18 CX Ryan Spence – Coach/Author: Losing yourself to find yourself

You're listening to the Corporate Expat Experience. Hello, everyone. Welcome back. Today I am going to introduce you to a guest that I met last year. I was in a course and we were in a hot seat session and this gentleman came on, he was in the hot seat. He shared a bit about his background and experience and right away I knew that he needed to be on the podcast. The podcast was still in development, we were still trying to sort everything out. But Ryan was the first person I think I actually that I didn't know that I reached out to and said, please be a guest on my podcast when it comes out. I don't know when, but stay with me. And he has. And so I'm thrilled to have Ryan Spence with me today on the podcast. Welcome, Ryan. Thank you for joining us, Cole.

Thank you for having me. Yes, I remember that hot seat very well. And then, yeah, it got us to connect. So it was standing up there was a bit nerve wracking. But I'm glad I did. Made some great connections.

You did a great job on it and I was so inspired by your story and definitely excited to have you on today. So, Ryan, please introduce yourself to our audience.

Great. So yeah, I'm Ryan Spence. I'm a former big law lawyer, so. So all that means is I was a lawyer in one of the big international law firms for 11 years. Still sounds a very long time when I say that, at the same firm. And I started off in London, as you can probably hear, I'm from the UK and moved out to Singapore in 2014. Always wanted to go to Asia, had spent some time in Asia post law school and jumped at the chance to go and live somewhere where the sun shined every day, which it doesn't always do that in London. So it was fantastic. Love the lifestyle, made some great friends and even the work I enjoyed initially. But anyone who's been in that sort of environment, as I'm sure a lot of your listeners have, knows that being in big law, being in a big corporate organization can be very demanding. You can sacrifice a lot. And when you're single or when you don't have any responsibilities, that's a little bit easier to take. You kind of look at it as part of the, part of the work that you put in to kind of build this big career. Everyone tells you that you should want to, but around the time of having my first child, I started to question, is this really what I want to do? I would kind of look around and look at the ladder and think, do I actually Want that life, that life of a partner in a big firm? Do I kind of want to be doing those hours, being away from the family, not knowing if I'm going to have a weekend, if I'm going to have a holiday? And initially I told that voice to shut up and be quiet because what else am I going to do? This is what I'm trained for. This is what I'm doing, meant to be doing. I got a good salary, I'm successful from the outside. And that voice just kept talking to me. It kept getting louder each. Each month, each year. Second child came along, still talking to me, and started to speak to other law firms. And that still didn't feel right. It wasn't really the environment that was, that was wrong. It was the whole, the whole industry. The whole thing just wasn't right for me. But I just didn't know what I was going to do, which I'm guessing that a lot of your listeners can relate to. You don't want to do what you're doing, but you don't know what it is that you want to do.

Absolutely, absolutely. So what kind of made you feel like or decide to make that leap to do something different?

So I think for a lot of people there's that trigger point. There's that thing that happens that is just the final straw. And for me, it was Christmas 2018. We were on a family holiday to Bali, which is one of my most favorite places in the world, and we booked this amazing villa with some friends. We'd arrived at Bali airport, got in our minivan, heading to the villa, all in that holiday feeling. And you're never too far away from your emails when you're a lawyer. So turned on the phone, emails came in and a client said a deal that had been dead was now back on the other side, wanted to close it by the end of the year. And it didn't take much mental calculation to realize that that meant I was going to be working on this holiday and over Christmas. So this amazing villa, we had a spare room in the villa, which I spent a lot of time in on calls, writing emails, drafting documents. And even though, yes, we were in paradise and we did have a good holiday, in my mind I was always thinking about work. What have I got to do next? What's going to happen tonight? What's the response going to be? So there wasn't that switch off that a vacation is supposed to be. And this wasn't the first time. I think every single holiday over the seven years I was in Singapore, apart from when I got married, when I was allowed to turn my phone off for two weeks, I worked. But there was just something about this one that made it different. You know, I was there with my two kids, we were there with friends. And I just said to myself on the plane back, I need to do something else, I need to get out, I can't do this anymore. But I didn't know what. And I think the thing that was stopping me from figuring out the what was limiting beliefs. I just felt that all I could do was law. So even though I knew I wanted to get out, everything that I thought about doing instead was still law related, although not in private practice, was still related to the industry that I was in. I just couldn't see, see past that. So that's, that was the trigger point, but that wasn't the point I got out. Still took me another two years, just over two years, really, to actually leave.

Oh, wow. So two years. So what did you do during that time? How did you figure things out and how did you plan to leave?

So planning to leave is not really what I did. And it's not, whatever, not what I would recommend. But what I'm good at is that I decide to do something. I tend to go all in. And for me, that trigger point was one thing. So then it's like I needed to. I needed to shake things up. I talk about living a life of lethargy and that's very much what I had been in. I was in this life where I was going through the motions. I didn't really have enthusiasm for what I was doing, but I was good at it and I could do it and I was expected to do it. So I just did it. But I didn't have that sense of excitement, that thing where you wake up in the morning excited to get on with your day and to achieve something. So I tried to create that. And what I did first of all was set myself a challenge in January 2019. Didn't know what it was going to be until I found it. And one afternoon, just aimlessly scrolling through the Internet, I found a white collar boxing match that was going to be coming up in Singapore. So I applied to join the squad, um, and thought nothing of it. And then they invited me to an open evening, went to that, yeah, it's fine. But looked around, there's a lot of people, it's like, yeah, I won't get it, it's fine. Then they told me I'd got in and it was like, oh, okay. It's like, okay, I'm a pretty fit guy, it's fine, I can do this. And got to the end of the first week of training. We had three training sessions that week, two hours each evening. And I was just like, yeah, I'm not fair. There's no way I'm going to be able to do this. So I hired myself a trainer and just really threw myself into the process. And for me, that was a real turning point, to have something where I was really committed mentally, physically. It changed everything about me. And through that process, I continued boxing. It brought me back to my yoga practice, which I had used to do before. And then through the yoga practice, that kind of got me back into my head to kind of stop thinking about myself and what I wanted to do. And I went on a yoga retreat. And so it just started this whole chain of events. And so what it was, it's a process of slowly changing myself, which then sort of led to me changing my mind, which then led to me opening up to other opportunities and looking at things differently. And then the end of that year, there was the chance to go to London for work. I knew that there were potentially going to be layoffs at the firm, and so I jumped at the chance to go to London, see some friends, do something a bit different. Got talking to an old friend, an old colleague who was a coach, and she suggested coaching might help. So I said, fine. And through speaking to her, based upon the work I'd already done, I decided that, yeah, I wasn't even going to speak to other firms. I was going to go back, I was going to take the opportunity to be laid off and I was going to run with it and try and help people who'd been in the position that I was in to not. To not feel stuck, to feel that they had a way out. I didn't know how, I just knew what. And that's what I would like to share, is that once you know what, you just got to trust that you can figure out, how are you going to do it?

Wow, that is so amazing. Such a journey. And it is crazy how something starts just with, ok, I want to do something different, I need something to pique my interest. I've kind of been languishing and how that sets off that chain of events, right, to get you to that next level, to get you out of that place. So let's talk about that after you left, how did. How did things start to evolve?

So I walked out on 28th February 2020. So the pandemic was still early. It hadn't really sort of rippled around the world yet. And the plan was that I was going to do my yoga teacher training. I'd really got back into my practice. It really helped me throughout law to kind of balance out my stress, to remain grounded, to, to look inward. And I wanted to share that that's how I was going to help other people in corporate is through teaching them yoga and bringing them to the mat. And then the pandemic happened, so my training got postponed. Our plans to leave Singapore to come back to the UK got postponed, as did my planned month in Bali as well, which I'm still very disappointed about. But it was great. I just loved the fact that I was no longer tied to going to a law firm every day. And suddenly I had all of this time to just learn new things. And I discovered this whole world of online business and this whole world of online courses and online education. And I just consumed as much as I could along the way. Finally got to do my teacher training in the July, started teaching, loved it, and started a podcast and speaking to people in corporate who got to a stage where they were burnt out or unhappy and had used yoga to get them out of that situation. And that got people sort of reaching out to me and sort of saying, oh, I mean, this really helped me and oh, maybe you should coach, or could you speak to my friend who is in this role and they're not really happy and don't really know what to do. And I never plan to be a coach. I never really wanted to coach, I just wanted to teach yoga. But the more that I had these conversations, the more that I enjoyed them and the more that I saw the people I was speaking to get really energized through them and start to sort of make shifts in their own life. I just thought, well, okay, I know I said I wanted to do this, that's the what, but the how is fluid. Let me try this, let me just figure out what I had to do to get from there to here and share that with people. And that's what I did. I started coaching a couple of people in Singapore and they had really good transformations out of it, really enjoyed the experience, then moved back to the UK and set up the business here and decided that actually coaching was, was going to be it. I would still teach yoga, but coaching was going to be the main thrust. That was the way that I felt I could best help the people who I wanted to help.

I love that. So as you're coaching people, you're Helping people kind of get unstuck, right? And if they're in, say, corporate world, their employees, they're kind of stuck in their life, their jobs, their careers. It's so interesting because you can go about it so many different ways. And I see that with you. One is the body experience with the yoga, but also then the mind and that body. Mind connection.

Exactly.

So powerful. So powerful. So as you've started this business and you're doing this, and you did it through a pandemic too, which is really amazing. I think there's always lessons or things that we said, oh, I wish I had done this earlier. As an entrepreneur, what are some things that you wish you had known or done earlier?

I think you mentioned earlier about plan. I said I didn't have one. I knew for a long time that I didn't want to do law. I didn't know what I wanted to do instead. But instead of trying to figure that out, I think I spent too long just languishing in that lethargy and not really making a plan, not really sort of trying things out and not really working on my mindset. And I think that's the biggest thing for me is anyone who's sort of thinking that they want to leave a corporate role, particularly if you've been in it for a while. I think working on your mindset is one of the best things that you can do. The best things that you can start with, because entrepreneurship is probably the biggest personal development journey that you will go on. So many things will come up that you thought were long forgotten or long buried inside of you, and you need to be able to manage your mind to get through them. So I think if I was back in this situation that I was in, first thing I would have done is start working on my mindset from the outset, start to kind of really get into the frame of mind that I can do anything. Because once you feel deep and believe that you can do anything, you will start to try things. And that's accepting that you're going to be pretty bad at things as well. You know, I mean, you're going to try things and you're going to be bad at them, and that's okay. You're supposed to be. Because that's the only way that you're going to learn. You're going to figure out what you like and what you don't like. I think so many people can get fixated on wanting to do a particular thing, and then they get to do that thing and realize they hate it, whereas if they just tried it out before, before they'd done the big elaborate plan and business plan and logos and websites and all of that stuff, they would have been like, okay, I don't really like this bit of it, but I like this bit, so maybe I'll pivot here. So I think mindset, and then just trusting that you can figure it out as you go along.

Mindset is so important. And you and I both know that. We've talked about this. And I think, too, it pulls you through those times when you are going to fail. I mean, the failures are inevitable. They're just steps to learning, right? Steps to the next level. And thinking about how also in your journey things transitioned. You thought you were going to be doing one thing, and it's morphed into something very different. Having that mindset in the beginning, I'm sure has helped you through that journey, because I think a lot of times I see people get so fixed on, well, I plan to be a yoga teacher, and it's not working out, so I'm done. And they just throw their hands up in the air and they quit, and that's it for them. But I think, as you were saying, having that mindset of being willing and open to trying new things, super important as an entrepreneur.

Oh, without a doubt. Because the good thing about being an entrepreneur is autonomy, and there are no rules. But that can also be a bad thing as well, because you're used to having rules in the corporate world. So when you don't have rules, I think it goes one of two ways. Either you're suddenly so happy you don't have rules that you just lounge around all day and do nothing, or you take that corporate state of mind with you and you apply it to entrepreneurship. And then you've kind of left one thing and gone into the same thing. But now you don't have any of the benefits of being in corporate, but you have all the downsides, you know, I mean, you're trying to make yourself fit into this way of doing things, and I think that you have to be prepared to be wrong. You have to be prepared to fail and fail quite publicly as well. And then you have to be prepared to get back up and go again, because that's the only way that you can succeed. And you also have to know what it is that you're working for. What does success look like for you? Because I think when we were in the corner, corporate world, success is the next promotion, the next salary raise. You know, I mean, it's the next speaking Engagement in front of the board, whatever it is in your particular world, that's what success is driven to be. But is that success for you? Because when you move into entrepreneurship with a lot of people, it is because they have a particular passion and they have a particular idea of how they want to live. But so many people then get caught up in still living that same life and burning themselves out. So what I would suggest is think about what you want your life to be. What I do is I plan my calendar. So you kind of look and say, okay, what do I want my calendar to look like in say, a year's time? You know what I mean? What time do I want to get up? Where do I want to get up? What's the view that I want to have? What do I want to have for breakfast? Who do I want to be with? Start to kind of really work through that. Because once you know what your working towards, once you, once you've got clarity on what it is that you want and why you want it, the decisions that you make day to day become easier because you make the decisions that will support that vision of the life is that you want.

Oh, that is so good. That's something you touch on in your upcoming book, isn't it?

It is indeed. Yes, I do, I do have a book. It's. The book's called the Triple C Method and the subline is to gain clarity, boost confidence, and build courage so you can live life lit. And yes, the three Cs are the three pillars that I feel, looking back in hindsight, I really needed to solidify in order to get from where I was to where I am now. I don't just mean physically, I mean mentally. To know exactly what it is that I want to do, why I want to do it, and also know who I am, what my values are to then believe that I can achieve the things that it is that I want to achieve. So that's where the confidence piece comes in. And then to have the courage to take action, to just go after it without having all the answers, without having an elaborate plan, without having all the pieces that I need to just take action, try things, figure them out. And so that's what the book is for really is to get people into that mindset, to inspire them to see that actually I can do anything, but to then also give them some real tangible action steps that they can take to so journal prompts and questions they can ask themselves that will start to get them into that mindset of this is what I want to do. And these are the steps I'm going to take to do it. I don't want people to read the book, think it's really nice and inspiring, and then put it back on themselves. I want them to read the book, get the workbook that goes along with it, do the exercises, and keep coming back to it as they kind of start leveling up and start doing something a little bit different. Maybe it starts as an idea, then it becomes a side hustle, then it becomes. Then it becomes something that they think I want to do as a main hustle and start to make those steps. It's something that they can continually refer back to, to kind of help them on that process.

And it sounds like it's something that can help with other aspects of life too. Not just your career, but also if you're trying to, you know, become more fit, or if you're trying to have better relationships, it sounds like that your book can help in those ways too. And it's something you can revisit time and time again, but also for different situations.

Oh, exactly. I think the thing about entrepreneurship is it is business in a sense. But as I said, because it is the biggest personal development journey you will go on, it does impact the rest of your life. Because there's that saying that the way you do one thing is the way that you do everything. And so if you approach your business in a way that is. That is joyful in a way where you feel lit up or you feel excited, where you make decisions that support you, you're going to approach other areas of your life with that. When you see that taking those small, consistent actions each day in your business can really garner huge results, you realize that, well, if you want to get fit, if you want to train for a particular sporting event, if you want to have a particular sort of diet, whatever it is, you've got to take those small actions each day. There's no point waking up one day and going out on a 10k run if you've never run before. It takes a lot of work, 1k runs, or even 500 meter runs or lesser to get to that 10k run, right? Business, in life, in relationships, it's all about those small steps that kind of lead you to the bigger goal. So, yeah, the book will definitely help you in all aspects. I think initially, I expect people will come to it because they want to be corporate expats. They're thinking about that. But I think that as they get deeper into it and start to do the work for themselves, they will Realize that actually I can apply this to this area of my life as well and it will kind of take on a bigger meaning for them.

Oh, I can't wait for the book to come out. And I'll make sure to have it, the link of it when it's available in the show notes so everybody can grab a copy of it for sure. And you know, I'm thinking about kind of shifting gears a little bit, but thinking about things that we might miss from the corporate world. I mean we're on this entrepreneurial journey. We love it. There's so many things, amazing learning experiences. Are there some things though that you kind of miss from big law? From the corporate world?

I miss my colleagues, I mean the people around my level, other associates. I used to love when, I mean you'd go in a day and someone would come into your office and I mean they would say, can I shut the door? And they'd shut the door. And you knew if they were shutting the door that there'd be something coming up that they wanted to talk about. And I miss those interactions. And fortunately I've managed to sort of maintain pretty good relationships with most of the people that I worked with. But it's not the same as just sort of bumping into somebody and grabbing a coffee. So I do miss that. I think that as much as, as entrepreneurs, we love the freedom of that we can now generate wealth. There is no ceiling on what we can earn. And that's the beauty of it, that there is this sort of just vast expanse of opportunity. I think we'd all be lying if we didn't say that at the beginning that regular paycheck and the benefits that come along with it, you know, I mean, particularly when I was still in Singapore where, I mean, private health care is a thing and all of that, in the beginning there was a little bit like, okay, that isn't here anymore, I need to do something about that. But that can all be replaced. But I think, yeah, the sort of people and those sort of day to day connections and yeah, in the early stages, the sort of benefits and the salary. But in the grand scheme of things, I don't miss it all.

So how have you kind of filled that up? That mess about not having the colleagues around and kind of the little conversations in the office, I mean most of us are not in offices anymore with the current situation. But have you found a way to kind of fill that, that mess up?

Yeah. And I think that for all the problems with the, with the pandemic, one of the Things to come out of that is that people are so much more open to connecting online. So I've made a lot of connections from all over the world online, which has been great. And you just arrange like a virtual coffee chat with somebody and people are open to that. And it's been really good to have that situation where you are actually having proper life conversations with people. Not the spontaneous ones that you would have in the office, necessarily, but still, they're still useful to have. And what I found in terms of a business sense, towards the end of 2021, what I missed was not having other entrepreneurs to talk to, to. To kind of have those conversations with. And so I basically looked around and end up joining a mastermind with. With other coaches, which has just been fantastic. It's kind of really expanded my mind, both as a. As an entrepreneur and as a coach. And so that's been amazingly helpful. And yeah, just finding those communities as well online that, that have people who think like you do and who can show you what's possible and who you can learn from and who you can support and they can support you. So it does require you to get out of your comfort. I'm very much an introvert. I'm very much the guy who would be on the WhatsApp group and, or in a Facebook group. And we just look, you know that that was me a couple of years ago, and whereas now I've had to be a lot more proactive. But what I found is that people want to help. I mean, like, people like talking to you. People like to talk to people who are doing good things or who are interesting people. I do. So why wouldn't other people. And so if you actually go out and make the ask, I mean, it's very unlikely that someone's going to completely turn you down. So, yeah, you've got to find your squad. You've got to find your people who are going to be there to support you and be around when you need it, because it can be a lonely existence. But if you can make the effort to do that, then you'll be fine, whether that's in real life or virtually.

Well, and that's how we did. I mean, I stepped out of my comfort zone. I was like, let me just see, let me see, let me ask. Because as my grandfather used to always say, if you don't ask, the answer is always no. So I said, let me ask Ryan and see if he would be interested when I launched this podcast. I'm so grateful that you did, and I'm So grateful that we connected. And that's one of the things that I love about being an entrepreneur, is I'm getting to meet amazing people who inspire me every day. Like you. You kind of touched on it a little bit. The things that you love about being an entrepreneur, I mean, this unlimited cap on what we can earn and what we can make. Is there something else, too, that you love about being an entrepreneur?

I think there's one word that I would use, would be autonomy, and that kind of covers a span of things. I realized when I was in big law, looking back, that I'd lost part of myself. I had this whole sort of creative side to me that didn't really show itself. And when I left, suddenly it starts to come out of me. And what I liked about entrepreneurship is that if I have an idea, I can execute on it and do it. Now, I haven't got to ask anybody's permission. I haven't got to run it by any people. There's no committee. I just do it. And it may work, it may not work, but it doesn't matter. You get that instant feedback because you're not wading through sort of realms and realms of bureaucracy to kind of get things done. Same with your day. You get up, you set your agenda for the day. If you decide that you don't want to take any calls before midday, you can do that. If you decide you want to go to the gym in the morning for two hours, you can do that. You know, if you decide you're on a client call and actually you're fine, you've got some spare time, you want to spend longer with that client, you can do that. All the decisions are yours. And that can be a little bit daunting in the beginning because we're so used to incorporate. Even as you get more senior, there's always somebody else who has the same what you do or how you do it. And that does stifle you a little bit. But certainly in entrepreneurship, there is none of that. And it's kind of a little bit like being a kid in the candy store. You know, you can either eat all the candy and be sick, or you can kind of like, I can have all of this candy, but I'm going to sort of take my time, and I'm going to have a little bit this today and a little bit of that tomorrow. And, you know, and so it's entirely up to you. It's choose your own adventure.

That's so good. I love that. So, Ryan, this has been great, and I Would love just some final advice for anyone who is kind of sitting there unhappy in their corporate job and they're thinking about, they don't know what they want to do, kind of like where you were at, but they want to do something different. They're just not sure what. Give some final advice for them.

Sure. So I think me, I always say clarity is key. So the first thing I would do is figure out what your values are. It sounds like. I mean, we all think we know what know our values are. We talk about values a lot, but actually values are quite expensive. There are a lot of values out there, and different things are important to different people at different times as well. So particularly if you've been in a role for a while, you may find that you've got subsumed into how that role is done and doing things particular way that the organization wants you to do them. You may have lost part of who you are, which is what happened to me. So I think going back to the beginning and sort of doing that assessment as to what your values are, getting your top three so you're not overwhelmed, and then start to ask yourself, all the decisions that I'm making each day in alignment with those, you know, decisions in your job, decisions in your life and your relationships, and not to beat yourself up, but just to try and get a sense as to where they are. And if they're not, then you need to start to think about what would allow me, what life would I need to be living, who would I need to become to be doing things and making decisions that are in alignment with those values. There's a whole host of things that you could do, but I think if you start with that, those values are what's going to guide you to the next steps.

I love that. That is so powerful, and it's such good advice. And I think it's something too, that we can revisit more often. Right. So do it initially, but come back to it half year, every quarter, every year, and make sure that you're living a life in alignment with those values, those things that are important to you.

Yeah. Because as we. As we grow, we change, and we need to continuously revisit. I think that this is the. This is the reason why I still have coach and will always have a coach, because as I level up, things change, and I keep leveling up, things change, and I need help with similar things. So that's. That's kind of what it is. As you keep leveling it up, as you keep growing, as you keep getting to another level of your business, of your life, of your personal development, Things that you thought you had dealt with are going to come up again. So for me, things like confidence, you know, when I was decided to write a book, I just thought, okay, I've got my confidence, I've got belief in myself. I know what I can do. But then the questions come in. Who's going to want to hear what you have to say? Why do you think you can write a book? You can't be an author. All of those sort of questions from you in a critic because you're. You're pushing yourself further than you pushed yourself before. So if you've done the foundational mindset work, then you can tap back into those tools and strategies to help you as you get up. So I think that you just got to keep doing the work. Don't ever think that you can just relax where you are, that I'm fine now, everything is great. You've just got to keep working at it, keep moving and keep going.

That personal development is so important. And I can relate to what you were just saying, because as you know, I'm writing a book as well, and that imposter syndrome, you know, pops up. Who am I to write this? Are people going to listen to this? And it's just, keep going, keep going, because somebody is going to hear a story, Somebody's going to hear your words, and they're going to be inspired. It's going to make a difference. I know your story has inspired me, and I know it's inspiring to our listeners. So thank you so much, Ryan, for sharing. I really appreciate it.

Thank you. Thanks for having me here. It's. It's been great having this conversation. And I think, yeah, just to touch on what you said, the way that I sort of switched that whole imposter thing is I started to look at who needs to hear what I have to say, and I started to sort of frame it on that person. I call it service putting service over ego. So instead of worrying about my embarrassment, how am I going to feel? How's it going to affect me? I started to think about, how is it going to affect that person who I'm speaking to, who really needs to hear this right now. And it just made it a lot easier to then just do it, because then it's not about me. It's all about the good of somebody else.

Service over ego. I love that. I'm going to write that one down. You're going to be quoted very soon. That's such a Good one. So powerful. I love that. Well again thank you Ryan. And where can people find you? Because I know my listeners are going to want to connect with you. So where can people find you?

Sure. So Instagram is my playground as I call it. I'm always on there doing some something or other so that I'm at I amryanspence on Instagram so find me there. DM me say hi. Also got a website so im ryan spence.com and you can learn a bit more about my story on there. Also learn about how to work with me. And if you need some help with your confidence, if you are thinking of leveling up to do something you haven't done before, I have a free confidence journal you can download from there and that has six journal prompts which I use again when I'm getting to those moments where I'm like, ah, my inner critic is telling me I can't do this. Like I'm not really sure if I can achieve what I want to achieve. I can kind of work through those prompts to kind of just get that evidence down on paper and kind of get my head in the game so I can really push forward. So yeah, that's available there too.

You definitely need to get that. I have used it Ryan, and it has been very helpful, especially you know, as I'm writing this book and doing some different things. It's it's been very powerful to be able to use those prompts and kind of work through some stuff. So thank you for sharing that with me and with the audience. Definitely you want to do that. So be sure to go to iamrianspence.com and I will also have details in the show notes with the link with your Instagram. And when your book comes out, we'll have the link for that as well too. Again, Brian, thank you so much. I really appreciate you being here on the Corporate Expat Experience.

Thank you Nicole. Appreciate it.

Thank you for joining and we will see you on the next episode. Bye for now. Thank you for listening and if you enjoyed this episode and would like to help subscribe support this podcast, please hit subscribe, leave a rating and review, share it with others or post about it on social media for show notes, links to connect with guests and more. Visit us at corporate-expat.com and be sure to catch the next episode with more insights and inspiration to support your corporate expat experience. Bye for now.