Sara Riad - Nothing Is Linear

When in our lives have we ever slowed down this much and appreciated, oh, we can go for a walk in the fresh air. You know, when in our lives have we just stopped and spent that much time with family and connecting with family and getting to know family. So it's, I would say it's been a blessing. And the fact that I have friends all over the world, you connect with these people and you're like, oh, how are you? Like, what's happening for you? And you get to hear, I've gotten so much closer to a lot of people that I used to know that I now know very well just because of this virus.

Welcome to the Yoga Den. Are you a stressed out cog in the corporate wheel? Do you find yourself asking, what am I doing or why am I doing it? Then the Yoga Den is the place for you. I'm your host, Ryan Spence, AKA the big law dropout, writer, yoga teacher, and your guide on the path to well being through yoga. Yoga helped me find my purpose, change my mindset and my life. And in this podcast, I'll share how to live a life of intention. No reaction. Each week I'll be talking to a variety of guests, covering pearls of wisdom to help you figure out where you're heading to, where you really want to go. I won't find your purpose for you, but I'll help you plan the route. So sit back and grab a drink. I've been expecting you. Hello and welcome to episode four of the Yoga Den podcast. This week's guest is another corporate escapee, someone else who's made the switch from the corporate world to the yoga world. Sarah Riyadh is an ex corporate events planner turned yoga teacher. Originally from Egypt, Sarah is now based in Singapore and in a short time has built up a regular following of students online, teaching multiple classes a week to students from all around the world. This week's episode could have been two, even three times the length. We had so much to talk about and we got deep into some issues. Some of the things we discussed were how yoga teacher training transformed Sarah's life, her mission, and her passion to empower women through yoga, particularly women going through pregnancy and post pregnancy, and how taking a step out of the corporate world took her step closer to her purpose. I really hope this episode resonates with you as much as it did with me, but for now, grab your headphones, grab a drink and let's do this. Sarah, welcome to the Yoga Den.

Hello.

How are you doing?

I'm fantastic. Thrilled to be here today.

Excellent. Very good. To have you here to give the listeners a bit of context, because that's what I seem to have been doing on the last few episodes. We met during our yoga teacher training, which I think will both agree was a life changing experience. That whole training.

Absolutely.

Yeah. And you basically straight out of the gate are out teaching. See you over Instagram. You're teaching internationally. Tell me about that.

Oh, wow. I left the yoga teacher training and I did my prenatal postpartum right after that. And then I got straight into teaching online because I couldn't find a studio job.

Yeah.

And it's been fascinating. I'm reaching people who are friends and family who are coming, they're coming back and they're asking like, how do we join your next class? And so on and so forth, which has been fascinating and so exciting. And the more I'm teaching, the more I'm reaping the benefits myself. Not financially, but just like the. The passion is coming to me.

Yeah.

The longer I teach. Does that make sense?

Makes perfect sense. I think for me I found the same. It's that whole. The energy you get from teaching, from leaving a class where the students are happy and satisfied. It's. Yeah, it's. It's quite unlike. Unlike anything you think about beforehand, Right?

Absolutely. And the thing is that most days I'm like, oh my God, I need to teach. I'm so nervous. What do I do? What's my sequence? How do I teach this? How do I change it up? And then walking out of that class, I'm like, okay, I know what I did wrong, but at the same time, I feel amazing. And the questions I'm getting from people and like, oh, this hurts, this shouldn't hurt, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, okay, let me have a conversation with you. And either we talk, like separately, or I wait for everybody to drop out from the zoom call so I can address the questions one on one so that there's no. Some sort of embarrassment to say, yeah, cool.

I think it's good. I mean, I was speaking to somebody earlier about teacher training and Blair, use our teacher's words from the beginning. He needs to get out and teach. Like, this is all about getting you ready to teach. So, yeah, it's great that you and many of our other classmates are already out there teaching as well. Just to kind of. You learn by teaching. I guess you learn more yourself.

I agree. 100. And every time I teach a class, I have to say I take something away from that. A learning experience for myself or a Piece of feedback that somebody just gives me and it rings a bell, it makes sense and sometimes it hits a very sweet spot where, you know, you need to improve on one thing and, and when somebody says it to you, it means, okay, wow, it means a lot.

Yeah. Because that's the thing. You need real people to give you feedback. Right. We can all sort of read the books and practice on our own at home, but when you've got real students in front of you with real bodies, that feedback matters. And that's what's going to help you grow as a teacher.

Yep. Yeah, absolutely.

So taking a slight step back, like me, you are a corporate escapee. So you used to be in the, in the corporate world and then yoga stole you away. So like it has for so many of us. So do you want to talk a bit about that, what you were doing and kind of what brought you to yoga?

Sure. It's tore me away in a very graceful sense, actually. I used to. Well, I studied hospitality in the U.S. i worked there for a bit, which I had a blast in, and then moved to Egypt, to Cairo, where I'm from, and started working for the hospitality industry there and then moved to Singapore. And something was just not right. I was seeking something, but what I was seeking was not, I wasn't finding.

Okay.

Until I found yoga, what, five years ago, I would say. And somewhere during one Shavasana I was like, okay, this is what I need to be doing forever. It was one Shavasana, it was a tiny, tiny studio in Cairo, Egypt.

Okay.

And it just clicked. And I knew deep inside me that I needed to be a yoga teacher. I didn't know how, I didn't know when. I didn't have like any clear direction as to where I would go and how I would get there. Because it was so, so far fetched at the time. Being attending a yoga teacher training is super expensive.

Yeah.

And I couldn't afford it. I always wanted to do it, but I couldn't afford it and I didn't have the time working my corporate jobs. And then when I finally moved to Singapore, got in the corporate world. And then I've been thinking, every time I apply for wine, something happens. I like to believe it's my persistence and my, my partner's support is what made it happen eventually. Because no, you don't give up. If this is what you want to do, you keep pursuing it. And here I am.

Yeah. Follow your dreams. Definitely. It's that persistence and that discipline to kind of get you to where, where you think you need to be and where you want to go. So what was it about the corporate world that led you to yoga? Or why did you leave the corporate world and sort of get on this path that you're on now?

So I. It's a bunch of things. It's really a bunch of things. And I was always trying to find what it is that I'm destined to do and, you know, soul searching, whatever you call it. And I try to. To do the things that I love, but the more they don't make sense, the more they're causing me a lot of issues. Um, I've been in the corporate world not as long as you, for sure, but I reached a point where I am showing physical symptoms.

Okay.

As. Okay, I. I am not feeling it today. And as a woman who is cyclical, not every day is the same. So to expect me to go to work and perform the same exact way every single day is actually impossible. But a lot of women don't know that. A lot of the world doesn't know that. And the more I push myself, the more it made me feel worse. So physically, mentally, emotionally, I was just not feeling that I am who I am. And I lost my father two years ago, September, two years ago. And I had stopped yoga a couple months before he got sick.

Okay.

I was. I was doing yoga religiously. A few months before he got sick, I stopped yoga. I was distracted by a bunch of other things. And then after his passing, I was also distracted by my emotions until I was led back to yoga slowly. And that's what healed me. I mean, I. There's nothing easy about losing a father, but at the same time, finding yoga again led me back to myself and to try to discover how to heal myself from the pain that I was living every single day, essentially.

Wow. It's a. It's a common theme, I think, for people who go on to deepen their practice and maybe even teach that yoga hasn't necessarily always been a constant. It's been there, and then it's gone away. And it's been there, it's gone away. But this is normally a point where there is some. Some sort of trauma or tragic loss or something, maybe not as serious, but. But still quite grave, where. What brings them back to it? Yoga just seems to kind of like once it's got a hold of you, it kind of seems to keep pulling you back. And it sounds like that's what's happened to you. I mean, it's definitely what happened to me as well. So, yeah, yoga is A healing power is a powerful thing. It really, truly is. And what is quite nice about that is that it's obviously you saw it that way for yourself and it's what you want to give to the people that you're teaching. Do you think that's what is leading you down the route that you're going down in terms of the sort of women through pregnancy and post pregnancy?

Well, to back up a little bit and to address your point about yoga is healing and whatever. Amber Sawyer, my teacher, said that yoga meets you exactly where you are and exactly when you need. Just walks into your life, transforms you in a way that is unimaginable. And a lot of people don't understand it until. Until they actually experience it. You hear about yoga and the studies of yoga and the physical movement and the mindfulness behind it, but you don't really get to experience it until you've actually started doing it.

Yeah.

So, yeah, I fell off the wagon for a while and slowly when I started to pick it up again, it was bringing me closer to who I am and it was making people's lives around me much better. Like the people are I surround myself with.

Yeah.

It was improving their lives as well in a way that is incredible. And I cannot say how and why I entered into the prenatal postpartum world. I knew I wanted to, but I still can't pinpoint what it is that brought me to it.

Okay.

Um. I have to admit that during the training, Blair's training, when Amber walked in and gave us a two hour workshop, I was blown away.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And the next two days I was like, how do I make it work? How do I take time off work? How do my. How do I make it work to just attend her training? I made it work. I signed up, I registered, and. And here I am today again. And the more I teach prenatal, the more I am blown away. Every single class. I just feel amazing just being able to communicate something that helps people, especially during the most vulnerable time. It is not a vulnerable time. Pregnancy is a powerful, powerful, powerful thing. But a lot of our societies and our culture has deemed it vulnerable, which is not the case. I feel so strongly about that. It's not the case. A pregnant woman is so powerful and they more. The more they get empowered. It's just beautiful to witness, beautiful to observe.

Yeah. I think that there is this notion in the Western world, I think mainly that pregnancy is. It's kind of almost like an illness and that a woman who's pregnant is quite Delicate and needs to be taken care of. Whereas when you contrast that to other parts of the world and see what women who are pregnant, what they do, like how they carry themselves and what they're doing right up until they give birth and how they are after birth, it's just seen as like, it's a powerful thing, as you say, but it's also a natural thing. It's what the body is meant to do and it's what women are meant to, to do. So there is that kind of disconnect between the, between the two worlds in terms of how it's treated.

I would say absolute disconnect. It's treated like, oh, my God, you're pregnant, don't do this. Oh my God, you're pregnant. Be careful. Oh my God, you're pregnant. Don't go out. But no, when you're pregnant, you're powerful. You're growing another human inside of you. And I'm sure you've witnessed that with your wife because you have two kids, you know, yes, it is, it is not a time that people should be fragile with a pregnant woman. They should be supportive. Like, what do you need? You know, how can we help you have an empowered and powerful pregnancy? How can we help you learn about what you need so you can have an empowered birth, something that you choose? And especially, I don't want to get into that too much now, but especially with the Western medicine and all of that, it's become very. It's a huge disconnect and it disconnects a woman from her body tremendously. And there are, I mean, women have been giving birth naturally in homes for years. And this whole hospital, medical, epidural type of world has just emerged like 75 years ago, around 75. 5 years. And it's. The more I'm learning about this, the more it makes me sad and angry because how is this not common knowledge? Yeah, how are we so brainwashed by word of mouth, what we hear around us and so on and so forth that we don't have empowered pregnancies?

And I think it goes to questioning because again, going back to my training, we're taught the yoga is a form of. It's a form of self inquiry. So you look into yourself and you, by looking at yourself then makes you question everything outside of yourself. And you do start to look at the world differently. And so when we talk about yoga and the benefits of yoga for people, people always sort of focus on the physical and, you know, it's the usual things. I'm not flexible enough Or I can't do this, I can't do that. But actually, what I'm trying to get, help people to understand. And one of the reasons for this podcast is that it's so much more than that. And with what you've just said there, giving you that questioning ability, both of yourself and of the outside world is a really powerful thing, and just start to make you see the world in a different way.

I 100% agree with what you're saying. It's. After the teacher training, I was even talking to Blair and our colleague, yoga teacher jp, and I was like, if you go into that room and leave the same, you didn't get what you needed to get from that training. Something huge shifts, and something huge has to shift. Actually, no, I take that back. It doesn't have to shift for everyone, but if it shifts, it's magical. It's. It's. It's incredible. And yes, I agree with you. Go. Going back to the eight limbs of yoga, There are eight limbs. None of them are asana, except one. None of them are about the movement and how flexible we are. Except one.

Exactly.

And even me, as an amateur yoga teacher, it was mind blowing to know that, oh, my God, yoga is not just about moving. It's so much more. It's spiritual, it's mindful, it's a whole. It's a way of living, essentially.

Yeah, it is. And that's very much what I'm about and what this podcast is about. It's yoga as a foundation for your way of living and then having everything, everything flow from that. So whether you practice for an hour a day or 15 minutes, or whether you can do a handstand or you can barely touch your toes, it doesn't really matter. It's about living, the. The whole thing. And. And look, I'm. None of us are experts. Nobody is mean. You're always learning. I mean, I left the training just thinking, wow, I thought I was going to get a lot of answers, and now I have more questions and more things to study. And that's the beauty of it. You can never. You can never know it all. It's this continuous journey. And the more that sort of people can recognize that and just. Just try it out, I think they'd be surprised at how. How much better that they can feel and how much differently they will see things.

I mean, yeah, look at us now. Who would have known we'd be here recording this podcast together after our teacher? Who would have known we'd cross paths to begin with? Like, my Yoga teacher training got canceled in Bali twice. I booked Singapore a few times before I could nail one down. And I have zero regrets. I don't want to look back. I mean, looking back, I don't want to look back. And, you know, I don't want my past life. I am shifted. I. Not much has changed, but also a lot has changed. You know what I'm saying? I'm still living in Singapore, I'm still married. I'm still loving life. But I'm noticing every single day that there's a lot more to appreciate to life than the life that I was living. Waking up every morning, reporting to someone and, you know, leaving work late and not having time for family or exercise or yoga or anything, any space, really, to just be myself. And the moment I get on the mat, it all comes back and I start to question, why am I doing what I'm doing? Why am I not pursuing this? And then I had one conversation with my husband. He goes, what are you waiting for? And. And as supportive as he is when he. He says stuff like that, I'm like, oh, okay, tell me more.

Yeah, it does make a big difference having. Having that support because there are. I mean, people have stereotypes about you, yoga, and about yoga teachers and all the rest of it, and it's still not seen as a proper career by a lot of people or a thing that you can do, you know, I mean, as your thing effectively. So having that support makes. Makes a real big difference because it means that you're not having to have those battles at home, you know, meaning you can have them outside if you wish, or you can choose to ignore them, but not having to have them at home is a. Is a real. A real blessing.

Yeah, I hear you completely. And who's to say that we have to go around explaining that it's a career, even if it's not a career? You decide to be a yoga teacher and you decide not to call it a career, but it is actually a career.

Who.

Who am I to judge? Or who. Anyone else to judge? Like, what is this yoga teacher stereotype? What is it? Somebody explain to me what it is, because it goes against the yoga.

Oh, yes.

To have a yoga teacher stereotype, essentially, yes. If that makes sense.

No, it makes. It makes perfect sense. I'm with you. We are. We are definitely speaking the same language. So actually, one point, just to go back that you said. And you said you were an amateur yoga teacher, and you're not, you're out there teaching. So, you know, we're. We All. We're not amateurs. We're. We're all at different places in. In terms of our experience, but we're out there and we're teaching people. We're giving them. We're holding space for them. We're really giving them that moment, and they appreciate that. So, yeah, we. Yeah.

I mean, you have to start somewhere.

We have to start somewhere. Exactly.

If. If you're somewhere is two people on a Sunday morning, that's. That's. That's perfectly fine. I mean, I started doing prenatal, and I'm liaising with two studios in Cairo. And the moment they send me a text that we have one sign up, I'm like, yes, I'm gonna impact one person either positively or negatively. I'm open to that because not everybody will resonate with me, but at the same time, I will impact someone. And it doesn't matter. I. I blocked my calendar to hold this class.

Yeah.

If one person shows up, if five people show up, I'm still gonna hold the class. And when somebody says, oh, it's only me. Do you want to reschedule? No, you've booked the class. I'm here for you. You know, and it's. It's been incredible. Incredible. Really.

It is. Yeah. I had a similar thing on Monday. I'm. I had one person. There's supposed to be three people, and then two couldn't make it. And one person says, oh, yeah, I mean, it's all right. You still want to do that? Yeah. You're here. I mean, you've taken the time to come here. I'm here. Let's have a class. And I think that's. That's what some people don't get, is it's not about you as a teacher. It's about the students, and it's about what they need and what you can give them. And if you look at it through that lens, then it completely changes what being a yoga teacher is. Right. So, yeah, it's not about how you go. It's about holding that space and letting people get what they need from that time.

Absolutely. Absolutely.

Cool. So you were saying that you originally had a couple trainings in Bali that you had to cancel, and obviously ours in Singapore was. Was canceled a couple of times because of the big C word. Covid. So 2020. Yeah. Has been an interesting year for lots of people, for many reasons. In many ways, despite some of the setbacks, it's been a real breakthrough year for me. What's it been like for you?

An amazing breakthrough as well. For Me, it's been so much change from the beginning of the year into. I'm an event person, so I like having events and planning them and working in that field. And the moment the COVID 19 hit, there are no events and they're shrinking by half, quarter, and then less and less and less every single day. So that was quite crazy to witness. So that was the first major shift. The second major shift was the lack of travel that we were going to have, which was still. Everybody's impacted by that. So I really can't complain. And then I would have to say that without this virus, I wouldn't be here today. As much as it is a curse to a lot of people and globally, as much as I am cursing it as well, but equally grateful for it because I was able to pursue what I love. I was able to get some quiet time to disconnect and really get. I mean, I knew my husband, but who would have thought we would be stuck at home for what, two, three months? Yeah, three months face to face, just the two of us. And I mean, we've grown so much. So my relationship with my husband, my relationships in general, and the fact that, okay, how do I make something good out of what's happening? How do I maximize this time? How do I use the time to be grateful, to slow down and so on, but how do I. What do I do? The one thing that's been in the back of my mind for the past five years was yoga. How do I become a teacher? How do I impact lives? The way my teachers have impacted me. And Covid was gifted me that really. I signed up to Bali and I had to cancel a few trainings there just because we couldn't travel anymore. It was paid for, blah, blah, blah. And I was supposed to leave a few days later and then lockdown happened. And actually, I don't regret it because here we are now again.

Exactly.

Yeah, I don't regret it. And I had met with Blair to. To talk and discuss, like, what it's like to be his student and all. All of that. And I knew that this is what was right for me.

Yeah.

At the time. And I'm so glad I pushed through. I took the training. And if it wasn't for Blair, I wouldn't have met Amber. And if it wasn't for Amber and Blair collectively and individually, I wouldn't have been here today. So I'm eternally grateful for all the opportunities this year has. Has given me. The. The running around and the slow pace. It started off crazy.

Yeah.

But then when in our lives have we ever slowed down this much and appreciated what. Oh, we can go for a walk in the fresh air. You know, when in our lives have we just stopped and spent that much time with family and connecting with family and getting to know family. So it's, I would say it's been a blessing. And the fact that I have friends all over the world, you connect with these people and you're like, oh, how are you? Like, what's happening for you? And you get to hear, I've gotten so much closer to a lot of people that I used to know that I now know very well just because of this.

Yeah.

Virus. And it's been an incredible shift in, in a positive way. I mean, I feel very sad for the people that have struggled with COVID or have lost their lives because of COVID or live in countries where they don't know what to do because they're, they don't have enough funding, etcetera, and. Etcetera. But at the same time, I mean, it's life.

Yeah. And it's a reframing, isn't it? We can look at things that are bad in inverted commas and we can carry that negativity with us or we can accept what it is and then try and sort of reframe it and try and make it work for us or see how it can work for us. And that doesn't necessarily discount the people who, who are struggling and are still struggling, but it's just in order for you to be in a position to help anybody else, you have to help yourself. And by helping yourself get to a position where, yeah, it's not all sunshine and rainbows, you know, I mean, it's not all positive, but taking the positives out of it, accepting the negatives and then letting them pass, you're then better equipped to, to help others get through the situations that they're going through.

Yeah. Yeah. And I don't know if you remember Blair saying this. He goes, your cup has to be so full so you can give people out of that.

Exactly.

Other than giving people out of a half empty cup.

Yeah.

And I'm, I, I am a half empty cup person. I've always been. But I have to admit that that, that has changed. That has changed extremely. And it's, it's the other side of the spectrum for me. I've, I've always been like, what bad could happen? What's, what's the half empty, half cup empty side of this? And it was terrifying. Always thinking about what what's the worst? And all of a sudden, okay, how do I, how do I get myself out of that? Because I lived there for so long, and being there for so long, unless you realize it and you slowly come out of it, you really don't. So. Yeah.

And would you say that it's the yoga that's made the difference in terms of your reframing or have there been other factors as well?

I mean, it's been definitely my. The support of my family as well as the yoga, and the support of my family to pursue the yoga, which they know I'm very passionate about and they knew it would help because it, it has before. And I don't know what to say, but forget the asana. The fact that you can sit even for five minutes in meditation every single morning, just reframes. Like, I'll give you an example. This morning I didn't want to meditate. I was so restless. What did I do? I started opening every single drawer, every single cupboard, and I started clearing out stuff. And then by the end of it, all of a sudden, I'm coming. I grabbed my notebook and all of a sudden I'm writing stuff down. Like, questions, inquiries. What does this mean? I'm reflecting on conversations I had three, four, five weeks ago. And because I had that time, that was my meditation. I wasn't talking to anyone. I had no TV on. I was rummaging through drawers and closets trying to clear things that were no longer needed or necessary or that no longer served me. And that really helps give clarity to my mind. So meditation is not just sitting cross legged with your hands on your thighs trying to focus. It happened for me this morning without me needing to do that. And I didn't realize it until 30 minutes before I got here when I. My husband walked in. And all of a sudden I had these big conversations I wanted to have. He goes, where did this come from? Like, I was, I was rummaging through stuff this morning, and as I was doing that, it all came up. And it's as simple as that. It, it's not complicated. It shouldn't be intimidating. It's for anyone. And everyone who just wants it is interested in it.

I think that's a really interesting way that you framed it as well, because there is this perception that meditation, it's like, it's like the asana. People say they can't do the asana because physically they can't do it. They're not flexible enough. People say they can't meditate because they're Restless and they can't sit still or they can't cross their legs or whatever. And there are always these barriers that people put up that they have to do things in a particular way. And going back to what you said earlier, which you said Amber said to you, but I know Blair also said in training is that yoga meets you where you are. So today you might be able to. Maybe you might sit in child's pose and you might just do that for five minutes, and that's fine. And then tomorrow you might be able to balance for five minutes. It's not linear and it's. It talks to you. It tells you about yourself. I remember days when I'll be in a balancing pose and it's just effortless. And then there's days where I literally keep falling over. And because I've done the training and because I am now more aware of myself, both my body and my mind, I know that it's. My mind isn't still. My mind is not concentrating and not focusing what I'm doing. That's why I'm falling over. So it goes back to the reframing. Once you understand why something's happening, you can then better deal with it. And you don't beat yourself up as much about it as well.

What you're saying is like music to my ears right now. Two keywords out of what you said right now, and I've been delving deep into those two things, is one, it's not linear. Huge. And the mind body connection. If your mind is disturbed, you will not be able to find balance in your physical body. And I believe that. I believe that religiously because, you know, not every day on the mat is the same. And people who practice every day know that. And it may be intimidating for people out there who haven't tried yoga before who are like, oh, I'm not so good at it. But who. Who said there's good and bad?

Exactly.

You just do. You. And I'm more and more believing into that, that you just. I'd spend some time, beginning of my class just connecting people to their bodies just to, you know, little, little tiny words that even if you don't know anything about the mind body connection, it may. I don't know if it. It does every single time, but it may just click. And for me, if it does, hallelujah. You know, and the other thing that you mentioned is linear. I was just talking about that nothing is linear, but our world is so linear.

Yep.

It is frustrating. Frustrating, incredibly frustrating. I cannot even emphasize that.

No it's, it's true. I mean, it is. I mean, let's just take, let's just take as a child and education is like, is your child. And then. So as you mentioned, I've got two boys, five and nearly three, and sometimes it fascinates me just to watch them and watch how they move because you realize and you understand how the human body is supposed to move and it does, it just moves freely. There's no, they're not self conscious, you know, I mean, they just sit wherever is comfortable and how it works and it's fine. But then there's a point obviously where you send your kids to school and then they're forced to sit at a desk and that's where it begins. And then you have to go through school, and then you go through secondary school and then you have your exams and then you have to go to, you know, I mean, and there's this linear line which you're expected to follow. That's the expectation. And that expectation, in my view, just serves to kind of shrink your aspirations and your dreams. So then you just start to think within the box that you expected to think within. And so I'm very sort of much focused now about trying not to let them get into that box because I was in it for so long and many people are, and many people don't get out of it. But if you can have that expansive thought, and I mean teacher training again, I'm going to keep coming back to it. It's definitely that it's expensive thought notions are thrown up where you're like, wow, I never thought of that. I never even knew that happened. Why wasn't I told this at school? Why wasn't I told this by my parents? Then you just start to sort of become more creative and more open to sort of the way that things can be, not the way that things are.

Oh my God. How do I respond to this? I couldn't agree with me more. Again, I think, I think from the moment we started having these conversations, you and I have clicked and we're so aligned and it's beautiful to see. I agree, because the conversation I've been trying to have with the people around me for so many years, it's like you have structure your entire life until you graduate college and then all of a sudden you're out in the world on your own trying to figure it out. And that's the exact words I used maybe six, seven years ago when I felt the same. Like, you have structure from the day you're Born until you graduate college, and then you have to figure it out on your own. And then again when you are into the workforce and you're not aligned with what you're doing, and then you have to figure it out again. And it's so like, you need to do this. Who said, who said that this is how it's supposed to be? You know what I'm saying? It angers me a lot because it's. People put you in a box, and this is the box that you stay in your entire life. And if you, especially in a society like mine in Egypt, where it's a third world country and I mean, we don't have a lot of that, you're put in a box and you stay in the box. If you're born with money, you're born with money. If you're born Christian, you're born Christian. If you're born Muslim, you're born Muslim. And that defines your fate and your destiny. And then the moment you decide that this is not defining my fate and my destiny, you become a rebel. And nobody wants to hear you, nobody wants to talk to you. You're like this person who did that? What is my mother gonna say? What is my father gonna say? What are my cousins gonna say? And it's super limiting and it makes me very sad because you're put in that you're already categorized. People know who your parents are, they know what they do, they know which college you've gone to, they know how much money you have on average, obviously. And anything outside of that is just, whoa, what are you doing? And everybody's talking about you. And no, no, this is not how it's supposed to be. Because every person is born different, regardless of which box they were placed in. They had should have the ability to find themselves. And like you said, people are born and they die in these boxes and people emerge and take a different way. And I, I agree with you. The teacher training, I, I, you were to ask me if everybody can take their 200 hour teacher training. Yeah, I would definitely tell them to absolutely go for it. And the, the moments of clarity that I'm getting that I, Sorry. That I was getting during these trainings, just sitting there dozing off like, oh my God, I have no idea where this came from, but now it all makes sense.

Yeah.

And I'll give you, I don't know if you remember me sharing, but I did share during the training that every time my husband and I go on vacation, the first day, it was after Blair was, was sharing about Suppression in the city and going out in nature and all of that and how that is releases. Yeah, yeah, exactly. In that moment, I was like, oh, my God. Every time I leave the city to go with my husband on vacation, I get an emotional release the first day. I either cry or get angry or get frustrated and I just release it all. And I don't understand what's happening. He doesn't understand what's happening. And now we do. Yeah, or I do. And I explained it to him, obviously, because I owed him this much. But at the same time, like I'm sitting in a room with 14 other people and this came up, you know, more people need to just delve deep and moving and breathing, and all of that just emerges, all of these emotions and feelings and patterns, that of self awareness that we need to delve into, if that makes any sense.

Yeah, no, it makes perfect sense. Excuse me. And I think when we're talking about the corporate world in particular, so much of what we've just been talking about is relevant. So when we're talking about not taking the time to slow down, I mean, that's very much the case. I mean, it's always about more. It's always about just keep pushing forward. I mean, success isn't like you get there and you've won. It's like, okay, but more keep going, keep going. You managed to do that. Keep going. And you then, either you're of that personality where that works for you, or you feel you have to conform and sort of, as you suppose we go back to the box analogy, be in that box, because that's what you expected to be in, to be successful. And that's what then affects you. And that suppression that you talked about is that. Which is why people get sick. Right? It's like there's always that thing where you'd be working, you'd be working so hard, and then you'd be waiting for your holiday, your vacation to arrive, and you go on holiday, first day of your holiday, you'd be sick because suddenly your body has time to breathe and all of this comes out. So if you don't have the awareness of yourself, you can't notice that that's happening. So the stress and everything that goes along with that just seems normal. Because for everybody else it's normal and it's expected. It's just like you're working hard, you're supposed to feel like that. But once you know yourself and you know your body and you know your mind, you can intuitively know when something is off. And what's causing that as well. And so for me, that's. If people could take that away from yoga. And by yoga, whether it's a physical practice, the meditation, or anything else, that's. That's the key. You know what I mean? That's all they need to do. Have that awareness, and then you can start to. Then figure out what you're doing. If that works for you, and if it doesn't work for you, okay, what are the alternatives?

Yeah. Yeah, very much so. And, yeah, you see people all over the world. I'm like, I'm suffering from this. I'm suffering from that. Like, when was the last time you took time for yourself? When was the last time you exercised? When was the last time? It doesn't even have to be about exercise or meditation or yoga. When was the last time. Last time you just sat down out of stress to ask these questions? What am I doing? Why am I doing this? And, I mean, I'm only almost 28, and people live entire lives and decades of this. I'm so grateful that I'm here today to be able to talk about this and hopefully inspire other people with you along my side. And at the same time, just tell people that what they're feeling is valid, because I know even if people don't talk about it, it's there. The stress, the mental exhaustion, the physical exhaustion that comes out like, oh, why am I getting sick every month? I kid you not, Ryan, the days that I was not doing the things that I liked and I was dragging myself to work or whatnot, I was getting sick two, three times a month, sometimes, sometimes less, sometimes more, depending on the month. But it was projecting in my physical body way more than I actually anticipated. And I. What I used to do is go to doctor, take these medications and fix it, but it never really got fixed.

Yeah. It doesn't get to the root cause, right? Yeah.

And the sad truth is, it's very hard to get to the root cause. Yeah, it's very hard. I mean, with the help of my family, I was able. Okay, you're feeling like that because you've been through a lot the. The last few months, like, no. Yes. No. I'm, like, I start to sort of question it, but then now that I have complete clarity. Yeah. Every time I've been told or every time I've been sick, I think back, like, what is the root cause? What is making me sick? And honestly, Ryan, since. Since I've been working from home and started the yoga teacher training, Knock on wood. I Have not been sick.

Yeah.

Like I've been before.

Yeah.

I have not been able to say, oh, I'm taking a sick day, or I'm tired. Nothing.

Yeah.

I mean, if I want. On the days that I want to stay at home and, and do nothing, I'm just honoring how I feel.

Yeah.

That day. And I have, honestly, I now have the freedom to say, okay, today is Monday, but I don't want to do anything. If I want to lay in bed all day or if I want to watch TV all day.

Yeah.

I'm allowing myself to do that because I'm not doing nothing.

Yeah.

I'm resting. And that's not nothing. No, that's. That's very valuable. It's a very valuable thing to be doing, if that makes sense.

Yeah. And that's. I am. It took me a while to. To accept that because there is that thing where, well, this time here, and I should be doing something and you should always move. But it's like. And if anyone is listening who does any kind of sport or training or whatever, they always say the rest days, that's where. That's where it happens. That's where you build the muscles. That's where your body gets stronger and it repairs itself. And if you don't allow it the space to rest, it will just keep breaking itself down, breaking itself down until it just breaks and just doesn't do what you want it to do. And the same goes for the mind. It's a whole thing. You have to allow that space to. It's the sort of yin yang. Right. You kind of. You of kind. You power yourself and then you kind of take a step back. You can't keep pushing yourself to that limit all the time because it's just not. Not sustainable.

And it's not normal. No, it's become the norm. Yeah, but it's not.

Yeah, it's.

It's not sustainable. It's not normal. Nothing about it is. I mean, you see people who are like 30 years old and they're like suffering from diseases that are unheard of at their age. And you come to the root cause. It's just stress.

Yeah.

Because scientifically, cortisol, when it's spread all over your body, that's what it does.

Yeah.

It causes disease. It weakens everything out. It's like a. It's a hormone like any other hormone. When you're. You're feeling good, when you're laughing, when you're exercising, when you're meditating, that's giving back to the body. And Calming it down and, and healing it, essentially. And then when you're stressed all the time. Yeah, it's taking away from all of that. Yeah, it's depleting you, essentially.

Yeah. I mean, we're supposed to live in balance, right? So, yeah, you have the ups and downs, but I've seen so, so, so many people and at times myself as well. Where you're in that state pretty much constantly, you don't, you're not even always aware of it either. But when you're sat staring at the screen for hours on end and, or when you're kind of like sort of stressing over an email or whether something you set up was correct or all of that is contributing to the breakdown of your, yourself internally. And if you don't allow yourself that release and that sort of come down to kind of bring yourself back into balance, it can only end one way.

Yeah.

So, yeah, heavy stuff. But let's, let's go to something a little bit lighter in terms of yoga and yoga teachers. So as yoga teachers, very much having to put ourselves out there, which for some people comes naturally and for others not. It definitely didn't for me.

Me neither.

So, you know, social media, Instagram in particular, it's a little bit of a minefield and it takes a while to kind of figure out what you are and who you want to be and how you want to present yourself to the, to the outside world. I know that you, obviously you're, now, you're out there, you're teaching and you've kind of done what I did and set up a separate account for your yoga to try and sort of keep that, that demarcation. Have you found your, your voice yet? Do you have a sense of how you want to be and how you want to present yourself to the world?

I mean, I'm doing my best to stay true to myself because it gets very messy with the outside social world and you wanna, you want more followers. But for me, it's just like I want people that I will resonate with. I don't want my follow list to be higher. I, I post what I feel and what's genuine to me. I don't post what looks good and what might look good. It's all. And I never pose something that I was forced to do. Like the days that some days it's very hard to get on the mat.

Yeah.

And it does not look graceful when you can do that. And I, I don't post that. I post my genuine self like where, where all of this is coming how it feels for me and my identity. I have not still been built within the yoga industry or no, I, I wouldn't call it industry, but in the yoga world.

Yeah.

I mean, I want to be a person to hold space for other people. That's all. I don't want to be the person in a beautiful pose on Instagram. I don't want to be the person that is intimidating other people because sometimes looking at people in beautiful yoga poses is intimidating. Instead, I am working on my progress and I am, yeah, posting a picture of a pose that doesn't look a hundred percent. But I'm also explaining that it took me X amount of years or months to get here. I'm still not a hundred percent there, but I'm working on it. And that's the road. I mean, I'm already a yoga teacher and the fact that I'm still working on all of these things validates other people that, okay, we're not losing hope. She's, she's, she's a yoga teacher, but she's still working on this stuff, you know, And I don't want to portray myself or present myself in, in a way that does not reflect who I am.

Yeah.

Because a lot of the media is now, unfortunately, lies and coaxes and stuff like that. I, I don't want to be that person. So I'm taking my time. I'm putting up the content when I feel passionate enough to, to put up the content. I tried to do it every day, but my heart was not into it every day. And to honor myself and the people who follow me, I'm not going to try to make it every day if it doesn't feel right. Yeah, that makes sense.

It makes perfect sense. It is a minefield because you teach yoga or something brings you to yoga. So we talked about healing before, or whatever it is kind of brings you to this thing and you, you discover the magic of it and what it can do for you. And you may do your teacher training and come out of it with more questions and answers and sort of really inspire. And you just want to hold that space and teach people. But then you kind of have to start thinking about what's my personal brand and how am I going to position myself. And when I get my photo and all this other stuff, which kind of seems counterintuitive, but it's kind of necessary if you're going to get your message out there and help the people you want to help. So you kind of have to do it. So then it's kind of Finding the way to do it in a way that is true to you, as you said. And as long as you stay true to yourself, there is no right or wrong. But it's when you. As you say, when you think about, oh, followers, I need more followers. Okay, what's this person doing? They're doing that. Let me do what they're doing and see if that. Then you do start to lose yourself, and then you may as well be back in the corporate world where you're losing yourself anyway. Right. Because you're. Yeah. You're no different, so.

Or in a world where you're just not true to yourself and you're imitating someone else. And. Yeah, it's become so easy to look up so many yoga teachers and platforms and sequences. Everything has become available at our fingertips. And in all of that, where are you? Where is Ryan? Where is Sarah? Like, how do we. How do we come across as exactly who we are? And to be honest with you, most of my yoga classes are friends, and I love that because they keep coming back. Not because I am Sarah, their friend. Yeah, because they could have come to class because, oh, she's. She's teaching a class that support her. But I mean, three months later, why are they keep. Why are they back?

Yeah.

If it wasn't, you know, affecting them in a way.

Yeah. You were giving them something they needed, right?

Yeah. And yeah, they're friends, but also there are a ton who aren't. And that's. That's a great accomplishment.

Yeah, no, it is. Certainly is a great commission. And I think that also, if you do truly believe that yoga is for everybody, which lots of people say. But if you do truly believe that, then it's incumbent upon you to share, you know, me, share the journey. You know, I mean, so share. Share the good and bad, for want of a better term. You know, I mean, share, as you said. Yes, this might look like something that. That you want to get to, but this is the work I had to do to get there and show that there is a consistency to it, there is a dedication to it. It doesn't just happen overnight. People aren't just born that way. And so, yeah, if people kind of put in the work, they. If that's what they want to get, then they can get there. But I think also in terms of the content that we're putting out, it's also showing that that's actually not the goal. You know, I mean, it's. You can have your goals and that's fine, but that's not the Goal of the yoga as a whole, you know, it's. It's just a very small part of what it is that you're doing and what you're trying to achieve.

Yeah. I mean, the goal is to. The goal is to be there and hold space for people mentally, physically. And to be honest with you, Ryan, I've been working with people, especially prenatal and the yoga students that are coming approaching me on Instagram, wanting to book my Zoom classes. I share my number. If you. If. If you ever. A lot of people don't use it, but if you ever want anything, if you ever want to talk about something, if you ever need advice, I'm here for you. I'm not just a yoga teacher. I'm here to hold space in whatever capacity that. That I can. I. I'm not a doctor. I am. I'm not anything other than a yoga teacher. But if I can help you or if you can call me or text me, and it will always be confidential to ask me a few questions or pick my brains or whatnot, I always share my number. WhatsApp, me, FaceTime, call me, I will always make time. And that's not very typical of yoga teachers.

Yeah.

Unfortunately. Which should be the case because we should be practicing what we preach. And if. I mean, Amber is like that Amber, I can. I hope you're listening. I can text her or give her a call or show up to her class, and she will always be inviting. And that's what I wanna. I wanna carry this legacy on.

Yeah.

Where, yes, I am a yoga teacher, but I can. I can be there for you. You know what I'm saying? I can. I can hold your hand. We can get through this together. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah, no, I definitely do. And they think that the landscape of where we are now makes that a little bit easier. The fact that people are having to either teach on Zoom or if you are teaching in person, you can only teach a small number of people because of the restrictions. So you're getting the intimacy that we probably didn't have before when you're having these sort of huge, mega classes. And from the teacher's point of view. Yeah. It's funny because teachers always seemed like these sort of ethereal beings at the front of class. They kind of walked in just before class started and they kind of led you through the class. They probably did some of the poses that you'd look at and be like, what the hell are you doing? I'm never going to get there. And then class would finish and you'd leave. You never really. They never sort of seemed like real people. And now it's interesting, sort of as I get to know more yoga teachers and obviously being one myself, that I want to bring that I'm just a normal person. I mean, I'm no different to you. I've been through the training. I may be practicing longer or more consistently, but I am no different. There's no reason why you couldn't do what I am doing and there's no reason why you couldn't get the benefits of yoga, just like I am getting. Yeah.

And there's no reason that you can't be better than I am.

Yeah, exactly.

As a student, by all means, if you see that, you're like, oh my God.

Yeah.

And it's not intimidating. It's, it's, it's very empowering to see students who are. Yeah, you're better than me. Good, good. I mean, it's, there's nothing to be jealous of. There's nothing to be ashamed of as a yoga teacher if a student knows how to handstand and you don't. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

And what I'm saying right now is in alignment with what the yoga actually is. It's non harming, non stealing, truthfulness and not hiding behind this yoga Persona, per se. Like, I am who I am as a human. I am. Yeah. I'm a yoga teacher because I've gone through my training and I'm teaching yoga regularly and now full time. But I'm, I'm still human.

Yeah, exactly.

I still have my feelings, you know, and good. I, I've. And at the same time, as a yoga teacher, you're getting students who haven't done yoga before. They're like, oh, I'm doing two classes a week in a row and it feels amazing. If I wait until the following week, it doesn't feel so good. What should I do? Like practice?

Yeah, yeah. I said, I said this to a few people recently is that it's better if you were to do 15 minutes every day than sort of try and do a hardcore hour and a half hot yoga class once or twice a week because you don't get the benefits. And I, I used to be there, particularly with my job and not being able to get out where you'd want to go to class and then you couldn't make, you'd have to cancel. So it was like a class here, a class there, and you leave feeling good. But you don't really get the long Term benefit. So consistency is, is very important.

It's key. I, I, I mean, and I don't want to sound like, yes, we have to have a daily practice, but also, if you skip a day.

Yeah.

Or two days or three days because you don't feel like it, honor that. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah. And that's yoga as well, right?

Yeah, absolutely. There we go. It's honor. Honor. You honor yourself. Honor what you feel in that moment. Sometimes you'll wake up and you, you'll have the energy to practice for two hours. Sometimes you'll wake up and you won't have the energy to practice and you have to force yourself on the mat. Some days you, you, you don't even want to get on the mat, and you do, and you feel better, and some days you just don't make it.

Yeah.

And that's fine as, as a yoga teacher, and I'm sure you would, you would agree with me on that. It's okay. It's, you know, life is not linear as well. Just like we can't go to the corporate world and perform our jobs linearly every single day. The days that you don't feel like moving and you just sit down in meditation, or you sit down, read a book, or you do something that is meditative for you, that's enough. Yeah, that's good. That's good enough. As long as it makes you feel good and that you've gotten your few minutes of mindfulness, whether it's practice through movement or the breath, or just doing baking or doing something with your hands, and that's more than enough. Some people, I mean, they, they take this and say, oh, this is not yoga, but. No, it's a way of life.

Yeah.

Find yoga in whatever you do, however you do it, and then it'll just fall into place. It's not one way or the other or this way or the other. It's just, it's just the way it feels for you.

For you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that's, that's just true. Wow. So where do you see yoga taking you? Do you have sort of any ideas or any desires, ambitions? Wishes?

I mean, I, it's growing a little bit every day, and I'm grateful for that. And if it continues to grow in that rate every single day, impacting people who want to be impacted, who want to find someone like me to guide them through their practice and to hold space for them, by all means, I've, I fulfilled my purpose. The goal is not to make zillions. Yes, the goal is not to be someone who I'm not. The goal is to be exactly who I am and to attract the people who want to, to, to know me, to resonate with me, who want to, who are curious, like self inquiry, to probably towards me or whatever. Yeah, I mean it's, it's hard to answer that question because I cannot tell you that being a full time yoga teacher is the same every day. Yeah, Every day is very different. Every day you're doing different things, you're teaching different classes, you're developing yourself in a very different way as well. And like we said, it's not linear.

Yeah.

So I just hope that I reach as many people out there that want to be reached. Not by force, not by power, not by, you know, being in a specific box. Like we agree, like we talked earlier, but just by finding a person they resonate with, they connect with. And that's it. That's my goal, like to reach as many people as I can who want to be reached.

Yeah.

The people who don't want to be reached, by all means, hats off, be who you are. Continue to stay exactly where you are if that makes you happy. And the yoga is not something you can't, you can force. It's something that you either discover or you don't. And that's completely fine. And if people come to one class and they don't resonate, by all means, I will give them like, oh, I like to do Ashtanga more. Sorry, I don't teach Ashtanga. But here is a great, perfect, sorry, teacher that will, will teach, teach you.

Yeah.

And I don't want that student for myself because I'm not a business. I, I don't want to acquire people.

Yes.

I want to teach people to be who they are and to connect with who they are. And if that means coming to classes three, four times and they're off on their own connecting to who they are, I completely agree with that. I have no problem with that. Like, don't. If you don't resonate and you've, you're off on your own, stay there, continue from there, you don't have to come back.

Yeah.

And if they do come back, by all means. You know, it's thrilling for me to see people come back. But yeah, it's a business. But at the same time we have to take the business component out of it because it, the business component is important, but at the same time it's not what the yoga really is about. You just want to empower the people around you. And if they get empowered and they decide to do it on their own, by all means.

Yeah. And I think that's the thing, is that if the business is interfering with the reason you got into it, then you've got a problem. And as we had a discussion with somebody else earlier today is if you start from a place of abundance, then you'll always be fine because you're never going to be stuck. Things will come back to you. And that's what I've really liked through the journey I've gone on since even taking into account social media. I've met so many amazing people just through social media who've been really helpful and supportive to me and I have to them without any expectation. And as long as you do that, you'll be fine. Because as you say, it's all about who resonates with who. So if a student doesn't resonate with me and they want to do something else, like you said, you know, people who you can kind of say, well, maybe go see this person, they'll be really great for you. And that's kind of how it goes. It all goes around. Things will come to you as and when they need to come to you. You don't need to hang on to things and grab onto things. And people aren't possessions, as you said. And there is something quite nice about empowering somebody enough that instead of them coming to your class every day, they do feel that they're confident enough that they can study themselves at home because that's where the real inquiry happens. You know, when you're on the mat on your own and you're trying to do something, whether it's something new or whether it's just trying to get your Warrior 2 right or your child's pose right. You know, I mean, trying to kind of really feel your body, you can only really do that at home because you have the space and the time. You're not kind of trying to follow with everybody else. So yeah, I think you just gotta just, just, just give and as long as you give, you'll be fine. I see it.

I don't know if you've seen my post several days ago about abundance versus the lack of abundance. And recently I've been really intrigued by this topic. Like where, where do I stand? Do I have abundance? Do I not have abundance? Like, where do I stand? But come to think about it, just a few moments every day to just pause, even meditation, even in your bed, it doesn't matter how you're sitting and where you're sitting just to pause and realize that you have that abundance in your life and that you're able to give. So, so long as you can give, you know, like, to the maximum that you can give and somebody out there will resonate with you, you don't have to give. Like, you don't have to compare your abundance with anyone else. You. You give as much as you can give, and that's enough. And so long as you focus on the abundance versus the lack of abundance, you're good to go. You're good to go. Really, it's as simple as that. Like, you look at other people like, oh, it's such a nice dress. It's so expensive. Why can't I get that? Do you feel jealous or do you feel happy for that person? Do you feel like you, you, you want to be in an experience that is not truly you just to be. To feel abundant, or are you already abundant as you are? And it's been a huge topic and I. My internal debate with myself has been that, like, abundance versus lack of abundance, I have to be grateful for everything that I have to date. And if I was in a shittier situation, I would have to be grateful for that as well. Because no matter what situation you're in, if you just pause to find the abundance in that situation, you're golden. You're really golden. And. And that's what life is all about. Just being happy and feeling the abundance with whatever you have going for you. As long as that. It's. It's a decision you made on your own. It's a decision that you know you're pursuing and not necessarily pursuing, just. Just feeling the state of gratitude and happiness exactly where you are and knowing that exactly where you are is exactly where you need to be. Not more and not less. If that happens to be more in the future, by all means good. If that happened to be more in the past and less of it is now, you're growing in different ways. So I feel like the. The world around us has put us on a. On a realm of expectation that we have to have this job, drive this car, own this home. That we're not grateful for what we have and we don't feel abundant with actually what we have. And we are always seeking more, but the more we seek, the more we feel lack of abundance. And it's just a vicious cycle. It keeps going on and on and on. What are your thoughts on that?

Yeah, complete. Completely agree. It's the. It's like I said earlier, it's that Constant striving for more. Like, when is enough enough? Because, okay, it's like if you imagine you're winning a race and you, you get to the finish line, you're done, right? And then you kind of, you, you cool down, you stretch, you, you go off you, you go and live the rest of your life. But there isn't that in. I mean, in that sort of in the current world that we're living in. Because if you get to what you think is the finish line, it's a case of, oh, well, okay, you got there quicker than we thought you would. That's great, but keep going like there's more to be had, like you've got to keep. And when does it stop? And when are you satisfied? And if you're not, then you can never then be happy because you're always going to want more than what you have because there'll always be somebody who has more than what you have. And if you always want what they have, then you can never be satisfied. So gratitude is important. I mean, be grateful, as you said, for what you've got. And you might not have everything, but you have something. So find the something that you've got. And it doesn't mean that you can't be unhappy about things at times. It doesn't mean that you're not going to be in bad moods. It doesn't mean that you're always going to be dancing around and happy. It just means that you take the time to notice, okay, I have this, and I'm grateful for that, and I'm grateful for this, and I fell out of my gratitude practice, but so it's not something that I do every day.

That's you off. Haven't we all fall. I mean, it's reality. We all fall out of it. And it's a matter of bringing yourself back up.

It's the awareness. It goes back to the awareness, right? It's like everything. It's like if you're not practicing every day yoga, or you're not practicing your meditation or whatever, it's fine. It's being aware. It's being aware of why you're not doing it and sort of giving yourself the space because you will come back to it when you need to. But I think what the problem is with a lot of the way that we live is a lot of things are done without that consciousness, without that intentionality. So we're just kind of sleepwalking through and we're not taking care of our health. We're not thankful for what we've got. We always striving for more without really knowing why we're doing that. You know, it's just because we've been told we need to strive for more. So therefore you do more. But if you actually take a step back and going back to where we started, really self inquiry and being aware of yourself and then being aware of things externally and starting to question externally, then it's like this doesn't actually make any sense. Why am I doing this? Why do I need to go down that route? And I'm hoping for some of the conversations I've had with people throughout this year that people who have said that they're now looking at things differently now that they don't have the long commutes, they're not always on a plane, they do have more time at home with their family. They have seen there was a different way of living. Whether those people can carry that through and whether we do now see a shift going forward or whether it's just a blip on the horizon, I really hope it's a real shift, but only time will tell.

I feel like it could be a real shift just because this is completely unprecedented and we've been, I think SARS has showed us. Well, I wasn't really aware during sars, but like it has showed the world that, you know, life goes on even after a huge pandemic and this is what we're going through today. Everybody's been able to work from home. Everybody's been able to do exactly what they need to do. I mean, with, with the exception of a few industries, but I would say majority of the people have managed a way around it. And if only employers in the corporate world would understand that. Okay, let's honor this shift and instead of going back to square one, let's see how we can mitigate a middle ground, you know.

Yep, we can but hope. I think where many of us are hoping for that just, just to make things better for, for individuals and for the world generally. So have you, obviously one of the things on, on the podcast, it's about helping people figure out if what they're doing is what they want to do, where they're heading, what their purpose is, and if they're on the path to, towards that. Do you know your purpose? Have you found it?

I mean, I cannot say I, I do know it a hundred percent, but I have to say that I am one step ahead of where I was and I am, I know I'm working towards it. Don't know exactly how it's going to turn out and what that's going to be, between the yoga, the prenatal, the postpartum, women's health, and all of that is intriguing me. So I have yet to pinpoint exactly where that is. I'm doing all of it with a lot of love and a lot of passion, but narrowing it down has yet to come in my horizon. It's. I. I would say it's still early, just because it's been only a few months.

Yeah.

But I'm grateful to be here because I believe this is step one of where I need to be and step one from something that I don't want to be. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah, no, I know exactly what you're saying. It's all about. It's all about microstates. It's about taking a step. I mean, one step every day. And yeah, the purpose question is a big question. And yeah, not everyone knows what their purpose is, and that's fine. But once you're starting to at least have those thoughts, then you're already on the right path, because a lot of people don't think about that. It's just, you know, okay, this is what I do. And you just kind of keep going day by day, day by day, day by day. But if you start to question, okay, what am I doing? I need more meaning in my life, I need something. Then at least you start to search. And once you start to search, you're then taken off in a different direction. And so that's all that really needs to happen, is for you to get to a position where you start to question, then you start to search, and then you start to explore the areas that you're searching, and then you'll find it. And what it might be one day may slightly change the other day, but it's unlikely it'll deviate because once your values are in check, then that. That will kind of lead you in the direction where you feel you need to go. So, I mean, for you, obviously, there's a strong feeling of wanting to help people mean wanting to sort of help people sort of navigate their lives, sort of feel good in their bodies. That's a purpose. I mean, it's. It's broad. And yes, you could sort of narrow it down, but at least, you know, okay, that's ultimately what I want to do. Let me figure out the steps to get there.

And I always, ever since I was in college and out of college into the corporate world, I was asking myself, like, what am I doing? What is this job doing to me, other than depleting me and giving me a paycheck. And essentially that's good in a way. And some people like that. But at the end of the day, like, what is the purpose? If I leave tomorrow, if I get sick or if I get hospitalized, what does this entity mean to me?

Yeah.

What do I mean to them? What's. What's the point of doing all of this?

Yeah.

What am I doing?

Yeah.

So question, self inquiry.

Question, question, question.

And yeah, I mean, I definitely know that I made a huge step to start working towards my purpose, but at the same time, I have. I mean, to help people. Absolutely. How? When? Where? I'm still figuring that along the way. And I feel like every single person who has their purpose in check still has these. You know, I. I hope I'm helping people, but when, how, where comes along the way, even if they've been doing it for years and know they've been helping people for years, if, if you're really living by your purpose, there's a humbling aspect of it.

Yeah.

That turns out an area of you that's like, okay, I did help people, or I hope I'm helping people, but I. I'm not satisfied. I want to do more.

Yeah.

And that's when you know you want to keep. You're doing what you. You're born to do.

Yeah.

And you want to keep going in that direction to keep improving it, to keep impacting humans more and more and more. And you're never satisfied as to how many or. Or where you've reached. Just because there's always an area or a group of people or a part of the world that you haven't reached and haven't heard any of the stuff that we're talking about. And it's. Honestly, Ryan, it's been incredible these last few months just because I'm learning things I've never heard before, and I still don't know how to process it, whether to be angry that I haven't learned this before in my life when I was a kid, or whether to embrace it and be hopeful. I mean, I definitely feel a little bit of both.

Yeah.

But I can't pinpoint which one I feel more of because why am I just learning this, you know?

Yeah, I feel that a lot, particularly since teacher training and as I do my own reading and my own sort of inquiry myself, it's. Yeah, there's a vast. A vast wealth of knowledge out there, which are things that are quite important to know. And, yeah, we weren't Taught them and we just didn't know them. But we know them now. So I guess we've got to be thankful that we're at that position where we're at least finding them out now and we can help to sort of pass them on as well. To sort of people.

Absolutely. And I believe that in that entirely to. The knowledge you gain is priceless. Just pass it on to whoever and whatever will listen to you.

Yeah.

And it's so incredible because there will be people who want to listen and there will be people who are going to be like, what are you talking about? I don't want to listen to that. And what is it that we're learning if we're not willing to pass on? It defeats the whole purpose. It's. It's why we were created, like, for centuries.

Yeah.

Somebody was taught something that passed it along, passed it along, passed it along somewhere. It deviated into this crazy world that we live in now, which I'm also grateful for, because I don't think you and I would have been here if it wasn't for this.

Yeah.

Madness.

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. You got to. It goes back to the reframing and gratitude as well. You know, maybe thankful for where we are. Okay, so as a corporate escapee, what three tips would you give to listeners who are trying to figure out what they're doing, where they want to go?

The three tips, first of all, because a lot of people are not looking there. Listen to your body. Your body speaks wonders. It will tell you everything you need to know and honor that. Listen to your body and honor what the body tells you. And after that, you're golden. The third tip is whatever the communication is that comes out of that, do not just scrunch it in a piece of paper and throw it away.

Yeah.

The mind body connection is incredible. And a lot of what happens, the body stores. And if the mind can't process it, the body will speak it out in a way. One way or another, it will come out. If it's a little eczema on the arm or anything, it is. Anything at all, the body will start to speak. So if you're in the corporate world and you feel stressed and your body starts to tell you, okay, it's time to make a change. Honor that. Find something mindful. Find something that you love. Find something that you're passionate and always, always, always have something outside of the corporate world to be passionate about that you could fall back on. Essentially. I can't say I really fell back onto yoga because it's Always been a part of me. The last five to six years. I, in a way, I definitely did. But at the same time, find something outside of your work that really identifies who you are to you and pursue that. Nothing against the corporate world. If you're all about it, do it. And if these aspects, if your body is speaking to you, if something doesn't feel right, then explore these options. Listen to your body, Find something outside of that that makes you who you are.

Sound words. I can't argue with any of that at all. And I think that something you said there is worth reiterating, is that it's not about necessarily coming down the corporate world or saying everyone should get out now while they can. It's just about being intentional in what you're doing and being in what you're doing because you want to be there and knowing why you're there. Because for a lot of people, and me included when I was there, you, you don't. You, you think you do when you get in, and then some way you just kind of lose your way and, you know, I mean, it all gets a bit murky. So it's just about being intentional and letting your intention guide you and not just be sort of dragged along by expectation or limitations or anything else.

Yeah, yeah. And listening to your body is really tuning into your intuition and the intention. What is, what does this mean to you? Is this what you want to do? And start questioning, like, what who am I? What am I brought here to do? What am I supposed to do? And what is it that I'm doing that is serving me? And what is it that I'm doing that's not serving me? And vice versa. It's. It's easy to say, but it's so hard to execute and it may take years, months, even minutes. Hopefully this podcast, somebody listens to it and has a sudden shift. But I'm also aware that a lot of people won't, and it will take them years and years and years to figure it out, or maybe one year or months. And that's. That's okay. That's completely acceptable as long as you end up exactly where you need to be and how. Where you belong, where you feel you belong, not where anyone else tells you you belong.

Yeah, exactly. Great. So we're going to go into a few quick fire questions before we come to the end of what's been a deep and a very interesting chat, as always. And I mean, as we said, we could stay here for a lot longer, but yeah, I'm sure I'm sure there'll be a part two at some point. So let's, let's just dive into a few quick fire questions. So first thing, what's one piece of advice you would give to your corporate self? And you may be what you've already said, but is there anything else you think of?

I mean, I don't know where to begin and I don't think, Ryan, there's one piece of advice I would give because it's always a combination of experiences and trials and errors and there's no one size fits all. I definitely wouldn't be here if it wasn't for my corporate experience. So I'm not denying that whatsoever. I appreciate it for all that it's done for me, but I also appreciate realizing what didn't serve me there, if that makes sense. So there's not one thing I can put my finger on and there's one thing I can say is that, I mean, everyone is very different.

Yeah.

And I mean I wish I had one, a one word answer or one sentence answers to give other than what I've said. Just, just tune into you. Outside of everything and anyone else around you. What do you need? What do you feel? What is your emotional life like? How do you, how do you tap into that to figure out who you are? It doesn't matter how. It could be a variety of things, a variety of steps in a variety of or many, many years. But what is it that defines you and how do you work towards that? Okay.

Yeah, yeah.

Does that answer your question?

Yeah, that's. That, that's an answer. And yeah, that definitely I can imagine my, my yoga copy itself sort of standing there a little bit dazed and like, oh, that's deep. But no, it makes perfect sense. It definitely makes perfect sense to me. Now. What's next? What's your best or most worthwhile investment of the last five years?

Oh, wow, Ryan. What type of investment?

Anything, Anything you spent money on which.

You think, oh, that was financial.

Yeah.

That'S hard. I mean, one of them would definitely be my teacher training.

That's what I thought. That's what I thought you would say.

Most expensive price tag that I've seen in the last, in my entire life, actually.

Most expensive and most transformative. Right.

I mean I, the amount of money I put into that is way less than what I got out of it. So it's worth, I wouldn't say it's worth every penny because it is. Yeah. And, and beyond. And the second best thing would be my travels since I moved to Singapore because, not because, oh, I went there and had fun but because they, they, they grew me, they've broadened me. They, they led me to who I am in a way.

Yeah. Cool. Sounds good. Do you have a quote that you refer to often or that you try to live by?

I struggle with labels a little and with, I mean, not necessarily a quote.

But you know, just a few words. Yeah. Or it doesn't have to be, just.

Be who you are.

Yeah.

Be who you are. It's as simple as that. I, I could have come up with a fancy quote that I was, would have been prepared.

Is sometimes the best. Yeah. The best choice.

But being who you are and just taking a moment to reflect inwards, to tap into your intuition and where you need to go for you above anybody else. Because once you, once you do that, everything else falls into place and I, I'm from that school. Like when you're a better person, everything around you becomes better. Yeah.

Okay.

It's not really a quote, but.

No, no, be my two cents. Be who you are. That's, that's a quote. I mean that's perfect. It's authenticity is important and for a lot of us, we can lose that at times without even realizing it. So. No, be who you are. I will definitely, definitely take that one. Practice led or self led?

What do you mean?

So do you prefer self practice at home or do you prefer to be led in the class?

A little bit of both. I, I, I like to find the balance in that because my self practice is definitely beautiful, but I wouldn't be who here or I wouldn't be who I am without my teachers. So it's important to have that balance because it's never one thing or the other. It's always, it's always a balance.

Yeah.

Self practice for every yoga teacher is key.

Agreed.

And it works wonders. You get to discover what you want to discover, not what anybody else projects on you in a class or whatever, but at the same time it's nice to have that once in a while when you go into a class. I feel like my presence super arises in these moments because I don't have to think, I just listen. And actually in a way they heighten my listening and being present skills. So yeah, I would say a little bit of both. I wouldn't say 50, 50. I would say more self practice. But I mean, who are we without our teachers?

Exactly.

Teachings, you know?

Exactly. Yeah. And having that sort of new viewpoint, inspiration and new ways of doing things. So yeah, I think they're both Important. And yeah, it depends on the day as to which I prefer. At the moment I'm craving, craving a lead practice just because it's so hard to get into a studio. But yeah, in class, music or no music.

For me, it depends. Sometimes I'll play music and sometimes I won't. If I have a lot to give in terms of theory and philosophy, I will play less music. But if I am, I wouldn't say less. I don't know how to describe it. Sometimes the music helps the students and I, I would, after I've spoken and give my two cents of philosophy and theory. So also balance.

Balance indeed.

Whatever feels right.

Okay, dream retreat destination.

Oh, moments of silence.

There's a whole wide world out there.

I mean, Bali is the cliche, but definitely Bali. And I haven't been to a retreat in Egypt. And they've are incredible. You have retreats in the desert. You have retreats in like far away home somewhere by the beach and stuff like that. So definitely my home country to begin with. Bali would be next, just because I've been to Bali so many times but never on a yoga retreat. And I really resonate with the, with Bali and I would definitely retreat there.

Yeah.

Sri Lanka, India, and the list goes on.

The world, the world retreats. And, you know, we had a quite a deep, philosophical, beautiful conversation. So let's end it on a superficial note, relatively speaking. Aloe or Lululemon?

Oh, no, you're gonna have me pick her. Can I tell you a balance as well? I mean, I have both. I have both. I, as a woman, I enjoy Lululemon's leggings and Aloe's bras.

Oh, interesting. Okay, A bit of mix and match.

A bit of a mix. The aloe leggings, not so much.

Okay.

There's a few shorts that I really enjoy, but mostly Lulu's leggings, especially the Align line.

Okay.

And Alo's bras. Sports bras for sure.

Okay, mix and match there. Interesting. We'll see. I'll be, I'll be asking that to a few yoga teachers as we, we, we go through the show. So be interesting to sort of see what the, what the count is as we come to the end.

Yeah. But there's also a lot more.

There are a lot more. They're just the two biggest, so I thought. And I, and I own things from both, so I just thought I'd throw those two in there. But no, there are definitely, there are definitely other yoga apparel companies that you can frequent. So yeah, don't just Stick with those two, I say. So to close out, what have you got going on? Anything coming up soon or tell us about your classes that you're teaching?

Well, I'm teaching classes throughout the week on Zoom, so you can follow my Instagram @Sarah S A R A S R I A D. So Sarah Sriyad, and you'll find my schedule on there. I do have an upcoming Optimizing Pregnancy Through Yoga Round two workshop, which is. The round one went very well and we're launching around two and. And in the pipeline there's a beginner's yoga program and soon to be recorded online classes.

Exciting. Yeah, it's always great speaking because people always have these things going on in the background. It's quite nice to kind of hear what everyone's doing, how creative they're being and what's going on. So. Great. So. Well, we look forward to seeing more from you, definitely. Both on Instagram and hopefully at some point, teaching in real life, you know, what people used to do in the olden days. But thanks for joining me here in the Yoga Den. It's been great. There's definitely a lot more we could talk about and I'm sure we will both off Mike now and, and maybe in a future episode as well.

Absolutely. It would be my pleasure. And thank you for having me. It's been incredible.

No problem. Thanks, Sarah.

Thank you.

Thanks again for tuning in to this week's episode of the Yoga Den podcast. If you like the show, hit subscribe and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. This really helps to get the show out to others and lets me know to keep creating new episodes. If there's anyone you'd like to hear on the show or you'd like to come into the Yoga Den yourself, drop me a line on Instagram Heogeden podcast and at Ryan Spence Yoga. And if you want to find out more about me, what I do, what I'm up to, check out the website ryanspenceyoga. Com. But for now, eat plants, give thanks, do yoga, peace.