facial aging purposes, you don't want to burn your facial fat. Like that's not a thing.

No, you want to do. No.

And you know, for the proprietors of these, you know, online places that are selling this, you need to get a grip on reality. You do not need to be selling that to a woman in their 20s. And I've, I've heard of this in their 20s and 30s and 40s who are of that BMI, like that makes no sense. What are you trying to do?

Yeah, well, they're, they're trying to make money. And I think that's another thing that kind of, when you're looking at health advice online, you do always, I tell people that I work with because they come to me, oh I just, Just, you know, saw this new supplement or saw this new thing, and it's like, you have to keep in mind that those people are actually running a business and they're not just giving you this health advice. Like, they're probably getting a kickback on that product and they probably so, you know, I've seen even some people that are medical people sort of turn into that influencer seller kind of aspect. So you have to be careful about just saying, okay, is this just, you know, something that they're trying to get me to buy? Because it's trying, they're making money on the program or the product or whatever, too.

Absolutely. I mean, yeah, I mean, I get it. Like, the, the bottom line is the bottom line. It seems like a very, it's disingenuous to say that maybe the most powerful tool, like you've ever, like you alluded to it, literally is the most powerful tool I've ever seen introduced into medicine today. Like, there's a Bottix in the, you know. Okay. That changed everything. Yeah. Since I've been alive, this is the thing that I've.

This has changed the GLP1s.

Yeah. I mean, this has definitely changed things that I, I, I, you know, when I was in training, dealt with, you know, diabetes especially. You just go back to how bad diabetes can get.

Yes.

And, and this is really altering the course of that, which is great. That's, that's wonderful. It's all the, you know, derivations of it that just make no sense. And every time I hear this, I get triggered when I hear microdosing, because I'm like, what in the hell are you talking about?

That's not a thing, really. That, I mean, so they're just.

That is something that is, you know, in the world of off label.

Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, there's the FDA trial and that was on label. That's what it means. And it had these dosing parameters. When you say anything else, you're off label. When you mentioned a, a compounded product, now you're in a whole different situation. Not only are you not using a pharmaceutical grade product, now you have to scrutinize where that was compounded. And if it's not been tested, you know, as a, as someone with a pharmacy background, you know, you have no idea what's in that. That could be anything half as strong.

Yeah.

Or unfortunately, it could be 10x is strong.

That's what's scary.

And that is what is the problem. Because if you take a drug like Manjaro, which is Tirzepatide. And you compounded that with say, you know, the standard B vitamin, which is what's traditionally done, but you gave somebody the 10x strength of that and they thought they were microdosing. What do you think happens to their face?

Yeah.

And they have, they're like, I was just microdosing, Dr. Whitfield. Like, okay, well, this is what happened. I can't really tell you that. And if you bought it, I'm not going to say by who or I'm sorry, from whom, but I've been told that this is more than a, a large enough problem amongst those people, you know, from a pharmacy standpoint doing that. And that's, you know, when you hear them say, oh, we're going to pull back from compounding.

Yeah.

Because there's a quality issue. It's so different than the food or the air or the fluid.

Yes.

I mean, so people are so willing to inject themselves with that they have.

No idea about because they want the quick, they want the fix. It's like, just give, give me the thing that that will help and I can just do that thing and I don't have to take the time or the effort. You know, some of the other things take more time and effort to, to do. And so it's like, okay, that's the answer. What do you see about, like, when you're seeing people and you're saying they have to go off of it for six months pro, like pre surgery, are you seeing changes come back?

I had to put a, I had to put a question in our paperwork now.

Okay, because.

This happened to me not once, not twice, but multiple times where people started using it.

Okay.

Not disclosing it and then wanting a fat transfer.

Okay?

So for everybody listening, when you take a drug that burns fat and you come and ask me for a fat transfer, those two things don't work.

No.

Transfer. And you get on that drug, that.

Is dumb and paid to do that.

Anybody tell you it's not, you should come back to the person like me who did the fat transfer for some advice. Because once again, Dr. Mill is correct. You're trying to get the quick fix to a problem rather than create a long term solution to a problem. And those drugs, mark my words, they all work.

Yeah.

There's no question in my mind. They all work. And the ones that are coming are going to work better than the ones they have right now. They're going to get more efficient at burning fat. So if you don't want to look like an old shoe early in life, be very, very cautious of what you inject as it relates to a GLP1, because you're going to age faster and look worse. And there is. I'm not the guy to come see afterwards. I, I will tell you, like, if you don't disclose what you're doing. Yeah, you're gonna really cause problems because nobody's guiding this. Like you said, the people online are just trying to make money. And then I'm dealing with the aftermath of it and telling people they can't have surgery, and then they get upset and I'm like, well, okay, you said you wanted to have a fat transfer, but you're taking a drug, it's burning. That focuses on burning fat by modifying behavior. Left all these things, you're just like, really? Like, yeah, there's the disconnect. Right? Like, I, I get. People want to lower information. I want to do that too. But if you're trying to get your fat utilized and you, first of all, you want to preserve facial fat, let's just. Gals come to me all the time about facial aging. Like, you don't want to do that and burn your fat in your face unless you're like, all right, I got to do it for health. So I'm just going to deal with the consequences and, you know, maybe go get, get XYZ treatment afterwards. But for my health, I got diabetes, I got a blood pressure problem, I got a. Whatever, whatever. The thing is, like, this is the sub. The. The treatment. Okay, that's fine. Like, you understand the situation and it's a. Okay, we're focused on this problem now. We're going to take this medicine and see how we do. Yes, that's okay. That's fine. Then you've made an informed decision. But on the Internet, where you're just buying something off of one of these things and I'm not going to say their name so I don't get some weird cease and desist letter. Yeah. There really some kind of relationship that's going to guide you long term about what you're doing and how you're doing it? No, it's just transaction. They're just like, okay, Meg, I'll send you this in the mail. And then you inject yourself and, you know, check it in a month.

And I think that's what. I think you made a great point there. Because when we're looking at medications, we're looking them, we're looking at them for FDA approved diagnosis and a specific purpose. And so what's happened with this Medication is that it's gone from the indicated purpose to caught wildfire. Because as you're saying that we're seeing it works, and then it's. It's just sort of gone rogue and not really being used for the indication that it's developed for. Under supervision of a practitioner who can monitor that.

Right. I mean, it's just. And at some point, I presume they're going to put out a study that talks about microdosing of GLP1s, and they may not say it in that, but you have to understand, like, beg. How much money does it take to put together a trial to run.

Yeah.

Get approved. Like, everybody has to get their head out of their butts and understand that this is not. You don't walk back and go, oh, well, now we need to do it at 1/4 the dose and run that trial and get the results and then publish them all.

No.

No, that's not gonna happen. Guys are trying to recoup all the money they spent to get the drug to market.

Yes, exactly. Yeah, I know.

It's not so hard. Like, I, you know, I'm. If somebody has their own clinical experience, which is pretty large like we have in surgery, then they're the ones who need to file an IRB and publish it. That would be great saying that, hey, we did 100 consecutive patients on this, you know, microdose, whatever the hell that is, and this is what we found. That would be awesome. And I have friends who say they have good data that would be great to. To put forth so everybody would understand it better rather than, you know, I get this, like, slaying thing about microdosing. You know, if you microdose, it's fine. I don't even know what that means. And then from what source that. I mean, and who.

Yeah, who's saying it? Who's giving you. Who. Who are we taking medical advice from? Is that what, you know, what you're saying?

Then you gotta, you gotta get the, the drug. Somebody.

Yeah.

So you have to control where it's coming from. And then, like, is it actually what it says it is? Like, there's a lot of peptides that, you know, people ask me all the time, probably, like, you like, hey, can I take this? I'm like, where did it come from?

Yeah, what's the source?

And they, I'm like, show me the back of it. You know, they'll show us the back of it. I'm like, nope, I can't tell you. That's okay. And if it says research only you have literally lost your mind. Not use that drug.

Yeah. And not. I mean, it's. The peptides are. That's a great example, because it is. It's new. People hear about it, and you have to be, you know, educated and use. And I think that, like, everything that goes in our body has an effect. And I. I think that we always have to think about that when we're taking anything. Like, whether you're taking a zinc supplement, which is like, I'm just throwing out something, like, the simplest, you know, one of the, like, simple things that still affects your body. Like, if you're taking a peptide that you don't really know and you might have just heard about on the Internet, they're all affecting your body in different ways. And so everything that goes in your mouth, whether it's your food, whether it's a supplement, whether it's medication, what do you understand why you're taking it and what it's affecting? The people come to me with 30 supplements or more, and it's like, why are you actually, like, let's pare this down. I'm not in the business of just saying, let's throw more things off. Like, why are you taking these things? And I think understanding what you're taking it and why is really an important piece.

Absolutely. Always like. Always like it. You know, just to your point is, you know, I look at what's been done just in the last.

See.

All right, we're in. Since 2020, the papers that have been written about GLP1s. 967.

Okay.

Since 2020. So once again, the drugs, although they've caught all this, like, attention now, they're not that new now. Right. The effects and the things and the. The stuff that's coming out of the literature, you know, the top 10 hits are like, that are just about GLP1s are, you know, effects beyond the pancreas. That's new treatment for Parkinson's, As you would expect. Type 2 diabetes, Alzheimer's, like, they're finding out it's doing so much more now. They've had it for a period of time.

Yeah, and that's an interesting point that you're saying, too, because if you're. That'll be interesting as more research comes out. Like, if you're saying, okay, there's Parkinson's or Alzheimer's and you're seeing positive effects, but you do, like you're saying, have someone who's not overweight, who. Not, you know, where. Where does that fit in? Because it does burn fat. So it's, that'll be interesting.

Yeah. Because these articles say like what are its effects beyond the pancreas. Right. That's the whole point.

Yeah.

And the, the concern is like these there, I guess therapeutic windows, they're going to be different. And these low BMI patients who don't have diabetes, I mean that's the, you know, I don't know and nobody knows what's that gonna do. But we've already got this phenomenon of Ozempic phase. I did a video about it. Totally got ripped off of my channel because they said it was a copyright infringement. But like it's a real thing. It's not going anywhere.

No.

You know, I, I know people.

That do look, I would say like that looks so much better before. You know, they have lost weight but their face ch. Like you're saying it's like their face looked better before and it. So it. We have such a weight image, like body image issue too. And that's like unpacking a whole another topic. But, but like what is thin enough and why do you like. How do you feel comfortable and love the body that you're in too?

Right. I mean everybody's. I think the take home really is going to be. We talked about self work or nervous system work. Like that's paramount. Let's focus on that. Let's. You know, drugs are drugs that especially this one's a very powerful tool when indicated. You know, be mindful of that, that be mindful of protecting, you know, your facial fat, I guess. And the things that you put in your body, the quality of the things you put in your body and on your skin are super important. So it's been fun having you on again. I know we got a little kind of tangential but it was, it was fun because I like your insights. I really appreciate having you on again back. Thank you.

Thank you so much for having me.