Create a Workplace Culture Where People Thrive with Robin Daniels

Hi everyone, it's Jen De Waal. And on this week's episode of the Leadership Habit podcast, we are talking all about building a workplace culture that people want to come to. I mean, we're really just breaking it down into thinking what can you do to create happier employees? And to have this conversation, I am so excited to welcome and introduce you to Robin Daniels, who is the Chief Business and Product Officer at Sensei. And Robin has previously been. Let me give you his track record. He has been a three time CMO with more than 20 years of experience in marketing and growth. Leadership roles at Salesforce, Box, LinkedIn, Matterport, and WeWork. He's done 2.5 IPOs and acquisitions and led companies through Hyper Growth to become epic. His passion is creating winning teams that do outstanding and meaningful work. Robin knows a thing or two from his vast experience and track record about what to do to actually create a culture and a workplace where people actually want to come to. I hope you enjoy our conversation. Foreign. Hello everyone. I am so excited for today's conversation. We are talking all about how to build a workplace culture that people actually want to come to. Now I laugh at this because we know so many people laugh about trying to go into the office to find a culture and in this hybrid world there often isn't a culture. And and we see those mandates to come into the office and please come and do this and people don't want to. And so we're going to talk all about employee happiness, what you can do to create a culture where people can thrive. Robin Daniels, I am so excited to have you Chief Business and Product Officer at Zenzi. I'm so, so happy. Welcome to the Leadership Habit.

Thanks Jen. I'm so excited to be here. Can't wait to talk about my favorite topic, how to create an environment for employees to thrive. So let's do it.

Yeah, I mean, I want someone to be intentional with this. So if you're a leader, we're going to share with you tips and techniques considerations. Think about even small steps that you might be able to take to help your people just improve their quality of work life. And knowing that improves their quality of home life too. But before we dive in, I know our audience heard a little bit about you. You have such an impressive background. Could you tell our audience a little bit more about who you are and what your organization does?

Sure. Thanks for again. Thanks for having me. So I'm Robin Daniels and I'm the Chief Business Officer here at Sensei. I'm originally from Copenhagen, Denmark, where I was born and raised, but I'm a nerd. And so when I was 21 I bought a one way ticket from Copenhagen to San Francisco because I wanted to be with all the other nerds of the world in Silicon Valley. I didn't have a job, I didn't have a place to stay, I didn't know anyone, I'd never actually been to San Francisco or California when I went. But I had to this driving thought that I didn't want to look back on my life and regret not having the courage to go. So I moved over there, applied to every job I could find and luckily this was at the height of the dot com era so everybody was hiring. Even somebody who was 21 years old and inexperienced could get a foot in the door. And I ended up getting a few job offers and I took a job with a startup company in Silicon Valley. And a month after I got there, because I remember thinking to myself, ah, this wasn't so hard. A month after I got there the whole market crashed and it was pretty brutal. And this company I was at did not end up making it. Six months later I was out of a job, had to find another job. So I hustled my way and found another job. Four months later that company went under. So the first year was rough. But then when you zoom out and you think about, I spent over 20 years in California. I ended up being early days and some really iconic tech companies including Salesforce, Box that went public. LinkedIn, WeWork, Matterport was a company I took public in 2021 so. So you end up accumulating hopefully more wins and losses which, which I'm proud to say that I have. And now I joined this company Sensei to lead the go to market and product development for the company. We're a 200 person company, just over 200 people and we have about 2,000 customers around the world. About half of them are from the US half rest of the world. We basically offer a platform that's really focused about how do we make people the most successful that they can be once they're in a company. Meaning how do you engage them deeply, how do you ensure they have the right skills and knowledge to be successful and how do you ensure that they're performing at the levels that you need to perform at in order for your business organization to be successful? That's what our company does. We're basically a platform centered around what we call human success, making every person the best version of themselves every single day.

Yes, I love, I mean from where I said, I feel like the differentiator for that is really that you have, of course, what you can do for the organization and how you can improve productivity and improve what they need or their business objectives. But then you're also taking that human first, like employee centered approach. How can I make it better for them? I just think that is, I don't know if I see it as often. I think even in sales experiences I've been a part of, it might be more catered towards the organization. And I just love that you're seeing every person. I think that's a cool differentiator. So you know a thing or two also by the nature of what your product does. And maybe we'll talk a little bit more about some of your features or how you actually deliver on employee happiness. But let's dive in. How do we actually create a place where people can thrive, A workplace that people actually want to come to. And so to start it off, I of course have to ask and we have to talk about the reality.

Yeah.

Why are employees unhappy today? Because you see it. I mean, Bamboo HR called it. Employee unhappiness is at an all time high and they're finding this globally. Like it's not just, you know, us centered or maybe even centered in Denmark. I mean, are people unhappy there?

Maybe not as much as other places, but there you see it too. I mean, gender. The reality is these statistics drive me crazy. And the reason why is because they are the same year after year. And I just feel like as a leader it's, it's my duty to make sure that this doesn't happen. So I, I always think of I am where I am today because many people invested in me and gave me opportunities that maybe I didn't have and invested in growing my skills. And it's made me a better leader and, and the red thread for my life, the silver lining has really been around. How do I create an environment around the work I do and the teams that I work with so everyone can thrive? And, and I've noticed a few, few things, you know, so if you take a step back, I think the first generation of kind of HR technology or HR philosophy was really around can we, can we optimize people for the maximum output of the business? That's why I think it's called human resources. It's kind of a very cold term when you think about it. Right. Think of people as resources. A lot of it's about optimizing the throughput of what they do and also just making sure that we cover the basics of, of what they need to be successful. Oh, do they, Are we getting, giving them pay? Are they complying with what we need to be complying with? Are they taking their vacation? Are they, are we tracking them? And so on. And I think we realized again, this is nothing, nothing new. I think we realized maybe 20 years, maybe 15, 20 years ago that this is not enough. In the next generation of workers coming into the workforce, we want to make them happier, more successful, more. We need to change the culture around it. So we thought, well, let's change the, change it from hr, human resources to people and culture. So many companies now have a people and culture department. And we thought, okay, that's going to change everything by changing the name of it. And part of that was, oh, let's also make the office a great place to work with foosball and free food and snacks and ping pong tables. And you know what? I think it helped somewhat because it at least made you want to at least come to the office because it wasn't soulless anymore. And maybe it felt more like a group of people, a tribe of people, camaraderie, maybe even a family. And it made you maybe feel like you belonged a little bit more. So I think it helped, you know, and I was honestly part of that movement when I was at WeWork. I was the chief marketing officer there. And trying to say that at an office where people gather together doesn't have to be sold. Let's get the best out of people by giving them a space where they can thrive. But I think we realize here in 2024 that that's not really actually solving the root cause of the problem. I think the root cause, if you look in pretty much all the data that says that, like you said, most people are unhappy or they want to quit. And if you look at the reasons why, it's usually because nobody invests in them. They don't feel like they're going anywhere in their life or their career. They don't see any purpose of what they're doing and they feel kind of stuck. And so when you dig that, well, is a better office space going to solve some of those problems? Probably not, right? I mean, they're kind of plastering over the surface of what makes people seem unhappy on the surface. But if the root cause, if you feel stuck in your life, then free kombucha on tap is not going to help if you feel stuck in your life. So we have to address, I think, the root cause of this. And it's why? One of the reasons why I've created this framework that I published an article about 10 years ago that's really around how do you get ahead in your life? Or how do you kind of get to the next level? Because it was the question I would get mostly as a leader. I've hired hundreds of people, led thousands of people. How do I get ahead? And when people don't feel like they get a clear answer that that's when you start feeling disengaged or stuck or unhappy. And I started noticing that there are really kind of three, three core elements to it. Number one is you have to have clarity around why you're working on something and what, what difference is going to make. Like it's super hard to be motivated if you feel like you're working on something. You don't really know why. Like you get to Friday night and you're like, I felt really busy, but I don't really know if I made any difference. And that's a sucky feeling. So first step is clarity. You have clarity on what you're working on and what difference this will make to the success of the business or team and so on. And you have that, that can drive a lot of motivation. But of course that's, that's not enough. The second thing is people also want to feel like they're moving ahead in their life. So if you're a senior manager and you want to be a director or your director and you want to be a vice president, well start then modeling yourself after the behaviors of those people who maybe have gone before you. Or have clarity around what it means to, to be able to get to the next level. That requires also that leaders do the heavy work of saying, if you want to move from director to vp, here's what I need you to do. And usually when you tell that to people, then they'll motivate them because you can see most people have really strong self motivation. They want to then step up, they want to do the work. But if you don't have clarity, then you're just kind of like blowing in the wind. You don't really know what it is that you're aiming for. So that's the second thing. And then the third thing, which maybe mostly gives you a sense of belonging and inclusion, is do you feel like there's a tribe around you that care about your success? And do you feel like you're part of a tribe where you can invest in other people's success as well? Meaning are people like looking out for you do they help you when you need help? I mean, are you helping others when they need help? And that provides this kind of sense of being part of something a little bit bigger than yourself. So you're not just working in isolation. Um, and those three things, usually when you have those three, one, one alone can be okay, but three of them combined are really powerful. And whenever you solve that for an employee, you can see their motivation go up. You can see their happiness go up because they feel like there's a purpose and meaning to what they do. But it's not easy. And I think it's actually in some ways gotten more difficult, at least on the surface in this new world we're living in with remote work. And like, when you can't just go over to somebody in the office and say, hey, Jen, let's talk for next hour. I want to understand what's driving you, and so on. It's not impossible, but it now means managers and leaders have to do even more work because they have to really lean into this. Right. And take the time to get to know people. So I know that's a long answer, but I think it's not a simple solution either to this question.

No. And just to kind of recap like thinking about, you know, why are we really unhappy? We feel like no one's investing in us, or we don't have meaning or purpose in our role. We feel stuck, or maybe no one cares. And so I love that solution of thinking around clarity of purpose and that career path and career growth is all. As well as creating the community that people want to work in. Because I. I can see what you're saying by. If you have one of them, sure, that's going to be fine, but you really do need all three to capitalize. What role do you think pay has in this? Because I know that someone is sitting there thinking, well, it's all pay anyways. That's all people want in terms of what's going to make them happy. From your not, you know, from your perspective, what role do you think pay or salary plays in this?

It's great question. I think it plays a really important role. I think I wrote an article, another article. I like writing articles on this stuff because I'm very passionate about it. About the 15 different parameters to rate a potential job on purpose, team culture, location, and pay is certainly on there. And I think anybody who says that pay is not important is lying. I think forced pay is important. We all. We all want to do well, and there's nothing wrong with wanting to do well, it gives you more opportunity to live the life you want, gives you more freedom, maybe also freedom to help more people around you. So absolutely matters. But I rarely see it matter the most. Unless maybe you're talking where you're in a desperate situation, then just the only thing that you need to survive is just a job with a paycheck. Then of course it's a different situation. But I think in general, if you have the luxury of being able to have some options, which I think many people do, pay certainly matters. But it's really the number one, number two or maybe even number three thing. I find the top three things are usually purpose. I think especially this new generation. I'm waking up every day fighting for something worth fighting for. Like if I don't believe in the mission of the company or the mission of the team, honestly it's very hard to stay motivated. So that's number one. Number two I would say is impact. I mean luckily we live in a time where people really want to make a difference. I love that. That makes me very optimistic about the future that people want. They don't want to just have a dead end job where there's no kind of purpose to it or no, they're not making a difference so they want to make a difference. And I think I get that question a lot now. And if I'm successful, what difference will it make to the business or the team? And so I think that's great. And then, and then number three I think is the culture, like am I working with people that I'm laughing with, having fun with again, like to this point of like having a child to look out for me and I can look out for them where we become part of something that I feel like there's at least a friendship. Maybe not family is a strong word, but at least a strong friendship. If I think back again on the 20 plus years of my career, there's so many highlights I remember of great campaigns and IPOs and successes. But the thing I remember most by far, the people all the time. And luckily I've worked in a lot of companies and I always pick up a few people at each of these jobs I've had that stay with me for the rest of life. And that's what matters the most. And you can see that in people. They. If I ask you, Jen, like think back into 20 years of your career. What do you remember? It's probably the people that you remember the most.

Age. No, of course, of course I remember the people. And of course even on social media, watching people stages right now and just thinking fondly. But yes, of course, course, it's absolutely the people. Sorry for the bad joke. I like to know.

But of course, I can guarantee I'm way older than you. Okay.

No, the people are everything. I think obviously we're seeing, you know, diversity, equity, inclusion, belonging. Shift really into that belonging space. Because that's what we want. We want to feel like we're part of something greater than ourselves. And yes, I need someone to laugh with. I also need someone to say, like, I'm sorry, this is bananas, but research on that, like, I know better up did something a few years ago and they found that your job satisfaction can increase by almost 10 times. They did a belonging. That's what they found by having a friend. And so you have to address that employee loneliness.

I can always see it's a little harder now with, I think, remote work, but I was always noticing the people who eat lunch by themselves, who don't really have a tribe or an entourage. And sometimes you lead an entourage, sometimes you're part of one. I've been both, you know, but when people are not part of anything, you can always. I'm always, to me, like, that's a flight risk. Even though they're great with their job, they're not happy here, I can tell, you know, because they don't. They're just like, not included in the. In the thing that's happening, you know, And I have a very simple barometer for success. It sounds maybe, but for me, it's, do I laugh every day? And, you know, because life is hard, work is hard. You're always going to have stuff that doesn't go well, both in life and at work. But am I at least enjoying the ride? And I have a group of people I can laugh with. And it's those days when I feel like it's been really heavy. Those days suck, I think, really, you know, they happen, of course, but I try to minimize them as much as I can.

But I think this begs, like, then the opening for the next question, because we're really getting into happiness. Things happen outside of work. You know, work can be that safe place for us. It can help us with resilience or just laughing. So what role do organizations or leaders play in shaping happiness? Because you have the traditional, I would say, older school belief system, which is personal time, personal dime. You don't bring that stuff in here. We're not responsible for that. And I think you now have this space where there are still some people that are really reluctant to touch anything that has to deal with something outside of the workplace. And I think you can also see that there are still people that say, like, that is not an organization's problem to manage around your caretaking, to manage around blank. So what role? But I of course, believe in the other side, but I know that there's still working through that change to find that common ground between both sides. What role do you think organizations and leaders play in shaping the happiness?

I think they play a crazy, critical role, honestly. And I. And I hear this because I speak to a lot of leaders all the time and how difficult it is or how time consuming and now with remote work and blah, blah, blah, I'm like, yeah, that's the job. You know what an honored honor and a privilege it is to be a leader. You know how many people want to get to the level that you are at whatever leader you are. So. So your job is to pay it forward, look out for your people, and do everything you can to. To show up and give him every opportunity to succeed every single day. Doesn't mean you can succeed with everything and you're always successful. But you have to fight, I think, relentlessly to show up every day and fight for your people. I have this thing I always say to my teams, and I have a lot of leaders who work for me, so I hope they pass it forward as well as my job. If somebody shows up every day and they like what they do, and they do a good job and they're good for the overall health of the team and the business, meaning that they're a net positive. My job is to fight for you tooth and nail and give you every opportunity I can to succeed and give you the right resources and time and focus and skills and all that. That's my promise here, and I'll fight relentlessly to make that happen. What I can't promise you is that your job will always stay the same, that the team will always stay the same. And that changes what's not going to happen, because that's just not the reality of life. So if you're okay with, like, things changing, projects changing, sometimes team changes, sometimes new managers will come in, whatever it is. Those are things that you can roll with and optimize for. But my job as a leader, and I say this to all the other leaders, is to show up every single day. So when I hear these stories, for example, I was a chief marketing officer many years ago at a company, and I left. And then if a little bit while later, they got Another chief marketing officer and I just heard that this new person who came in wasn't showing up for one on one because I had a lot of people who'd worked for me at this company. Of course our new leader, the new chief market doesn't show up for one on ones. I don't really know what the priorities are. And just like it's just kind of. I wasn't mad at this person. I was just embarrassed for the art of leadership because the job of a leader is to show up relentlessly for your people to understand their motivation. This is also part of it is, yes, it's hard because everyone's motivation is different. Like you said, somebody, sometimes somebody wants more pay, sometimes somebody wants more responsibility. Maybe they want to be promoted, maybe they want a different title, maybe they want to move to a different part of the business. You can't treat everyone the same. You have to truly understand the motivation of someone and if you want to drive them towards greatness. But the only way to do that is by doing the work, taking the time, understanding where they're coming from, what are you optimizing for and that honestly it's time consuming, it can be heavy, but it can also be joyful. Like if you really lean into it, I think. But, but it does require a lot of work. And this is where there's no excuse to not do it. It is ultimately the job, I think of the leader to do exactly that. And then sometimes you find out, you know, that what you had to story in your head is going to maybe completely different than the story of the person you're actually talking to. Maybe they want something different and you can then optimize for that. But if you treat everyone with assumptions and bias, I think you're just going to make a lot of mistakes in driving that culture forward.

Yes, well said. I mean I even just saw you open that. That is the job. Like, and you know, I work with crescom, we're a global leadership development organization. And, and I mean this with love, but I'm often surprised when I hear people get kind of frustrated of the some of the challenges of leadership. Like this is what leadership it is. It is caring personally about your team members. And I know that sometimes you might feel like you are a grown up babysitter. I know that sometimes it gets very, very like tedious. But that is the rule. And if you lean into it, I swear you will find some beautiful upside with it. But you also have to accept that that is kind of what comes. It comes with the Territory of being a leader. Like, you're going to deal with stuff that you are like, why do I have to deal with this?

That is so true. It's so true.

You don't get to escape that. And I can empathize because. Yeah, I'm sure. So it is ridiculous that I'm like, oh, man. But that is also the rule and how can we make it better for everyone, knowing that in turn, they will work harder for you. And of course that engagement, engagement and everything will follow. Calling all managers and leaders. Enhance your skills and unlock your team's full potential with Crestcom's complementary leadership skills workshop. In just two hours, you'll gain actionable tactics to improve decision making, build trust and increase accountability. Leave with a personalized plan to address your biggest challenges and accelerate success. This workshop is a game changer for ambitious professionals committed to growth and being their best. Secure your spot by visiting crescom.com freeworkshop you know, getting into it, because I know you do a lot of work, your business is aligned around obviously creating better workplaces. So let's talk about the how. How do you do this? If you're a leader in organization, listening to this right now, how do you then, like, build a culture that people actually want to work in? What would be your recommendation for starts?

For sure. I think it's being very clear and intentional around it. I think there's many layers to this. So just, again, if life was easy and there were easy answers, everyone would be doing it. I'm sure we have a half hour. Exactly, exactly. But basically, I think it's about leadership, it's about culture, it's about accountability. It's about the values that you have. It's around using the right processes and also using the right technology and platforms. And this is where we come in as a business. But I'm not under no illusion to think that, oh, you use our platform, it's going to solve everything magically. It's part of it, right? It's part of driving deeper employee engagement. Giving people purpose and happiness by giving them clarity and goals and opportunity to learn the right skills. Those are all important. But it requires a lot more than that, honestly. It requires leadership to lean in. Having clarity around what you're trying to achieve, having clarity around how you measure people's use of the values. You gotta go around to these companies, every company, I'm sure you've seen this all the time, have values that they care about. Here are top five values and accountability and trust and get shit done and all Kinds of stuff. And then what I usually ask, well, how are you holding people accountable to them to make sure that they matter? I don't know. Did you kind of shrug your shoulders? You probably see that.

I don't know, you already see me rolling my eyes. I mean that with. I wish we actually had a way that we were accountable to our values. But so many companies just have the values and the values aren't really there to serve anything except for it's wall art if you're in the office.

Exactly.

On your employee intranet page.

That's right. That's right. And stuff you have to learn during your onboarding and you have to memorize. Jen, what are our top five values in our kid? When are we ever going to like? It's just mind boggling that you think that this is. If people think that this is going to change the game. But there is a way. If you're really serious about this, then you also have to hold people, I think, accountable to them. And this is why I think you have to change the way that we reward people. I think a big part of it. So I think we've come from a world where we reward people solely based on them reaching a goal. It doesn't really matter kind of how or the way you did it and so on. And I think oftentimes it leads to unhealthy behavior. And I think it leads to also even toxic environments. And I think it's because we haven't held people accountable to the standard of how you get there. And you see the new generation, that's not acceptable to them. They really care about the how as well, not just the why. Right. And so the how matters, but it only matters if you're actually holding people accountable and measuring. So the way I think of it is the way if you, if you have values, let's say you have five values, these are ideally things that you can control a hundred percent. Meaning your attitude, you're positive, you know, we're, we're get shit done. We trust each other, we collaborate. All this stuff. Yeah. These are all things that are in your control 100%. You know what's not in your control 100%? The outcome of the stuff that you end up doing. Like when, when you put out a great marketing campaign, can you guarantee that everyone's going to love it? No. When you put out that next amazing HR program, can you guarantee that everyone's going to love it? No. But you can do the best. And the more you show up with consistency in your values, the right attitude, positivity, optimism, working hard, all those things, all the things you can control, the more likely you are to hit the right outcomes that you want to the right goals. So for example, if a business wants to hit 100 million in revenue next year, well, if you show up, if you have a team that shows up every day with bad attitude, not the right data, not the right mindset, not the right values, do you think you're going to hit that 100 million? Maybe it's going to be fairly unlikely. But if you have a team who works their ass off, but they the right mindset, they collaborate, they work hard, they have their true to the values of the business, are you going to hit the hundred million still? Maybe not. But you're certainly going to be a lot closer because you have a solid plan and you're trusting each other and the process to get there. But my point is you should also reward and measure people not just based on the goal of hitting 100 million, but also how you got there. And until we start changing the culture of rewarding people based on the way they show up every day, the way they collaborate, the way they hold two to the values of the company, you're always going to end up in a situation where it's results at all costs. And that just leads to a lot of toxicity. I think a lot of the issues that we have in society today is because it's been growth at all costs. And doesn't matter the side effects we have of that growth. Just grow, grow, grow, grow. Oh, it's too bad that it's going to hurt a lot of people. We're just, we're growing, you know, Is that the world we want to live in? I don't think so.

And I think people are really, I mean, Generation Z is absolutely voting against that. I, as a speaker, I live in the burnout space and talking about it and you know, even the do more with less strategy that was so popular for the last 20 years that, oh, if you can have that innovative and creative mindset, you know, this is exciting because you have an opportunity to apply it. And underneath it, I think that guise of newness is maybe I'm not giving you the resources that you need. Maybe I'm not even staffing out your team like and it's burning people out and we needed to have a different way. And I love that. Just coming back down to what got you there, because it, it triggered to me the four agreements, which is always do your best and the best is all you can do so understanding the limitations of what we, you know, can do instead of penalizing people for what maybe didn't go. Because sometimes there are going to be factors outside of your control that contribute to whether or not you have an outcome or you achieve that outcome. But then at crescom, when we talk about feedback, we are like rewards. We often talk about what gets rewarded, gets repeated. And so if you take that time to give that feedback to people, you know, this is what you did. This was so great. Of course, then people have clarity going back to what you had said earlier, around what is expected of them. And we can do so much better because expectations are said and that's all people want.

That's right.

Like, I don't know if you have an answer back to that because I do want to talk about one other thing that you and I had talked about in the pre call, which I think is important too, like, which is addressing toxic personalities.

Well, I'll tell you, I mean, just to elaborate on what we just talked about, this is part of what, what our platform at Sensei does. So it's a part of our product. Every single week. It asks every employee four basic questions. Very, very simple. And it's meant to take a few minutes to answer these questions because it shouldn't be a big thing or else nobody will ever do it. Number one is on a scale of one to ten, how are you doing? And it gives you kind of an instant barometer as a manager to see how's my team doing? Number two, what did you achieve this week? Okay, so it gives me instant insight into what's going well and kind of what's not going so well. The third question is what blockers did you have? So you can instantly highlight those blocks in number four, which might even be the most important question, is what do you want to call out for helping you out and doing a great job? And so there's three powerful outcomes of those questions. Number one is it provides this deep self reflection where every Friday you're thinking to yourself, am I working on the right things? Because everyone gets super pissed when you get to Friday and you're like, man, I was busy, but I don't really know if I moved the ball forward on anything that matters. But I was really busy. Yay on me. Busyness is not an excuse for getting shit done, right? So we all know that. So it allows for this self reflection. Number two, it really gives you instant like, I would say closeness with your manager. So instead of like the assumption becoming a big issue and Then at the end of the quarter or every six months, maybe at the end of the year, you're doing like, hey, let's sit down, Jen, and talk about what you did.

Well.

And I can see it's the end. And you can turn leadership around to become much more of a servant leader. You can go to my team and say, hey, Thomas, I see you're struggling with this. What can I do to help? How can I help? What can I unblock for you? Do you need more resources? Can I take this off your plate? And it becomes a much friendlier conversation where we show we're in this together. And then the third part of it is this deep sense of belonging when you can see all the people calling you out and all the people you call out, which what most people do is they look at their. They open up their calendar, they see, what did I do this week? And then they start calling out people. We see this in the platform. It's like, it's so heartwarming. This person called out this person. And this person in Australia called out this person in Poland. I'm like, what a wonderful thing. And what it does is it makes every person aware of the fact that they're part of something bigger than themselves, that they do matter, they work, that they do matters, and people care for them. And that's irreplaceable. This feeling of belonging is irreplaceable.

Oh, my gosh, absolutely. Well, and I think it's. You're talking about too, like separating the person from the problem, getting people's ability to do that in their reflection. Like, it's not ending my work week being so frustrated at this particular person. It's understanding the action or the behavior that you were frustrated with, which I think is an essential ability. It's our emotional intelligence. We have to be able to. I understand that if we're giving feedback and asking for what we need. So I like that it breaks it down like that. And of course, no one takes time to think anymore, so you're actually building in time to reflect. I mean, I just love the call outs because too often we don't really think about. I mean, we might think we might say it, but we're not intentional always about that. And so I just appreciate the touch points that your product provides for people and then ultimately creating a lot belonging. Because, yeah, we spend the majority of our life at work. I want to feel like it matters. I don't need it to be a family, but I want to feel it matters in that my work meant Something. And these people care about me. Again, it's not about creating the family, because I know that's a trigger for some people to be like. It's like a family. It doesn't have to be that for everyone, but it does. I want you to. I want you to care about me. Robin, I've enjoyed our conversation. I know I'll have to have you back for other questions on what we need to address, but I know we need to wrap any final thoughts that you would share as it relates to our topic, creating a place that people actually want to work in and come into.

Yes. Yes. I really do. I mean, I'm so passionate about this because I think every person plays a part. They really do. And oftentimes I think it's just leaders who play a part. I don't. I don't think that's true at all. Of course, they might have a disproportionate impact on a culture, but everyone plays a part. And you can do something every day that changes the outcome and the culture around you and your team. You really can. It's the way you show up, the way you behave, the way you invest in the people around you and. And help them become better. Trust me, just. In all my years of leadership, it never goes unnoticed. It never does. So keep showing up. And I think. I think everyone really has a strong part to play.

Yes. Well, and I think it reminds me of one of my favorite quotes, what you just shared, which is every person you meet is both your teacher and your student. Like, you have something to share with them. They have something to teach you. All right, Robin, now we need to tell our audience how you can further help them to actually create a place that people want to come to. So how can our audience get in touch with you?

Well, this is a good question, because this is why we just changed the name of our company to Sensei, which is, of course, a play on the Japanese word sensei, which is both kind of a very respectful way of being a teacher, because we believe that everyone is both a teacher and a student at the same time. Right. So to your point, and we're very passionate about this, everyone is on a road to mastery, but you're never done. The road to mastery is never done. You never wake up one day and say, I'm done with this. You can always learn more, and you can always teach more. So that's why we named the company Sensei. So our. You can just go to our website, sensai.comseti n.com or you can find me on LinkedIn. Robin Daniels I'm happy to connect and answer any questions. I'm always available.

You need to come. He is speaking around. I mean, I love it. You are truly committed to your purpose of making workplaces better and caring personally about the individuals. Follow Robin, check out their work. I think that you'll be very, very happy for it. Robin, thank you so much for taking the time to be in the Leadership Habit. I really enjoyed meeting you and I enjoyed our conversation.

Me too, Jen.

Thank you, thank you. Thank you for listening to this week's episode of the Leadership Habit podcast. Robin was such a great guest. So animated. I love the considerations about really. Again, coming back to the basics, are you aware of the purpose or can you give people purpose and meaningful work? Paint to them the track and how they'll grow and evolve. And of course, creating in a community a sense of belonging where all can thrive. That's all we want. At the end of the day. Sometimes we complain. So I hope that you enjoy that. Connect with Robin, get to know a little bit more about Sensei. I think you'll be happier for it. And of course, Crescom, we are focused, committed and all we do is practice leadership development, giving leaders the tools that they need to manage feedback, have difficult conversations, even make decisions. We've got you and we would love the opportunity to to connect and help you develop yourself and your team. Head on over to crestfab.com there you can request a complimentary leadership skills workshop where you can invite everyone on your team or others to be able to work together and come for this unique experience to develop themselves. So give us that opportunity. Or of course, ask for a brochure and you can find out about the 24 unique topics that we cover through our Robust Leadership Development Development program. And finally, if you know someone that could benefit from hearing this message, share it with them. And don't forget to leave us a review on your favorite podcast streaming platform. Thank you so much for listening. We appreciate your time. Go out and make it a great one.